#in what gwyn considers a hobby

[realfae12]

My friend ships Gwynriel, and I’m an Elriel. I joined this fandom a year ago, and honestly, I’ve never seen casual readers fight so intensely over fictional characters. My friend wants Gwyn to end up with Az, and I respect that—it’s her choice. I believe Elain will end up with Azriel, and she’s okay with that because it’s my choice. She loves Lucien, and for me, Lucien is just there—I neither love nor hate him, but I do want to read his story because I see potential in him.

We talk about our favorite ships, laugh, and sometimes share our points of view, and that’s how it should be, right? If we started fighting and threatening each other over fictional characters, then I’d say that, in our 19 years of life, we’d learned nothing. It would show we’re truly acting illiterate and mannerless. Loving a ship and wanting it to happen is okay, but what’s not okay is threatening others or calling them rude names just because they don’t like your ship. How is that acceptable?

Some grown women in this fandom act like hormonal teenagers who don’t know the difference between right and wrong. In their rage, they insult Elain, calling her “boring” or “plain.” Not liking a character is fine—my friend doesn’t particularly like Elain either, but she doesn’t hate her, and that’s her choice. I was really shocked when I first saw people threatening each other, even threatening to doxx over ship preferences. It’s exhausting.

I hope things calm down, but have people considered what would happen if the author doesn’t choose their ship? If you’re this attached to the characters, I’m not sure how you’d cope. That’s why I suggest taking a step back. The author knows what she’s doing; after all, she created these characters. Take a step back and find a new hobby, because at the end of the day, these are just fictional characters.

[lovemyromance]

It is actually crazy that people keep saying "we don't know enough about Elain or her story to have her be a main character in the next acotar book"

Like I'm sorry - but Elain literally is going to have the next ACOTAR book. It's not a point of discussion and anyone who thinks it's going to go from Feyre Nesta to Azriel - or even Feyre Nesta to Gwyn - or worse with Feyre Nesta to Nesta again- is fooling themselves past the point of reason.

Think about everything you know about books.

Think of everything you know about stories

About patterns

Let go of how much you "think you know SJM" and just think using LOGIC.

Like you can doubt Elriel - don't recommend it but you can - but please don't sit here and tell me with a straight face that ACOTAR 5 is going to be about anyone other than Elain.

It's just getting embarrassing at this point. Idk how to make this any clearer -

But if the emphasis on sisters and clear development of their bond hasn't been spoken about enough in and outside the books by SJM herself wasn't enough -

Perhaps you should consider the fact that Elain is still somewhat a mystery. You know her trauma, but you haven't heard it from her yet. You know her love interest - but you haven't heard it from her yet. You know her desires and hobbies - but you haven't been in her head yet. She has remained silent on all the things that you would READ A BOOK FOR and y'all are still asking "why would Elain be next?"

Why would Elain be next? Because she has not shared a word about her feelings on her trauma or her life or anything about her powers and what she holds dear and what she values and who she loves.

Why would Azriel be next? Same reason, but at least we know enough from his POV to see he's a clear love interest for Elain. Would he be a main character though? No. Not without Elain.

Why would it not be Gwyn? Idk - maybe because we already heard everything about her trauma and her life and saw her healing arc begin with Nesta's in ACOSF?

Why would it not be ANOTHER Nesta novel? Because again, we have seen her trauma, her story, her life, her love, her powers firsthand already.

Please people. Enough is enough. You might as well DNF ACOTAR as a series now if you're going to insist on your delusion.

[curiousity-cell]

sometimes i feel that people don’t really even /try/ to understand elain. like they have all these think pieces for lucien & azriel & gwyn etc, but they just don’t try with elain. they don’t bother. and it frustrates me to no end because you know exactly why that is - because she has more ‘feminine’ interests & this makes her ‘boring’. her hobbies are quiet, she likes to keep to herself & people often overlook her BECAUSE she likes to keep to herself.

rn i’m thinking of her childhood and what their mother says about elain & the sisters

- nesta was groomed to be the matchmaker - to find herself a match, elain a march & feyre eventually the find a match. that was her main priority. find herself a marriage & then sort out her sisters.

- feyre was ignored by their mother, not even considered. because she was a “wild thing” since birth and the mother evidently didn’t know how to handle that

- elain though? she’s deemed useless. mama archeron may not say it but you know it’s implied.

elain is pinned as useless and only good for her beauty. only good for what potential matches she could make in the future. i think this is integral to her character and why she keeps to herself so often. this is the potential context of her character that keeps me sympathetic to her and why i adore her so much. because after so many people call you useless from your childhood, eventually you start to believe it. eventually it sticks. eventually you only know yourself as useless and nothing more.

add on then their poverty when their soil wasn’t good enough to make vegetables, imagine how useless you feel there. that gardening and baking is the hobby you’ve found you’re good at, but you can’t even do that because the environment around you limits your capabilities. also, a lack of education in planting & harvesting vegetables because you can’t afford books and tools to learn how to do so.

