#like i structure a lot of my life around making sure ppl take me seriously. is that manipulative. girl idfk. probably. i hate it.
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theres a lot of shit in my life that makes me go hmm i probably didnt need to lie about that. like it probably would have been fine if i told the truth here. huh
#really starting to recognise the amount of like. defensive lying i do. not about anything important but like. little things#like excuses for missing work and stuff. or just omitting things. idk. feels weird to start acknowledging it#like its never gotten harmful apart from lying abt my drinking but thats what addicts do.#personal#shit like saying i have crohns bc they dont take ibs seriously as an excuse even tho it gets debilitating.#like i structure a lot of my life around making sure ppl take me seriously. is that manipulative. girl idfk. probably. i hate it.#i also dont believe half of my own shit so idk.
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i mean how sam always seems to have the final say, sam and his new gf got colby with someone they picked, sam dominates opinions during interviews even if colby speaks sam always has the final say, he says things like people shouldn’t live life via a book (talking on christianity whilst sitting next to his christian best friend) but then lives his own life via self help books and preaches them at every chance (whats the difference?). the structure of their videos now are basically everything sam wants to do (rituals and such), it was him and his family who made the financial decisions for the both of them and they share a bank account (this was probably smart when they were 16 and im sure they have personal accounts too)
i also saw people on twitter saying colby looks like hes starting to figure it out. how also sam would not have made it half as far in his career without eye candy colby standing beside him. how sam treated kat and how many colby is seeing similarities with his own relationship with him.
colbys codependent on sam so he would never walk away but i hope sam isnt taking advantage of him or manipulating him in anyway to make colby stay around.
a lot of this isn't really manipulation. at least i don't believe it to be.
sam is a control freak who thinks he's always right/is too stubborn to listen to others. and colby goes along with a lot of what sam says bc one, that is his best friend and business partner, and two, colby doesn't see himself as intelligent like sam so sam's able to get his way a lot bc colby won't rock the boat/trust his own opinions.
it would be manipulative if sam fed into those insecurities colby has and told him "yeah we should go with what i want bc your choices are poor" but colby actively deciding to go with what sam says just bc he thinks his idea is good is not sam being manipulative.
for everything else, i'll break it down how i think it is.
colby was going out with ms singer, k's other friend, before all going out with m. and that didn't work out so that's why k introduced m to colby and they hit it off. that's not really sam playing a part or manipulating colby to date someone just bc. i think that was just happenstance tbh.
sam just talks a lot more than colby. i personally think also as of recently colby seems disinterested in a lot of the outside content they have been doing, and i think that's from burnout and the fandom et large just constantly berating him and it tiring him out.
the christianity/self help thing is just sam being hyprocritical. it's also why i find his argument of not like astrologers to be stupid. just bc it don't make sense to you doesn't mean it's lesser than. i think it's dumb to read a book written by (basically) a get rich quick scheme artist who hasn't had any hardships but knows therapy speak relatively well, and for some reason that makes them qualified to tell me how to live my best life. but hey, to each their own lol
the structure of vids… eh, i think they both agree to that layout. and i think part of that also comes from the comments and what some ppl want as well.
sam's family being involved has less to do with sam and more to do with colby's family just not taking his dreams and career seriously. not to mention, sam's dad was already retired by the time snc were getting started so it makes sense that that man knows a thing or two more about business. and also he tried to be in their lives and it seems as if colby's parents (minus his mother) didn't so again, not really sam.
and the boys, i would assume, have both the business account and their own personal ones. they just talk about and use the same business account more (probably for tax write offs lol).
i do think colby wants time away from the brand and business, but i don't think it's sam's doing that makes him want to leave, at least not fully. i think the over working and the constant long hours/having little to no time off has definitely put a damper on things for colby. and some of that is also tied to sam wanting them both to constantly work and needing to do something "productive" at all times. but i think that's also why they have reduced their work load a lot.
i think in the long run colby will not be in this business as long as sam might want him to be/will be. colby seems about ready to dip out to me sometimes, but i think that also comes from the pressure of the fans and how mean they can be. how invasive they can be. how careless they continue to be towards someone they claim to love. colby keeps a lot inward, and this tied with his own personal struggles (along with his cancer and such), i think colby wants time away that he feels like he can't take. and whether that's bc of sam or other facts is not something we really know 100% about.
i believe they are both very codependent on each other, mostly bc, as they have mentioned, they are the only ppl in their lives they feel they can be 100% themselves around. not to mention every bad and good moment in the last 10+ years has had each other in it, so of course they are gonna rely heavily on one another. i do hope they eventually take some time to be by themselves, away from one another. just to get some space. i don't think that's happening any time soon, unless something major transpires.
but short answer, no. i don't think sam is being manipulative towards colby. i think colby can make his own decisions, regardless of sam. he actively chooses to be with sam daily. i'm sure if he didn't like it he would have left by now lol
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1-5 and 20-25 :-) sorry for all of them hehehe — 🖤 also i’m getting off work I WILL SEND U ANOTHER ASK HEHEHEH
oaiwenfoia you’re sooo c*te perhaps i’ll d*e………. hm………… anyway;; thank you angel (sorry it took me so long to do this ;; ___ ;;)
also this got mad long so i’ll put it under a cut!
1. how did you get into graphics / gif making?
i was an early ‘the vamps’ and ‘5sos’ fan and because of that, i used to make lil graphic type things?? i guess?? like i tried to make stuff like the ones i saw online omg… and mine were soooo bad but it was like so fun and i used to use this online editor and it was trash but like i would have so much fun… (and that was back when i was in grade 7-ish..? so i would’ve been like jfjfiwaoefo 12/13) and then i just kept doing it;; eventually in grade 10 i took a graphic design course and i got a hold of photoshop and it blew my mind and from there i just kept kinda… doing it??
and with gifs omg… ok i swore i would never make gifs cause it looks SO complicated like bitch ill kill u what do u mean layers to frames wtf !!!!!!!!!!!! and then when i was in my first year of uni in around june i was like… omg i wanna try again… cause i’d tried it before and my ps just crashed… so i was like let me give this another go.. and i did… and it worked.. and my mind was like blown omg… i was in AWE… omg i just realized its been a whole year since i learned how to gif stop ill die
gfx/gif questions
2. do you do something creative/related “irl” as well?
well!! i just got into college for graphic deisgn hehe;; so i’m hoping that that’ll be my future :’)
3. who/what inspires your graphics / gifs?
