#or elain i think shes interesting with what little sjm gives us and i hope she doesnt make her another feyre

[arson-09]

Random but this song makes me think of nesta and elain🧍🏻

[acourtofthought]

@starsreminisce posted these comments on their blog:

And the last paragraph really stood out to me.

Something I've seen said by a certain side of the fandom is that a bonus chapter should not change the trajectory of what is in the actual book. I disagree with that because I look at the bonus chapters as a sneak peek of what's to come in future books (with this particular bonus following the pattern talked about in a post yesterday, with the resolution to the small story pointing us in the direction of Gwynriel), things that Sarah will at a later point expound on within the actual series even if they weren't initially clear to us without having read the bonus.

But say that's the truth, say the bonus chapters are only in line with that which we already know (which still works for Gwynriel because though the bonus hinted at Gwyn having a curiosity towards Az and him possibly having a bond with her, we do see bits of that in the actual book as well, there are scenes with her staring in his direction and scenes where he's staring in hers, where he shows admiration for her, where she's teasing him, where Nesta calls Az her new ribbon).

One of the big arguments is that it's extremely clear that Elain has no interest in Lucien, that it's been the case for multiple books. It's said Elain does not owe Lucien an explanation, that she does not owe him her time or attention.

So why not write an Elain bonus chapter in SF where she and Lucien have a conversation discussing how they don't want to explore their bond? According to E/riels there's no need for it in the first place since she's made herself clear but they have also claimed that she won't break the bond until we have her POV. Then wouldn't a bonus in Elain's POV before her book be the perfect place for something that's so obvious so that when she starts her own book "with Az", there's nothing standing in their way and the focus can be on their romance and the plot and not the emotional toll that her severing her bond with Lucien would take? If the Elucien bond is as much of a non issue as some claim it be be, then why not deal with it in an Elain Bonus Chapter? When her book starts, Sarah could even recap the events of the bonus for those who had missed it.

Elain thought back to that conversation she and Lucien shared shortly after Solstice. Where after Azriel's rejection, which had cut her deeply, she realized there was no place in her heart for anyone but Az even if she wasn't sure he still wanted her.

That would have actually be a perfect way for SJM to move us past the Elucien bond with very little in the way of feeling devastated on Lucien's behalf, where his heart is not being broken in real time within her romantic arc.

But the author didn't do that. She gave Az and FEYRE a POV. Feyre who already had 3 books and a novella and Elain with a total of 0.

We know Az doesn't think Lucien is good enough for Elain but we don't know if Elain agrees with that.

We know Az questioned the Cauldron because of his brothers and her sisters, that he hadn't thought of being with Elain beyond his sexual fantasies but we don't know where Elain stands on the whole "just wants one taste / why wasn't Az made my mate" debate.

We know Az thought of Elain as too trusting and hopeful but we've no clue whether Elain was really thinking anything of the sort.

We've got Feyre thinking back on how she made sure to keep her mouth shut on Elain not wearing Lucien's gloves, how had she put them on she would have never been pierced in the first place but we still don't know whether Elain's actions with the gloves actually line up with her thoughts.

If Sarah wanted to continue on with what is apparently so evident in the four books of buildup for E/riel there was nothing preventing her from finally giving us Elain's POV in SF and having her tell Lucien that there's no reason for him to hold out hope any longer.

The more likely explanation for why Elain wasn't given a bonus is because everything that E/riels and Az claim that is so very obvious regarding Elain's character might actually not be as obvious as they think.

If she's so happy in the NC, then why hide her thoughts?

If she's so in love with Az, that it's clear as day, then why hide her thoughts?

If she's so disinterested in Lucien, then why hide her thoughts?

If we're supposed to believe that Elain's choice is Az, that there is no competition and that it should not be a mystery to anyone at this point, then why has she been so reticent to put us into Elain's head?

[nikethestatue]

I’m starting to genuinely worry about the upcoming elriel book (if it ever comes out). SJM and Bloomsbury are taking way too long and refusing to give us a single a crumb, and the fandom is spiraling every day because of it. While I love Elriel’s quiet and understanding relationship, it’s getting harder and harder to keep rampant interest in them because of the lack of new content, which is genuinely a shame since I found this lovely part of the fandom because of them.

My biggest fear is that even after this never-ending wait. SJM will fail to deliver. CC3 was a dumpster fire and ACOSF was all over the place, and both were highly anticipated within her following. Plus, now SJM has to juggle two extremely loved characters (Azriel and Lucien) and fully flesh out Elain, who’s been pretty mysterious throughout the books. I feel like too many smut scenes (like in ACOSF) will be jarring (especially if she includes any BDSM, which I’m a little against), and elriel honestly deserves more than just having sex in secret and calling it a day. I think that above all, I really just want SJM to tune the book to their personalities and give us all what we’ve been hoping for: a romantic, hot, magical book that puts to rest the nonsensical debates within the fandom and elevates Elain and Azriel’s characters even more.

I don’t want her to try please parts of the fandom, or give any attention to E*ucien/Gw*nriel, or even prove all of our theories right. I just want a good book.

Anyway, I’m so sorry for the rant. What are your thoughts on SJM’s silence and where the book might go? You’re always very clear and rational with your take on things. 💜

Thank you! And feels free to rant, because I think you aren't the only one and we are all in the same boat.

I think I am on a different spectrum now. I used to be very worried about the content of the book. And now ...I am not even sure there will be a book within the time frame of my interest. Meaning, by the time it comes out, will I even truly care?

Beyond that, we don't even know who the MCs will be. And that's always been my biggest problem. My biggest fear. What if the book isn't even Elain's?

And no, I am not even worried about GA or Elucien. I don't believe that SJM would ever write GA or that it even crossed her mind. What I fear is that SJM is going to do something utterly strange--like another Nesta book. 'The Adventures of Nesta in Erilea'!--something like that.

Because her inability to ever clearly say, Elain is the next FMC lives rent free in my mind.

Like I still remember the absolutely catastrophic sense of dejection when she casually announced that the book following HOSAB would be HOFAS. That was a massive mindfuck.

So I suppose to me, at this point, and with the complete silence that's coming from her and BB, I am not even thinking about what the book will be ABOUT. I am just thinking will the book be Elain's?

It's been Elain-silence pre-HOFAS, it's been complete silence about anything and everything post HOFAS.

I don't even understand what happened to the HOFAS paperback. Not that anyone needs it, but at least it's some news?

I genuinely cannot explain the complete silence and the utter disengagement from the readers. It's baffling.

[starsreminisce]

Did the ACOTAR books define what a seer is? Did they say what court it seers came from? or is this a mother given gift?

The only time they've talked about what a seer was right after the Twin Ravens attack, when Feyre started connecting the dots that Elain foresaw the attack. Azriel then said that she's a seer after her riddles became clearer. Other than that, it seemed very minimal because it did take Azriel a few days after Feyre asked him what her riddles meant for them to come up with an answer.

From ACOSF, Nesta explained a little more about her powers. She said that Amren was like her, not possessing any court-specific magic, and I would guess it's the same for Elain since Nesta and Amren were also Made from the Cauldron.

Like Nesta, Amren did not possess court-specific magic related to the High Fae. It didn’t make her influence in this court any less mighty. Nesta’s own High Fae powers had never materialized— she had only what she’d taken from the Cauldron, rather than letting it deign to gift her with power, as it had with Elain. She had no idea what she’d ripped from the Cauldron while it had stolen her humanity from her—but she knew they were things she did not and would never wish to understand, to master. The very thought had her stomach churning.

From how it was described, it's more of a Cauldron-given gift as opposed to being from the Mother since Nesta gave her powers back to the Cauldron but the Mother intervened from Nesta giving it all back.

“I gave it back to the Cauldron in exchange for the knowledge of how to save them.” She swallowed. “But a little remains. I think something else—someone else—stopped the Cauldron from taking all of it. And I made some changes of my own.” The Mother. The only being who would see the sacrifice Nesta had made and give a little back. Perhaps it was she who had peered out at them through the Mask. “What did you change?” Nesta rested a hand on her abdomen. “I changed myself a little, too. So none of us will have to go through this again.”

But I do think it's interesting that Elain started separating her dream state and her awake state after her conversation with Lucien in the library and how their proximity seems to trigger her visions. Last we were told in ACOSAF that she has received no visions and in ACOSF, her powers remain but, like Nesta, have not been mastered or even touched if she said that she needed to get reacquainted with them.

Lucien was not around in ACOSAF, but he started being in Velaris more in ACOSF from the sounds of it.

SJM does seem to like having a power link her mated pairs. Rhys taught Feyre about her daemati (and winnowing) powers, and Cassian trained Nesta to channel her Silver Flames into her attacks.