[i’ve been trying to find the quote for the soil part as support but i can’t fucking find it so this is all i have]

imagine how useless you feel then. i think her becoming fae (as traumatic as it was) is actually helping her. it’s healing her. cerridwen and nuala are helping her, her discovery of being a seer is actively helping her realise she is not useless. she has worth. she is finding her worth.

this story to me (which will be in her book in acotar 5) is so compelling to me. elain discovering her worth and realising that she doesn’t have to be “the pretty one”, “the boring one”, that she /can/ be soft & strong all at once. that her optimism and her kindness is a strength.

i cant wait. i’m so excited. i adore her already based on pure observation i can’t wait to get inside her head. and i will continue to try to do it now until her book comes out because her story will always be compelling to me because it’s a different story to warrior-training-sword-fighting-uber-magical-powerhouses (no shade to feyre & nesta - i’m just very excited to learn about your sister :))

(I ALSO FOUND A REALLY CUTE FEYRE & ELAIN SCENE FROM ACOTAR 1 WHICH PROVES FEYRE FORGIVES HER i will post it later - i’m very enthusiastic about my archeron sisters & their bonding.)

[acourtofthought]

I see some Elriels talk about the solstice presents as an example of how close and connected Elriel is, but I don't understand that because the gifts Elain and Azriel give each other don't seem that deep.

Elain gives him ear plugs and headache powder. One is so he doesn't have to listen to Cassian and Nesta have sex and the other is because he's apparently so annoyed by other people that he gets headaches. These are gag gifts. I mean, they clearly show us that Elain is clever and has a sense of humor, but I don't see anything to them beyond that.

Azriel gets her a rose necklace. Something that, to me, suggests only a surface level of understanding Elain. I kind of think Azriel's thought process was kind of like: Elain = pretty and flowers. Flower jewelry = pretty. Pretty flower jewelry + Elain = win.

Now, Lucien gets her jewelry, too, the pearl earrings, but her engagement ring also has pearls. So, maybe he saw her ring and figured out that she likes that particular stone. Which seems to take a bit more observation.

He also gets her the gardening gloves but also has them enchanted, so he took something he knew about her and went the extra mile.

Idk, maybe I'm being unfair to Azriel because I don't ship Elriel. It just seems like he's not going beyond the surface with Elain.

Completely agree. Az got Amren jewelry the first Solstice that we read about, "exquisite pearl-and-diamond earrings" so him getting Elain a necklace is not all that special when it comes to gifts Az has given.

If we look at his gift for Nesta the second Solstice however, that was an extremely thoughtful present, something that goes above and beyond for her interests. He took what he knew she loved and made it possible for her to enjoy that hobby for a longer period of time.

Which is the same with Lucien's gloves. E/riels continue pushing the narrative that Elain wants scars on her hands which is why she doesn't wear them but Feyre literally tells Lucien that Elain put on gloves to do her gardening so he found her ones that were enchanted so she could garden for as long as she desired. Then in the Feyre bonus of SF we again have Elain wear gloves which tore (leading Feyre to have to pull out thorns from her hands and her thinking if she had been wearing Lucien's gloves nothing would have pierced her at all). If someone wants scars on their hands they wouldn't be wearing any gloves, that's kind of the point of wearing them in the first place.

I'm not sure the story behind the pearls Lucien gave Elain the second Solstice but we've never seen him give jewelry to anyone else AND Nesta mentions that jewelry is a normal Solstice gift for mated males to give.

In comparison Az gave Amren jewelry, he gave Elain a necklace then he gave that same necklace to Clotho to give to Gwyn. I think it's clear Az doesn't put a lot of meaning behind who he's handing jewelry out too.

And gag gifts, while funny, do not really suggest some sort of deep insight into Azriel on Elain's part considering neither gift is something he's likely to ever use.

[nyxreads]

I see alot of Elain stans wanting to read about soft female characters and that is why they love Elain as the next lead of the acotar book. I get it. Please don't misinterpret what I'm about to ask but soft girls are way too overrated. This is why men easily step on women, because women are too soft and can become a doormat. Elain is "too kind", "too forgiving", and some stans hate "girlboss" but did one of you pause and think that maybe the reason why some people like girls like Gwyn or Nesta is because they are the representation of women who stood up after centuries of patriarchy? Women aren't lesser. We love to read more girlboss characters in fantasy books because they empower us. Just some food for thoughts but I love Elain too, she can show more flavor in the next books

Hi anon,

First, I want to clarify to you that (imo, I can't speak for all) but Elain stans don't really hate badass characters. There's that. And I don't really think feminine women are overrated considering how characters like Elide, Yrene, Elain (at least in this fandom) are overlooked because well, they don't wield sword or isn't bitchy enough.

The thing here anon is, instead of women empowering women (may it be fictional or real) it became a competition. Of who's better, who can wield sword better, who can kill, who can say the last word, who's fit to have a love interest. It comes to the point where some women especially in this fandom look at characters like Elain and decides they are weak because they aren't the kind of women (as per to your own words) who stood up after centuries of patriarchy. Instead of uplifting every female characters, women started tearing female characters down that they deemed boring or unimportant in the series.

