#plotting vs pantsing

[tlbodine]

Stuck? Try junebugging.

I don't know who needs to hear this, but we're 5 days into nanowrimo so maybe this will be helpful.

Do you want the safety and surety of knowing what happens next in your story but can't stick to an outline? Does knowing in advance what will happen suck the joy out of discovery writing? Do you try to wing it through plots but get tangled in plot holes or have a story that runs out of steam because you can't figure out what went wrong? Are you at your most creative when you have a little bit of guidance? Do you tend to under-write? Do you get ideas in your head for random scenes and snippets that drop from the sky without context?

If any of these apply to you, junebugging a draft might be for you!

What Is Junebugging?

Since you're on Tumblr, you might already be familiar with the concept of junebugging as it relates to cleaning. If not -- I think the idea was first introduced to me by @jumpingjacktrash.

The basic idea is that you tackle cleaning by way of controlled chaos. You pick a specific area you want to focus on, like your kitchen sink, and then wander off to deal with other things as they occur to you, but always returning back to that area. You end up cleaning a little bit at a time in an order that may not make sense to an outsider but which keeps you from getting overwhelmed and discouraged.

How Does Junebugging Work in Writing?

OK, so that's great, but how does this work with writing? Well. In my case, the general idea is to jump between writing linearly, outlining, and writing out of order. It usually looks something like:

Start free-writing a scene, feeling my way through it and enjoying the discovery process.

Thinking, ok, now I have this scene, did anything need to happen to lead up to it? Do I need to go back and add some foreshadowing? Does this scene set anything up that needs to be paid off? And then jump forward/back to make those adjustments.

I'll usually have a bunch of disconnected ideas of ideas that have popped into my head, so I'll write those down in a list somewhere and then try to figure out what goes in between them and what order it goes in.

I'll write what I call "micro-scenes" which is where I'll just sketch out a few essential elements of what's going on without worrying too much about details, description, etc. -- just he did this, she said that, the setting was this, real bare-bones script. Then I can come back through and flesh out each of those microscenes into an actual scene later.

Got a story that has a complex structure? No problem. Write through each storyline one at a time and then chop them up and weave them together afterward. Write all the B plot scenes first then come back through to do A plot and C plot. Move the pieces around like legos. No one ever has to know.

This method works for me because I can't "decide" story elements in advance. I have never been able to just sit down and "figure out" what happens in a story beyond a couple steps ahead -- I have to discovery-write my way forward. But at the same time, that gets really daunting. So I zoom forward with micro-scenes, roughing out the beats in the most bare-bones way possible, then when I run out of clear vision for what happens next I backtrack, flesh out those scenes, build in connective tissue, etc. and by then I will probably find more inspiration to jump forward.

It's basically folding drafting, outlining, and revising all together into a single phase of writing, which is chaotic and goes against everything people teach you, but if it works? then it fuckin works.

Anyway, sorry for the jumbled-up post, I'm dashing this off quickly while I heat up a pizza and I'm about to dive back into my WIP -- but I hope this was a little helpful. If nothing else, take this as my blanket permission that it's 100% OK to jump around, write out of order, write messy, outline sometimes, pants sometimes, and do whatever else it takes just to get through the story. You've got this. Good luck.

[thesorcerersapprentice]

Analyze the structure of your favourite books in the genre you want to write in. Focus on structural commonalities.

Combine your (very personal) structural findings with your general knowledge of outlines to create a table with headings for all the plot points you feel are absolutely necessary to keep your attention as a reader (these are the same things that will keep your attention on the story as a writer with a boredom-adverse brain).

Fill out this table for your story. This will take several attempts. You will discover that your idea was less fleshed out and/or entertaining than you'd initially thought. That's ok! It's better to find out now than later when you're knee-deep in writer's block. Come up with additional information/characters/worldbuilding elements/plot points to make up for it.

Start writing! Along the way, you'll discover new characters/worldbuilding elements/plot points developing organically from the writing process. Incorporate these into an updated version of the outline for ease of reference.