Lucien's reaction to seeing Elain's powers in action had exact wording when another male watched their eventual-end-game-female counterpart in a different light, so I wonder what Lucien felt when this played out and how he was the one who ultimately left to bring back the sixth queen.

Hope this was helpful! Thanks again for asking!

“The sixth queen is alive?” Azriel asked, calm and steady, the voice of the High Lord’s spymaster, who had broken enemies and charmed allies. Elain cocked her head, as if listening to some inner voice. “Yes.” Lucien just stared and stared at my sister, as if he’d never seen her before.

“That bastard,” Nesta said with utter coolness, though her eyes began to burn, “may wind up being the only person standing in the way of Hybern’s forces and your people.” She didn’t so much as look at Cassian as she said it. But he stared at her—as if he’d never seen her before.

[bloomingdarkgarden]

Hello,

First things first, sorry for any grammar mistakes. English is not my first language.

Second, I would like to say I am beyond happy that I found your page, and the fanfiction. I have been reading since I was a little girl, and this fandom was the first, where I was ridiculed for liking two characters together (Elain and Azriel). So at first it really turned me off from anything relaring to them, since I didn't want to be bullied. But after discovering you, I have to say I love them even more! I actually would like to know what SJM thinks herself about this ship war and how Elriel shippers are being treated and made fun off. But, lets leave it for another time.

Third, I think I have never read anything so lovely as your writing. The world you created, the words and actions you put into these characters are nothing short of breathetaking. What made you love Elain and Az in the first place?

To me I think, it's the potential of the way they would fight for each other. Feysand and Nessian, sure, they're mated and all, but these two, oh boy. The way they burn Prythian to the ground for the one thay chose.

Anyway, thank you for this hope you give us. For this beauty. And I hope one day to read an original book written by you 🩷

'There will come a poet whose weapin is his word. He will slay you with his tongue' 🩷

Hi beautiful,

Thank you for such kind words regarding the story. I’m sorry you have experienced ridicule over faeries. All I can say is that people take these books astoundingly seriously considering how many massive plot holes there are. I don’t have the ammunition for it, only the bandaids. You are welcome to hide under a a rock with me away from it all. There’s tea there. And naked pictures of bat boys.

It’s hard to say what made me fall for Az and Elain. But I love this question.

I think it’s has something to do with defying expectation.

She’s been spoken for and consistently underestimated most of her life. There’s something intrinsically interesting about her staring wide-eyed into her own fate and turning away to choose another destiny entirely. Elain has a tendency to shock people and I find that telling.

There’s truly something beautiful to me in the dark fragility between them. I find it absolutely hypnotic. Something about sharing comfortable silence at odds with their mutually charged need and desire. The delicacy is 🤌

For me it has nothing to do with them fixing one another. But merely existing with their demons, somewhere sweet and dark and entirely their own. I think it really hit home for me when Az was the one out of everyone to recognize Elain’s powers.

All she has ever wanted is to be seen. She said that once, regarding Greyshit. And the day Az recognized her Sight he saw her truly.

"-as if the understanding, our understanding… it freed her from whatever murky realm she’d been in."

That was the darkest period of Elain’s life. And it was Azriel who saw her and delivered her from it. While her mate was in the room, at a loss. That's not something a girl ever forgets. Ever.

"𝙋𝙚𝙧𝙝𝙖𝙥𝙨 𝙝𝙚, 𝙩𝙤𝙤, 𝙝𝙖𝙙 𝙨𝙪𝙛𝙛𝙚𝙧𝙚𝙙 𝙖𝙨 𝙀𝙡𝙖𝙞𝙣 𝙝𝙖𝙙 𝙗𝙚𝙛𝙤𝙧𝙚 𝙝𝙚 𝙪𝙣𝙙𝙚𝙧𝙨𝙩𝙤𝙤𝙙 𝙬𝙝𝙖𝙩 𝙜𝙞𝙛𝙩 𝙝𝙚 𝙥𝙤𝙨𝙨𝙚𝙨𝙨𝙚𝙙.”

This raw, organic understanding.

Why everyone has to be mates is beyond me. That sort of pre-ordained shit reeks of conservative undertones / ownership and makes me 😬. Maybe just because I am a polyamorous bisexual faerie myself idk. I would be cool with it if it were one out of every 20 couples in ACOTAR or something. There are lovely fun tropes with it, but also problematic ones.

Why can’t we just have good old fashioned, star defying, cast-system-breaking-jack-and-rose-titanic-etched love affair idk.

If it happens with Elucien I'll be happy too, but that's another bag. I worship Lucien's ass. I just worship elriel's asses marginally more. I want the world for all our character's asses.

In my heart, Elain’s trembling fawn era is OUT. Elain’s dark-laced self-evolved reputation era defying the gods with a very bad bf no one wants her to have is IN.

Damn the Cauldron. Damn the Stars.

Lets 🫰 fucking 🫰 go 🫰

[tadpolesonalgae]

i think we'll get a vanserra book like if the next one is really elriel then i hope we get a lucien and eris book focused on their family because there's so much interesting plot there. the helion and loa mess, killing beron and eris becoming high lord, lucien finding out he's the day court heir, everyone seeing eris isnt really all that bad, seeing their whole dynamic in the past + how it would change, seeing eris make autumn a better place, finding out more about the other brothers (if they're as bad as their father or like eris faking it). we wouldn't even really need luci or eris to get any romance partners for it to be a really good book (idk if i trust sjm to do it righ tho) - 🧶

Honestly I’d love it if Az just stayed on his own for a little 🫢 give me a non-cringey self love story for him where he recovers his self-esteem without getting into an inevitably messy tangle with probably either Elain or Gwyn. Let Elain enjoy standing on her own too, after being in love with Graysen for so long and expected to get with a man, let her enjoy being by herself with friends instead of romantic partners and let Gwyn become more comfortable in the outside world! I want Gwyn to come see Velaris at some point, to recover enough to begin venturing out into the world again and healing!!

(Sorry for that tangent)

And I would LOVE a Vanserra book! Let me see more of Eris and Lucien interacting, let me see how Beron treats them, let me see what Eris and his mother’s relationship is!! It’s mentioned she’s rarely lucid—is that difficult for Eris? He shifted to be a little infront of her at the high lord’s meeting—does Beron ever wield LoA against Eris? There’s so much!! Will Lu ever get to see his mother again??

I know what you mean about maybe not trusting sjm though unfortunately… :/ if she could channel what she did with tog I think that would be more enjoyable? Let us just see everyone getting along together instead of using every book to have a romance sub plot 🫠

[emilyondemand]

Something I find a little interesting about some in the fandom is how literal things need to be spelled out. I think this could be a bit of a case of not understanding the difference when an author shows us something(good writing) and tells us something(mediocre writing, except where exposition is needed, obviously). This is especially important in relationship dynamics, and I think this can be applied to Az’s bonus pov as well as to his and Elaine’s relationship as a whole.

SJM has been peeling back layer after layer showing us the depth of feeling and tenderness between Az and Elain through their actions toward one another.

Elain noticing Az rubbing his temples and getting him something to alleviate his discomfort

Az making a joke at Amren’s expense to distract everyone from Elain’s embarrassment

Az staying up with El after 3 am to listen to her gardening plans

Az acknowledging Elain’s contributions and service to her court and family through her domestic duties and not letting anyone eat until she is seated as a sign or respect

Az respecting Elain’s privacy with Lucien

When Azriel hears about the fight between Nesta and Elain, he doesn’t wonder about the fight, he is worried about Elain’s well-being. “What happened to Elain”

Azriel’s shadows coiling like snakes to defend Elain when she’s insulted.

So a common argument is that we were in Azriel’s head and he did not think about Elain in any other terms outside of her beauty and having sex with her. That even in Cassian’s bonus he thought about Nesta as a “pillar of steel and flame,” but I feel like this again comes down to that pesky little thing that antis love to hate, context. And even in context, this remark from Cassian isn’t much different than Azriel thinking about how open and hopeful and trusting Elain is when she looks at him.

Cassian and Nesta, at the point of time of his pov, had only seen each other a couple times. Nesta was still human, Cassian didn’t understand why he was drawn to her, they each had a very visceral reaction to one another that manifested itself by walking a very thin line between love/hate (and very often fell into hate territory). This encounter happened before he made a vow to protect Nes, which in text seemed mildly out of place, but was illuminated by their interaction in his bonus pov.

The bonus gives context for Cas’s actions in that moment. Just like all of the moments Elain and Az have had over the course of four books give context to Az’s bonus.