Anon, there is strength in gentleness. There is strength in forgiveness, in fact according to research people who forgives tend to live longer and their hearts healthier. Just because women are feminine doesn't mean we are lesser. We have a vital role in the society, and whoever sees feminine women as lesser, are the real lesser one. Because looking down at somebody because they don't meet your standard of strength shows insecurity.

Most women are feminine anon, I think it's time for us to stop demonizing femininity. Hollywood fooled us hard, let's open our eyes, this is why it's very important to also see characters such as Elain take the lead and have her own book.

There's enough representation of girlboss character in fantasy series, and I have no complaint in that. But there's also nothing wrong in embracing your feminine side and wanting to see a representation of it on fantasy books.

And let me tell you, irl, it's not women who held guns that helped on the war, it's the women most people sees as doormat. In fact, during the WWII, men underestimated these type of women and thought of them as fragile and helpless but they are spies, anon. They became a big weapon in war. Women are capable of anything despite of their trait. It's 2023 anon, let's stop underestimating women because of their gentleness or because of their hobbies and desires in life.

Stop tearing down women (fic or not). Just because you don't relate to them doesn't mean no one does. Every kind of women can be a main character.

And this is long enough but OMG (I am trying to be calm, really) stop looking down at my sweet girl! Lol okay bye.

[nitecourtfairytail]

I just need to rant for a sec.

I genuinely don’t understand how or why SJM (and the fandom) puts women against other women so often. Especially Elain. Poor thing is constantly compared to her sisters, to her friends, to her sisters’ friends. Like why? Why can’t we all agree that no two people are exactly alike and that’s okay?

I have no issues with Gwyn. I don’t see her and Azriel as a couple.. or not a lasting one at least (their personalities clash too much for a long-term relationship) but I don’t hate her. Do i think she’s a little childish? Abso -fucking-lutely. But I honestly kind of like that. I like that she’s unabashedly herself.

I’m a fully grown adult and there are still things from my childhood that make me giddy: I never miss an opportunity to watch Disney’s Hercules, Mulan, Aladdin, or Robin Hood. I’ll still watch them wide-eyed, and sing along. I LOVE dinosaurs and if you ask me my favorite it will change with my mood. The scene in ACOSF where the Valkyries have a sleep over? I WISH I could do that (my friends are spread out too much now). It must have been so cathartic for the three of them to experience something they missed as kids.

All that being said, the problem I have with the gw*nriel ship/ G stans is that there is a constant need to put Elain down in order to lift Gwyn up. They’re different characters with different backgrounds and different strengths/weaknesses

Gwyn is loud and outspoken. She’s excitable and determined. Her strength is defined physically. None of this is bad!

Elain is not a confrontational character. Whether it’s from her upbringing or her own volition, she prefers the background instead of the spotlight. She’s shy and quiet. She evaluates before running headlong into something. She has a “different kind of strength”. While both characters are kind, Elain’s transcends what is considered kindness for high society-going as far as treating their staff as people rather than ‘the help’, and respecting them as people. (And I will DIE on the hill that Nuala and Cerridwen are not just staff for the IC, but valued and beloved friends of Elain).

She sees the good-seeks it out-and regardless of how deep it’s hidden she always finds it, and holds on for dear life. To be so kind, so loving, so willing to search for something beautiful regardless of her station in life is truly a strength. As well as her ability to see past the outward appearances of those around her. The fact that she has more feminine hobbies and ideals isn’t a bad thing either. That’s just what she likes! Femininity is not a crime, and I for one look forward to the day that we have a heroine who’s not a fighter. It would be a nice change of pace.

I know these are characters in a fictional series. I know that they have a lot more rounding out to do to make them multi dimensional (can’t wait for Elain’s book for her growth), but we real live actual people not in a book….as far as we know.. can’t let ourselves think like this because it bleeds over into everyday life. I don’t want to be compared to anyone but the me I was. Compare me to me. Compare past Elain with present Elain. Compare past Gwyn to present Gwyn. Stop comparing them to each other. It’s just not cool

[litnerdwrites]

I feel like that's also the reason that Elain and Feyre push her towards Cassian.

Feyre and Elain seem to go off of their mother's version of Nesta, describing her as the kind of person their mother would want her to be, and having no issue manipulating her talents and passions, like dancing, for their own benefit like she would. Nesta is proud, a queen, a caged wolf, with claws, etc. Just like her mother would've wanted.

They never once take the time to get to know Nesta as an individual, beyond their time in the cabin or what their mother trained her to be. They don't know anything about her traumas, and even through she told them not to countless times, throughout ACOSF, it comes back to her being upset over her neglectful father being killed. They never once consider any of the other things that they know happened to her, like the cauldron, or any other aspect of war, aside from her father's death.

They never ask about her hobbies or what sweets she likes, why she likes them, or what she would rather do with her life, and when they do learn something, like the fact Nesta wants to travel, it's in one ear, out the other and never brought up again. The only people who I'd say even remotely know Nesta personally, are Gwyn and Emerie.

I think Feyre and Elain see Cassian as the opposite of what Nesta's mother wanted, plus Cassian seems to like her, so they try to push them together and play matchmaker without her permission.

