#jttw book club

[journeythroughjourneytothewest]

A happy pride month from the pilgrims!

[nikofortuna]

JTTW Chapter 59 Thoughts

Chapter 59 for the @journeythroughjourneytothewest Reading Group!

In the German translation this starting poem is just a little different in the details and I like that it mentions the three-legged golden crow. They show up in Fabulous Beasts as well including a scene where the archer Hou Yi shoots down the nine suns, which thinking about that story in the context of the suns being birds it makes so much sense.

Woodcutters seem to just be the most chill guys in all of Journey to the West. They are always nice and helpful and do not bat an eye at Sun Wukong’s appearance whatsoever.

That does make me curious as to why the people of that village think of Princess Iron-Fan as a he. Or was it perhaps just a misunderstanding on Sun Wukong’s part? While in this translation the old man also called her by he, perhaps the original Chinese used a gender-neutral pronoun and that’s where the confusion stems from.

Hmmm, how could she possibly get to see her son again… Oh, I do not know, but maybe request for Sun Wukong to ask Guanyin to let her see him sometime? Sun Wukong even suggests it himself. It is really not that complicated or difficult, Guanyin is kind and she would probably be fine with it. Make it a boarding school type of thing where Hong Hai’er gets to see his relatives on set holidays or something of the like.

I do feel this whole conflict could have been handled by just talking it out. Like Princess Iron-Fan did not say she would not lend him her fan outright, just that she cannot give it away that easily. Sun Wukong could have just asked her to come along to extinguish the mountain herself.

Ah, there is the misogyny rearing its head again. We went through such a fine arc with the Kingdom of Women already, one would think they would tone it down after that.

Careful now if she fans him too often he will just come back from the opposite direction!

Oh it would have been funny if Princess Iron-Fan had not budged after being hit in the lower abdomen along the lines of ‘I have given birth before, you think that little bit of pain will make me cave?’ and only react to the chest pain.

Is Zhu Bajie suggesting going around the mountain? Finally they address this! Though the explanation why they cannot just go around the obstacle only works in the context of all of this being an allegory, if taken at face value it makes no real sense.

[lavaflowe]

JTTW BOOK CLUB

CHPT 7-9

@journeythroughjourneytothewest

Chpt 7

•”All this was probably refined in his stomach by the Samadhi fire to form a single solid mass” I know other deities can use the fire but I’m wracking my brain for when it used before(this point) specifically- My understanding was the furnace refined the immortal elixirs and fruit- I’m going to assume Laozi is just theorizing and doesn’t know what actually happened

•Diamond body….👀

•Erlang gets absolutely DRIPPED out, he earned it FR

•eyes permanently irritated by the smoke churned up the the Xun trigram, someone get this man some eye drops

•he is extra pissed

•HE JUST BODIES LAOZI IM YELLING😂

•”this cosmic being fully fused with nature’s gifts passes with ease through 10,000 toils and tests”

•Big war form out to beat serious ass, he’s not jokin bitch

•” bright and luminous; ….illustrious pearl of mani he is indeed” MMMMM comparing him to a mani- a flaming (wish granting) jewel is hilarious 💀

•Tathagata bringing in the big guns (himself)

•”how tf do you know The Way and not know who I am?? And you’re so….violent” I can sense the side eye

•I wonder if Wukong has previous incarnations?? Buddha says he just reached human form this incarnation but if his rock was there at the beginning of creation, wouldn’t his soul be ‘baking’ (for lack of a better term) the whole time until he hatched?

•” and with a total lack of respect he left a bubbling pool of monkey urine” Iconic moment LMAOOOO

•smart for Wukong to leave a momento- too bad it didn’t matter lol

•ah so he was jumping to visit the pillars again, not run away(supposedly)- he’d rather prove he’s right than escape💀 that checks out

•monkey has been squished, it is now party o’clock

•are you allowed to give the Buddha drugs if it’s an offering? Like wine??🤔 “wtf is this allowed? Wtf”

•”Wukong is wiggling out”

“Dw, take this”

*slaps tag on the mountain like flex tape*

•enough room to breathe and move his hands- I would lose my mind

•Molten copper & iron pellets mimic punishments in hell (just learned this🙏), shedding the Karma like water -I feel like 500 years is pretty good tbh considering everything

Woe molten metal and iron upon ye

Chpt 8 + 9 under cut:

Chpt 8:

•lots of lovely poems in this chapter

•a paragraph recap of the past 7 chapters

•wonder what Feast of the Ullambana Bowl is? (the notes say it’s a mass for the dead and is also know as the Ghost festival, practiced by Taoists and Buddhists)

•”the Chan mind shines bright like a thousand rivers’ moon; true nature’s pure and great as an unclouded sky.”

