#its not like reylo like it works

[like-sands-of-time]

Reylo readers I need to read a fic where Rey accepts bens hand and becomes empress, the two of them having to figure out how to work together to bring about the end of the war they both want

[marklikely]

the results of that "is fanfic a book" poll have shown me one thing and its that this site never graduated past that absolutely insufferable phase in 2013 where everyone acted like every book is the single most sacred thing on earth

[racnarath]

I have a lot of thoughts on this - for one, there seems to be at least two or three different issues being argued in this thread (OP was probably talking about the $100+ mass market production of a draco/hermione fanfic that shows up on Etsy when you look for general bookbinding stuff, some people are talking about the legality of fanfic, others about the morality of money in fandom) - but for now I think I'll bring up this point. What about zines?

Zines often charge money. They often include, if not exclusively focus on, fanfic. They're sold new online and at cons, and old prints are on ebay and the like. I see from Fanlore's page that there's been a long debate about no money charged versus coverage for materials versus compensation for time and labor. I've never really seen a debate here though about the legality/ethics of them here though.

The only real difference I can see between a zine being made for sale and this bookbinding debate is that the zine (presumably) has the permission from the author and the author is aware that their work will be put into a mass-produced item that will charge money.

Fellas, fellas

Why on earth are you BUYING PHYSICAL BOOKBOUND COPIES OF FANFICTION????

ACTUALLY WHY ARE YOU EVEN BOOKBINDING FANFICTION TO SELL?!?!?!

IF ANY OF YOU DO EITHER OF THESE THINGS, GET OUT!! I AM NEVER SPEAKING TO YOU AGAIN.

In all seriousness though, authors on AO3 have begun to pull their works off of the site to avoid getting sued by people stealing their works to make a pretty bound book for profit. Entire accounts could be shut down as well.

Listen, I’m all for saving favorite works by printing them out and putting them in a binder, or learning how to make a bookbound copy yourself and/or assembling one with a pre-made and purchased fancy binding for a fanfic FOR YOURSELF or AS A GIFT to someone, but making bindings with and putting fanfiction in it TO SELL is where I draw the line.

Literally the entire point of AO3 is that you can read it FOR FREE.

It is DISRESPECTFUL for people to make money off of hardbound copies because guess what, the original creators of these fics get nothing. We are literally only writing fanfiction for our own pleasure.

Buying and selling book-bound fanfiction is also ILLEGAL YOU DUMB SHITS. People who are selling content while claiming to be a book binder is a misconception of their services. Book binders make the covers and all that, not the actual content of the book. Selling fanfiction is also an immediate violation of copyright law / Creative Commons licenses. The original fan work will get erased from the internet.

Fanfiction is already a legal grey zone since they are works being written about are protected by copyright. Copyright holders can in fact go after writers as well as the person who sold the fanfiction.

This also goes for people who steal fanart and, claim it as theirs, and put a price on it.

Don’t make it worse.

rest assured, we can still write our fanfics and make our art.

Buying a binding for you to assemble onto your own fanfiction or fanfiction you printed for PERSONAL USE is fine.

HOWEVER,

Bookbinding fanfiction for profit is literally ruining things for everyone. DON’T.

If I see any of them on Etsy, I swear to god-

[olderthannetfic]

https://olderthannetfic.tumblr.com/post/749847926364307456/confession-time-i-shipped-reylo-when-the-force#notes

Maybe it's bc I never got into Star Wars bc I'm not a big fan of sci-fi, but I'm fairly certain that Reylo was the cishettiest cis het ship to ever set sail in the cis sea, riding the het waves of the cishetero straights.

Like, that ship seems to be a staple with cishet hetero-cis young adult YA authors. I've probably seen more rewritten cishet Reylo fanfics with the serial number filled off to become #original works than any other fanfic cishet ship in a long time. Last one was Twilight Edward Bella I think.

Like that ship seems to be the staple of the cishetero foundation of todays cishetero YA market for better or for much worse. It's like the bodice ripper Fabio trashy romance, but for women under 35-50 year old. That ship was probably the most cishet coded ship I've seen in some time with any notoriety, with how it basically falls into every classic and rigid cishet romance trope, and seems to blossom in that garden of straightness. I mean, I don't think all the writers are cishet, but with that ship you you can try to take it out of its cishet story and try and make it queer, but you can't take the actual cishetness out of the it. The rainbow don't shine on them, to say it nicely, no matter how much it rains.

--

Yeah, it's a quintessential Wattpad ship of a certain type.

A lot of the pull-to-publish ventures I've seen in recent years are run by Reylos girlbossing their way to a writing career. (Like, not just individuals pulling to publish but people trying to start their own presses or apps or whatever.)

I saw TFA in the theater because friends wanted to go. I like fake death and Finn and Poe were hella hot, so I was marginally interested, but I really don't care that much about Star Wars. I only ended up in the fandom because 1. Finn and Poe are hot, as I said and 2. I got pissed about some bullying.

Anyway, we got to the scene where Kylo is leaning over Rey in all his uninspiring... uh... glory. And my friend hears this tween girl in the row ahead of us let out an "Ohhhh."

In the words of my friend: "Someone just became a woman today!"

That little girl and her audible italics are what I associate with Reylo to this day.

[middle-earth-mythopoeia]

No, Amazon’s Rings of Power is not “woke”

It annoys me so much when people complain about Rings of Power being “woke.” First of all, because of the way they overuse the word, woke has become a next-to-meaningless term that can be applied to anything conservatives don’t like. Second, Rings of Power is only progressive in the most surface-level way; underneath that it is in fact extremely regressive. People who whine about Rings of Power being woke are not only annoying, they’re also just plain wrong.

