#sua is alive in the same way ivan is for me

[absha120420]

in a kinder world

[crustyfloor]

a bit of a... something i dont know its early and I have a deep seated sense of dread for whats to come *explod

The caption of this post is "vision after." that phrase is a reference to a vision you get of a future situation, or in this case, a "future life" as I interpret it, but also an insight, mirrors are often referenced as openings into the soul

First of all, the mirroring... I see that Ivan and Sua are framed with true mirrors. However, they are framed so that they all look right at us instead of how it would be correctly. Had Ivan and Sua been in the right position, they would've all been aligned (this feels especially like a frozen picture because Ivan's snaggletooth is on the correct side if he wasn't turned around, same thing with Sua if she was positioned in sync with her counterpart). They can face us and accept it. They always thought their deaths would be for the best in the end.

Till's version is more out of line, in other words, his mirror is incorrect. Unlike a true mirror, Till's mirror is concave and shows us his position flipped, he's misaligned with his counterpart but won't face us. This makes me believe his death wasn't honest, hence why it isn't as aligned and why he can't face us as Ivan and Sua can. Till isn't truly on the same wavelength as his counterpart because Till isn't fully there. yet?

I also interpret this as a way of establishing that Till, as a character, hasn't been fully honest yet, for example, his send-off post was narrated by his mother and not him. He won't look at or at all acknowledge us because he isn't ready. If he's dead, I see this lack of focus as a manifestation of his guilt. He wasn't truly willing to die in round 7, his end was forced onto him. If these mirrors are a way of looking into the future, Ivan and Sua can look and move on, accepting it with a bittersweet smile because they've already done all they need to, they can justify this means to an end. And they have no regrets over the way they died. Till regrets everything.

He can't look back at us because, in a way, he's still reflecting, if anything, he's mourning himself here as he stares at his counterpart, what would be his 'future'. But is unsure of whether to accept it or not. He didn't want to take this kind of defeat and move on in the first place after he found hope again (he will fight the demons and revive)

... vivinos you're fawking with me.. THE BLOOD CHICO THE BLOOD.. TILL IS ALIVE 😭😁🤞 THE LIGHTING..

the thing about this is that it's very obvious Vivinos doesn't want us to know for sure whether Till is alive or dead for sure like Ivan and Sua have been quite established to be dead. He doesn't look like he fits in, but he's supposedly one of them, it feels very up in the air for me, at least.

[one-selective-bitch]

ALNST Friday Brainstorming

Ofc they didn't reveald them before wiege's release, it would have spoiled who would have died

(Fed by Hate, Starved by Love - @/Official_ALNST on X)

Does that mean that Hyuna got shot in the head and not her back?

Well it would make sense if we take into account the splatter on Luka's face. It could be provoked by someone spitting it on his face bc Hyuna has a mask on, and if she was on her back there wouldn't be a splatter at all.

So maybe the crack on her face comes from that (?)

In Luka's case it only reminds me of his patch in the poster scene in wiege, or the same we can also see in the 너의 실존�� 곧 나의 요람 official art

Bot other that that it also matches with Sua and Ivan

Since they tok have their main crack on their necks

(btw I see that: Sua -> hiding the crack bites her lips as if she's hiding her pain. Ivan -> seems not even to notice the crack and concerns himself with keeping his face together. Luka -> actively digs into the crack EDIT: scratch that he's actually scratching near the crack)

Hyuna can also be grouped with Mizi and Till since they all have a crack on their face (?)

They all are making an effort to let the crack be seen by holding their hair up

Idk how to end this em....Till is once again grouped with Luka and Mizi...so add that to the "Till is alive folder ig" (but fr it's bc they're the ones that witnessed the other half of their pair die)

And apparently "Fed by Hate, Starved by Love" it's the official translation of what was written behind the photocards (?)

I'll probably let analyse that quote by someone else that has a more concrete idea of what to say about it, bc ofc all of them are "Starved by Love" and Fed by Hate" in a way or another but I can't yet put my finger on it

[inkdetect]

do you think ivan is dead? i know there are a lot of theories of people saying he is not. just wanted to see your take on it

Hi! Thanks a lot for the ask. Super duper sorry for being so late, I hope that this answers your question- and if there's still anything unclear, please feel free to ask more or correct me!

We've been given many hints that Ivan could be dead, but we'll go through some theories and debase them.

Is Ivan dead?? My take on this:

-> As we know, Ivan was shot multiple times before he was hit in, if I remember right, the chest.

Many think that he may have been rescued by the rebellion, who could have been backstage, since they took control of the Alien Stage for some time.

While that IS a possibility, the rebellion was in shambles before AND after Mizi redirected the missile. Besides, we'd have been given hints- even subtle, in Ivan's single songs, or at least a frame where he makes his appearance.

Others think that one guard may be ivan, since the shape of the eye and eyebrow is distinctively the same. But like I said before- he was SHOT multiple times: how could he be running around, let alone standing without wobbling?

-> And once again, as I mentioned before, I don't think that Ivan was hinted at to be alive at all in any of his singles. Not even his lyrics give way to that possibility.

In 'Mi Vida Loca', we can hear till gasp/take a breath in the end, and the beating of his heart (the xylophone), starts playing once more.

Till also usually doesn't appear in any of the official arts with the currently dead cast (Ivan, sua and Hyuna). He stays in line with the characters that are currently alive.

So there hasn't been any hints that'd suggest that Ivan is alive at all. And well- after the last comic...

As for the latest official art- the one with Till in a cat maid outfit and Ivan in a bunny maid one, people have been pointing out the fact that Ivan doesn't have wings, so he's likely alive.

Then again, Luka also has devil wings but he's very much believed to be alive too, so I think that the drawings list simply be from an alternate universe, and only made for fun.

