#in response to symptoms that were distressing you too

[sad-wet-cat-hannibal]

(Essay incoming so I'm adding a read more)

I think you've said some good stuff here, and I too get annoyed or even angered by people using the term in a way that I interpret as flippant; but I'd like to add that as someone who frequently described distressing books and films as "traumatising", it turned out that that word was rather apt - because my intense response was caused by my trauma being triggered by those very same things, too often in ways that felt like reliving it.

Here's the kicker. I didn't know I *had* any trauma. All I knew was that engaging with these works made me feel distressed and disturbed as if I were personally traumatised by these things. Like they were real. Like they damaged me. Just from reading them or seeing them. They'd haunt me for weeks, sometimes months, sometimes years. Sometimes they gave me weird symptoms I couldn't explain. So, naturally, I was hyper-avoidant as fuck.

That intense sensitivity and hyper-avoidance, combined with my ignorance to the fact that my psyche was not experiencing these things from an untraumatised position, meant I thought that "intensely distressing/traumatising" was just the normal effect these things had - except lots of other people seemed oblivious, and even delighted in the exact same works. Sometimes none more so than the kind of motherfuckers who actually like traumatising people.

So I figured, as incomprehensible as it seemed, everyone else had to be either too numbed out/oblivious/naïve to realise how awful this shit was, or were actually big fans of bad things happening in real life.

Because if to me it felt too real, capable of destroying my peace of mind for weeks, then surely to some extent that must be the same for everyone else, right? (Obviously not, but I was younger and working with what limited knowledge I had.) From that logic it's really easy to buy into censorship, into propaganda that claims that the symptoms of a society with a dysfunctional approach to life are often born of the media that echoes them, rather than the other way round. It's real to you. It's your only explanation. (You don't want to feel like this. You don't want anyone to feel like this. It's inhumane.)

What I'm trying to say is that not everyone knows they're traumatised. I think as many as those who do, do not. Perhaps far more. And for those people, the only time they are able to touch on the truth of their half-veiled iceberg is when they tell you that The Bridge to Terabithia "traumatised" them.

(I know it "did" me.)

Telling them they're exaggerating, and misusing language that doesn't apply to them runs the very real risk of making it harder for them to treat their feelings with the consideration and weight they deserve, and enabling them to begin the process of unraveling their denial and tending their wounds. It runs the risk of reinforcing the (potentially forgotten or minimised) messaging they may have already received, during and after the trauma, that it doesn't matter. They're exaggerating. They're making things up. Other people have trauma, other people have it so much worse, other people suffer - but not you. Your account of your experience is unbelievable. Silly. You will not be seen or heard or understood, not by anyone else, and not by yourself...

Yet. Hopefully one day. But I think it often takes other people being willing to shine a light on the pain, and say, "Yeah, it's real. It's caused by things. You aren't alone and you aren't exaggerating."

I think the flippant watering down of the word is potentially very unhelpful too, but there's a section of society who want to push the narrative that the vast majority of people speaking seriously and from a place of relevant psycho-education about their trauma are just special snowflakes jumping on a trend. Maybe I shouldn't, but I feel wary of adding fuel to their fire by trying to gatekeep trauma. I don't know what the solution to these two conflicting uses of the word is, or if it's even possible to create a solution that doesn't simultaneously police the traumatised out of expressing their pain the only way they currently know how. Which would set back the whole thing of trying to help people... We get enough trauma olympics ingrained into everyone as it is.

Oh yeah!! Just remembered, Gabor Mate said in either his book from 2024 or an interview about it that he considers everyone to be traumatised, the question is simply one of degree (if I'm remembering correctly). So from that it may in fact be possible to argue that books and films can traumatise people, although perhaps not necessarily to the extent we might associate with PTSD or CPTSD.

I'm wondering if, as a society who cares about vulnerable people, we could stop saying "traumatize" when we truly mean "upset"?

