#smp discourse

[jestbee]

thinking about how this would be over if quackity made even the smallest of statements. but he’s just letting his fans dogpile dream as usual and completely ignoring dream’s attempts at smoothing things out

I doubt it would be over, but it sure would improve my opinion of him.

I understand not wanting to be involved in drama, I understand his wanting to keep his project untainted by it, but the fact is it's happening.

Whatever has happened, whoeber had what idea and when, we can not truly know for sure. Only they know that. But at least Dream has been civil and has told his fans not to send hate. It's not foolproof, and people still are, but at least he said it. He's right about that. People do need to stop. On both sides.

But Q hasn't even done that, he's stayed quiet because it's easier for him and honestly it's really affected my opinion of him as a person.

I'm not gonna stop supporting qsmp content because the other creators on there don't deserve that, and I'm not gonna be sending hate to anyone or judging anyone who is a fan of Q, but unfortunately I can't help but feel differently about him given how he's handled this. Even if he says something now, it'll be too little too late for me personally.

I'm sure Dream is a dab hand at ignoring people online these days, so a few salty fans aren't going to do him any harm, what makes me sad is that he clears cares about this project and once again whenever Dream tries to do anything there's always something negative that happens in return. He deserves a break.

In order to remain a little level on the situation, I will say Dream could have potentially re-thought his tagline. While he was *technically* right as Q had only ever referred to qsmp as bilingual in any marketing stuff prior to that announcement (there is a stream clip of him saying multilingual but that isn't how it was marketed, just an off-hand addition in a stream that's easily missed) and at the time Q hadn't announced his real-time translation, I think Dream using similar "first" wording was bound to end in comparison. I don't know what he knew before, or when he came up with that line, but the fact is that by the time Dream was ready to launch, Q had already launched qsmp with that similar wording and from a simple marketing perspective it would have been good to change his tagline just to avoid more comparison than was already bound to happen. It was similar enough that people can spin it as intentional, which isn't a good look even if it isn't true.

My curiosity wants to know how this all happened and who knew what about what the other was doing, but I doubt we'll ever get it. It all seems a little too similar to be entirely coincidental the way it's being spun, but I also don't think there is any malicious stealing going on. I think there's a world where it was something a little more nuanced, but I won't make any guesses as to what because we don't have the info and it's not going to improve things to have a bunch of fan speculation flying around.

I hope Q says something soon, I hope this doesn't cause a rift, but I fear the damage has been done.

Either way, at least we got SlutSMP out of it, which, let's face it, is the best thing anyway.

[huggywuggysuppy]

The whole wifeswap bit was incredible and especially how you can see the gears turning in Gem’s head where she doesn’t want to call Joel her husband (funnier because Lizzie is on the server) and so logically defaults to wife. And everyone rolls with it!!

[orbch]

dsmp quackcicle they make me want to launch myself off of the tallest building in the world

[stemms]

I could never understand people who treat DSMP like a dead fandom or feel ashamed of still adoring this piece of media in 2024. After all, isn’t the whole point of enjoying any story to keep it in your heart for years instead of forgetting about it the moment it loses its popularity? How did classical literature or old movies/series survive and remain appreciated until today, for example? The DSMP fandom is alive because there still are people who deeply care about the characters, and it will keep on living until there’s at least one person passionate about it.

It is true that the DSMP fandom was bigger in 2020-2022, but it’s also important to remember the quality of the fanbase at the time. I remember seeing so much more harassment, especially directed towards people interested in portraying c!Prime’s canonically abusive dynamic without even exploring the aspect of /p physical affection; many people were forced to deactivate their accounts because of the insane amount of toxic reactions. There were also A Lot of people incapable of understanding that CC’s characters weren’t supposed to represent their real life personalities, which either led to certain CC’s harassment for being “horrible people” or to misinterpretation of certain characters (e.g. c!Dream, c!George, c!Sapnap, c!Quackity, or c!Sam), a huge amount of poor lore comprehension, leading to Lots of victim-blaming and abuse apologism.