Besides, I do understand that people are sad or delusional, or dare I say, hysterical about Ivan's death, but Alien Stage isn't just about the characters themselves or the ships.

It's about the love that they represent: they all explain and show you a certain side of love, and it's a story for us to understand.

They won't revive the character UNLESS if it's to teach a lesson. Alien Stage is about love and sacrifice, karma and faith.

If this isn't solid or anything, please feel free to fry me, gently, at least. I'm all for explaining and I like to understand others'perspectives. Once again, sorry for the late answer, and thank you for the ask!!

[awaggaa]

something about the flowers reflecting how each character expresses love,,,,

mizi gives full flower crowns to sua, and vice versa, but sua is also depicted giving flowers more often(??) but in less quantities to mizi. this could reflect how mizi unabashedly gives love to sua, while sua doesn't believe she should be burdening mizi (my heart is the greatest poison something something).

at the same time, she gives smaller but more consistent acts of love (in mizi's letter to sua she cites a ton of acts of service including eating her tomaos for her and just generally spending time with her).

ivantill is like. ivantill?? everything that could be said about them atp has already been said LMAo

till is a tried and true flower boy and ivan knows this. 'eating' or crushing flowers WILL get tills attention. ivan also entertains tills little flower games. "cheer up" WHAT IF I TROUT? (obscure reference pay me no mind) DID HE REALLY HAVE TO SAY THAT IN THE INTERVIEW? REALLY?

are ivan and till foils of each other? i dunno! anyways ivan doesn't really know what to do with his love for till so he just. plops it on his head. badabing badaboom. it's a careless way of expressing it, but the flower crown itself has had time and care put into it. he does his best.

tills also often depicted chasing, hiding, or letting go of flowers. he tries to contain his love and also doesnt know how to handle it. wowie

luka has been yearning for longer than tills been alive isnt that crazy

anyways hyuna is intentional and careful with her love for luka. rather than a flower crown being tossed onto his head (this is not a callout post in any regards. coughs ivan coughs), she weaves flowers into lukas hair. just like counting his fingers, this action reminds luka he's alive. yay

luka treasures, preserves, holds on to, etc. hyunas love. im not sure if these were the flowers hyuna gave him but judging by how his room is LITTERED with hyunas posters they probably are..

interestingly, not only are these flowers preserved, theyre RIGHT NEXT TO his alien stage medal. in other words, hyunas love and his win are of equal value. they both represent his literal state of living. he's the version that survived alien stage. he's the version that was loved.

the medal is also of the great anakt,,, something something make me your god i can give you everything,,, something something if you were in my arms you'd be safe,, i dont know,,

[k9punkout]

it's that time again

here's my analysis on the Anakt Garden artificial flowers and what they represent to the characters and story overall

the anakt flowers are consistently featured on screen throughout alnst, whether it's in the videos, official art, or the comics. they can't be shown that often if not to mean something, especially in a show as detail oriented and heavy in symbolism as alnst.

okay so there's been this theory running around that these flowers had hidden cameras in them used to monitor the children.

in the artbook, that theory was proven to be true.

so we know now that the anakt flowers are secretly cameras. seemingly innocent and beautiful decorations are used to spy on the children, a testament to the fact that they had no right to privacy, that their lives were not their own.

the fact that mizi ADORED those flowers but had no idea of their true purpose is reflective of her dream to sing in alnst. something idealized and gorgeous, but with darkness residing just beneath its exterior. she sees the world through rose colored lenses and is unaware of the evil that lurks just beneath her favorite things/dreams.

her reality is way more disturbing than she realizes, the aliens are way more cruel and invasive than what she expects, and her love for the spy devices disguised as flowers shows just that.

im not too sure if sua KNEW about the cameras, but she knew about the Snow Thing, so im gonna assume she knew abt the cameras too.

her letting mizi play with the flowers without telling her a thing and even allowing her to craft flower crowns out of them is an example of her deliberate avoidance of the truth behind alnst. through mizi's joy, she forgets about the harsh reality they live in, and escapes through that.

whenever mizi's holding them, the flowers almost look real.

the fact that she lets mizi give her flower crowns and put them on her head, and does the same in turn... she's willingly giving in to the system to keep mizi's blind-sighted joy alive. dooming them both because she can't bring herself to break the bliss.

as for till. he initially began to like the flowers because mizi likes them. till has always liked pretty things.

his talent being floral art, even if the flowers are spy devices... sort of reminds me of one of his coping mechanisms--making art that's representative of his pain.

he takes something terrible or twisted and reforms it into something pretty. something that can be appreciated rather than avoided.

(page 59 of the artbook has a quote referring to till that reads: “When I couldn't sleep because of insomnia, I could only fall asleep by squeezing out my physical strength with creation. I like to doodle, so I doodle anywhere, and I often write poetry (mainly about mizi) to support my emotions.”)

in comparison to many of the other ways till uses his hands (fighting, breaking things, playing loud and powerful melodies, etc), the way he handles the flowers is methodical. gentle. precise and careful.

we're shown his kinder side for the first time THROUGH a flower, too.

he knows his illusion is particularly fragile, so he does all he can to not mar it before getting lost in it. he uses it as a distraction.

till tends to trail behind mizi and sua with flower crowns/chains of his own because he wants to play with them as well, but he rarely makes the move to approach them.

at the end of the day, the false reality, the illusion of purity, is not till's to keep. no matter how peaceful the garden may seem, there will come a period of time when till has to go back. when he must be reminded that his body doesn't belong to him.

ivan never had much interest in the flowers. in fact, he was more often shown breaking them or stomping on them rather than playing with them. (whether that's because he KNEW about the cameras or simply because he wanted to piss till off (or both) im still iffy on but there's that)

ivan has always been the most connected to reality out of the group. he sought no form of escapism, in fact, he frowned upon it (he says mizi's optimism is too much for him at times, and criticized sua for living in a wonderland despite knowing how it will inevitably end. for nurturing mizi's innocence for so long and then shattering it in the cruelest way.)

he fell in love with till, who had no choice but to face reality head on and he relates to sua, who's also had her fate sealed by the society she lives in. he's very honest to himself about these facts.

he doesn't run from suffering, having been exposed to it since infancy. no point in avoiding the truth if it's being perpetually shoved in your face all the time. he keeps it real.

no interest in the flowers, no interest in a plastic paradise. (i could find a way to tie this to that one acrylic stand of ivan eating a flower but i think that's just a silly doodle. nothing SUPER DUPER deep about it.)