hm, well!! whenever i see really great pieces of gfx or even in real life when i see a magazine piece or a billboard that just looks stunning i feel inspired!! and i’m like eugh i wanna try making smth like that ;; also music and movies and games inspire me sometimes?? but if i was to say who!! then it’d probably be all my amazing content creating mutuals!!! their work is always wowing!! i always tag ppls gfx with ‘gfx inspo’ bc im genuine :0 when i see it ;; ___ ;; like how is everyone so creative and talented;;
4. what do you enjoy about making graphics / gifs?
oh wow, mm… it allows me to be creative? and put to use skills that i think aren’t always appreciated? like my p*rents never take me doing graphic design seriously;; but then recently my mom wanted me to make a lil label for her for a friend’s garden and i did and she was like !!!!!! so happy abt it i was like TT TT cause both my parents were finally like ok i get it sorta;; i really like that i’m able to make smth kinda outta nothing?? like art is really interesting bc you get to let your thoughts and experiences affect the outcome of your work so?? like.. i like that everyone has a different style??
and for gifs;; i really enjoy that its such a structured task like… its very.. orderly and routine based?? like i know what i’m doing everytime?? and the places where i get to change it up are like the colourings and the style of set i make and that makes it fun and creative too;;
5. what do you dislike most about making graphics / gifs?
mm the creativity block;; i feel like sometimes i cannot think of ANYTHING to make and those days i feel kinda useless as a cc…… it sucks but foiawnefiawn eventually i’ll figure smth out if i move things around enough fajwefowaeo
and giffing omg…… idk… probably the colouring process…… but thats majorly because my laptop’s screen displays colours kinda whack from how they actually look and so i have to do 2x the work to make sure it looks good and smdays its like idc anymore just post the set and pull the trigger
20. your favourite fandom(s) to make graphics / gifs for?
for gfx it’s definitely stray kids!!! they have some of the most fun lyrics to work with and their concepts always always inspire me like crazy!!!
for gifs its the tmg fandom! everyone in that fandom is suuuper nice and supportive and like;; even if i’m not always making gifs i dont feel like i’m falling behind or ? like ppl will be mad or smth ? like its a safe small community and bc of that it feels so good ;;;
21. how much time do you spend on a single graphic / gif?
very dependent! gfx can take from like an hour to like a week+?? it just depends on how intense and intricate it is ig;;
gifs are shorter;; probably take me a few hours?? the longest a set has taken me is maybe like 6 hours but that’s bc i was being slow about it and trying to find all the necessary parts! but on average itll take abt half an hour to maybe two for one set
21. what is your biggest improvement since you started making graphics and or gifs?
ogoaiweniogaw stop this is so funny.. i wanna go find my old wattpad covers so you can all cringe with me but… mm, with gfx i guess i learned what my Aesthetic™ was and what i really liked and like fjjfaiosdksfd i learned how to use photoshop which is a big thing lmaoooo……… and with gifs!! definitely my quality (shout out to vapoursynth) and my colouring :’)
23. what is your biggest improvement in the past month?
hm… time management jfaiweoofiaw i’ve definitely gotten wayyy faster at giffing and i really do not take as much time anymore;; which gives me some peace of mind lmao
24. what is something that you’re wanting to learn right now?
illustrator! i’ve been fooling around with it a lot recently;; and even one of the pieces i submitted in my portfolio was smth i made on illustrator heh;; but theres a huge learning curve (like btich what is the pen tool ill kill u) fnaoiefiownf so i wanna get lots better with it ;;
25. what would you like to see others learn how to do?
this is an interesting question;; mm i guess everyone is different?? so idk if i can answer this question cause i think everyone’s style requires them to learn in their own ways?? so idrk ;; i guess something to make certain people’s lives easier would be like LEARN KEYBOARD SHORTCUTS !!! that shit saaaves my life like idk man it cuts down on my time for sure;;
#🖤 anon#anon#answered#thank you babie#i'm soooo sorry this took me as long as it did#also sorry this is sooo long fjaowiefnoaiw#i hope you're well angelllll
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just watched a video by a creator i like about shitty trends in body types and the rise of bbls etc
and the entire last half of the video was her talking about her own body issues like as an example
but.
i just.
her partner is a personal trainer and like.
there was just. a lot of talk. about natural body sculpting. and put in the work like adele.
i want to be SO PAINFULLY CLEAR that those were NOT! the takeaway messages that were emphasized!
but BOY did they make my skin fucking crawl!
the creator is thin. or at the very least, is Small and Curvy. conventionally attractive.
but she’s put on weight on her stomach and bbls typically take the fat from your stomach and put it on your ass/hips. so ppl w her shape have these flat stomachs. and she’s like damn i’ve considered flattening my stomach
but instead she’s just like “yeah y’know the normal stuff of like what you eat and exercising” and the whole “calorie deficit” thing and i am
.....
FRUSTRATED.
how do you make an hour long video about the damage that the proliferation of unrealistic body image goals and plastic surgery are doing
AND THEN REPEAT FATPHOBIC GARBAGE???
also i’m not going to shit on a person for getting plastic surgery ever
like among the many reasons that’s the case, hi hello i’m a trans person and while medical transition isn’t part of my life (except maybe breast reduction bc i just got back into Seriously Exercising Again finally, and oh my GOD my breasts are a LIVING NIGHTMARE to work around) it absolutely is for so many trans people
like it’s crucial to mental health and survival, and also like, bodily autonomy. let people do what they want.
HOWEVER
my “exception/however” is that by and large, most plastic surgery things just. perpetuate fatphobia and racist beauty standards and also trends based on them.
and i just think that that DOES need to be laid at the feet of the industry and also health care in general.
like plastic surgery that changes someone’s weight or the structure of their face to match with values that are fatphobic or racist is not morally neutral.
the person getting it is not at fault for it, but the thing itself is like. not morally neutral. it doesn’t make them bad, the thing just Sucks and contributes to like. perpetuating shit in society that is actively harmful.
discussing losing weight and like. applauding adele--who, by the way, has had work done and hasn’t talked about it. like. i’m sorry, her face is not the same, and that is NOT just weight loss. i’ve seen people who were very fat lose a lot of weight over the years, their faces DO NOT CHANGE THAT MUCH.
it’s not a huge difference, but like. christ. how many celebrities just get their eyebrows surgically lifted, y’know?
anyway whatever.
i was just really frustrated that she talked about curating her instagram to make sure she saw as many different kinds of bodies as possible, and like “accepting fat bodies” or whatever and i’m like.
and still. you’re talking about body sculpting and losing weight and calories in and calories out.
like your training partner said “maybe 1 pound lost a week is about as good as it’ll get” and like. yeah at least it’s realistic but also ???