Maybe Feyre and Elain should deign to try a little harder next time. If not for Nesta's sake, then for Cassian, despite how little he knows/deserves from Nesta as is. But, we wouldn't want the big, bad 500 year old general to feel 'caught in the middle' or have to 'choose' now would we?

And if I said Cassian is exactly what Nesta’s mom would’ve wanted for her?

[not-poignant]

Hi Pia! I hope you're having a good day. I had a really random question for you. Does Gwyn know how to spin, sew, crochet, knit, etc? I thought he knew how to sew but then I couldn't remember where I'd read that. If he does, would he find it calming the way he does cartography? And I'm super behind on TIP but all these trow asks are reminding me how awesome they are and how happy I am for Gwyn that he befriended them.

Hiya!

Gwyn can definitely sew, because he often had to mend his own clothing while on the road as a soldier, and he was taught how by other fae. So while he’s not like, the best ever at it (mostly due to lack of practice) he’s an attentive and dexterous mender or clothing. Though he stopped doing it / stopped caring as much when he became King, I think in part to rebel against Crielle, who cared about clothing and fabrics a lot, which had the side effect of driving Gwyn’s interest away from the sartorial, and anything to do with fabric work.

This might change in the canon if it crops up in back story, but for now I think he can’t knit / crochet etc. I think he finds embroidery interesting (mostly because he’s seen maps that have been embroidered rather than painted/drawn), but he doesn’t have the time to keep up with his own hobbies anymore, let alone learn new skills, so a lot of that is on hold.

Outside of the feeling of a job well done re: mending a piece of clothing when he was younger, I don’t think he’d find it relaxing, because I think a lot of those skills would just remind him too much of his mother. Gwyn took a lot of unconscious steps to avoid being like her, or to do things that remind him of her (even though he is with someone who is remarkably like her: interested in fashion, interested in poisons and plants, has their own garden, cruel, wants to be the right hand wo/man of the King, likes power, dominating, has compulsions or an ability to make people do what they want via voice etc. - if you ever sit down and think how much like Crielle Augus actually is...)

Cartography for Gwyn is calming in part because it was so separate to almost any of the interests of his entire family. Like, his father knew how to read and make maps, but he wasn’t interested in it. Gwyn’s hobbies outside of hunting (which he enjoys for its own sake) have always been cultivated in a way that...can also be seen as subtle rebellions (or not so subtle) against the An Fnwy family.

Unfortunately because fabric/thread/crafting was the domain of Crielle, Gwyn doesn’t care to really learn it. I think he only really would if it was say...central to a species of fae that Gwyn was trying to get to know, and then he’d probably never do it again.

[theladyofbloodshed]

Okay so you love Azriel. I have to ask, what did you think of the bonus chapter? The entire thing but mainly:

1. His views about Elain (the way he thinks that the bond should be with him, instead of it being with Lucien)

2. The way he claimed the he would win the Blood Duel against Lucien. (Arrogance or true love for Elain)

3. His re gifting of necklace to Gwyn.

Personally I love the third one because I kinda saw this as a soft beautiful gesture towards a friend. However, the fandom thinks it was a horrible crime on his part which is just 😫

This chapter opened up a whole can of worms of how not-in-a-good-place Azriel is at this point in the story. He's unable to sleep, razor-sharp thoughts are slicing him, and at his core he is desperate to have love. He's envious of Rhys and Cassian having mates. But I loved having his POV.

He views Elain as not somebody he actually wants a relationship with, but somebody he could be with because, although she's mated, she's unattached, she's beautiful, and quiet. However, his self-loathing is so strong that he avoids looking at his own hands when she hands him the gift, he uses words such as sacrilege and sullied when referencing his hands touching her. Most of his thoughts about her are of a sexual nature. Basically, just wants to fuck. It doesn't mention anything about her hobbies or personality, literally just her body. And that's fine if they're just after a quick hook up, but pure lust will not sustain a relationship. Whilst lots of SJM's couples are overly sexual with each other, there is at least some teasing and playfulness. Training is also the foundation of most of her couples and I don't see these two ever training together, The IC will not force Elain to be a warrior like Nesta. They both acknowledge they shouldn't really be doing it. Elain saying she should go but not moving, Azriel agreeing. Talk of only the Mother witnessing it because it's a secret. It doesn't seem to me that Azriel wants Elain because he loves her, he is just so desperate to be loved by anybody and Elain is convenient. She's not happy with her bond, she's beautiful, they get on well. She's an easy choice.

