#johnny and tory parallels

[magedoesstuff]

I am a simple girl. I see a Johnny and Tory parallel edit I click on the like button, simple as that.

Seriously though, the parallels between those two make me feral. Especially when Johnny tells Daniel that Tory was working through her mother's death by fighting, and he knew because he was the same way when his mother died. I—speechless, I love them so much!!

[transjlawrence]

"He was a means to an end." "Is that what I am?"

Supernatural / Cobra Kai / Karate Kid II / I hope this reaches her in time by R.H. sin / Karate Kid / Franz Wright interviewed by Kaveh Akbar / Franz Kafka / Out of the Woodwork: The Real Food

[soupforsoup]

I'm so sorry but I do in fact need Robby to CLEAR Kwon or I will riot, if you're gonna have Kwon beat Robby AT LEAST make it because Kreese tells him to cheat so we can get some chewy parallels from tkk1 or else I'm tearing out the executives throats with my teeth

[riotpanther]

Cobra Kai Dynamics: Tory Nichols and John Kreese

I’d like to speak with you about Tory Nichols.

Let me guess, she owes you some money? Get in line.

No, I’m just a neutral third party looking out for her well-being.

What, are you her grandpa or something?

Or something.

[miriadalia]

Ok, I've seen some people comparing this scene from the trailer to the one in the KK1 movie where young Johnny kisses Ali against her will......

Ehmm NO

Please, writers, you can't do that T-T

Tory's been through so much already: abusive father, abusive aunt, predator landlord, idiot bosses, sick and then dead mother, little brother far away, friends and boyfriend incomprehension... And now a kiss without consent??? Hahahahaha NO

Also why making Kwon the ULTIMATE MONSTER?? One thing is being the most heartless fighter and other VERY DIFFERENT thing is being an ab*ser.

Yes, young Johnny did that and now he has a whole redemption series and all of us (I think) have forgiven him for what he did, even Ali. So why couldn't Kwon be like that too?

Well, I just think there's a limit they shouldn't surpass with the KK movie parallels. Not only because they're too dark but also because I crave more originality in the Cobra Kai plots.

Now I'm just hoping they won't remake that KK2 scene where Chozen keeped Kumiko hostage and threatened to kill her with a knife if Daniel wouldn't fight with him.

Oof... It would be so easy: Kwon loses against Robby and threatens to kill Tory with the knife Kreese brought from Korea. Then Robby fights Kwon in a death duel, but Kwon dies by accident with the knife in his heart as the leak said..........

[izzythehutt]

In hindsight Tory going back to the CK dojo seems like the most natural narrative choice in the world because A) her relationship with him remained unresolved in the last season—plus his excuses for leaving her behind are largely legit/she's been shielded from his most psychotic behavior and B) this show doesn't actually work if you don't have at least ONE main character in the CK dojo at any given time and she's the only one left who could plausibly flip (except maybe Kenny?) He's got to have a kid character to play off of and she has the strongest connection to him.

Plus like...the dramatic gold you can mine from the Johnny/Robby/Kreese/Tory inter-generational familial karate love square is unmatched.

[sleepyicon]

spent last class period watching keenry and lawrusso edits with my bestie, #lovinglife

[blusandbirds]

robby keene, kyoto

kyoto (phoebe bridgers) // strike first // cobra kai never dies // mercy // no mercy // now you're gonna pay // december 19 // the rise // the rise // downward spiral // taikai // match point // taikai // let's begin // bad eggs // long, long way from home

[autism-swagger]

Just saw someone call Robby and Miguel Lawrusso 2.0.... Are women not allowed to have anything.

[hawtriwitness]

oh wait, that breakdown is just... like tory's

COBRA KAI S6EP13 "SKELETONS" I loved you, man. Idolized you. Every good thing about myself... Strength. Confidence. Karate. You taught me. I only wanted to please you. So, yeah, that night in the parking lot, December 19, 1984, was the single worst moment of my life. But what hurt even more than being choked out was you abandoning me.