(look at him. what is his PROBLEM <3)

as for the overarching meaning, flowers in general tend to symbolize innocence, purity and beauty. by that logic, FAKE flowers would symbolize a fabrication of purity.

a flower that is not only fake, but used as a spying/restriction device, a tool of oppression, symbolizes a prison painted as a paradise--such is the world of Anakt Garden.

[eruanee]

On Round 7 and the utility of sacrifice

⚠️ ROUND 7 SPOILERS ⚠️

I wanted to use this post to respond to some criticism I've seen circulating about Round 7 — it mostly being about Till's death making Ivan's sacrifice useless.

To be fair, this post doesn't aim to dismiss anyone's feelings or criticisms about R7 or Till's (presumed) death, they're all incredibly valid! I even have my own that I will talk about later. This post's only goal is really just to start a conversation about the general narrative of ALNST and how to write a compelling narrative in general. No matter what I'll say, people resonate with stories differently and expect different things from them, and that's okay!

Personally, I truly didn't expect Till to die. Before R7 came out, I even texted a friend saying this:

– If one of them has to die, I think it'll be Luka. Till's protagonist syndrome is too strong and his death would be narratively flat, I believe. – Yeah.

And well, shot missed, unlike the one that shot through Till's neck.

Though, I really do believe Till might not be dead, not only because of the #copium but this isn't really the point of this post — I will assume he is so I can discuss what his death would actually mean to the narrative and how it would impact it.

I understand that no one (including myself) expected R7 to go that way. A lot of it had us realizing we might have gotten some elements of the story wrong — something I didn't take into consideration is that the round was probably rigged to make sure Luka would win, which makes sense because of course that Alien Stage isn't the fairest competition (and if Ivan's pictures on the billboards aren't part of Till's hallucinations, this is plainly evil).

R7 also had us wondering what the goal of the rebels truly is: did they even intend to save Till? If not, why did they save Mizi, what did they see in her? Unlike what I first thought, like many others, it seemingly wasn't a rescue mission.

When I watched R7 for the first time, I audibly gasped the moment I saw the "Luka wins" sign appears and Till being shot down. And I thought "Ah, so that's the kind of story VIVINOS wanted to make." I was already a huge fan of their work before ALNST began, mostly of their horror stuff. When I watched it, I knew I was about to sit in front of absolutely devastating content that would leave me sick. The tragedy was always cruel, often unrewarding, but I would always ask for more. Good thing ALNST now exists, uh!

I mention this to state I went into ALNST expecting roughly the same thing and it's essentially what I got. I didn't expect Till to die but his death, in a way, didn't surprise me. Did it make me sick though? It sure did!

I do agree R7 feels incomplete. I think it's interesting that I have not a single idea of what's going to happen next, but my biggest regret is indeed that Till's death doesn't seem to do justice to his character or characterization.

Till, the rebellious misfit, always breaking rules to the point he has to be physically restrained, completely beaten by despair and trauma once again, dying on stage after he got a slight glimpse of hope he can never actually reach.

This is peak tragedy, and a beautifully animated one at that, but it doesn't feel like a compelling character development. If Till is truly dead, then he dies with the potential of being so much more. And this is truly sad and disappointing.

And this is why his death would make me sadder than Sua's or Ivan's. They got to choose their deaths and what it would mean for them, Till didn't. He was suffering and overwhelmed. He only accepted his fate because he got to know Mizi was still alive before his final moments. He got to die in her embrace, which is probably the only thing he could've asked for if that were to happen.

Sua's death got to introduce us to the reality of Alien Stage.

Ivan's death was an emotional climax. It conclused his character arc in a devastating way, but gave him a meaningful ending nonetheless.

Their deaths let us understand what kind of world Alien Stage takes place in : a cruel world where humans are pets to aliens, if not simple disposal. A world where feelings are never reciprocated until it's too late, where you long for something impossible until you realize you should've paid attention to what was right in front of your eyes, too.

Alien Stage is a show where the candidates' suffering are seen and consumed as mere entertainment.

In this system, I believe Sua's and Ivan's meaningful deaths are anomalies. Till's death is the standard. An extremely unfair event, result of an extremely unfair competition. This isn't about who deserves to survive, but about who manages to. If anything, I think the aliens are relieved Till is dead, as he was mostly a bother to them. Luka is beloved and accommodating.

A world where death is the easy escape, if not almost a selfish one. Sacrifice is an act of love, but also an act of egocentricity. The sacrifice aims to be remembered as selfless and generous, but in the end, they only "run away without any sense of responsibility". The gift sounds beautiful when actually, it might only be rotten.

In such a world, how can a sacrifice ever be useful? I guess Ivan's wasn't. A sacrifice only happens to create a possibility, a chance, a what if.

Another very frustrating part of Till's death to me is that I thought he had the power to be a protagonist. I still stand by it but he was robbed of this agency. Him being used as a narrative device for Mizi's protagonist plotline (at least that's what I believe) feels a bit cruel, even narratively.

Alien Stage can be a frustrating story because it seems there is no way out, which is ultimately not something people are seeking for very often in a story. I still hope there's a way out somewhere, maybe not for Till, but that would already be something.