Trust the process, and have fun! ✨

how to outline a story:

write a bullet point list of everything that happens

realize it doesn’t make sense

cry

start writing anyway

[coffeeandcalligraphy]

Hold on I think I cracked the code behind why so many people don’t understand what pantsing/discovery writing is!! Intention!! Though pantsing entails “writing without an outline” (so much nuance there) it doesn’t mean you don’t have a specific intention behind a work! Intention can evolve but it’s like the guiding force behind a work & something I’m aware of while I work, even in the most subconscious of ways… intention!!!

[jsmawdsley]

On today's blog, S has an update on her current side project and the differences between plotting and pantsing.

[razziecat]

Lois McMaster Bujold, who has won Hugo and Nebula awards for her sci-fi/fantasy work, once said, "The world comes into being as the story passes through it."

Some writers plot extensively, some write more organically, figuring it out as they write (like me!). Either way is valid! You can always go back and fix any inconsistencies.

I've been writing fanfic for way too long. Now, whenever I write bits for my original story, I forget that this is a world I personally created, no one can read my mind so I need to actually take some time to describe things in a little more detail. With fanfic, I work under the assumption that people reading it have at least some basic knowledge of the world and characters so its easy to get lazy with descriptions. Like if I write a scene set inside the Shinra building, I can just say 'Presidents office' or something and most readers will immediately know what it looks like. But I forget that I can't do that in my original work, lol. Since there's castles in my original work, I can't just say 'the throne room', I need to actually describe some details to give a glimpse into what I'm seeing inside my head. Honestly though, I see all this writing advice and stuff floating around the internet and then feel very guilty about my own writing. I don't plan anything, usually. I just sort of...write. I have a vague idea of the start and ending, but I don't write anything down or plan anything more than that. The world just sort of builds itself. I've never felt like I have any control over the situation, shit just sort of happens lol. If I make any attempts to fomally plan anything I write, it goes horribly wrong. Its the number one way to absolutely kill my creativity. At most I like to design maps of my world, so I know what things look like, where the characters are travelling etc. But all the details just naturally happen as I go. I don't know if this is 'wrong', its just the way I do things. So yeah, I'm sorry, I have 0 control over my own writing and characters, they do their own thing. I'm just writing it down lol.

[rightwriter]

A nice motivating video by these two authors, Katytastic and Alexa Donne to get you in the writing headspace :)

[writingtips-resources]

Plotting vs. Pantsing: I Found My Writing Style

Every writer, at some point, faces The Great Question.

“Should I make my main character suffer more?”

(the answer is always yes, by the way).

I’m talking about: Are you a Plotter or a Pantser? And let me tell you—I’ve been on both sides of this chaotic, caffeine-soaked battlefield. "I found my style, but it wasn’t without trial, error, and a couple of existential crises along the way."

Let me explain to you- step by step.

I Started with Plotting

When I first started writing, I thought plotting was The Way. I had color-coded spreadsheets, a detailed scene-by-scene breakdown, and enough sticky notes to wallpaper a small room- thinking and writing as a Plotter.................

Chapter 7: Sarah finds the amulet.

Chapter 8: A mysterious storm begins.

Chapter 9: Emotional confrontation with the villain.

“Wait, why is Sarah suddenly flirting with the villain?

THAT WAS NOT IN THE PLAN.”

But, In simple words, Plotting gave me structure, clarity, and a false sense of control (spoiler: the characters always win).

I Shifted to Pantsing: My Wild West Era

At one point, I threw my outline out the window (metaphorically… mostly) and declared, “Let chaos reign!”

Suddenly, I was free.

No outlines, no bullet points—just me, my keyboard, and a vague idea of where things might end up- thinking and writing as a Pantser:

Sarah picked up the amulet. Cool. Now what?

Maybe it’s cursed. Maybe it sings Broadway show tunes. Let’s find out!”

“Oh no. I’m 40,000 words in, and I have no idea what happens next.”

Pantsing felt like an adventure. I was uncovering the story as I went along, and sometimes I wrote scenes so unexpected, I had to sit back and say, “Did I just… did I just make that up? Whoa.”