Lovely poem, and I’m beginning to realize this book is very heavily focused on the Chan school, which I don’t know why I didn’t pick up on sooner? White-Robed Guan Yin is a Chan specific form, usually depicted in their bamboo grove

•Tathagata reveals his 3 baskets of scripture after everyone is done presenting their poems, feels almost like he suggested the celebration to announce these

•Each basket corresponds to scriptures of Heaven, Earth, and the Damned- a total of 15,144 FUCKING SCROLLS

•oooo Guanyin poem!! “ a golden body filled with wisdom, fringes of dangling pearls and jade, …dark hair piled smartly in a coiled-dragon bun. With brows of new moon shape and eyes like two bright stars, her jadelike face beams natural joy. …Her orchid heart delights in green bamboos; her chaste nature loves the wisteria. The living Guanyin from the Cave of Tidal Sound.”

•5 Talismans: Embroidered Cassock that will protect him from falling back into the Wheel of Transmigration, a 9 ring priestly staff that will protect him from poison or harm, 3 tightening fillets- the Golden, the Constructive, and the Prohibitive Spell.

•Guanyin thinks this will take about 2 to 3 years💀 hooooo boy….

•FLOWING SAND RIVER!!! MY 2ND FAV BOY!!!

•Green and Black complexion, Gleaming eyes like the lights beneath a stove, forked mouth with teeth like knives and swords, and disheveled red hair

•like that Wujing is using a priest staff he def took from one of the monks he ate lol

•Wujing fighting Moksa for his life only to drop everything to apologize and talk to Guanyin LMAO

•MOKSA PICKS HIM UP BY THE COLLAR AKFKAKDJDJ

•ah, so Wujing didn’t reincarnate, he was changed, STABBED OVER 100 TIMES EVERY 7 DAYS AND FORCED TO COMMIT CANNABILSM SO HE DOESNT STARVE AS PUNISHMENT- THATS JUST LOVELY😭

•I like the interpretation that he could have been trying to signal a coup by breaking the crystal cup

•Guanyin hearing about Wujing’s string of skulls: it’s a surprise tool that will help us later

•BAJIE TIME

•this idiot bro “HOW DARE YOU TRY TO GET FLOWER PETALS IN MY EYES!!” “IDIOT THAT WAS GUANYIN” “…Guanyin is here??” “LOOK UP”

•Wuneng is reincarnated, he got beat to death in Heaven for hitting on Chang’e LMAOOOOO GET REKT

•ah yes, casually mentions killing his pig family and then his life of eating humans. Lovely.

•AO LIE TIME

•I committed a little accidental arson, please bail me out

•Damn, he got a really short intro

•interesting that Guanyin id’s the Peach Banquet as Wukongs fall from grace. I would def agree with this- eating the peaches like he did was extremely reckless and the beginning of the end imo

•”who tf is talking shit up there”

•No one has ever visited Wukong, I’m guessing the Guards were horrible company

•I like how both Guanyin and Sanzang try to give Wukong a religious name- Guanyin is very happy to hear he has the Wu- prefix as well lol

•arrived in Chang’an, let the hunt begin

Chpt 9:

•Chang’an bb, all blooming flowers surrounded by 8 rivers (DAMN, that’s a lot of water)

•Guangrui got first place in the examination, good for him UwU

•SURPRISE WIFE

•”gave the girl to Guangrui as his bride” UM I THINK SHES THE ONE WHO GRABBED HIM LMAO

•Guangrui has some fated beef with these two random boatmen, Liu Hong and Li Biao- states that he was destined in a previous incarnation to be enemies with them, is this a result of bad karma?

•NOOOOOO MY GUY GUANGRUI

•Liu Hong reminds me of Liu’er Mi-*gunshot*

•since they’re at the bottom of the Hong river, which Dragon King is this?

•Golden Carp coming in clutch, nice

•LADY YIN IS SO METAL LETS GO “she hated the bandit so bitterly that she wished she could devour his flesh and sleep on his skin” DO IT GURL, KILL HIM

•damn, too bad she’s pregnant with Sanzang….dw Girl I know you would kick his ass otherwise…

•there goes his toe…

•get named River Float idiot

•damn bro chill, that wasn’t very monk-like of you

•homie got called an orphan and cried JAKDJSJFJ I FEEL BAD

•she didn’t even check the toe I THOUGHT SHE DID- WHAT WAS THE POINT LMAO

•nvmnd

•I guess licking the eyes is better than spitting on them…sigh…

•GODDAMN THEY RIPPED LIU HONG AND LI BAIO APART….good for them, deserved in fact

•Lady Yin committing suicide even after she was reunited with her husband makes sense, as there was a trend where wives whose husbands died or they were assaulted, killed themselves. This was show loyalty to their husbands and add weight to their claim of SA- Lady Yin’s husband coming back does not change the fact that everyone knows she was forcefully married :((

(I use the term ‘trend’ only as a way to describe the rise and fall in wife suicides tied to either a husbands death or as a response to SA)

[digitalagepulao]

Will Horse, Mind Monkey

i thought i'd do a little something today since the reading club for JTTW over at @journeythroughjourneytothewest hosted by @/sketching-shark officially begins tomorrow! to everyone embarking on this venture, i hope we all have a wonderful time, and wishing for us plenty of fun, learning, and inspiration!

also lowkey Bai Longma concept reveal! i based him off Mongolian horses because i adore them, i find their resilience and endurance a good match for the Will Horse allegory, and also the mental image of a long noodle dragon turning into a stout horse incredibly comical

[here4tripitaka]

Chapter 58: Wukong chooses good over evil. By killing somebody.