I am sick of hearing sad books or movies "traumatize" their readers. I simply do not believe that happens. A traumatic experience might be adjacent to books (I have vivid memories of books I was reading around certain experiences and even how the contents of those books affected my processing of the experiences). But it's not caused by the book. And, y'know. The weather is Christofascist Censorship Attempts outside.

Meanwhile from the other side I continue to be surprised at just how badly people fail to understand trauma and traumatic experiences in general. Watering down the term isn't helping. Find other hyperbole to express that The Bridge to Terebithia gutted you, chewed on your heartstrings, and made you cry your first pair of contact lenses right out of your preteen eyes.

[embers-of-the-league]

Tenko Shimura's ‘allergies’ and the implications thereof

I think most people always agreed that Tenko's allergies were - in some form or another - emotion-based.

Back in 235 we get the infamous "it only itches at home line" line.

It's also emphasized again later in the chapter when we see that the itching gets progressively worse after Kotaro yells at Tenko (meaning that it gets worse when Tenko is sad and/or in distress).

Back in the day, I saw a lot of people theorizing that the itch was a sign of Decay and that it was the early stages of the quirk manifesting within Tenko. But given what we know now, about AFO giving Tenko the quirk and especially when he gave Tenko the quirk, I don't think that this is the case.

We can pretty much pinpoint exactly when AFO gave Tenko the Decay quirk.

These two panels are from 235 and 419 - and I firmly believe that these panels take place only minutes apart from each other. This is also clearly the moment that AFO gave Decay over to Tenko, as shown by the small glow of his hand.

Before this point Tenko Shimura was quirkless.

Tenko got his original quirk stolen from him when he was just a baby - meaning that during the time between being an infant and being 5-years-old, Tenko was officially quirkless.

This makes a huge difference if we then look back at his allergies and why they appear.

This panel is from just before AFO takes Tenko's hand and gives him the Decay quirk. Look at his face. This boy already has irritated skin around his eyes (it looks like he's just been scratching at it too).

With the knowledge that Tenko at this point in time still is quirkless, I think it's fair to say that the allergies are not an early symptom of Decay.

It only itches at home.

Because the itching is purely psychosomatic. Because it's a stress-response/anxiety-response to the environment this young boy is forced to come home to every single day.

This boy is 5. He's 5. It's not normal for a 5-year-old to think thoughts anywhere near "does my father hate me?"

Kotaro has already put a fear in this little boy, which doesn't stop or go away as soon as his punishment does. The trauma in this boy is already so big that he thinks about these things in the moments when his dad isn't even actively scolding or punishing him.

It doesn't take a destructive quirk to cause a physical response like itching. All it takes is being constantly afraid of when you're going to be yelled at next, when you're going to be punished next, all by the hands of the parental figure you aren't sure even loves you at all.

It only itches at home.

Especially when the four walls of your house are a prison.

[lunar-wandering]

anyways as i mentioned earlier here is my absolutely nuts 'analysis' of Boboiboy having autism, and how each of the seven elementals kinda showcase a heightened version of an autism symptom-

so we're gonna go down in order (of manifestation for the elements)-

Boboiboy himself- he's just got the vibe, y'know? But also; it's been established he had no friends prior to moving in with his grandfather, which, y'know, is quite strange for a "normal" kid his age. He also tends to look at the people around him to know how to react in certain social situations (usually the person he looks to is Gopal which. Isn't always the best choice). Also the strong sense of justice is obvious (including that he goes so far as to help villains as well). (Yes this can be an autism symptom).

Halilintar (Thunderstorm). hear me out. Halilintar manifested due to overstimulation. I mean obviously the phobia of balloons is a huge factor here- but being in distress due to loud sounds is exactly one of the things that causes overstimulation for autistic people (could contribute to why he has this fear in the first place). One of the ways people might react to overstimulation is by becoming irrationally angry. Basically what I'm saying is that Halilintar spends most of his time on the edge of a meltdown-

Taufan (Cyclone). autistic joy. listen LISTEN. it's DIFFERENT from other people's joy, okay? a lot of autistic people experience emotions very intensely, it can full out take over you. also as far as i remember (it's been a while) he was the only one who had such an intense reaction to the mood changing potion- sure, the other people who had it were locked in one emotion, but none of them went as wild as he did- because he felt it a lot more intensely.