As for now, it seems Mizi's role is to manage to make Sua's sacrifice, as well as all of these deaths, worth something. This is the 50th season of Alien Stage. The pile of corpses is leaking red.

I do wonder where the story is going to head.

At the very least, Till wasn't unknown till the end. You could say that being loved, even for a blink, makes one's life worthy to be lived.

[macarxncito]

Thoughts on KARMA (ALNST) (Part 2)

<< Part 1, Part 3 >>

!!!! MAJOR ALNST SPOILERS BELOW !!!!

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Return of the fallen angel motif <3 they're literally falling <3 it's not subtle in the slightest <3

Notice that Luka isn't present in this clip, I'm not entirely sure why but I think maybe it's reflecting Mizi's own views on Luka and how she doesn't see him as being worthy of forgiveness?????

My apologies... I'm about to talk about IvanTill again... BECAUSE HOLY SHIT IF THIS DOESN'T CONFIRM THAT IVANTILL ISN'T UNREQUITED THEN NOTHING DOES

Till appears confused and uncertain before he grabs Ivan's hand (emphasis on the fact that Till grabs Ivan's hand). He then looks at Ivan (Till looks at Ivan, they actually meet each other's gaze for once and Till is the one that initiates it, should I just kms) and smiles at him and we can see the way his gaze physically softens

YOU ALL DON'T UNDERSTAND THEY MAKE ME SO VIOLENTLY ILL THIS WHOLE MOMENT MAKES ME SO VIOLENTLY ILL

IvanTill you will always be my favorite example of a romance doomed by miscommunication and the circumstances of its existence that could've been beautiful if only given enough time </3 right person not enough time type shit </3

~~~

We finally got our MiziSua kiss!!!!!! A win for yuri nation <3

I think what's interesting about this to me is that it does confirm that kissing is still an act of love in the alnst universe, when the ivti kiss happened in r6 people were analyzing it and arguing that kisses might not have the same meaning that they do in our world but this scene seems to dismiss that argument

That being said, I don't think it's entirely appropriate to compare the MiziSua kiss to the IvanTill kiss because their circumstances are very obviously different, this is very obviously meant to be a gentle and loving kiss while the r6 kiss was a whole other issue lol

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I've seen people say that the ending to alnst doesn't do Hyuna justice and that her character kind of got tossed aside but I think this moment and these lines disprove that

Hyuna is a very tragic character and also one that I think many can find relatable in the way that she spent her life running from her past. Every seemingly selfless decision she made held a secret selfishness as she sought to bury her pain beneath a sense of justice and Mizi was the only one that could see it (perhaps she saw it in herself as well)

I think people who see her as a dissatisfying character probably haven't listened to her sub songs

Also almost forgot to point out that Hyuna has a Luka poster

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Just wanted to include this because I think these lines are the main message of alnst as a whole <3

And also because the visuals are beautiful lol the one with the rabbits kinda reminds of vivinos' Tili Tili Bom video (I know those were rats in that video but you get the vibe)

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I don't see enough people acknowledging just how beaten up Mizi got by her own fellow rebels, I guess it's kinda fucked up that she rerouted the missile and also shot Isaac's leg but still goddamn lol

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The fact that even as she holds Till's body in her arms she's still thinking about Sua </3 love a queen who haunts the narrative

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This was the moment when I realized I'd have to apologize to a lot of my friends lol

Listen gang, I really did not think Till would still be alive!!!!!! I didn't think vivimeng would pull a plot twist like that!!!!!!! Especially after almost a full calendar year!!!!!!!! It makes me very conflicted because of course I'm happy one of my favorite characters of all time is alive but I'm also frustrated with myself for being so confidently wrong lmao

I've also found it difficult to be enthusiastic when I've already received so many I-told-you-so's from an obnoxious number of Till alivists lol

Anyway, welcome back to my favorite latino

This expression... omg gang... she could hear his heartbeat... she was ready to lay down her own life and sacrifice every last person on that stage and yet... she knew she had to get him out of there... she'd just gotten beaten by her own comrades and yet still she reached out to Isaac with such desperation on her face so she could ensure Till's safety

~~~

It's not clear in the screenshots with the way the subtitles are laid out but Isaac specifically says "to love" when Sua's on screen and "and be loved" when Ivan's on screen

Just wanted to target this specifically at the people who say Ivan was loved by no one (SO loud and SO wrong)

<< Part 1, Part 3 >>

[tabsters]

Official Alien Stage Covers I Think Would Be Cool If They Happened

thought too much while I took a long shower hot enough to cook me alive while listening to every alien stage song

NUMBER 1:

if wiege ends up being a duet between luka and hyuna (it probably will [PLEASE say its a duet between hyunaluka vivinos]), then that makes 3 songs for our three main duos. since mizisua covered cure and ivantill covered my clematis, what about a hyunaluka cover of cure and my clematis? and in turn, a mizisua and ivantill cover of wiege? a total of nine songs and some serious mashup potential between all of them.

NUMBER 2:

an Ivan cover of sweet dream and a sua cover of black sorrow. THE SIBLINGS EVER. I think it would be so cool if Ivan covered sweet dream (there's already a fanmade English version here), and it would complete the trinity of sua, luka, and Ivan as being "the perfect ones", since luka already has a cover of sweet dream. and a sua cover of black sorrow is just a personal need because I want more black sorrow and I want more sua.

NUMBER 3:

a mizi cover of all-in and a hyuna cover of unknown (till the end). till, mizi, and hyuna have already been established as "the rebellious ones" to contrast the other three's perfection in the eyes of the aliens. mizi's cover of all-in could be a representation of her getting over her grief and her fully embracing life in the rebellion. I think a hyuna cover of unknown (till the end) could be an AU for what if she reciprocated Luka's love for her (but hopefully we'll find more out about hyunaluka in wiege. COME ON VIVINOS PLEASE.)