Azriel and Elain find themselves in a private romantic situation. One that Az has been simultaneously trying to avoid, but also hoping for desperately. The author is expecting her readers to understand by this point in the story that there is an established bond between the two, so there is no need for Azriel to wax poetic on Elain’s virtues, he knows what they are. Because, as opposed to Cassian and Nesta in Cassian’s bonus, Azriel and Elain have spent over 2 years moving in the same circle and getting to know one another. SJM is noting the familiarity that has occurred between them when she has Azriel remarking on:

Not needing his shadows to read Elain

Elain understanding why he was avoiding the river house and his motivations- indicating that these two have gotten to know each other well enough to communicate without words

Moments unseen to the reader involving mutual flirting with lingering glances and the brushing of fingers

And Elain making a sex joke with Azriel shows that these two are obviously comfortable with one another, especially in light of Elain’s reaction to Feyre’s attempt to discuss Fae periods with her

Ironically enough, antis also conveniently forget that between the two POV’s, it’s Cassian who is concerned about how Mor will feel about him and Nesta; Azriel on the other hand, doesn’t spare a thought for Mor while he is with Elain.

Then we get to the confrontation between Azriel and Rhys. Antis seem to think that Azriel is going to just start pouring out his heart to Rhys, and the truth is, he kind of does in his own way. I think it’s also important to note that Azriel’s rage here had less to do with Rhys interrupting, than it did with Azriel knowing Elain was confused and hurt and he was forced to be the cause of it.

So then we have Azriel:

Willing to upset the tentative peace in Prythian for Elain

Willing to fight a blood duel for Elain

Prioritizing Elain’s wants over the entitlement of the mating bond

Questioning Fate and the Mother

And his feelings need to be spelled out more than that? In a bonus chapter the majority of readers don’t even know about?

SJM shows us over and over in the bonus that there is a deep and intimate connection between Azriel and Elain, and it is mutual. The lengths Azriel would be willing to go for Elain and her well being says loud and clear that his feelings for her aren’t purely sexually driven. The cliche: actions speak louder than words, personifies their relationship.

[katsum50]

Just from hearing clips from the interview last night it makes me wonder if Elain doesn’t play a decent size role in CC3 which is why SJM stopped herself really quick when she said we would see more Elain in the next book.

I mean there had to be a reason roses and bread were mentioned in the townhouse, so we were reminded of Elain’s prescense and only her and Mor were missing. Makes you think when Bryce sees Elain something could happen, such as her scar glowing.

I could go into a lot of theories about what the Cauldron gave Elain and her connection to the Mother hinted at in ACOSF, but others have stated it better than I ever could. If Elain does play a role in the ACOTAR side of CC3, that would definitely give us lots of Elriel crumbs I’m sure.

Also I think even with the language barrier Bryce would like Elain. I imagine her gentle spirit would remind Bryce of Juniper even though they look nothing alike. I think they both smell like jasmine too, though I only read the CC series once so I could be mistaken.

Anyway, it could be all three sisters and “brothers” have a part to play in helping to defeat the Asteri. I still go back to Hypaxia explaining to Ithan about the two intersecting triangles, male and female, dark and light and power lying where they meet. Also it give s definite reason to have three of the most powerful Illyrian’s born end up as family meeting three Made, powerful, females.

If Elain does play a part in CC3. I worry about her fate a bit. She is a dreamer who has been shown to want a better world. We know she loves her sister and considers herself as a member of the Night Court. I just have this feeling that Elain is one of those types that loves easily and freely. I could see her doing anything to help her “family” or even those in the CC world. (I have a definite fanfic in mind about it that I want to write so badly, but I really need to finish my other two first. )

Also I could go on about how all three sisters are possible starborn, maybe decedents of Theia’s lost daughter or given her power when Made. Elain looks a little different than her sisters, and Nesta remarks how she has grown infinitely more beautiful though she can’t say how. Be interesting if Elain is almost like The Mother or Theia reborn, especially if you pull Aidas and the rest of Hel in the picture.

All this rambling to say, I hope we do see Elain in CC3 as more than just someone who stays behind watching Nyx, and as it is my preferred pairing, I wouldn’t be opposed to some subtle (or not subtle) Elriel moments.

[elriell]

Why Elriel is most definitely a Sleeping Beauty Retelling!

Since this was brought up a few days ago I cannot get the idea out my head that Sarah is basing Elriel’s story on Sleeping Beauty, and now we know she hid crumbs in her other books, alongside a quick browse of her pinterest boards it seems more and more likely! Especially since she loves her retellings.

A daughter was born, and they called her Aurora. Yes, they named her after the dawn for she filled their lives with sunshine. 

Listen well, all of you. The princess shall indeed grow in grace and beauty, beloved by all who know her. She'll walk in springtime wherever she goes!

There are so many parallels between Elain and Aurora, they are both beloved by all, kind creatures who thrive in springtime. Aurora is named for after the dawn because she filled their lives with sunshine, A) tell me this isn’t Elain and B) the meaning of her name;

Elaine as a girl's name is of Greek origin meaning "sun ray or shining light".

Yet another parallel is Aurora believing they still treat her as a child, who does that remind you of?

Oh, dear. Why do they still treat me like a child? 

Even if love is full of thorns, I’d still embrace it. I know that in between those thorns there is a rose worth all the pain.

Could this be any more spot on? We have spoken extensively about Elains, not only willingness to get her hands dirty but the pleasure she derives from creating something beautiful from her labour. If this isn’t a metaphor for Azriel and their future situation I don’t know what is... 

This is very important, it keeps getting brought back up in text to show us Elain is going to fight through the bad to get to what she wants. Her hands might bruise and bloody in the process but she will to do it to enjoy the fruits of her labour.

Which leads me to why even further than a Sleeping Beauty retelling I think it will be Elain saving Azriel and breaking a curse/spell. Let us look to SJM’s pinterest board shall we!

These are just a few of the SB reminiscent pins she has saved, one of the more recent ones in the bottom right. Notice it is the girl saving the man, tell me you do not get immediate Elriel vibes from that, the roses, the colours.

There also seems to be a lot of cursed/chained art too, I definitely think something is going to happen to Azriel that Elain has to save him from, my best guess would be Koschei. 

Elain’s story thus far has heavily emphasised on choice, as we have seen through her interactions with Lucien and their bond overall, hence why I think it will be her making the choice to save him rather than him coming for her.

He has already saved her, it is time for her to shine. It would also grant her the opportunity to explore her own agency, and not what is expected of her.

 A ray of hope there still may be in this, the gift I give to thee. Not in death, but just in sleep, the fateful prophecy you’ll keep, and from this slumber you shall wake, when true love’s kiss, the spell shall break.

I think that it is interesting considering she is a seer, that Sleeping Beauty has so many references to visions, fate and so on, after the Azriel POV where we are shown he clearly believes it is fate that three sisters would all fall for three bothers.

Almost like it is... Fate. 

This will be the ultimate moment where Elain gets to decide her future and potentially follow her own fate. Not to mention we know the Cauldron loves Elain and gifted her with her abilities, could this be another tie-in, gifting her the ability to wake/heal Azriel? 

But see the gracious whim of fate - why, 'tis the self-same peasant maid, who won the heart of our noble prince but yesterday. She is indeed, most wondrous fair, gold of sunshine in her hair, Lips that shame the red rose, in ageless sleep, she finds repose. The years roll by, but a hundred years to a steadfast heart, are but a day. And now, the gates of a dungeon part, and our prince is free to go his way. Off he rides, on his noble steed, a valiant figure, straight and tall! To wake his love, with love's first kiss, and prove that true love conquers all! 

Love’s first kiss? Could this be why she didn’t allow them to kiss in the hallway... Anything is possible but the parallels are certainly interesting at this point you can’t deny! 

Also here are a few more little crumbs she could have been planting through the series, the colours we most see Elain in are pinks and blues and the most run along joke through the movie is her dress being changed from one colour to the other... Nothing major but certainly interesting.

These were by no means the only references to her wearing those colours I am just trying to be brief. 

Not to mention Roses really took a bigger role in ACOSF in regards to associating them with Elain, while she certainly had past references to them before but adding in her fathers gifts and Azriels gift both being roses. Hmmmmmmm.

There was a few more little things but I would love to hear everyone else’s thoughts!!!! If not SB what retelling would you think? I am a die hard Hades/Persephone fan so I am sad that is already been done because LBR they are perfect for it hahah

[icedflames]

I ship Elain and Azriel and am very hopeful that the next book will be theirs but the one thing that makes me less confident is the usage of “a thing a secret, lovely beauty”. Do you think it possibly could be a hint to gwyn and Azriel happening?

Nope. Not at all.

