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shadowcanine · 1 day ago

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a deep dive into love has won.

before we begin, i’d like to make a disclaimer:

what i did is extremely dangerous, and i do not recommend anybody else taking the steps i did. cults are extremely damaging, and inherently designed to isolate and, in turn, control you. under no circumstances should you seek a cult out for the purpose of ‘’getting in” like i did. i did this purely for informational and research purposes; i know how to keep myself safe and differentiate reality from delusion. do not do what i did. if you made it past the disclaimer, hi :) as always, information will be under the cut. this post is purely for research and educational purposes, and is also extremely long- you’ve been warned.

It's November 30th, 1975. Somewhere in a small town in Kansas, Amy Carlson is born. Her parents divorced when she was young, and she now spends her time inbetween their homes. This didn't stop her success though, as throughout her childhood and teenage years, she was a good student- primarily earning A's and B's. She even worked at McDonald's, where she quickly climbed the corporate ladder, eventually managing her own location. Her employees would describe her as a ''great leader'' and very kind. She would do her best to accommodate them and their needs during her time with McDonald's.

Amy would go on to have 3 children, each with a different father. Her ability to achieve and maintain healthy relationships was lackluster at best, with majority of her relationships ending with claims of abuse or romantic neglect in one way or another.

Somewhere during the mid 2000's, Amy does shrooms. In her words, this was to ''see what all the hype was about.'' She then began to question if this is what the world really was like- and if so, who stole this reality from her?

It's also during this time that Amy develops an interest in ''New Age'' philosophy (New Age refers to a range of spiritual or religious practices of beliefs- it gained it's popularity in America during the 1970's. It's hard to explain what exactly it is, as the entire belief system is quite jumbled and confusing. Imagine closing your eyes while somebody blends a bunch of food, and you're supposed to name everything in the blender. It's essentially impossible.)

During this time, Amy becomes very active on the website ''lightworkers.org'' it was on this website she met ''Amerith WhiteEagle'' who convinces Amy that she is divine; shortly after this, Amy begins to claim to experience paranormal experiences- most notably was a voice telling her she would ‘’one day be President of the United States’’.

It’s late 2007 now, and Amy wastes no time in leaving her third husband, children, and job. She cuts off majority of her family, and proceeds to meet ''WhiteEagle'' in Colorado. It only gets worse from here.

After meeting WhiteEagle in person, him and Amy form a group (or. more accurately, a duo) together. They call themselves the ''Galactic Federation of Light'' (or GFOL). Their first video is posted to YouTube in 2009. They lead this group under the names of ''Mother God'' and ''Father God.'' Most of these videos discussed outlandish topics, starships being an example- and one of the core ‘’beliefs’’ of Love Has Won / GFOL.

The group would then gain their first follower- Miguel Lamboy. It's 2014, and for whatever reason, WhteEagle and Carlson split. Apparently, WhiteEagle had left for another ‘’lightworker’’ he recruited from New York- and Carlson went on to join with Miguel. Miguel was now in charge of the financial aspect of the group, as well as budgeting.

2014 is also when the group really begins to gain momentum, credits of the internet. The group would regularly hop between Colorado, Oregon, California, and Florida between 2014-2018. They eventually settled in Moffat, CO. A quaint small town, where the group claimed to feel ‘’more connected’’ to the Earth. WhiteEagle and Miguel were not the only ‘’Father Gods’’, though- with a long line behind them. Amy was described by ex-members as ‘’never going more than two minutes without a ‘’Father God.’’ ‘’ Jason Castillo would become the final ‘’Father God’’ in 2018.

The group now had between twelve and twenty full-time members who lived with Carlson in Crestone, CO. Crestone has been described by locals as a place where the ‘’veil is thin’’ (ie, you’re closer to the universe there). The team would livestream daily, usually on Youtube, to accomplish their ‘’goals’’. The goals for these livestreams were as follows:

• Recruit more members.

• Encourage and solicit donations.

• Promote ‘’New Age’’ products, as well as vitamin supplements.

The team of Love Has Won regularly advertised something called ‘’etheric surgery’’. It cost $88 per person, and could allegedly ‘’remove sickness’’ and ‘’negative energy’’ from the body. They also sold *colloidal silver, which they claimed could cure COVID-19. (Colloidal silver is known for turning a users skin a ‘’blue-gray’’ tint if consumed in excess. This is called Argyria, and while on it’s own isn’t a major health problem, it doesn’t go away- even if you stop consumption of the silver.*)

Love Has Won would also use these livestreams to push their beliefs. The main belief was that Amy Carlson was the 534th incarnation of Mother God. They believed she was a deity, destined to lead exactly 144,000 believers out of the ‘’superficial reality’’ present in the ‘’3D-world’’ and into a ‘’fifth-dimensional plane of higher existence’’. Amy, believing she was an incarnation, was also apparently quite a few people in her past lives. These are some of the people:

• Mother Earth

• Gaia

• Cleopatra

• Jesus Christ of Nazareth

• Joan of Arc

• Harriet Tubman

• Helena Blavatsky

• Marilyn Monroe

• The mother of Elvis Presley

Amy claimed to have full memory of these past lives, including Jesus’ crucifixion. Allegedly, she could also ‘’produce miracles, kind of like Jesus.’’

In order to accomplish her goals of leading believers out of 3D world, Amy claimed she needed to communicate with ‘’The Galactics.’’

The Galactics were an ‘’etheric team’’ of spiritual ambassadors, largely made up of celebrities who have died. This team included Robin Williams (the main ambassador), Patrick Swayze, John Lennon (the command of the main starship), Whitney Houston, Prince, Steve Irwin, Carrie Fisher, Rodney Dangerfield, Tupac Shakur, Chris Farley, David Bowie, Gene Wilder, and Michael Jackson. Among this etheric team were also the still alive Donald Trump and Carol Burnett. Amy claimed the Count of St. Germain was also helping her.

One of the stories Amy frequently told was one of her ‘’past.’’ In this past, she lived in Lemuria (a continent proposed in 1864, which was theorized to have sank beneath the Indian Ocean) and Trump was her father. An obscure technology existed, but the details of what this item did are unclear. The theft of this item, however, caused an ‘’explosion that sank Atlantis.’’ While Amy (Mother God) was able to save the technology, she was not fully ready to ascend to the ‘’fifth-dimension’’ because humanity was not ready. As a result, she ‘’continued to return to Earth in human form.’’

The original LoveHasWon website was removed, but while it was still up, it claimed that Amy was a ‘’spritiual surgeon.’’ She would work ‘’multidimensionally’’ to operate on people’s bodies and cure whatever they may be suffering with. Allegedly, Amy the (former) McDonald’s Manager, had cured cancer, Lyme disease, addiction, suicidal thoughts, removed brain tumors, and ‘’cured’’ Autism. What a portfolio.

Now, before we move on, it’s time for the good part of this post. In an effort to make the most accurate and in-depth Love Has Won post, I came to the conclusion that the best way to get into the minds of these individuals was to let them into mine. As such, I spent a few days posing as an interested ‘’recruit.’’ This included partaking in multiple video calls with the team, participating in livestreams, and researching their ‘’sources.’’ If you’d like a simple answer; yes, I did ‘’join’’ a cult to make a Tumblr post about it.

It’s also worth mentioning that even though my involvement with this group was fairly surface level, it has kind of fucked with my head a bit. I feel extremely negatively about these individuals, and the interview was a shit show marketing tactic clearly geared to seek out mentally ill individuals in order to manipulate them into joining. I’ve attempted to make this section as informative as possible, but the actual phone call was incredibly confusing. I promise I’m doing the best I can in this regard- there’s only so many ways you can turn pure propaganda into an informative piece. The chamber is spun dry. Regardless, here’s a detailed description of the phone call- as well as some thoughts I simply couldn’t hold back regarding it.

The interview itself was pretty confusing, starting off with who we’ll call ‘’Moon’’ calling me out of nowhere at 11:38PM. It was a video call, and while my webcam was on, the room was dimly lit. Moon insisted I turn on a light, and upon me doing so, said I was ‘’beautifully made by Mother and Father of all creation.’’ It was extremely uncomfortable. The call then progressed with Moon asking me how I ‘’discovered’’ ‘Mother’’ and ‘’Father’’ God. I told her I discovered them through the HBO doc, and claimed their ‘’message really resonated with me.’’ This would open the door to the most uncomfortable hour and a half phone call I have ever had.