NUMBER 4:

an Ivan cover of blink gone and a hyuna cover of blink gone. I think that these two are going to be the most likely covers, because of what studio lico did with ruler of my heart. mizi and luka are not a duo, so a sua and hyuna cover of ruler of my heart was released—by doing this, they're reuniting the duo (idk if I'm making sense). in the same way, I think an Ivan and hyuna cover of blink gone will be released in order to "match" with till and luka.

NUMBER 5:

this isn't really a cover idea but I really want to know what the song luka sang in round four was. (also, sources apparently differ on whether round four actually happened or if vivinos decided to just not show round four in order to make the audience sympathize less with him).

[sylver-drawer]

Karma Spoilers/3AM Analysis-Theories

TW, mentions of s*icidal thoughts

Getting the more obvious stuff out of the way:

- Till lives (joined the Rebellion, saving kids while carrying the memory of everyone with him)

- Luka forced to face what he had done, still alive and honoring Hyuna’s wish, but is still obviously wrecked and after healing from the explosion was put back into the system (I can’t see this as a happy ending for him)

- Mizi implied to have died in the explosion after making sure Till had been saved (given Isaac’s monologue as if ‘the witch’ had died long ago)

Deciphering the ink-hearts:

- Bleeding makes me think reciprocation(?) or at least the feelings being understood somehow

- Alternatively—the hearts also signified who died, and who lived.

- Ivan taking his heart out and forcing it onto Till, and his heart breaks (his feelings were seen?) notice—no Till heart seen or shown to be cracked, with the latter point of it signifying that Till lived

- Luka, in one hand an unbroken heart (Luka’s heart?), with Hyunwoo grasping Hyuna’s chest and the implication of both their hearts being broken (Point One Theory=Hyuna and Hyunwoo’s affection were made clear to eachother, but Luka never got to make his love completely clear and Point Two Theory=Hyuna and Hyunwoo’s heart broken, but Luka’s in tact means he lived when those two died)

- Both Luka and Till’s hearts being implied to be in tact is what leads me to think of the Point Two theory (unbroken heart = live, broken = dead)

- MiziSua has one shared heart, but bleeding profusely (the most reciprocated/love known to eachother)

- Also with the Point Two theory, both halves bleeding mean both do end up dead

MORE ON MIZISUA. Ok, so many thoughts, and so many clarifications now, but more than anything I am vehemently denying the toxic MiziSua pipeline:

- Mizi and Sua wanted to die. They both came to Alien Stage to die.

- Mizi attempted(?), but after seeing how distraught and in pain Sua was, tried to live for her instead.

- (To Hyuna, about Sua) “She was secretly rehearsing her death every night. And I knew, but pretended not to. Maybe I just wasn’t as desperate for her (she couldn’t figure out how to make Sua want to live, while Sua made her want to live). I know my love is different from yours (Hyuna’s love for Luka(?)), but it was love, too.”

- On the same note, Sua was also constantly trying to die—but not in the way Mizi was. Sua was trying to die, but specifically when she and Mizi are to go against eachother. They had access to materials, and like Mizi could easily walk off the edge—but she didn’t want to die before the stage—and Mizi didn’t want to die as long as Sua was by her side.

- That means both girls lived for eachother. For as long as they could, until outside factors had to force a choice to be made.

- At around 1:00 at the MiziSua squabble, and with my previous analysis, I think I was right—my initial analysis when the teaser dropped, being that Sua told Mizi they couldn’t tie while Mizi was trying for one.

- As their fight ends, both girls are absolutely heartbroken with tears welling up in their eyes. The line that lines up with them, at around 1:04, is “You and me, or We”. It’s death—before Sua smiles at Mizi reassuringly.

- Sua chose to be the one to die, and without Sua, Mizi wills to die.

- The scene that follows is Mizi ruining the Rebel’s plan, turning the bomb around to Alien Stage—where she is. This scene lines up with the lyrics then, “Me, together with you”. Mizi intends to die, now joining Sua (together).

All of Karma is Mizi feeling undeserving of life. It makes me think of Mizi’s thoughts in “My Fragile God”—that when she’s loved, she feels as if she’s been given permission for life. The scene that follows is Mizi—alone—as dead children comfort her (“To Eternity, or perhaps even beyond”). Everyone she loves, everyone that loved her, are dead—so she sees no point in living. She’s concrete in her plan to die—what she feels is what she deserves for her ignorance.

I wonder if that’s why she wants Till to live, the moment she realizes he’s alive. He’s the only one left, one of the people she loves and one who loves her—and someone who always loved honestly, true to himself and what he loved.

[crustyfloor]

(sorry to the anon I couldn't answer directly because cough tumblr being an idiot cough)

1) Since My Clematis encapsulates sincere love in Alnst, and Cure represents the tragic side of it, and Wiege represents humanity and its perseverance, I think the theme of Karma will be grief & death (and it will include remembrance, maybe, or in other terms flashbacks).

And with what we know about the general theme of Alnst, it will then center Mizi, Till, and Luka's grief, the essential "cause and effect" of their actions leading up to the deaths of those they held dear, and then how they faced the impact and consequences head-on from there. With that, I think Karma will also show how humans can persevere through it, even when it's grim (It makes sense to me for these aspects of the story to be amalgamated into the very last episode with this specific cast)

(I think that mostly cause of these flowers tbh.. flowers especially in funeral settings can symbolize death and rebirth, etc, and they remind me of Anakt gravesites, so that's grief, but Mizi Luka and Till also have a theme as the ones who had to live after Sua, HyunA, and Ivan's deaths) It's meant to be...