Then I Choose "The Hybrid Approach"

I realized I’m neither a hardcore Plotter nor a full-on Pantser. I’m somewhere in between—a Plantser if you will.

Now, I start with a loose outline:

“Sarah finds an amulet. The villain wants it. Big showdown at the end.”

But I leave the middle parts open for discovery.

If Sarah decides she wants to flirt with the villain in Chapter 9… well, who am I to stop her?

Now, the real magic happened and I was too satisfied!

Key plot points? Mapped out.

Character arcs? Clear.

Everything else? Chaos, baby.

So, What’s Your Style?

Finding your writing style isn’t about picking a side and sticking to it forever. It’s about experimenting, adjusting, and figuring out what feels right for you.

If outlines make your soul happy—Plot away.

If you thrive on chaos—Embrace the Pantsing life.

If you’re like me and want both structure and spontaneity—Welcome to the Hybrid Club.

At the end of the day, the goal isn’t to write like someone else—it’s to find your rhythm, your style, and tell your story.

So tell me, friend: Are you a Plotter, a Pantser, or somewhere in between?

Drop your chaotic (or highly organized) thoughts below—I promise we’re all friends here.

[writingquestionsanswered]

I've seen across the web multiples tips for outlining/plotting when you have ADHD, however, I feel like I kinda have the opposite problem: I'm autistic and I always feel a big need of minimum surprises, doing things methodically and planning ahead of time, but my stories don't quite flow and I may need to work a non-forced pantser mindset, so if you gave me any advice on how to embrace a less outlined writing, I'd be eternally grateful.

Middle Ground Between Planning and Pantsing

It sounds like you need a middle ground between planning and pantsing, but it may take some trial and error to find one that works for you. Here are some possibilities, though:

1 - Do a Beginning to End Summary - Most of the time when people talk about outlining a story, this is what they're talking about. Just doing an in-depth beginning to end summary. However, you can adjust the depth of your summary to suit your needs, which makes it a great tool for when you need something with just the right balance of planning and spontaneity to fit your unique set of needs. Try free writing a summary of the story as though you were explaining it to someone else. Talk about as much of what's going to happen as you know or can flesh out as you go. Just having this in hand when you write can be helpful. If you find you need more structure, you can go into more detail. If you find you need less, you can pull back.

2 - Use a Story Structure Template - I've found that 90% of the time when writers struggle with planning vs pantsing and/or outlining, it's because they don't have a good understanding of how stories work and how they're generally structured. How stories work and how they're structured does depend on the type of story you're writing, but outside of experimental or deeply literary stories, most stories do have some sort of structure. You can learn more about plot and story structure, along with suggestions for story structure templates, in my Plot & Story Structure master list of posts.

3 - Do a Scene List - I'm mostly a planner, but I have to be careful not to let myself get bogged down with too much planning and too many details. So, for me, the best middle ground between planning and pantsing has been scene lists. I love scene lists because they're such a straightforward road map to your story, while at the same time having the depth flexibility of a beginning to end summary. You can put in as much or as little detail as you want. A scene list can be a just a list of scene titles that just let you know what's going on in the scene, like: Scene 1 - Hunting with Gale. Scene 2 - The Reaping. Or, you can do a brief or in-depth summary of what happens in each scene. Or you can even do what I do, which is a fairly extensive data table containing things like when and where the scene takes place, who's in it, plot point, summary, etc.

4 - Do Chapter Summaries - If you prefer not to break your story down into scenes, you can do chapter summaries instead. Like a scene list, this can be as light or in-depth as a scene list, from a list of chapter titles or working titles that suggest what happens, to in-depth summaries of what happens in each chapter.

5 - Do a Timeline - Timelines are kind of like scene lists in that they break your story down into important events/moments, and you can choose how deep to go. There are a also a lot of different formats you can use for a timeline, but you might want to start out by doing an old-fashioned line drawn on paper, then mark in the most important events. From there, you can start filling in the next most important events, then the slightly less most important, zooming in as much as you want to.