The golden necklace seemed ordinary -- its chain unremarkable, the amulet tiny enough that it could be dismissed as an everyday charm. It was a small, flat rose fashioned of stained glass, designed so that when held to the light, the true depth of the colors would become visible. A thing of secret, lovely beauty. (ACOSF, Azriel Bonus Chapter)

Azriel bought Elain a gift - a gift full of symbolism. The necklace was a rose, which is associated with Elain:

She plucked another figurine from the mantel: a rose carved from a dark sort of wood. She held it in her palm, its solid weight surprising, and traced a finger over one of the petals. “He made this one for Elain. Since it was winter and she missed the flowers." (ACOSF, Chp. 55)

It's also interesting how Elain is brought up here:

“Don’t forget that gardening often results in something pretty, but it involves getting one’s hands dirty along the way.”

“And torn up by thorns,” I mused, recalling a morning this past summer when Elain had come into the house, her right palm bleeding from several gashes thanks to a stubborn rosebush that had pierced her gloves. (ACOSF, Feysand Bonus Chapter)

And then Feyre stated that she didn't dare mention that if Elain had used the gloves Lucien had gotten her, she wouldn't have gotten hurt. Moving on...

Mama Archeron had told Nesta that:

My Nesta. Elain shall wed for love and beauty, but you, my cunning little queen... You shall wed for conquest. (ACOSF, Chp. 4)

Elain shall wed for love and beauty... A thing of secret, lovely beauty.

Secret... Where does secret come from?

Shadows darkened his eyes, full of enough pain that she couldn’t stop herself from touching his shoulder. Letting him see that she understood why he stood in the doorway, why he wouldn’t go near the fire. His secret to tell, never hers. (ACOSF, Chp. 58)

"A thing of secret, lovely beauty" is clearly a reference to Elain and Azriel's relationship.

And then we have:

He slept as well as could be expected, but when Azriel returned to the river house to gather his presents before dawn, he found Elain's necklace amid the pile. He pocketed it. Spent the rest of his day, even the blasted snowball fight, with every intention of returning it to the shop in the Palace of Thread and Jewels. (ACOSF, Azriel Bonus Chapter)

Azriel intended to return Elain's necklace.

I repeat, Azriel intended to return Elain's necklace. It's her necklace in Azriel's mind. And Azriel had every intention of returning it.

Friendly reminder that right before this paragraph, Azriel stated that could have sworn he had heard a faint singing following him as he descended the stairwell. Please see my post on that here.

And then "he found himself at the library" instead of returning the necklace. And then we have:

But Azriel tucked away the thought, consciously erasing the slight smile it brought to his face. Buried the image down deep, where it glowed quietly. (ACOSF, Azriel Bonus Chapter)

Sounds weird, right? Well typically, SJM uses glow, glowing, and glowed to refer to power. Here are some examples peppered throughout ACOSF:

Amren’s eyes glowed, a remnant of the power that had once burned inside her. All that was left now. (ACOSF, Chp. 1)

Nesta blinked at her hand. She had seen sparks. Her fingers were embedded in the stone, the rock glowing as if lit with an inner flame. (ACOSF, Chp. 10)

Gwyn’s hair seemed to glow brighter with her song, skin radiating a beckoning light. Drawing any listener in. (ACOSF, Chp. 13)

“Do you know how your eyes glow when your power rises to the surface? Like molten steel. Like silver fire.” (ACOSF, Chp. 15)

Nesta hefted Ataraxia, settling her weight between her feet, making sure her stance was even. Unshakable. The blade began to glow. (ACOSF, Chp. 54)

These are just a few random examples from the latest book. I believe there are a few examples of the mating bond glowing but there's a major issue with this argument - mating bonds do not glow until they're accepted. The magic of accepting the bond causes the threads to glow. It's very doubtful that glowing in this instance would refer to a mating bond. Especially when there is nothing else in the books that indicates that the two are mated.

And finally, in it's own paragraph we have:

A thing of secret, lovely beauty.

The last line of Azriel's bonus chapter. And a fantastic way for the reader to recall where the line was initially said (when Azriel was giving Elain her necklace) and what occurred during the first half of the chapter (Azriel and Elain almost kissed and Rhys interrupted due to the repercussions).

Now, with all that said...

I highly doubt this chapter is going to play any role in the next book. We may get a small line but it is a bonus chapter. The people who have read it represent a very small percentage of the people who read this book. It also was not a widely disseminated chapter and I'm pretty sure we all read it off the internet.

An author is not going to put major plot points in a bonus chapter. The purpose of the bonus chapter was to confirm a few details some readers may have missed:

What Azriel's secret was;

Elain and Azriel's feelings for one another;

Why they cannot be together (I.e. the external obstacles preventing them form being in a relationship);

Gwyn's powers.

Easy peasy. Just remember how much of a role Cassian's gift to Nesta played in ACOSF. And his gift was actually in the novella.

[acourtofthought]

🔮🔮🔮 SEER? 🔮🔮🔮

In many world mythologies, some figures can provide insight into events and even predict future events. Prophets, diviners, oracles, and seers are just some of the names given to these powerful people. The term ''seer'' comes from the word ''see,'' meaning to perceive something, usually with the eyes.

Elain is a Seer (obviously) but there's a lot of unanswered questions surrounding things she's done that being a Seer doesn't quite answer.

She found flowers—somewhere. She laid them at his head, on his chest.

It's not impossible to think they were simply growing on their own somewhere nearby but the fact that Feyre draws attention to, as if she hadn't seen any flowers and wasn't sure where they came from stands out to me.

… “She loves her garden. Always loved growing things.

Could she have somehow magicked the flowers into existence?

Elain rushed to Cassian, but the warrior was panting—smiling grimly and panting— / Had she (Feyre's referring to Nesta) done some healing, somehow, in those moments after she’d severed the king’s head? Or had it been Cassian’s immortal blood and Azriel’s battlefield patching that had already healed him enough to manage to stand, even with the wing and leg? I didn’t ask my sister, and she supplied no answer as she took the water bucket dangling from Elain’s still-bloody hands,

How was Cassian healed? We know Nesta hadn't done it as Feyre initially wonders. And anytime Az or Cassian have healed themselves, she states it as fact rather than making it a mystery. Elain was the one who immediately rushed to Cassian after stabbing the King which is interesting when you consider that she previously had a vision about Cassian's death.

“Will—will many of these soldiers die?”

And he knew the cruelty of the Hewn City troubled her.

She had been always so full of light.

She glowed with good health.

- Healers in the TOD series are synonymous with light and we know that Yrene uses memories of "light and goodness" to help defeat Valg infections: "And I saw what it was doing to you, and all I could think to stop it, to blast it away …” She pursed her lips, as if they might start trembling again. “A bit of goodness,” he finished for her. “A memory of light and goodness.” He didn’t have the words to convey his gratitude for it, for what it must have been like to offer up that memory of her mother against the demon that had destroyed her. Yrene seemed to read his thoughts, and said, “I am glad it was a memory of her that beat the darkness back a little further.”

Which is interesting when the last page of SF has the following: "A permanent marker of the beauty and GOOD he’d tried to bring into the world.", in reference to Elain's rose carving that Nesta places on her father's gravestone. The carving belonged to Elain, roses are somewhat symbolic of Elain and SJM chose to have it go on a bit of a journey in SF, first being placed near a figure of a goddess then at her father's resting place instead of having Nesta give it back to her. And Elain, based on canon, tends to remember things in her life with optimism (or with clarity) though it would have been very easy to focus on the negative:

She had looked at that cottage with hope; I had looked at it with nothing but hatred. And I knew which one of us had been stronger.

“You tell yourself there’s nothing that could have been done because it’s unbearable to think that you could have saved him, if you’d only deigned to show up a few minutes earlier.” “You think I’m to blame for his death?” Challenge filled each word. Challenge—from Elain, of all people. “No one but the King of Hybern is to blame for that.”

I've seen people comment on how Elain didn't seem to mourn for her father all that much which they found odd because she was supposed to love him the most but I think what's more likely is that she's choosing to remember the positive memories she had with him rather than dwelling on the sadness of his death.

Silba, the Goddess of Healing and Gentle Deaths also is symbolized by an owl 🦉

Elain perched silently

Elain blinked and blinked,

Elain cocked her head,

Elain shifted her face toward him. Another blink.

Blinking every now and then.

Very bird like mannerisms and this thought continues below.....

Rhys’s body strained with the effort of not going after them as they soared for a copse of trees far behind the battlefield. / I had Rhys move Elain to the farthest reaches of our camp. / Elain stepped out of a shadow behind him, and rammed Truth-Teller to the hilt through the back of the king’s neck as she snarled in his ear, “Don’t you touch my sister.”

Seriously, how did Elain get to the clearing where the King, Nesta and Cassian were? No one took her, there's zero chance anyone would have let her face him alone.