Well, this chapter explained a lot. I’m finally up to speed with you all - the Six-Eared Macaque was Wukong’s alter ego. Now that I know, I’m seeing the last few chapters differently. So I want to circle back to this from last chapter:

Look, we’ve all had bad experiences with team work. I’m sure we’ve all had times when we’ve wanted to spit the dummy and just do the whole thing ourselves. So we can take all the credit, which we totally deserve… maybe. But apparently that is not the solution.

It is interesting that the macaque is killed, not just subdued. Not only is it killed, the entire species is permanently eradicated:

That is, Wukong’s decision to commit to ‘good’ is permanent; even irreversible. That is a deep level of commitment. It’s very different from the idea of having to fight temptation constantly - having to re-commit to choosing good every day, many times each day.

In other words, I was thinking this:

Whereas Wukong was thinking this:

I guess he’s got a point. If you’re ever going to reach true enlightenment, I guess you’ve got to quit your earthly bullshit once and for all.

So I guess it’s kind of like this:

And then you’re Gryffindor forever, no further effort required to stay away from the dark side. HOORAY! Except I think Wukong would be more like:

Interestingly, Tathagata’s description of the Six-Eared Macaque doesn’t make him sound inherently evil:

The footnote is cool:

Brave’s AI had a wildly different take on that saying:

I mean, Yu would know better than random AI, obviously. But the AI answer did make me curious. Alas, the search results seemed to have nothing to do with it.

Anyway, Wukong’s lack of sentimentality in killing the macaque is interesting. So is his reproach to Tathagata when Tathagata seems horrified:

Perhaps Wukong is right: perhaps bad traits within oneself should be squelched unflinchingly, without a backward glance. Perhaps compassion is an inappropriate reaction there, just as Tripitaka’s “compassion” is misplaced a lot of the time.

Still, I’m surprised that nobody punishes him or says he’s out of line for telling Tathagata of all beings what to do. Seems pretty cheeky.

The conflict between Wukong and Tripitaka is resolved by Tathagata and Guanyin telling Wukong and Tripitaka to pull their heads in. Tripitaka obeys without hesitation. I kind of love this about him.

Tripitaka and Wukong really are opposites in this way. Wukong is all backtalk, defiance and autonomy. Tripitaka is obedience and reverent submission personified.

Anyway, this results in everyone being best buds again:

Because no one needs to actually talk through their differences or resolve their feelings about, you know, whether it’s okay to murder people or not. They just need to be told by their superiors to get over it.

And now, in no particular order, honourable mentions from this week:

I loved the bureaucratic hand-writing at the Mountain of Perpetual Shade. “I’m not sure how to deal with this. Let me call my manager. Let me call ALL the managers!”

That moment where you want to be nice to your guests, cos they seem really fancy. But you also want them to leave before they smash up the furniture:

Flower showers!

These were referenced in in chapter 52, too:

I wish I knew what Yu was talking about. Even my best googling returns nothing. But it sure does sound pretty!

Last up, it just sank in that Guanyin has a cockatoo:

TIL cockatoos are not just Australian. And that Indonesian white cockatoos look much more regal than their Australian sulphur-crested cousins. 

Apparently:

They were quite popular in China during the Tang dynasty, a fact which in turn influenced the depictions of Guan Yin with a white parrot. The Fourth Crusade was also sealed between Holy Roman Emperor Frederick II and the Sultan of Babylon in 1229 with a gift of a white cockatoo.

Speaking of all things nature, did anyone notice that the macaque turned into a bee when it tried to escape? Alas, the macaque’s bee clearly wasn’t as impressive as Wukong’s bee transformation at the Scorpion Demon’s lair, because the macaque’s bee doesn’t get any poetry. Let’s honour it with this picture instead.

RIP, Evil Wukong!

@journeythroughjourneytothewest

---

Image credits: The usual spiel. The images above are either AI, or random pictures from the web, or a Frankenstein of both; some modified, some not. They are not original. The pre-existing images should turn up with reverse googling or have links embedded, but feel free to ask and I’ll dig up sources.

[ryin-silverfish]

Chapter 18: What a Swine!

-A few pages into the chapter, and I found the first hook to go on a giant tangent: according to Gao Cai, Gao Village is located in the Kingdom of Qoco. I have no idea why Yu translated it as such, since the original Chinese name——Wusi Zang(乌斯藏, a transliteration of dbus gtsang) sounds nothing like that, but in short, it's the Ming dynasty name for Tibet.

-However, a quick glance at this map would show you that the real Xuanzang didn't cross Tibet during his journey; rather, he went the long way around the Himalayas, travelling on the Central Asian Silk Road. In the Ming dynasty, if you wanna go to India, you could actually take the route through the Himalayas and Nepal, but it wasn't there in the Tang dynasty (because there were a couple of hostile kingdoms in the way; Tuyuhun, Tubo, etc.)

-Sidenote, I absolutely love how JTTW '86 adapted this chapter, with SWK getting his flirt on and the legendary "Pigsy Carrying His Bride" sequence that had made its way into many subsequence adaptations.