Ever since the casting was announced, right-wing idiots have been shrieking about Black actors being cast in Rings of Power. These trolls have made all kinds of dumb statements about how Middle-earth = Europe, but they seem willfully ignorant of the fact that Europe has never been exclusively white, and there is no reason to exclude people of color from the cast of any Tolkien adaptation. Still, this didn’t make the show progressive in its casting (which was tokenistic) or its writing (which ranges from bad to horrible).

For instance, the only storyline Amazon writers could apparently think of to introduce Arondir was literally him being enslaved. I mean, really? Is that really the best plotline to go with? To be clear, I’m not criticizing the actor, I’m criticizing the writing. In addition, Amazon cast actors of color overwhelmingly in parts invented for the show—rather than as actual Tolkien characters—which more easily allows them to be sidelined by the narrative, and the casting overall was in no way diverse enough. So I find it bizarre that people criticize the show for its so-called wokeness, when very little effort was made from a diversity and inclusion standpoint.

Right-wing nutjobs also threw a fit about Amazon portraying Galadriel as a warrior, to the point where they started calling her “Guyladriel.” They whined about Galadriel being too feminist and too masculine in the show, but that’s the opposite of what happened and betrays a fundamental misunderstanding of Galadriel as a character. First of all, she fought at Alqualondë in one version of the story, so no one should have a problem with her wielding a sword. What IS a problem is everything else about her portrayal.

Amazon’s writers took one of Tolkien’s most interesting characters and stripped her of her power, her authority, her gravitas, her wisdom, and her ambition. They had Gil-galad, her younger cousin, order her around. They had Elendil compare her to his children, even though she’s older than the sun and moon. And they made her a petty, naïve, incompetent brat whose entire first season involves being manipulated by Sauron, and as if that wasn’t bad enough, having a bizarre will-they-won’t-they relationship with him. In addition, Galadriel is canonically tall and strong, and one of her names means “man-maiden,” but they made her short and waif-like instead.

Galadriel in Amazon’s show doesn’t even resemble the character Tolkien wrote—the character named Nerwen, who never trusted Annatar, who certainly never had some creepy Reylo thing with him, who was powerful and wise and authoritative, who had a marvelous gift of insight into the minds of others—not a quippy, rude, annoying idiot who is constantly being controlled by the men around her. I don’t know why anyone would look at Rings of Power and think this portrayal is progressive. It’s actually a failure of imagination: Amazon’s writers literally cannot conceive of a powerful woman even when all of the work of imagining her has been done for them.

In addition to the faux-feminist-and-actually-sexist portrayal of Galadriel, Rings of Power is also on the whole weirdly regressive from the standpoint of gender roles and gender expression. Tolkien’s Elves are canonically tall, beautiful, and long-haired, regardless of gender. Tolkien’s Dwarves all have beards. So what did Amazon do? They gave most of their male Elves short hair, while the female Elves still have long hair, and they did away with female Dwarves’ beards. They patted themselves on the back for “letting” Galadriel fight, but don’t show other female warriors—in battle scenes, for instance, why are all the soldiers male? In general, they made their characters adhere to conservative gender roles and gender expression, which is especially glaring because it contradicts what Tolkien actually wrote.

On top of all this, they decided to throw in some anti-Irish stereotypes with a side of classism, just for fun. They had the ragged, dirty, primitive Harfoots speaking in Irish accents, while the regal, ethereal, advanced Elves speak with English accents. None of the actors playing the Harfoots are Irish themselves, to my knowledge, which makes the choice to have them speak this way especially questionable. Seriously, who thought this was a good idea?

All in all, it makes absolutely no fucking sense to criticize Rings of Power for being woke. It may look progressive on the surface because there’s a Black Elf and a woman with a sword, but that’s as far as it goes. The show isn’t particularly diverse to begin with, and it treats its characters of color poorly. Galadriel’s portrayal is disgustingly regressive, as is the show’s overarching take on gender. This is to say nothing of the caliber of the writing in general, which is unsurprisingly low. There is so much to criticize—like the nonsense about mithril, or the fact that Celebrimbor of all people doesn’t understand alloys, or the fact that you can apparently swim across the Sundering Seas now—which makes complaining about the show’s supposed wokeness especially irrational.

I also have to wonder if the people still whining about wokeness know anything about Tolkien’s works. Do they know that the crown of Gondor was based on the crown of the Pharaohs of Egypt? Do they know that Tolkien considered Byzantium the basis for Minas Tirith? Do they know that female warriors already exist in Tolkien’s books? Do they know when they rant about how much they hate “Guyladriel” that Amazon’s portrayal is actually too feminine? Ultimately, people who complain about wokeness in Rings of Power—or any Tolkien adaptation—are just betraying their own idiocy. I honestly think if Tolkien’s books were published now conservatives would scream that they’re woke too.

[uglypastels]

A question to my fellow fic writers,

Idk but have any of you thought of publishing your fics as original stories (so obviously changing names and stuff) but opted out of doing it because of what is associated with fanfiction-turned-published work? I'm thinking like, all the reylo books, After, etc. And like how that is being viewed, so just not wanting to be a part of that.

Because I know I have so many stories I wrote that I would love to explore the world of more and my delusion says that maybe since it did well as a fic it could do well as an actual book but then I'm thinking of people eventually finding out how it used to be a x fanfic and what that usually means in the public opinion but who knows maybe its just internalised shame...

But yeah, anyone else who thinks like that?

