#riding crop.
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squirting-sub · 4 months ago
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Bloody finish
(TW blood)
Remember that painful paddle?
For my 25th birthday, my dom gave me a new wood paddle with a bunch of holes in it, making it very painful as there's almost no air resistance to it. She promised to hit me 25 times each with both wood paddles, her belt, our split leather paddle, the riding crop and a rubber pencil (sounds funny, but it's thin, hard and wraps around the curve of my skin. Similar to a cane). In the end she used both her hands as well, hitting me 200 times total.
She first did 20 with each tool, except for the painful paddle I linked above. She had the suspicion I'd start bleeding if she hits me with that once I'm all warmed up. So she saved it for last. After the 20 with each, she did the last 5 in the same order. Of course, she hit harder though.
Finally, she used the painful wood paddle with the grid. She hit me twice and made me look at my ass. It was already bleeding after just those two hits, but to me the pain felt nice and I didn't feel the bleeding. She asked me if I want to continue and finish the 25, explaining that once I make my decision, only our safe word will make her stop and she won't care how much I struggle or bleed. I weighed my options. We've never done impact play like this and our play never included much blood. It was the first session that made me cry. In fact I was still sniffling, but we talked about everything beforehand and I was the one who wanted to try it even if it meant bleeding. I still wanted that. I wanted to take all 25 smacks and figured I still have my safe word. So I told her to go ahead.
While she hit me, I heard her say how my blood is splattering on the sheets and after she was done she showed me how bloody the paddle was.
Pictured below is a photo of my ass at the end of it. Again, big TRIGGER WARNING: you will see a bloody ass below!
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Unfortunately we were very busy, so I haven't taken many photos of how my ass looked the days after. I still have marks though and sitting is still uncomfortable.
I'm glad I made that experience and don't regret it. I'd also do it again, but it's definitely not something I need every week.
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rubberbeautys · 24 days ago
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@DonaFckTien
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marsoid · 18 days ago
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🔥 RIDE OR DIE UPDATE! 🔥
When Lucky discovers his missing mother was once a champion street racer, he and flirtatious mechanic Vick repair her car and are launched into the world of street racing to find answers. But what they don’t know is that something demonic is lurking beneath the hood of the car, something fueled by revenge… and gasoline.
⫘⫘⫘⫘⫘⫘⫘⫘⫘⫘⫘
Read update | Tapas | Webtoon
First page | Read ahead on Patreon
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dorkylilguy · 4 months ago
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he loves cowboys 😋💚
and cock
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a-spacecadet · 5 months ago
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Equestrian Confucius! 🐴
-
(who prefers giving his horse sugar cubes over riding)
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cabinette · 4 days ago
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OC worms got to me tonight I'm afraid. Concepting more stuff for my Lonely OC
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squirting-sub · 11 months ago
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The reward
We got a new flogger (pictured below) made from very hard rubber and were both eager to test it after getting back from meeting with friends.
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In the living room, she pulls me close and kisses me, only stopping to take my clothes off. As we make out, she walks me backward until my back is against the wall. We continue making out when suddenly she turns me around and pushes me against the wall. She takes my arms and holds them behind my back, then pulls the knife she was carrying around with her all day out of her pocket and holds it against my throat. "What were you thinking about when you were playing with my knife earlier, hm?". "I was thinking about this, Daddy. About your knife against my throat." "And does that turn you on?" "Yes Daddy, it does.". She moves the knife down my body so I can feel the cold blade against my skin before she walks me to the bedroom.
As she gets the new flogger, I kneel and wait for her. When she gets back and sees me on my knees, she smirks and walks up to me. Then, she pulls my face against her crotch and orders me to take off her pants. Once I do, she pulls my face against her crotch again. "You like that smell?". I tell her I do and kiss her through her briefs. She orders me to take them off as well and to take care of her. One of her hands is in my hair while I carefully lick her pussy. With the other hand, she gently slaps my ass with the new flogger. I jump from the surprise but her grip prevents me from pulling away. I continue eating her as she drags the flogger over my ass and slowly increases the intensity. "On a scale of one to ten, how bad did that hurt?" "Hmm... I'd say a three." "Ok, on the bed with you."
