#my therapist and I are pretty agreed that it is while the psychologist just isn't quite certain

[eurazba]

Not beating the ADHD allegations to anyone except, apparently the one fucking person who can actually diagnose me

[prince-liest]

I feel like this is a risky question but if you don’t want to answer you know what to do. Reading 666 I questioned so many things on love and relationships that I’d already started to question before, but not to such extent. Inevitably this led to a talk with my psychologist (you know how people joke “my therapist will hear about you” well yeah that happened) and asked her what’s the difference between romantic and platonic love if we exclude social expectations. To this she replied it’s sexual chemistry you can have with more than one person, and nothing more. Beside that, it’s technically still just “platonic”. The more I think about it the more sense it makes. In which case, I wanna ask if you agree as an aroace, and in the terms of 666 does that technically mean Alastor loves Vox in that sense? I think you’ve said before he wouldn’t go as far with anyone else, so I guess I’m asking you if he feels genuine sexual chemistry with him, because I do have a hard time figuring that out while reading (unreliable narrator is my enemy) and most of the time I’m even more confused than Vox is on how much Alastor is enjoying anything sex related

I have a couple of things to say about this one, haha. It was interesting to think about, and I'm admittedly more delighted than I should be that I've made it into someone's therapy session, hahaha.

Firstly, I disagree with your psych about how to define romantic love and I think the same would go for a ton of people both aro and allo. "Friends with benefits" is a known concept that is different from "romantic partner" for a reason, and I don't think we'd have so many "we started out friends with benefits but, oh no, we caught feelings down the line, how unexpected!" romance plotlines if friends with benefits was the same thing as a romance apart from social expectations. Also, this way of describing non-platonic love makes it impossible for non-aro ace people to love romantically purely by definition, and I think many non-aro ace folks would disagree with that.

Secondly, Alastor isn't sexually attracted to Vox in 666 regardless. He enjoys the things they do, which is very different. Not to get too clinical about it, but he doesn't even tend to experience sexual arousal unless they're getting up to the very specific type of acts that he's personally into, which is why every time Alastor is taking on the dominant role his internal narration is pretty much just going on about wanting to eat Vox whole - it's entirely a non-sexual sadism thing for him, even if Vox is still getting off. It's possible to enjoy sexual activities for reasons other than sexual gratification, and that's about 80% of what Alastor gets out of their encounters.

If you want to see what it looks like when I write from the POV of a character who is sexually attracted to their partner as a point of comparison, I recommend reading How to Bag an Angel: Take That, Depression! and then contrasting that to Alastor's internal narrative in the 666 chapter where he fucks Vox. But as a straight answer, I write Alastor as a character who sometimes gets off on being forced into submission/humiliation, and not really all that much else.

I think defining romantic vs platonic feelings can be very personal, and both psychologists and philosophers have been trying to do it for ages, so it's something that you kind of have to define for yourself - but that's my view on it as pertains to this fic, at least! I hope that was helpful!

[sasukimimochi]

i wanna ramble about my view on JC but i'm so bad at words

so like, i see posts where people talk about these things JC does or WWX holds back from, i don't wanna go searching but also want to leave these details out cuz i don't want to accidentally call people out cuz that is not my intention (not that i have the audience to do something like that) so i'm just gonna go from my memory and kinda summarize what i think abt him...

gonna add a read more line bc this gets long!

Uh, btw please no hostility i'm not trying to start arguments, these are just my thoughts i really wanted to get out there. i'm definitely no therapist or psychologist so take this with a grain of salt, this is the view of just an average reader who retains a lot of info [tho still manages to miss details at times]. Anyway if you have info you think i should have addressed, reply and i'll make additions if i agree/want to expand on the info presented to me!

So, WWX and JC have a weird thing going on, it's not exactly brothers but they definitely wanted that, the reason why i say they aren't solidly brothers is because i'm pretty sure Madam Yu has influenced JC from the start of his arrival which is why he doesn't call wwx a-xian or Wei Ying or A-Ying- Why he doesn't allow himself to let loose properly around anyone even in private, why he constantly scolds wwx, etc. i believe firmly he's been quite influenced by his parents due to him being the next sect heir and the pressure that comes from it, as well as what he feels like madam yu is correct on- wwx is uncle jiang's favorite.

Madam Yu still chides Yanli for doing domestic acts for WWX but not on the same level as JC, who is constantly under pressure by her to be the perfect heir to the sect. She wants him to be better than WWX, which of course affects all of the family but Yanli gets left out of the fire a bit, which i think is what gives her such a strength to do these supportive acts for the brothers [and why she's also both the brother's favorite. She's basically the mom they wish for. Supportive, understanding, and helps mediate them]. Though this is a burden she has to bear, it's not that big of a burden to her because she loves the two so much.

Jiang Fengmian... i might be spelling his name wrong, so i'll call him Uncle Jiang cuz it will be faster for me to type with no mistakes haha. Anyway, I have complicated feelings about him.

At first i thought he was great and did no wrong, but that was on my first pass and when i had just watched the donghua only. My opinion of him since i read the novel isn't bad, but it's not super good. He's in a complicated position! There's only so much he can do about his wife, they argue super often and while its not usually crazy loud, it's pretty intense. [also, i'm not sure if separation is really a thing that happened back then, i think that's really a modern thing.] I feel like we're likely seeing Uncle Jiang's will to fight dimmed down by the wear of time.

