#smp george analysis

[bleue-flora]

So um, in light of my last post I was inspired to look into other dsmp people's ages because I feel like we don’t really think about it too often and oh does it make things interesting…

Just for reference and consideration, here are some United States Legal Age Minimums:

Drive: 16-18

Adult: 18-21

Vote: 18

Drink Alcohol: 21

Political Office: 25 (Representative) 30 (Senator) 35 (President)

Military: 17-18

Also Note: On average the brain is scientifically not fully developed until age 25 - and oh wouldn't you know it 90% of the server fall under that, meaning no wonder we have a bunch of wars their prefrontal cortex isn't fully developed and wouldn't you know it that part of the brain is responsible for regulating attention, behavior, and emotion as well as the processing that Actions Have Consequences... huh whelp that makes sense.

Anyways… age data is below (I didn't do everyone nor every event - nobody got time for that ;D... I didn't have time for this to begin with lol...) But I specifically want to highlight that not only was Dream 21 from Jan-Aug of his Imprisonment, but Sam was also 21 till Jun, and Quackity was literally 20 while he was daily torturing Dream... 20?! They were roughly a year apart, all of them so close. Like can you imagine, treating your peer like that? Sam is like a couple months older than Dream and that's it. Quackity can't even drink legally in the United States. That's insane...

(* to signify canonical Immortality)

Ok, so the full list of members and ages is at the bottom, but first, here are so key events I picked just to highlight their ages at the time.

Server Creation - April 24, 2020

GeorgeNotFound - 23 Callahan - 23 Dream - 20 Sapnap - 19

L'Manberg War - August 2, 2020

BadBoyHalo - 25 WilburSoot - 23 GeorgeNotFound - 23 Callahan - 23 Punz - 23 Eret - 21 Awesamdude - 21 Dream - 20 Fundy - 20 Skeppy - 20 Ponk - 20 Quackity - 19 Sapnap - 19 Niki Nihachu - 19 Jack Manifold - 17 Purpled - 16 Tubbo - 16 Tommy - 16

Pogtopia vs Manberg War - November 16th, 2020

Philza - 32* BadBoyHalo - 25 HBomb - 26 WilburSoot - 24 GeorgeNotFound - 24 Callahan - 23 Punz - 23 Karl Jacobs -22 Antfrost - 22 CaptainPuffy - 22 Eret - 21 Technoblade - 21* Awesamdude - 21 Dream - 21 Connor - 21 Schlatt - 21 Fundy - 21 Skeppy - 20 Ponk - 20 Quackity - 19 Sapnap - 19 Niki Nihachu - 19 Jack Manifold - 18 Purpled - 17 Ranboo - 17 Tubbo - 16 Tommy - 16

Exile - December 4, 2020

Ghostbur - 24 Technoblade - 21* Dream - 21 Ranboo - 17 Tubbo - 16 Tommy - 16

Doomsday - January 6, 2021

Philza - 32* HBomb - 27 Callahan - 23 Punz - 23 CaptainPuffy - 22 Eret - 21 Technoblade - 21* Dream - 21 Fundy - 21 Ponk - 20 Quackity - 20 Sapnap - 19 Niki Nihachu - 19 Jack Manifold - 18 Ranboo - 17 Tubbo - 17 Tommy - 16

Disc Confrontation - January 20, 2021

HBomb - 27 BadBoyHalo - 25 Callahan - 24 Punz - 23 Antfrost - 22 CaptainPuffy - 22 Eret - 22 Awesamdude - 21 Dream - 21 Ponk - 20 Quackity - 20 Sapnap - 19 Niki Nihachu - 19 Jack Manifold - 18 Ranboo - 17 Tubbo - 17 Tommy - 16

Quackity’s First Prison Visit - March 16, 2021

Awesamdude - 21 Dream - 21 Quackity - 20

Techno's Visit- June 6, 2021

Technoblade - 22* Awesamdude - 21 Dream - 21

Jailbreak - November 28, 2021

Philza - 33* HBomb - 27 BadBoyHalo - 26 George - 25 Callahan - 24 Punz - 24 Karl Jacobs - 23 Antfrost - 23 CaptainPuffy - 23 Foolish Gamers - 22 Eret - 22 Technoblade - 22* Awesamdude - 22 Dream - 22 Connor - 22 Fundy - 22 Skeppy - 21 Hannahxxrose - 21 Ponk - 21 Quackity - 20 Sapnap - 20 Niki Nihachu - 20 Jack Manifold - 19 Purpled - 18 Ranboo - 18 Tubbo - 17 Tommy - 17

Comprehensive List From Oldest to Youngest: Name - Date of Birth (Current Age) - [Join Date] Age when Joined

Philza- March 1, 1988 (36) – [Nov 16, 2020]  32 *Immortal*

HBomb- Jan 4, 1994 (30) – [Sept 22, 2020]  26

BadBoyHalo- April 2, 1995 (28) – [May 19, 2020]  25

Wilbur- Sept 14, 1996 (27) – [July 12, 2020] 23

GeorgeNotFound- Nov 1, 1996 (27) – [April 24, 2020]  23

Callahan- Jan 19, 1997 (27) – [April 24, 2020]  23 

Punz- Jan 31, 1997 (27) – [July 7, 2020]  23  

Karl Jacobs- July 19, 1998 (25) – [Aug 26, 2020]  22 

Antfrost- Aug 27, 1998 (25) – [Sep 5, 2020]  22 

Captain Puffy- Sept 18, 1998 (25) – [Nov 16, 2020]  22

Foolish Gamers- Dec 18, 1998 (25) – [Jan 16, 2021]  22 *Immortal*

Eret- Jan 9, 1999 (25) – [July 19, 2020]  21

Technoblade- June 1, 1999 (23) – [Sept 22, 2020]  21 *Immortal*

Awesamdude - June 8, 1999 (24) – [April 28, 2020]  20 

Dream - Aug 12, 1999 (24) – [April 24, 2020]  20

Connor- Aug 26, 1999 (24) – [Nov 16, 2020]  21

Schlatt- Sept 10, 1999 (24) – [Sept 20, 2020]  21 

Fundy- Oct 10, 1999 (24) – [July 7, 2020]  20 

Skeppy- Jan 17, 2000 (24) – [July 18, 2020]  20 

Ponk- April 18, 2000 (23) – [May 7, 2020]  20 

Quackity- Dec 28, 2000 (23) – [Aug 11, 2020]  19 

Sapnap- March 1, 2001 (23) – [April 24, 2020]  19 

Niki Nihachu- Nov 3, 2001 (22) – [Aug 6, 2020]  18 

Jack Manifold- Aug 14, 2002 (21) – [Aug 3, 2020]  17 

Purpled- Oct 24, 2003 (20) – [July 9, 2020]  16

Ranboo- Nov 2, 2003 (20) – [Nov 17, 2020]  17 

Tubbo- Dec 23, 2003 (20) – [July 7, 2020]  16 

Tommy- April 9, 2004 (19) – [July 4, 2020]  16 

They are all babies confirmed... things make so much more sense... brain development guys it's important ;)

[cearthduo]

Decoding c!George: Discussing the fandoms mischaracterization and disregard of Gnf [Explaining George's character.]

Note : I will not be using "c!" because i find it tedious, but this is about the dsmp characters. I will be using she/her pronouns for George throughout this blog and all of the following ones. If this bothers you, feel free to read this using whichever pronouns you prefer. Enjoy.

I couldn't count on seven hands the amount of times i've been hit with "Does George even have lore??" in response to me mentioning her at all. Due to how obnoxiously genuine I find that question usuallyis, I decided to start a little series! In it, I'll be going into depth about George's lore whilst critiquing, hating, and debunking common potrayals/headcanons for the character.

This post will focus on George's general character traits, while the next ones will go more in depth on specific arcs, details, dynamics and theories. The next planned posts will be about George's lore and Dnf.

Alright, now that the introductory portion is out of the way, I can start with the analysis. The first step to understanding a character is figuring who the character is. So our first section will be talking about the basics of c!George as well as common potrayals, misinformation and more below the cut.

The bones of c!George ))

Let me also get this out out the way first and foremost: George a fully developed character. Traits of ccGeprge should Not impact your portrayal of her AT ALL.

With that out of the way, how do you portray George correctly? Who is this character? What are her motivations?