Now that DSMP is over and less popular, a significant amount of people responsible for the fandom’s poor reputation is gone, and people who genuinely understand the characters and simply want to discuss and/or create content for their hyperfixation in peace, stayed. Of course, this fandom isn’t perfect or entirely free of Weird™ people, but there’s certainly less toxicity, and it’s all that matters.

The next time you feel ashamed of still enjoying DSMP, try to remind yourself of the wonderful memories, excitement, creativity boost, and friends it brought you, and focus on the fact that this story will remain alive for as long as you let it.

[conarcoin]

the concept of "lore" ruined discussion of mcrp because like. people use it to mean some kind of weird hybrid of plotline and worldbuilding but ONLY if the server is drama-focused otherwise it doesn't count i guess.

so you get people saying like. hermitcraft isn't a lore server. smplive isn't a lore server. sdmp isn't a lore server. and it's like yeah this is true because "lore server" is a meaningless slop category you guys made up. they very much have plotlines and worldbuilding though 💀

[astrowarr]

every life series season has a villain, but not in the way you might think. it's always a symbol of some kind. it's not a person, but a concept, an ideal, an overarching force. that is, in every season except wild life

third life had circumstance. everything was new and hard to grasp, and no one knew what to do. the villain of third life was the world itself; think of the animal extinction, for example.

last life had brutality. both physically and mentally. it was rife with betrayal and isolation; reds had to abandon teams, and the boogeyman mechanic's paranoia forced everyone apart.

double life had love. love, and the fate it tangled itself in. it was a complex villain, but love killed them again and again, and rewarded the single person who didn't give in to it.

limited life had time. the passage of time itself was the enemy and everything was driven by that. they clawed their way to every last second, and time ate them all in the end.

secret life had the secret keeper. unyielding, unrelenting, unmoving, all-knowing. when the secret keeper forced them to do awful things, no one disobeyed, but hated it all the same.

wild life has grian. grian is representative of every wild card the world plays. he runs the command, and stops it at the end of the day. he is transparent about that. he accepts bribes for information, and unabashedly uses his knowledge to his advantage. he is Other. the players treat him the exact way they did the secret keeper; he's not a player like them this season, he's a symbol, and one of every awful thing that's happened to them at that

which is to say, wild life's villain is a symbol and an overarching force. it's just, for the first time, simultaneously a person, too. everyone else is realizing that too and are pointing their blades at grian, slowly but surely. it is SO fascinating

[cloverstellar]

insane to me that some people still think that you can say ctommy and cdream are separate and should be viewed separately narratively speaking when a big chunk of the dsmp’s story was driven through cdream’s obsession with ctommy. no im not saying cdream was in the right but its no fun to see people water them down to just cdream using ctommy as a side piece and less like an objective he had to conquer and subdue to fit his regime. or turn around and say ctommy’s story did not revolve much around the abuse he sustained from that in the same breath because it DID and. man. man

[the-final-sif]

Dream's Response Summary

Dream posted a response to various accusations, covering just about everything ever because he was done with this shit. I've done my best to summarize it here, but I recommend going and watching his whole video. This is going to be extremely summarized for readability and I'm only going to cover stuff I consider serious so anything about speedrunning is getting skipped.

The tl:dr is: Dream never groomed anyone or had inappropriate contact with anyone underage, he provided proof that one accuser flat out lied, and the other ""accusation"" was from a third party who was never involved. The actual supposed victim released a statement that they were never groomed, nor a victim in any way, never was asked about someone sharing information about them, and wants everyone to shut the fuck up.

Police were never actually contacted, both twitter accounts were lying about doing so to make their claims seem real. Also the supposed snapchat video shown is a very obvious fake.