[amaltheas-garden]

my mid-season Rings of Power thoughts (as someone who's never read Tolkein)

Robert Aramayo as young Elrond was a gift from god to show he has not yet abandoned humanity and there is still light in this world

I liked Galadriel! I think there's a lot of room for improvement in the character writing department, but I thought she was fine

I understand the Galadriel x Halbrand shippers (I thought it was gonna be a reylo 2.0 but it was more like angelic warrior goddess adopts funny hobo)

uhhhh dumb question but is the show saying Gandalf is an alien who came to earth via meteor cuz i'm confused

Tar-Miriel -> skin? Flawless. face card? Lethal. Fks given? Zero = we love to see a brown girl winning

elf ranger human woman and emo son. I don't know their names and I do not care.

overall I'd put the show at about the same level as shadow and bone (that is to say, some clunky writing/not the best dialogue/plots are a bit all over the place, but there are some genuinely good character moments, and it's entertaining enough for me to keep watching, can't speak to its execution of themes/adherence to canon since the only thing I've seen is the lotr trilogy and am pretty unfamiliar with Tolkein's work)

[frumfrumfroo]

I was reading some old Reylo posts and came across a user on here saying that even if Rian Johnson had directed TROS, it still would've been bad, because of interference from higher ups (Rey Skywalker was a consistent theme across the two scripts - but imo, I think that might've just been because they were collectively mad she wasn't a Skywalker lol).

If this isn't an annoying and tiresome question, what do you think? It's hard to speculate but I do find it a bit fun, because there's always been that 'what if' for me that if Rian had done it, maybe it wouldn't have been awful... I guess the implication here is that, was TROS always going to be bad?

I'm ruminating on it a bit because it seems like Disney has kind of segmented the SW fanbases across their shows - Prequel stuff, worldbuilding stuff, OT stuff, and now the romance/Force storyline stuff. All of these combined elements is what made SW so potent, what made something like Reylo so powerful, but it's what makes it a hard brand to sell.

What we heard was that Kennedy asked Rian to do it, but he said he needed more time to write the script and Iger/DLF was unwilling to move the release date. I'm not sure how verified that ever was, but it's the most depressing fucking thing imaginable if true. The same short-term only, immediate profit and your quarterly bonus over the integrity of the company and the franchise which has been destroying Disney as a studio over the last decade or so.

I do think the most blame for tros must ultimately rest with Iger, but it's not like that absolves JJerio from responsibility for how bad it actually is.

I have answered this exact question before, and speculated on related stuff a few times, but unfortunately I haven't been able to find that post for you.

To me, if we learnt anything from DotF being a thing, it's that there was never anyone at the wheel, plotgate was totally true, and the directors were allowed to do whatever they wanted. If Rian had been making the third film from the start, I don't think they would have tried to impose any major story beats on him. The reason it became such a shitshow was The Book of Henry came out and they realised Colin's script was totally unacceptable way too late.

And once the can of meddling was open and you're back to JJ 'no thoughts, head empty' Abrams as a workman director, the suits were basically writing epIX with Terrio's incest fever dreams as connective tissue. They kept elements from Colin's version because they were trying to save time and use as much of the work which had already been done as possible. There was no commitment to any of those ideas, it's just incompetence and with no direction or ideas of their own, they were making a reddit checklist to try to please the whiners rather than writing any actual story.

Like, none of this would have happened if Rian were involved, because Rian would have written an actual story.

SW is mythology and very few people working at DLF seem to have ever understood that or have any idea what it means. Disney has segmented it because that's what they know, they want to have different product to sell to different demographics to maximise saturation and profit. That's their business model. They don't understand the foundation, the Saga itself, and its universal appeal, they seem content to let that stay dead and focus on compartmentalising and pandering to smaller, separate audiences.

[junkyardghost]

Would you like to watch the next Star Wars movie about Rey in the cinema despite Ben not being in it?

As of right now I have no desire to see the new Rey movie. Ben not being in it is a huge reason why and I don't think I could handle any more heartbreak or Reylo erasure after TROS. And speaking of TROS, I believe that movie ruined Rey's character. It stripped away all that made her unique and special and relatable, it erased all her growth and development, it left her exactly were her story started (alone on a desert planet), and it replaced her with someone that effectively had no agency over her own life and future. Fuck you JJ Abrams and everyone else who thought any of that was a good idea.

If the new movie is nothing but a continuation of TROS and all its shit, I have absolutely no interest.

If, however, it is not and the movie by some miracle shows genuine respect for Rey's character and brings back Ben (this part is most definitely non-negotiable for me) and my fellow Reylos like the movie, then I will see it. But only then.

I apologize if my tone came across as harsh, it has nothing to do with your question (which btw thank you very much for asking ❤), I just worked myself up over my disdain for TROS. And I do truly hope the movie will surprise me, but I'm not going to hold my breath.

[equal-shipping]

Kaishin Reveal and What It Means For You

Okay I need everyone to keep their shit together because I think this is being blown out of proportion. What follows is a quick rant about what the hell is going in the DCMK fandom and what is going on in fandom in general cause I don’t know why I’m seeing so many people lose their shit over something that was most likely going to happen followed by a quick lesson by a ‘fandom elder’ on how to ignore canon and make a ship your own. 

Spoilers ahead and whatnot. 

April 11th the DCMK 27 movie came out and information was revealed about how Kaito Kuroba and Shinichi Kudou are now cousins. Twitter lost its mind, Tumblr lost its mind, Discord servers are being created and now everyone is wondering what the hell should they do. 

I’m going to be honest, if you are a creator for KaiShin, please don’t delete your work. 

Either archive it or orphan it but please don’t delete it.