‘’Moon’’ went on to explain how the group’s main focus is ‘’coming home’’ which refers to being in the physical presence of ‘’Mother and Father.’’ I said ‘’wow, that’s really awesome!’’ and I was then informed that ‘’Father’’ had actually created the word ‘’awesome’’ by combining ‘’awe’’ and ‘’sum’’ to describe ‘’Mother.’’

(After the interview, it was pointed out to me that this may be referring to being in a ‘’state of awe’’, and considering this is a cult we’re talking about, I have reason to believe that suggestion is correct.)

‘’Coming home’’ does not just refer to being in their physical presence, however, as it also apparently about exploring our talents and skills, and where ‘’energy is the greatest.’’ I won’t put you all through the mental gymnastics I had to do to figure out what this all meant, so I’ll explain it like this:

Imagine you volunteer at a soup kitchen. It’s a good deed, and it helps your community, but does it help anybody outside of your town? No. You volunteering at a soup kitchen will not create a ‘’ripple affect’’ of energy. ‘’Coming home’’, however, will. Because being in the physical presence of ‘’Mother’’ and ‘’Father’’ is where positive energy is abundant, it will allegedly flow out of ‘’home’’ and to the rest of the world. This is essentially Love Has Won weaponizing a savior complex, with the implications being the world cannot be happy, or positive, or good, if you yourself do not ‘’come home.’’

I was also informed that during the filming of HBO’s documentary ‘’Love Has Won: The Cult of Mother God’’, Love Has Won attempted to get the crew to stay with them for three months. They wanted them to ‘’see the miracles in action’’ and believing anybody who came into contact with Mother and Father would immediately know they were ‘’god,’’ they deemed it important to have HBO stay. HBO did not- instead staying for 2 ½ days to wrap up interviews and research before leaving.

My contact, Moon, also told me that she had been interviewed by HBO, though her clips were cut from the documentary. The only image of her in the documentary is a photo where she’s in the background, and only the back of her is visible. Moon claims to not know why she was cut from the documentary, theorizing it was done for one of the following reasons (taken directly from the interview and unedited):

‘’News are all about selling fear. Media is all about selling fear and anger. Mother and Father are about evolving from our past lives into this life- this life is our last lifetime to recognize mom and dad. Through the souls journey of a culmination of experiences and conditioning, it leads them to mom and dad. If a person is unable to accept constructive feedback from Mother and Father, they leave.’’

So, not really an answer to me asking why she was cut from the documentary, but beggars can’t be choosers I suppose. My personal belief is that she was too into it to be in the documentary. Everybody else interviewed, with the exception of Father God, had left the cult. Moon had not, and I’m not sure if pure cult propaganda is what HBO wants on their network.

Moon also shared with me that she had lived with Mother and Father for quite some time, before and after the ‘’ascension.’’ She had to return to Asia to ‘’finish up some stuff’’ but did not elaborate on what ‘’stuff’’ was. She plans to return ‘’home’’ when she is able to do so.

I did my best to press Moon into giving me a concise answer about what exactly Love Has Won believes in, but she herself seemed confused on what exactly that entailed. She didn’t elaborate on many points, but I’ll do my best to explain what I was told.

Love Has Won believes that ‘’Mother’’ and ‘’Father’’ are here to provide us with joy, abundance, and health. They can heal anything, and have created everything. They are strictly against-hate, and believe humanity cannot progress via literature alone. We must go out and experience things, as experiences are what raise the soul ‘’higher and higher.’’

I also did ask about the 2020 Hawaii incident*, and opinions on it seem to be jumbled. Some members were angry, but some just believed it was a waste of time.

*(In August of 2020, LHW briefly relocated to Hawaii, specifically the island of Kauai. They believed they needed to be in Hawaii in order for Mother God to ascend. They were met with extreme backlash from locals after Amy claimed to be the Hawaiian volcano goddess Pele. Protests outside of the home was LHW was in lasted for days, and included protesters lighting driftwood fires and chanting Hawaiian prayers around the home. Video footage provided showed eggs and rocks being thrown at the rented home, as well as the windows of the home and SUV parked in the driveway being broken in. Kauai’s mayor, Derek Kawakami, negotiated with Love Has Won to depart the island. They flew to Kahului Airport on Maiu, and in September of 2020, the group returned to Colorado.)

As of 2024, Love Has Won believes the protests in Hawaii were ‘’pointless’’ stating during the interview:

‘’If you don’t believe Mother God is who she says, why don’t you just ignore us? Why attack us?’’

I was also informed that their ‘’teachings’’ can be found through their songs on YouTube, but upon investigation, most of these songs are just covers. Very few of them are original work, and, as such, very few contain any sort of meaningful information regarding the groups teachings.

I was then asked by Moon why people hated Jesus, which seemed redundant to the conversation. I’d include context as to why I was asked this, but there isn’t any. She just randomly said it. The conversation is as follows:

Moon: ‘’Why did people hate Jesus?’’

‘’Huh?’’

Moon: ‘’Do you know why?’’

‘’They hated Jesus because he spoke the truth?’’

Moon: ‘’Exactly. They couldn’t- they couldn’t fathom that Jesus could heal on the spot, and that’s what Mom and Dad are- they can heal a person on the spot.’’

─── ･｡ﾟ☆: *.☽ .* :☆ﾟ. ───

I had previously made an excuse that my memory was bad, and asked if I could take notes. During the end of the interview, I apologized again for the typing sounds and how many notes I had to take, saying, ‘’I’m a bit stupid, sorry.’’ Moon replied with an incredibly off-putting statement, but had to quickly after to start her day.

‘’You are beautifully, beautifully crafted by Mom and Dad.’’

Now, as you’re reading this, it may be hard to understand how exactly Love Has Won is a cult. Sure, they’re clearly unstable, but is it really a cult? To answer that, you have to know what a cult is. This section is mildly lengthy, and while I’m sure many of you have the knowledge to understand this is a cult, some may still be confused or feeling unsure.

Cult Education Institute has a list of warning signs, which we’ll be going over and explaining how each one applies to Love Has won, and therefore proving it is, indeed, a cult.

Some warning signs of a potentially unsafe group/leader are the following:

1. Absolute authoritarianism without meaningful accountability.

Love Has Won, specifically Amy Carlson, is known for their lack out of accountability. If any members were to speak up about these things, it created an unsafe environment for the rest of them. There’s one instance of ‘’Father God’’ locking members outside in the Colorado winter, and taking away their heater. This is because they ‘’disrespected Mother.’’

2. No tolerance for questions or critical inquiry.

Members of Love Has Won are expected to fully accept Mother and Father god as the creators of everything- those who start to question whether or not this is real are kicked from the group, and told to ‘’come back when they know better.’’

3. No meaningful financial disclosure regarding budget, expenses such as an independently audited financial statement.

Miguel Lamboy was the sole member in charge of finances. Other members never saw this money, but were expected to constantly contribute to the costs and living expenses of the group. Members were not allowed to use their own money to buy food for two main reasons.

a) Food would clog your body, preventing you from absorbing the teachings of Mother and receiving her energy.

b) Members buying food instead of donating meant less money for the group overall, which was a concept Father and Mother couldn’t stomach.

4. Unreasonable fear about the outside world, such as impending catastrophe, evil concspiracies and persecution.

Love Has Won views those who hold disdain to Mother and Father, or those who refuse to accept them as the Creators of Everything, as ‘’whores.’’ They believe these people were trying to prevent Amy’s ascension, which, in their eyes, is considered persecution.

5. There is no legitimate reason to leave, former followers are always wrong in leaving, negative or even evil.

In the interview, Moon stated that the only people to leave the team were those incapable of accepting constructive criticism. They were ‘’blinded by hate’’ and unable to ‘’get over themselves’’ and accept Mother and Father’s criticism.

6. Former members often relate the same stories of abuse and reflect a similiar pattern of grievances.

Nearly every ex-member of Love Has Won tells the same story;

‘’Mother God’’ was constantly drunk or high, or some combination of the two. Nights would be spent listening to domestic disputes between Mother and Father, and watching Mother hit Father on numerous occasions. All members share a pattern of claiming financial manipulation and abuse at the hands of Love Has Won. They were not allowed to use their money on themselves, and were pressured into giving what money they did have back into the cult.