And how did she hear that they were in trouble in the first place? A vision is one thing but usually they're not so detailed but she knew the exact moment to arrive.

“I can hear your heartbeat—if I listen carefully. I can hear her heartbeat, too.”

“I can hear the sea. Even at night. Even in my dreams. The crashing sea—and the screams of a bird made of fire.”. It was an effort not to glance to Nesta. Even the town house was too far to hear anything from the nearby coast.

“Will I hear the earthworms writhing through the soil? Or the stretching of roots?

“I can hear your heart beating through the stone.”

“I can hear her—crying.”

Seers have visions but Elain hearing things seems something different to me.

Mercifully, Elain quietly approached me at breakfast

Elain was again at my side. I hadn’t heard her steps.

Nesta started, not having heard her sister approach. She scanned Elain from head to toe, wondering if she’d been taking lessons in stealth either from Azriel or the two half-wraiths she called friends.

Not only did Elain somehow make it to Nesta and Cassian in time all on her own, not only can she hear things (not just see) that others are unable to because of distance but she can also move with quiet and stealth. To me, the answer being, "yes! She must be training to be a spy!" seems too obvious since Nesta thought the exact same thing and that means there's then no mystery waiting to be revealed. It also doesn't account for the fact that Az tells us he's been avoiding Elain and Elain had been moving quietly since the novella, before she had ever given Az her present and they chatted that first Solstice.

She can hear things from a great distance beyond that which others can (which is not the same as Az's shadows whispering to him). She can move with stealth and quiet in a way that surprises people, she was able to travel a great distance in a short period of time in order to get to Nessian and she asked Amren about being able to choose a specific body.

I've seen a lot of theories based around these things as standalone scenarios.

The hearing things must be related to her being a Seer.

Her moving quietly must be because she's training to be a spy.

Her question to Amren must be because she wants to be human again.

The secret she's keeping must be that she's trying to work with Koschei.

She got to Nessian because she can winnow.

But put them together and you've got enhanced hearing, stealth movements, speed, and questions about choosing forms (as well as keeping these things a secret) and that all seems to make a more intriguing picture to me than claiming Elain is a spy who might betray her family and friends.

What I also love about these possibilities are they have nothing to do with Elain and any love interest. They are about Elain as an individual and what she might be capable of without any influence from anyone else.

[mrspettyferr]

Reason 1035235 Book 5 is Elriel and Book 6 is Vucien

With the way these books are being written, one stand alone after another with an overarching plot, then ACOSF would need to not only center on a romance, but set up the next one. They need to show progress in some form. And if we go back, the whole point of ACOFAS was to give a little fluff, but also to set up the next few books. (SJM herself said seeds were planted in ACOFAS for the spinoffs.)

Now, I actually want to dive into Lucien's romantic setup. So we're going to look at Lucien and Elain, and Lucien and Vassa.

FYI, this post will be very long, because I wanted to highlight most if not all of their the scenes.

For reference: Lucien and Elain, Lucien and Vassa

ACOFAS

Lucien and Elain

He hadn’t mentioned Elain, or his proximity to her. Elain had not asked him to stay, or to go. And whether she cared about the bruises on his face, she certainly hadn’t let on.

- -

Elain, at least, would be too polite to send Lucien away when he wanted to help. She was too polite to send him away on a normal day. She just ignored him or barely spoke to him until he got the hint and left. As far as I knew, he hadn’t come within touching distance since the aftermath of that final battle. No, she tended to her gardens here, silently mourning her lost human life. Mourning Graysen.

How Lucien withstood it, I didn’t know. Not that he’d shown any interest in bridging that gap between them.

- -

“You’re welcome to stay for the night,” I said, since Elain certainly wasn’t going to.

Lucien lowered his hands into his lap and leaned back in the armchair. “Thank you, but I have other plans.”

I prayed he didn’t catch the slightly relieved glimmer on Elain’s face.

- -

“She wants nothing to do with me.”

“Would you, if your positions were reversed?”

He didn’t answer.

- -

“Spend time with her.”

“I don’t think she’ll tolerate two minutes alone with me, so forget about two weeks.”

- -

“I can’t stand to be in the same room as her for more than two minutes."

- -

“He brought you a present.”

Those doe-brown eyes turned toward me. Sharper than I’d ever seen them. “And that entitles him to my time, my affections?”

“No.” I blinked. “But he is a good male.” Despite our harsh words. Despite this Band of Exiles bullshit. “He cares for you.”

“He doesn’t know me.”

“You don’t give him the chance to even try to do so.”

Her mouth tightened, the only sign of anger in her graceful countenance. “I don’t want a mate. I don’t want a male.”

- -

I handed Elain the small box with her name on it. Her smile faded as she opened it.

“Enchanted gloves,” she read from the card. “That won’t tear or become too sweaty while gardening.” She set aside the box without looking at it for longer than a moment. And I wondered if she preferred to have torn and sweaty hands, if the dirt and cuts were proof of her labor. Her joy.

Lucien and Vassa

But Vassa’s freedom would end. Lucien had said as much months ago, and still visited her often enough that I knew nothing in that regard had improved.

- -

“I’ve been at the Spring Court every now and then. But if I’m not here in Velaris, I’ve mostly been staying with Jurian. And Vassa.”

- -

"I think he’d have been crowned king by now if it wasn’t for Vassa.” A twitch of the lips, a spark in that russet eye. “She’s doing well enough. Savoring every second of her temporary freedom.”

- -

“You’d be surprised to see how the three of us get along.”

Friends, I realized. They had somehow become his friends.

“So you’d rather stay with them?”

“I’m not staying with them. The manor is ours.”

- -

“That’s what we call ourselves. The Band of Exiles.”

- -

From these scenes, we essentially know Elain and Lucien have not progressed AT ALL. Elain still mourns Graysen, she wants nothing to do with Lucien, avoids him and is obviously uncomfortable around him.

Lucien on the flip side, isn't really trying to bridge that gap, but he's still hanging on and has some mate instincts regarding Graysen. He's not lost hope for her, but he's not really trying to push too hard either. (IMO out of respect, but also because of lack of interest beyond the bond.)

Conclusion: They're not being set up at this point. They haven't progressed, and his feelings technically aren't really genuine because it's not ELAIN he's interested in. It's his MATE. (Note, not his fault. Not blaming him for this. Just pointing out this is a more superficial "relationship" because its not based on an actual relationship, but a bond that neither chose for themselves.)

Lucien and Vassa on the other hand have made progress. They started off allies in war and are now friends. He's spent a lot of time with her, he's now living with her (and Jurian), and they have a name for themselves. He feels comfortable in the human lands with her and Jurian, unlike in the Night Court. (This is very important for Lucien's journey and I'll talk more about it in a second.)

Conclusion: Lucien and Vassa's relationship HAS progressed. It's moving forward, whereas Elain and Lucien are still stagnant. Friendship is a stepping stone in all of SJM's romances, so we can expect whoever Lucien ends up with, it will start with friendship. And at this point, Vassa is his friend, not Elain.

Now let's move onto ACOSF, because this is where SJM could turn things around, right? This is where she has to really start steering the ships in the right direction because the next books will focus on these relationships.

ACOSF

Lucien and Elain

There had been some tightness in Elain’s face as she’d said it. Normally when she made such excuses, Lucien was around, but the male remained in the human lands with Jurian and Vassa.

- -

“Why are you here?” Cassian asked, unable to help the sharpness. “Where’s Elain?”

“I am not always in this city to see my mate.” The last two words dripped with discomfort.

- -

Her brown eyes were wary. Usually, that look was reserved for Lucien.

- -

Elain, the wretch, had taken the seat between Feyre and Varian, about as far from Lucien as she could get.

- -

He and Lucien did not exchange gifts, though the male had brought a gift for Feyre and one for his mate, who barely thanked him after opening the pearl earrings.

Cassian’s heart strained at the pain etching deep into Lucien’s face as he tried to hide his disappointment and longing. Elain only shrank further into herself, no trace of that newfound boldness to be seen.

Lucien and Vassa

“Lucien can’t be entirely trusted anymore.”

Cassian started. “What?”

“Even with Elain here, he’s become close with Jurian and Vassa. He’s voluntarily living with them these days, and not just as an emissary. As their friend.”

- -

"So Lucien can’t be unbiased in reporting to us on Vassa.”

- -

Mor winnowed Cassian after sundown directly to the manor that had become home and headquarters to Jurian, Vassa, and—apparently—Lucien.

- -

Vassa rolled her eyes, then looked to Lucien, who sank onto the sofa beside Jurian. Like the Fae male had settled similar arguments between them.

- -

Both Jurian and Lucien stared at her, the former’s face utterly unreadable, and the latter’s pained.