You put time and effort into this, into something you love, and just because the mangaka is so SO set in his ways of every single ship being friends to lovers does not mean you have to follow the same format. This doesn’t make you an incest shipper or whatever, it doesn’t make you a person who you don’t want to be, it’s just something that you had no idea of knowing was going to happen and I hope that you can look back at it fondly. 

Anyways, for those enjoying Kaishin on the sidelines all I’m going to say is Pick a Lane. 

Ignore Canon 

If you are an old time shipper then this may not be new for you. I mean Gosho literally had another ship that turned out to be cousins like at this point it’s ‘who is my cousin’ being played in the entire Detective Conan manga. You either already guessed it, are an active incest shipper (hi, hello, tis a me) or you are used to your favourites dying. This situation is no fucking different. 

Wolfwood is dead, in my head he is alive and well and treating his Plant husband right. 

Sora is missing, not in my head where he is kissing Roxas and Riku and Kairi and whoever else wants to get at the sunshine of the KH universe. 

Ben is dead, NOT IN MY REYLO FANFICTION. 

If you are a person who actively kept up with the manga or actively kept up with the show it is possible to ignore canon because they do not suddenly go super deep into being cousins and knowing about each other. They both don’t know if they are cousins or else the jig would be up immediately and the manga would be finished. You CAN ignore canon and if Kaishin is a ship that brings you joy and just serotonin production I implore you guys to choose this lane if you still want to enjoy Kaishin. 

It’s by far the healthiest option and teaches you how to curate your own fandom experience. 

Alternate Universes and You 

I was in the Hannibal fandom for a while and I clearly remember the ‘Hannibal is not a Cannibal’ tag on AO3. I thought it was hilarious but I would never dare to make fun of it because that is a prime example of CURATING YOUR FANDOM EXPERIENCE. 

Here are some examples on how you can start tagging: 

Not Cousins AU

Kaito and Shinichi aren’t family 

No Family Relation AU 

Pre Kaishin reveal 

Or just make a quick blurb of how you mean this drawing/fic to be perceived. Again, this is your experience and you get to make the space you want to make. It’s up to you to make/interact with the content that makes you most comfortable. Again, if you want to delve into AU’s then that is up to you and I think it’s a pretty good lane for those who just feel weird about the whole reveal. 

Stepping Away

Your moral values are your own, people, and I am in no position or even want to judge them. If you feel uncomfortable about this now, see your love for Kaishin diminishing because of the reveal or just don’t see yourself shipping Kaishin in the future then you are more than capable of measuring your response and stepping away from the ship entirely for your own health. 

Is it going to be sad? Yes, but they are fictional and I recommend having an idea of what you have in your life outside of fandom that makes you happy that you can focus on as you go through this. College, work, whatever hobbies you may have taken up–hell put all your eggs into another ship that you know also brings you joy! 

Do not let this dictate your day or your month or your year. This is just fandom, you don’t have to make a big statement unless asked about it, you do not have to justify your decision to anybody, curate.your.fandom.experience. 

I’m going to end this with a repeat of what I just said. 

This is all fictional. We are playing in a fictional sandbox where we can all make whatever we want in any capacity and as long as it is tagged correctly then nobody’s lines have to be crossed. If you just started enjoying Kaishin, find out how you still want to enjoy it or step away. If you have shipped Kaishin for a while, do the same fucking thing! The east side of the fandom is having a field day with the movie, why can’t the west have some fun too?! 

I’m going to ship Kaishin (however all my reblogs will be moved to my other blog for incest-y stuff and just other content people may not vibe with in general) and hell I might just join the Kaishin Big Bang for the hell of it because I have been shipping this ship since I was 15 years old and I’m about to be 30 so….I’m staying fucking seated cause you aren’t getting me out of this chair, Aoyama, you aren’t getting me to ship Aoko with anyone other an Akako so suck on that. 

Be safe, be smart and curate y’all.

[jessread-s]

✩🌗⚔️Review:

What this book lacks in world-building it makes up for in the all-consuming enemies-to-relcutant allies-to-lovers plot. 

“The Hurricane Wars” follows Talasyn and Prince Alaric, two bitter enemies with opposing magical abilities, as they are thrust into an uneasy alliance to bring an end to the Hurricane Wars. But a greater threat is coming, and the searing passion they find in each other could either save their world or destroy it. 

As a huge Star Wars fan, I thoroughly enjoyed Guanzon’s debut novel! I found great enjoyment in identifying connections between “The Hurricane Wars” and the films (7-9) as well as the ways in which Guanzon branches out to build the relationship dynamic between Alaric and Talasyn (inspired by Kylo Ren and Rey). I went feral over the addition of the arranged marriage trope that Guanzon incorporated into her storyline and really like how she infused Southeast Asian culture into Talasyn’s background. I wasn’t originally a Reylo shipper, but Guanzon has successfully converted me. 

For readers picking this one up without having seen Star Wars, this book has its pitfalls. The magic of fanfiction is that writers can create an alternate universe where beloved characters that may not have otherwise been romantically attached can get together. Very minimal world-building is needed because the assumption is that the target audience is already familiar with the source material. The problem is that traditionally published novels don’t work that way. Readers aren’t always part of certain fandoms and, in my opinion, “The Hurricane Wars” (part of the fanfic-to-romance pipeline) suffers from assuming everyone is a Star Wars fan. I came into this book with a full understanding of the characters, the magic system, and the conflict. I can see how others who have not seen the films could easily become lost because at the end of the day, the goal of this book is for Reylo to get together, even if it is to the detriment of the world-building,  plot, and conflict. I think that is why part I felt so rushed to me. Part I is not as developed as part II because only the bare minimum is done in terms of developing the world and magic system to establish that Alaric and Talasyn are enemies. Part II was much more interesting because that is where the sexual tension, angst, and banter between the characters finally comes into play. It is clear that the romance is what drives this book in comparison to the war that is going on or the magic that is present. 