Gempa (Earthquake). i will admit, i struggled for a moment with Gempa- but honestly i think it's because he is, in my opinion, the one who's the most similar to OG Boboiboy. other than the heightened need to protect, which likely includes the sense of justice, I think Gempa is the one who masks the most out of all the elements. This is also why he seems to be the most neutral element.

Blaze and Ice. I'm doing these two together, because technically, their origin points are from the same thing: Burnout. It's just two very different responses to it. On the one side, Blaze is trying to, ironically enough considering the name, prevent burnout, by relieving stress (by doing things in the middle of night while no-one is looking and there's no pressure of social interaction). When there is too much stress, he falls into an overstimulated state similar to Halilintar's. On the other side, Ice represents the more depressed side of burnout- aka what happens after you actually burn out. It's why he's tired all the time.

Duri (Thorn). Okay so technically Thorn first manifested in battle but we're ignoring that. His tier 1 manifestation, as we all know, was mainly most definitely because Boboiboy got a concussion- but! Here's the thing; I don't think the concussion is why Thorn acts the way he does (though it's probably a part of it). I think, Thorn is just unmasked. The others all mask on some level, but Thorn just, doesn't. He doesn't really care how others might perceive him if he does 'childish' things or says things that no-one else understands because they didn't make the same connections he did, and he certainly doesn't care that deadpan telling someone their outfit is terrible might hurt their feelings, it doesn't even occur to him. He doesn't mask at all.

Solar. Again, technically manifested during battle. However once again we are ignoring that. It was established that the manifest condition for Solar (as Light), was for the elemental master (Boboiboy) to "expand their knowledge", and "read more". And, well, I know Boboiboy specifically read a bunch of science and history books and stuff, but honestly I don't think it really would've mattered what he chose to use to expand his knowledge, because Solar's main autistic trait is special interest. Because Boboiboy mainly focused on science and stuff, that became Solar's special interest, hence why he rambles off about formulas and stuff, and why he likes doing experiments. He hyperfixates on that stuff.

now. i could do the fusions... but honestly i haven't thought about the fusions enough to draw conclusions, so we're sticking with this

[angstics]

On rewatch, max seemed to be going through a certain kind of Nightmare during “gay week” that Must be attributed to a turbulent episode of internalized homophobia.

My textual evidence is: his confusion / discomfort over being referred to as “daddy”, his almost panicked reaction to avery talking about the threeway (he mentions “the pact” three different times while tristan is open to it… max seems very embarrassed and wary), of course the awkwardness with tristan. There’s also a general air of coldness from him the whole episode. He smiles a few times, but there is a Noticeable Pitch Drop in his voice. Like it’s wild to watch Any other episode then this. Jj flowers

He is going THRU some shit. And im not sure why? He liked the threeway (“wonderful”), he has 0 awkwardness with avery (smiles at her, no tension with her), he doesn’t particularly Fight for avery (doesnt ask her to choose). The tristan fight is the symptom of something big. I guess from their sexual encounter to the quiet to the awkwardness to the throuple suggestion to the tension to the professional fight to the increased tension eased by cap to the apology and relationship breakdown. then he smiles at them.

I feel like. You can see when the tension became intense. Right when avery brings It Up. Then max gets jealous? I feel like. That isnt the appropriate response OR response time. Also during the initial talk, he KEPT trying to shut it down. Thats actually the only thing he says. He doesnt sound jealous. He sounds ashamed. Like i said, embarrassed. Over what? Sharing a girl? Would he have felt this awkward if he slept with her then later she slept with tristan? No. You know how i know. Because he didnt really do anything when tristan and avery kissed and he saw. Afair. And you know what.???? It couldn’t even have been he was ashamed of doing weird sex because hed ALREADY done a threeway. And he called it BAD because they were more into each other. YOU KNOW WHAT HE CALLED THIS AVERY TRISTAN THREEWAY? WONDERFUL!!!