At her core, George is actually a very similar character to Dream. George also craves power and control. They have the same aspirations (that being the servers reunion and a return to the early days of the smp), the same opinions on L'manberg and Tommy (George's takes during the pog v swag debate seem to parrot Dream's (or rather, Dream parrots George later)), the same violent outbursts in response to a loss of control or respect, and the same belief that they are above the rules of the server.

A big part of c!George's character is her obsession with strength and power. This has been a core part of her since the very beginning of the server. Prior to L'manbergs existence, George spent the majority of her time maxing out her armor and weapons. She was the first member to have fully enchanted gear, and it was op. To the point that Dream and Sapnap wanted to strip her of everything because she was using her power to terrorize the server and they couldn't fight back. Due to this, George was the first character to ever be labeled a tyrant.

Contrary to most potrayals, George is a very social and energetic character. She'll talk to and hang out with anyone on the server, despite any negative relations. People typically portray her as being constantly sluggish or lazy, but this portrayal is incredibly inaccurate. George does not sleep for long periods because she's tired, but because she lacks the ability to wake up. This is shown during the elections where George is genuinely upset and bothered by the fact she wasn't able to attend. Whenever she's actually active on the server she's always in action, running around, building things, pvping, gathering resources, etc. Her constant sleeping/dreaming does not define her character and instead something that seen as negative even by George herself.

George also tends to cling to titles that represent power. The most prominent example of this is the dethronement conflict, where George tries to keep the title of king. It's to the point where she plans a takeover of the entire smp in order to reinstate herself as leader. George also seems very keen on taking control of L'manberg, saying at one point that "It could've all been [hers]" had she made it to the election. In the godhood stream, George continuously refers to herself as "God" even denying XD's divinity. When Karl says that there's already a god of the smp, George replies with "I am God." She even has the confidence to call herself God to XD's face. She seems to see herself as powerful even when she lacks power. A good example of this is her telling Eryn that she's king of the smp, despite having lost the title an entire year prior.

It's very common for people to lean into George's "apathy" in their portrayals. Although it is a part of her character, it's commonly over-exaggerated or misplaced. Usually, George's lack of awareness is accidental. She lacks a lot of facts about the server and its members due to her sleeping for so long. Many people seem to think this is on purpose, as if she purposefully avoids events. This is incorrect. There are many examples of George trying to be a part of the main server. Some examples include: George wanting to build her house closer to the action and refusing to live with Sam because his home was too far away, clinging onto the vice president title despite easily being able to drop out after missing the elections, trying to help blow parts of L'manberg after the war, and her asking other characters for tours and updates. I could list a million more instances of George actively trying to join in on the lore despite not actually being able to contribute much, but it would take up too much of the blog.

So far, you have a character who is obsessed with power, strength, and titles. One who's very social and energetic, who tries to be a part of the server despite never being able to, who cares for her friends and property, and who wants to return to a more peaceful era.

So George isn't apathetic towards events, but what about towards other characters? For the most part, people who portray her as not caring for others is completely accurate. George doesn't care about other people being hurt/dying or about countries exploding. Especially if these things are in her interest. George only reacts negatively to her own countries and friends being hurt or threatened. This is most noticeable during the godhood stream, where George becomes panicked when Dream talks about destroying Kinoko. George also worries when Sapnap and Dream get in an argument during the dethronement, repeatedly asking them why they're fighting. She also tends to defend her friends from mobs, showing that she has care for their safety.

There are, however, instances of George having a strange care for L'manberg. She seems upset about it's destructive but it's likely because she blames herself at least partially for it's destruction. That being said, she seemed to have a dislike for new L'manberg and only cares for the Manberg era of the country (likely because she was in power.)

Is that all there is to George's character? No, of course not. George is a very complex character and these are only her base characteristics. Unfortunately, this is getting long and probably hard to understand. So, I'll leave it here for now and in the next portion I'll talk about the dream lore and what it tells us about her character.

Also

I hate writing my thoughts down. So I actually might not ever speak again. Especially because nobody fucking cares about this character. UGH.

[bleue-flora]

And honestly that’s still too nice. They are the worst… Though if unreliable is the tamest word for c!Sapnap and c!George, what is the kindest description for c!Sam and c!Quackity he could say if forced?… Greedy? Corrupt?…

So C!Punz definitely has a baseline level of rage for the denizens of The SMP due to the whole “Cares about C!Dream.” thing, but C!George and C!Sapnap probably have a special place in his heart for how specifically he hates them. “Unreliable” would probably be his kindest descriptor for them if he was forced to be honest.

[conarcoin]

okay i now know too much about one specific aspect of homestuck and thankfully nothing about the rest of it. anyways, some dream smp classpects or whatever. i have never read homestuck, i just like character analysis.

dream - thief of blood. steals people's bonds and attachments for his own gain.

george - bard of void. invites destruction through absence. i just thought this one was funny

bad - bard of heart. allows destruction of his own heart.

punz - thief of light. steals fortune for his own gain.

fundy - heir of blood. is changed through his bonds with others, particularly familial.

wilbur - bard of mind. allows/invites destruction of his own mind and ideas.

schlatt - witch of rage. manipulates negative emotions.

karl - page of time. leads others through/using time.

connor - knight of time. uses time for his own benefit.

foolish - sylph of life. repairs life.

slime - seer of heart. observes and learns from the feelings and heart of others.

uh, yeah, there we go. feel free to yell at me why i'm wrong people who have actually read homestuck

[mcyt-rarepair-tournament]

please tell us how Brutus is a c!Karl song i would love to hear you out

Okayokayokayokay. So I understand that a lot of people never watched c!Karl’s lore pre-TFTSMP however there is a really good analysis video of him on YouTube that explains it really well, and it was made before doomsday even happened.

But to sum it up: c!Karl really wanted to be involved in the lore. He was always trying to be a part of the big stuff, and he even comments on it during c!Niki’s birthday party, when c!Wilbur is about to blow Manberg up (You can actually hear him say ‘wait, am I part of a big event for once?’) Sad-ist’s meme animatic Dre Smp was made because there was a whole bit about Karl wanting to be included.

Later, c!Karl made Rutabag-Ville while the Pogtopia war was going down (this is actually the context in which c!Techno chased c!Quackity and gave That Speech) and eventually annexed it to c!Schlatt. Why? Well, he’d wanted to join Pogtopia, but had been turned down, I believe it was even specifically by c!Quackity.

Later, c!Quackity and c!Tubbo confronted him over this decision, and he eventually said that he sided with c!Schlatt because he felt welcome and c!Schlatt was nice to him. Now, obviously, we all know this was manipulation, and it’s my own little headcanon that c!Karl knew subconsciously what he was doing, but wanted to be accepted so badly he didn’t care.

This also extends beyond the Pogtopia war. I think not a lot of people actually know that Karl was part of the New L’Manberg government as its creative head, but he was left out of every discussion by the rest of the cabinet (we got ROBBED of butcher army c!Karl). He expresses bitterness over this readily! One thing I forgot to mention earlier is that he actually did try to get people on Manberg’s side back in the war by giving them gifts, but they always burned them when he left.

He also founded El Rapids during this time with c!Sapnap, c!Quackity, and c!George. Some drama happened, and in order to assert their nations independence, Karl sacrificed one of his lives by blowing up part of his country in order to frame Eret for it.

(side note, but fun fact; c!Karl was the one who snitched to c!Dream about c!Eret helping Pogtopia, which is what got c!George on the throne. Just a little fun fact.)

Of course, his lore does kinda peter out after that. His CC began streaming TFTSMP, and we know how that went. Not to say he never streamed at all, but they became a lot rarer since a lot of the server began to think they needed more scripted lore, thus their standards for streaming became higher.

I also agree with the headcanon that he has FOMO (Fear Of Missing Out) and while you could say that this was just his CC wanting to be in more lore, you would be right, but if we brushed off character’s lore because the CC wasn’t 100% in-character, we would have very little characterization left. A lot of Karl’s characters comes from before the 4th wall had really solidified on the server, plus it comes from late-2020, while a lot of newer fans got into the smp around early to mid 2021.

Basically, Brutus is a song about envy, hatred, and a whole lot of mixed emotions based on the assassination of Julius Caesar. While c!Karl never went to the extremes Brutus did, it’s not really hard to see how closely the song echoes his treatment on the server.

I tend to divide c!Karl’s characterization into three parts; first is his more immature and young personality that is set during the Manberg to El Rapids era, second is his transitioning phase between that and someone a bit more mature, which I put from Doomsday to The Pit (the eighth TFTSMP episode), and third is his more mature characterization, where he is burdened by his time traveler duties and has grown into his own person, past the need to be important and make an impact, though the shadow of Manberg and El Rapids loom over him.