So if they go w/ this ^ then Mizi, Till, and Luka's perspectives and how they lived through the consequences of their actions and a fate that they didn't anticipate will be coordinated around to send this message and let us into their minds and how grief distorts and impacts them

(and yeah they'll all have shared survivor's guilt, trust me)

(This also means we get to see scenes of these three at their lowest. CURE FROM TILL'S PERSPECTIVE!!)

2)

(actually...I suspect this graphic not appearing with Luka and Mizi the same way it did with Mizi and HyunA hints that neither Mizi nor Luka will die... nobody will die the alive trio will survive 😇)

5) I suspect Mizi will end up finding some sense of peace by the end of the video, not like she’s fully getting over Sua or forgiving herself entirely, however in this current arc, where she's faced with consequences, and she's ultimately blaming herself for them is being set up to be resolved. She’s the kind of person to understand and get back up again, so it’ll happen somehow.

6) SOMEONE will finally get on the stage with the defibrillator so they can reccesuitate Till's lazy ass

7) A LITTLE BIT OF CURE FROM TILL'S PERSPECTIVE!

8) Karma will be a Mizi solo but I actually think it will sound a little more harsh or distorted, I can't get "Worst case scenario" -(nastyona) out of my head... now I think Karma itself will have a nastyona-esc sound, maybe for the little throwback to the trigger series (or that's my favoritism for that series talking) plus I think there will be dialogue sequences

9) More hyper-realistic and low-key eerie frames this time around that symbolize the self-sacrificial and theological themes of Mizi and Sua's dynamic & a reflection of the way Sua "haunts" Mizi's narrative.. yesss 🤤

10) I don't think Mizi will take her mental breakdown out on Luka and do anything to him directly, so no sneakily shooting Luka in the ass

11) Till breathing

12) At least a hopeful ending . Please, "The happy ending is where they all die." propaganda is like the cheese touch to me 🙎‍♂️

After we've been shown humans living with hope in a world like this in Wiege, even despite the odds and the rebellion's existence itself, I think it'd be a nice touch to see the rebels' plan to reconnect humanity through this rocket and HyunA's efforts and passion be seen through in the story. I'm not sure how that would play out, but why would Vivinos put those efforts and all that build-up in vain if not to set up a hopeless ending contrary to what messages and goals have been conveyed thus far in this series? I also think it will open up a chance for the remaining cast to get off the dubiously explodable stage this time. I want the characters to live to see this message through, if all goes well

13) i want till to live (gets blown up)

[one-selective-bitch]

Sua & Ivan

They and their counterpart are touching hands in a symmetrical way

They and their counterpart both are facing us so they are asymmetrical

we see their faces

They are smiling at us

There's blood on them, in the places associated with their death

Till

He's touching his counterpart's hand with the opposite one, so it's asymmetrical

He's facing his counterpart, so it's symmetrical

We don't see their faces

For what we see of the counterpart face, he's not smiling

There's no trace of blood

They're total opposites

I know I've already made posts about these official arts but I wanted to list all the differences I've noticed

My conclusions are always the same:

Till's alive bc even tho he's grouped with the dead characters he's the odd one out and also bc he doesn't have any blood on him

He's different bc he didn't die sacrificing himself like the others but losing the round as he tried to reach for his last hope (Mizi)

We still don't know what's going on on his head unlike Sua and Ivan that got their own introspective mini comics

But seriously, at least to me, it looks like Vivimeng are trying to keep ambigouous his death as much as possible which is kinda sus

[tilltheend153]

All Evidence That Till Is Alive - recap

This post will cover (mostly) everything that has hinted to Till's survival before the release of karma. The main reason why I'm making this post is mainly because I've grown tired of people calling till alive believers ''delusional'' or not realising the hints that have been given out and getting shocked that he actually survived. I do not have all the hints gathered here and there are actually more that I lost and are unable to find, unfortunately. Most of these are gathered from my own observations and things that others have pointed out

1. Till's 'All In' cover

This is the earliest foreshadowing from what I know of. The red tape plastered on his neck was the same spot that was shot and this might've also foreshadowed the fact that he's currently mute (or at least partially mute) as a result of that shot and in a way foreshadowing his survival since no other character that is dead nor alive for that matter has this tape. The tape could symbolise bandages, hence foreshadowing his survival.

2. This scene in Round 7

People saw this as confirmation that Till is truly dead. That's understandable, since Till is recalling a fond memory which is what happens when you die - your life flashes by your eyes. However, the question is, why SPECIFICALLY this memory? Especially a memory in which Till and Mizi are hiding from the aliens? It's sneaky, Mizi telling him playfully to keep quiet. And unlike the flashbacks in the other rounds that contain multiple scenes, round 7 only has this flashback (other than Till's traumatic flashbacks of Ivan) which feels deliberate. This hinted a sort of rebellion that the two are doing, a sort of narrative purpose for this deliberate scene.

3. The monitor ear bud fell off

This ear bud device monitors heart rate. The fact that it fell off after Till got shot means that the aliens would not be able to detect if he's actually dead. If he was actually alive, they would have no way of finding out or finishing the job.

4. The blood loss

There is noticeably less blood as opposed to Sua's and Ivan's death.

5. His image was the only one that flickered

Unlike the rest which blacked out completely, Till's picture actually flickers before it blacks out.

6. 흔적 - Trace

This comic is on the love Io has for Till carrying on through him. If Till is carrying that love on, it would not be possible for him to do so if he was dead. It would also make more sense to have such a hopeful comic if Till was alive, rather than dead (and he is alive). You would expect a comic from his perspective if he’s dead since we haven’t explored that. And yet, we got this instead.

7. OFF THE RECORD (Actor AU)

Do you see the ominous tape? 🤨 This reinforces the first point for the 'All in' cover art.

8. Love hate art

Till is coloured here, just like Luka and Mizi in the other two love hate arts. The both of them survived as well, hinting that he's in the ''I'm alive!'' team.