I didn’t mind this, which is why I’ll likely pick up “A Monsoon Rising”. I’m ultimately glad I stuck with this book despite getting bogged down by part I because I absolutely devoured part II. And hey, if this is the book that convinces more people to watch Star Wars, I’m willing to look past its shortcomings. 

Cross-posted to: Instagram | Amazon | Goodreads | StoryGraph

[piglet26]

Alright, Is the Star Wars Fandom Sexist?

As you probably know Daisy Ridley signed onto do another Star Wars film. I welcomed this..... mostly. If they don't reunited the Dyad I'm very curious as to what would be the point (more on that later.) Well, I saw this quote from a recent interview of hers, "I think my take is things get blown out of proportion and the interactions I've ever had with people have been nothing but wonderful and supportive," Ridley said. "I've only ever been embraced. And I think we're going to make a great film."

Now whether or not Ms. Ridley actually feels this way.......she's intelligent enough to say just this. Undeniably, all of the men who have talked shit about her for the past 7,8 odd years will now have softened to her for simply not holding them accountable. Hey, that's the biz kids. Don't make enemies out of your audience. No man wants to be called a sexist even if he actually is one.

Is there sexism in Star Wars? Yes and no. It has never been a straight answer. Now if you ask a lot of men in the Star Wars fandom if they are sexist..... they'll say no. Why? Princess Leia of course! Padme! Strong women who directed men, issued orders and politically led. They did and do support these women. In fact, if you had asked me if the fandom was sexist prior to The Sequel Trilogy I would've said that the SWF is one of the most progressive fandoms for women and has been since the 70s!

Where did it all go wrong?

Well, maybe this

Or, this

Maybe just good ole fashion paranoia. Personally, I think it's a combination of all three. The minute Disney bought Star Wars the fandom was primed to distrust it. Change, for better or worse, was on the horizon. Hell, even worse, corporate change. It's Rage against the Machine raging FOR the machine. Least we forget how Star Wars started...... as a "fuck you" to corporatized assembly-line movie production.

However, we are not her to discuss whether The Sequel Trilogy was good. Debatable..... with the exception of Reylo. That's just iconic. We are here to discuss how on earth Daisy Ridley ending up bearing the majority of the responsibility for its failures. Maybe even more importantly the "Feminization" of Star Wars.

A sane person could tell that. The same people screaming "Star Wars is Dead" for the last seven years are still saying the eulogy. Still going on whining and complaining about it. There is a general rule when franchise start to go off the track - you ignore it was ever made. Godfather 3? Tokyo Drift? Never happened.

If you don't like what Star Wars has become then the first person on your shit list should be it's creator. George Lucas. George could've signed over Star Wars under the guarantee that whatever outline he produced for The Star Wars Sequel Trilogy, Disney HAD to stick to - he didn't. He could've signed on a producer - he didn't. He could've picked someone else except Kathleen Kennedy to replace him - he didn't. Somehow George Lucas has escaped any responsibility in what his life's work has become. Maybe the fandom got it out of their system after the Prequel Road Rage.

News that George Lucas's treatments were thrown out and the extended universe being cancelled didn't exactly calm down the public.

Maybe the next person should JJ Abrams and Kathleen Kennedy for for thinking that there was something wrong with Star Wars. Star Wars already was diverse. It already HAD strong females. Yet, there they went finding problems that didn't exist. Why? Money. Disney has a powerful female/family demographic. Star Wars a strong male demographic. Disney sought to combine the best of all worlds in one franchise and they were the company to do it. Look at what they accomplished with Marvel!

Then the announcement came that there would be a female protagonist. A female Jedi to be exact. I thought this was different and interesting. The men did not. What they saw in there head was THE FORCE IS FEMALE in flashing bright lights. This was it. Confirmation. Star Wars was about to get pussyfied. From the get-go Daisy Ridley's Rey was to be a focus, a target, for the mistrust, uneasiness and rage from the men.

Let's me be clear men are ok girls liking their stuff. As long as girls are not in a position to influence whatever it is they like, or rather "ruin it." Can you blame them? If a bunch of straight dudes came in and started writing Sex and the City I'm telling you- they'd ruin it.

The Force Awakens finally arrives and curiosity was able to lure in even the most salty man. Not to mention the possible joy of seeing Han, Luke and Leia on screen together again. TFA is a perfectly decent film. There were two glaring choices in this film. One, Han is killed. Two, Rey beats Kylo Ren at the end. All things considered we should not have been surprised what the internet had to say. Rey was a Mary Sue. Men who didn't even know what a Mary Sue was were even saying this.

The term “Mary Sue” was first coined in 1973. A young main character, usually a woman, who was portrayed as unreasonably gifted across every discipline: intellect, combat, the arts, etc. This character would often become respected (and maybe even loved) by main characters and would end the story by saving the day in heroic fashion.

You don't have to like Rey. You don't have to love her. Rey isn't even the greatest character ever developed, but come on! I wonderer if the people criticizing her even watched the movie. I heard criticism that Rey was too likable! Well, she's the protagonist. She's too pretty! That's a bad thing? She's too nice! She comes off really brash and naive actually. She's the greatest pilot ever! She flew once and not that well. Most of the criticism around Rey was disingenuous and petty as hell.