In short, c!Karl is a nuanced character who faced the curse of fanon and lost. But hey, so did everyone else. I’d argue he got some of the worst of it, though C!Ranboo is a tough contender. So is C!Sam, actually. And c!Fundy. Just… a lot of characters got the short stick by fanon.

This is my first shot at making an essay, so it’s a bit messy. A lot of this can be found on vod channels, however, so if anyone wants to give links feel free to do so! Also you can correct me if I got anything wrong, it has been a hot minute since I’ve watched a DSMP vod.

That’s my two cents, anyhow. I just really like c!Karl and feel like he got done dirty by a lot of fans. They really did take a nuanced character who was both selfless and selfish, kind yet a bit of a sadist, loved to mess with his loved ones but also hated when anyone touched them, and turned him into a little soft boy who can’t defend himself against anything or One Of c!Quackity’s Mean Crazy Ex-Fiancés. No, I am not exaggerating, I saw someone legitimately call c!Karl crazy because of the Kinoko argument. Y’all…

That’s pretty much it! My fingers are getting tired so I’m sorry if it got a little messy at the end or I got a bit off topic. If anyone needs more clarification I will happily oblige. There were even a few details I left out because I wanted to cut down on this post’s length. C!Karl is a fascinating character and he’s been my No. 1 for nearly two years at this point. Thank you for listening!

[suenitos]

Don't let them stop u sharing ur thoughts

I'd love to read ur ideas on isolation and cgnf :D

anon 😭🫶 ok I share just for you.. i fell asleep mid-writing this LOL

basically the post was about how most punishments on the smp are related to complete isolation (exile, pandora’s vault, the egg, limbo) and interpreted as a metaphor for COVID lockdown/quarantine (which makes sense given the years it was most active why and to me was an interesting way to frame it metatextually that i haven’t seen before). personally I don’t think any character’s story encapsulates this narrative/interpretation more than cgnf.

he doesn’t interact much with other characters outside of his dreams, he obviously sleeps a lot (having not much else to do in the main story or “outside”), the nature of his dreams is absurd and sometimes chaotic (similar to how a lot of us viewed world events primarily through social media with very little power, energy, or will to do much about it, with exceptions), and he himself progressively becomes jaded from being on the inside looking out (or within to his own relationships with characters appearing in his dreams, most notably cdream). he is literally confined mostly to his dreams (equivalent to our homes and imaginations, hobbies, or our screens) to experience any enjoyment/tangible emotion. In a way the dreams are much more appealing and possible to him than any opportunities to achieve them while awake. even if we take off the lens of covid to analyze his story it is entirely about isolation and how it seeps into every part of his (character's) life, culminating in a final stream where he wants out of this cycle (though, canonically he never gets to, hm?)

of course this is all just from the story provided to us by george and there are plenty of non canon character interpretations (irt cdream and dxd) and suggestions of events that do a lot of the heavily lifting in deeper cgeorge analyses. this is also not to suggest anything about real life george's mental/emotional state at this time/playing the character whatever the fuck (thats a different essay on just how much actors put themselves into their characters). just relatively surface level analysis of cgnf through the frame of real life event covid and isolation, because it was taking place at the time.

tl;dr: i hate that george lore has never been treated seriously in these interpretations of "main" story events. even if it doesnt seem that way his story is able to be interpreted in many different ways even if it is mostly completely isolated from other characters. CGEORGE FOREVER.

[mushroom-soup-is-my-religion]

I’ve officially been watching haven smp for a year as of today

So heres drawings of the first ten characters who’s pov i watched, in order along with a little thing about how i watch or draw them

I draw Aster’s galaxy form in eight individual layers, plus any other features on a separate one! I started this pov thinking the edited vods were the only ones that were up, but eventually went back and watched the rest!

@420technoblazeit

This was the first pov I watched all the way through and the first haven character I made detailed fanart of!

@kriber

The first stream I ever watched live was the armor breaking one. Which I watched on a public bus on the way to class and then I had to pretend to be normal

@knife-moth-mc

August is the hardest for me to draw because my tablet brightness is fucked up. I can tell when normal flesh tones are fucked up but it’s hard with the purple which is why my early art of them looks super washed out

@lightning-skys

I first watched this pov while doing a practical exam where I had to wander around identifying trees for hours

@gawaininred

Bird is my favorite character because there are Things Wrong With Me. Having a character with Issues be your favorite just because they’re cool or fascinating is not an indicator of something being wrong but if that’s all i was evaluating on I wouldn’t have a favorite. Canonical concussions georg over here is the character I relate to the most and that’s what we call “trauma”

Angel is the first haven character I drew any fanart of, that being the angel autism creature. She’s also the first one I successfully got one of my irls into watching

@angelhunnybunny

I watched Moth and Anathema’s povs out of order which is very interesting in terms of analysis of unreliable narration

First haven character I started assembling a cosplay for! Still half done but it’ll be here eventually

@diamondjackdaw

A very fun one to draw because I can put as much or as little detail as I need depending on time and energy, and also i don’t have to draw a face

@stars-and-branches

Soleil is also very fun to draw because she has a very consistent color scheme and I still don’t have to draw a face. Also see if you can count the number of normal and hidden pockets in this particular art and ill tell you if you’re right

@mousewich

[graysontheslime]

i got bored and analyzed a cool song to relate it to dsmp!tommy so here that is:Tw for mention of suicide and i think drug use?the song is Re-do by Modern Baseball! 10/10 song you should listen if you haven’t!! :D also you should thank @mellorphic for the reason this is being posted lmaoo okok onto the analysis JKBSBFJ--

“I wanna start from the top, maybe like a do-over. Replace the voices in my head with blind innocence”

So this line makes alot of sense for me. Tommy’s life was absolute *shit*. He didn’t have the greatest life so it make sense that he would want a ‘do-over’. Tommy was a kid when he joined the smp, he was childish and impulsive. He was largely innocent of how shitty the world was. He wants that innocence back, he wants to be able to be a kid again. The ‘voices’ in his head could be chat, but thats more of technos thing. I think the voices he’s talking about is his internal thoughts. His suicidal ideation, his impulsive things. C!tommy once said he was everything he didnt wanna be and that really reminds me of this line.

 “I wanna complete re-do, maybe change my name. Report the losses grab the claim, it's a shame it's such a shame” 

Nothing to say about this line besides the ‘its a shame, such a shame’. Tommy *could’ve* had a great life. He *could’ve* been great. Thats not me saying he wasn’t great or anything, i mean great in tommy’s standards. I dont think he regrets a lot of his impulsive actions (dueling dream/giving him his discs for lmanburg/ burning georges house down) but he’s not blind and he does see how they altered his life. He thinks its a shame that he never became anything of himself. He’s not obsessed with legacy or anything, he doesn’t *want* to be something, but he can recognize its a shame.

“We're pissing away our time 'cause we're pissing away these beers. No monumental moment ever came from saying ‘Come on dude, just take one more shot’.”

Nearing the end of the smp, when wilbur left, tommy really as just pissing away his time. He had no one really. He wasn’t *doing* anything with his life. He didn’t have anything to live for and he lived in paranoia and when it came down to it, he’d rather kill himself and everyone else around him than live with the idea that dream was still out there. IK the song is talking about beer when they say ’just take one more shot’ but i think it fits tommy more if their talking about giving something another shot. Tommy isn’t one to give up, he always gives things, people, objects all ‘one more shot’. Almost nothing good ever comes from it though. He’s said he doesn’t believe in second chances, that he believes in people. In not giving up on others. I think thats a bit of dangerous thinking on his part, especially with the people hes always around.

 “Try to, try to forget, that your bones will dismantle And the dreams you had, they'll collide with time”

Tommy wants to forget that he’ll die soon enough. He’s both terrified of and welcoming of his death. I think he wants to forget what limbo is. (btw I'm taking bones will dismantle as a ‘you're gonna die’ type metaphor idk man). Tommy had dreams, ofc he did. He mainly just wanted peace. He wanted a community. He wanted to be friends with so many people and do impulsive things. He wanted to see the good in people, even when there was nothing there. But when he does these things, when he makes friends, when he has a community, it all comes crashing down around him. He cant keep that peace for forever.