WHY DO WE HAVE TO TALK SO MUCH ABOUT LOSING WEIGHT? AS IF THAT IS SOMEHOW NEUTRAL IN OUR SOCIETY???
and also this idea that people should do what they want--yeah, they should. but what they want does not exist in a fucking vacuum.
are you really going to tell me that people who get procedures done aren’t influenced by beauty standards at the time? or some other thing having to do with like, white supremacy and all its attendant pieces?
again THAT DOES NOT MAKE THEM A “BAD PERSON”
but i AM saying that all of our decisions and preferences are influenced by what is around us and what we take in, etc.
so no, getting a bbl because you want one and it’ll make you feel better--that isn’t. like! that’s not in a vacuum! i mean it COULD be! certainly! i’m not here to be the arbiter of this shit!
i just think this conversation is more complicated than “unattainable beauty standards” and the accessibility (in terms of pervasiveness) of plastic surgery.
i also don’t think (i’m going to repeat this again here!) that plastic surgery is ~evil~ bc it’s not. it’s existed for a long time and does a lot of good in the world in terms of things like transition, etc. and also just like, things that people wanna change about themselves bc like. idk. bad memories, or just being irritated thinking about one of their features too much and like “eh, just get rid of it” or whatever. y’know? there’s a lot of shit and grey and again BODILY AUTONOMY.
i will never, not in a million years, tell someone what to do with their own body (beyond begging people i love to please for the love of fuck not do something that will 100% give them covid)
that’s not the point i’m making
i think, in an ideal world, it would be possible for plastic surgery to exist and be relatively popular or accepted--and for it to not, by default, perpetuate a lot of horrific beauty standards that literally kill people
but i also just. think more realistic and honest conversations about bodies, how they change and grow, REAL discussion about HEALTH by which i mean--things that are unnecessary that can harm you versus the moralizing of health and dehumanization of sick and disabled people, etc. like having REAL conversations about this shit would, i bet, lower the rate of people getting plastic surgery.
there’s just so many harms being perpetuated by the industry and the prevalence of it in media.
and it just. bugs me. that in a longass video discussing just that.
this person. somehow. perpetuated those same fucking problems and praised someone for losing weight.
do you think adele would ever have lost that weight or gotten work done if she wasn’t famous? probably not. at least not to that extent.
do you honestly think the way she lost weight was safe? was entirely by choice? like. i sure as fuck don’t. i also don’t think it’s sustainable without a FUCKTON of extra work and being miserable in your day to day life.
i just. i’m tired. i’m sick of trusting people and still finding casual fatphobia.
she literally said at one point “maybe i need to reckon w the fact that my fear of having fat on my stomach is internalized fatphobia”
it’s not internalized it’s just fatphobia. and yes. you should.
the video is more than 6 months old and the vast majority of people commenting are thanking her for this honest discussion.
bc i wanna be so painfully clear about this, too.
her discussing her own bodily insecurities and then attempting to debunk them IS VERY GOOD! YES! MORE CONVERSATIONS LIKE THAT, PLEASE!
but don’t follow it up with talk about “real” ways to lose weight and BODY SCULPT. you’re perpetuating the fucking problem.
people with eating disorders ALSO ABUSE EXERCISE.
i’m just very tired. hopefully she’s like. idk. had some discussions about it. no one is “perfect”, that’s not my point.
i just wish. that. she had been a little more conscious about how some of that was coming off and what it’s really saying.
also the “why don’t y’all just do it like adele” thing was bitter and more aimed at influencers. but they “joked” about like--
“god forbid people put in some work for once”
//stares blankly
excuse me?
i really can’t tell their full sense of humor or where it’s aiming or what the intent is (bc it was her and friend at that point in the video)
obviously they’re goofing and there is SOME layer of irony.
but. the way everything was edited. and sandwiched with all this talk about body sculpting and shit (which WASN’T ironic in the LEAST), it’s just.
not great. i didn’t like it. i sat through it hoping it would get better because the first half of the video was fine.
i learned a bit about bbls and where they come from and how they work and also how they can kill you (not commonly, but YIKES. enough YIKES to be a dangerous procedures).
like valuable info! good insight!
and then you top it off with fatphobic garbage. i’m tired.
oh no wait i forgot. a thing.
she said at one point that she wished she was either much skinnier, or much heavier. because her in-between weight feels weird.
and i would just like to say
AT NO POINT WOULD YOU STOP FEELING WEIRD ABOUT YOUR BODY
AND ALSO BEING MUCH HEAVIER WOULD INCUR SO MANY SOCIETAL ILLS AND HARMS AND BIGOTRY AND STRUCTURAL SYSTEMIC OPPRESSION
KINDLY DO NOT SAY YOU’D RATHER BE “ONE EXTREME” BECAUSE THE MIDDLE SPACE IS WEIRD
at the same time!!!! i’m saying it here and NOT NAMING OR TAGGING HER because holy shit let people feel what they feel and process it
but oh my FUCKING god don’t act like an extra 40 pounds wouldn’t immediately get you on the fast train to “let’s yell at that fatso” town. no, it wouldn’t be better just because it’s more concrete. it would not be better kindly readjust your thinking and take this into account--and also maybe use it to continue to feel better about your body.
also this is complicated because holy shit race and skin color make everything way more nuanced and complicated! i am ONLY talking about weight--i am not specifying the ways in which fat black women would be treated versus fat women of other races, esp white. my point is just that in general, it’s Not Better than being ~in between~
but also the trauma around being treated as in between? very legit!
i’m tired of having to carry all the nuance idfk man i’m just venting and frustrated. i don’t think she’s a bad person. i think she was right and insightful about a lot of stuff. i think i don’t have a single leg to stand on to tell someone how they should feel about their body or their relationship to it or their trauma or ANYTHING.
i am just frustrated that a video meant to be a net positive or neutral instead ended up saying this stuff that IS FATPHOBIC because it is PERCEIVED AS NEUTRAL because health is still being held as this golden moral standard without her even realizing it.
this is not me railing against HER. i guess i should’ve specified that to. i’m not mad AT HER. i’m frustrated.