Many critics have taken the lazy route of she has no character arc or character, but that’s not a very observant take. Her yearning for family and her desperation for her parents to return, while understandable, made her vulnerable to Kylo Ren. Her loneliness made her ultimately vulnerable to anyone who would be nice to her. Now I understand there was no consequences for her faults. However, there can't be both criticism. She either doesn't have a personality, or, she has one, but doesn't suffer consequences for it.

“How could she fly the Millennium Falcon so well?” “How could she beat Kylo Ren when she’d never used a lightsaber before?” “How could she resist Kylo Ren’s interrogation?” The film answered most of these questions. Ironically, no one questioned the 8 year old Anakin Skywalker or the farm boy Luke Skywalker for being amazing or great at anything because of The Force.

She grew up defending herself in melee combat. Her quarterstaff is not a lightsaber, of course, but it was established early on that she has the instincts and the reflexes to hold her own in a fight. While I don't agree with Rey beating Kylo Ren I understand how it was accomplished. Pure, dumb luck. It was luck that Ren was physically and spiritually crippled during their confrontation. Not to mention he had the hots for you. Finn was able to hold him off mostly because Kylo was toying with him, but when he grew bored Finn ended up face first in the snow. No one questioned how Finn the janitor could wield a lightsaber.

Let's talk about Finn, or rather John Boyega. All things considered pretty lucky guy. He got a likable that he played well and got paid well. You wouldn't know it by listening to him. He complained bitterly. He attacked the fans. He attacked Disney. He attacked America. He got off Scott free with fandom. Most remember him with nothing but fondness. Maybe because he is black people feel slightly uncomfortable going after him. But, the women? No problem. Even when fans hate male characters, they talk about what they hate with nuance.

Daisy Ridley did her job and she went home. She carried on beautifully and respectfully with what she was given by the production team. That is all any actor can do. The same would apply to the girl who played Rose Tico. Yet, criticism of what was happening on screen started to bleed onto the actresses in real life.

Mark Hamill shit talked the Sequel Trilogy - fair, enough. But why did you sign on? It he because he needed a job? Hondo wasn't a great leader. I agree. But, countless people ended up losing their lives due to Poe because he refused to listen to the female authority around him. Where was the fandom with their logic bitterness scorecard? The majority of the criticism I heard (Literally several videos on Youtube) was criticism towards Hondo for not telling a newly demoted soldier all of her plans.

Anywho Rey has this new movie coming out...........okay. Not sure who wants to come back for it other than her. After TROS and the fans most co-stars seem good doing other things. OG characters are killed off. There is one person with stunning jet black hair, 6'3, plush naturally red lips, a big dick, freckles and a heroic run that she's in a dyad with that would make this whole movie worth it. Do I faith they'll do the right thing and pay Adam Driver whatever they need to to bring him back? No. Cause there is a little bit of an agenda. For some reason love in the Star Wars universe doesn't do very well, but for the woman it's none existent. The concept that a strong woman doesn't have to die alone seems odd to the very people that want equality for women. For example I saw this comment, "Rey Skywalker is her own character and her continuing story doesn’t have to revolve around Ben Solo. Daisy Ridley’s return shouldn’t be overshadowed by fan expectation over Adam Driver returning."

Yes, it does. This film needs to work. I cannot stress that enough. You know people want to see this film fail. Reylo isn't purely for sentimental reasons (I WOULD SEE MY DYAD REUNITED FOUR TIMES IN THEATRES) Reylo is the biggest marketing advantage Disney Star Wars has..... you knew that when Solo flopped. Do the smart thing, put these people on mute and give us a iconic fight fuck scene.

Rey also wear clothes appropriate with her environment and match the physical needs of what she needs to accomplish like her male peers. Logical and refreshing. I hear the men mostly complain about the lack of hot women in their fantasy.

We could also talk about the sexism Carrie Fisher faced from the not only the studio, but the fandom for the crime of getting older and gaining weight. Her in a metal bikini is already in the spank bank - she contributed enough.

Again, neither Carrie Fisher nor Daisy Ridley in a smart world could ever really own that. Anymore than the Rose Tico actress could. Worse, they could never really tell the Fanboys what they really think of them. I love me some Fanboys, I do, but they aren't a perfect group of people. They just criticism everyone's work like they are. We're suppose to ignore the giant dump they take on anything and everything that comes out. I genuinely think the people beyond The Star Wars Sequel Trilogy sought out to create a great story. To honor what came before. In many respect they did. They aren't George Lucas though.

There is legitimate criticism towards Disney for how it has handled the Star Wars franchise. Currently it can't exactly be be described as quality over quantity. The writers seem like they are writing for early 00s Disney Channel rather a complex space political fairytale. Characterization has not been wonderful. Again, it's not simple. While Disney has not steered the ship perfectly. I would argue there was an audience sitting in ill will and waiting to be disappointment.

[howlsmovinglibrary]

Hello! I saw your response to the "5 things you could talk about for an hour" tag game, and I just wanted to say that I am in fact very interested in your perspective on how fandom/fanfic has impacted media literacy and the publishing industry, if you'd ever like to yap on Tumblr about it!

hmmm... other people have said it better than me in various different tumblr posts but I'm a yapper why not?