I hope something here will work for you!

•••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••

I’ve been writing seriously for over 30 years and love to share what I’ve learned. Have a writing question? My inbox is always open!

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[adorewritingartistry]

Plotter vs. Pantser: Finding Your Perfect Path to Storytelling Success

[Large text: Plotter vs. Pantser: Finding Your Perfect Path to Storytelling Success]

Every writer, at some point, faces the age-old question: to plan or not to plan? Are you the meticulous architect, carefully drafting blueprints before laying a single brick? Or are you the free-spirited explorer, charting your course as you journey into the unknown? This internal debate boils down to the age-old rivalry: Plotter vs. Pantser.

Choosing between meticulously planning your story's structure and events in advance (plotting) versus writing without a detailed plan, letting the story unfold organically (pantsing, or writing by the seat of your pants), isn't about one being superior. It's about understanding your creative process and finding the approach that unlocks your best work.

The Allure of the Plotter: Structure and Control

[Medium text: The Allure of the Plotter: Structure and Control]

Plotters thrive on structure. They meticulously map out their storylines, crafting detailed outlines, character profiles, and scene breakdowns. For them, the joy lies in knowing the destination and meticulously planning the journey.

Benefits of Planning:

Reduced Writer's Block: Knowing where you're going significantly reduces the chances of staring blankly at a page, unsure of what to write next.

Stronger Narrative Cohesion: A well-planned story is less likely to suffer from plot holes or inconsistencies. The beginning, middle, and end connect seamlessly.

Efficient Writing: Having a roadmap allows for faster, more focused writing sessions. You can efficiently hit your daily word count goals.

Complex Plot Management: For stories with intricate subplots, multiple characters, and elaborate world-building, planning can be crucial for keeping everything organized.

Meeting Deadlines: If you're working under tight deadlines, a detailed plan provides a framework for staying on track.

Consider plotting if:

You feel overwhelmed by the vastness of a blank page.

You enjoy organizing and structuring information.

You struggle with plot holes or inconsistencies in your writing.

You thrive in a structured environment.

You are working with a complex plot or world-building.

The Spontaneity of the Pantser: Freedom and Discovery

[Medium text: The Spontaneity of the Pantser: Freedom and Discovery]

Pantsers, on the other hand, embrace the unknown. They dive into their story with a basic idea or character, trusting their intuition to guide them. For them, the magic lies in the discovery, the unexpected twists and turns that emerge as they write.

Benefits of Pantsing:

Increased Creativity and Surprise: Letting the story unfold naturally can lead to unexpected plot twists and character development that you might not have considered while planning.

More Immersive Writing Experience: Pantsers often find the writing process more engaging and exciting, as they are constantly discovering new aspects of their story.

Flexibility and Adaptability: You're not bound by a rigid plan, allowing you to adapt the story based on new ideas or inspirations.

Authenticity: Characters can feel more real and their actions more believable when driven by spontaneous choices within the story.

Overcoming Over-thinking: Sometimes, planning can hinder the creative flow. Pantsing allows you to overcome your inner critic and just write.

Consider pantsing if:

You get bored or stifled by detailed plans.

You find that your best ideas come to you while writing.

You enjoy the thrill of the unknown.

You prefer a more intuitive and organic writing process.

You enjoy the sense of discovery.

The Hybrid Approach: Finding a Balance

[Medium text: The Hybrid Approach: Finding a Balance]

The truth is, many writers find themselves somewhere in between these two extremes. You might be a "plantser" – someone who does some initial planning but leaves room for improvisation. Or you might meticulously plan certain aspects of your story (like the overall plot arc) while allowing other elements (like character dialogue) to flow freely.

Ultimately, the best approach is the one that allows you to write effectively and enjoyably.

Experiment and Find What Works for You:

Try different approaches for different projects. A short story might benefit from pantsing, while a complex novel might require more planning.

Start with a minimalist outline. This can provide a basic structure without being overly restrictive.

Allow yourself to deviate from your plan. If a more compelling idea arises, don't be afraid to explore it.