-JTTW Research had written pretty comprehensively about Pigsy's origins, from the Daoist deity Marshal Canopy to his ties with Marici, an import deity with a boar mount who's also associated with the Dipper Constellation. As such, I only had one tidbit to add about possible inspirations for his character in folklore that predated the above.

-The earliest tale about a lusty pig demon could be found in the Tang dynasty Xuan Guai Lu(玄怪录). Guo Yuanzhen, a historical general during the reign of Gaozong and Wu Zetian, came across a mansion in his youth during travel. The whole place was lavishly decorated, as if preparing for a wedding banquet, but eeriely empty save for one crying woman.

-Turned out, she was the unwitting soon-to-be bride of a god called "General Wu"(乌将军), who demanded a beauty as his wife every year from the locals, and because they would pay a hefty sum to "buy" said bride, her own father sold her out to be this year's sacrifice. Furious, Guo disguised himself as a guest, pretended to offer General Wu some venison, then cut off his hand with the meat knife.

-Wounded, the General fled, and his severed limb turned into a pig's hoof once the sun came out. Soon, the bride's family and village elders came to the manor, ready to collect her body for the funeral, and were so freaked out by what Guo did that they were ready to sacrifice him to General Wu too, since the "god" was known to summon storm and hails whenever he didn't get his bride.

-Guo scolded them for being so damn guillible because no real gods would demand human sacrifices or, y'know, have pig hooves as hands, before gathering the young men of the villages and following the trail of blood to the pig demon's abode, where they proceeded to smoke it out and kill it with an assortment of arrows and farming tools.

-The woman, after calling out her terrible parents, pledged herself to Guo and became one of his wives, and all was well.

-Honestly, Pigsy's evolution from his folklore origins to JTTW Zaju to JTTW novel seemed to be one in which he became increasingly sympathetic; from basically being a more lusty version of Guanyin's goldfish, to an opportunistic kidnapper who took advantage of a pair of star-crossed lovers' family feud, to an ex-deity turned reformed demon who kinda got screwed over by his in-laws.

-Final note: Pigsy bragged that even if they could get the "Monster-Routing Patriarch" to come down from the Nine Heaven and exorcise him, he could still claim to be an old buddy of the guy. Which…wasn't wrong, considering that "Monster-Routing Patriarch" was the title of Emperor Zhenwu, Lord of the North, who was worshipped alongside Marshal Canopy as one of the Four Saints of the North Pole.

@journeythroughjourneytothewest

[crzyimp]

JJTW Chapter 6

Guanyin when arriving for the Peach Festival:

Bodhisattva Guanyin finally shows up and already having to deal with Wukong's (and future) shenanigans.

One thing that popped out to me was that Wukong being merciful to Moksha and Erlang due to their ages. Wukong does/commit many things, but killing minors(but are they minors or just young adults?) isn't one of them. He did the same with Nezha earlier too.

It's was heartbreaking seeing Wukong so defeated after scaring his own troop and even trying to join them inside the cave. I personally think he wanted to comfort his family before being stopped by the others. He didn't even fight the men waiting for him at the cave! He chose to shape shift away instead. I really wanted to know what was going through his head during that moment, the poor monkey king probably beating himself up for scaring his family and maybe even guilt for bring all of this mess to their doorstep.

Don't wanna ramble too much, so this is my take away from chapter 6!

@journeythroughjourneytothewest

[journeytothewestresearch]

Chapter 8

@journeythroughjourneytothewest

I'm not doing the read along, but I wanted to point out something that others might find interesting.

You will recall that the Buddha has a not so nice opinion about South Jambūdvīpa, a.k.a. the Land of the East (China).

I have watched the Four Great Continents, and the morality of their inhabitants varies from place to place. Those living on the East Pūrvavideha revere Heaven and Earth, and they are straightforward and peaceful. Those on the North Uttarakuru, though they love to destroy life, do so out of the necessity of making a livelihood. Moreover, they are rather dull of mind and lethargic in spirit, and they are not likely to do much harm. Those of our West Aparagodānīya are neither covetous nor prone to kill; they control their humor and temper their spirit. There is, to be sure, no illuminate of the first order, but everyone is certain to attain longevity. Those who reside in the South Jambūdvīpa, however, are prone to practice lechery and delight in evildoing, indulging in much slaughter and strife. Indeed, they are all caught in the treacherous field of tongue and mouth, in the wicked sea of slander and malice (emphasis added). However, I have three baskets of true scriptures which can persuade man to do good (Wu & Yu, 2012, vol. 1, pp. 204-205). 我觀四大部洲，眾生善惡，各方不一：東勝神洲者，敬天禮地，心爽氣平；北俱盧洲者，雖好殺生，只因糊口，性拙情疏，無多作踐；我西牛賀洲者，不貪不殺，養氣潛靈，雖無上真，人人固壽；但那南贍部洲者，貪淫樂禍，多殺多爭，正所謂口舌兇場，是非惡海。我今有三藏真經，可以勸人為善。