[zappedbyzabka]

Some of my general thoughts on CK season 6 part 3

Ralph and Billy's tearful scenes with 'Miyagi' and Kreese were phenomenal. They're such great actors 10/10.

I have a lot to say about Johnny's scene with Kreese but just to keep things short, I'll talk about that another time. But wow wow wow. Dominique Swain applauds.

Daniel's nonstop anxiety about his family getting hurt :/ least he had fun getting tipsy with his wife. Amanda looked gorgeous with that new hair (though she always does.) He really tapped into offense side this season. Looove how he knew exactly what to say to make Silver blank-face and leave lmao.

I'm SOOOO never getting over 'You're alright, Lawrence!' and lawrusso recreating the nose swipe scene with Daniel acting as Kreese for Johnny to inspire him. Johnny was MUCH enjoying that.

Daniel basically buying Johnny his building back?😭 AGHHHH. 'I believe in you'....

Tory being dressed in the same gi as young Johnny, and Robby being dressed in the Miyagi Do gi with a hurt leg—paralleling Daniel—in combination with those scenes being where they get back together makes me insane. Like, lawrusso in another universe.

I feel Robby could have gotten a more smoothed out and rewarding end but at the same time, I'm glad he's happy and taken care of now. Angel.

Sam and Tory's scenes together were so heartwarming. Especially the scene of Tory getting emotional over the LaRusso's kindness and generosity to her. Finally getting some one on one with Daniel and Johnny.

When Sam brought up having something to tell Daniel but being worried he'd be disappointed in her, my mind instantly went to a coming out scene tbh.

The montage of binary boyfriends and samtory as Bobby's reading the vows? What are you trying to say???

Bobby and Johnny meeting up again <333 Bobby still gives him that special 'I would actually do for you' stare (whether platonic or not) and I squeal about it. I love that Ron got some time to shine<333 I thought Jimmy would appear, but he sadly did not.

I also thought Anoush was gay but I was obviously mistaken since he was kissing Ralph's daughter (Julia's performance was hilarious.)

Silver speeding away with Johnny in that car was crazyyy. Billy had yet another Scott (not the werewolf) Mccall moment except he didn't get locked in a tower this time. You would've thought the employees would have seen Silver in the papers months ago and called the cops.

His envy over Daniel and Johnny having things to live for and people that actually love them was sad—especially with him being ill. If you think about it, Kreese was all he had besides the money, and when he didn't have Kreese the only way he had anyone around him was pretending to be someone else.

His jealousy over Kreese's love for Johnny really shined through as well with that 'I don't know why you messed up what I was doing with Kreese' (paraphrasing) and the way he called Kreese pathetic for groveling to Johnny no matter how many times he rejected him. Silver felt that he himself was pathetic for having always crawled back to Kreese no matter the rejection he faced.

Also the fucking grenade boat explosion scene??? INSANE???? Literally died in each other's arms. I know many people have problems with it but I don't see what else they really could have done for the two villains with endless crimes (which I love about them alright) that wouldn't be worse.

Think about how Silver probably thought he'd die alone, but didn't. When I realized Kreese was set on offing himself and taking Silver with him the whole time, and that was the reason he spent most of his scenes apologizing to the last few people he loved...

Would like to know more about what happened to Wolf. His bitchiness almost rivaled Johnny's, and damn did he eat up every scene he was in. Just a great character.

Johnny with the tailor? There's my prissy brat.

Considering everything wrong with the baby plot, I at least liked how they did end up choosing to show it. Johnny going full girl dad and being so sweet and coddling to the baby + Miguel and Robby made my heart SOAR. He's always been tender with them but the writers never really did let him to just relax and love. He deserves to be happy, like every imperfect victim irl and in fiction who gets bashed for not meeting people's standards does.

Carmen is a baddie. Just chilling truly

[purpleheartskies]

Robby is the underdog - Part 7

In s6e5, the leitmotif for Daniel's kk1 win against Johnny was used for Robby's captaincy win against Miguel.

(Watch with sound. Credit to another Robby fan who pointed this out to me and created this video.)