(under the cut to save a long post)

fandom/fanfic impacts on media literacy:

media is viewed through shipping goggles first and a critical lens second (both of them are allowed! i love my shipping goggles! but i also like having multiple tools of analysis in my arsenal!)

this also sometimes means that media devolves into relationships and 'fan service' moments, above plot or delivery of a good and satisfactory story (I'm not saying OFMD but I kind of am. I'm not saying BG3 additional content that has focused on popular characters and ships above incomplete and underwritten narratives... but I kind of am)

because fandom now also has a big purity culture kick back, and fandom has become mainstream, that means mainstream media also has a purity culture kick back (for instance, everyone performing scandalised and 'disgusted' reactions to Saltburn, when actually all that is is a... psychological thriller)

fandom/fanfic impacts on the publishing industry:

the Locked Tomb's popularisation of fic-ish writing, alongside the reylo fanfic boom (Ali Hazelwood serial numbers filed off -> romance pipeline) kind of coincided perfectly with the pandemic. as did the success of Travis Baldree's coffeeshop AU, Legends and Lattes. people wanted comfort media, but at the other end, publishing industry professionals were working from home and likely spread thin. I think this created a perfect storm for 'fast fiction' (like 'fast fashion') where basically a fanfic can be quickly changed into a book with minimal editing that doesn't matter anyway bc it provides a dopamine hit. None of this is inherently bad. I don't dislike fanfic-to-published-novel on principle. What I *hate*, is bad editing. Extremely high quality editing is what trad publishing has, in a way fic doesn't. Bc fic can be as long as you want it to be, and can linger, and can have fun - it's not designed for efficiency or quality control bc that's not the point. that being said... quality control can, in fact, improve a work's quality. but trad publishing doesn't have good editing anymore, bc the pandemic proved it didn't necessarily need it, and publishing companies love to not spend money on things, especially if it will make them a profit without that care or attention.

what i will also say, is there is a reason it's easy to file the serial numbers off. reylo fics are very far from canon, for a number of reasons. Legends and Lattes is a coffeeshop AU, without any character work. This doesn't mean they are bad. It just means they feed into a general trend of 'fic as tropes' - rather than 'fic as character study', for instance - which in turn means that romance in particular has also become 'romance as tropes' (or even 'romance as smut' which is another thing I have feelings about, bc bad editing + fiction as smut = really, really bad smut actually lads)

in general 'fiction as tropes' has then obviously been aided by tiktok as the primary marketing platform. rather than provide an explanation of your story, providing an explanation of its tropes encourages your book being read this way

another thing that has happened as a result of fic is 'queer rep' as being 'there is queer people in it' or 'there is queer romance in it'. again, not inherently a bad thing. i love a gay book. but gay and queer experiences exist on a spectrum. a book with queer MCs for the sake of having queer MCs may end up feeling tokenistic, if the writer has included queer rep for the sake of queer rep, or (and we need to admit this happens!) to be trendy!! to hit on the 'queer rep' zeitgeist!!! similarly, a queer book without any romance in it can still be queer, but gods forbid we have *that* conversation.

As I said, all of these things have been discussed in tumblr posts far better than mine. In terms of my personal experience - teaching undergraduate literature classes, this is what I've noticed:

because of fandom or social media with fandom lite edges, a lot of my students are very up-to-date on things such as intersectional feminism, gender performativity, compulsory heterosexuality, queer coding, etc. I don't need to define these terms, whereas they were defined when I was an undergrad.

however, the flipside of this is they often approach the texts I teach only with a contemporary mindset. The biggest example I have of this is Jane Eyre. Jane Eyre actually benefits from a contemporary mindset - after being heralded as feminist in the 1960s, intersectional criticisms in the 1980s/90s by postcolonial critics called out its racist treatment of Bertha Mason. BUT if I have to read another essay about Jane Eyre's relationship with Rochester being 'problematic', I will scream. Not bc I don't agree, but because criticisms of this novel need to also acknowledge that in the victorian era, such a blatant discussion of female sexual desire was radical for its time. That class and sexism was a big enough issue in the 19th century that for Jane to get to marry a man from the landed gentry on equal footing was a big deal at the time. It's fine if you decide Jane Eyre isn't feminist! but you need to prove that through multiple critical lenses and not just a jezebel-article style treatise. (for instance, one essay critiqued the male gaze in Jane Eyre... Jane Eyre was written by a woman looking very disrespectfully actually, and also... film hadn't been invented yet. while the male gaze existed in art, the normalising of female objectification, sexually, required film. also... the male gaze is a term that requires a man with eyes to be making that piece of art.)

the other biggest problem I have when teaching, is the 'queer character as queer representation' thing, and ESPECIALLY "good queer representation means morally good queer characters'. I teach Giovanni's Room. Anyone who has read Giovanni's Room, knows that the main character is both gay... and a bad person. That book isn't just talking about being gay, but about being closeted, trapped in compulsory heteronormativity, and also... 1950s racism. One of the biggest challenges for me as a teacher is to ask students "don't just tell me there's gay people in it, look at what those gay people are doing. is queerness portrayed positively or negatively? what aspects of the experience are being represented? do these aspects have value, especially when it is a queer artist making the art?"

(people also feel like they can't call a gay character mean or bad, because of the whole 'gay is inherently virtuous' part of fandom's mindset. spoilers: gay people can suck too. and are allowed to be portrayed as such in fiction, once you have a tool in your toolkit known as nuance).

anyway, aside from the fact it means i occasionally struggle to find good romance books bc I want not just well written sex but character development - which fanfic has! I'm not saying fanfic doesn't have it! but the fanfic that gets published sometimes doesn't, and certainly very rarely has both! - my teaching is absolutely where I see fandom's impact most clearly.

[olderthannetfic]

When there was an anon about "To Gaze Upon Wicked Gods" a few months ago (or so?), I got curious and looked at the Goodreads reviews linked and at other reviews and the description.