I'm face down ass up as she gets a softer flogger and a paddle to warm up my ass and thighs with. After a few minutes, she goes "I think I've been warming you up too well... I want to leave marks on you." And with that, she gets the new flogger and starts working me with it. Not only does she hit my ass and thighs, she also uses it on my back. It hurts bad. It's a sharp, stinging pain. But I like it. Eventually, she switches to the split leather paddle, the evil wood paddle, and the riding crop. During a little break, she asks me if I'm enjoying myself. "Yes Daddy, but breaks are also good.". I tell her that I also enjoy breaks with a different kind of pain, like wax. "You want some wax?" "Yes, Daddy." "Where?" "On my back, Daddy." She leaves and I stay in my position, patiently waiting for her to get back. "And since when do you call the shots, hm?", she asks before I feel an ice cube on my back. I shiver as she spreads it over my back and up to my neck, then down again. Eventually, she pushes the small remainder of the ice cube inside of me. Then, she continues with the impact play. Out of everything, I enjoy the riding crop the least. The stinging pain it causes is severe. It's concentrated to a small area and for some reason my brain doesn't process it as fast as the others. It takes a few milliseconds after the impact for the pain to set in and it's confusing to me. As the session goes on, I eventually end up laying flat on my stomach with my legs closed. She uses the riding crop last and the frequency of her slaps is fast and they're hard. I scream into the mattress and try to move away. It hurts so bad and I'm whimpering when she finally stops.
She moves next to me and gently strokes my hair, giving me soft kisses on my forehead, cheek, and shoulder. "You did so well, I'm so proud of you. I've never met anyone who can take as much as you do.". Still recovering from the intensity, I smile at her. She puts the split leather paddle, the new rubber flogger, and the riding crop on the mattress in front of my face. "Do you want to earn a reward?". "Yes, Daddy", I nod. "Good. You have to take six slaps with each of these three to get your reward, ok?". Hearing how low she set the number for each, I know she's gonna hit me hard and I'm a little afraid, but I agree nonetheless. She starts with the split leather paddle and as it's the one that hurts me the least, she hits me with full force and counts each one out loud for me. I yelp a few times, but mostly I enjoy those. Next, she uses the new flogger. Four of the hits are on my ass and two end up on my back. All of them make me scream into the mattress again. For the last six, she uses the riding crop, and again, the pain is intense. When she's done, she praises me again. "Ready for your reward?". "Yes, Daddy.", I say, but I'm suddenly feeling cold and shiver. When she asks me why I'm shivering, I tell her and she orders me to turn around. I'm a little weak and my backside hurts, so I struggle to turn and shake my head. She firmly tells me to turn around and when I do, she takes a blanket and lays on top of me, the blanket covering both of us.
She holds me and I hug her, slowly getting warmer. After a few minutes, she asks me if I'm warm again or if I need more time. I tell her I need a little longer and she says to tell her when I'm warm again. While I get warm, she kisses me softly and when I tell her I'm warm again, she pulls the blanket off of us and kisses down my body. She tells me I can cover up again if I start to feel cold. She kisses my chest, sucking on my nipples, getting me to moan. Moving down, she kisses my inner thighs, teasing me, before eventually licking my pussy. Eating me out ever so slowly and gently, she makes me moan and forget about the little cold I'm feeling. Her eating me out doesn't happen often, so I enjoy it immensely. My hand is in her hair and I can feel my orgasm building. When I cum, I moan "Daddy, I'm-", trying to let her know. She keeps sucking my clit, letting me ride out my orgasm but then doesn't stop. Instead, I feel her push her fingers inside me. After a clitoral orgasm penetration feels very intense for me and it doesn't take long for me to cum and squirt. Her face still between my legs, she drinks it and pulls away to fuck me harder. After the first orgasm it doesn't take much for me to cum again. After a few thrusts I'm squirting more, grabbing the sheets as my vision gets foggy from the tears in my eyes. She keeps going, making me cum again and again. I try telling her that I can't cum anymore but the words won't come out between all the moans and every time I manage to get out a word, she drags another orgasm I didn't know I had left out of me. It's like she went feral. She's completely primal and in the zone. She's not paying attention to anything and barely hears me as she fucks me. All I get is a "what??" when I finally manage to get out "Daddy, I-". However, because she makes me cum again I can't finish the sentence and she keeps going. When she finally slows down, I think she's done but just a few seconds later she continues. Pressing on my lower stomach with her free hand, she makes me cum again, squirting all over her hand and arm. After I don't know how many orgasms, I'm spent and just lay there motionless when she finally stops.