because it’s so fucking pervasive that even well meaning people fuck up in ways that aren’t just like “oh shit you made a mistake” but like in ways that are like “yeah, accepting fat people is like. okay. but also. it’s still bad and people should still lose weight because it IS possible, just change your diet and exercise more.”
like that is a takeaway that a LOT of people are going to have from that video. and i’m tired. and they’ll swallow it more easily--including ppl w EDs and fat people struggling w body image--because it’s coming from a well meaning person who is sympathetic and educated and kind.
whatever i need to stop. feel free to please ignore this. this doesn’t need to be a discussion. i’m only typing like half of what is happening in my head rn, rest assured that the most unnecessarily nuanced “all sides” Discourse is currently happening in my head and i’m considering not even posting this rant to my own fucking blog.
here’s the other reason it makes me feel bad
i just got back into exercising with this dancing company/app that i like and have been following for a while, but i haven’t done their classes or bought a membership yet. i finally did, bc i’m like, i wanna! a lot of things i wanna do involve being more active and fit, and learning to dance.
and i’m really struggling with how weak and out of shape my body has gotten in the last several years, because i used to be pretty fit. i looked the same, though.
i’ve gained more fat in my stomach and on my back over the course of the pandemic because the SHEER VOLUME OF COMPOUNDING STRESSORS have just continued to go up for the last like. five years.
and there is NO ROOM to exercise in this FUCKING house, so i’m FORCING it now bc i just got. bored and sick of it.
i want to be fit again bc i want to do cool things and feel good about what i can do, and just be more active.
the strength of my legs was something i LOVED and would brag about. i loved cardio kickboxing bc i felt strong and powerful.
and i never lost much weight at all. i was still the same shape.
so that’s not the goal.
though i DO want to kind of help remove some of the extra fat i’ve gotten over the last few years, because i had already reached my set point weight, and this is extra.
i’m NOT going to change my diet because my diet is already such a huge issue for me, and i think my diet is fine.
i am NOT exercising JUST to lose weight. it’s all of the above reasons. and i have VERY realistic goals about what weight i COULD lose and actually keep off (not much--10 pounds? idk, i’m bad at quantifying weight bc it looks so different on everyone and at different points in your life)
and i want breast reduction bc my breasts are so fucking huge that they make a LOT of things i want to do and enjoy basically impossible and also they HURT ME. ACTIVELY. and i hate it.
smaller boobs would make me feel physically better, and also i’d feel more confident.
but i am STRUGGLING. i hate how weak i am. i hate how out of shape i am. i hate my body bc i sweat SO MUCH and it always makes me feel gross and pathetic and weak and ~fat~
but. i don’t know that, even now, i would say that i hate my body. i don’t think i do. i’m REALLY frustrated with it. i hate the passage of time. i hate the fucking world, i hate this country, i’m sick of everything being infinitely harder than it needs to be.
but my body has been so stressed out and panicked and like i get it. if you need to put on some weight about it bc you don’t know what else to do, fine. that’s okay. i will accommodate and adjust. and i will try to take care of you so that the extra weight is just extra weight and not like, declining vitals/blood work, etc.
idk i’m just rambling now, my point was this:
i’m in a really sensitive place with my body. my relationship with my weight and body has been very weird. i’m fat but not a large fat. i’ve been made fun of for being fat but i have structural access to things other fat people don’t. i’ve been fit and i know that being fit doesn’t make me thin, bc that’s just how my body is. i’m short and fat and always will be.
so.
a relatively thin person.
talking about body sculpting.
and putting in the work.
makes me angry.
because IT’S NOT TRUE.
and it riles up those old feelings i used to have, and still sometimes think about. how much easier life would be if i was thin. the clothes, the access--people thinking i’m hot. people wanting to date me.
what would my life have been like if i was thin in high school? if i knew what gender and sexuality was at the time?
i can’t pursue this line of thought, it’s not healthy.
but it makes me MAD.
because that shit isn’t true. and believing that body sculpting and diet and exercise and putting in the work would just FIX my body is like. so fucking toxic.
I LITERALLY KNOW THAT IT WON’T.
it will just make me fitter and more athletic/physically capable. i might lose some weight, so i might look a little more muscular. but i will still have my stomach (though slightly smaller), i will still have big flabby arms, i will still have “thunder thighs” as a fellow 9 year old once told me, my face will always be round.
that’s. like that’s fine. it’s my body. i know what it is. i’m trying to get it back to being fitter so i feel better in general.
and i’m just.
body sculpting is not a fucking thing.
how dare you say that celebrities and influencers saying that bbl results are achievable through diet and exercise are dangerous liars
but YOU saying that BODY SCULPTING is fine is like--not a problem at all.
again, not me mad at this one person.
me mad in general at the things society makes acceptable, even/especially among people who thing they’re anti-fatphobia.
and also just personally. i felt really bad about myself after the first few class-things i did the other day. i felt weak and pathetic. and today was also bad bc i found their “basics of dance” program and it’s. REALLY basic.
and still i was struggling. like intellectually i know it and can do it, but my fit. and my physically limitations.
it sucks. and i hate it.
and i just don’t want people pretending that you can magically fucking change your body--or even acting like THAT IS A NORMAL AND ACCEPTABLE GOAL YOU SHOULD HAVE
i’m tired i’m tired i’m tired
my fingers hurt i have to stop typing
#really excessive and extensive rambling about body image and eating disorders and weight loss#also plastic surgery and other related things like with social media etc#i watched a video and i didn't like the second half and this is me ranting about why#because i think it perpetuated and contributed to fatphobia even though the video's aim was ostensibly to shit on fatphobia etc#and i'm really just tired
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p.o. : shadowhunters
i kinda really wanted to write about this one, because..tbh i had some sleepless nights because of it, so hear me out, well, in case you care. if you don’t know it’s a teen tv series based on a series of cassandra clare books. as being a teen show i knew what i was diving in and don’t tell me older people can’t watch it. i actually fully enjoyed it even if my teen times were like 10 years ago, despite all the flaws and stuff. to be clear i came for malec* and actually stayed for it. (*malec is how everyone calls magnus+alec ship, they’re an actual gay couple in the series ufufu).