"A leitmotif is a repeating melodic phrase in music that is used to represent a character, setting, emotion, or theme. The intentional use of music as a means of communicating character, tone, or theme is a leitmotif." "The leitmotif has proven particularly effective in film scores as a means of creating continuity, heightening the drama and building an emotional connection between characters and the audience.

The fact that the leitmotif for Daniel's (first) win against his bully in kk1 is used for Robby's (first) win against his bully blatantly indicates that Robby is the underdog and Karate Kid of this story. This is more evidence that Robby is the Daniel in this kk story and Miguel is the Johnny.

It's important to note that when Miguel won the s1 avt final against Robby, no leitmotif was played when he won the match and was handed the trophy. Right before his win, an ominous motif was played, indicating that the win wasn't good. After he's handed the trophy and asked to speak, the shot slowly zoom's in on Johnny and starts playing his leitmotif in Cobra Kai (called Father and Son), because his focus was on Robby and his loss. This "win" for Johnny was a major loss in their relationship. In the s4 avt final, a triumphant motif was used for Eli's win, while a more melancholy one was used for Tory's win / Sam's loss.

No kid who has won a trophy so far had gotten the kk1 leitmotif for Daniel's win until Robby did in s6e5.

During the tournament in s1e10, Daniel approached Robby in the locker room and spoke to him about the "need" to find balance:

Robby: "I just wanted to get back at him [Johnny]." Daniel: "I know. But you're never going to find balance that way. You can't let that bad blood change who you are. I'm not saying you need to like the guy. I know I never will, but he... he is your father. And believe me, you're lucky to have one. You just gotta try to remember, he's... he's not a monster. He's just a guy with a lot of demons. Mr. Miyagi always told me there's no such thing as a bad student, only a bad teacher. And your dad had the worst teacher there ever was. It sent him down a wrong path. But you don't have to go down that path. Do you understand? You don't have to ever become him. Trust me. You let go of all that anger, and I guarantee you, no matter what happens tonight, you go home feeling great."

In kk1 tournament, during his conversation with Miyagi in the locker room, Daniel talked about his need to find balance.

Daniel: "Can you fix my leg with that thing you do?" Miyagi: "No need fight anymore. You proved a point." Daniel: "What? That I can take a beating? Every time I see those guys, they'll know they got the best of me. I'll never have balance that way, not with them, not with Ali... ...not with me."

Both Daniel and Robby are injured in these scene because a Cobra Kai had injured each of them during their semi-final fight and got disqualified for it. Both Daniel and Robby were then automatically given the semi-final win and were supposed to fight their bully, the main Cobra, in the final. (In my Robby is the underdog - Part 1.5 post, I go over some more of parallels between s1 Robby and kk1 Daniel in their respective avts and that Miguel had already been set up as the bully and Robby as the underdog going into the tournament.)

Both of their mentors had also told them that they didn't have to continue the tournament but both of them insisted that they wanted to. Daniel said what I've quoted above. Robby said, "Yes, I do. I'm going to have to face him sooner or later. Might as well be today."

Miyagi's original lesson to Daniel about balance was this:

"Better learn balance. Balance is key. Balance good, karate good. Everything good. Balance bad, better pack up, go home. Understand?"

In s6e5, Robby was losing the match, until he found balance when Tory arrived.

During the tournament in kk1, when Daniel was fighting to win a spot in the semis, Miyagi told Daniel: "Remember your defense. Points coming. Concentrate. Focus power. Remember balance. Make good fight."

During Robby's final match in the s1 avt, Daniel told Robby, "Breathe. Focus. Find your balance."

In his captaincy match, Robby was fighting offensively until he found balance, then he switched to mainly defense and won.

Interestingly, in the s4 avt, Daniel had at first told Eli something similar to what Miyagi had told Daniel in the kk1 tournament: "Concentrate, defense, focus, power. You find your balance, and those points will come."