7. There are records, books, news articles, or television programs that document the abuses of the group/leader.

Love Has Won - Jason (Father God)’s Abusive Side

Love Has Won: The Cult of Mother God

I was in LHW in 2018 - parts one and two.

Love Has Won Members Defending Cat Abuse

8. Followers feel they can never be ‘’good enough’’.

Members share similar claims of doing anything they could to have the chance to be close to ‘’Mother God.’’ One ex-member, Hope, would clean the house from top to bottom- everyday. The only acknowledgement she got from this was an offhanded comment Amy made to a friend. They constantly try to do everything they can to be in her good graces; waiting on her every beckon call, allowing her to do nothing while they handle everything, etc.

9. The group/leader is always right.

Questioning ‘’Mother God’’ would result in being screamed at, or, as it happened to a group of members, locked outside in the Colorado winter all night with no heater. If you were to so much as imply that Amy may not be god, you would be removed from the team and sent on your way- sans any money you may have given, or any resources to help you get home.

10. The group/leader is the exclusive means of knowing ‘’truth’’ or receiving validation, no other process of discovery is really acceptable of credible.

Team members were encouraged to talk to Amy about any sort of problems they were having, or even any ones that may have occurred during childhood. For all intensive purposes, this would be considered traumabonding- as Amy would help the team through these issues, making them think she was the only one that could help, and then pick them apart if they weren’t ‘’good enough.’’ Love Has Won is anti-therapy, anti-church, and anti-physical-family. Team members were encouraged to rely solely on Mother and Father. If their physical family disagreed with the practices of Love Has Won, the team was told by Miguel to “cut them off or leave.”

─── ･｡ﾟ☆: *.☽ .* :☆ﾟ. ───

“Okay, but if I’m not in a cult, how do I know if someone else is?”

There’s also a list of warning signs regarding people involved with a potential cult, which we’ll go over so you can compare this list to the actions of Love Has Won members. This is just the list, no more explanation paragraphs about how it’s a cult, don’t worry.

1. Extreme obsessiveness regarding the group/leader resulting in the exclusion of almost every practical consideration.

2. Individual identity, the group, the leader and/or God as distinct and separate categories of existence become increasingly blurred.

(important note: majority of LHW team members were given “godly” names. while in the cult, they went by the “godly” names as opposed to their birth names.)

3. Whenever the group/leader is critized or questioned it is charactered as ‘’persecution’’.

4. Uncharacteristically stilted and seemingly programmed conversation and mannerisms, cloning of the group/leader in personal behavior.

5. Dependency upon the group/leader for problem solving, solutions, and definitions without meaningful reflective thought. A seeming inability to think independent or analyze situations without group/leader involvement.

6. Hyperactivity centered on the group/leader agenda, which seems to supercede any personal goals or individual interests.

7. A dramatic loss of spontaneity and sense of humor.

8. Increasing isolation from family and old friends unless they demonstrate an interest in the group/leader.

9. Anything the group/leader does can be justified no matter how harsh or harmful.

(see: amy’s cat abuse + LHW locking children in closets when they were overwhelmed from the noise of the home)

10. Former followers are at–best considered negative. At worst, evil and under bad influences. They can not be trusted and personal contact is avoided.

In September of 2020, shortly after the group returned to Colorado, it had been stated that Amy was in extremely poor health- being paralyzed from the waist down. Love Has Won still hosted their daily livestreams, but those now included scenes of Amy having to be picked up and carried to bed, unable to walk on her own. According to Amy herself, she had cancer- though it’s not confirmed how accurate this statement is, and autopsy reports make no mention of this claim, or anything alluding to it being true.

In early April of 2021, Love Has Won was located in an RV park in Mount Shasta, CA. They were asked to leave due to overcrowding. In the weeks leading up to her death, numerous wellness checks were called for Amy, usually being called in by her sister, or mother, who would watch the streams. Each time the police arrived to preform these wellness checks, Love Has Won claimed Amy wasn’t home.

Amy was last seen alive by somebody not affiliated with Love Has Won on April 10th, 2021.

Now, it’s worth mentioning that the team of Love Has Won knew Amy was dying- but that’s not how they saw it. Love Has Won was convinced that a starship, piloted by Robin Williams, would come to pick Amy up and take her to ‘’ascend’’ to the 5D plane.

At Amy’s request, the group travelled to Ashland, Oregon- where they stayed at Callahan’s Mountain Lodge. According to two Love Has Won members, Amy had asked to be taken to the hospital, but the team refused, claiming:

‘’Mom doesn’t know what she’s talking about- she would never set foot in a 3D hospital. That’s a death sentence.’’

While in Ashland, Amy lost all motor control, and required around the clock help for daily tasks. At an unknown date, Amy passed away in the room of Callahan’s Mountain Lodge. When staff became suspicious, her body was transported to the Mount Hood National Forest. The group camped there, with ‘’Father God’’ sharing a tent with Amy’s corpse. They were waiting for the ‘’Galactic’’ beings to come and retrieve her body, but ‘’Father God’’ claimed he heard a calling to move her body. As a result, Love Has Won drove her body back to the group’s home in Crestone, Colorado- where Miguel, the one in charge of finances, called the police to report that the group had brought Amy’s body into his home and were staying there without permission.

Amy’s body was found- mummified, and in a sleeping bag. She was wrapped in christmas lights, and her face was covered in glitter. Her eyes were missing due to the decomposition. Police described the findings as a ‘’makeshift shrine.’’

The Galactics never came.

After Amy’s death, an autopsy was done. Her autospy was released in December of 2021, and states her cause of death as the following:

‘’Global decline in the setting of alcohol abuse, anorexia, and chronic colloidal silver ingestion.’’

The autopsy found no proof to substantiate Amy’s claims that she had cancer.

Seven members of Love Has Won would have charges brought against them for child abuse, abuse of a corpse, tampering with deceased human remains, and false imprisonment. If convicted, they would have been facing around 12 years at the lowest. The charges were later dropped for the following reasons:

• It happened in Colorado. In Colorado, you cannot be charged with both ‘’abuse of a corpse’’ and ‘’tampering with deceased human remains’’ if both charges arose from a single incident.

• Amy’s corpse showed no signs of being tampered with in a malicious way- and for being a corpse found in a makeshift shrine, was in decent condition. It’s clear her body was respected after her death.

• The prosecutor told the judge he thought the constitionality would be in question regarding abuse of a corpse involving Carlson’s body decorations.

Despite the house and group’s bank accounts both being in Miguel’s name, he faced no charges. He did, however, empty the bank accounts, totaling $333,000. He has not been heard from by the group since April 28th, 2021, and news outlets have failed to locate him. HBO did locate him, but he refused to participate in the documentary.

Amy Carlson’s remains were returned to her family.

As of 2024, Love Has Won is still active. Father God now claims to share a body with Mother, with some ‘’sources’’ claiming to have seen Mother’s face ‘’on top’’ of Father’s face, and heard them both speaking. They still believe that Mother will return, and are still trying to recruit new team members.

Their website states that they have some pretty ambitious goals. Apparently, Father is asking for donations to build a school where children can learn about their ‘’true’’ parents. He is also asking for donations for a hotel room, with the tagline ‘’RESPECT GOD WITH A HOTEL STAY.’’

On top of these, he plans to build a house for the team to live in. Where he plans to acquire this money? We may never know. After the HBO documentary, they seem to struggle quite a bit with recruitment. Any Google search of their name will bring up hundreds of articles, documentaries, and videos telling you the same thing I am: Love Has Won is a dangerous cult.

They still are very active online, having accounts on nearly every mainstream social media platform- though most have been banned or terminated by site moderators. If you look for it, you’ll find it. Don’t let it find you, though. I’d really rather not see you guys on a documentary six years down the line. Thanks.

Some members never left, though. The group remains active, and most likely will for the foreseeable future. Unless, of course, the starship comes to take them to the fifth dimensional plane.

Overall, it’s a mindfuck. They target people already struggling with addiction, telling them that psychedelics and alcohol are ‘’medicine’’ if used properly. Love Has Won affirms other people’s delusions, and if you know anything about people who suffer from delusions, you know they tend to stick around the people who affirm what they believe.