by “i knew what i was diving in” i mean that i’m aware of all the cliche stuff that might be going on. and let’s be real a girl who lived a normal life suddenly finds out she’s can’t be that anymore and many amazing things but also sad things wait for her on her adventure, and the series are like that, with clary finding out that once she was just an art student, but now she finds out that she belongs to a totally different world and all the bullshit like vampires and werewolves and mages are all real. and with that i was right actually, but that’s what made me giggle all the way. the cheesiness was overflowing. you know how you sometimes watch something that isn’t that well done, but you actually like it for it XD i had the same experience. last night i thought it would be a great challenge if i actully watched the entire series with a bottle of alcohol and took a shot every time they asked - are you ok? or - we need to talk.
but as the show unfolded it actually developed by folds. you know if you have an eye for such things you’ll see how first season didn’t have much set, swords were funny as if they stole star wars prop, they saved money on cg like, for example, in scenes when fight between wolves happened not right in front of characters but behind something else, yet you could hear the sound instead. my favorites are when they fake-stabbed and it was like a knife in an armpit trick, i even took screenshots to savor the moment. and there were many things like that. yet i’ve read ppl still really liked it. not to mention i liked it. i know i didn’t take it as seriously because it made me giggle, but i’m still pretty positive about it. while in next seasons you could see that they got more money they could spend. on emotional side everything developed too. and malec got better too ufufufu but jokes aside it really had scenes where i was sitting and wiping tears away.
i have no idea how different the series are from the books, because obviously i haven’t read them. for malec alone i could actually read everything to find out.
to sum the whole thing up to me it was more like - it’s good, because it’s so bad. that was at first, the cheesiness stayed but with the next seasons it got better. i’m on season 3 already and i started watching just few days ago it seems XD and that should speak for itself.
but honestly i’d love to know if any of you guys ever watched it, or more than that - read it. i really want to know how malec is in books. and sorry for the interest, but i like strong relationships. others had like a change of heart, seeing different people for different reasons, but malec stayed strong, and i like that XD you are free to message me :)
and while i’m at it, i really liked this video on youtube, one of the funniest i’ve seen
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ok, i’m done, like fully done watching all the episodes released to this day and what can i say...tbh i’m pleasantly impressed. it did get better and better, the only like big complain i have is that this show is cramped af. because even if all the seasons are behind me i’m not really sure about entire universe and questions left hanging. well, name me a perfect show without a flaw though))) yet, still confuses me like why they made cary special, because as far as i remember they divided themselves into worlds of light and dark, and shadowhunters as they claimed were like half-angelic beings, while later the emphasis was brought only to cary who has blood of angel, so the earlier mention of entire structure kinda ruined the impression. i may be mixing things up, but it kinda stuck with me from earlier stages. like where she really receives this strength from, why is she so blessed as if her dad is god himself. and other questions as well. like why they don’t have a special thing that allows them to mass-spread the word quickly. fights sometimes looked tedious because of all the “throwing around”. also weapon choice, many times izzy was like overpowered and put in a difficult position because of her whip. at times i wished they’d use guns XDDD i can go on for a long time
also it was such a pleasure to speak with few people on this show and find few things out. i’m impressed they actually did a lot of changes. impressed, but not surprised since changing things, sometimes entirely, is a common thing, especially with “based on” shows and movies. and if i were a reader and saw it was tailored differently my mind would be fucked too. yet, looking at it as a piece of its’ own is actually not a bad thing. because in season 1 i was honestly almost cackling all the time, i couldn’t immerse in the feelings of the characters, but by season 3 i was thinking to myself - wow, that’s a good move, that was powerful, i wonder how it’ll impact him in the future and so and so forth. one thing i’d agree for sure is that characters are older. sorry for sentiments but if the graphic scenes will involve love and sex, then making characters older is a wiser choice. it’s a tv show after all.
anyway, i was pleasantly surprised in general. and yes, malec is like the best thing here))) no doubt. it’s really worth watching it just because of them.
#txt#personal opinion#and i know i'm daaaaaaaaamn late into the game#and i feel sorry for what they did to this show#it totally doesn't deserve it
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answer All the questions for your newest oc
DEAD U HAD TO ASK FOR NEWEST DIDN’T YOU. welp in that case have ya boi eneko
What’s the maximum amount of time your character can sit still with nothing to do?he’s a patient dude! eneko can likely sit still doing nothing for as long as his physiology will allow aka until he needs to go to the bathroom or smth. he does well w low activity as he’s an introspective person
How easy is it for your character to laugh?FAIrly easy?? on a level of one to ten w one being laughs at anything that moves or doesn’t move i’d say he’s a.. 6. ok so not that easily like he IS fairly taciturn but he will smile and laugh at a good joke esp if he’s comfy around the person making it
How do they put themselves to bed at night (reading, singing, thinking?)by crying- no jk he doesn’t… cry… emotions? what are those??? (thats a lie he’s an emotional mess) he will plan for the next day, strategizing and such but that’s honestly rlly bad for him. he stresses easily. on nights when he’s got a clearer head he’ll hum softly or read if he’s not feeling too guilty abt burning off candles. he does like night walks they always clear his mind
How easy is it to earn their trust?oh oof that’s a tricky one. not that easy but at the same time- OKAy yeah just not that easily from one being the easiest to ten being the hardest he’s likely a 8
How easy is it to earn their mistrust?VERY hard. once you’ve gained his trust he will be LOYAL af to u eneko is quiet n not the most expressive but he will absolutely go down in flames for someone he’s deemed trustworthy. a solid 9.