He covers Manatreed, the run down is the guy was a childhood best friend he grew up with and who was struggling with homelessness. Dream helped him, and never knew about the battery charge (Manatreed had lied to him about it). When Dream spoke to Manatreed's ex girlfriend, she was very clear she never wanted any of this publicly out there, that she was happy that Dream had been helping Manatreed and she wanted the best for him.

Dream still doesn't know exactly what happened with that situation, he has since lost contract with Manatreed, all he knows is he was trying to help a childhood friend and got lied to.

The first allegation from Oxy/Anastasia, he's extremely clear they only ever messaged in twitter dms and he disproves the claim about the texts/tik tok. He has a google voice number hooked up to his tik tok account for obvious reasons, and she was showing imessage texts. This is not possible, which means she was lying.

As part of this, Dream scrolls through his twitter dms and shows he responds to fans all the time and talks to people in his community from all over. He also shows how he's friends with and has hired people that were fans of his, including people like Foolish.

He discusses Amanda, the two of them messaged on instagram back when he was a much smaller creator. He showed/posted the transcript of the two of them talking about normal stuff. They had been messaging since 2020. He did attempt to post a complete transcript of those messages, but she had deleted some of her messages and he doesn't have a way to recover them.

Dream explains that Instagram has a "feature" where if you ever reply to someone, then you literally cannot remove their ability to message you without blocking them. Something I did not know about instagram and which is fucking wild.

Since he replied to her in 2020, that meant she could message him forever and her notifications would be constantly showing up for him. He attempted to delete her messages/her ability to message him back in 2021 and showed proof of this, but realized he couldn't. Dream also in doing so accidentally deleted the context to her messages that she was a fan and basically everything prior to 2021.

Since he didn't remember her (what with the prior messages deleted), she was dmnig him from her personal account without fan content on it and was talking about being a streamer, he assumed she was a smaller streamer he knew and was talking to her as such.

They were talking about music so he gave her his personal snapchat to talk and because he wanted to get some feedback on a new song he was working on. He wanted to send the song via snapchat so he could be reasonably sure it'd stay private.

Dream categorically denies any sexting with Amanda or sexual messaging at all, he goes through why she most likely did this (he had been ignoring her messages and made a new snapchat with only close friends). He also downloaded his own data (something Amanda refused to/failed to do), went through the snapchat logs and did see some messages, but never saw either of his supposed compliments to her.

Amanda claimed Dream deleted her dms and that's why she couldn't provide any of the evidence she claimed she had, but Dream showed those same DMs very clearly undeleted. The dms were never deleted and she lied as an excuse.

Amanda lied about going to the police. Dream had his lawyers file a bunch of requests, and track down the police station that she went to based on the photo. They filed every request possible for any information with this police station, and there was no record of Amanda visiting the station or any records relating to Dream whatsoever. So either she lied about filing anything, or she told a story such that the police filed literally no paperwork whatsoever about the situation. Not even a report.

Dream sent the police station a copy of his own drivers license and Amanda's information so they could contact him if anything did come up, and nothing ever did. Nothing was filed, nobody cared.

Dream got swatted several times as a result of online harassment, including his family, and the harassment was overwhelming and awful for him.

He addresses the gumball situation, he showed up to a birthday party for a friend, gumball's VA was there and kept getting aggressive with him. While on facetime with some friends, Cantu ended up hitting Dream to impress them. Dream was obviously put off by this, but at the end of the night people ended up ubering together and Dream ended up in an uber with Cantu. He thought it'd be fine since other people were involved.

Cantu dropped his phone out the window made the uber driver pull over to look for it and got in trouble with the police. The uber driver tried to talk to Cantu about handling the police in the future, and Cantu started calling the uber driver slurs and claiming the uber driver had "down syndrome".

Dream got involved, trying to defend the uber driver, and Cantu threatened to kill him and called him slurs. Later Cantu apologized and Dream wanted to forgive him. Only later, Cantu started spreading lies about him and calling him a pedophile, so Dream realized the apology wasn't sincere and called him out for his behavior.