However, after Eli told Daniel that Robby knows Miyagi-do better and Robby had scored one point on Eli, Daniel told Eli to fight using Cobra Kai and to put Robby on defense. This means that Robby was relying more on Miyagi-Do to fight, while Eli was relying more on Cobra Kai and won the tournament primarily using Cobra Kai teachings, despite representing Miyagi-Do. Eli didn't rely on having balance to win. He won by channeling his anger into fighting. It wasn't a real/pure Miyagi-Do victory.

Daniel had given up on Miyagi's teachings pretty quickly in order to secure the win in the s4 avt. Robby in turn still believes in and follows those teachings. In fact, his balance was off during his match with Eli because Robby had adopted "no mercy" while fighting Kenny and that had affected Robby greatly especially when he saw Kenny and had the realization that Cobra Kai wasn't helping him with his need to find balance.

In his captaincy match, he still relied on those Miyagi-Do lessons and teachings about balance. After he was able to find balance, he won the captaincy match primarily using Miyagi-Do. His win secured him the spot as the male captain, representative, and potential champion for Miyagi-Do in the final tournament in the series. His win was also celebrated using the OG Karate Kid leitmotif for winning by finding balance.

The overall theme of the series is about finding balance not just in karate, but in life as well.

“You remember lesson about balance? Lesson not just karate only. Lesson for whole life. Whole life have a balance. Everything be better. Understand?”

In my post Robby is the protagonist, I describe the role the protagonist plays in the story. One signifier of the protagonist is that the theme of the story is told primarily through their story:

The protagonist in a story is the character who offers the most conflict in situations, has the longest emotional journey, and has a primal goal to root for. Their transformation shapes the story's theme. Their choices and motivations affect the direction of the story. They're at the center of the conflict and their decisions push the plot forward. In a story with multiple characters with journeys, there is ultimately one character who is the primary driver of the overall story and their story tells the theme of the overall story. The other characters' can be protagonists in their own journeys but these become subplots of varying levels of importance. The protagonist is the character whose fate matters most. They have the highest stakes and the greatest obstacles.

Everything about the above statement is captured by Robby's story in s6e5:

He offered conflict by resisting Miguel trying to gaslight him about his greater need to win.

His issues with balance have been ongoing since s1, "the longest emotional journey":

"You may know the moves, but none of that matters unless you have balance.... I didn't mean balancing your body. I mean balancing your life. Look, Robby. I know it's hard growing up without a dad, believe me. Mine died when I was young, so I know. But when those bad feelings all weigh you down, you gotta... you gotta search inside for the good stuff, you know, and just... Because then you can find some balance in your life. Understand. It's not easy, but you'll do it."

He has primal goals to root for. He has to find balance in life. He also doesn't believe in his future but has to make a future for himself by knowing who he is and believing in himself and his future:

"Well, you are the tree, Robby. You've got strong roots. You know who you are, right? So now all you've gotta do is visualize what you want your future to look like, and then you make it happen." He also needs to find balance.

Robby's the only character that actively tries to grow and find balance, the theme of the story. Finding balance is emphasized for his story specifically, though other character's stories touch on the theme to different extents.

Robby's choices and motivations really do affect the plot. For example, Robby could have given into Miguel's claim that he deserves the win more, but Robby didn't. Robby stood up for himself and his future for the first time since he stopped doing so in s5e5. Robby didn't back down after that.

At the end of s6e5, although others in Miyagi-Do care about Tory, Robby is the one most connected to Tory and is the most affected by her rejoining Cobra Kai. That is, he is still most central in his connections to both sides in the dojo war.

Robby's fate has been set up to matter most. Robby issues with balance will greatly affect his ability to fight and lead. He has the highest stakes and the greatest obstacles during this tournament. (Though, Sam is also a captain, she won the spot by default, isn't an underdog the story, and balance is mentioned but is not a focus in her story and doesn't affect her karate.) Interestingly, even most Miguel fans are wondering about what will happen to Robby, though they viciously want him to get injured so that Miguel can take over and win.

Robby's story in Cobra Kai, like Daniel's in kk1, is about finding balance. Daniel's issues with balance in kk1 were centered around his issues with Johnny bullying him, how that made Daniel feel, and the trauma it caused. Robby's issues with balance are also centered around his issues with Johnny's behavior towards him, how it makes him feel, and the trauma it causes him. This parallel of kk1 Daniel's issues with balance being about Johnny and Robby's issues with balance being about Johnny is an interesting one.

