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moritakathedrawer-leonaguilez · 8 months ago

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Support differences of the Hoshidan siblings from the Original script vs the English localization

They say that in the Original Japanese version of Fates there are many changes that were different from what we got in the English localization. So I wanted to see for myself if that was true, however, I don’t know Japanese yet, I’m still starting. Very fortunately, I found a translation mod and this is the closest thing I could feel to the original.

And when I played it, I did not expect differences in the script and supports, they are not just mere translations or rewording. And the whole time I was like “WHY DID THEY REMOVE THAT?! It makes more sense and flavour for the story, and without it, there would be gaps in the story. But on the flip side there are things I like in the localization and funnily it added more flavour too.

Thus, I would like to share what I noticed with the support differences with the Hoshidan siblings in my Birthright run.Mostly the main theme of the supports are the same however the mood, feeling and tone would be changed if some lines are removed or changed, I notice the changes could affect Corrin/Kamui’s relationship with his siblings.

--Very long post ahead--

Note that I would use Corrin’s Japanese Hoshidan name, Kamui interchangeably for flavour. I would use Corrin for the EN while Kamui for the JP.

Let’s start with Hinoka, because I noticed a few differences.

Hinoka’s support’s seems to be the same in both version but in the localization it feels worded better since in EN she felt relieved and proud to be Corrin’s big sister but in JP she still feels guilty of what she did with Mikoto and doesn’t feel she deserves to be Kamui’s big sister. This is one of the few times I prefer the EN version, however this is one of my least favourite supports so I can’t impartially look at this.

For the rest of the siblings,it is way longer and I will go through every little detail I noticed.

Sakura and Kamui

C SUPPORT:

Besides some changes in the wordings and such, I could not notice major differences in tone or mood of the script that changes the flavour of the conversation even though the Japanese script seems to be longer.

B SUPPORT:

In the EN version, the conversation starts with Corrin asking Sakura questions right away about why she wanted to become a priestess, it’s more like an interview. However, in the JP version it is longer and feels like a conversation— Kamui starts by discussing a book on History and gods which was cut out in EN, here Kamui tries to connect with her anxious and awkward little sister.

This may be minor or not, and the localizations may not be translated word for word, but I noticed the differences between the portraits of the two versions. It seems that Kamui is more direct and Sakura is more anxious or uneasy in the EN ver than in the JP where Kamui is more patient and Sakura is calmer. We can also notice these portrait differences with other supports.

A SUPPORT:

This part is very noticeable, the EN version is so condensed than the Japanese version that it lost meaning than the original where it shows a lot why Sakura she is now— the causes of her anxiety and overthinking. The JP version expanded Sakura’s overthinking that shows her scenario of what-ifs, like if she was the one who was actually kidnapped, Big brother Kamui would be the one would be worried, and she really feels bad about Kamui’s kidnapping and fears Kamui would not be kind to her which this leads to her more anxiety. Kamui reassures his little sister Sakura that it’s all okay and he will always be there for her.

You can see that the EN is awfully shorter than JP. And JP Kamui’s words are more caring and worried while EN Corrin feels pity.

MY THOUGHTS:

As you saw,the EN version is awfully short and many parts were cut/condensed that it paints that Sakura is just very anxious and Corrin is direct with his words and looks at her with pity making her more anxious. Compared to the JP version, it gives full context and story why she’s so anxious, socially and mentally. It shows the whole story why she is an overthinker, and the whole reason why is scared of facing her lost sibling knowing she was originally planned to be taken according to rumours and she feels guilty to be not taken. I also like the flow of their conversation because it shows Kamui is trying to connect with Sakura and not scaring her too much with questions compared to the EN version. I especially love the last part of their A-support where Kamui says that he will protect her as a Big brother and never leave her precious little sister’s side. Most of all, I love the JP version because it made me appreciate Sakura a lot more because honestly when I first read the EN version it felt lacking.

The EN version is so short that I suspect: Do they have a word limit counter?

Takumi & Kamui

C SUPPORT:

In EN Corrin wants to connect to Takumi, but his response is hostile and they’re being sarcastic with each other due to Corrin’s background with Nohr. Corrin wants to learn archery to prove his loyalty and dedication to Hoshido, to gain trust and give him a chance to prove himself in battle his loyalty.