- -

Vassa nodded. “It is all I have gleaned from my time enslaved to him.”

Lucien stared out the window—as if he could see the lake across a sea and a continent. As if he were setting his target.

- -

“And Jurian and Vassa?”

“At each other’s throats, as they like to be,” he said, a tad sharply. She wondered what that was about—and for the life of her couldn’t read it.

- -

Elain and Lucien have still remained stagnant. Elain is even more uncomfortable--she sits as far away as she can, unlike in ACOFAS where she at least sat within talking distance--and she literally shrinks inward and loses her newfound boldness around him.

While Lucien showed disappointment and longing on Solstice, he's now showing actual discomfort, just like Elain. He's spending most of his time away, with Jurian and Vassa, and still isn't doing much to bridge the gap.

These two have, imo, sank further. They didn't just remain stagnant, they kinda backtracked even more. Why? Because at this point, we know Elain has seemingly gotten over Graysen and developed feelings for Azriel, and I think Lucien is developing them for Vassa.

We see a potential spark of jealousy regarding Jurian and Vassa. The manor isn't just theirs now--it's home for Lucien. (Something he was struggling with in ACOFAS, feeling like he had nowhere to go, no place to call home. Again, this is progress in their relationship but also in Lucien's journey. Remember, that's important.) It's pointed out that not only is Lucien voluntarily living with her, but he's so close with her that the Night Court doesn't think they can fully trust him to be unbiased on Vassa. Like he can't do his actual job because of her, and his relationship with her.

All of this is more progress on their relationship, emphasizing they've grown closer, he now has a home (with her and Jurian), and he's setting his target on Koschei, knowing she will have to return to him - THAT is all set up for his romance.

In conclusion, without even needing to dive into Azriel and Elain's progress over the series and obvious setup, we can see Lucien's journey has progressed with Vassa - his romantic setup is with Vassa. Not Elain.

And I didn't even go into the Swan Lake/Koschei parallels. But I'll just leave the post with this:

A bird of flame...and a lord of fire. I wondered if they’d found each other yet.

[miru5llec]

One of the things that rub me the WRONG way is when people say that Elain is BoRiNG on Twitter and Tik Tok. Like????? Listen to what I have to say. And I’m sorry in advance for how long this post is.

After Nesta deals with the mortal queens, the only bad guy left is Koschei. I don’t think that Koschei is going to have a big role in this book, he’s probably gonna have some mentions throughout the story and help the mortal queens when necessary given the fact that he most probably is the “dangerous new alliance”. Why do I think Koschei is not going to be part of Nesta’s story? Because she has nothing to do with him, nothing has been teased or forshadowed in the books and she would not be able to kill him given the fact that he can’t die and she doesn’t know where the chest containing his mortality is.

Which leads me to Elain who is THE ONLY one who has a connection with him, aside from the mortal queens and Vassa. In ACOWAR, she has a vision about an onyx chest. According to legend, Koschei’s mortality is contained in a needle that’s placed somewhere highly inconvenient and very far. But, finding and breaking it is the only way to destroy him. It’s hidden in an egg, inside a duck, inside a hare that's inside an onyx chest; the chest is buried under the roots of an oak tree, which grows on an island at an undisclosed location in the middle of the ocean-sea.

If Koschei can’t die, why should he be afraid of Nesta or the IC? He has literally no reason at all. BUT there comes Elain who has the slighthest idea of where his mortality might be. It’s only logical that Koschei will be at least a little threatend by that. My theory is that when Koschei will find out that Elain is a seer, he’s going to start manipulating her. Like an Aleksander Morozova/Alina Starkov kind of situation. Imagine him being constantly in Elain’s mind, trying to make her leave her family behind and join him. And that’s why I believe that something very bad happened to Elain while she was in the Cauldron.

I also do think that Koschei is to blame for seers being so rare. Imagine if they weren’t and 6 out of 10 seers would have had visions about the place where that chest is burried, he would stand no chance. I mean what chances do you have against someone who, if trained accordingly, knows every step you’re going to take, who thinks ahead of you and takes in consideration every foreseeable future. Let me answer it for you. None. Seers can literally change the future and mold it to their wishes. But Elain is BoRiNg, right?

And also, don’t you ever wonder about what exactly the mortal queens will give Koschei to have him on their side? He is going to give them his protection and alliance for what? It can’t be for free and surely not cheap. A SEER would make some kind of sense, I mean they are a rarity. But I don’t think the mortal queens know about Elain being a seer, but maybe Koschei will find out? I mean he kinda is one of the most if not the strongest warlock to exist in the ACOTAR world.

And now let me tell you why Elain and Azriel will most probably end up together. So let’s say that Elain figures out where the box is located, she will need at least a little bit of help. Who will give her his constant suport? Azriel. Who will most probably train Elain in combat? Azriel. Elain will go to the mortal lands so she could meet with Vassa and question her about Koschei. Who will be with her every step of the way? Azriel. Who will sail with her to the Faerie Realms so they could kill the Death God? Azriel. And probably Lucien too, though I doubt it. Who will train Elain to be a spy so they could gather information about Koschei? Azriel. It just makes sense. I’m not going to give you whole speech on why elriel will most likely happen when you have amaizing people who already explained it, but you got the idea. And more importantly, if Elain and Azriel will truly leave Prythian, we would have the chance to see how the Faerie Realms actually are.

A lot of people started shipping Emerie and Azriel (and I’m not saying you’re wrong, you can ship whatever you want), but if we put these two together, what would they add to the plot? Nothing. Let’s say that Azriel and Emerie (even though she has nothing to do with Koschei) decide to track Koschei down and they find him, how would they find the box, or what is in it? They would need the help of a certain seer 👀 Like I said, I don’t think that Emerie and Azriel will add anything to the plot and their story would end in like 200 pages. ACOSF will take place in Ilyria and it’s unlikely that the next book will also take place there.

Let’s talk a little bit about Elain and Lucien too. I still do think that there is a posibility that they will end up together, I mean we don’t know what cards SJM will pull at the end. And again, like I said above with Emerie and Azriel, they would add nothing to the plot. Feel free to disagree with me, I don’t mind, but I believe they would be boring, sorry not sorry. Give me Lucien x Vassa, give me Lucien learning about his true father, let me see him going to the autumn court to wreak havoc, give me him talking and clarifying things with Eris, give me Eris justifying his actions, give me Lucien talking about Jesminda, give me Vassa being the Queen of the mortal lands, give me Vassa and Lucien fighting Beron alongside eachother, give me Helion being a true father and helping his son, give me the story of Lucien’s mother and Helion, give me Lucien, Vassa and Jurian being a comedic trio, give me their stories. There’s so many things Sarah could do with Lucien that doesn’t involve his mating bond with Elain.

Sometimes I come across people, especially on Tik Tok, who want Elain to die, but Lucien would suffer so let’s keep her alive for now. Can’t you see how messed up that is? Like Elain is an object with no feelings and her only purpose in the future books is to accept the mating bond. She can say no. She can reject the mating bond and she can continue ingnoring Lucien if she wants to. A lot of people don’t realize that when the mating bond snapped into place, it was in one of the most traumatic experiences of Elain’s life. She has every right to deal with this in her own ways. Do I think that her ignoring Lucien till the end of times will be any good for them? No. She will have to face him one day, and that day will be when she wants it to be or when Lucien had enough of staying on the side lines and thinks that it’s finally time to face her.

I have to laugh every time when people ignore the fact that in one of the 2018 interviews, SJM said that during her pregnancy she started gardening and shifting to Elain’s mind and how she is going to have visions about ivory strangling her in her sleep (and a very interesting thing that ties ivory to my Koschei theory is that ivory does grow on oak trees 👀) And also it wouldn’t make sense for her to write Feyre and Nesta’s story and then skip to another character. And at the end of ACOSF we will have Azriel’s POV so... I think that confirmed elriel at least a little bit. But again, we don’t know what Nesta’s book will bring us.

Elain is BoRiNg! We don’t know anything that goes in Elain’s mind or how things are from Elain’s perspective. I think that Elain tries to repulse every negative emotion, especially anger. I think that Elain is hiding behind a very well constructed mask and at some point that mask is going to break and she’s going to snap. Remember when Elain whispered that she hopes they all burn in hell (they being the mortal queens), I think that we got to see a little bit of who Elain Archeron truly is. When she hit those hounds with her feet and when she stabbed the King of Hybern in the neck, it’s not out of character. That is the true Elain. Don’t you ever think that maybe Elain wants people to underestimate her, to think of her as weak so she can have the upper hand in any situation? GOD for all we know Elain could be growing poison in her garden. Anything it’s possible. But for sure she’s not as dumb and naive as Feyre’s perspective makes her out to be.