She looks at me concerned, then relieved when I move my head to look back at her. Kneeling in front of me, she's panting and shaking. I can see in her face that she's flying and not all there. She's not thinking clearly and looks indecisive on what to do. Usually, she'd get a towel to dry me, but now, after trying to stand and being too shaky for it, she lays next to me. I roll onto my side to lay in her arm and stroke her hair and face as she's panting. Holding each other, we slowly come down from our highs.
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venusandsaturnsrings · 6 months ago
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The school year finally ended... I hate college SO much :( but I am alive!! I beg for some crumbs of thoughts on Sunday... -chubby darling anon who is very much alive and finally got a mitsuri scale figure <3
putting all of my other fics, blurbs, and asks on PAUSE for this!! congrats!! no more school foorrr… 3ish months!! after dropping out of uni, i’ve been finally considering going back myself for phlebotomy!! canadas health situation is lack lustre rn and the course is less than one year + paid practicum + immediate job placement which is kinda sweet… CONGRATS ON THE FIGURE TOO!! i recently (like a month and a half ago) procured the hatsune miku jirai kei subculture fashion figure and i cannot stress how pretty she is <3 sits on my pc right now bc my shelves are full… ANYWAYS… love you!!
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includes: silly sunday hcs, potential story spoilers, maybe ooc im still feeling him out, praise, degradation, riding crops, his hands…, and gender neutral reader!!
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very poignantly the hopeless romantic type. he’s always functioned as a ‘singularity’ of sorts and over the years developed a certain fondness of it, even if it hurts. it’s worth noting he vividly reminds me of the line ‘i miss the comfort in being sad,’ from nirvanas ‘Frances Farmer Will Have Her Revenge on Seattle.’ he’s the type of partner to always be stuck in that self-absorbed martyr mindset a little bit.
pragmatic to a fault. Sunday is deeply a skeptic, take his departure from the harmony in favour of the order, as an example. it’s cool because it means you’ll never have to worry about any technicalities but it also means he has a hard time letting go of control or being spontaneous.
very into more subtle romantic gestures and an absolute gentleman. you’ll have flowers at your door at least once a week and he makes sure to take all of your preferences into consideration when planning dates (he will be the one planning). keeps his hand on your lower back most of the time, the waist is far too scandalous!!
not a big texter. he prefers speaking face to face and will call if he can’t come see you. that said, he’ll make sure to like or respond to all of the silly pictures and messages you send, even if it’s a dry ‘haha’ or just a heart. occasionally, you’ll find that he’s sent you a letter, ask about and he’ll shrug and say he simply wanted something more heartfelt if he’s to communicate written. he’s got a special stamp to seal the ones he sends you.
grabs your phone when you go to show him something. no explanation i just feel it in my bones.
although he’s no singer, he’s still a classically trained musician. i imagine he was taught the violin but went on to learn his preferred instrument, the harp, himself. he’s a bit shy about playing so rather than asking, just wait until he thinks it’s late and you’re not around to hear; he’s got quite the set of fingers.
…speaking of fingers, my bread and butter, he’s beyond skilled with playing you. while he enjoys getting down to business, getting to leisurely spread you open and thrum against all your nerves gets him going. could spend hours having you laid out, in his lap, on the floor, wherever, just gently coaxing you open, wet, and pliant for himself.
off of that, he likes you best worn down to soft edges and weak desperation. getting to play the saviour, making you come undone, has him stiff in his pants.
lots of sweet praise and subtle degradation. things like, “you want to be good for me, don’t you my sweet?,” or, “now, now, don’t get greedy on me. be patient, silly thing, and i’ll appease all of your foolish whims,” annddd, “come now, you’ve been so well for me, angel, don’t ruin that with any useless whines.”
he’s not one for being too harsh against you but push the right buttons and you’ll get a ‘dumb’ or ‘stupid’ here and there. Sunday doesn’t curse but he knows his way around how to make you feel inferior and looked down upon.
he likes the power play of staying fully and pristinely clothed while your completely nude, save for maybe a pretty collar he’s got you belled with. if you’re real trouble, say maybe a no good criminal causing problems on Penacony and once arrested you’re at his disposal and oh so pretty, he’ll find a nice muzzle to fix you with.
strikes, no pun intended, me as the type to have an affinity for riding crops over anything else for punishments. you’ll get the same sugarcoated degradation while he comments on how you’re not even good enough to be so close to his gloved hand that he just must use the crop!! (he likes the pretty bruises it leaves).