I think Amy’s story is a bit sad, though. I do believe at some point she realized how wrong she was, but it was too late. The team would convince her she really was Mother God whenever she expressed these thoughts- she did invite her family to come visit her when she was dying. Upon her daughter writing a strongly worded email, Amy simply replied something to the effect of ‘’You look just like me. I love you, feel free to come visit me in Hawaii anytime.’’

None of her family showed up, though. Probably as a direct result of the way she treated them. She abandoned her child, and had minimal contact with her sister and mother. At the end of the day, Amy Carlson was an abusive cult leader at best, but it’s still hard not to mourn who she could have been had she gotten proper help. She begged to go to a hospital, they refused. I think if things would have played out differently in Amy’s first relationship, none of this would have had happened. But hey, what do I know?

Anyways, this post has been really draining for me. It’s taken me three days to write it, and that’s not including the weeks of research I had to do, and the days and nights I had to spend communicating with these lunatics. This post will be queued, so whenever you see this, assume I’m sleeping for the first time in days.

I’d like to make a special thank you to the following people for helping me out with this:

@silliesthumanalive for helping me analyze the transcript of the interview

@goredawg for letting me complain about how exhausting it was, and letting me ramble whenever I found something new out.

Anyways, I hope you all enjoyed reading, and I know this was really long- but I’d rather have the information available. I’m sure at least one person will learn something, whether it be about identifying cults, or simply realizing how fucking insane these people were and continue to be.

TLDR; Amy Carlson did shrooms in the early 2000s. Then became convinced she was God, and the reincarnate of hundreds of celebrities. Apparently, managers at McDonalds can become Jesus. Got people to follow her message, and ended up dying as a direct result from the message she spread. Don't join a cult, kids- and don't try to create one, either.

─── ･｡ﾟ☆: *.☽ .* :☆ﾟ. ───

# I hope none of you guys get kidnapped by the John Lennon starship and taken to the fifth dimensional plane. All complaining on my end aside, I’d be lying if I said this wasn’t kind of fun to work on. Thanks for reading! :)

# Also, I apologize for how the text was broken up. Normally I’d keep it somewhat clumped together and just use a divider, but there’s so much text here, I feel like this formatting is significantly easier to digest.

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weneverlearn · 9 months ago

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Kurt Bloch: An Awesome Guy Who Awesome People Like

Rocking with the Fastbacks and recording all your favorite bands since 1979

Fastbacks, 1988; Kurt Bloch far left, Gumby t-shirt

“There truly is something about inspiration and enthusiasm that really is inspiring and enthusiastic!” - Kurt Bloch

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By: Eric Davidson

I’ve been thinking a lot about joy of late. Like pure, eyes-to-the-sky, skipping down the street joy. There is a paucity of it around right now.

We could follow a zillion trails to and from how we got here, but this is ostensibly a music blog, so I’m going to make a quick stab at the roots of this unenviably joyless position we’re sitting in, rock-wise.

The Fastbacks were joyful. Starting out in 1979 in the dawning days of Seattle’s punk scene, they became a local fave on the basis of action-packed shows stuffed with careening pop hooks, irked energy, and a friendly, guffaw around onstage demeanor that didn’t exactly scream “pre-hardcore era.”

Fastbacks retreated for a few years, circa 1988, and when kicked back into gear a couple years later, found themselves being a preferred opener for a load of grumpy grunge bands who I’m guessing hoped to absorb some of the Fastbacks positive energy to counteract their mope – which the Fastbacks were more than ready to supply.

A mélange of metal volume, fleeting bouts of prog whimsy, Ramones tempos, and BubbleYum stickiness, the Fastbacks created a singular sound. Like most great bands, they never fit into any particular zeitgeist – too raggedy for the pop punk contingent, too peppy for the grunge trend, they nonetheless retained a respected status among bands who appreciated their consistently grabby tunes and fun live show.

Despite any remaining expectations of what “success” was supposed to be, by the turn of the millennium the Fastbacks became that precious thing – one of those awesome bands that awesome bands like.

It should be noted that, while grunge soon gained a definition as a downer genre (that has taken root since), Bloch and company palled around with that Seattle scene from the get-go, and knew many of them as fun rocker kids just trying their best to get through seven months of rain by rocking.

The Fastbacks kept careening forward right through the ‘Alternative Rock” era that ignored all the fun underground garage punk and instead painted rock as increasingly dreary and grievance-based. The early 2000s came, and the Fastbacks took their leave.

They’ve recently gotten back together for occasional reunion shows. Always holding them together throughout their stop/start whirlwind of a career was ace guitarist/producer and philosophical center of the band, Kurt Bloch.

Bloch, who began his career as a recording studio whizz with Fastbacks, never stopped twiddling the knobs for lots of your favorite bands and/or underrated acts. We checked in with him on his ongoing mission to bring fun to the fringes despite the mainstream consistently choosing incorrectly.

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Kurt Bloch, rockin', 1990 (Fuck the NRA. I will assume Kurt's t-shirt here was de rigueur '90s irony.)

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What was the first album you loved; and what was the first album you loved because of its production?

Good question, hard to answer. I think it was 45s and AM radio that got me going on recording qualities, how loud some of the great hits of the early-’70s sounded. How some records sounded like they were a band playing inside your head. I think I was aware of EQ and compression sounds early on, how the drum fills would sort of obliterate everything behind it on some songs. How the guitar would be so loud in the breaks. How, if the record didn’t have enough treble, it would be unexciting; if there was too much then it’d sound wimpy.

Then getting into albums, and FM radio, you’d listen to Larks’ Tongues In Aspic or Dark Side Of The Moon, and they had this spacious quality that was rad; the Scorpions’ Fly To The Rainbow was right in your face, really up-front and close. Then, going to see bands live, we’d see the coliseum style shows – that was so cool, but then getting to see bands in smaller spaces where you could hear the amps on stage, and feel the sound pressure in the room –now that was a mind-opener. You could feel the Marshalls and the actual sound coming off of the stage.

Then when punk bands started playing, that’s when it started getting interesting. You know, like I just saw this killer band that sounded so great at the show, and their record sounds like a bowlful of shit. Why?! That leads to one-track, two-track, four-track tape recorders, and each time you record something, you have a whole book of revelations of what to do and what not to do. So many great recordings from that early punk era without a bunch of reverb. It was another revelation. A lot of those early digital reverbs that everyone had, I just hated that fake trebly, scritchy sound. Rather just not use any reverb than that icky sound.

How did the Fastbacks form?

Kim and Lulu were high school friends of ours, The Cheaters was our neighborhood band; only lasted a couple years but they were good ones! When that band disintegrated on-stage, there was still band gear in my parents’ basement. Kim (Warnick, bass/vocals) had been in a band, The Radios, and Lulu (Gargiulo) wanted to play guitar and sing. Somehow my parents didn’t put a stop to it all, so we started playing a couple times a week. Not saying we got good, but we got better.

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How long before you felt you had locked into the Fastbacks’ sound?

I reckon whatever “sound” we had was pretty well established early on; it was just whatever we wanted to do. Of course we loved the punk bands of the era first and foremost, but also the ’60s and ’70s pop music we grew up with; and the hard rock bands of the ’70s too! And I always was a fan of the wonderful arrangements and sound of the ’70s prog bands, once I started writing most of the songs, these things would creep in.

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Live, 1986

I have this romantic vision of Kim Warnick as a long-haired rocker teen crashing parties and such. Is that correct?

Ha ha ha!! We were all pretty good (bad?) at crashing parties, some of the shit we did makes me wince thinking of it all. But it was 1977, ‘78; things were different back then, a different kind of boredom ran rampant through kids’ minds back then. There was a real disdain for society, maybe not to the degree of the UK bands at the time, but still there nonetheless. Often there was nothing to do other than the proverbial let’s go fuck shit up. And the music was such a part of all that.

So you got a story about something back then that would make you wince now?

Back when we were teenagers in The Cheaters, we would go to pretty desperate lengths to create excitement. The Cheaters singer, Scott Dittman, was maybe the funniest person I’ve ever known, and often in our search for something to do, he would drive a car full of us down to the frats at the University Of Washington. We’d go crash frat parties, rarely did we fit in unnoticed. You’d grab some keg cups and try to hang out, usually immediately, “Would you please leave.” And that didn’t often sit well with Scott. If we were going to “please leave” then we would not leave without exacting some sort of a toll. I guess we could run pretty fast, or we would’ve got our asses kicked pretty well back then. Somehow a few weeks later we’d go back to the same frat house that had a bookcase upended or a row of bikes knocked over, and lo and behold, the same thing would happen again. Of course we were never hired to play any frat parties.