But the most fascinating thing to me is Elain’s powers, a seer’s powers in general because there’s so much you can do with the ability of seeing the future. Imagine her fighting after she masters her powers: her dodging every arrow, every sword blow because she already knows when and where they are going to hit, her knowing where and how to strike her opponents harder. Her powers can go in so many directions. I can’t wait to see her journey going from being only Feyre and Nesta’s sister to a badass seer spy. But yeah sure don’t buy her book after ACOSF because for sure it will be BoRiNg!

But before we get to her book, Nesta’s story will come out in 2 months and, for sure, her journey will make us want more of the ACOTAR universe. Can’t wait for ACOSF.

[helion-ism]

I don't know why but I feel that if Elucien is going to happen it will be Elain who will take the first step, I don't know how she will find out her feelings but I would love to read her jealous of him and trying to get his attention to her after feeling jealousy. I think about it because Lucien will hardly try to get close to her because he feels rejected and while he wants to be close he doesn't want to upset her and doesn't want to get hurt. Or they're going to be put together to do something together but Lucien's going to be all apprehensive, like not wanting to get too close so he doesn't bother or something. How do you think the dynamics between them will be?

I have thoughts.

I need it, for health reasons, to be elain. lucien has already shown over and over again that he cares and wishes to get to know her better. in acosf, he said to cassian that he’s not always in velaris for elain. in fact, his exact words were: 

“I am not always in this city to see my mate.” The last two words dripped with discomfort.

the fact that he is still calling her his mate, the last two words uttered uncomfortably because he is still not recognising him as such, and it hurts. yeah, I’m fine, I’m fine. lucien is still giving her presents for solstice, who knows, maybe he’s also left something for her on her birthdays? my point is, even in acosf he is still looking at her with longing. so I think it is pretty safe to say lucien still is very interested in the girl. but that’s why I need elain to make the first move. he has shown interest again and again, which she has recoiled from. I think it would make more sense for elain to go through some sort of change, to witness something happen, and then really see lucien. but the question is, what does it take?

the jealousy trope is just *chef’s kiss*. yes, I’m obsessed with it and if that is the case, I will be so very happy. though I think that could only work if elain gets to know lucien a little bit better first. elain is reluctant to approach lucien at the moment, who knows what’s going in her life, but she doesn’t know him, which is why I think it’s unlikely she could get jealous easily. 

you said: I think about it because Lucien will hardly try to get close to her because he feels rejected and while he wants to be close he doesn't want to upset her and doesn't want to get hurt.

and that’s exactly it!!! lucien has been feeling rejected for like two years now, I feel like he’d think he is hallucinating when elain finally makes the first move. I’m here for it. and she has to because he doesn’t want to upset and hurt her, she is the one who has to set some boundaries, otherwise things can’t possibly move forward.

I think it is likely that something will happen that either forces them to be together or that puts them together out of convenience? in my brain, the most logical reason would be elain going to the day court to learn more about her seer abilities. lucien happens to be there, too, because he is still trying to find something to help vassa and helion offered him (or maybe feyre and rhys who told him about it) that he could use the day court libraries. well, elain and lucien would eventually run into each other and without influences from the night court, who knows how fast their relationship would develop? :) 

and about the dynamic ... oh, it’s gonna be so good. once elain gets past her shyness, there will be banter. I hope there will be a push and pull and flirting and also blushing and nervousness and lucien being sassy and elain snapping and then laughing about it. lucien making inappropriate jokes and elain thinks she hates it at first but when she’s back at the night court, she finds she’s missing all that, she’s missing him. ugh. maybe. I don’t know. sjm will probably come up with something entirely different, but anything elucien I will love. there’s also the possibility elain would for some reason go to the band of exiles, but I’m not sure if I like the tension that would undoubtedly arise with graysen there, too. or autumn court drama. who knowsssss

[kimsnnn]

Part 2

Disclaimer: This post is in favor of my ship, Elriel. No hate, just an opinion. This is what makes sense to me. If this isn't your cup of tea, and it came up on your feed, no worries just skip please. 

With all this in mind Elriel to me just seems so clear.

The enemy is Koschei and Vassa is the only one to be directly linked to and affected by him so she will be the one to defeat him, plan and give us insight from the inside because she is the one who is captive. She has a personal interest in defeating him and that victory and moment is rightfully hers to own.

She will get a book. Her being a firebird means nothing? why would people assume she won't have a conscious while in that form when Rhys, Tamlin and Helion do?  Why do people believe that a story cant be developed and moved along as a firebird? Has any one ever read a werewolf book? Im soooo confused. I mean why is that a end all? Even as a firebird she can see and reveal so much, and as a person even more.

The main original characters that have a direct link to Feyre from the very beginning before Hybern, Amarantha, and ACOWAR are Nesta, Elain and Lucien. Those are the characters that make the most sense to have their own book. Not Tamlin who is of no importance to Feyre anymore. Who is of importance and who where her first family Lucien basically becoming her first brother. She is always concerned for these people. If you take a look at all of Feyre’s POV in ACOFAS its always showcasing her concern or confusion for  Her sisters, Lucien and even Mor (possible novella).  These three individuals (N&E&L) are the ones she has an original relationship with and the most history, a shaky relationship that has room to be improved on. These are the wildcards, the ones who have wronged her in some way, the ones who’s stories NEED to be told. Three different people three different stories.

If you also take a look at Rhys’ POV in order, you realize he talks to or refers to 5 people usually:

Cassian, Azriel, Mor, Tamlin & Lucien

Each of these first 5 POV also directly touches on what issues exactly are pertaining to them or could be pertaining to them if that had their own book OR how they may contribute to the whole over arching plot.

If we conclude everything from those first 5 chapters ( I'm not including the rest because its too much, and they also include these 5 characters regardless) of importance this is what we have and what each book may touch on.

1st POV: involves

-Cassian - Illyrian dissent, inequality, Nesta, queen Braiylln, training female Illyrians,

-Cassian’s role

2nd POV: involves

-Azriel-shadows/powers strength, Az’s past, confusion on shadowsinger abilities, Illyrian dissent/hate, Human queens, Hyberns people, Human lands, Vassa’s situation,

-Az’z emotions (& concealing of emotions) on : Lucien, Elain, Possibly Az’s mom and her whereabouts (Rosehall).

3rd POV:

-Tamlin/Lucien-SC and Tamlin current state and down fall, alliance with Tamlin, peace/future, Lucien’s and Tamlin’s relationship, Anger/Hate/Remorse/Defeat/Hope/Empty, Feyre

-Feyre-Tamlin, Rhys’ actions and remorse

-Jeweler(Neve)-no jewels for Feyre, Neve’s background

4th POV:

-Velaris estates along the Sidra before and after hybern,

-Mor: Rhys and mor’s relationship currently, Kier/Eris/CoN

-The CoN people occupied the Velaris estates (they left Hewn City before the division of the NC)

-Kiers upcoming visit to Velaris in Spring (the hewn city’s containment and curiosity)

-Mor’s Mother/ desire to leave the NC

-Mor’s Role

Rhys’ 1st POV which included Cassian and Cassian’s following POV/Chapter was a foreshadow to ACOSF completely. Everything touched was basically addressed in ACOSF.  Rhys basically told Mor and Cassian to assume different jobs and roles (to lessen Azriel’s world load) in their chapters which came true in ACOSF.

A bond between Elain and Lucien does not mean they will have a book. If I'm honest they remind me a little of Nesyrn and Chaol who seemed like with time something could blossom between them but in reality just weren't for one another and were better off as friends. All that connects these two is an unwanted bond, a person they both have wronged yet care about (Feyre) and an incident that resulted in Elain’s trauma. Everyone thought Elain who is literally everything to Nesta, who Nesta would have sacrificed everything for, would be more involved, yet she wasn't even present in the majority of Nesta’s book, at least not as present as we thought she would be. But she was mentioned throughout ACOSF nearly in every chapter because Elain does and has impacted Nesta’s life completely.This is something I expect to happen for Elain’s book as well. Yes Lucien will appear but perhaps the purpose of his appearance would be to get closure and fill in questions left unanswered. If ACOTAR 5 is an Elriel book and not ACOTAR 6 then her book will also serve to set up for his book with Vassa.

Feyre’s relationship with the IC is fine and any issues can be resolved in the books of the others (like for example as Love interests) or in a novella.

Cassian had a POV, the second main role in ACOSF but.. ACOSF was Nesta’s story.

The same can be said for Elriel’s book as well as Vassien’s.

And yes a male can have a book like Chaol did but in my opinion it won't be Az with Gwyn being the second main POV. It will be Lucien with Vassa who has far more ties to the IC and to the over arching plot. Vassa at least has met Feyre the main character of the whole ACOTAR world.