When Rhys challenges him on deserving Elain, he deflects the question and claims Lucien doesn't - because from his internal thoughts, Azriel doesn't think he's good enough to touch Elain anyway. Azriel also confesses internally that he hasn't really planned anything beyond jerking off about her. That's not a forbidden love where they're being kept apart. He's horny and hasn't considered any implications beyond fucking her. Azriel is a skilled warrior. One of the strongest in Illyria's history so I do think it's just his arrogance and self-assurance that gives him confidence that he'd win the Blood Rite. I love Lucien, but he hasn't unlocked the Day Court powers properly yet and has not trained them, so he's at a disadvantage although we know he can fight. I also headcanon that Azriel is scared of fire because of his hands, so I wouldn't be rushing to fight somebody whose power is fire, if I was him. The Blood Rite has no winners. If Azriel killed Lucien, it would cause a war between Autumn and Night (you think Beron wouldn't take it as a slight, even if his son is exiled) and perhaps even Day when the truth comes to light. They lose a valuable asset in Lucien due to his ties to many courts. Further, Lucien is still Elain's mate. The loss of a mate can affect the other terribly. If Lucien killed Azriel then he'd be outcast from the Night Court or Cassian/Mor would probably try and get revenge. Elain would likely never talk to him again. It's just so stupid to even think about doing it. 3. I absolutely love the shift in tone when he goes to the House of Wind. He sits on the lawn of the river estate in the cold to calm himself down then Gwyn is in the ring - shadows don't warn him because they can't wait to play with her. He immediately shows concern, asking if she's cold. She makes him snort when she kicks him out then she teases him. His restlessness settles when she smiles at him. Then their interaction ends with him ensuring again that she doesn't stay too long or she'll be too cold. Their easy conversation is so at odds with the nervous, hesitant exchange he has with Elain where his thoughts are pre-occupied with how wrong it is for his ruined hands to touch her. He demonstrates with a sword for Gwyn and not once does he think of his hands. Their conversation is easier, he's calmer during it, his shadows want to stay and watch. Although re-gifting is not great, I think the necklace is symbolic for his heart. He's had it prepared for Elain, he's hesitant to give it to her, doesn't think he should be touching her as he places the chain around her neck. It's returned. Rejected. He has every intention of returning it to the store then diverts course and it's given to Gwyn unexpectedly. I also think it's interesting that when Rhys asks "What of Mor?" Azriel chooses to ignore the question rather than answering it. It would be easy to say "I'm over her", so why doesn't he? He even reflects on the fact he'd been ready to enact the Blood Duel when he'd found her in the woods - been ready to die in her honour.

[marjansmarwani]

hi i know it’s early and we don’t have a lot of informations but i love your blog and your takes so i was just wondering. where would you want next episode to go? like what would you like to see happening based on the few bits of information we have? :)

Hi Anon! Thank you for sending this, theorizing about the episodes is one of my favorite hobbies. I'm hoping to make this as coherent as possible but I apologize in advance for the fact that it will likely not be very coherent at all. I am also planning a spec fic so a lot of this will also be in my fic which I'm hoping to have done by this weekend (aka a lot of this came right from my outline). So consider this a sneak preview to that, if you want.

Anyways, here it goes. I hope you wanted a chaotic info dump because that’s all I’m capable of on this day.

I'm pretty sure it will pick up almost immediately after the end of 3x07, probably the next day as they are leaving for New York. I am agreeing with this post by @doublel27 in the fact that Carlos will be going, but isn't able to go right away. My guess is that they did book seats but that maybe Owen got bumped from the flight and Carlos insists Owen take his seat, that he'll follow on the next available flight. The promo makes it looks like he is in the airport and I think this makes the most sense. (I do have specific thoughts on the fact that he is on the phone and who he is talking to while watching, but I will save those for my fic. They're probably not right but they're fun.)

I see flashbacks happening throughout the episode. I would love to see one from the start, when the plane takes off. And TK getting up to go to the bathroom to get a moment to gather himself (which is where he is when the emergency starts). I think that they will mirror the action in the episode, but that isn’t exactly shocking. It seems like pretty standard procedure for this kind of thing.

The other thing I see and and pretty tied to is TK being the only one who can help. There is clearly at least medical emergency and if there is no doctor or nurse on board, a paramedic would absolutely be the next best thing. I’d like to see thing for a couple of reasons: to show TK being good at his job, to give him something to focus on, and to have Owen forced to play sidekick and just have to help TK as he saves the day in a way that Owen can’t.

I do think that they will make it to New York in the end (probably with the help of a time jump) and I wouldn’t be surprised if the episode ended on a scene of TK either at the funeral (maybe giving a eulogy? I need to do some research on Jewish funerals I don’t know if that’s even a thing) or right after, possibly with Jonah. I also wouldn’t be surprised if he decided to stay in New York for a while at the end of an episode, and that he might not even be in the next episode.

You also asked what I would like to see, so here’s a list:

Good Dad Owen. He is my favorite version of Owen and the relationship between TK and Owen is one of the things that first drew me into the show. We haven’t seen a lot of it (or hardly any, really) this season so I’m banking on this being an episode that contains a lot of it. I want to see TK handling the emergency and Owen assisting him, and being proud.

TK addressing his grief and along the way deciding that he is not going to fall into old habits and comping mechanisms (i.e. relapsing) because of something Gwyn said or because he wants to keep making her proud. I think this also makes sense because they have been very conscious about showing how he has grown since we met him in season 1 and this could be another way to show that.

Some sort of Tarlos reunion. Carlos not being there makes sense, but if we don’t get to see their reunion later I’m going to have some words with someone. I’m not sure who yet, but someone. We deserve it and so do they.