“Your unrequited love for life will surely- Halt that I'm thinking way too much at night”

Tommy loves things easily and hard. Including his life at one point, but ofc he hardly receives the same time of love he gives so freely. He doesn’t let him think about this though. He doesnt want to think about his life. He stopped going to therapy, he stopped going out. He started taking invis, so he could feel at least somewhat on the outside what he felt on the inside. invisible.

“Maybe I could just move away or go extinct like a triceratops, But I love loving, watching movies, sitting back and also breathing”

Tommy thinks about how he could just leave the smp like wilbur, he could just sail until he reached land, far far away from the smp. But.. he could also just kill himself. He could just die. C!tommy has made plenty of references to suicide, mainly during exile. He *could* do these things, but he still loves too much. Even with how bad he had it, he still loved doing things. He couldn’t leave without leaving the good things too.

“My family and friends would be crushed, but is it enough? (Oh no, it's not enough)”

His family and friends are not the reason he’s alive. He could say they are, but their not. What has any of them really done to keep him alive anyways? They are not the reason he’s not moving away or ‘going extinct’.

“Oh, the future freaks me out, but I guess I could just, Curl up in a ball and think”

At the end of the smp Tommy doesn’t have any plans for the future, he barely has anyone, he’s so caught up with the past he cant even begin to think of the future unless someone else is leading the conversation. (tubbo and him talking about L’Moonburg) 

Then its just the chorus again, twice but in the second time theres new lyrics in the back 

“Try to, try to forget (I won't be breaking any barriers) That your bones will dismantle and the dreams you had (so I'll keep thinking the future) They'll collide (future freaks me out) With time, your unrequited love for life (I won't judge you if you think the same) Will surely halt that (so let's keep thinking) I'm thinking way too much at night (well the future, the future freaks us out)

This feels like a conversation between tubbo and tommy, with the parentheses being tubbo and the normal part that i’d already analyzed as tommy. Tubbos more hopeful at the end of the smp, talking about L’moonburg, excited to start a new country with tommy. He’s not planning on doing anything new he’s not breaking any barriers. He’s just thinking about the future they’re gonna have together as co-presidents, as best friends. Of course, the future freaks him out too, but he doesn’t keep himself from thinking about it like tommy. He understands why tommy’s afraid though, he wont judge him for it. He knows it freaks both of them out but he wants a future together so he tells him to keep thinking. <3

----

ANYWAYS! That was it ^^ I’m open to critism and i’d love to hear yalls thoughts too! sorry for any typos tho ^^

if i was artistic enough i’d draw the ending part like a convo between tubbo and tommy. who knows i might do it anyways LMAO

[dreamsclock]

why george is the most interesting smp character... [sigh]

so this is going to be very incredibly focused on george’s dethronement arc, where he was dethroned on quackity’s stream. it’s an INCREDIBLY interesting stream in terms of dream as a character, but also, if we want to start looking for smp!george lore crumbs, for george too. pls note - any reference to any name is a reference to the character !!

[ @netheriteaxes THIS IS 2K+ WORDS I CAN’T BELIEVE THIS,, DROP THE ANGST FUCKER /lh]

under the cut for length !!

george is a manipulator. he’s a manipulator - maybe as much as dream is, maybe more. and the thing people don’t understand is that manipulation isn’t always a negative thing: technically, we’re manipulating someone every time we get them to do something for us without directly and honestly stating it. things like saying “it’s cold” and having someone else in the room close a window, flattering your sibling before asking them for a favour, bringing up the fact your parents didn’t let you go to the last sleepover in order to try and make them let you go to this one, et cetera. we all do it, and george is no exception in the smp! the only thing is, he’s very good at it. 

in the very beginning of the exile arc, we see a very good instance of george’s manipulation and the extent it works on dream. when his house burns down, nowhere does george tell dream “i want you to exile tommy for burning my house down” (at least not to my knowledge - granted, i’m running off my own memory right now, so if i’m wrong lemme know sidhfkdvl). instead, it’s implied through the little things and little gestures; going along with dream interrogating tommy in ‘trial’, playing up how upset he was, etc. it was EASY to rebuild the house and a minor everyday crime compared to other crimes that have been committed on the server, and george knew that. 

because here’s the thing about george - he doesn’t care. he doesn’t care about anything, other than entertainment. as soon as something isn’t fun, he’ll drop it, and if he sees an opportunity for entertainment, he’ll take it, no matter what it is. it’s why he participated in the l’manburg war and slept in for the elections, it’s why he built his house in the manberg/pogtopia final battle, it’s why he tried to indirectly get dream to exile tommy, despite having his house fixed quickly and ,, never visiting it again. it’s FUN to be overdramatic sometimes, FUN to pretend to care about things for drama and then grow bored of them, war is fun while politics isn’t - it explains so much about his character.

which brings us to the dethronement itself.

george and sapnap DOMINATE the situation right from the start. dream appears, fixing the path and generally seeming rather uneasy with the presence of so many people to be an audience (“this was meant to be a quick thing- no no no, we can have the conversation another time”). he says what he has to say, and tries to sugarcoat what he’s doing - he admits to it !! he admits to his own manipulation !! (“we can work together, me and you.” / “mmm, sounds like you’re sugarcoating it.” / “i mean, i am sugarcoating it a little, but it’s for the best.”). dream admits he’s being manipulative - and for a positive reason, not for an ‘evil’ reason. he is direct despite being uneasy about the whole situation, probably the most ‘sane’ and honest we hear him, and nobody listens.

except george, who listens and decides that it would be fun to twist the situation. not because he hates dream: i think he does care for dream, i think he cares for all his friends and loved ones, but i think he loves being entertained more. we see this in the way this situation - which could have been small and nonexistent, given no audience and therefore no opportunity for amusement - escalates, with george beginning to argue back and get upset.

sapnap, who is upset from dream’s spirit speech, starts getting upset for george, and george, who no doubt thinks this is amusing, lets him. quackity too jumps on this train, and it’s interesting, because i think this is one of the first times dream realises the power george has over people. he is instantly put on the defensive when people (george, sapnap and quackity) start arguing against him. here are just some interesting quotes i picked up:

dream: we’re not fighting...

george (i think) (about sapnap at dream): he’s disgusted, did you hear that? he’s absolutely disgusted.

dream: listen, the reason i’m even saying george should step down as king is because i care about him.

and then we get to another interesting interaction between dream, george and sapnap.

sapnap, about the dethronement: george, you don’t have to do any of those things

dream: sapnap- i, well, he DOES, first of all-

george: what?

and it’s this dialogue that makes me frustrated when people say that dream has complete control over the dream team, because he does not. neither of them listen to him, or are even inclined to listen to him - george’s what feels incredulous, not upset or surprised, it feels challenging. dream is the leader of the dream team, but george is the one with power over DREAM, not the other way round: and, being likeable, unlike dream, george has allies in and has power over almost everyone. he becomes best friends with quackity, the ONLY guy that actually had issues with him after he didn’t show up for the election !! i don’t think george is surprised that dream thinks he has control over him: i think he’s amused, because he knows it’s not true, and because he knows how badly this is going for dream.

dream, unlike george, gets incredibly uncomfortable with the attention, rambling (“no, no, no no no i worded that wrong, people don’t like ME and therefore they don’t like YOU because you’re behind me and you're my friend-”) and fidgeting and generally moving around. george, on the other hand, embraces the attention and pity he’s getting, sparks the fire for more, especially when his kingship is actually being removed. he plays on dream’s reputation of being the bad guy, plays on the resentment for dream that sapnap has, plays on quackity’s friendship with and loyalty towards him, all to create this situation that escalated into the breakup of the dream team.

and now we get to the infamous line: “just say it. say you hate me.” and it’s powerful, i’ll give him that (@ cc!george THANKS FOR THE SCRAPS OF ACTUAL ACTING SIR). but it’s dramatic. it’s probably over the top, too - you can hear it in his voice, it’s dramatic !! i’m not saying it’s ALL acting - to an extent, he probably is annoyed/upset dream would dethrone him, especially publicly - but i think this is, once again, deliberately provoking the situation. let’s look at what happens just before and just after this line, too:

dream, to sapnap: stop pointing the damn bow at me!

sapnap: i don’t know if i-

george, interrupting: just say it. say you hate me.

dream, laughing in disbelief: george, no, george, i care about you, that’s the reason i don’t want you to be king.

there’s a lot going on. but dream is adamant he cares - why would he admit this to people who are canonically against him and dislike him (quackity, sapnap, eret)?? why would he admit this after his big speech about not caring about anyone or anything if it wasn’t true?? dream doesn’t hate george - nobody even SUGGESTS that he hates him, characters only going so far as to say he didn’t care - and george knows that. 