This is similar to foreign views of China that the historical monk Xuanzang encountered in India. Brose (2021) writes:

For many of the monks he had befriended, the decision [to return to China] was hard to fathom. “India is the birthplace of the Buddha,” they reminded him. “Although the Great Sage is gone, his traces remain. To travel around and venerate them is enough to make one’s life content. Why would you want to give this up after having come here? China is a barbarian land where people are neglected, and the Dharma is despised. That is why no buddhas have ever been born there. The people have narrow aspirations and deep impurities, so sages do not go there. The air is cold and the land is dangerous. How can you think of returning there?” Xuanzang reportedly responded by quoting an exchange from the Vimalakīrti Sūtra, where the noble layman Vimalakīrti asks Śāriputra, “Why does the sun come to Jambudvīpa?” The answer: “To illuminate it and eliminate the darkness.” If Xuanzang remained in India, the true Dharma might never be known in China (pp. 61-62).

Xuanzang believed he lived in the latter day of the law, so he felt it was important to return to China with fresh sutras so that Buddhism would continue to flourish there for centuries to come.

Sources:

Brose, B. (2021). Xuanzang: China’s Legendary Pilgrim and Translator. Boulder, Colorado: Shambhala Publications, Inc.

Wu, C., & Yu, A. C. (2012). The Journey to the West (Vols. 1-4) (Rev. ed.). Chicago: University of Chicago Press.

[loyaltykask]

Chapter 5

Love the smack talk.

Wukong: So rude Gods: You broke all the laws! Wukong: But I wasn't rude about it

True peak: Cry about it

Warlord Wukong really said: I have favoritism only for my own family

RUTHLESS. Love it.

Love Wukong but it must have been a bitch to be one of those 72 Demon Kings that follow under him out of fear.

Talk about a toxic workplace environment. @journeythroughjourneytothewest

[creativeafterdark]

Chapter 8

So unfortunately this week I have no sketches for the chapter due to slight burn out and work related reasons (also I had completely forgotten we get introduced to the pilgrims minus Sanzang in this chapter and their designs are anything but ready). As a result, I'm just going to write my thoughts.

@journeythroughjourneytothewest

First things first: Guanyin. I love Guanyin. They're just so calm about being attacked by two monsters and letting Hui'an handle combat. It also shows the sheer difference in strength between the four disciples, after seeing the trouble that he went through fighting Sun Wukong. Guanyin is a true being of mercy, not really making a big fuss out of being attacked and I commend them for it, I would be chewing Zhu and Sha's heads off. Though the "Perhaps in Two or Three Years" answer they gave the great Immortal, I'll need to pay attention to how much time passes to see if that's accurate (but I recall the full journey takes 14 years? Correct me if I'm wrong).

Next up: Sha Wujing. So after I'd previously read the Abridged Version, I was utterly confused as to why the Jade Emperor was petty enough to punish this poor man for BREAKING A CUP. Then I found a comic by antidotefortheawkward that explained how breaking a cup could be seen as a signal to attack. And I was like "...ah. That makes more sense now." Still a little petty, not hearing him out, but it made sense that it would be his first thought. Especially if he was cast out AFTER Sun Wukong's Havoc. I don't think we got a clear answer on that timeline (again feel free to correct me!). Even if he did eat people, I still love this pilgrim and can't wait for his chapter.

Next: Zhu Wuneng, aka Zhu Bajie. Quick to lower his weapon for a woman, lol. Jokes aside, it seems as though he's very unlucky with women (and vice versa). There is his flirting with the Moon Goddess (which is still unclear if it was consensual or unwelcomed, that would change my opinion of how this all went down), him killing his new form's mother and siblings (I've heard people say human flesh tastes like pork, so I guess that's where he got the taste for it, huh?), and the death of Second Elder Sister Egg (and him getting all her stuff). Unlike Sha Wujing, it does feel like Zhu Wuneng was begging a lot more for mercy. But Guanyin chose to believe his intent as being genuine, so he will be the next disciple.

Next: OUR DRAGON BOY. I'm gonna call him Bai Longma, as that's the name most know him by. I feel out of all of these, his punishment was the most unfair, and the fact that his father went to the Jade Emperor and seemed to be just fine with a DEATH SENTENCE honestly kills me. Like, I feel as though everyone was so on edge after Sun Wukong that punishments just amped up. I am glad Guanyin immediately jumped to his defense, and as a result got Sanzang a much better mount than any old horse.

And finally: Sun Wukong. Our old monkey. And the start of my favorite relationship in the story (the friendship between Guanyin and Wukong). Sun Wukong is still very bitter of Tathagata's trick but appears willing to do what he must to get free, though knowing what I do, I'm already thinking "Uh huh. Sure. Whatever you say, Great Sage" in a sarcastic tone. But that's for another chapter.

And with that, Guanyin continues their own journey to Chang'an to find our Tang Sanzang.

All in all, a very short but important chapter, setting the stage for journey and meeting the key players.

I probably will be doing more writing than drawing for the next few chapters (minus the intro to Sanzang), to both get off this burn out and because I don't recall any characters that show up more in the story aside from these chapters, so I don't see a point in making a design for them.