Don't be afraid to revise. Whether you're a plotter or a pantser, revision is an essential part of the writing process.

The most important thing is to experiment and find the approach that best suits your individual creative process. Embrace the journey, whether it's meticulously planned or wildly unpredictable. The goal is to tell a story that resonates with you and, ultimately, with your readers. Now go forth and write!

graphics and dividers by @saradika-graphics

[rebornofstars]

*And throws questions at you!!!*

for the lu write a thon ask game :3

What is your favorite WIP (published or not)?

What is an unsung WIP of yours you'd like to promote?What do you like most about your own writing?

Who is your favorite character to write, and what do you like about how you portray them?

Are you a pantser, a plotter, or something in between? What does that process look like for you?

ahhhhh ok i'll give it a shot!!!!

my fav wip? changes every day. primordials, maybe. i feel like im cooking with that one

unsung wip? fuckface maybe? 😅 it's very silly, i don't know about unsung, though... my fav thing abt my own writing is definitely when i think of a cool idea and get to giggle about it excitedly to myself

hmmm. can't decide! i have the most experience with wind (almost 70K, holy shit 😭) but honestly i love them all. each have little personality quirks & behaviours that make it fun! though i don't know how good at any of it i am, lol

pantser vs plotter? depends on the story! i have this wip called yestermorrow that has been driving me up the wall for months and months, and it's got more than 20K in outlining but less than 5K in actual drafts. lmao. primordials is planned, and the second half of the cursebreaker has all been (loosely) planned. but everything else i just make up as i go! not in the sense that i open a blank document and then see what comes out, but in the sense that i have a vibe or general idea, and then i start there and flesh it out as the story goes

what does that look like for me? well. the plotting usually starts with a rant / ideas dump, and slowly accumulates more and more different ideas until i can start fixing them together into something resembling a story. and then once i feel like i know what the story is about, i estimate chapters, and split up plot points, fiddle with the pacing, and then flesh out each chapter into an instruction manual for when i come back later to write. fairly standard method of plotting i think? i don't know. how do other people outline???? help

the pantsing is just. whats a cool-sounding sentence? ok, whats another cool-sounding sentence?

i really don't know

im making all of this up as i go along

💖

[slayingfiction]

Plotters VS. Pansters

In the world of writing, there are two types of creators often discussed: plotters and pantsers. These terms describe a writer’s approach to crafting stories. Whether you’re an aspiring author or a seasoned novelist, understanding these styles can offer valuable insights into your writing process. Let’s dive into what makes plotters and pantsers distinct and how each approach contributes to the art of storytelling.

Plotters: Architects of the Written World

Plotters, often referred to as ‘architects,’ are writers who plan their stories meticulously before diving into the actual writing. They are the mapmakers of the writing world, charting out each twist and turn of their narrative.

Detailed Outlining: Plotters create extensive outlines, character profiles, and world-building elements before penning their first sentence.

Controlled Storytelling: This style lends itself to a controlled narrative with fewer inconsistencies and plot holes.

Time Investment: Plotting can be time-consuming initially, but it often makes the writing process smoother.

Famous Plotters: J.K. Rowling and John Grisham are notable plotters, known for their detailed story planning.

Pantsers: The Free Spirits of Storytelling

Pantsers, or ‘gardeners,’ as George R.R. Martin likes to call them, write ‘by the seat of their pants.’ They dive into writing with a general idea or none at all, discovering the story as they go along.

Spontaneous Creation: Pantsers often begin with a basic concept or character and let the story unfold naturally.

Flexible and Dynamic: This style allows for more flexibility, often leading to surprising and dynamic plot turns.

Adaptable Process: Pantsing can be less intimidating for some writers, as it doesn’t require extensive pre-planning.

Famous Pantsers: Stephen King and Margaret Atwood are known for their pantser style, crafting intricate stories with a more spontaneous approach.

Which Approach is Better?

The truth is, there’s no ‘better’ approach. Both plotters and pantsers have their strengths and challenges. Some writers are strict plotters or pantsers, while others fall somewhere in between, employing techniques from both styles.