Do they consider laws flexible, or immovable?laws are flexible defo. he PREFERS structure but if morality trumps laws he will break them. it also helps that he’s lowkey part of a rebellion so technically his existence in the present is breaking the law
What triggers nostalgia for them, most often? Do they enjoy that feeling?god save us all. he’s a nostalgic dude so uh, oh damn i dont have backstory for him yet i made him last night rainy stop bullying me but ykw we’re doing this. flowers defo. queen anne’s lace n bluebells esp? bring back memories n also pumpkin stew. mixed memories w that one. queen anne’s lace mean sanctuary n bluebells mean gratitude which is LOWKEY ironic considering they spawn memories of burning along w memories of his older sisters so yes?? he does like remembering his sisters but no not in that context. the stew is a weird reminder of his first love n that’s. also complicated
What were they told to stop/start doing most often as a child?talk more and talk better. he’s got a bit of habit of being short abt things and the middle sister of the fam was ALWAYS getting on his case abt no u can’t word it like that but the eldest was and is a terrible influence n absolutely encouraged it bc she found it hilarious. it’s good they love each other i swear
Do they swear? Do they remember their first swear word?yes he’s part of a rebellion and a soldier what more do u eXPECt and no he doesn’t remember his first swear word. he also doesn’t curse that much dont get me wrong. he has to be comfy around u
What lie do they most frequently remember telling? Does it haunt them?gosh uh. eneko is still v underdeveloped so i .. WELL I CANNOt tell u in the present it’s prbly smth angsty involving his sisters or his lovER but the answer to does it haunt him? yes absolutely he must Suffer :)
How do they cope with confusion (seek clarification, pretend they understand, etc)?it depends on the situation’s levity. if it’s smth important he will absolutely bluntly ask for clarification if it’s smth casual he’ll just nod and pretend like he knows what ur talkin abt bc social anxiety is a b
How do they deal with an itch found in a place they can’t quite reach?Suffer in Silence
What color do they think they look best in? Do they actually look best in that color?he doesn’t rlly think abt this. he likes green tho but he wears a lot of black (that’s partially required by his associations and partially bc idk what other colors exist thanks @ god) he looks best in hmmm red
What animal do they fear most?himSELF
How do they speak? Is what they say usually thought of on the spot, or do they rehearse it in their mind first?he’s usually fairly forthright so he sounds like he’s saying whatever comes to mind but the reality is he says abt 1% of what he’s thinking and he won’t say things that are quite obviously rude. who knows tbh maybe he gains secret enjoyment from watching ppl squirm under his bluntness eyes emoji
What makes their stomach turn?torture n he hates the sight of bones. blood he can stand but bones? no thanks. unfort in the business they’re in he comes across both of those more than he’d like. he also hates working in the theoretical. it’s unnerving but he’s fine if someone he trusts is wading thru the abstract for him aka thank u @ kent for being the resident intuitive
Are they easily embarrassed?nah not particularly
What embarrasses them?if u slap his BUTT in public jkjk i mean that would embarrass him if u caught him by surprise but hmmm he doesn’t like attention if u draw attention to him he’ll freak a lil that would fluster him also excessive praise esp if it’s expressed publicly. he squirms beneath the spotlight
What is their favorite number?19. day of the month he last saw his sisters smiling
If they were asked to explain the difference between romantic and platonic or familial love, how would they do so?he’d prbly say smth deep which i cannot truly replicate but prbly smth like. “familial love is steady. it’s the mountain beneath which u were born. it’s the protection n the stability n the impossible sheer volume of it that can’t quite be comprehended. platonic love is like cords linking u to them. it’s the promise, the assurance of i will pull u up if u fall and if i can’t ill fall w u. it’s a tug o war and an anchor. romantic love is a stallion. it’s the passion and the chance but if u know how to tame it it serves to make u a better man than u could ever become on ur own. it’s the teamwork and the flames”
Why do they get up in the morning? to execute justice and to experience each new precious day he’s been gifted
How does jealousy manifest itself in them (they become possessive, they become aloof, etc)? it’s ugly when jealousy rears its head in him. he doesn’t SAY anything but his actions become more erratic and he has a harder time focusing. it’s likely he’ll become more impulsive. he’s not DANGEROUs per se but it’s not a situation u want him in
How does envy manifest itself in them (they take what they want, they become resentful, etc)? envy he’s better about. mostly bc unlike w jealousy he doesn’t already have the thing. it’s smth he’ll just push down and soldier thru like he does w most uncomfy things in his life
Is sex something that they’re comfortable speaking about? To whom? oh MY GOD DONT TALK ABT SEX that’s SCANDALOUS- the answer is no he finds it unprofessional in his line of work but he would be comfortable discussing it w his s/o
What are their thoughts on marriage? good. he approves. however, for himself he finds the prospect unlikely considering the high risk nature of what he’s involved himself w. he expects to die before 35 in all seriousness
What is their preferred mode of transportation? in the sweet embrace of death horseback
What causes them to feel dread? the knowledge that everything’s falling apart. that fate and circumstance are slowly but surely chipping away at the very foundation of what u live for and there’s absolutely nothing u can do to stop it. also freaking the appearance of the antagonist or his minions
Would they prefer a lie over an unpleasant truth? in theory? no. in practice? he’s actually p sensitive that’s a difficult one to answer. it would greatly depend on the circumstance but in the long run he prefers the truth
Do they usually live up to their own ideals? yes but in his own eyes, no. he holds himself to extremely high standards and is very self critical. also he has rlly unachievable ideals he’s a lil bit idealistic beneath the guise of realism
Who do they most regret meeting? ohohOHO jk i have no idea not there yet in the story but prbly the antagonist he’s a b
Who are they the most glad to have met? funnily enough? he could almost say the antagonist. he’s the reason why eneko’s working as hard as he is for what he is. without the introduction of the antagonist he would’ve been oblivious to the terrible injustice around him and likely ended up a victim by some obscure mindless death order. however the person he truly admires is the rebel member who took him under her wing however she’s still in the works so i can’t give u much on her
Do they have a go-to story in conversation? Or a joke? i don’t think so, no
Could they be considered lazy? NOPE not in any sense of the word. eneko works extremely hard. he’s v dedicated n dutiful
How hard is it for them to shake a sense of guilt? oh, very hard. he’s naturally altruistic so he tends to take failures to heart and internalize them and considering the dangerous line of work he’s in he oftens has guilt building up inside him. he’ll likely carry it w him for the rest of his life once he’s decided to be guilty abt smth. if someone doesn’t help him w it it can break him down in ugly ways
How do they treat the things their friends come to them excited about? Are they supportive? yes!! he’s a pure son. you’ll definitely get a smile out of him if smth good has happened to u. he’s very supportive of his friends. he would die for his friends and likely all of u i just want u all to know this
Do they actively seek romance, or do they wait for it to fall into their lap?neither. he finds seeking romance irresponsible w his lifestyle. as i previously stated he expects to die young