[off topic, but here’s an interesting line that comes from dream who sounds incredibly uncomfortable: “i’m not GOD. i’m NOT god.”... compare that with his line “what does that make me, god?” from tommy’s most recent stream. i….. yeah, i don’t think i need to say anything.]

and now we get to another interaction i think people tend to look at through a very narrow lens. george walks away from dream with his head low and crouching (in minecraft mechanics, a position of vulnerability and also greeting/openness) as he goes. here are two interactions we have:

puffy: awww, george is sad!

dream: he’s NOT sad!

puffy: no, he looks sad!

dream: no, he’s not sad, he’s ACTING sad, he’s NOT sad, he’s not sad, alright, listen…

AND

dream: well, eret, it’s- (struggles for words) this is just [george] doing theatrics!

puffy: no, dream, he looks sad-

dream: he’s not-

someone (quackity?): he’s crying!

dream: he just looks sad on purpose.

both of these are on the way back to the castle, where dream is backed up and on the defensive over his actions. he doesn’t genuinely believe george is upset - some people read this as dream speaking for george and speaking over him, dictating what he does and doesn’t feel - but i’d argue differently. although we don’t have much of a stable character for george considering how little lore he’s directly been involved in, especially at this stage, it’s hard to know how he’d react to these things - but george isn’t a weak character. he’s been in wars, he’s actively ignored the possibility of his friends dying in the manberg-pogtopia war while building his house, why would this make him crumble and cry in front of everyone?? he makes no move to properly argue against dream here, focused more on his act and letting other people speak for him. and another thing i noticed was the people claiming dream is speaking for george right now make no complaint when quackity and sapnap do the exact same thing.

and here’s the thing. george LETS them. and that’s not because he’s too upset to know what to think: it’s clear he’s picking up the volatile emotions from the others, thinks he can get some sort of amusement or show out of this, and plays into what he thinks will be fun. and not necessarily in a bad/evil way, because i genuinely think he’s motivated out of nothing but fun. it explains cc!george’s attitude to lore, too, and it explains george being in ‘exciting’ bits of lore and not others - he sticks with what is fun, and, at that particular moment, dream and the dethronement are what’s fun.

and i think dream sees that - at least to some extent. i think he realises george doesn’t actually give a shit about this, and is just playing for fun. he gets frustrated, calling george a baby and promising to build him a castle “far away from here” and several times offers to try and make it up to him.

and of course we see none of this from dream’s perspective, or even george’s perspective, but quackity’s, who is a notoriously unreliable narrator, especially when it comes to people he doesn’t like. and here, he says:

quackity: chat, [george] basically got fired under the pretence of “we’re friends!”.

and it just goes to highlight his bias and where his loyalties lie, because that’s not what happened ,, like ,, almost at all. he has no sympathy for dream (and fair enough, after everything). he doesn’t realise that george doesn’t care as much as he’s making out to (and not to mention, dethronement is NEVER mentioned by george again - albeit because cc!george didn’t want to do lore, but taken in this context, it’s arguable that george just ,, doesn't care). 

this idea of george not caring only shows his friendships in a new light?? obviously, the irl reason he doesn’t hang out with dream on the server is because a) dream is In Prison and b) before that isn’t supposed to hang out with anyone for lore reasons, but looking PAST that, he flits from sapnap and dream to sapnap, karl and quackity. he goes to the people that interest him: one of these people benign dream xd, a literal god who bends to his every whim. doesn’t that seem like fun, having a god cater to your every whim? don’t you think it would remind george of another overpowerful, godlike person he used to hang about with? it’s interesting that george sort of flits from powerful person to powerful person, and each time, they cave to what he wants. it’s incredibly manipulative, but again, not in an evil or bad way, it just highlights how powerful he is despite not having any sort of scary reputation or strengths. he has a way of wrapping the most powerful people on the server round his finger and can manipulate emotions incredibly well and to his advantage. he cares more about fun, good or bad: it explains so many of his actions.

and, as dream says resignedly in the dethronement scene: “that’s just how george is, i guess.”

[420technoblazeit]

ik we talk a lot about fanon interpretation but it literally blows my mind how most of the fandom seems to see dreamxd. i see posts about him and it's literally like oh haha can't believe god is a gogy simp. when that's? a ridiculously small part of his character???

did we all miss the part where dreamxd was meeting george in his dreams, creating all sorts of hallucinations to make him question reality? and torturing the dream versions of his friends, displaying an incredibly fucked up sense of morality and humor while still being weirdly attached to him???

the takeaway here should not be that he's whipped for george but that the god of this world is by no means a benevolent one

[thecoppersoulbox]

Ok I’ve been thinking about this since this morning and I just gotta get it out there

Of course c!George chose Kinoko Kingdom over c!Dream. Kinoko Kingdom has c!Sapnap.

Sapnap is the literal only person who has always been on George’s side, no matter what side that is. He may have been Dream’s best friend first but he took George’s side during the dethronement. They’ve always lived together, whether that’s in the community house, El Rapids or Kinoko Kingdom. To join Dream would mean actively betraying Sapnap for someone who has screwed him over before, and that makes no sense.

Even though he’s not seen at Kinoko all that often, he cares about that kingdom because he cares about Sapnap, and he would never willingly hurt him. Destroying Kinoko with Dream would essentially be breaking Sapnap’s heart, because he knows how much Kinoko means to him. If Dream had asked him to do anything else, George might have joined him, but instead he asked him to go against the one person George would never dream of hurting. Metaphorically and literally, given that during his dream of mass destruction George never touched Kinoko and Sapnap didn’t appear at all.

Of course he chose Kinoko over Dream. It would be stupid to betray the one person who has always been on his side.

[bleue-flora]

It really does always come back to George…

Tommy kills George -> Banishment

L’manberg tries to claim George’s land -> War

George is part of Manberg’s cabinet -> Dream switches sides

George keeps getting murdered -> Revive Book

Tommy burns down George’s house -> Exile

Dream used to give George red roses before he left -> Egg

George doesn’t come to visit -> Jailbreak

George leaves Dream -> Dream bullies guy in Exile, Community House blows up, Doomsday, Staged Finale, Pandora’s Vault

Quackity hurts George’s feelings -> Las Nevadas Finale attack on Quackity

George thinks the dsmp is no longer fun -> Reset

[rnelodyy]

The Exile Conflict: George's POV

So. The other day I wanted to see what persuaded George to testify in court against Tommy for exile, so I pulled up his vod of the day of Tommy’s court hearing to see what was said.

Five and a half hours later, I have combed through the entire lore portion of the vod, analyzed it by rambling into a Discord channel, and I have found some SUPER interesting lore insights into both c!Dream AND c!George. So here is, in chronological order, c!George’s side of the exile debacle.

(this is all rp, names refer to characters, not content creators)

So, not going to lie, I had no idea what happened before I went in. I believed that Dream had talked to George, convinced him to help him get Tommy exiled, and George gave him approval to build walls around L’Manburg. I wanted to see what exactly Dream had said to convince George to let him do all that.

Start of the vod, George learns from his chat that his house got burnt down. He, Quackity and Karl head over there to assess the damage, and while George is upset that his stuff got destroyed, he’s optimistic. He says, “It’s not actually that bad, I can fix this,” and starts clearing out the signs and netherrack while Q and Karl are standing there being unhelpful and teasing him by lighting more fires. So I figured that the conversation with Dream came later.

And then I saw this.

[ID: a screenshot from George’s vod. George is rebuilding his house. There is a chat message from Tubbo reading “dream this goes agenst the treatys (sic).”]

That’s Tubbo discovering the walls. That’s him confronting Dream about them. As you can see by the timestamp, George hadn’t even been live for ten minutes, and he had NO CLUE what happened. I did some more investigating, and discovered that the walls were built THE NIGHT BEFORE, barely an hour after the actual grief took place.

So Dream discovered that George’s house had been griefed, and his literal first response was to build walls around L’Manburg. He didn’t ask George for his input, or even tell him that his house was griefed. He only talked to George about it once George physically went looking for him (and we’ll get to that conversation in a bit because it’s a DOOZY), and I firmly believe that if George hadn’t gone over there, Dream would’ve never said a word to him.