Mix and Match: Many successful authors use a combination of plotting and pantsing. They may start with a rough outline but allow room for the story to evolve.

Personal Preference: The best method depends on what works for you as a writer. Experiment with both styles to find your comfort zone.

Genre Considerations: Some genres, like mystery or high fantasy, might benefit more from plotting due to their complex plots and world-building.

Conclusion

Whether you’re a plotter, a pantser, or somewhere in between, the most important thing is to keep writing. Each approach offers unique pathways to creativity, and understanding your own method can enhance your writing experience. Embrace your style, and let it guide you in your storytelling journey.

Remember, there’s no right or wrong way to write a story. The beauty of writing lies in the diversity of its creation.

Happy Writing!

[cryptid-crafted]

November Writing Update

(for @creators-club monthly round-up event!)

Plotting:

Hit the 75% mark (second iteration outline) in in that bright and bitter dawn

Began picking at the first iteration of Invader of Stars outline; currently making research plan

Writing:

(it might not seem like a whole lot, but it's more than I've written consistently in a while and that is a-ok with me)

250 words on a Durgetash (Baldur's Gate 3) fic

2.4k on a Captive Prince fic

1k in short character sketches for ITBABD

Other:

Miscellaneous admin tasks, including migrating material off of gdocs and into LibreOffice/Ellipsus

Looked over a contract for a large project to be signed next month!

Finally posted a WIP intro for ITBABD

Participated in a panel on planning/pantsing for the @duckprintspress Patreon (and had a GREAT time, highly recommend becoming a patron so you too can have a great time)

2024 has been a weird year for me, writing-wise. I've written...very little. Embarrassingly little, actually.

However!

I finished up with my most stressful and time-consuming projects near the end of October, and that weight has been slowly easing. I feel better about moving forward with actual writing again. Moreover, I've spent a lot of the year refilling my creative well. I've been doing a LOT of reading, which I haven't done in ages, and really sitting down to check in with myself about my process.

Turns out, I'm less of a pantser than I thought! Sitting down and plotting in that bright and bitter dawn (as well as chatting shop with some publishing friends about their own processes) has really forced me to look at how I approach original work vs fanwork (but also, short stories vs novel-length work).

I'm hoping to finish a lot of my other miscellaneous stuff in the first week of December (and I have a bunch of beta reading to do for a Trigun zine). Ideally by the new year, I will have:

Completed second iteration outline of ITBABD

Completed Invader of Stars outline entirely; sent off for approval

Completed and published that damn BG3 fic that I've been picking at for OVER A YEAR

Completed and published the Captive Prince fic

Hit the 75% mark on my own submission for that Trigun zine

[moonshine-nightlight]

Any advice for writting longform stories like NWWD?

@honoikazuchis

thanks for this ask!

thats a pretty open ended question and my answer will inherently be relatively specific to me and the way i write, but i'm happy to share my advice!

I will link a few other posts where i answered some other writing asks:

worldbuilding [x] editing/exposition [x] writer's block/POV [x] plotting vs pantsing [x] how long does it take me to write stuff [x] my writing process [x] writing spicy scenes [x]

otherwise, see below for me rambling way too long about writing.

disclaimer: this is just my opinion and how i do things, obviously there's a lot of variety and nuance for everyone's writing process.

firstly, is that personally, i'm inclined to writing longform stories so thats a bit of a built in strength of mine. generally speaking my story ideas come with lots of lore (see above for my love of worldbuilding) and i like relationships that are deeper/longer, with slow burn being a favorite of mine (why basically all my short stories have the two people involved having met prior to the story starting). that being said, technically the main character in 'Nothing's Wrong with Dale' doesnt meet demon!Dale until the flashback of chapter 2 and why is part of why that story is so long/has a built in arranged marriage premise. Of my two potential long form stories i'm going to do next: one they already know each other (and are basically already in love just being pining idiots about it) or two the story takes place over several months/high stress situations and does not end with marriage etc. But thats more of a concern if you're writing romance.

in general, my advice for longform stories is to already have a relatively complete, high level view of the story when you start. some people can just improvise the entire story as they go--I cannot. i think its very helpful to know where ur story is going to end, more crucially when it is long and you'll be taking a while to get there. by this i primarily mean the setup for the story, then general ending, and vaguely what sort of metaphorical journey they take to get there. you do not need to know every scene and detail in the middle--and plot points/characters can and will evolve as you write and think more on everything--but having the broad brushstrokes figured out asap is critical, in my opinion.