The stark contrast in their stories is that Daniel had the support of his loved ones including his mentor in his kk1 match, whereas Robby doesn't have the support of his loved ones and his mentor. Johnny, Sam, and Daniel specifically have been on Miguel's side for some time. They all were on Miguel's side during the captaincy match. (Daniel did seem concerned about Miguel after this loss and not that enthused by Robby's win.) Everyone siding with his bully plays a significant role in Robby's issues with balance. Johnny, especially, choosing Miguel over Robby while neglecting and abusing Robby has played the biggest role in Robby's traumas and issues with balance. Tory was his only support during the captaincy match. However, going into the ST, Tory is no longer on/by his side too. Robby is indeed all alone going into this tournament.

Overall, this story is told from the pov of the bullies, Johnny and Miguel, who are unreliable narrators. Right now, all the "good guy" characters have been on the sides of Robby's bullies. They each frame themselves as the good guy. In s6e2, Robby explicitly called out Miguel for framing Robby as the bad guy. Overall, there is so much evidence throughout the story that Robby is the protagonist, underdog, and Karate Kid narratively and thematically in this story.

(This post is part of my Robby is the underdog post series and is also titled "Finding balance - Part 4".)

[moreofaloner]

When did cobra Kai truly lost the ball with the writing?

The easy answer must be after the school fight. Season 2 was the peak but the school fight made things so much more serious and cult-ish that dealing with bullying, and family cycles was not important enough to put on the ten episode schedule.

But truth is season 3 for me gave us so many good plots, and character development and growths. Season 3 is when I finally start liking Sam, even if she still makes stupid mistakes this is the season she leaves behind her childhood and is heading towards adulthood for me.

Then we have Cobra Keene.

This show couldn't finish before Robby joined cobra Kai, and the fact his father wasn't there yet again is almost poetic.

Johnny losing the dojo once and for all and trying to create something new and his (even with a name as ridiculous as eagle fang) was beautiful.

Hawk's plot in season 3 must be the highlight of the season. The kid who doesn't have parallels to the movies gets the sickest plotline he could get. We see him go fully dark, and make even Kreese flinch.

So season 3 is not the point where they lose control. Is it when Silver comes along?

Again no.

For me this show's main focus was to show that nothing is black and white, but there are grey areas. Johnny wasn't the villain. He made stupid mistakes.

Bringing back Silver, and the whole arc of the cobra husbands in season 4 could just be the redemption arc of John Kreese.

Maybe Kreese was the bad guy, but he doesn't have to be anymore. By breaking the cycle of violence with Tory at the all valley he could jump start his redemption arc.

For me they lost the ball at season 5. They forget what the core of this tv series is and they introduce world domination by cobra Kai...

The show about kids being bullied and finding their strength in karate is now a show about a karate cult taking over million of teenage minds...

Miguel (the main character in case you forgot cuz I did) has for some reason gone on a solo trip to find his father with zero leads... And then we see zero personality for him.

Hawk who is the champion and has just finished a beautiful arc is now nerfed.

Tory Nichols is carrying this season on her back. And Kreese's redemption is thrown in the non- recyclables.

What would I do differently?

Keep the Kreese in prison stuff and focus on him actually having a breakthrough with the doctor. Have him care about Tory at her visits and tell her to put herself first before the sekai taikai.

Scratch the whole Mexico storyline and focus on Robby, Johnny and Miguel building bridges by doing fun stuff like Johnny and Robby did in Mexico.

Have the Larusso focus on a legal fight with Silver until they realize what happened with Stingray.

GIVE SAM A PROPER STORYLINE. This girl has the same storyline in s4,5&6 and it's finding herself away and through karate. The most interesting thing that has happened to her besides Tory is now Axel. In season 4 we slightly saw her cobra side. Let her embrace that? Or idk give her another hobby, another friend. Make her get a job. Give this girl something to do so she can find herself.