Scott also loved to fight. He took boxing lessons and was always trying to teach us how to fight too. You knew when the gloves came out it was time to find something else to do. “Come on, you just gotta keep your guard up.” (smash smash smash) “You said you weren’t gonna hit us in the face.” Yeah right.

The Cheaters and The Accident (another erstwhile punk outfit) set up a show at a non-punk bar, somewhere down by Olympia. This would’ve been 1979 maybe. There were no roadmaps for like-minded or “friendly” places to play, outside of the major cities. But we were trying to do something, anything, and our double bill got the booking. This bar had a dance floor that also was used for bar fighting. There must have been some sort of organization to the fights, but it was sanctioned bar fighting. No-one was on the dance floor or anywhere near it when we started, so Scott tried to solicit a fight or two during our set. This was unfriendly territory, we were all, “Stop this nonsense!” But once you told Scott not to do something, well he was going to double down of course. Fortunately no one took him up on his offers, and we got out unscathed, but the bar owner took me into his office at the end of the night and gave me a rundown on what we needed to do to become successful in the music business, and the first thing was to get rid of that singer.

1978

First Fastbacks show, February, 1980 – any memories of it?

Oh, totally! The first Fastbacks show, it was at a rec center in a quiet neighborhood, it was three bands: The Vains, Psychopop, and The Fastbacks. We were all friends, and it was all three bands’ first shows. Very ramshackle, but we cobbled together a sound system, someone had a few lights, everyone brought what they had, and the show went on. A little rough around the edges, but the power didn’t go out, no cops were called, nothing was ruined – an early triumph for sure.

Was the power pop zeitgeist of that time a thing for Fastbacks? Did you feel a part of it?

No! For sure the New Wave was hitting strong at that point, but we were certainly not embraced by the new wavers at all. I suppose for that first year, we were pretty terrible, but we had some friends and people who wanted to give us a chance. Getting Duff (McKagan – yes, that one from Guns ‘N Roses) to play drums was the first step into making the band more listenable, but we were still a long ways off of what the general public would consider valuable music. We got kicked off of a show after our first set (of two). “That’s okay, you guys don’t have to play another set.” And I was all, “What do you mean we don’t have to?!” Oh, I get it.

Then when the hardcore bands cropped up, we were pals with some of them, but we weren’t furious enough for them really. I recall some sort of fury at a DOA/The Fartz/Fastbacks show. It required some foresight, which many didn’t possess, to support any kind of music that wasn’t 100% punk. Conversely, the proper power pop bands, well, we were a little too power and not enough pop, I reckon. We wanted to be that, but it’d take a bit still to hone those chops.

Had Duff McKagen played in any band before that?

Duff was the bass player in The Vains, who played that Laurelhurst Rec Center show. That was his first show. He must’ve been 15, barely 16?

Did he exhibit behaviors that would later align with Guns ‘N Roses’ infamous lifestyle?

We were still pretty reeled-in at that point, no one really even got plastered, no one started doing drugs yet. Might’ve been some Budweisers around, but nothing stronger yet.

Guns 'N Roses 2nd show, 1985

Got any Vains stories, recollections of a show, or the general scene from whence they came/played? Was there a good raw, original punk scene in Seattle in late '70s? I'm aware of Soldier and some other bands, but I wanna get it from the horse’s mouth.

The Vains only played three, maybe four shows total. In the late ’70s into early ’80s it was pretty hard to keep something going if you were any sort of impatient. Most bands never got the chance to play enough to iron out any difficulties, or taste any sort of real success. Lots of arguing over what direction to take, stick to your punk rock guns, and play to a rental hall of your friends; or try to get “jobs” in the bars, which would mean being stricken with the “cover band” tag, which was NOT punk.

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1978

The Enemy worked the hardest, yet still couldn’t crack the code in 1979. The Telepaths, The Blackouts, The Lewd – everyone broke up, or moved away and then broke up. The Fartz made a pretty good go of it, but even they sorta morphed into Ten Minute Warning, and then morphed into an art band… The Silly Killers stayed pretty punk. The Living ripped it up for their short lifespan. But they were all in that 1982 dilemma, you can almost see a line in the sand, drawn in the summer of 1982. Not a lot of bands made it across that line that summer.

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The Enemy live, 1980

If I remember it was some sort of divine intervention that The Fastbacks reconvened in 1983 to fire it up again, it was nearly the end of the line. But it was also clearly a new beginning, a new lease on life, a new crop of kids started bands in those Metropolis years; the Metropolis was a new all-ages venue that I would consider the petri dish of the next bundle of bands.

As the ‘80s took hold and punk rock hall shows were sort of the only stage for many of our bands, after a couple years of not getting to any sort of next level, it was clear that there needed to be a re-grouping of some sort. We’d see our friends’ bands get actual paying gigs in bars – if they were non-punk sounding. Of course many of the punk bands went to the dark side of ’80s metal. Everyone was looking to do something that could “go somewhere.”

Somewhere right in that 1982 corridor, drugs started flourishing, stupidity set in. Duff came with us Fastbacks as a “roadie” in 1984 down to L.A., and when we came back I reckon he moved to L.A. to escape that whole rigamarole. No one was getting anywhere here anyway. A bold move at that time, at the advanced age of 20!

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1987

Word is Fastbacks have had between 12 and 20 drummers. Short of naming every single drummer, are there a few you’d like to point to as having had a particularly interesting stint; or who went on to other bands?

Gosh, all the Fastbacks drummers had something great about them. There were a few who only did one show. I publicly apologize to those who didn’t last. Those were strange times. I don’t think there are any unsolved mysteries in the Fastbacks drummer world, Dan Peters, who recorded a couple songs with us but no shows, Tad Hutchison, and Tom Hendrikson, who each did one show…. Some convoluted moments for sure, and all killer drummers!

Do you think if you would have remained drummer for Fastbacks that you would have still gotten into production?

Yeah, I think the fascination with recording was parallel to the live playing side of things, it was always there in my constitution. Wanting to learn, wanting to figure out how to make records that captured how killer bands sounded. It was such a tall order back then. Seemed like the old guard [engineers] didn’t “get it,” or were prohibitively expensive; and so many of the others didn’t sound kickass like we wanted. Of course this comes from the actual band, first and foremost; that is learned the hard way! But if the band blazes at their show, it seemed that their records should sound blazing too, but that wasn’t often the case.

1988

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1989

From what I remember, the Fastbacks rep was that of the favorite local band of all the Seattle bands, and hence got on as openers for bands who would soon get huge during that whole grunge thing…

Pretty hard to say from the inside view. We had the unfortunate hurdle of being broken up from late-1988 till mid-1990. A lot of opportunity probably squandered during those times. But, unlike anyone else I can think of, we did get a second chance via Sub Pop, and another decade of rock. I know we were quite lucky in that department. We never did gigs large or small with Nirvana, Soundgarden, sort of the class of ’89. We did share a slightly miserable practice space with Green River and later Mother Love Bone. Always pals with those cats, so we did do opening stints with Pearl Jam in 1996, all around the world.

What was miserableness about it?

Oh man, that place… It was in a basement in Pioneer Square, the old, original downtown Seattle. The Great Seattle Fire devastated downtown in like 1889, and they rebuilt the city on top of the old city, one floor higher. So our basement was on the level with the old, original city; some rooting around could be done. There was no bathroom or running water down there, so you had to go to the bar a block away to use the facilities, but often you just couldn’t be bothered. In the space next to ours, it was a smashed up, decrepit old room that we moved all the garbage from our side into. No lighting of any sort, so it was all flashlights if you had them, and filling up bottles of pee and putting them where ever we could find room.

But of course we raged supreme down there, some epic parties, bands playing, and whatnot; of course no water or facilities, but grand times in the ’80s. Somehow, I ended up being in charge of paying rent, not the best job for me to take on. It meant tracking down Andrew Wood once a month and trying to get him to pay his share of their rent. First it was Malfunkshun, and Green River was there too. We might’ve blown up before Mother Love Bone started? I think I remember Green River blowing up too, after their California trek; it would’ve been not too long after that that The Fastbacks unceremoniously imploded. But for a while it was definitely a rager.