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dozydawn · 2 years ago
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“Rodeo.” Aspen, Colorado, 1981. Photographed by Nick Dewolf.
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ss2149-ssklavenjunge · 11 months ago
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fr-wiwiw · 4 months ago
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my previous tumblr post just got flagged xD see my nsfw twitter here for full version>> 🔞🍆🍑
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smallmeanie · 5 months ago
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cranky as hell and need someone to pin me down and hit me
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ancha-aus · 7 months ago
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RealAgeAU drabble - Moving
Hello I am back and I got another idea for this little silly au that I have @spotaus to thank for for the original idea :3 Though I think this may be officially becoming one of my AUs hahahaha
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Also yes. I know it would work better to number these uploads but also i am not writing these in any set order so it will become miserable for all of us if i number them because either they will be out of order or I will have to rework all the names and I am already editing links I don't need that extra energy in my life.
ANYWAY! :D
Next part! The one I lovingly clal in my head - The one where the gang finds a more permanent temporary home. (also yes. Before this they all speed-run the whole Parental bonding and emotional bonding to the idea of having a babybones. Which honestly can and probably will make four different drabbles)
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Horror stares at the door and wonders once again how he got to this point.
Well, no. That is a lie. He knows exactly how he got to his point.
He glances over his shoulder where the other four at hiding off to the side. Out of view from the doorway but still visable for Horror if he looks just right. Seems like Dust won the discussion, again, and is holding Nightmare, again.
Horror wants to say it is surprising how quickly they all just... accepted the situation they got into but he really isn't. Monsters are weird like that. Forced adoption is not that wild all things considered when you are talking about beings made of magic and emotions.
Horror stares at the door and raises his hand before knocking twice.
He really hadn't wanted to do this but they have no other choice. As he waits he can't help but think back to what made them decide this.
Cross walks from side to side "That was way to close! That was the third time we came across the Stars with Nightmare out. Third!"
Killer nods from where he is sitting wiht the sleeping Nightmare in his lap "Yeah no kidding. It is annoying as shit that they are hunting us."
Dust shrugs "Not surprising. Nightmare 'disappeared' after all. We are their only lead."
Killer grins "We were lucky Cross managed to lie his way out of the last one." and he shoots Cross a wink.
Cross sputters "I panicked!"
Killer grins and winks "Sure sure daddy crossy."
Horror holds up his hands between his two... co-parents "This is not the time. We need to figure out where we can go." and he thinks things over.
Cross sighs "I don't get how they keep finding us!"
Dust huffs as he packs their bags "We go to too little universes. Makes it easy for Ink and Dream to pick us out because they recognise us personally."
Killer frowns "Meaning. we need a big universe?" he taps his chin "But also mostly positive as we still don't know how obvious Nightmare would be otherwise."
Cross frowns "I think it will be fine. He can't feel the balance anymore right? And no one seems to have a reaction to him like they had before nor how people have a reaction to Dream's aura thing. Maybe with the corruption gone he really is just... ex-guardian now?"
Killer groans "I hope so. I am not a fan of child labor."
That is when it hits him. Horror sits up "I think I know a place."
All of them turn to him and he immediantly regrets saying anything. See? This is why he normally tries to limit what he says.
Either way. Here they are now and Horror prays this works. Please. They need one thing to work in their favor.
The door opens and a gasp "Horror! It has been ages! It is great to see you. How have you been?" Crop smiles at him.
Horror steels his nerves. Come on. Too much hangs on this moment "Hey Crop. Nice to see you. I am... okay. How are you?"
Crop frowns at him instantly "You sure? You don't sound okay. Trouble at home?"
Horror chuckles "Kinda? Not exactly. Euh... Can't go back to that place now?"
Crop frowns "Why? Need a place to stay? I got a spare room."
Okay yes! this is going great! just... gotta make sure he knows.
Horror nods "I do need a room. Not just for me though..." Crop starts to frown and Horror raises his hands "Just temporarily!"
Crop frowns "Did... something go wrong?"