The distressing part was that it was good for everyone. Two people Werent more into each other than with a third. Uh oh! There’s no third he realizes!!! The angry embarrassed ashamed part has to be from the total enjoyment he had. Which necessitates sexual pleasure from whatever Tristan was doing, and seeing Avery & Tristan together. Ergo. #InternailzedHomophobia

Theres a billion more things to talk about. Like the vagueness of Tristan’s sexuality, all the IMPLICATIONS throughout the show in terms of max’s sexuality, the episode’s marked separation btwn Gay People and max & tristan. The theme of “too much” and what that means in a tv show ABOUT indulgence. Ummm!!!!

[usopps-devotee]

can you PLEASE write some fluff/comfort for your angst Luffy writing? 😫 i wanna give him forehead kisses and cuddles PLEASE

(it was amazing btw!!!)

Anon I know what you asked for but imma make this a series and giving this to yall next time, but life has been interesting (derogatory) since the beginning of February 😋

Pt 1 not your fault

Tags: angst, hurt/comfort, like one mention of blood, no harm tho its used as an expression, please know it's okay to ask for help sometimes, mention of skipping meal.

Wc 1.3k

It's been some time since you found him crying, the only immediately noticeable change is Luffy seems to be more aware of you and touch you than before. Maybe that's why he noticed your disappearance today. The reason why he's noticed every flinch within the last week, the tears that started to well up but didn't fall when you dropped a teacup, trying your best to laugh it off as Sanji and robin assured you it was okay. The moment of deep breaths after any loud sounds, Luffy swears he saw your soul leave your body when Usopp and Franky started to try something new with Sunny's cannon. Zoro was there to notice the last one too joking about you being jumpy, your captain surely noticed you becoming quieter after that moment.

So when he walked into your room without knocking, he didn't mind being hit in the face with the pillow you threw. Not knowing or caring who it might have been, only focused on the darkness of being hidden under the covers. You heard his footsteps come closer as he tried to figure out where your head was. When it was located he sat down and pulled you into his lap. Not bothered to move the plush fortress you are surrounded in. Being so close to him helped, your body relaxed at the contact, not knowing how much you may have needed the connection.

"You missed breakfast, Sanji said you missed dinner as well." 

Knowing this isn't exactly about the missed meals, while he is worried about that, it's more so the fact that you haven't left your room. Being one of, if not the most, cuddly members of the crew seeing you spend so much time alone was jarring to him. After all, if Luffy had a problem he came to you. So why couldn't you do the same, was he the problem? Is someone else on the ship? What could be disturbing you so much?

The worst part is if you were honest, you didn't have a clue. You had just been feeling wrong, completely off without reason. Now that your captain has found you alone and distressed, it only makes the tangles and knots in your gut feel worse. Guilt plagued you as you didn't have to see his face to know that his wide eyes had been staring down at you for any movement, for any symptom that you could be getting better or worse. For any kind of response really, he just hopes it's not more remorse. When he does finally feel you move it's a good 30 seconds of trying to get one hand out of the blanket before you're tugging him closer. There's the feeling of his arms wrapping around your body as his heartbeat can now be heard through the thick blanket. You're not sure how much it helped but it definitely helped the tears stuck in your eyes finally fall.

You feel yourself starting to shake as a voice in the back of your head tells you you're being dramatic. You have no clue what started this ache, with him here you can't push it down till it goes away like you were trying to do. It bubbles up and slowly consumed you, not able to pinpoint whatever emotion this is all you can focus on is how overstimulating everything is. You can't concentrate on his heartbeat anymore, you can hardly breathe. Choking on the first sob before you feel it come up. There's nothing to hide, you're mental state is as scattered as paint across a floor. Desperate for something, anything, to ground you. Luckily luffy is still there, peeling the covers off from over your head, you're too trapped in it to notice that most of the movement isn't coming from you.