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Nifty, random link I stumbled on with some cool early Fastbacks fliers, stories, and live stuff.

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1992

While you didn't play with the "biggies" of the scene as much as I thought, got any early Nirvana or Soundgarden tale of any sort you'd like to share?

Our fabled practice basement was just a couple blocks from The Central, a venue that was sort of home base for a lot of stuff. The Vogue as well, it was on the north end of downtown, we were on the south end. Many people had keys to the place, so it was not surprising to duck in between sets at The Central, to have cheap beers or whatnot. I first saw Soundgarden at The Central, and they were certainly mind-blowing. Would’ve been ’87? Quickly became a favorite Seattle band, and when their first 7” came out, my roommates hated me. I had a tendency to play those 45’s over and over and over again. But they played The Central a lot, and just got better and better, heavier and heavier. I remember the first time they played “Beyond The Wheel”, it was at the Vogue. I was standing next to Mark Arm and we looked at each other and just said FUUUUUUUUUHHHHHHHHH…

The first Nirvana show I saw was also at the Vogue, it was maybe not the greatest Nirvana show, but man I thought that singer was amazing. Shortly after, Jon Poneman (Sub Pop co-founder) was at the bar there and said, “If you buy me a coffee now, I’ll give you a 45 tomorrow that will change your life.” An easy proposition. Sub Pop HQ was half a block away, he gave me a “Love Buzz” 45, and once again, the roommates had a reason to hate. I must’ve played that record 100 times in a row. Might’ve taken them a bit to find their pummeling style, but man they sure did. Then after Bleach had been out a while, all the rumors of major label this and major label that… So exciting and weird.

Who is a favorite Seattle “grunge era” band you really dug and maybe didn’t get the recognition you think it deserved? Mine are the Derelicts and Zipgun.

Of course! Pure Joy, Flop, H-Hour, the Meices – wait they were actually from SF… Huge Spacebird, Once For Kicks…. Have you got an hour or so?!

I know you are no doubt tired of this question, but do you have a late ‘80s/early ‘90s story or show that happened where you thought, “Damn, this Seattle scene thing is getting some real attention? This is fucking weird.”

After the Fastbacks blew up in 1988, I started playing with the Young Fresh Fellows, and we were off and running pretty hard right away. Certainly a parallel path from the Seattle Grunge Explosion, but a decent path it was! I was pals with Jon and Bruce (Pavitt) at Sub Pop when they started, so I’d go hang out at their early HQ/distributor place downtown. It was amazing to see some of these bands blow up when they did.

Young Fresh Fellows, 1989; Kurt Bloch far right

I suppose the thing that sealed it for me was listening to the advance cassette of Nevermind on a Young Fresh Fellows trip. Scott McCaughey had been assigned to review it for local music rag, The Rocket, and I nabbed it from him on a trip out East. It totally blew my doors wide open. Already having been a superfan since that “Love Buzz” 45, and seeing a couple of the shows they did here before going out to record that album, then hearing it for the first time on headphones; then as our tour progressed, seeing the record just going ballistic at every record store, it was just crazy. It never stopped getting bigger and bigger. This is so fucking weird!

Strange feeling of seeing a local band you saw shlubbing around town or peeing next to them at a dive, to hearing them play in a grocery store in Nevada, or whatever....

Soundgarden was the first one I remember blowing up. They went from Sub Pop to SST to A&M – they sorta seemed to have their shit together pretty well. Alice In Chains were kinda off our radar, they were only on the Rock radio stations; it wasn’t until their second album that I noticed that they actually were killer. But Nirvana, they were crazy cool from the get-go, not in the FM Rock station sort of way, but the punk underground sort of way. Plus I didn’t really know them at the beginning, so there was way more mystery about them. A couple legendary Seattle club shows before they went off to start Nevermind; the OK Hotel first playing of “Smells Like Teen Spirit,” we were just transfixed – What the fuck is this?! Then the Off Ramp show, they went on really late, and got cut off right before 2am. Somehow the club picked up the empties and let the band play on into the night, and what a show it was. Then… nothing.

Didn’t really hear anything from Nirvana ‘til the advance cassette of Nevermind went out, and of course thinking, if I like this so much, it’s probably never gonna go anywhere. Wrong. It was like a slow ball of fire, radio then record stores, like every record store playing it, every magazine… It would’ve made you hate a lesser band, but it really was great so there was a sense of pride attached to it all. Finally something we loved is big. But then how big? There seemed to be no end to it. It was everywhere. And so weird to think that kids dug something that was blazing and amazing.

Were you defacto producer of Fastbacks from the get-go of recording?

Oh for sure. Not by strong-arming anyone, but just because there was no money, and no one else could be bothered! Our first 45 was with Neil Hubbard and Jack Weaver, as we were doing a song for a Seattle comp LP, and as per the usual, just recorded some extra songs in our allotted time. The first EP was Peter Barnes, drummer for The Enemy, killer Seattle band and very much an inspiration to all the bands in the late-’70s in Seattle. Then after that, it was trial by fire.

Can you tell me more about The Enemy, and their local import?

The Enemy pretty much initiated the punk “scene” in Seattle. There were a few bands, but they started a club, it was all ages, March, 1978. Otherwise it would’ve been hall shows, but The Bird brought everyone together. Originally only open for a few months, but there were shows there every Friday and Saturday, it really did give us something to do.

My first band, The Cheaters, might not have actually played anywhere if not for them. We could have languished in my parents’ basement forever if not for being stopped by The Enemy members at a Ramones show: “Hey! Are you guys in a band? Would you want to play at our club we’re opening up in a few months?” Of course we said yes, we didn’t tell them that we were just barely a band, we’d never actually played a show, nor would we maybe ever had if not for their offer. We were just teenagers, my brother Al was still in High School. But they took us in and let us play shows. The drummer, Peter Barnes, filled in for a night our real drummer couldn’t play.

Everyone knew each other, when it was time to record what was to be The Fastbacks’ first EP, Peter volunteered to be our producer. He figured out how to get cool, kickass sounds and make things happen. No one had any money or experience so it had to be on a budget, but he made it happen. The record turned out great. “In America” was on the commercial new wave station, we thought we had it made!

I thought I knew what to do, to various degrees of success. Conrad Uno at Egg Studio did much of our first album. He was wise beyond words and also a great teacher. After that LP was finished he was all, “You can do all this, I think, I’ll be back at the end of the night to close up!” Then it seemed like the right avenue. So many producers seemed like they just wanted to add stuff in order to have their presence be felt. I always felt, like – what is the least amount of stuff we can have on here to make it happen? Less stuff, but louder. Certainly not against adding things, but also happy to leave things out as much as possible. Always loved the one-guitar bands that didn’t double everything all the time. Makes you think a little harder about what you’re doing.

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1994

Okay, I will name a band, and you give me the first thing that comes to mind when you think of your production gigs with them:

Presidents of the U.S.A.

We’d do several takes of any given song, as the band was learning them, Chris (Ballew, singer) would play his two-string bass flawlessly every take, and sing a scratch vocal that could’ve been used as the keeper. Never a mistake, never less than killer every time.

Robyn Hitchcock

Also just an amazing music machine. Put him in an iso booth with a mic for vocal and one for acoustic guitar. He’d show the band a new song and go into the booth, sometimes it would just be one take and they’d nail it, with the lead vocal included. Never a lyric sheet in sight. A brain that truly works overtime. Peter Buck playing his 12-string on a song that he had just heard, and plays flawlessly the first time. Great Peter quote: “I like to get things right.” Indeed!

Fastbacks

Ha!! Some of the recording we’ve done astounds me to this day. It’s like any idea we had, we’d just do it. I swear, no one ever said, “Are you sure this is a good idea?” Listening back to the early ’90s recordings, there truly is something about inspiration and enthusiasm that really is inspiring and enthusiastic! Some of that music is pretty weird, even some songs that I wrote, I can’t imagine where they came from. I know we did them and all, but what was the impetus, where did they come from?!