I also, as a side note, don't set out with a story length in mind. i can generally get a good handle on how long a story will be by the idea and outline, but i dont try to make it long. if anything, i did try to challenge myself to write shorter stories, like my novellas, when i started this blog/posting original writing here. that was not only because i do tend to get very complicated/long original ideas, but also because i think it was important to me to actually finish some original work, which i had never done before.

shorter stories tend to have more straightforward plots. not that you can't boil down longer stories to simpler summaries, but generally longer story ideas have more stops along the way so to speak that come to me when i'm developing the idea because i want to cover more with the story. the main character in dale having had childhood illness, dale raised by his grandparents, there being tournament stuff and assassins stuff and uncomfortable parties and most importantly MC figuring out dale was a demon immediately and dale not knowing the MC knew that were all things i came up with (loosely) very soon after i started working on it.

which leads into my next piece of advice: write everything you brainstorm down - you will forget and you will remember there's something u've forgotten and it will annoy the hell out of you. write your notes, write your what ifs, write down possible character names, write down cool ideas for scenes--heck write some of the scenes up then, evn if its for chapter 24 of 35. dont save what ur most excited for as like a carrot on a stick, i find that it doesnt help and that having part of my story that i love existing already is a much better motivator to write the rest

i'm also a big outliner and planner. i think some people think what that means is that u should b able to write a plan once for a story and then never change or deviate from it--but no! change the plan as you go; scrap things that dont work out and add new ideas when they come to you. however, i do think having something down that covers the whole story, lets you get a good idea of the shape of the story, and reminds you of your end goal, are all incredibly helpful. i also keep multiple worldbuilding notes docs; character and location lists; picture inspiration; etc to support the longform idea

i think u also hav to hav confidence/delusion that you will in fact finished. i hav started multiple longform original writing ideas in the past. none of them are done except dale. and part of it was not taking some of my own advice up top, but i think i also just wasnt as committed? lik it'd get lost in worldbuilding, or writing other projects, or life happening (which is all absolutely fine) but dale was the first longform idea where i like, really believed i could write it all and where i was dedicated to putting in the time i'd need to finish it. i knew i would need to take breaks and it would take more than a year (which i did and it did) but i still believed i'd get to where i am now, with a finished draft which i think was really key.

also, practice, i've been writing for years and year; i've been reading for even longer; and i've been writing and posting fanfic for years as well. some of my longer fanfics were such good practice for how to plot a long story without having to generate all the lore myself and having guardrails on for the story/characters in general. aside from dale, my next five pieces of longest writing are all fanfic.

lastly, find at least one person you can talk to about your story. i really think that helped me stay excited and motivated about my longform story in particular. i of course like talking about shorter stories too, but i dont think i felt as compelled to keep talking about them during the process of writing them as i did for my longform stories (even my longer fanfics i talked with other ppl in the big bang about or other writers on discord). and i dont just mean posting the rough drafts as u go like i did, but friends, irl or online, that either are also writers or are just interested in what story you want to make. i think it helps make it more real to you, it gives you ways to talk through issues that come up, its a way to get excited because they're excited, and it makes someone besides you ask how everythings going. the longer stories ideas i had but never got finished are also ones i primarily kept to myself, because i dont think i'd realized how helpful it could be to share them and also because i was still sure that in order to justify telling someone or evn for someone to care, it would hav to already be written, but it doesnt! and in retrospect, i wish i had because maybe those stories would exist--or maybe i'll dig up those notes and talk to someone about them and then find myself back to writing about them (rip to Aftermath, that corrupted external hard drive did u dirty and killed my motivation).