He's worried about you hyperventilating, the last thing he wants is for you to pass out at a time like this. You haven't even told him what's wrong yet. You helped him with him and he wants to do the same, he wants to solve it if he can. He made sure to take things slowly, not rushing to any conclusions, just being there in the moment. Seeing your face filled with tears made him want to jump into action. There has to be something he can do to get them to stop. All he could think to do was hold you close, going as far as to place the shank's hat on your head to see if that would help. Everything only made you sob harder.

The hand thought placed on his chest now balled into a fist gripping his shirt for dear life, the other wrapped around his shoulders so you buried your face in his neck. It's highly plausible the rest of the crew can hear your despair, as your captain Luffy would make sure you are not teased for this, just as he put Zoro through a mini hell for laughing at you days before. He wants to treasure you, you're the only one who lets him feel human, let him feel and express instead of hiding behind his smile. He's so lost in his thoughts he almost missed you speak.

"Thank you."

It's hushed and horse, no surprise as all you've done today is sleep and cry. But it's the only thing you can think to say. To your surprise, those two little words shocked Luffy. Why are you thanking him? He hasn't done anything yet? Were you just overwhelmed? Now he's just as lost in your emotions as you are. He really doesn't want to rush, nor does he know how to ask. Confusion is written across his face, he does reach one conclusion. Touch helps, he helped him, it was helping you, so what had you done that night that when you comforted him? He's brought back to the kiss you placed on his forehead, full of warmth and comfort, maybe the same would work for you.

Sheer embarrassment, terror, and panic flooded through your system as Luffy tiled your chin up towards his face. Causing more tears to well up and fall but he kisses them all away. Starting from where they would gather and fall off your chin he worked his way up one side of your face, kissing all the tears he could see and then the corner of your eye before moving to the other one. For the first time in days you smile, you smile, it's not faked, forced, or caused by nervousness. None of it, it's a real, genuine smile. It makes Luffy beam from ear to ear as he now sprinkled kisses anywhere he could reach. It makes you laugh, he's never been happier to hear the sound of your laughter. He'd kiss you forever if it meant you'd never be sad again. But he still had that nagging question in his gut.

"What made you cry in the first place?" He almost reconsidered the question when the smile immediately dropped from your face. Maybe he should have asked another day or basked in it a bit longer. "I- I don't know, I just- everything feels so-" Wrong, out of order, discombobulated. Like your heart has been thrown against a wall just to see the blood splattered. There's definitely a strong emotion behind this all but you're struggling to articulate it. Whatever it might be. "It's fine if you don't know, just tell me how to help, okay?" You nodded thinking, trying to get your mind out of the dark place that it currently resides in. The only thing that has helped so hard was him, his voice, his arms, the sound of his heart beating, his smell, his kisses, everything about Luffy rang with comfort there was nothing else you could want or need but him.

"Please just don't let me go."

[escapingrealtiylovinginsanity]

Will Halstead: Roommate Part 2  

This series is going to be really light and playful. 

Will looked at the boxes piled in the living room and was already regretting his decision to let you live with him and that was before you walked in holding a leash. A leash connected to a huge hairy white dog. “No,” You looked up at him with no shame, “Absolutely not.” 

“Will, you already agreed.” 

“Yeah, reluctantly and under distress.” You rolled your eyes at his melodramatic words. “And that was before I knew you had a small horse. Which you didn’t mention.” 

“Well, I thought if you knew, you would be...more hesitant to agree to me moving in.” 

“I would have told you no.”  

You shrugged smiling guiltily at him, “Yeah or that.” Will scrubbed his hands down his face shaking his head. “Oh, come on Halstead. It’s not like she will even be your responsibility. She is completely housetrained and doesn’t chew anything.” He eyed her wearily as she started sniffing his new tennis shoes. “You have to at least like dogs, you're not a monster.”  