[cookiescackles]

On chapter 42, Guanyin is so brutal to Red Son. Tbh he was given multiple chances that he did not take very well, and the demon king has probably done worst stuff to others. But still, kid’s bleeding crying and begging. Gah.

Meanwhile Wukong is hiding behind Guanyin to avoid getting hit by Red Son, and he’s like “say it again, say it again.” Bruh. Zhu Bajie moment. Bajie literally did the same thing to him the previous arc.

Wukong was also so respectful in his interactions with Guanyin this time tho. Does this count as a 杀鸡吓猴 moment?

I like to think the reason Guanyin didn’t give the other two circlets that the Buddha gave her to give to the chosen guy who will journey west(Buddha gave her three), is so that Bajie and Wujing doesn’t have to wear it.

Wukong: When I was your age, being 300-400 years old, your uncle I was already a super powerful demon king.

Red Son: Same! also not your nephew hrrrrrr

Wukong: ok but I didn’t go around bullying all the tudi and mountain gods. And I didn’t eat monks

[journeythroughjourneytothewest]

So how about that first meeting between Sun Wukong and Erlang Shen.

[nikofortuna]

JTTW Chapter 51 Thoughts

Chapter 51 for the @journeythroughjourneytothewest Reading Group!

You know Sun Wukong is deeply upset if he actually begs for someone’s help.

Maybe he should have warned them about the weapon snatching ring upfront. Though he was probably not expecting it to absorb fire as well or be able to repel water.

The German translation points out in the notes how the Star of Fiery Virtue being associated with red and the South and the Star of Watery Virtue being associated with black and the North is in reference to the Wuxing specifically the fire and water element.

To be honest I did not pay enough attention to notice that when Sun Wukong went to get water he went to the Northern Gate instead of the Southern one when I read that part. However I did notice that the present deities only asked why he was there without an ‘again’ attached to it and half-thought it was a different day so different deities were on patrol but no it was just a different gate instead.

For as much as Sun Wukong is probably frustrated with that fiend he also seems to really enjoy their clashes.

It is also just a fun back and forth to read with all the cameos and entertaining smaller fights.

[lavaflowe]

JTTW READING CLUB CATCH UP

Pt. 2

@journeythroughjourneytothewest

Chpt 4 Thoughts:

•the fighting immediately at the gate should have tipped everyone off this wasn’t going to go well💀 doomed from the start

•the hand holding with Gold star of Venus and Wukong I am not okay, I’m exploding it’s so cute

•Holy shit the poem about Heaven is LONG

•Wukong handles being called a bogus immortal very well?? I thought he would be angrier about that… I guess he knows its true tho🤷‍♀️

•Wukong is fantastic at his job- the best horse girl around (for the 2 weeks he was there lol)

•tantrum™️ kicks over his desk and smashes everything with his ruyi bang, causes property damage and LEAVES

•interesting that I’ve seen a lot of adaptations have him release the horses and do a mini havoc in Heaven

•love that it’s just 2 random demons who suggest 齐天大圣 to Wukong, not anyone important or anything JAKDJSJ

•HE QUITS AND THE JADE EMPEROR CALLS FOR HIM BE CAPTURED BECAUSE HES A MONSTER??? HUH???(I thought Gold Star stepped in but I GUESS I WAS WRONG)(capitalism smh /j)

•NEZHA APPEARANCE WHOOOO

•Spreading Flower axe sounds so cool, prime design material

•”eyes glowered strangely like burning stars; past his shoulders two ears, forked and hard; his voice resounded like bells and chimes”<- poem about Wukong, so lovely

•Theme I’m noticing: Wukong treated like an animal until proven otherwise (makes sense but also not)

•asks Nezha whose little brother is he, and Nezha immediately spits back like 3 insults JAKFJSJSJ, he is not here to mess around🔫

•3 HEADED 6 ARM FIGHT: WUKONG v. NEZHA

•the old bait and switch then smashing Nezha’s shoulder (flash back to all the paintings of Nezha running off while holding his broken arm💀)

•Love that Wukong called himself the little brother of the fraternal 7

•Gold Star Of Venus more like Master Negotiator/Mediator

•….is Gold star lying??? WUH

•”Peace and Quiet” and “Serene Spirit”- it’s like they don’t know that’s gonna bore the shit out of Wukong💀 like watching a train wreck in slow motion- HES NEEDS ACTION AND SOMEONE TO PLAY WITH

Chpt 5&6 under cut:

Chpt 5 Thoughts:

•uses all his free time to make more friends

•Gold Star realizes that he may get bored so they give him an extremely tedious task that will also probably bore him JAKDJAJAJD

•HELP HE JUST STARTS EATING ALL THE PEACHES WHAT- he behaved for probably like 2 weeks (again) and then decided he couldn’t wait any longer to try the OLDEST AND RAREST FRUIT IN THE GARDEN!!! AND HE PICKS MULTIPLE, NOT JUST ONE

•I’m yelling he does this multiple times

•okay but him playing around and eating making him tired and taking a nap on the branches when he’s 2 inches tall?? Adorable, no longer mad he ate all the peaches, he’s just a little guy

•ah so he only ate the really good ones. Ofcourse.