Horror pauses and thinks this through once more. He trusts Crop. Crop has never been anything but kind even when Horror had been an ass. Even when he had to once drag Dust here to get healing before they could make the jump back home.
Horror looks to the side and he sees the others just beyond the treeline, hidden in shadows and waiting. Crop takes a look as well but he can't quite spot them. Crop looks back up at him.
Horror takes a deep breath "You need... to promise me, no not just promise you need to swear. That what you are about to learn will not leave this universe."
Crop frowns as he immediantly looks uncomfortable. It is the reaction a promise gets from most of them. But Crop also shoots him a considering look before he nods. He holds out a hand "I swear and promise I will not share the about to be giving information. UNLESS! It endangers anyone." and he waits.
Horror stares at the hand and thinks. That... That is fine right? That should be fine. Nightmare being a child doesn't endanger anyone. Only them and Nightmare. Horror nods and shakes the hand.
Crop nods and steps aside "Come inside. I bet you will be more comfortable explaining there." he glances at the forest "Do your... friends? Want to come in too?" a guess clearly. probably on multiple fronts.
Horror shakes his skull "Not yet. Need to know your answer and reaction first." He turns to the forest and makes a signal to wait a bit longer. He sees a thumbs up shot his way back. Probably Killer. He never bothered with the signals they had learned together.
Crop nods as he steps aside and Horror walks in, having to duck slightly for the door. The door closes behind him and Horror sees the small living room with fireplace.
Crop leads him to the kitchen "Lets talk there. I will get some tea."
A few minutes later they are both seated and with a cup of tea. Crop looks at him expectingly.
Horror takes a deep breath and takes out their most valuable resourch. The Dreamtale book. And places it on the table. Crop frowns at it before looking at Horror.
Horror nods to it "It will help explain... Very long story short... Nightmare was never an adult. He was a child with a magical shield of some type. That magic has ran out."
Crop stares at him for a moment, then he pulls the book closer and starts reading it. He pauses at the title before opening it.
And now he waits.
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Crop sits wiht his skull in his hands. Horror just sits across from him, with his empty cup of tea. Crop's own cup has grown cold a long time ago. Horror just waits for anymore questions but Crop hasn't said anyhting in the last ten minutes.
Horror looks back at the book and sees that Crop has turned the pages back to the one with the drawing of Nightmare's head being cracked open. The image makes a very clear show on how small Nightmare was compared to the ones attacking him.
Horror still thinks the book doesn't do it justice. Nightmare is much smaller in person than the picture makes him seem. The cracks had been much worse than the picture showed. But it is the closest they got.
Crop finally sighs and speaks. He doesn't look away from the picture "I don't... Know a lot about this whole... multiverse stuff. It isn't my place at all. And that is fine." he pauses for a moment "But this... You are telling me... That the one being that had everyone afraid. That everyone saw as a demon. Is a child... is this child?"
Horror nods before he explains more "Nightmare... gained a lot of magic and powers when he ate those apples. At least that is what the story implied. We haven't managed to get him to tell us yet, mostly because well... he is six again." Crops pulls a face as well, yeah. Horror agrees. A PTSD filled six year old is not easy. But they are managing.
Horror nods "so... What Cross nad Dust think what happened is that... The magic and negativity of the apples bond itself to Nightmare. Which game him the magic and powers he would use. The connection to the balance because the apples were part of the balance. and more importantly, an adult form and mind to fit all the magic. There was just no way all that magic and energy would have fit a babybones. Especially one that hadn't shown much magic beforehand." an assumption on their end as Nightmare was never said to use magic in the book.
"We think... We think that this magic of the apples just. ran out. We had been in battle at the time and Nightmare had been hit but it shouldn't have had that much of an effect. it was the same type of attack he had been hit by before. Dust thinks it was just the last bit of magic that the apples had having run out. Meaning that with the magic and energy so went the form." all a theory of course. But it is the only thing they have.
Crop nods as he clearly thinks "And as he was suddenly an adult. instead of just being afraid and scared. all that pain and emotions took a more violent turn. As he was an adult and was suddenly able to realise that it was unfair which made him angry..." Crop pauses.
Crop glares back at the table and shakes his skull "It is... It is a whole story about victim blaming. A victim is blamed for the abuse they suffered. They are made to believe they deserve it and should be abused. Then as soon as they fight back and defend themselves they are seen as guilty." Crop takes adeep breath as he leans back "What I don't get... Why come here? I can't help with any of this."