Consider: you have a family member who won't ever listen to what you say, regardless how sound your argument is- you can be completely in the right and have all the facts, but no matter how long you press on, the result never changes. Do you put in the same amount of effort for the rest of your life? No! You understand that no matter how much you argue that their answer will remain the same. I personally have a family member like this, and while i defend myself regularly, it does not go anywhere. That is the nature of some people, no matter what they may not treat your view with the respect it deserves.

anyway back to the main line here, i dont think wwx is wrong about what he said regarding JF to JC. "he's just hard on you cuz you're going to be sect leader" or whatever it was along those lines- WWX does not seem like the type to lie to make someone feel better and i think this is why JC appreciates that conversation so much (besides the heartfelt twin prides which is obviously something that stuck to him for a long time). And i agree, JF is definitely trying to prepare Jiang Cheng for his position as sect leader one day.

do i think Uncle Jiang is completely guilt free of favoritism? No absolutely not, he canonically holds wwx more as a child, which i think is hard to argue against- but i do think the context of that is missed in part by most. WWX may have been a bright kid with sun shining out his ass but he was also a scared kid that just got rescued off the streets after his parents never came home. A kid that was fighting for food from dogs and likely starving and scared because he was on the street for like 5 years [if i remember it was from age 4 to 9 in the novel]. Of course he got held a bit more- i can't imagine he would be completely unphased immediately upon arrival, at least with his Uncle Jiang who was totally willing to provide him comfort- which wwx probably desperately missed from his now dead parents. We know canonically that the memory of those parents, however small, is unreplaceable and dear to wwx- but having JF treat him dearly is truly a balm to what has happened to him.

I'm not gonna say JC didn't go through things that made him cry and want to be held, in fact if WWX came into the house and suddenly got a lot of attention, it's going to feel pretty shitty for JC! Of course this combined with abruptly losing his privacy and puppies was what initially had him pushing the other away, but as you could see, after WY breaks his leg after running off and they make up, they get really close and despite this looming responsibility and family troubles, the two are very bonded. imo making them look like 6 year olds in the donghua is an injustice to their relationship, because 9 year olds tend tend to have more emotional intelligence (?) at that age. I'm not sure how to phrase that, but basically making them look younger and act like giggling children took away from the scene a bit for me lol. Jc is old enough to realize he doesn't dislike wwx! This isn't a child quickly getting over his anger, he's young here yes, but he's decided in this moment that he cares about this new member of the family, despite being called the son of a servant. [which yes madam yu is once again influencing his view of this segregation but i think he is much better at ignoring this particular in his youth]

I am rambling more than i thought i would lmao- i have a lot of feelings about their relationship and i think it's skipped over so much

um, i'm not sure which direction i was going in before i went onto the parents. Let's skip forward.

lotus pier fell and not only did JC see wwx get humiliated and whipped and nearly disfigured, his mother who he was about to lose blamed wwx for so much. When you lose a family member you have an attachment to, whether it bad or good, this influences your thoughts about them and with no way to resolve said thoughts. i find this hard to explain, so i'm just going to hope you understand what i'm referring to here. Especially in ancient china though, i believe it's a big thing to hold such a high regard for your parents, but especially if they have passed? i can't say this is fact but i believe that is the case i just am sticking to my memory here. So these things in combination with Trauma, i believe starts this heavy, negative emotion in JC that is hard to unstick.

JC and WWX may get into a one-sided scuffle but soon after they cry together like children. They just experienced hundreds of lives lost- people they grew up with and trained with and cared for as well as the people who provided and cared for them- their family was unstable, but still was a family and support system- now they had only two people and one of them was far away, the one that was typically their pillar. I feel like a lot of people hold JC to an impossible standard in his situation- having a bad day and taking it out on someone is one thing, going through a traumatic massacre i think allows someone to get a bit unreasonable [though of course nearly choking him was quite far, remember, he's extremely unstable emotionally at this point].

"WWX didn't do that though!" of course not. WWX is a different person with a different personality, is older (though i don't know by how much), and is extremely resilient, but he does process his trauma just differently. As you see over and over in the novel, wwx goes through many things others wouldn't dream of, but he starts acting differently even before the golden core removal, not only after. He's going through the same things, but i'm pretty sure no one reacts to trauma the same way to the T. JC's just happens to be misplaced anger, which is probably way too simple a way to put it, but anyway...wwx also gets angry. very angry. The two both have the correct target of anger in the end, despite Jc's breakdown. He still harbors his mother's words, but at this point they're still in the background of his mind.

Now again we go forward- JC willingly sacrifices himself for WWX. Look, if he doesn't like wwx at all i think this is extremely contradictory. even if he was s*icidal, he could have chose other ways to get to that end if that was the case. and a gentle reminder that JC perks back up and is ready to fight once he believes WWX knows how to fix his core! i don't think he was truly wanting to die or anything like that until he thought he had lost everything except wwx and jyl. He believes in wwx's strength despite his constant fear of inferiority, so if he was gone, what would it matter if wwx was there to continue to protect yanli?

Essentially he was like 'well what are we going to do if i can't lead the sect? We would be in a homeless situation and there is a war.' aka there's not a lot of hope all around, i don't think he was only upset about the core, but it was definitely the main force because if he didn't have a core, how would he survive what was happening anyway? he's like 'if i'm gonna die let it be on my terms' yk? He also doesn't feel like he's strong enough before he lost his core to protect anyone. Without it? fat chance.

whew... this is a lot already, so maybe i'll post this and do a part two later addressing YLLZ arc, then the "present" one. i just have a lot of feelings about their relationship and i'm sad to see so much negativity around him...JC is quite flawed, but a lot of the characters are flawed! that doesn't make them bad characters, it makes them interesting and human.