Nashville Pussy

Another tale of just trying not to ruin a band that sounded killer. Amazing to think that they all fit in the tiny live room at Egg for that first album. The sheer volume of air pressure in there was unbelievable. A perfect example of what we’d set out to do, just try to not let the recording process get in the way of the recording. And nominated for a Grammy! I went with them to the Awards show – limo, booze, and afterparties. We were scheming all the horrible things that we’d say when we won the award, who we were gonna thank, who we were gonna blame. Of course there’s no way we’d win, they barely could say the name of the band when reading off the nominees! But what an experience. So many laughs.

Mudhoney

Five Dollar Bob’s Mock Cooter Stew (Reprise, 1993) doesn’t get enough props. I think it’s a great record. I really tried to make each song sound different and killer in its own way. Dan Peters (drummer) is always dishing out the quality.

Young Fresh Fellows

It’s easy to work quickly with a band you’re in. You kind of already know what’s going to happen, you know how to set up since you’ve already seen what works and what doesn’t over the last decade or two. We had intended to record maybe four or five songs for Tiempo De Lujo. Somehow we’d crammed all four of us in the basement here; after the two days we’d recorded twelve band tracks – so an album it was! Toxic Youth as well. We’d gone over to Jim Sangster’s living room to learn a few songs before starting recording the next day, and once we got going, they just kept coming and coming. When inspiration strikes, keep the tape rolling!

Can you describe Conrad Uno's Egg Studios; the kind of size or situation you were dealing with? Was there like a famous recording board there you worked with?

Egg Studio, where I and others honed their chops, was a welcome alternative to the “normal” studios of the time. It was truly a basement studio, the performance room was smaller than an ordinary living room. Many bands’ rehearsal spaces were larger than this. But it really did have a relaxed feel to it, and loud bands could all set up in the room and play live and get a good sound. Mudhoney, Nashville Pussy, Supersnazz, Devil Dogs, Supersuckers, Zeke – it was home base for so many great albums.

Conrad Uno moved into the house in maybe 1987, I reckon we finished Fastbacks …And His Orchestra there; and by early 1988, we began Very Very Powerful Motor, then the Sub Pop 7” and Zücker sessions. It began as an 8-track studio. Conrad brought in the Spectrasonics console that was formerly at Stax/Volt studio – rumored to once be owned by Paul McCartney, under whose purview a varispeed knob was installed. The knob remains, it’s Paul’s Knob. The console is now at Crackle And Pop studio here in Seattle, and is working better than ever.

Before Mudhoney began their third album, Piece of Cake, their second at Egg, they bought a 16-track machine for the studio, and that was the classic setup for so many records there in the ‘90s.

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1996

I personally would love to hear about making the classic Devil Dogs album, Saturday Night Fever (Crypt/Sympathy for the Record Industry, 1994). Whose idea was it to make it kind of like a party, with friends and fans whopping it up in the studio between songs?

It was their idea from the beginning to make it a party album, “You have been invited… to a party!” Another band that didn’t need any fancy fussing about, they already sounded like a house on fire. Just tried to record them and not get in the way, make sure that the playback sounded like it did in the room with them.

Definitely the last night of the session, they invited all their Seattle friends over for a party, and we played the songs from the album through twice, if I remember, and just had a mic in the room while they were going. All the bottles clinking and all the blabbering was totally what happened. There was so little time to get everything done while we were there. They had booked two gigs on recording days – one out of town in Bellingham! Basically it was like wrangling the Three Stooges to record and mix a full album and an EP in like five days. Let’s just say that the morning hours were not particularly productive. But fortunately, when they were on, they were unstoppable. And so fuckin’ funny! What a fucking great record!

Oh yeah, definitely the most hilarious band to tour with too! We did a month with them once in Europe, traveling in the same packed little van. And even the bad hungover mornings in the van drives would lead to so much cracking up. Singer Andy G. sometimes stood up and imitated Tom Jones live. Anyway, can you recall who all was in the “crowd” on that record?

Honestly, I don’t! The studio was in a neighborhood, so all sessions had to be finished by 10pm. I loved the idea of recording a loud listening party and then mixing that in with the album, but it was so precarious to cram a bunch of drunks in the tiny studio and try to not let any gear get ruined, while still egging on loud misbehavior. Then getting all the cats out of there by 10 and not annoying Conrad or his neighbors in the process.

You must have some fun Andy G. stories too.

All three of those guys had their moments! Andy, Steve, Mighty Joe. Someone should’ve given them their own TV series. It might not have lasted very long, but what a show it would’ve been. I’ve never seen a group rile each other up the way they did. Should’ve had a room mic going constantly while they tried to make a group decision. There was way more work than we had time for. Somehow we got it all done, but just barely.

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Crypt Records, 1993

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And here’s where I decided to check in with Devil Dogs drummer, Mighty Joe Vincent, to get some more details on their Bloch party: "So, in the friends crowd [on the Saturday Night Fever album] was Eddie and Dan Bolton from the Supersuckers, James Burdyshaw and the rest of the Sinister Six, and a bunch of really cool women whose names have escaped my memory banks.

We def recorded on the Stax board. I remember because we had hopes that there was some soul residue left in the cables that might coat our tracks.

We totally loved Kurt. What’s not to love? I do remember that it was a Crypt budget recording so we had to make every minute count, so we were mixing until we were all so tired we were delirious. I’m pretty sure we went ‘til 2a.m. or something like that, but that was mixing. We did that in the middle of a tour, so we did about two weeks of gigs from NYC across this great nation of ours as well as that other great nation to our north, then out to Seattle. While we were doing it , we had a gig up in Bellingham, so we took a day off to drive up there.

I remember Scott Mccaughy was working there at Egg. I was talking to him one day and he told me his days of playing out on the road were over as his wife just had a kid and he had to be a good dad and provide a steady paycheck. I really felt bad for him. And then of course, a short time after that, Pete Buck asked him to come on the road with R.E.M. and said he would pay him a million dollars. Like an actual million dollars. That always made me happy to hear."

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And now, back to Kurt Bloch!

Who were bands you liked to tour with? And/or, a classic Fastbacks tour story?

We had some great west coast tours with DOA in the early-to-mid ’80s, they were definitely an early inspiration to go head-on and charge through best you can. They certainly blazed a trail for the rest of us to follow, doing everything themselves, like Black Flag did from Southern California. The ’80s were a rocky road for the Fastbacks. We played a lot of shows in Vancouver, BC, as well as Seattle, but it was a lot of problems and fighting, ha, and it wasn’t until the ’90s that we actually went out for any length of time – certainly getting into occasional serious trouble with The Meices, Motocaster, Gaunt, and even the New Bomb Turks!

Pearl Jam asked you to do some stadium shows in 1995, arguably the peak grunge year. How did you relate to the whole fame/stadium situation surrounding those shows?

It was January ’95, Pearl Jam asked us to play a radio show from their rehearsal space. I kinda didn’t know what they were talking about, and maybe sort of blew it off. I was trying to finish a Sicko record that night, couldn’t be bothered. I did like their Vitalogy record, “Not For You,” “Spin The Black Circle.” The rest of the Fastbacks were all, “C’mon, we’re doing this!” And I grudgingly told Sicko I was going to have to leave early. I didn’t even bring a guitar, I knew that Stone had a cool ‘50s Gold Top, maybe I could use that.

Then of course we get there and it’s really fun, just a big party scene, tons of buddies and band cats. We played three songs on the Pearl Jam gear setup, maybe Kim talked on the radio, drank some beers, great time! That was cool enough, but then they asked us to open a few shows at the end of the year, Salt Lake City and San Jose I think, and we’re all like, “Hell yeah!” And everything went well, then, “Would you want to go do a U.S. tour, oh and maybe a Europe tour following that…?” And we were all, “Hellz yeah!” And that all went great, clearly we would be the next big thing, the world is gonna love us, nothing holding us back now! We had a great record out, New Mansions In Sound (Sub Pop, 1996). Man, that was it – lots and lots of fun, great shows. We invented an auxiliary opening band for some of the shows, The What. We played Who tunes with Eddie Vedder incognito with a wrestling mask. We drag Mike McCready out for jams, Stone Gossard to sing one of his PJ songs, Eddie did “Leaving Here” with us a couple times, just great rock times in the giant venues. Somehow it didn’t lead to us being the Next Big Thing, but it was fun to pretend for a few months.

1994

Any good backstage shenanigans stories?