(Sidenote: Karl, at this point in the story, had declared himself “vice vice president”, and REALLY wanted Tommy’s position. That’s why he’s so adamant that Tommy needs to be punished by being stripped of his rank. He even outright tells George that Tommy needs to be overthrown, and the vice vice president should become the new vice president.)

At this point, Karl goes over to L’Manburg and tells George about the wall. From George’s reaction it’s IMMEDIATELY obvious that he has no idea what the wall is about; his first reaction is confusion, wondering how building a wall is helping him. Then, he shifts gears and says that yeah, there SHOULD be a wall! George, at this point, is angry, and willing to accept the wall as his revenge, but is still confused as to what it’s even trying to accomplish.

Karl: Here's what it is. It's two people. That are just obsessed with power. Tommy and Dream. And they're using your ashes, the ashes of your house as a political statement.

Now Karl is wrong about Tommy here. Tommy didn’t grief George’s house to make a political statement, he griefed it cause he thought it’d be funny. However, DREAM is absolutely using it to make a political statement. Griefing the king had never been treated as a serious offense, Eret was robbed blind practically every day by Hbomb and Fundy (the then-president’s son), and they never faced consequences from Dream. Dream had also been going around griefing various structures and trying to frame Tommy for them the previous week, so of course he would jump on this immediately.

So, at this point, George has fixed his house, and goes to L’Manburg to meet up with Karl and see what’s going on. He’s shocked upon realizing the wall is made of obsidian, and goes to find Dream, who is sitting in a hole. Thinking he’s AFK, George pours water over his head, but Dream wasn’t AFK at all, and joins the VC right after.

The conversation that follows goes like this:

Dream: George! Um… I guess just to keep you updated that way you know. [...] Tommy griefed your vacation home.

George: It was Tommy? If I scroll up in the chat, he said “No” when I asked him.

Dream: Well, it’s him. But anyway, Tommy griefed it, and since you’re the king now, that’s like griefing the king’s property, so I decided to build the wall around L’Manburg, and because the treaties are technically void… I just want them to handle Tommy accordingly. (Karl: I agree.) I’m dealing with it for you, don’t worry.

[...]

Dream: But don’t worry! Don’t worry. I’m handling it, I’m handling it, okay?

George: How are you handling it? By building a wall?

Dream: I’m- I’m handling it.

Karl: Dream, in your opinion, do you think Tommy should step down as Vice President?

Dream: Yes. One hundred percent. That’s not even enough.

[...]

Dream: I’m taking care- George, I’m taking care of it, okay?

George: How do you know you’re properly gonna take care of it?! I did nothing wrong, and my house was just burnt to nothing!

Dream: George, don’t worry!

George: I had to rebuild it just now.

Dream: Look! Do you see this?! George, look at how much I’ve already done for you, I’m handling it, George.

George: But this isn’t gonna stop them from ruining my house in the future!

Dream: I know, nono, trust me. George. I’m handling it. I’m handling it. Bye.

[Dream leaves the VC]

(Note, I removed stammering and unrelated tangents for clarity, but didn’t change the meaning of sentences. Please watch it for yourself if you’re curious.)

There is a LOT to unpack here, so let’s start with Dream.

First, his tone during his explanation of Tommy’s crime seemed almost… bored? I don’t think that was bad acting, we know cc!Dream can act, it just seemed like Dream was trying to get the explanation out of the way as quickly as possible to get back to making demands from L’Manburg.

Second, Dream isn’t telling George anything about what he’s planning. George brings up very valid points, like “how is a wall around L’Manburg gonna prevent further griefing?” and “how are you planning to handle this situation?” Yet Dream tells him nothing. He brushes off all of George’s questions, and when George keeps refusing to back down, he breaks out the guilt trip with “Look at how much I’ve already done for you.” Then when George KEEPS asking questions, Dream just repeats that he’s handling it and leaves.

Third, Dream never mentioned he was trying to get Tommy exiled. George doesn’t KNOW he’s trying to get Tommy exiled, the word “exile” won’t get brought up for a WHILE. Hiding his true motives from George and trying to keep him away is not only a huge dick move, it’s also hampering George’s ability to figure out what’s actually happening here.

After Dream leaves, we get this conversation:

George: ...is he just gonna stand here or is he gonna handle it? Dream, go handle it! Karl, how is he- how is building this wall "handling it?" Can you explain that to me?

Karl: I just wanna know, like... I feel like that's handling it. That was the first step in handling it. By him building the wall, it sets a precedent.

George: It is a statement... Like, you mess with George, I... build a wall...? Question mark...? But like... There's nothing stopping them from just coming out of this wall and doing it again.

Karl: Think about it like this, though. It wasn't Tubbo. Y'know what I mean? And Tubbo now has to deal with the fact that his silly little vice president has the audacity.

George: It's just that... I just don't feel safe anymore.

Again, Karl is right on the money, but missing the point. Tubbo SHOULDN’T have to deal with this. This isn’t his problem, and it’s not his fault, this should be between Tommy and George alone.

Then, George gets in a call with the L’Manburg crew. They’re all freaking out, Tommy most of all, and George can barely get a word in before they move VC’s to have a crisis meeting. However, before being dragged into the meeting, Tommy does manage to talk to George quickly.

Tommy: Gogy, whatever happens bro, just remember, me and you, we tight.

George: Rrrright... I dunno- Dream said it was you, why would Dream lie?

Tommy: Cause he's out- he's a menace to society! (Tommy keeps rambling about how Dream is like the Joker before he’s dragged into the meeting).

Is Tommy doing this to try and lessen his punishment, or is he genuinely saying he and George can still be buds? I don’t know, but either way, George doesn’t believe him, Tommy leaves to meet with the L’Manburg Cabinet in the Camarvan, and George suddenly realizes that everyone else left too. He moves VC’s to join them, only for Tubbo to immediately ask him and Karl for privacy. When they refuse to leave, everyone else moves to VC2.

Karl is upset that they’re not treating him like a L’Manburgian citizen, and George sympathizes, trying to comfort him a bit, until he gets a DM from Dream.

[ID: a Minecraft DM from Dream saying “get out of the borders”]

[ID: two Minecraft DMs from George to Dream saying “should karl come with” and “are you going to hurt them”]

[ID: two DMs from Dream saying “just stay outside the borders” and “stay neutral ur king”]

Again, Dream dodges the question. George wants to know whether he’s gonna hurt the L’Manburgians, and Dream just tells him to get outside the borders and stay neutral. This is basic information, a simple yes or no would’ve been enough, yet Dream gives George absolutely nothing.

At this point, Dream is very blatantly disrespecting George’s autonomy by making every decision about how to handle the griefing of his house for him, and refusing to give him even the most basic information about what he’s doing. GEORGE is the victim, yet he doesn’t even get to know what is happening. No dispute over griefing has EVER played out like this, at no point did somebody else take it upon themselves to take revenge for a grief without telling the actual victim that the grief even took place, what their plans and goals are when it comes to the actual revenge, and without the victim being able to weigh in.

This behavior can only have two explanations: either Dream thinks George is completely incompetent and will get seriously hurt if he attempts to resolve this himself… or he’s already started seeing George as another tool for him to use. Remember, this is only days before the Spirit-speech, and a few more days before he dethrones George without warning and - again - without asking him what HE wants. Whether Dream has lost all care for George altogether at this point is impossible to say, but he clearly doesn’t respect George enough to let him know what he’s doing, handle things himself, or listen to his opinions.

Because boy does George have opinions about this.

George: I'm gonna go do my own thing. I'm not interested in war. Okay. I don't want these shenanigans. I'm gonna stand with Dream, 'cause me and Dream... I'm not gonna be hurt if Dream's next to me.

George is a pretty non-confrontational guy. Retaliating against someone griefing his house by surrounding their entire country in obsidian and causing a massive uproar isn’t something he’d do, or would WANT to do. He’s going along with it because he feels like it’s his chance at revenge, he trusts Dream, and every time he tries to do something else, he gets ignored by L’Manburg (not out of malice, but because there’s a MASSIVE DIPLOMATIC CRISIS that needs to be dealt with first).

George, at this point, is starting to get very restless, and tries to vent his anger by taking it out on things around him, while still trying to stay neutral. He threatens, but ultimately doesn’t go through with griefing the L’Mantree, and takes a live fish from the pond under Party Island to drop onto the cabinet as they’re meeting with Dream (which is, admittedly, very funny).