Haven't looked at them this "round" of the asks regarding it, but IIRC I got the impression that it may originally have been a fanfic that had its names and some details altered to be published as an original work because IIRC some reviewers said there was little exposition as if one were already knowledgeable about stuff like the characters and world setting. Of course, I may also be (and most probably am) absolutely incorrect in this assumption.

The "mob" of angry reviewers also kinda gave me the impression that they may have been a friend group (based on their very similar phrasing and vocabulary and accusations, which may still also just be coincidental) who disliked the author for fannish reasons or something else and decided to take their (fannish?) dislike to the published literary world with the author's first publication... but again, I may just be wildly misinterpreting things and may have read their reviews in bad faith.

Regardless of whether or not the book is a "colonizer romance" or badly written or even disrespectful or tasteless or something else, I feel sorry for the author...

--

I wouldn't assume this. Usually, when het fics get the serial numbers filed, they're from one of the big het ships with a whole culture of doing this and it's all very open and liked by the fans. Some review would say which ship at the very least if not what the original title was.

However, I would absolutely assume that a book that reads like fic is by an author whose past experience writing is mostly with fic and who reads a lot of fic.

I also have the impression that some authors in the romantasy space are people who like sff settings on TV but don't have a lot of practical experience in how one establishes sff world building in a novel. They may have cool ideas, and these ideas may show up by the end of a book or later in a series, but the beginning doesn't have much flavor. Someone coming from a more book sff background would probably either explain more up front or whet people's appetites to understand the sff elements by giving a lot more sense of the setting. (But they might fall down on the romance aspects.)

There are also plenty of cliques in booktok, booktube, book twitter, etc., so a group of angry reviewers could be coming from somewhere like that and not from fandom beef.

It's also possible that the reviewers all sound the same because they read/watch the same book influencers who talk a certain way rather than because the reviewers are friends with each other.

Very likely, you're picking up the vibes accurately. I just think there are some other possible reasons for these vibes.

--

Poking around goodreads reveals a bunch of Corrain drama spillover. Search 'corrain', 'youtube', 'reylo', etc. for the reviews that give a sense of where samey-sounding people might be coming there from.

It's very clear that many reviewers heard all about the book long before they read it.

[etaindelaserna]

The “When shipping leaves the boundary of the fandom”-phenomenon.

Shipping is something I’ve always been doing. The medium didn’t matter: books, movies, games. The crackiest of crack ships wasn’t save from me. Within the confinements of the fandom it felt right to me to play the What if? game. It’s fun to imagine different scenarios or outcomes of certain canon moments. Creators know what these fans want and deliver it. Creativity at its best. It’s also fun to interpret and analyse moments in terms of dialogue, camera work, acting performance and to engage with the themes and messages one can derive from them.

Maybe it’s because I’m old but lately I’ve started to notice that I find it weird, even unsatisfying, when professional writers or producers engage in blatant shipping (looking at you Amazon). And I’m trying to figure out WHY it bothers me.

It started back then when The Force Awakens dropped and Reylo became a thing. I liked the idea of that ship but it was destroyed by questionable, careless writing decisions. And maybe THAT’S one reason why I can’t handle shipping in a professional setting: you have all the money and talent at your disposal — where are the great ideas?!

There are great fanfics out there written by people who are actually published but most fanfics don’t have that quality and they don’t have to have because a) when you start writing you write a lot of rubbish and b) every form of fan engagement is a win in my books — no matter how serious or unserious the commitment. What all great fanfics have in common is: they aren’t great because of the shipping but because of the writing.

It angers me when professional writers do it because it feels as if they’re not doing it because of passion but to get attention. It feels cheap. Careless. Like a last minute resort. It feels as if they’re saying “Ah yes, shipping. That’s what all the teenagers and middle aged single moms want, so let’s throw some of that into it”.

Maybe it’s just because once the shipping leaves the fandom and becomes real it’s to some extent not ours anymore. Reylo, at least for me, was great as long as it wasn’t made canon, because by the time it was made canon, the fandom had already written masterful stories for them, so much so that the real deal was under pressure to deliver something better.

Thoughts?

[atalienart]

but they are published fics…? and there’s nothing wrong with that like congratulations to them for being noticed and picked up by a publisher maybe over an ‘eww nooo’ reaction? also btw a lot of your thought posts when coming from someone writing a book feel like you’re telling people how you want them to react to your work rather than letting it happen naturally when they read it, like sorry people will read your book and make connections and see similarities to x,y,z other published works but that’s a good thing anyway! people will be engaging positively in your work, analysing and taking it all in! engagement is good even if it’s not the kind you want

I assume you're answering to this [x]? First of all, I don't expect people to do anything. Second, technically publishing fanfiction is illegal, so whenever someone publishes something outside of fanfic spaces I treat is as something original. And of course, big congratulations to the author, no questioning that. Now, I didn't say "eww nooo", I said I couldn't enjoy reading the story seeing actors' faces in characters. Are you telling me I should react differently to that book? Of course people will make connections and find similarities, and that means not everyone will have warm feelings towards the story. I like to use my imagination while reading fiction, that's it. To you the knowledge that the story has its source in reylo fandom is a bonus, something that makes the book more fun. For me it means I'll see Adam Driver and Daisy Ridley's mannerisms that I don't particularly enjoy. It's nothing personal, I don't even have an opinion on reylo fandom (it's like any other fandom). I just have preferences and voice them on my blog. My thought posts are just that - thought posts, not a guide to how people should react to anything. And the fact that I myself write doesn't mean I should just shut up whenever I don't like something. I'm a human being with likes and dislikes and it's fun to talk about those with others.