There weren’t a whole lot of super shenanigans. They had an espresso machine onstage every night, so we’d all slug down coffees, blast through our tunes, and then get drunk and watch Pearl Jam. Sometimes we would annoy their wonderful crew by being loud and boisterous aside of the stage, spilling bottles of wine or whatnot, but not much more than that. Everyone got along really well, and it was well-protected against after show bullies or negativity. We’d just keep on our course, often ‘til the huge sports arena closed down and they’d kick us out after everything had been loaded out – and we’d still be back there cranking tunes and running around.

It was totally like an arena-sized version of a living room party most every night. Their crew moved all the gear, we barely had to do anything except play every night.

I know you knew some of their members from earlier in the scene, but did you know Eddie Vedder before he got asked to join Pearl Jam?

I might not have met Eddie until the live radio show we did? He came up from San Diego. Didn’t know him before then at all, but we were fast friends. We would spend hours talking about the Who and riding around on the catering carts and smashing into the walls of the arenas. Come to think of it, we were probably very annoying. But no one, like, smashed up their hotel rooms or anything. It was probably comparatively tame.

Might sound weird, but while playing in the Seattle scene -- which is generally described as kind of serious, or dark, or junkies, or you know, “grungy” – did you and the Fastbacks feel kind of out-of-place; or are those kind of definitions of grunge and that town/time not correct?

The Seattle “thing” certainly was a dark, serious sound. That isn’t to say that every musician was dark and serious, but that darkness prevailed. To say The Fastbacks felt a little out of place at that point would be correct; but I always thought we were here first. It’s not like we didn’t dig lots of the bands, but it also wasn’t like we would try to take them on at their own game. It just wouldn’t’ve happened. We did do a version of “Swallow My Pride” – Green River’s, not The Ramones – on Sub Pop 200 [compilation], after a Soundgarden version too; but it ended up being menacing only in a Blue Öyster Cult sort of way, rather than ala either previous version. Slow and heavy just wasn’t in our DNA.

Columbus, OH, 1993 (Courtesy of Bela Koe-Krompecher)

I remember when Fastbacks stayed with New Bomb Turks while on tour in 1993, you guys, well I think specifically Lulu, made an amazing Thai meal for us. Did you always cook for bands you crashed with, or just for us ‘cuz we’re so awesome and nice?

Ha. I think the wonderful cooking was a bit of a rarity. We weren’t much of a crash on people’s floor kind of band by the ’90s, but sometimes it was great to have a day off and some good ideas! Remember that Metallica VHS box set had just come out, and we watched it ‘til the end because Lulu and I both worked on the film crew for the shows they filmed in Seattle, and we wanted to see if we, several years after the actual shows, got any credits at the end… and sure enough we did. Reason to celebrate!

Columbus seemed to love you. What were some other fave towns you played?

Always a great time in Columbus. Not necessarily Cleveland though. We weren’t the hard-touring road warriors that a lot of the other (more successful) bands were. It was whatever city we had friends in that were the best. Vancouver BC, San Francisco, L.A., NYC, maybe Albany, Columbus, Istanbul…

Contract and ticket for 1993 Columbus, OH show. (Courtesy of Bela Koe-Krompecher)

Highly technical and professional stage diagram implorations, Columbus, OH, 1993 show (Courtesy of Bela Koe-Krompecher)

I could be wrong, but you didn’t go over to Europe a lot, did you? Were you able to procure any production work from Euro bands you met whilst on tour there?

Oddly, not a lot of Euro tours… Seems like we should’ve done more, but there was always something. Young Fresh Fellows did some great trips, especially in Spain. Fastbacks Spanish tour was a bit of a dog’s breakfast. Not because of the people in Spain, no sir. We certainly lit it up in Japan once, though!

I did a couple albums for Les Thugs, the French band. One of them in Seattle and one in Angers. May have been bookended with some music travel. It’s amazing to look back at the old calendars and see that between tours with the Fastbacks and Young Fresh Fellows, recording with those two bands and recording other bands. Man, there were times when there was nary a day off, those ‘90s months were packed! Gotta consider myself pretty lucky. And so many killer records I got to be part of.

As a producer, do you feel you are mainly bringing an “ear” to finding the sounds the band wants, or do you try to gently impose a certain style and sensibility over the whole production?

Always try to keep the kickass factor high. I would never try to impose anything other than to try to keep everyone happy so they could do their best work, and not do the same bit over and over and over. Work hard and play hard, but not to overanalyze every little thing. Not under-analyze either, but if it’s killer, it doesn’t matter if everything “lines up” perfectly, or if the choruses speed up a little bit. Try to capture what is great about a band live in concert, and not dilute that if you can help it. Don’t add a bunch of crap just to put your mark on a project.

It's interesting how you professed a love for prog, but you had an innate sense of not always overdubbing too much – note your comment about loving bands that only had one guitar, etc.

The true exciting prog bands started coming out around 1968 and ’69, Yes, Genesis, King Crimson, Van Der Graaf Generator; Pink Floyd and Moody Blues had already been around but maybe weren’t quite included. Recording technique at the time was still fairly straightforward for the most part, there was of course room for overdubbing on an eight-track machine, but most of the first-wave prog bands’ recordings were not overloaded with overdubs. The magic was what they did with their four or five musicians, the arrangements you hear on the record were the same instrumentation as they played live. Some of the songs would have been concocted in a studio, but it wasn’t until later that walls of overdubs became commonplace.

That’s where the greatness of the original bands lies – cool vocal arranging and melding several songs’ worth of ideas into one track. Not a lot of room for squirminess either, it wasn’t so easy punching in on a giant eight-track tape machine in 1968. You made one mistake on that verse? You do the whole thing again!

Okay, gotta ask, with as much exposition as you’d like – what was your favorite recording session(s); and worst recording session(s)?

Pretty much always subverted the disasters. A time or two I told a band, after seeing a live show, that they weren’t quite ready to record yet; play a few more shows and practice a lot, record your practices and actually listen to them constructively. Studio time is expensive, practice time is (or at least was) cheap. You don’t have to have every bit of every song nailed down exactly, but do have most everything pretty well figured out, and be ready for criticism during the recording. If the rhythm isn’t working, be prepared to fine-tune your part so it is; if your harmony vocal is a half-step off, go ahead and adjust!

Some of the great sessions are those where I feel that I learned things, a new piece of gear, a new way of looking at things. Overwhelming Colorfast, Supersuckers, Les Thugs in France, The Meices in Florida… Or the records that just slammed out of nowhere. Devil Dogs, Flop, Supersnazz, Nashville Pussy. So many first albums by bands where they have been playing the songs at shows for a year or two, the tempos are up, the blood is pumping, get rid of the headphones and make it like you’re playing a gig. Play the song three times without stopping. Play three different songs in a row without stopping.

1999 (Courtesy of your's truly)

You’re still actively producing. What have you worked on recently you’d like to highlight? And what’s coming up?

There’s always some great Seattle band records going on – Bürien, 38 Coffin, Once For Kicks, Insect Man, The Drolls, Zack Static. These days, some records take a while to finish, I suppose it’s the nature of the business now. Trying now to clean the slate and get these out the door before starting new ones!

And there’s maybe a new Fastbacks coming, no?

There was no plan of any sort. We were having lunch as we sometimes do, and started talking about a couple songs it would be fun to learn and maybe record. Our pal Joe “Meice” Reineke had recently finished an ambitious and fantastic recording building in his back yard; wouldn’t it be fun to check that out….? Well let’s call him and see what his schedule is. Oh! he’s got a day open, whaddayasay, let’s take it. Well there’s a few other songs we could learn, let’s make it two days… I guess we’d better practice… What if we did enough songs for an album? Maybe we did! Got some band tracks, everyone played their butts off! Now we gotta make more magic. No target completion date nor avenue to release, but everyone is excited to finish it!

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Post Script: This article sprung from an editor at a national mag asking if I wanted to do a story on Kurt Bloch, which of course I said yes to cuz Kurt's a great guy and I've been a Fastbacks fan for a goodly spell. But some months passed and plans changed, and so here it is! Also, I would've put more videos in this piece because the Fastbacks have a ton of great songs, but I guess I just learned there is a 10-video limit for a tumblr post. Who knew?

All images courtesy of Kurt Bloch, except where noted.

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