•Gently breaking the news that he’s probably not invited to the banquet 😬

•immediately freezes the peach maidens- WHY??? WHAT WAS THE REASON???

•Identity theft smh

•he is feeling….mischievous

•RESIST UR IMPULSES OH MY GOD

•he is so wasted he accidentally wandered into Laozi’s lab

Wukong: I’ve never met Laozi….now is for SURE the perfect time to make friends, when I’m so drunk I can’t walk straight

•He keeps putting things in his mouth, very monkey™️ of him

•IMMEDIATELY sobered up and knew he was in deep shit

•he lived in heaven for over a century 👀👀, Wukong says half a year- so maybe like 175 days?

•he goes back to get wine for his monkeys 🥺🥺

•next day/year Everyone one complains about the Havoc LMAO, they just kept coming, I know the Jade Emperor is distraught HAJDJAJ

•Wukong was going to straight up ignore the heavenly army they sent if they hadn’t busted down his door😂

•all his demon Allies were captured while he did a 1 v 6 with Nezha and the 5 Devarajas

•Wukong starting to get lost in the sauce, doesn’t care his ally’s were captured as long as his monkeys are okay

Chpt 6 Thoughts:

•Guan Yin Rolling up their sleeves to fix this mess

•”nothing but an invitation to disappointment” THE DRAMATICS

•I wonder if the Greek constellations were actually listed or if that was a translation choice??

•interesting that he outlasted Moksa instead of outwitting him- I feel like there’s a deeper meaning to that

•Guan Yin: I have a solution…..call in your Nephew

Jade Emperor: GENIUS

•Erlang is PUMPED to fight Wukong

•something something Erlang Shen is HAWT

•Erlang Shen: I’m here to kick your ass and arrest you

Wukong: your MOM

Erlang already swinging:

•Warform fight pt 2: Electric Boogaloo

•”they darted as stars to fill the sky”

•Erlangs eye being called the Phoenix Eye sounds SO COOL

•spotted bustard has no standards-I stand by the whore joke

•Erlang having fun with their fight LMAOOOOO

•HELP WHY DID HE WASTE TIME ENTERING A TEMPLE??? WUKONG PLS💀💀 UR ARMY IS GONE AND YOURE CORNERED NOW IS NOT THE TIME

•Wukong defeated with an assist from Laozi and Xiaotian

•stabbed for his crimes

•it’s execution time

•really loved that the poems were used to describe all of the fights

[digitalagepulao]

The Yu translation calls the King of Havoc's weapon as a scimitar, which I can only assume means a dao. There are many types of dao, and at the period this chapter should happen, that means that curved blades are only just starting to become a more common sight. They range from 84 to 114 centimeters, but for the sake of convenience, I'll pick a length that matches the human arm from wrist to shoulder.

The King of Havoc is described as "thirty feet" tall which is a hecking lot!! By average proportions, just his head is 3ft tall!

Also by average proportions, that means that the length of his arms is somewhere around 340cm or 10'11''. Meaning that the dao that Wukong takes from him has a blade of about that size, and we can eyeball the handle as somewhere in the ballpark of 3ft or 92cm.

In academic terms, that's a beeg sword!

@journeythroughjourneytothewest

[here4tripitaka]

Chapter 57: Opposite Day Tripitaka gets violent; Wukong cries; Sandy goes nuclear

The one where Tripitaka dies. Except not.

This week I’m going to jump around a bit more. Let's get into it.

Tripitaka and Wukong

Last week I was deeply unimpressed with Tripitaka and sympathetic to Wukong. This week it’s the opposite. Tripitaka gets 10/10 from me for the way he handles things, whereas I’m pretty unimpressed with Wukong for (1) hitting Tripitaka and (2) being an insincere git who’s trying to get back in with Tripitaka for all the wrong reasons.

It’s not that he’s realised he was wrong to kill all those people; not that he misses Tripitaka; not that he’s worried Tripitaka won’t be able to complete the journey without him. No, he’s just too embarrassed to go home with his tail between his legs:

Have you ever had an ex who promised to change that thing you broke up with them over - only to go right back to their old ways once you agreed to get back together? Well, Wukong is the platonic version of that:

Tripitaka, to his credit, is not fooled:

Is this really the same guy who was fooled three times by Lady White Bone - and so many others? I think our boy is growing up.

This is one of my favourite themes in JTTW - this stuff about gullibility being a moral shortcoming. I mean, I don’t actually know whether Wukong is sincere here. But it doesn’t seem like it.

I’m still against the violence - the band-tightening spell. But I have more sympathy for Tripitaka this time, because he’s made it very clear he wants Wukong gone. BOUNDARIES, WUKONG. And Tripitaka seems much more calm and collected, so it doesn’t seem spiteful.

Wukong continuous with his “weasley, manipulative ex” schtick:

Tripitaka, to his credit, maintains his boundary:

You really can’t say fairer than that. He doesn’t get violent - he gives Wukong a square warning.