Horror shakes his skull "This isn't about any of the big stuff. We don't even care about it. We just... Nightmare is himself again. His real self." he taps the page lightly "Not his aged-up self that the corruption enabled him to be."
Crop stares before his face changes to shock "You are trying to hide him." Then a frown "Why not go to your own home? Has it been compromised?"
Horror snorts "At this point? probably." a confused look and Horror continues "Nightmare used his magic to shield off an universe and make a castle." he shrugs at the glance "Nightmare likes to read. I imagine he liked to read back then too. He may have been an adult technically but he was still a child at soul. Child him wanted a home and wanted that to be a castle and adult him made it happen... probably... that is Killer's theory at the moment."
Crop laughs and nods "Suonds reasonable- oh... and with his magic disappearing."
Horror sighs "When I left his universe the castle had already been decaying..."
Crop frowns "Left? The five of you you mean?"
Horror looks to the side and feels the shame return "We.... we did not react well... when we saw the changes at first... we... we obviously dind't know what was going on and well." he looks down "We abandoned him. I know it was wrong and stupid and we all regret it. We came back but we still did it." shame.
shame shame shame shame shame shame shame-
A hand on his shoulder. Horror glances up and Crop smiles at him "It is okay. You are trying to fix it now right? obviously. Not cool that you abandoned a child... but it can be nerve wrecking. Suddenly going from a position where a person is mostly guiding you, to going to a position where you suddenly are responsible over that same person."
Horror looks to the side "We still left." he can't believe they just left!
Crop nods "But you returned." he grins "And you are trying to fix it."
Horror nods again "We are..." he chuckles "Not that we have been doing a good job at it. Jumping from place to place."
Crop hums "So you are looking to settle, at least for a little bit, while also hidding. Why this universe?"
Horror nods "Yeah..." He looks to the side "We... we don't know how everyone will react. To him being like this. Maybe they will react well. Maybe not. We don't want to risk it. Risk him."
Crop stares at him for a long time and nods "There must be better places?"
Horror shakes his skull "The Stars kept finding us. Dust figured out we needed a big universe that leans towards positive. Yours is one of those. It is one of the wider and bigger ones. And overall leaning towards positive."
Crop frowns "It can't be the best one..."
Horror shrugs but continues "True... there are bigger and more positive ones. But those are busy. Many people. many places. Yours is quieter. more empty. Gives peace and room to work from."
Crop frowns as he taps his chin. He thinks deeply before sighing "You guys got any type of backstory we can use? The multiverse thing isn't a known thing here and the only reason my brother and I know is because you crash landed here."
Horror blinks "You will let us stay?"
Crop nods "Sure." and he grins "Can't kick out four parents with a babybones." and he gets up.
Horrro shakes his skull "That isn't... Well I mean technically." He knows that Killer has come close to killing quite a few people with how protective he has grown over Nightmare and that isn't even including the motherhenning of Cross nor the clinginess that Dust has.
Crop chuckles as he nods towards the stairs "The attic is messy and should be cleaned but can be used by you four, well five. There is an old bed and an old lounge chair up there." more thoughtful "How big is he exactly? we will need some clothes. Probably also get a healer to check him if he is developing okay after all those magical shenanigans."
Horror stares for a moment before smiling "Thank you... I know it is a lot."
Crop shrugs as he opens the linnen closet "Horror. Taking care of milking all the cows on your own is a lot. Having to fix your roof in the middle of a thunderstorm is a lot." He straightens his spine with blankets in his arms "Helping a friend and his friends who have somehow aqcuired a babybones, while strange, does not compare to either of those. Now get your friends out of those woods. They will make the animals nervous." he grins "I am excited to be one of the first ones to meet the real Nightmare."
Horror smiles as he packs his book and goes towards the door. "Thanks again Crop."
Crop waves it off as he moves the piles upstairs.
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Boom! and they are staying in FarmTale for now! Horror and Crop are homies and Dust is more of an acquaintance of Crop but it works. Aged-up Nightmare knew that Horror had an universe he liked to visit but never demanded details. *shrugs* Nightmare didn't see the point. as long as horror wasn't going to betray him what did it matter he didn't tell him?
Surprise Nightmare, this is your temporary home now. For a bit. or maybe longer? They are still figuring it out.
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