Will had begrudgingly agreed to let you and your miniature horse stay. “But I’m not taking care of her. And she’s not allowed in my room or on the couch.” You had nodded, giving him your assurances. You were trying to be as agreeable as possible. You didn’t want to make waves. This was your only option for housing.  

It had to work. 

You didn’t like the thought of locking your dog up while you were out of the house. You knew she was a good girl. She wouldn’t chew or break anything. You couldn’t guarantee she wouldn’t jump on the furniture so you were stuck. It made your stomach churn with guilt and forced you to move her water and food bowls into your room. 

You stuck to the new routine the next week, trying to make up for locking her up in your room with extra walks. If that meant dragging yourself out after dark. Things started to change gradually. You are so consumed with how busy you are that you barely notice it.  

First, it's little. Will letting her out of your room when you are gone- “I didn’t want to listen to her whine.” Will sneaked her scraps of food when he was cooking or he couldn’t finish. You had noticed white hair on the couch and started compulsively vacuuming in hopes that Will wouldn’t notice. Shooing her off whenever she jumped on. It was stressful and a pain in the ass but you managed. Will seemed to be over his irritation with his unwanted visitor. 

At least you had thought so. 

You were searching the apartment in a panic and looking for your precious ball of fur. You had been gone too long and had rushed home to take her on a potty break. You felt guilty about how busy you were. She had been lethargic and you usually found her asleep on your bed when you got home. Now she was gone. 

The front door opens and you swing around to see a fluff of white fur calmly entering, tongue hangout and to the side. An exhausted but happy dog. Will trailed behind her leash clipped to his waist. He was glistening in sweat from his run. “Hey, what are you doing?”  

You slump in relief feeling your exhaustion return tenfold. “I was looking for her!” He looks down at the dog for a moment and back at you. His expression is like a child caught with their hand in the cookie jar.  

“Oh, right-well we went for a jog.” 

“You went for a jog,” You echo blankly, “With my dog- that you hate...” It takes longer than it should for your sluggish brain to process the new information. “Wait- I knew it! You don’t hate her.” He scoffs undoing the leash from her harness. 

“I tolerate her.” He corrects flatly but the twitch at the corner of his lips betrays him. You smile even bigger catching him in his lie. 

“Aw, Will- you big softie. How long have you been taking her on runs?” The exhaustion would explain her lethargic-like symptoms. Then another thought occurred to you as you followed him into the kitchen. “You're the one who’s been letting her on the couch, aren’t you?” 

“A few weeks, and I don’t let her- she just does it.”  

“But you don’t make her get off.” You shake your head laughing, “And I have been cleaning that damn couch every day.” Will meets your gaze across the bar top. “Just admit you like her Will.” 

Will sighs heavily, “I don’t hate her.”        

[hoverboards-and-dragons]

Quick question does Michael have some sort of separation Anxiety?

Because in one reblog you mentioned that pre fall he would send a distress signal when he can't see anybody

In another you mentioned he now has panic attacks when he doesn't know where his sword is

Plus, his sleeping habits.

It started as just separation Anxiety, that was always apart of him.

Michael was a child soldier for all intends and purposes, his most base intention is to protects what is God's. All of his siblings had their own thing going on, the Godfam is Michael's thing.

But Michael was born with a sword into a world that didn't know violence, he had prey animal instincts before predators existed. Always on the look out for a danger that refused to appear and so that tension could never be resolved.

He's the closest to their Father, and by that I mean he was purposefully built more mentally and emotionally reliant on Him than his siblings or most other angels, 'his strings are pulled tighter' so to speak. This was for his role as executioner, if Michael dissented there wasn't another angel that could enforce punishment and God is really trying to avoid doing it Himself. And so his bond with his twin wouldn't be enough to drag him down with Lucifer.