I don’t think a lot of time will be spent on this given everything, but worried firefam. The found family is still my absolute favorite part of the show and I want to see them grappling with this. Hopefully more than just one quick scene. They’ve all been through a lot and they deserve some time to address their emotions when facing another trauma.

Does this make any sense? I hope so.Thanks again for asking Anon and I hope this lived up to what you were hoping for!

[gwyns]

At this point, Sarah just has to say "flowers" to get el/riels screaming. Remember when Sarah said that she loves flowers and they connected that to El/riel? Or when some of them bullied artists for drawing Gwynriel or Gwyn with flowers? I can't even believe the whole "bread and roses" became such a big thing that they were willing to bully gwynriels and yelled that El/riel is confirmed...when it has no meaning behind it.

I know we laugh at it, but considering the fact that some of the El/riels were willing to seriously bully people over fricking flowers is concerning. The fall is going to be harder when Sarah confirms Gwynriel.

it's kind of impressive really how they can take the most mundane things and connect it to their ship and scream endgame. sjm could literally mention how she had pizza for dinner and they'd be out here like "one of the ingredients in pizza is BREAD and bread comes from dough and you know who would make the dough? ELAIN and what else does elain like to do? GARDEN so therefore ROSES are involved and since azriel gave her that ROSE necklace that she returned to him that obviously means they're endgame!!!1!!1!"

on a more serious note it is very disgusting how they find it so easy to bully (and stalk) others and seemingly have no shame in doing so. elain and azriel AREN'T REAL. they're not going to jump out of the pages and thank you for defending them and their loaves. pls go get a new hobby or make some new friends or just do something productive bc the way y'all act online is worrying.

[lovemyromance]

what does the term "heal" entail, exactly?

I see that word around this fandom a lot in the context of:

"Gwyn is going to heal and she and Azriel are going to have a book on their journey"

Not trying to hate, just genuinely trying to understand what people mean by that? What does healing mean? Everyone in ACOTAR has different traumas and they coped with them in very different ways.

Nesta drank a lot and slept around to cope, but she only got to a better place mentally when she trained. So is that what people are considering to be her healing journey?

Feyre also had a hard life - what was her healing journey? Also training? Painting? Were those not just considered hobbies she used to cope?

I understand Gwyn has trauma and she has to heal from it and her going back to the library may not be the end of her story... but what would that story entail? Would that story take up an entire book?

Rhys & Lucien also had SA trauma. They were tied to other plot lines and their trauma was barely addressed, merely used as character development or a plot point to progress the story. How is Gwyn going to have an entire journey on healing when Rhys and Lucien didn't?

And again, what does it mean for Gwyn to heal? How is it going to take up an entire book? Or will it be a novella in between just focused on Gwyn healing and then the next book will pick back up with the Koschei conflict?

Because right now as it stands, Gwyn isn't really related to Koschei? At least, not in comparison to Elain or Lucien or Vassa or Azriel or Nesta or Cassian.

Is her healing also going to be to train? Wouldn't that just be ACOSF 2.0?

Is her healing going to be to sing? Which is like fine.... but that's not really a story or a plot, that's a hobby. Feyre painted and Nesta danced as hobbies but that's not the focus of her book. It's not the plot.

Is her healing going to be to just be with Azriel? How would that help her as a person if she needs a man to get better? That seems very anti SJM's stance on powerful women.

I just want to know what "Gwyn is gonna heal" as the plot of the next ACOTAR book means 🤷🏻‍♀️ People love to use that term and write paragraphs on how great a Gwynriel book will be but so far no one has given me an answer on what it means to "heal".

[mrspettyferr]

Heyy. So i just want to say something. from gwynriel perspectives and i try to understand why they are so convinced the next book is about az and gwyn. Of cos they included unending shadow theories , elain's useless womb, weirdo hobby gardening, a secret lovely beauty quote (dont forget it was to described elain) and so on. So here, they said that yes elain would appear in the next book bcs az would reject her (they said az only want elain just for sex ) and az finally begin to realize he loves gwyn. I know this is kinda funny. And they go on and on that acotar6 is about elain finally accept the mating bond with lucien. I know most of these theories doesnt make sense but i want to know your opinion on these theories. Love y'all ❤

I think it’s fairly obvious many of them (not all, I never like to generalize) frankly don’t understand Elain as a character. They have a perception of her, one they don’t like, and they like Az (and Lucien), so they want to cling to anyone that could possibly sink that ship. Which means trying to fit a narrative around that couple.

Some of those theories are comical. So let me just lay down some facts and common sense.

Looking at this from a plot perspective:

Koschei will be released from the lake, because there’s no way in hell a final battle with the villain will happen with him chained up. 

He needs all four Dread Trove items to be released from his lake, so the fourth has to be found in book 5 so he can be free in book 6.

Only Feyre, Elain, and/or Nesta can find it. Feyre and Nesta have had their main journeys

It’s Elain’s turn, especially considering she already volunteered to go find it. And its veiled in shadows. (hint hint who will help her)

The Feysand bonus scene did not highlight "let's help one sister before we help the other" and "we haven't seen everything Elain can offer" just to say ACTUALLY, let's wait and skip over her for a book.