What’s also very interesting is that George is starting to heavily exaggerate how much his house was actually damaged. He started the stream off upset, but optimistic, saying he could rebuild it easily, and took maybe fifteen minutes to fix the house (George isn’t a very fast builder either, not helped by the fact that Q and Karl were messing with him, and he had to replace a wall made out of mushroom stem blocks). But about fifteen minutes after leaving for L’Manburg, he’s claiming that his house was completely destroyed, and that he had to rebuild it from the ground up.

I’m psychoanalyzing a bit here, but I think George is doing this to try and justify both Dream’s actions, and his own anger.

See, griefing on the Dream SMP (as well as literally every single other Minecraft server ever) works something like this. Person A wrecks person B’s shit. B gets pissed and retaliates by wrecking A’s shit. A retaliates against THAT, and so it continues until either A or B gives up and leaves it alone, A and B decide things have gone far enough and hash out a compromise, or an outside influence (usually an admin or another player) forces them to cut it out.

This is likely how the conflict WOULD have played out if Dream never intervened. George would’ve gotten angry and griefed Tommy’s house back, and Tommy would’ve rebuilt it and either retaliated, sparking a semi-lighthearted feud, or ignored it, as he doesn’t really start shit over people destroying his house or stealing from him unless they take something he has a lot of attachment to.

But Dream threw a wrench in that entire dynamic.

Suddenly, George, angry and ready to take it out on the guy who wronged him, is being shoved to the side by Dream, who keeps telling him to stay out of it, that he’s got it handled, that he doesn’t need to worry. George tries to go to Tommy to read him the riot act, but Tommy is already getting raked over the coals by the L’Manburg Cabinet, stuck in meetings and trying to figure out what the FUCK to do next, so he’s too distracted and freaked out to divert his attention to George. Same goes for the rest of L’Manburg, it’s hard to deal with one guy pissed that his house got wrecked when you’ve got a national fucking crisis on your plate.

So instead of a lighthearted prank war, there’s now a diplomatic crisis in L’Manburg, Tommy is suddenly facing the prospect of losing his home and friends and everything he ever loved over what he thought was just a funny prank while being screamed at from every direction, Tubbo has to play the voice of reason in an impossible situation he’s just not equipped to handle because he’s sixteen goddamn years old, and George is just… sitting on the sidelines, hopped up on anger he can’t vent without starting ANOTHER diplomatic crisis, feeling completely helpless while Dream is running around, “handling” the situation, and refusing to tell him anything.

Anyway.

George eventually joins the call, and Tubbo asks him to take them to his house to assess the damage. George tells him that the damage was fixed already, at which point Tommy starts yelling that if it’s fixed, there’s no proof that it ever happened.

Then something very interesting happens. I may be reading too much into this, but I’ve seen nobody bring it up, and I think it’s important to take note of.

Dream: Listen, if you want to, you can review his [George’s] VOD!

Tubbo: Can we review the VOD?

[...]

Fundy: Wait, whose VOD?

Tubbo: Tommy’s VOD, I assume.

(people talking over eachother)

Dream: Nonononono, why would you do that when you can watch George’s VOD? You can watch George’s VOD when he just fixed it. And he saw all the damage. And he’s heartbroken.

This is… Odd. What they’re looking for is proof that a) there was a crime, and b) Tommy was the perpetrator. Why would Dream want them to watch George’s VOD, which just consists of him looking around in the aftermath of said crime, when Tommy’s VOD has undeniable proof that it was him?

This is speculation but… Which would make Tommy look worse, you think? The VOD where he just fucks around on the SMP with Ranboo before breaking into George���s house, taking some stuff, putting up mean signs and making a mess, screaming and putting out an accidental fire, then leaving? Or the VOD where George walks around the ruins of his house all sad?

Tommy’s VOD would prove without a doubt that it wasn’t a politically motivated attack, and that the fire was an accident. It was still a robbery, but… That’s not the worst thing that’s ever happened on the server. It’s not even the worst thing that Tommy has ever done. It’s certainly not exile-worthy. And I think Dream knew that, because in order for him to know that Tommy griefed George’s house, he’d have HAD to have been streamsniping, meaning he knows EXACTLY what Tommy’s VOD looks like.

(Also I wanna point out that George’s VOD wouldn’t have been much better for him, especially since George was only mildly upset and said that the damage would be easily fixable while walking around his house. But I mean, we all know Dream isn’t listening to a single word out of George’s mouth at this point.)

Dream and Tubbo leave to talk in private, and Tommy leaves the call when Quackity and Fundy start yelling at him, so George is left alone once again. He wonders out loud why Tommy can’t just admit it was him. Keep in mind, George still hasn’t heard the word “exile” being dropped yet.

Anyway, George yoinks part of the L’Mantree while the cabinet talks in a different VC. When he joins back, they all take Tommy to court.

I’m not going to describe the whole court case here, because I’m assuming most of you have already seen it, and there’s not a whole lot of other stuff there on George’s side of things (and also it makes me very sad). However, I will be posting some quotes from Tommy that make me think he’s DEFINITELY onto Dream, and has realized this is unfair.

Quackity: Alright, this is a case of the nation of L'Manburg versus crybaby who got his fucking house burned down. (laughter) Tommy: (quietly, very seriously) Except the crybaby has Dream on his side…

Tommy: Listen guys, (inaudible), you do a bit of graffiti, you do a bit of stabbing, that's all fun! That's all fun and games!

Tommy: Dream retaliating by building obsidian walls is absurd! I did no griefing, I only did robbing! I'm a robber!

Tommy: Tubbo there's WALLS around your home! There are WALLS, bro! Tubbo: Yeah, and I'm hoping that this will be enough of a satisfying conclusion to get them torn down! Tommy: BUT WHY ARE THE WALLS EVEN THERE?! You can't just build walls just 'cause I- me and... by myself, I did it- Tubbo: George is the king of the Dream SMP, Tommy. He is the king. This is considered... I don't even wanna know what this is considered. George: T-t-t-t-t-treason. Tommy: (crosstalk) There are massive walls all around, dude. That is a- That's griefing! Surely we should arrest Dream as well!

Anyway, Tommy ends up confessing to keep Ranboo out of trouble, and Tubbo sentences him to probation. This, finally, is where we get our first reference to Dream’s exile threat.

Tubbo: Tommy, I have been advised to banish you. [...] However, that is a very extreme measure, and I'm hoping that we can please both parties by probation.

Except this isn’t telling George anything. He doesn’t know that “advice” came from Dream, or that it was more of a demand, or that the walls are there to facilitate exile. To him, this may as well have come from a cabinet member to threaten Tommy into complacency while in court.

George stays in a VC with Karl, Ranboo and Niki. Ranboo apologises to him for the damage, and George accepts it, says he doesn’t blame Ranboo because he believes Tommy infected or manipulated him somehow, and says he just wants his stuff back.

Meanwhile, in another VC, Dream is overriding the decision of the court, saying Tommy should be exiled anyway.

George missed all of that. He doesn’t know Dream demanded exile, or that he was using the walls to threaten L’Manburg into exiling Tommy, or that he went behind his back and overruled the decision George had agreed to!

George: (responding to a dono) "Sorry about Tommy burning your house down, homie." Yeah, I mean, it sucks. And he's- he's getting punished for it, so it's okay.

George was perfectly satisfied with the probation. All he wanted Tommy to do after that was give him his stuff back. He didn’t think that Tommy deserved even more punishment after that.

Anyway, after joining the call with L’Manburg again, George catches Tommy being yelled at for wanting to get the discs, then laughs at Motherinnit yelling at him to empty the dishwasher.

At this point, Sapnap joins the call. He’s completely out of the loop, and George gives him the short version of the story as far as he understands it. Sapnap doesn’t factor too heavily into this analysis but he does have some… ahem, opinions.

Sapnap: These L'Manburgians, George... They should've learned their lesson the first time around. We dealt with them. (referring to the L’Manburg Independence War) Niki: Hey, don't say anything against the L'Manburgians! It's just... Tommy.

Sapnap: You know, Tubbo's the president. He should really be doing a better job of keeping his people in check.

Sapnap: Tubbo needs to get better control of his people. Ranboo: I think it's just harder to control Tommy than most.

...yeah.

Anyway, Karl is sad and Sapnap and George try comforting him for a while… and then George gets another message.

[ID: a DM from Dream saying “come here”. Under it, a message from Quackity, saying “o_o”]

George goes to find Dream, who returns him the unnamed fish that lived in the pond by his house.