Hawk in the first episodes of season 5 was showing great promise. They could develop this side of his character. He could become the protector of the geeks, he could choose to not have another mohawk.

Here's an idea, give Hawk and Sam a shared storyline.

Show us the friendships beside the main ones. For example in season 2 Demetri, Sam and Robby spent all their time together, in season 5 they don't even acknowledge that they train for the same dojo.

I'd still bring in Devon and make her a cobra. Her bond with Tory is the best thing to come out of season 5 probably. Oh well... besides protect the egg.

Have big Red crack a joke with a main character.

Get rid of Silver once and for all, give Kreese his freedom but he stays away from karate.

Because Sam embraces cobra Kai's style so we'll, Daniel is forced to realize and admit that cobra Kai has good versions and since all the bad guys are gone, Johnny takes over once again.

Stingray takes over the younglings class.

There's an adult class and Stingray makes appropriate friends.

Bert stays his ride or die.

Honestly cobra Kai's last season should be 5. They should tie all the loose ends, somehow bring to life a last big fight and leave everyone at a better place from where we found them.

[riotpanther]

EVERY SAM AND TORY SCENE/MENTION (52/?)

“The Rise” — Cobra Kai Season 4 Episode 10

Full All Valley Fight || Part 1 || Part 2

[justhereforthecupcakes]

There is a parallel (though unequivocal one) between Daniel and Johnny’s exchanges regarding their mentors.

40 years ago Johnny told Daniel to watch his mouth in a threatening manner when he asked Johnny if he ever considered that maybe Kreese might be wrong.

The difference is Daniel suggested Johnny maybe apply some critical thinking skills (still not his strong point) to his Sensei’s methods and world view.

That’s not being disrespectful.

(Incidentally look who turned out to be right?)

Johnny calling Mr. Miyagi a liar and a thief — while dismissing that Daniel does in fact know what’s it like to watch a sick parent die? And as a nine year old child who wasn’t nearly as equipped as a teenage Tory or adult Johnny?

Absolutely flat out disrespectful and crossing a major line. Not to mention amazingly gross insensitivity on Johnny’s part.

“Watch your mouth, asshole.”

You really shoulda taken your own advice, Johnny.

[izzythehutt]

Most complaints about the storytelling decisions regarding the teens in Cobra Kai boil down to not understanding that the younger characters are all supporting their adult counterparts, acting as a foil to or echoing some theme from the original films through their relationships with their OG franchise counterparts. Do they have arcs of their own? Of course. But at the end of the day, Miguel, Robby, Sam and Tory's storylines will all be written to give maximum dramatic payoff for Johnny, Daniel and (to a lesser extent) Kreese's character arcs, because they were the original characters the entire show was built around.

This is why "who deserves to win the final tournament fight?" is so pointless. Ask yourself not whether Robby or Miguel is a "better fighter" who "deserves to win", but how their stories will best serve Johnny's, because I guarantee that's why they made the writing choices they did.

Miguel is an obvious 21st century version of Daniel (to Johnny's Miyagi), with a classic coming of age and underdog sports movie arc. Johnny's vocation in life (a fact frequently repeated by the show itself) is to teach martial arts, and Miguel is his principle protege. Miguel's "big win" being a tournament fight makes sense, as karate itself is a totem for his relationship with Johnny. Robby, meanwhile, functions far more as a parallel to Johnny himself, and his arc has been (thematically) about not becoming the worst version of the man his father became. Since the entire show is built around the idea that Johnny's toxic mentor derailed his sense of self-worth/adult life by physically attacking him after he lost a tournament, Robby losing the final fight and realizing that's okay is not mean or proof that the writers hate him, but in fact...an obvious choice for his character.

I can guarantee that Sam's final arc will be tied to her relationship with her father, and the strength and wisdom he's given her. Tory (through her relationship with Kreese) also functions as a kind of girl reboot Johnny, and one of her core functions on the show is to be proof of Kreese's spark of redeemability. I have no doubt she'll be used for that purpose before the end of the show.