In JP, Kamui wants to connect with Takumi like in EN BUT because he wants to bond with him. Takumi isn’t fully trusting him but he is open to bond with Kamui unlike his reactions in EN. As Kamui didn’t grow up with Takumi, he didn't know what to talk about and it became awkward. As Kamui sees that Takumi is into archery, learning through him would be a good place to start bonding.

Comparing the two versions, you will see that EN’s theme is all about loyalty, while the JP version is about sibling bonding. [Skipped lines means they are exactly the same]

Like I said, EN Takumi is more sarcastic and hard on Corrin versus the JP version. Also take note of these closing lines of the JP version because it will appear again in their A-support and it’s worth mentioning.

B SUPPORT:

In this support, it shows Takumi teaching Corrin archery, then taking a break. When EN Corrin says that Takumi makes it look easy, he does not take this well and sees it as sarcasm and when talking about archery they both just brush it off as effortless. But in the JP,when Kamui expresses that archery is harder than it looks. JP Takumi gives his insights about the beauty and effort of archery which was cut out in EN. Kamui praises Takumi how amazing Takumi is and Takumi didn’t expect such praise that it caught him off guard other than the sarcastic remark in EN.

You can see how the EN version again condensed the JP script comparing the two. In short. The EN version shows Takumi doing it effortlessly while the JP version shows beauty and perfection in archery.

A SUPPORT:

At the end of the B support Corrin injured his hand and in this A support he still strives to learn archery despite his injuries.

In EN, Corrin says that Takumi is a strict but a good teacher and he hoped that Corrin was worth his time. Then Takumi admits that he is good but doubts him. This shows that he’s truly dedicated and loyal to Hoshido and wants to continue to train him.

But in JP, the whole time Kamui is genuinely excited to learn, you could tell he wants to bond with his little brother Takumi, and compliments him how amazing he is. And in turn, Takumi is liking Kamui and sees what a gentle and kind person he is and now sees him as a sibling and enjoying his company. This recognition makes Kamui very happy.

The major changes in themes you would notice is that in EN Corrin is doing it as an obligation/business to prove his loyalty and dedication. And in JP that Kamui wants to connect and know more about Takumi who once was hostile to him, it is a true sibling bonding and to have connection.

Remember those final lines in their C-support, it’s cute in A-support there’s a call back to that in the JP version: “Please treat me well, big brother Kamui”.

MY THOUGHTS:

Takumi and Kamui’s relationship is interesting because it had a rocky start. I always find their dynamic interesting and I am curious how their support would play out. When I first read the EN supports, it didn’t feel like they’re connecting, it felt more like a business relationship and just doing it to resolve things. When I read these supports in JP, I LOVE IT! It mending their relationship, it felt more meaningful than the EN version, and it felt like a genuine sibling bonding.

The whole time I was reading the JP version , I was like “WHYYYY???????!!”. Why the heck the localization team rewrote this from a nice bonding/connecting to just doing it to prove loyalty. In the original Takumi is more receptive and I love the final lines of Takumi, “please treat me well, Big Brother” because he also said that in C-support too, I love that call back it shows that Takumi has trust with Kamui as a sibling. The JP version shows Takumi’s passion and love for archery through expressing the beauty and striving for perfection. While EN Takumi is just reactive and too proud. Dammit localization team!

In short EN version made it about duty, dedication and loyalty vs JP version’s sibling bonding and connection.

Ryouma and Kamui

C SUPPORT:

In this support Kamui wanted to know about his Hoshidan siblings when he was taken away and wanted to connect. In JP Ryouma looks forward to talking and excited to connect with Kamui and he even has a gift that has a lot of meaning to him. It felt more sincere and warm . He is accommodating, and even tells Kamui that they, his siblings, have a good opinion on Kamui. However, EN Ryoma tells Corrin’s situation is just sad or unhappy and his conversation felt short, and he is too busy that they’ll talk in another time.

As you can see again that EN is shortened and condensed again than the original which loses the meaning and expression of desire of Ryouma to get close with Kamui.

B SUPPORT:

In this support Ryouma is describing his siblings, both versions felt the same but EN Ryoma is shown to be very busy again and when he talks about his siblings it’s brief and it seems that his mind is somewhere else. But in JP he is very eager to talk to Kamui and takes his time. You can see in the first part of this conversation he does not imply he is busy unlike in EN, and when talking about his siblings it felt more detailed. However it’s too long that I couldn’t add the screenshot here. The huge difference can be noticed in the last part of this support.