Hypothetically speaking lets say Az does get a book and ends up with Gwyn and the plot is about the Illyrian camp. Their story would most likely be written as a novella if anything not an actual book, there is not many ties that Gwyn has so far to the whole plot at least not yet. But getting a novella still wouldn't make sense when we have characters, who are not only closer to the plot but also provide an opportunity to get info/support to win this war, like Mor who is spending time in Vallahan, and Tamlin who’s literal court is not only in shambles but unfortunately detrimental to the success of attaining peace.

I do think Gwyn is more important to this plot then most give her credit for but I dont believe that necessarily means shes due a book or a main POV especially over Vassa. And Emerie.

Vassa who has direct link to koschei the main issue, point and villain of the plot and Emerie who has a direct link to Illyria and its backward ways in everything most importantly on its stance of women and their roles.

SJM Set Elriel to be endgame because it just makes the most sense. Not only because of their connection, moments and relationship thus far but because that's what makes the most sense with this plot. There’s no spinoff in the works.

There’s no reason for Gwyn or ANYONE for that matter to be the one to defeat koschei over Vassa, no reason to have the hugest wedge between Elucien while building a bridge for Elriel, no reason to build and hint for Mor’s leave and put emphasis on Tamlin & the SC’s dire situation.

Has anyone considered if Lucien wants to even be HL ?

Lucien’s future as a highlord comes down to if he even wants to even become the Day Court’s High lord in the first place.

Lucien thought less of humans and was indifferent to them in ACOTAR yet now has found a home and friends among them. ‘

Truthfully the BOE’s work in the same way that the IC does and the Valkyerie.

Actually scratch that the Valkyerie work exactly like the BOE’s.

Yet can anyone imagine any of the Valkyrie leaving their group or be far from each other especially if one of their member’s is their possible love interest ?

They will choose each other and they will create a future where they are all together.

I don’t see lucien who has finally found stability and friends leaving the BOE’s to play high lord at Day court unless Vassa and Jurian decide to leave with him. Which seems unlikely. The only way I see that happening is if vassien truly becomes endgame resulting in Vassa going to Day court. But where does that leave Jurian.

I believe that after the Beron and AC issues are resolved, that Eris will ascend and become HL, Lady Autumn will leave to be FINALLY with Helion to be Lady Day 😍, and Lucien can enjoy his life in the mean time with his found family, stay as an emissary and possibly prepare to be Day’s HL down the line in the future.

[bookofmirth]

Can you please elaborate why it is considered problematic that SJM wrote that elain is uncomfortable around lucien? You mentioned in a previous response that it was not a good move for her to write elain being uncomfortable by a disabled POC but I’m not quite sure why that is a problem because she is not uncomfortable because of his disability or race- her discomfort has nothing to do with that.

Also, racism is not an issue in prythian the way it is in real life. You have high lords such as helion and tarquin (among others) that are explicitly POC and there has never been mention of any hostility towards them because of the color of their skin. The only discrimination I can recall is between high and lesser fae which is classist not racist.

I’m just confused why it is considered ableist or racist when SJM decided to write how elain is uncomfortable around lucien when it has nothing to do with his skin color or disability.

On another note- would it have been racist if amarantha (a known rapist) was written as a WOC rather than white? I’m just trying to understand your point of view and I’m a little lost. To me, acotar is a diverse world with characters of all races and some are good, some are evil but pretty much every character has done something morally grey at at least one point in the series. And none of that is not specific to one race vs another. There are white characters that are good, morally grey and downright evil. And the same can be said for other races.

I appreciate any further elaboration you can supply!

Hello! I will try my best. I don't mind answering questions like this! I recognize that I have had a lot of education about these topics and I have learned A Lot from Black women on Twitter over the years. I hope to share it in a way that is useful. I can maybe make a reading list if anyone is interested, but people should definitely ask around so that it's not getting filtered through just one person (aka me).

So the whole thing with talking about race in the fandom is that race does not function the same way in the acotar world as it does in ours. You are correct about that. You may have seen my post that attempted to break down various ways that characters access privilege in Prythian? Either way, yes. It is not a one-to-one correspondence with our world and the book world.

However, there are issues within the acotar world that mirror issues in ours, and the way that fans engage with those issues can reveal underlying prejudices. I mentioned in this post that we don't have to intend to do these things. (Also, intent versus impact is like diversity, inclusivity, and equity training 101. It's one of the first, and most important things you will learn. Even if you didn't mean to harm someone, they still feel hurt, and it's important to acknowledge that.)

The issue with the way people talk about Lucien - and I mentioned in another post that this is perhaps just as much on Sarah for creating this scenario as it is on the fandom for hopping on that horse and riding - is that there is a history of white women being painted as the victims of Black men specifically.

I'm going to put the rest of this under the cut because I want to show you some examples.

I hope that I don't have to explain why this is disgusting. There is a real-life example of this ^^^ if you google Emmett Till and read his story. This is by far not the only example of a white woman claiming that a Black man (or boy, in his case) was harassing her in some way, and often, that has resulted in lynching.

These are clearly older examples, and also really good examples of how people of color can be dehumanized, but these problems persist. The methods are just more subtle. More recently, it could result in police brutality. When that women called the police on a Black man in NYC last summer, it played into the long history of a woman claiming that she was being threatened or victimized by a Black man. As @gimme-mor explained in her post, the concept of white womanhood is often used as a way to uphold racism and white supremacy because it shows people of color as being violent threats, giving white men (and white women) a reason to retain their privilege.

You're probably wondering now what the fuckity fuck this has to do with Acotar and Lucien. I am getting there!

Because of this historical context, there are many slurs and stereotypes used against POC that on the surface, seem innocent. However, they have a deep, dark history of oppression and violence. It's not about the "one time" that someone said one racist thing, but generational trauma. I can't speak to what this is like as a lived experience, and so I would really appreciate anyone who does want to add on!!!

For example, just to take us away from acotar for a minute, there is a problematic, sexist and often racist trope in which characters get fridged. This is a term used to refer to the way that women, women of color, or characters of color (this could include queer and disabled people as well) are killed off to further a white person's story. This happens SO OFTEN. Nehemia was killed in ToG to motivate Aelin. Sorscha was killed in HoF to hurt Dorian. In a multitude of super hero and action movies, the wife or girlfriend of the main character is killed off in order to provide either pain or motivation to the white male hero.

Individually, these events are whatever. Taken as a whole, though... it shows a trend that the girlfriend of the hero is disposable. It shows that people who are not white, straight, able-bodied males are worthless, and only function to further someone else’s plot.

So that's what is sort-of happening here. After a long, long history of white women positioning themselves (or being positioned) as the innocent victims of brutish, violent, barely-even-human men of color, there are some disturbing parallels when people try to say that Elain is a shrinking violet next to Lucien's insistent attentions.

The context is everything. It's not about this one event, but that there is a history in the real world of this trope playing out over and over, and it has even been an explicit tactic used to perpetuate white supremacy.

This context influences the way that we interact with one another in fandom. The point of that post was not to critique the acotar series itself, but to expose some problematic aspects of the fandom.

I am not going to speak for anyone else, but I think that the original intent of pointing out this parallel between Elain/Lucien and white feminism was not that we want people to stop saying that Elain feels this, or Elain feels that, or Lucien is doing this or that, etc. The reason why this has been mentioned in the past is because there are some very uncomfortable, violent historical precedents set, and while people may not realize that those exist, they may be unintentionally furthering that stereotype.

There were many, many other points made in that post that I think bear repeating and further attention. I hope that this made sense. It's hard to condense literal centuries of racism like this, and of course I am only talking about the context in the U.S. I'm sure it's different elsewhere.

The main takeaway from that post, though, is that it wasn't about the world itself. It was about the way that the fandom engages with the world, and how they utilize some problematic tools to do so. Critiquing the world itself is a completely different issue, which... I will sorta touch on now!

One last point, since you brought up Amarantha and the potential of her being a WOC and a rapist - it could be viewed as problematic and racist, due to the oversexualization of Black women in particular (again, the context throughout history supports this). However, that would not be a fandom problem! That would be an sjm problem.

BTW - I do have serious problems with the way that Illyrians are portrayed in acotar, again because of the history of POC being portrayed as uncivilized, brutish, violent, and... that word that means someone isn't religious. I am getting tired and forgot the word. When sjm says that Illyrians are that way, and when she emphasizes the fact that they are a race... yikes. It's not racist of us to point that out, but it was highly questionable that she created them to be that way in the first place.

Let me know if any of this doesn't make sense, please! To anyone reading this to the end, first off RIP! But also let me know if I've gotten something wrong or if you see something differently.