9. This art

It looks like there's some sort of blood transfusion happening...hm. The environment is obviously in anakt garden and the artificiality of the walls give you this feeling of fakeness, like this is all fake.

10. Vision after

Over here, Till's art is the only one that doesn't look back while Sua's and Ivan has them looking back. Very deliberate, if you ask me.

11. It doesn't make sense if he died

This one is less of a hint and more of depending on your understanding of the story.

Narrative wise, it didn't make sense for Till to die. Sua died as a shock factor, the first sacrifice, the thing that kick started Mizi's character development. Ivan died by the time we already knew him. We knew his personality, his view on himself, why he sacrificed himself and etc. In this case it didn't make sense for Till to die.

Ivan and Sua had a motive for dying, their sacrifices were meant for the other to survive. Till dying would essentially render Ivan's sacrifice useless. Ivan's death was fulfilling because his narrative was complete, Till's wasn't. We still haven't got his perspective at that point of time. It'll be a waste to kill him off so early without fully exploring his character, his point of view.

Unlike Ivan and Sua who died with a smile, Till ''died'' without smiling, because he didn’t want to die (smiling at Mizi wasn't counted because that smile was one filled with hope to survive + he wasn't smiling as he slowly passes out). That's just tragic and doesn't make sense narratively. Sua died for Mizi, Ivan died for Till and Hyuna died for Luka; all the characters that died did so in sacrifice and love, so the other would live on. There's this theme of love and loss. These characters that lived were meant to carry that love and live on.

To kill off Till without exploring his character completely AND render Ivan's sacrifice useless didn't make sense from a writer's point of view. It would've been such a waste. Ultimately, killing him off would've cut his character arc short. He hasn't even internalised Ivan's death yet, he just learn Mizi was alive, he just got a spark of hope, and then what? He just... dies like that?

The entirety of round 7 would've been lukewarm if Till really did die. It's predictable, considering Luka's fanbase and what not. You could tell that Till would lose even if he tried his best unless he pulled something that can actually shake Luka...and the only thing that could shake this guy is Hyuna. So unless Till imitates her and does a whole uno reverse back at Luka, it's highly improbably that he would've won, let alone survived. This is ESPECIALLY the case when you consider the fact that round 6 and round 7 were on the same day, right after Ivan sacrifices his death for Till. See? Predictable.

Of COURSE Vivimeng and the team would pull something so absolutely heart wrenching and suspenseful to us. Of COURSE it isn't that predictable. Otherwise, it would've been pretty disappointing.

In the end, I was right. Till is alive and I am coping ☕

[redrandomposts]

For Posthumous Kid AU - this actually implies that segyeins have the DNA of *all* contestants...can we have a MiziSua kid in the neighboring lab? Double the pain! (Also, Till&Mizi rolling through the same/very similar experience and bonding over it is always good.) ((Chartreuse eyes under elegant inky locks is also quite an image -u-.))

Ah, the pain and the bittersweet contentedness of living on...

mizisua kid, where mizi is raising them... and tillivan's kid too...

===

"Slow down!" Mizi yelled, shoulder-length hair fluttering in the wind as she ran for her kid. Compared to her twenties, her joints just didn't move the same. A decade or so of aging really wore her body down.

"Hurry up, ma, I see Sara!" Her precious little boy yelled, a bright smile lighting his face. Mizi could remember the day she found him - an infant curled up, short black hair and wide eyes curiously looking at everyone passing by. He was sucking on his thumb, chartreuse (as Ivan called it) eyes peering into her soul. It was the nose, or the lips, or even the ears that told her all she needed to know; this was her and Sua's child. Looking at him now, with wide brim glasses and thin summer clothes, she could see how they both mixed to create someone wonderful.

From the horizon, a taller child ran into view. Long black hair that shone gray in the sunlight, with a black and white dress that billowed in the wind marked her silhouette. Most of all, eyes that were as blue as the sky and pupils red as a sunset told Mizi and Till all they needed to know; this was Ivan's flesh and blood mixed with Till's. Only a year older than her own, Sara managed to show everything that Ivan could have - hope, joy, and love that she knew was returned unconditionally.

Mizi wondered if Ivan would have shone so bright had he been alive.

"Clematis!" Sara yelled, tackling her best friend. Behind her, Till was watching forlornly, and Mizi could relate. It reminded her of her and Sua when they were little; the way they fell into the grass, grins big and bright and so so so full of love.

"Ma showed me how to make flower crowns!" Clematis said, turning to his mom who held a basket of flowers they've grown in the gardens. "Ma, ma, I wanna make one for Sara!"

Mizi laughed, a bell-like sound that has rung for both eternal happiness and mourning. "Of course, Clematis. You can show Sara how to make one too, right?"

"Uh huh!" Clematis nodded, and soon both of the children's attention were engrossed in each other and their flowers.

After a moment, Mizi turned to Till. "Till," she breathed. His eyes were red and puffy, yet the small uplift of his lips spoke volumes. "What nightmare did you have last night...?"

"I was... dreaming that Ivan was here, too, joining in the activities as if he were a child also," Till said, chuckling at the thought. "It's almost his anniversary, y'know?"

She did know. Mizi also knew Sua's, could hear the gunshot every morning she awoke the day they performed their stage together and never finished it. She could feel the cold sweat and warm blood as Hyuna was injured, delaying their rescue and leaving Ivan's corpse behind; she could feel the guilt as though it were bugs crawling up her skin and spine and muscles and flesh and blood.

Till turned to Mizi. "I wrote him a song, and painted something with all of us... Sua, too. I made a copy for you, too, Mizi. It's just that..." he hesitated, taking out the rolled up print to display it. "...I can't really remember their faces. I'm so grateful that I have Sara, or else I'd forget his eyes and the way his hair fell, the smirk that he'd always have when taking something..."