When Kamui feels left out from Ryouma’s stories, it feels more depressing with his reply in EN where he reiterates that his background is troubling and sad— “Your story is troubling one”. In contrast to JP Ryouma, He comforts Kamui and is very thankful and happy that Kamui is back to them safely and he values his moments with Kamui — “I am grateful you treasure our moments together”.

Notice the contrasts with their portraits:

A SUPPORT:

Corrin felt left out and melancholic when Ryoma was talking about their siblings, in JP version the way he handle it that he is more caring, concerned and brotherly which makes Kamui very happy and comforted, which the conversation again is longer and meaningful than EN, which is short and condensed.

Little detail I noticed comparing the two: It felt out of place with the Ryoma shouting in this part which didn’t happen in the original version.

Later in the support, Corrin is given a ring from Ryoma and their siblings. In JP there's additional information, the ring is a prayer ring for self-defence particularly. Comparing the two it seems lines in the EN are condensed vs the original with Corrin’s reaction when given a ring. Also take note of the closing part of the JP version it says that link as siblings vs ties of EN.

Again, I noticed a little detail with the differences with the portraits:

“Happy to have you”, frown portrait lol

MY THOUGHTS:

The EN version seems to lean more about Corrin’s background and more of how sad his situation is while the JP version is more on sibling bonding and connection. The JP version is what I had expected of their supports,as the long lost sibling I am sure the eldest brother would be very hyped to connect with Corrin/Kamui, but in EN and it doesn’t feel that way and I even didn’t like their supports at first in EN as Ryoma felt a bit distant and it felt something was missing and now I found out that many was cut out from the original. Now I love their support more, especially that in JP that it felt more caring and there is brotherly bond and connection that was lost in the localization.

Also another thing I noticed, it seems JP Ryoma seems calmer and nicer than in EN, in the supports and in the main story. In EN it feels like he’s rash, tempered or temperamental. I have a conspiracy theory that the localization team is trying to do a character assassination attempt with Ryoma. Though I have no solid proof at the moment but if ever in the future when I am fluent with Japanese, I’ll do a deep dive into how they changed the characterization of Ryoma and the rest of the cast.

CONCLUSION:

I always thought that there would be few differences between JP vs EN but now see is that is not the case, there are many changes made for the international audience, both little to huge. I didn't even expect that they would change small details like portraits that would make subtle changes.

Is there a word count limit for the localizers?

As you can see time and time again, EN is way shorter than JP that results in meaning and sincerity gone, and warm interactions become cold. Cutting the script made it bad. Are they lazy?! Or were they rushed?

Most of all. Why am I fussing about these? About Corrin’s/Kamui’s relationship with the Hoshidan Siblings?

Because I was expecting that the siblings would be very welcoming to Corrin especially as a long lost sibling and eager to reconnect . I was so disappointed in the EN version that it seems that they aren’t much interested and Corrin doesn't feel welcome. It is upsetting especially that’s one of the reasons for choosing them and to be at their side and the whole theme of the plot is which family would you be with.

When I played the original/ JP version, albeit with translation mod, I am so happy to find that in the original JP version that they are warm, welcoming and want to connect with Kamui, and it feels like they have a genuine sibling bonding, making choosing them very worthwhile. It did improve my opinion of them and I love them more.

I have a hypothesis, why EN toned down the sibling bonding due to S supports. Probably it would be awkward with all that sibling talk, afterwards to marry them. Personally I really don’t like Corrin marrying the siblings, it ruined the story for me. I pretend that those S-supports never existed and that is why I didn’t include those in this write-up.

So does this mean I’m one of those “the Original is better” persons, NO. I’m more into good writing, it so happens most meaningful interactions are in the JP script. And to be fair with EN, there are things I like with the changes like Corrin’s supports with Hinoka, Rinka, which surprisingly feels better than the original.

I could go deeper if only I knew Japanese so that I could notice the nuances and subtleties which were lost in translation. For now I’ll make do with these translations and hope that the translations are accurate. And hopefully someday I could look back with this write-up and make improvements.

That’s all and THANK YOU!! Thank you for reading this long essay. This took me months to write and I truly appreciate you taking your time to read this. I hope it sees the Hoshidan siblings in a better light.

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