The third party who had been filming all of this saw what Cantu was doing lying about Dream and trying to claim none of this happened. They reached out to Dream and gave him the actual video as proof of what happened. Cantu tried to threaten them out of sending Dream the video of what happened, but they ignored him and sent them anyways. Dream also had the uber driver in his video backing up what he said.

Finally, the Jamie Allegations

Jamie is a mutual friend of several people that Dream knew, she did not post the allegations, she was never contacted about any of this she made an explicit statement that she was never groomed or a victim in any way.

Dream and Jamie meet prior to Dream being a youtuber on bbh's minecraft server, they were both fans of Skeppy. Which is why Jamie was followed by Dream, Skeppy, Vurb and some other youtubers in their friend group.

Jamie is still active online and put out her own statement, the person in the screenshots never gave permission for any of this to be put out, and they are very clear that the messages were taken out of context and that the claims made are false. The person in the screens is clear Dream is not a groomer, they never accused him of that, and that the twitter account is lying.

The snapchat video shown is very obviously fake, because snapchat just magically opens itself, there's no finger or button use interacting with the screen.

The burner account never actually contacted the police, Dream records him calling to the department they claimed to contact, and the person answering is very clear they have no contact from this person.

The supposed recent document posted is a fake convo of someone using a fake twitter account to talk to "Jamie", Jamie did not talk to them and it's just fake.

All of this was incredibly damaging for Jamie, who had no idea what was going on, and was getting harassed/stalked/having her irls contact.

Dream has also faced waves of harassment over obviously fake allegations, people have just been taking them at face value. He also shows how easy it is to fake these things as I have done.

He's been swatted, harassed, his family has been swatted and harassed, he's been scared for his own safety several times. It's been awful for him, and all based on fake shit. He's not stepping back from minecraft, but he is stepping back from twitter and no longer engaging with people behaving this way.

Also his ping pong record was undefeated.

[lacystar]

You’ve heard of main characters. You’ve heard of background characters. But in 2021, ranboo invented a brand new type of character: one that is simultaneously a main character while also being completely unnecessary to the plot.

[crastledivorce]

Actually it is genuinely insane to me how Secret Life fandom managed to invent fridging in a mcrp fandom like??? Lizzie was not fridged in story but I think the fandom managed to fridge her anyway

It's a Minecraft Roleplay SMP. Everyone is the main character of their own story, Lizzie included. Her death exists as its own story.

AND THEN FANS MADE A NARRATIVE WHERE SHE IS ONLY KILLED TO ADVANCE A MALE CHARACTER'S STORY FORWARD!

The primary way people are looking at HER DEATH is as something that breaks Jimmy's Canary Curse—SOMETHING THAT WASN'T IN HER VIDEOS!—instead of through the lens of her own story, perspective, feelings, videos.

I genuinely didn't realize it was possible. Fandom inventing a fridging that wasn't there in canon. You took her out of the void and put her into a refrigerator. It's so awful it's almost funny.

[sarcastictissy]

Remember that NONE of the ex-admins have said anything negative about Quackity himself expect from his lack of knowledge about the situation and not communicating with the admins. Which is a valid criticism.

Remember NONE of the past or current members of the QSMP have spoken negatively about Quackity and none of them have left because of him.

Remember that even now, no one has said they will leave the qsmp. There are people taking breaks or time off the server due to the circumstances but no one has explicitly said they will leave.

Even Antoine said he wants to talk with Quackity before making a decision!!!

Phil, Pac, Bagi, Foolish, Bad, Pierre, YD, Roier and others have played on the server since. They wouldn't if they didn't like or trust Quackity.

If you don't like him, that's fine! If you don't want to support the server, that's fine! If you don't want to buy merch, that's fine! It's okay to not like him or to have worries.

But I think it speaks more volume that some of his closest friends and members of the server haven't said anything negative about him, and I trust their judgement.