Mizi had the same problem, too. When she imagined Sua, she'd imagine her face before she died. She forgot the way she smiled before, when she didn't look so tense, forgot her embrace and touch and everything else. It's been eight years, and the way she remembers best is through archived videos of her only performance and her son, Clematis.

"I know Ivan would love Sara," Till breathed, looking at the sky wistfully. The clouds peacefully floated by, an image so unreal when before all Mizi saw were a fake hologram of it. "He'd love Clematis, too. He'd sneak candy and sing lullabies and read bedtime stories, cook breakfast and lunch and dinner, learn to bake their favorite treats..."

Tears welled up in both their eyes, dazzling in the sun. The laughter of the children seemed so far yet so close too, and if she listened closely, she could hear Sua and Ivan, too. Sua would adore the children, she knew. Sua... maybe she wouldn't be as good as Ivan at children, but she'd teach them the magical way she always solved math equations so easily, teach them faith and hope and that there is always someone for you, too.

===

i came up with sara when thinking of what till would name her. it comes from black sorrow, because sara sounds kind of like sorrow; he hazily listened to it as ivan performed, trying his best to grasp consciousness for... something. he didn't know then, but he knew now.

clematis, although sounding kind of like a girl's name because it refers to a flower, feels like the most obvious choice.

idk if i was really in character for them, but... it's been eight years since the events. they've had time to grow and reflect.

[applestorms]

HEY JUST SAW YOUR TAGS ON WRT MIZISUA AND YES OMG EXACTLY!!! that’s how i felt about mizisua for a long time until finally the fucked up potential got to me good and now it’s a secondary tier otp as well. everyone please focus more on that stuff!!!!

YES!!! fuck.

it’s the idolization to a fault, natural consequences of making One (1) person the center of your God, World, and Universe. hey guys stop making AUs where they’re both happy and alive. let’s talk about how sua dying only makes mizi blow her up into something even bigger and brighter and more beautiful in her mind, less human and less real. let’s talk about how naïve mizi is to think that they could ever survive this or tie in the first place. let’s talk about the fact that their scores are one single fucking point apart.

i get the parallels but like— guys. c’mon. why are we talking about sua like she’s just a blander, flatter girl-ivan, that score clearly does Not speak to the same kind of intentional sacrifice on her end. she was giving her all for most of that fucking duet. it’s frankly still kind of unclear to me whether or not mizi was actually Aware of the fact that this is a Death Game (or, really, how the fuck she could NOT know considering she’s watched the show before?? i know all her friends like lying to her about the three different flavors of abuse they’re living through but like. c’mon) but regardless, sua clearly knew. how the hell would she manipulate their scores to be that close?? did she see it as a lose/lose and accept the consequences either way, all for the chance to sing on stage with her bestie??? like— if she dies, she doesn’t have to care anymore, but if she lives, then hey mercy kill at least mizi doesn’t have to suffer? what is she like when she’s not stuck as the singular object of mizi’s affections? did mizisua seriously manage to drag both till and ivan into this show, and therefore their deaths through their dumb unrequited crush geometry? how are the scores even formulated? how can mizi be so goddamn oblivious? what happens to the anakt kids that don’t get on the show?

hey. sua. how does it feel to be relegated to the tragic backstory.

[ur-local-weird-person]

mizisua analysis :) (spoilers!!)

hello :), ik i'm a little late, but the mizisua video already released and here is a small analysis i made, this post will be divided in 2 parts: the actual analysis of the video and how it proves a theory i had, so without furder ado, lets start （。＾▽＾）

the actual analysis lol ─── ☆: .☽ . :☆ﾟ. ─── ☆: .☽ . :☆ﾟ.

i think the video was a nightmare of mizi, my reasons are:

mizi and sua canonicly met at anakt garden, and we dont have information of them meeting before

it doesn't seem logical to me that mizi cried so hard when sua went away, taking into account it was the first time they saw eachother

at the end of the video we can se mizi layed in a couch, crying, as if she just woke up from a nightmare (i will talk more about that scene later)

other thing i noticed is that the video references certain parts of sua's amd mizi's story, for example, mizi being the one who approached sua while the melody of my clemantis (specificly the part of when mizi and sua met in round 1), melody that also reproduces when mizi and sua separate (and the part that played was the same as when sua died), that's why i think the video was a nightmare of mizi who reflected some parts of their story and how painful their separation was (ik it hurts ;-;).

at the end, we see mizi laying and crying after waking up from the nightmare, and since i was curious about that scene i edited the photo and i found some things :)

we can observe that:

mizi is wearing her round 5 oufit and her hair looks a little messy (like in the end of round 5)

she seems to be in a place that looks like if its abandonded, or slightly hidden, it looks like a hideout to me (or at least, not the place where the contestants would be kept before the next round)

there is an earth poster in the wall

taking this into account...could this mean that mizi is alive and she's currently in the hideout of the people who rescued her???? this seems to make sense but idk (i hope i'm right :') )

small theory :) ─── ☆: .☽ . :☆ﾟ. ─── ☆: .☽ . :☆ﾟ.

in previous posts, i mentioned that i had a theory abt sua, my theory is that sua was mistreated by her guardians and that mizi was the only person she ever loved, also sua knew abt the dangers abt alien stage, but decided to not tell mizi (if you want i could explain why i thought that). the video proves my theory bc it shows that sua's guardians never loved her (her situation is similar to ivan's/luka's) but it also shows that mizi's guardians were nice to her (could mizi be manipulated by them into thinking alien stage wasn't dangerous? maybe). finally, i would like to note how it was shown the differences between growing in a negligent/abusive enviroment and a loving one (sua and mizi respectively), i think the way it was shown and how it affected mizi and sua was pretty goood :)

that's it, tell me if you have other theories, bye!