i think getting to understand and figure out your own process, to really look at yourself and see what works and what doesnt (as honestly as you can) is extremely helpful. u'll also figure stuff out along the way--dont hesitate to try to new strategies or drop one that are really not working for you. its all a learning process. be nice to yourself! give yourself the grace to make mistakes (or tell a friend so they can bully you into to cutting urself some damn slack when u can't stick to a weekly upload schedule u made up for urself).

whatever longform story you've got in ur head is one worth sharing and seeing through to completion--and then inflicting on everyone else lol OUR problem now ;)

[foxmulderautism]

im trying to practice healthy habits right now such as not responding to the writing advice post that pissed me off bc they flattened craft theory to basic rules again. however it’s about “pantsing” vs “plotting” so you’ve struck me where it’s personal

[elizmanderson]

Hi, here's my attempt at a specific question(s) for 'Remarkable Retirement"

Does Edna ever get a cat?

What was the writing process like, do you have a favorite scene?

How fantasy-esque versus modern-day esque is Remarkable Retirement?

Also also

"a dragon who hoards flowers"

more info on this one. I love this one.

I'll try to get the book whenever I'm able, it seems really interesting

<3

ahhhhhhhhh excellent. sweet sweet questions. let's talk about Remarkable Retirement!

Does Edna ever get a cat?

not in the published book! originally she adopted a stray who lived outside the nursing home and brought him partway on her adventure with him, but then he got cut because I am terrible at keeping track of characters' pets.

it is actually canonical that she's had a cat at some point, bc when she has to name something for Magical Purposes, we learn she's bad at naming things. she once adopted a stray cat and called it Kitty.

(in one draft it's stated that her son's father named their son for this reason lmao but I don't think that line survived)

What was the writing process like? Do you have a favorite scene?

part one of this question:

long and chaotic lmao. I wrote the first draft as part of a last-man-standing-style writing challenge in which I had to write at least 1000 words/week by the weekly deadline or drop out.

I made it all the way to the end for a grand total of 72 weeks. the last several weeks, the creator upped the word count each week (from 1000 to 1500 to 8,000 to 12,000 to 20,000) to pressure the last of us left standing to drop out so they could start the next round.

it was unsuccessful, as two of us not only reached but smashed right through the 20k goal of week 72 and were declared joint winners lmao. I wrote 32k that week and finished the draft at about 160,000 words.

I leaned heavily into pantsing for the first draft: I knew a few major plot points going into the first draft but otherwise figured most of the story out each week as I wrote more of it.

for subsequent drafts, which were revised over the next two years, I did considerably more planning. but still plenty of angst lol, especially since 160,000 is pretty chonky and the first draft needed some major restructuring. I think there were three major rounds of revisions total before I started querying.

(queried for two years, got lots of "love this but it's not marketable," and finally published with a small press that said "love this and we want to publish it." although I do have an agent now! but I got my agent with a different manuscript.)

part two of this question:

I do love a major plot twist and spent most of my first draft looking forward to writing it. but I think my favorite scene is probably the soft moment in the hospital between Edna and Amir. they're just *anime fist clench* so soft together.

plus it includes Amir calling Edna "Edna" instead of "Mrs. Fisher" for the first time, and I am a slut for a good name thing.

How fantasy-esque vs. modern-day-esque is Remarkable Retirement?

Remarkable Retirement leans heavily modern day, but magic exists and everyone knows about it. so the setting is modern and the characters travel to some real places, like Detroit and my hometown and California, and there are real-world things like nursing homes and cell phones.

but then you've got a part of the U.S. military that deals with dragons because there are dragons, and you've got a council of wizards that's mostly useless, and some of the nursing homes (not Edna's) are magical homes, and you can magically enhance your cell phone (but not iPhones because Apple doesn't let you do that).

so like. it's set in more-or-less the modern-day U.S. (minus the pandemic, which hadn't started yet when I wrote the book), but the fantasy elements exist openly alongside all the real-world stuff.

More info about the dragon who hoards flowers

his name is Basil and I love him very much