Do they have a system for remembering names, long lists of numbers, things that need to go in a certain order (like anagrams, putting things to melodies, etc)? he has fairly good memory esp w faces! but otherwise? i would say he learns best by touch. he’s a tactile person and also fairly auditory. music defo helps him remember things
What memory do they revisit the most often? prbly the day he separated from his sisters. it’s not a particularly good memory but it’s seared in his mind
How easy is it for them to ignore flaws in other people? he doesn’t ignore ppl’s flaws per se? he’s p perceptive so it’s difficult for him to just turn a blind eye at least within his own mind but eneko is v tolerant of ppl and accepting. even if he dislikes u it’s doubtful you’ll know he’s fairly good at keeping up the same respect for most everyone he comes in contact w. but yeah? he knows what flaws are there but he will simply accept ppl bc he knows everyone, including himself, esp himself, has many flaws
How sensitive are they to their own flaws?oh oof yeah he’s?? a p sensitive guy so while he recognizes his own faults jabs to his weak spots will hurt him and he’ll prbly sit on the accusation or callout for days esp if someone accuses him of being selfish or immoral or not having done enough for the ppl he cares abt (smth along those lines) he’d absolutely hate that. but if u tell him he’s blunt he’s going to be like im well aware of that
How do they feel about children? he’s SUCH A DAD he loves kids and he’s rlly good w them they love him bc he’s SOFT ok but he doesn’t plan on having them himself even tho he’d like to for the exact same reasons he isn’t pursuing romance/marriage
How badly do they want to reach their end goal? enough that he’d die to reach it
If someone asked them to explain their sexuality, how would they do so?eneko is either demi or grasexual w pan preferences. he’s also panromantic. if someone asked for explanation he’d be like “i’m attracted to people of all genders” and just leave it at that unless ofc they were like RLLY curious or smth but he doesn’t rlly consider himself demi or pan or anything he just knows he isn’t straight LOL
QUESTIONS FOR CREATORS
A) Why are you excited about this character?…strong silent type. that’s all i have to sayB) What inspired you to create them?i’ve taken some inspiration from other characters from shows, etc. i’ve written so he’s a bit of a love child of the best of my musesC) Did you have trouble figuring out where they fit in their own story?im still figuring it out so that’s a probable yesD) Have they always had the same physical appearance, or have you had to edit how they look?he’s been edited a bit there were a few reincarnations of him like at first he had straight black hair in an undercut style but now it’s WAVY and dark brown and he also got darker. id say he’s like latino w a lil african blood this is esp amusing considering i literally created him last nightE) Are they someone you would get along with? Would they get along with you?i think we’d get along alright if we could get past the initial awkwardness bc we’re both kind of crap at interpersonal relationships actually he isn’t that bad it’s mostly me and i THINK he might find me slightly abrasive n energetic (even tho im PLOT TWIST low energy compared to most extroverts) but he’s tolerant it wouldn’t be too badF) What do you feel when you think of your OC (pride, excitement, frustration, etc)?love…. i love my soft boi i usually hate my ocs aka i would slap them if given the chance but eneko? deserves happinessG) What trait of theirs bothers you the most?he is not real in general and non existent in actual writing as of the present. the latter tragedy i will soon solve. in all seriousness it’s prbly his bluntness it has the tendency to give me second hand embarrassmentH) What trait do you admire most?his tolerance and patience i have none loLI) Do you prefer to keep them in their canon universe?for now, yes! i dont have a solid grasp of him so until then he’ll stay where he was BIRTHEDJ) Did you have to manipulate or exclude canon factors to allow them to create their character?not rlly! the entire story he’s in is still in the works so everything’s rlly flexible
#regneriisch#eneko#triad#long post#diavasi#dead what is my life#ykw if any of y'all are going to send asks just send a chara name i want to do tthis again and suffer w all my ocs#my ocs
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What do u like about Wildqueen?
Anon i love that u asked me this question (i cant sleep so this is great).
Rene is ex military; he was dishonorably discharged for doing sth morally questionable because of something he believed he had to get done. He regrets that deeply (though im not sure he regrets what he did as much as the results of it), as seen in the episode after he was tortured, and he is haunted by his failures , which he sees as a sort of chain that make up his life.
now, thea knows how that feels. She would be able to relate to the discipline, to the dedication that might be ingrained into someone from a military background. and also to bending of general morals to get shit done and/or compromising herself and her integrity for something. (Because she did go with Merlyn, compromising herself cause she wanted to be stronger) I don’t think she would hold what he did against him, or judge him; nor would he hold it against her that she did sth very daring to get control of her life again.
Both Rene and Thea tried doing good with what they were left with, after their failures/tragedies/disappointments. Here is where Rene and Thea might have interesting discussions though, because the WHY of this varies for them. Thea’s morality is much more fluid than Rene’s, I feel. Rene seems to have the whole ‘this is right and this is wrong’ thing going on, while Thea seems more of a ‘this is right for now cause it gets the job done or works for me’ kinda girl. (she has limits obviously) She is not really a joiner or a by-the-system kind, while Rene was military. [what could have possibly prompted a man with such contempt for anyone telling him what to do, to join the military? maybe he was running away from something - his family situation - and saw the military as his only escape?] I don’t think he really like being within a structure that tells u what to do, though he could have made friends and found a family of his own there. After his discharge and what prompted it, its also just as probably that he is very disappointed/disillusioned by it. (Personally i doubt that he likes being part of a hierarchy because he has serious authority issues which thea shares and in both cases it stems from parental abuse). Anyway i just know that when it comes to why they do the stuff they do, or why he does and she stopped, those two could have some interesting conversations.
Not to mention that they both would totally relate to each other when it comes to the fuckton of trauma they have been through. Just once i would like to see someone react humanly - as in, the way I do, not the way arrow characters react to fucked up shit that happens to that - to what Thea has been through. I mean, can u imagine? Rene would lose his shit if he knew that
‘yeah i was stabbed through the heart with a sword and almost died and then took a dip into a magic hottub and then got super bloodthirty and THEN ALMOST DIED AGAIN FROM THAT SAME WOUND". ‘u were stabbed.’'Yeah’'Through the chest’'Yup’'By an actual sword? ’*a beat* 'what kind of fucktard psycho uses a sword? ’'oh u would be so surprised. Actually thats bad. With the kind of record the team has, u need to learn to handle one.’'A sword? o_O R u shittting me??’'I shit u not’'Wait wait wait. You took a dip into this pit and now youre like… alive. ’'Yeah’'…dude… thats way weirder than im prepared to handle.’'I KNOW RIGHT!!! ’
(Idk what that up there is, ignore it. Itbsounds more like me talking to thea 😂)
Rene is instinctively protective of those that he percives as needing protection. He went against olivers orders to help a little girl who was in danger in the II ep; because he probably didnt even think about what the Green Arrow would say or do to him. But he also treated Evelyn as an equal and never babied her. (Cause arrow forgot she was a kid but anyway). Thea would most definitely apriciate that and also find it highly refreshing after olivers constant worrying about her and malcolm taking away her agency at every point.