[tobi-smp]

I'm not going to watch tommy showing techno's dad around the server, because I just haven't been able to handle those sorts of videos emotionally. But Like.

realistically did any of you expect tommy to look at technoblade's dad and tell him how objectively wrong his son's roleplay character was?

getting mad that tommy framed techno's character in a more heroic light to Literally His Dad is. a bit ridiculous.

techno's dad doesn't need to hear about the complexities of the community house green festival scene, he's trying to honor the memory of his son.

[quaranmine]

the mcyt hate on this website is unreal. i mean, i knew that, but somehow it's so much more striking when it's directed at...jimmy solidarity of all people in that poll. like??? hello? yall are talking about jimmy solidarity?

i assume most of these people hate mcyt because of dream and dream smp. and jimmy is just...not associated with that at all. he's interacted with dream, what, maybe once? they were on a mcc team together three years ago in 2020. i literally don't think they've spoken before or since, not that i can think of. he's never been involved in dream smp either. honestly, in terms of degrees of separation, jimmy's just as close to stampycat (via martyn + netty) as he is to dream smp people. to my knowledge jimmy has never been in any controversy. not that i want to speak to soon or have anybody go digging up stuff, but like??? it's jimmy solidarity?? wet paper bag of a silly man who gives his two kitties little kisses on the head? AND PEOPLE ARE HATING ON HIM THAT HARD JUST BECAUSE HE MAKES MINECRAFT VIDEOS?

the entire term "mcyt" is just trashed because nobody knows how to separate the actions of a few people from an entire genre of content. which i already knew. but it just keeps getting continually proved to me

[prismatic-ink]

another Minecraft SOS update for you all, this time about why there's a "no lore" rule put in place.

Here are my own personal thoughts about this: Good. I think a lot of us would agree that Empires s2 fizzled out at the end and that it was clear, even if they didn't show it, that the CCs were just not that passionate about it anymore. I think part of that has to do with the scripted lore stuff (the other thing would be the crossover which I have a lot of Thoughts about but it might be a bit too controversial, ig if you see an mcytblr confession about the crossover being *ahem* mid then you know who wrote it).

While the elaborate backstories and planned lore segments had their place... these are Minecraft creators, not actors or writers, and I'm sorry to say, but the obvious Lore moments were just a bit awkward and ill-conceived to watch sometimes. I like roleplay-based SMPs, but I prefer it when the bulk of the lore is kept to the fandom, yk? It leaves more room for imagination.

Minecraft storytelling is at its best when it is improv, which is why Empires 1 worked better. I feel like forcing a traditional storytelling structure on a non-traditional format is limiting the strength of the medium (can you tell I also want to write a paper on Minecraft storytelling and its completely unique approach to narrative and the dimensionality of characters, completely deconstructing/transforming the concept of the "protagonist?").

anyways good rule fwhip keep on trucking 👍

[mayadoesfandomstuff]

After reading fWhip's reasoning for the "No Lore" rule, I can't blame him. What "lore" is within mcrp has gained connotations from the past few years of people using it just for the big stuff which puts so much pressure on creators to create big events and storylines even if it isn't a good fit for them.

Other than that, how fWhip describes how lore was treated behind the scenes is so confusing because honestly, it just sounds like some of them have poor roleplay etiquette. You don't just ask people to fill a certain role for your storyline out of nowhere especially if there's no discussion beforehand. You have to work together to write joint lore instead of putting them in an awkward position to roleplay out of character and in a way they aren't comfortable with or awkwardly reject the request. Besides this, just barring people from interacting with you because it messes with your lore is just weird like it's wild to put your lore above roleplaying in a roleplay server.

I understand that SMPs have this whole "everyone's the main character of their own POV" thing but you still have to be mindful of your fellow SMP members like that's the bare minimum when doing any roleplay. I hope this whole shift away from the big stuff reestablishes that lore isn't just the big stuff but the small stuff too because I do think that just making lore "big" was actually pretty damaging to mcrp long term.

[conarcoin]

c!quackcicle you will always be famous