It's pretty much the same when Wukong circles back when Tripitaka is hungry, dehydrated and vulnerable. Tripitaka still isn’t having it, and decides he’d rather die than accept sustenance from him. This, of course, is where Wukong hits Tripitaka - which is just beyond the pale.

Crying

Wukong gets an audience with Guanyin to dob on Tripitaka, and here’s where it happens:

I know next to nothing about pre-modern Chinese culture, but apparently this is how it’s DONE. 

For context, a few weeks ago, I tried to find out what the deal was with male crying. After all, Tripitaka cries a LOT. It turns out that academic Ya Zuo has done a bunch of work on it - at least for the Song era. It was fascinating - to me, anyway. (Scroll down to the row of tear drops if you’re not so fascinated, cos I’m gonna go on a spiel here.)

Crying was seen as an activity done by men, to be witnessed by other men, mostly for the sake of consolidating elite power alliances with… you guessed it… other men. Women and plebs could cry too, but their crying was seen as LAME, whereas elite male crying was BOSS.

This is kinda cool. Out of all the times somebody cried in Record of the Listener, it was men 42% of the time. That doesn’t sound like much, but women only made up 25% and children 4%. I guess the rest of the time it was deities, animals or - importantly - crying as a group activity. Group crying was well and truly a male-led, bromance-promoting activity. If Game of Thrones or House of Cards had been set in Song China, all the top players would have been strategically crying:

“[C]ontrary to the modern association of tears with weakness, male lacrymation [crying] in the Song acted to articulate and reinforce a position of dominance." (at 42)

Interestingly, Zuo finds that they weren’t necessarily crocodile tears - despite being political and purposeful.

Zuo explains a lot of interesting things. Apparently, one of the upsides of tears was that they could bridge awkward gaps where verbal communication would have just made things worse. As Zuo points out (I’m very loosely paraphrasing), you can’t really explain to the new emperor how you are TOTALLY loyal to them even though they just took over from your best bud the old emperor, who stood for the polar opposite. But you CAN bypass the awkwardness and cry your way into demonstrating some sort of unexplained yet heartfelt loyalty.

Wukong’s crying TOTALLY fits this. The “power alliance” thing, that is. Not the “this is too awkward to talk about” thing. He’s crying to try to convey his deep sincerity to Guanyin and forge an alliance, so he can force Tripitaka’s hand.

Tripitaka’s general teariness is a different beast. I’m still not sure that I understand the cultural context, but Zuo does talk about male tears in relation to morality. For instance:

That probably goes some way to explaining the waterworks when the queen of Women State and the scorpion demon tried to seduce him.

Guanyin: I’m always delighted when Guanyin makes an appearance. I could go on and on. Still, I don't really see why she thinks Wukong can't be in two places at once. Everyone knows he can do the hair-breath-clone thing. Unless someone's impersonating him.

Also, why would she send WUKONG with Sandy to go ascertain the truth at Flower-Fruit Mountain again? That’s like sending an accused criminal back to the scene of the crime with the police inspector to “help” them work out if the accused really did it.

Sandy: It was interesting to see Sandy take centre stage. I thought he was the even-keel voice of reason in the background. Apparently not, cos his idea of getting to the bottom of the truth about his doppelganger is simply to… kill him.

Dragon Horse: Why are they always tying up Dragon Horse? He’s an intelligent dragon-person in horse form. Surely he’s committed to the journey and knows not to wander off:

…

Tripitaka’s seeming death: Sandy and Bajie's reaction to thinking Tripitaka was dead was… oddly lax. They really should have tried a bit harder to check before calling it:

Calm down, guys. He's not dead.

Blue woollen wraps: What’s the deal with these? If they’re just blankets, can’t they get more? Did I miss some backstory? I’m gonna have to CTRL+F the chapters I missed, or something.

Tea rice: This made me want to try making tea rice. I’d never heard of it.

(Couldn’t find a pic of Chinese tea rice.)

Bad management: Why does Tripitaka bother to ask who wants to go to Flower-Fruit Mountain if he was always going to pick Sandy?

Wukong and the passport: He seems to think there’s a LOT more meaning to it than there is. Has the stress of the split turned him into some kind of passport conspiracy theorist? (Jokes.)

Wukong’s reply to Sandy about Golden Cicada makes no sense: Sandy points out that Wukong can’t just make his own journey to the west, because Tripitaka is Golden Cicada and that’s kind of the whole point. Wukong basically replies that he’s created his own clones of Tripitaka, Bajie and Sandy. But clearly the clone Tripitaka isn’t Golden Cicada, so it’s not really an answer.

Wukong’s group EATS their fallen comrade: what?!

Red Boy is still pretty snarky. I don’t think Wukong understands the concept of, “He’s just trying to get a rise out of you”:

And that’s it from me this week! I’m off to find out what the deal is with this Flower-Fruit Mountain Wukong clone thing.

“This is not what I meant when I said, ‘Let’s do body doubling'.”

@journeythroughjourneytothewest

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Image credits: The usual spiel. The images/gif above are random content from the web, some modified, some not. They are not original. The pre-existing images should turn up with reverse googling or have links embedded, but feel free to ask and I’ll dig up sources.