Not to mention that Rene is exactly the kind of dude to find Thea’s ability to kick his ass with one hand behind her back incandescently hot. U gotta respect a guy who respects and is turned on by female power.
He fights hard for what he wants - he is determined and Thea would respect that cause so is she.
Also notice how he always kept his flirting very casual, never pushy never putting anything on her, mostly fun. Cause thats a good point in his favour and would be in Thea’s books too. And how she dismisses him but in a kinda half amused half annoyed way. Its rather hilarious. And i love that despite her shooting him down he never gets bitter about it. Those two times he just kept on smiling. I bet their flirting would be so agressively playful.
He is very observant (as far as I’ve noticed he is the only one that brings in the evidence for felicity) and im thinking he is very good at noticing when ppl change patterns of behavior. he didnt realize what the change meant in Evelyn, in terms of emotions, but he was able to pinpoint exactly /when/ it had happened: after they learned oliver was a the Hood. —> Thea is super smart emotionally and has this amazing radar about when ppl’s *feelings* shift. Oliver and moira never fooled her with their 'were gonna pretend for theas sake’ shtick. She didnt know why but she knew sth is up. That’s great material there. Id be willing to explore that. The good and the bad. The way they might pick up on each other’s moods, tendencies. Good and bad days. The different ways they would notice stuff about each other: Rene by noticing when she does things differently, when she deviates from her routine. Thea noticing when he is angry or happy or annoyed about something, learning how to associate his expressions with his feelings. The two of them baffling each other on how they notice these little things that the other wouldn’t think to notice about anyone, or that they didn’t think anyone noticed about them.
It’s fun to think about.
Rene is exeptionally straightforward and honest. Thea would love that about him. Both would speak their mind frankly to each other since neither is more sensitive than the other.
Rene seems to concentrate on things he does well - mostly physical stuff, stuff with his hands (i noticed this in the crosover. While the nerds were doing their own thing rene was calmly sitting down doing his own thing, handling his weapons i think). He’s probably a kinetic learner, like Oliver. And is very comfortable around ppl who do well with their own things, which Rene might have no idea how to do. I just mean that he is comfortable in his own skin and isnt threatened by other people's power or inteligence. (That moment when Felicity delegated to him and Rory to do that analysis thing, and Rene was totally chill admitting he had no idea what felicity had been talking about and that he Rory and Curtis were the smart ones). And this brings me back to Thea being absolutely charmed by this kind of quality because Rene can manage to be sure in himself without being arrogant.
Also circles back to him loving that he can actually learn stuff from her, fighting-wise. And that would really boost Thea’s selfconfidence because i can just see Rene being flirty about it at first and then surprising her by taking her very seriously and truly wanting to learn. And in turn she would be a good teacher because though not always the most sensitive, Thea is patient. She would love it that he is sure in himself that he would think nothing of asking her to teach him. And that he respects her and her skill to want to learn from her. Something that nobody has asked her before. And in turn, she would notice that he is an amazing team player and that she can actually play off of him when it comes to having a laugh or teasing the other team members cause theyre both sich little shits. (im also thinking that Rene’s specialty in the field would be recon - because he is so good that noticing when the environment changes, and keep track of patters and routes and stuff like that)
Rene was physically abused by his father. Thea was psycologically abused by hers. They would be able to regognise each others hurts and false-steps naturally and it would add another layer of understanding to their relationship but also a kind of tenderness and protectiveness for each other. I feel like neither of them is much of a cudler in the traditional sense of the word but they would be able to understand each others need for affection and the occasional fear of it. I mean - their scars are symetrical in some way so they would understand each others impulses a lot better than most have before them.
Despite his history tho, rene loves kids and seems hopeful about having kids (abused children will tell u that growing up into that kind of person takes strength and most certaily, goodness), which tells me that there is a lot of hope inside that man. Thea seems to be struggling to grasp onto some kind of hope, for a normal life, a normal self, something to give her meaning. They could help each other find that hope within themselves. Rene could have a positive thing or two to share with thea even, since she is more of a stark realist while rene seems to be more positive.
He is so fucking upbeat about things he actually enjoys. Like the christmass sock that evelyn gave him. Remember that smile? How eager he was and how he tore into that gift - that was precious and so pure, in the real sense of the word, not the tumblr one. I think even after all hes seen rene - and i think this is his best character trait - still has that boyish wonder intact. What makes him an idealist no matter how hard he protects himself with that jaded attitude. Hes not jaded - hes pragmatic and has issues.
And thea, oh my god, she needs someone who can really just have fun with her again. Someone who would delight in having a good time, who would love to laugh with her. Who would teach her how to see the wonderous and the joyous in the world again because i think she is having such a hard time this year. (Im very suspitious of the extreme change she has made from last year to this year and how stubborly she clings to this new status quo. Not that she shouldnt want to get away from the violence - that is an a+ reasoning for her. But her stubborness to keep away feels like fear. And i want to know what she isafraid of and why. Why she doubts herself) Im not at all convinced she is doing as well as she fronts and even if she is, she seems so serious all the time. She used to love parties - not the drug and alcohol kind but the 'together with my family and friends’ kind and rene dies too. They would have the most outrageous christmass ever. Thea would totally spoil him with all these eccentric gifts that are rpobably super inner jokes between them and rene would have a blast decorating the tree with her.
The fights would probably be very explosive cause theyre both hotheaded ppl and where thea can admit she was wrong, rene would need a little more work but im willing to bet that it wouldnt be so hard in the face of someone he loves and considers equal to himself (it was harder for him to apologise to oliver cause its a power thing and a dick measuring thing and a pride thing - elements that would be a non issue cause there would be no such disparities with thea)
Theyre also both very physical ppl and very expressive ppl so im guessing sex would be such fun for them and theyd love to try new things and just go for whatever they want.
Look i could go on. But these are all the surface level stuff i could think of. Im sure there is more. For the most part, what got me into thinking i could rly like the idea of them is the fact that around her, rene is a total goofball (i just love how sincere he is in his admiration without once seeming creepy) - i like seeing him like that and i would love to see thea laugh more. I just think they could be good to each otherband that there is a story there.
#rene ramirez#thea queen#wild queen#arrow meta#season 5#arrow thoughts#i love them both a lot and this got long wow
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