Looking at this from a romantic subplot perspective:

Elain and Lucien have regressed, not progressed. 

Lucien is now showing discomfort regarding Elain and Elain visibly shrinks into herself and loses her newfound boldness.

Solstice would have been a perfect time to show progression - but nope, SJM did the opposite.

Lucien has a home with Vassa and is said to be so close with her, he can’t even be trusted to do his job. 

Azriel’s pov confirms mutual romantic feelings between Elain and Az.

Az’s moodiness, avoidance of the river house, the reason he won’t sit near the fire, Nesta’s knowledge of his secret, their shared charged look - all point to the advancement of a romantic subplot with Elain

As stated above, Az will be needed to help Elain with the fourth Trove item

Bottom line: Vucien and Elriel continued to progress in ACOSF, and this book needs to lead us to the next romance.

Looking at this from SJM’s actual words:

“I realized at that point I wanted to tell not just this story about Nesta and Cassian, but also I wanted to tell the story of all these other characters who were in the earlier books as kind of side characters.”

“I know what the first two will be about.”

“But I do know that the Cassian and Nesta book is next. And I know what I want to write for the second spinoff novel, but I’m keeping the door open after that.”

“And I remember the entire time I was ripping out ivy, and was trying to get some semblance of order into the garden beds, I went into Elain’s head. Elain is a gardener, and everything I did became research for her book.”

Many of the seeds for this book (ACOSF) are already planted in ACOFAS, along with seeds for some of the other spinoff novels.

“Do you have another book planned for the third sister?” - “Yes--yes to everything. As soon as Nesta and Elain came back onto the page in ACOMAF, I knew that they would have journeys beyond what the readers were seeing.”

I may have hated math classes growing up but I can do some simple addition. If the spinoffs are about characters from the original trilogy, and seeds were planted in ACOFAS (before Gwyn existed), and SJM is researching Elain’s book, and she knows what the next book is about....

Elain is book 5. 

Those theories are wishful thinking and disregard facts and common sense.

(Note: I'm not saying Gwyn won't play a role in the next two books, or that she won't have a novella or something in the future. I'm simply saying she's not getting a full length book before Elain and likely won't be a main pov until after the Koschei story wraps up.)

[acourtofthought]

The HOFAS bonus chapter dropped and i'm starting to think Azriel's book really is next? Like there's no way

HOFAS spoilers

I still think it's anyone's guess as to which book is next because the Az / Bryce / Nesta bonus is more about them getting to know one another and while we learn a few fun details about Az (and one line that seems to completely end the possibility of E/riel), it doesn't actually set anything up for his book plot wise.

For example, in ACOWAR, we learned that Lucien used to camp, fishes with his bare hands and enjoys reading though he hasn't gotten to in awhile.

In the Walmart bonus, we see that Az seems to really enjoy the kind of music played in "pleasure halls" or clubs and it ends with his shadows dancing to that music.

But just because we learned a bit about Lucien's interests / hobbies in ACOWAR, it did not guarantee him the next book.

And I don't think us getting insight into Az's hobbies in an entirely different series guarantees him the next ACOTAR book either. Learning about the music he likes is not more important to the ACOTAR series than dealing with Koschei, Spring, Beron, etc.

Could he get the next book? Definitely! But so could Elucien, especially when you consider Az and Nesta still don't give credit to Elain for her part in killing the King which is a continuation of the narrative in SF, where people underestimate her. It just all depends on which story SJM wants to tell based on what plots need settled first because right now, we know about things Lucien likes, things Elain likes, things Gwyn likes and now things Az likes so no one really has a leg up there not to mention not everyone reads CC, the things that happened in SF are still the main focus of the ACOTAR readers right now.

Actually, the bonus seems to be the first time we were ever given hints as to Az's interests so it feels more like SJM is just trying to catch him up to everyone else.

The only thing I think the bonus proves in terms of Az's future book (wherever that is in the lineup) is E/riels incompatibility and Gwynriels compatibility.

[yabai-korra]

Don't kill me but... I think this is a possible ship for the next ACOTAR book

This is just an opinion, NOT stanning it nor does the idea of this ship come from me shipping other ships, it's just what I think based on having experience on SJM books and after reading ACOSF.

Okay huh... I actually think this ship might happen in the next book...

So, one part of the ship is Tamlin.

As we all know Tamlin is based on the beast from The Beauty and the Beast fairytale, which only held a certain value in the first book since he shapeshifts in a beast, and is cursed along with his whole court.

However, (I have seen a few amazing people pointing it out here before), Tamlin more fits the description of the beast in ACOSF than ACOTAR, he's overridden with guilt to the point that he stays in his beast form (and the of beast can't turn back to human), feels very undeserving of love, almost forgot how to speak like a person and is actually adapting to the lifestyle and mindset of an actual beast.

The way Eris says it in a fairytale way as well...