[ID: a string of DMs between Dream and George

Dream: I saved your fish from quackity Dream: been keeping it safe George: how did you get it back!?!?!?! Dream: I robbed him tbh]

Dream then demands that George give him the bits of the L’Mantree. George asks why, but Dream once again refuses to elaborate.

[ID: a string of DMs between Dream and George

Dream: give me the leaves George: why (x4) Dream: I need them Dream: trust]

Here, Dream is doing the EXACT same shit as he was doing earlier. He’s making decisions for George without his input, and refusing to answer even the most basic questions.

Anyway, the lore kinda petered out at this point, Tommy asked for some leather for his book, then Sap, Karl and George hung around L’Manburg for a bit before they got invited to play Scuffed Chess for the last hour or so of the stream.

So what is the takeaway from this?

In my opinion, this is a very obvious sign that Dream doesn’t value George as a friend. He used the fact that his house was griefed as an excuse to bully L’Manburg into exiling Tommy, and not only did he not ask George’s input before he did ANY of the shit he did, he refused to answer even the most basic questions with anything except “dude trust me”.

The way Dream acts here is pretty obvious foreshadowing to his later actions: the Spirit speech, where he screams that he doesn’t care about anything other than the discs (and Tommy by extension) while Sapnap is right fucking there, and dethroning George because him being king is supposedly putting him in danger, while ignoring his protests, dismissing his genuine upset as him just being dramatic, and instead of abolishing the throne (because ANY monarch would be in the same amount of danger George was, and the position doesn’t mean anything anyway), he hands it right back to Eret, because apparently he’s more disposable.

Dream claimed he’s doing all of this for George, but he’s not. George never had a say in any of his actions, never wanted things to go as far as they did, and was purposefully kept in the dark about so, SO many things regarding the leadup to exile. George was expecting to get Tommy back, maybe have a small prank war, then move on. Instead, he became complicit in getting a sixteen year-old kicked out of his home and HORRIBLY abused, ALL against his will.

Dream wasn’t protecting George. He wasn’t defending George. He wasn’t setting a precedent for how to treat the king. George didn’t benefit from this situation, in fact, he suffered from it too, being repeatedly brushed off, having his wrecked home used as political ammunition, and being stonewalled by the guy supposedly helping him.

Let’s not pretend that Dream did any of this for George’s sake. Dream was the only one who benefited from any of this.

*mic drop*

[ruby-whistler]

/dsmp /rp

"c!Dream was never manipulated or influenced by anybody, he became a villain through his own bad decisions and he deserves what he got."

look me in the eyes and tell me that anyone, anyone on the smp tried to help him. i dare you.

george, who manipulated the public opinion against him for fun? who turned people against dream? who twisted dream's words, guilt-tripped him, made him out to be the bad guy when he tried to protect him? george, who never once visited him, or showed to be of any support, after everything dream had done for him since the very beginning of the server?

sapnap, who never tried to support him? who never told dream they were wrong about him? who dream covered for, again and again, taking the blame for sapnap's mistakes and fixing his mess, just for sapnap to turn against him, and believe the first bad thing tommy or george said, without ever listening to dream? sapnap, who visited him in prison, only to say he deserves to stay there, in terrible conditions, until his death, and that he'll kill him if he won't?

puffy, his self-proclaimed "guardian", who enabled his plans in giving him obsidian to build the walls without him ever saying a word? who never tried to talk him out of it, or to talk to him at all, then proceeded to say he should be in prison and that he doesn't deserve therapy or for her to visit him?

wilbur, who crafted a narrative in which dream was a tyrant for trying to preserve freedom and unity? who spread lies and forced this worldview onto everyone he met? who only ever sided with dream after proclaiming himself evil?

tommy, who doesn't look out or empathize with anyone besides himself and the small group of people that he cares about? who believed wilbur's every word, called dream the ultimate villain of the server, long before dream ever hurt him?

quackity, who condemned dream for seeking out power when he himself was hungry for control? who supported george and sapnap, the only people he had left, in leaving him?

sam, who worked alongside dream as he was spiralling? who tortured dream through starvation and punishment in the prison even before quackity came in? who dehumanized him, called him a monster, denied him basic human rights?

punz, the last person dream was hanging on to? who knew what dream wanted, and knew exactly how far he was willing to take it, but did nothing to stop him or try suggest a different approach? who betrayed him for a better pay with no regrets whatsoever?

don't get me wrong, some of these characters i don't blame for their actions, but the point is that dream was completely and utterly alone.

as much as cc!dream's said himself c!dream is "reserved" and likes to "withhold emotions" (aka he's an emotionally repressed bastard), there were big red flags blowing in the wind for his friends. just the fact that everyone seemed to hate dream just for trying to help and mediate since the beginning. that he isolated himself emotionally and acted so unlike what he was before. that he felt so lost and scared that he became desperate to try and control the situation. that he cut all attachments, accepted he was a "monster".

no one in the entire server of mostly adults, many of whom were older than him, tried to help him in any way, before villainizing, dehumanizing, and attempting to kill him.

when you're trying to do what's right and repeatedly get told you're in the wrong, doesn't that mess with your morals, your perception? when everyone says you're a bad person for trying to keep people from creating division, and no one disputes it, doesn't that make you feel lost and confused?

dream was going through a spiral, even if we didn't see it on screen. the dream from the l'manberg war is so much different from the dream during the disc war finale.

i wish more people realized that people's utter ignorance of that, of all the characters' choice to believe dream's a villain without any proof, until he became one, was in essence what caused him to become as corrupted as he did.

dream's choices were his own, but the reason he was willing to go to such lengths was the product of the environment he was in.

that is why i believe c!dream's a product of his environment, the entire dream smp is absolutely screwed, and every single one of them needs therapy.

thanks for something to my tedtalk.

[dreamygeorgenap-archive]

Shout out to one of my anons who pointed out that during Bad’s stream at around 22:20, after George asks for his stuff back from Quackity, he says George had nothing except for a bucket of milk and George said, “I had my shield!” and then we can see George with his shield back.

We’ve talked about before that this shield was Dream’s exact shield from when he was a knight to king George. Yesterday during George’s cooking stream at 4:05:38 Dream says that there is big George lore planned that Dream himself seems to be planning.

If Dream is planning George lore and for this shield to pop back up again out of seemingly nowhere and for George to be so protective of it, it definitely seems like George misses the time where he and Dream were on the same team.

[codyjey]

another day another george lore stream MAJOR SPOILERS obviously.. .

so. We start with c george complaining about how no one is around and just doing random shit because he's bored. pretty standard start. then, he goes to the prison and c dream is there. they argue. c george takes the side of KEEPING KINOKO SAFE OVER JOINING C DREAM... I find this super fucking interesting for his character. he's taking pride in his home. he cares about it. they continue to argue. c dream kills him.

c george wakes back up in his bed, thinking his shit will be gone, and it's not. he goes to walk back around, and c dream and c techno pull up to fight him. he kills them. now this is strange already since they are the two most skilled pvpers on the server. . . anyways.. .

c george goes to continue on a murderous and power driven rampage, blowing the smp up and killing anyone he sees. manatreed is also here, for some reason.

c george talks about how now that c dream isn't here, he basically owns the server. he gets so infatuated with that idea and I think it's because he misses being king. he misses having power, having purpose on the server, so he's taking it back.

then eventually he runs into c karl.. . now this isn't normal c karl this is, what was implied to be, inbetween c karl. he tells c george about him being a time traveler. c george makes him prove it. c karl then tells him he needs to stop what he's doing because he's, "friends with dreamXD now" )which I assume we will get more on when tales eventually comes back.) and that he wasn't gonna be happy. c george kills him.

then he decides he's gonna go to the end (with the help of callahan) and sets off on that quest. he finds the stronghold, dreamXD is there, and he's pissed, just like c karl said he would be.

they fight. c george kills him.

c george then actually goes through the portal, and begins to kill the enderdragon, but before he can get to it, he wakes up.

it was a dream. like always. and he's running around confused, and shaken up, and he ends stream.

NOW! I leave you with some questions.

is the beginning bit how c george imagines meeting up with dream again will go?

can c karl travel through dreams? or can george predict things through his dreams?

is the dreamXD in george's dreams the same as the god walking among the server? or is he a seperate being?

why, when c george killed dreamXD, did dreamXD make the ender dragon dying sound?

why was killing the ender dragon what woke him up?

how much of his dreams does he remember?

all questions I'm very curious about and would love to hear opinions on thanks For coming to my insane thoughts after every lore stream guys