What Eris says is a literal description of the beast from the original tale, and considering it's Tamlin's only appearance it's SJM's way of telling us he is still important to the story. If he wasn't he would have died in previous books (I honestly thought he will commit s*icide in ACOFAS)

Now... I have already said how I feel about his possible redemption here, long story short I don't think he really deserves it BUT due to his actions at the end of ACOWAR, guilt, and depression plus PTSD, I think he deserves a chance to earn the redemption, because I'm not sold out on it yet and I believe he should suffer for his actions (which he obviously does) but he is not like... the worst. I believe SJM will redeem him (as she hinted on) because she loves redemption and healing arcs, plus he is going to be important in the next war and it was clearly stated he isn't capable of leading anything in ACOSF. She sunk him to rock bottom and she wouldn't do that unless she plans on raising him back up as a better person.

Back to the ship sorry...

Since Tamlin is literally the beast now, I think he will get shipped with the beauty!

Feyre never really fit the og beauty. This is obviously not going to Feyre slander I love Feyre lol.

Beauty and Feyre both have brown hair and live with their father (Beauty in some versions has siblings) but that's really where all the similarity stops.

Beauty, as a Disney princess, is very pure and kind (not to say that Feyre isn't kind but to a different extent), but the very first time we meet Feyre she is getting blood on her hands and is arguing with Nesta.

Beauty's hobbies are reading and singing, whereas Feyre couldn't read nor does she sing.

Beauty really likes flowers (roses especially) whereas Feyre never had any special connection to them.

If you look at it, all three Archeron sisters fit one part of Beauty's character.

I am pretty sure SJM won't introduce a new character just to be shipped with Tamlin because a) she never makes someone a ship right in the first book of character's introduction and b) creating a character just to be a love interest for a hated character is going to make the worst possible ship ever.

So I think that it is possible that the beauty that will help the beast is.....

don't kill me

Gwyn.

Omg I actually typed that. I know that it sounds crazy right off the bet when it's said like that but I watched The Beauty and the Beast while thinking about ACOSF and something just clicked, so hear me out:

Gwyn's hobby is reading and she is a huge bookworm, like Beauty.

Gwyn has a beautiful voice and likes singing, like Beauty.

Gwyn is connected to roses (Elain's necklace) which is the main motive of the Beauty and the Beast.

Gwyn is literally associated with the word beauty. ("A thing of a secret, lovely beauty")

During the Blood Rite, everyone, including Nesta fucking Archeron and all the Illyrians, hid away from the BEASTS, whereas Gwyn was the only one that observed the beast, learned its habits, lured it to Belius and used the beast to her advantage.

In Beauty's intro song people sing that she is kind (like Gwyn), always reading (like Gwyn), very friendly (like Gwyn), dazed and has a head in the clouds sometimes (like Gwyn). Ofc these traits by themselves mean nothing bc they can be applied to a lot of characters, but put together they do form more of a unique personality.

Asshole meeting the cute pure girl with a bad past and she helps him become a better person is the trope SJM used in TOG so using it again wouldn't be weird because she did repeat herself a few times.

I just can't shake off the thought that Gwyn definitely represents Beauty, at least more than any other ACOTAR character.

I honestly don't know what to make of it, with Gwyn's huge connection to Beauty and the fact that she was the only one that knew how the handle the beasts.... sus

This is obviously not something I want to happen, I just think it's possible knowing SJM.

What do your guys think?

[rotten-games]

🙊 for all rott ros please?? Also, hope you're doing well!!

Hi thanks, I'm doing quite well, all things considered!

SPEAK-NO-EVIL - what is something your oc will refuse to stay quiet about?

Gonna take a more lighthearted response to this one for reasons.

Ardwen: Absolutely everything :/ someone please shush him. He will find a way to talk about something.

Arke: Swords and swordplay, if you didn't know any better you might just assume it's a euphemism. It isn't, he's just like that.

Bex: His work. All things considered, he actually enjoys his job and gets along well with his boss... not so much her partner, however.

Cal: All her animal companions; she will go on for hours about them. And her late wife.

Druvel: His past. His history; what jobs he's had, the experiences, you might even get a 'back in my day'. If you don't come out of a conversation with him knowing the intimate details of at least 300 of his 500 years that's considered strange. Though... whether any of it is strictly true is another matter entirely.

Emil: His boss’ partner. He does NOT like them at ALL! ... They’re mean...

Ettia: Oh, many things; the moon, the ocean, the passage of time and what it does to the land and the people that shape it... many things...

Gwyn: choice. Someone shut this man up and give him a lecture about destiny or something idk.

Herron: His work but because he has no other hobbies.

Keller: Her home. Home is not where she lives, but where she left many years ago. She could go on and on about the great beauty of her home, about the people, the desert, the dragons, but not even she could dare claim to do it justice.

Korrin: Destiny. Someone please give them a lecture on free will and the concept of choice.

Lokeira: Oh, whatever he has to complain about, I suppose.

Necrolym: Pretty ladies... and pretty men.

Nox: Her axes. She has many, many stories about her, uh, conquests. They are very violent, and very bloody.

Qora: Zora. If she talked much at all she would gush about him constantly.

Severa: Swords and swordplay but this time they are about 50/50 euphemism and genuine statement.

Spotter: Anything. Everything. Most of the time they don’t know what to say so they just say whatever first comes to mind.