Michael is,,, not really a full person on his own, and he certainly doesn't feel like one.

He's always struggled with nightmares, although not as tangibly. Someone going missing no matter how hard he looked or getting stuck somewhere and being unable to escape. Nothing awful but little leaks that Michael was meant for a cruelty that hadn't yet arrived.

Pre-fall this was manageable, Lucifer's brashness was a good balance for Michael, and more importantly took some of the responsibility off him as an elder brother but also specifically his older brother, who he didn't need to be unshakably strong for.

They were always an heir and the spare dynamic, they co-ruled heaven but it was a 51-49 power split and Michael is still wrestling with feelings of inadequacy given how culturally important ingrained purpose is in Heaven. Debasement to this Rightful place that was never his.

What was I saying? Right.

Post-fall it's a full manifestation of PTSD, if it can still be called separation Anxiety its a symptom. Because now he's lost a brother, and evil has seeped past the defences, and all that quiet itching buzzing under his skin has real function and justification.

Although he is more comfortable doing things alone now that he's older, not "distress signal when he can't see anybody" freaking out, that could be the release of that tension now that the threat is finally present and manageable and not hiding behind every corner. Or could just be a refusal to show vulnerability.

He's scared of losing his family, he's scared of failing his duty and being discarded, he has an emptiness in him where Lucifer was ripped out that he's constantly trying to fill with anything else. If anything goes wrong it's on him, as the oldest and as their potential executioner.

It's definitely intertwined with his autism, his sword's a comfort object, familiarity is safety, interruptions are dangers. As he loses sources of stability he becomes more reliant on the ones left. He's at this point the most traditionally religious of the brothers.

He doesn't have a sense of self outside what he can offer others. So he avoids finding out what hes like away from people in case he doesn't like what he finds. He takes a lot after his Dad.

Michael is ultimately a very shy kid who liked the shadows forced violently out of shell too early by a leadership position he didn't want and doesn't like.

Yes, he has very intense separation Anxiety.

[transylvanilla]

The worst thing about bpd is you almost never know if you should trust your own emotions. Am I experiencing a Normal amount of sadness in response to this? Am I experiencing an Okay amount of anger in response to this? Is it okay to cry right now? Should I be experiencing This Emotion instead of That Emotion? Is this emotional response appropriate or do I look/sound crazy/manipulative? Would a non-bpd feel this intensely upset in response to this, or is the intensity of this distress a bpd symptom?

When you can't trust your own emotions you can't trust your own judgement. This person hurt me, should I stop talking to them forever or is that Too Much? Does the Punishment suit the Crime? You might ask a non-bpd person what they would do if they were in your shoes, but theres plenty of non-bpd people who honestly aren't good at making these judgements either!! Theres plenty of non-bpd people who are so emotionally unintelligent that they basically are just as incapable as you of understanding What They Feel. It sucks.

A bpd person will be lucky to find someone they can place their faith in to help them observe and decide if their feelings and actions are appropriate. Most of my family have problems like mine so I've realized I can't turn to them for this specific thing. They can and will tell me I should feel evil and guilty if my emotions/actions are Inappropriate which is Unhelpful. I can, however, depend on the most mellow, level-headed person I know; my girlfriend, whom I'm very grateful for. A good therapist is probably another good option for other bpds.

Disclaimer, *I'm* not a therapist and I dont claim to have any real education or knowledge about bpd or emotional unstability or whatever else, I just wanted to talk about maybe the most important realization I've made as someone with borderline and has had to deal with borderline family for my entire life.

[marvelousbutterfly]

Who turned the temperature hotter? ('Cause I'm burnin' up)

Read on ao3

Peter being asleep when he’d usually go on patrol was odd enough, but his shivering form was what really made her concerned. He didn’t even stir as she felt for his temperature, and she couldn’t help but wince in sympathy at his warm skin. Or in which sickness and sensory issues don't mix.

Peter felt like shit. It started with a headache around the second period, so mild he couldn’t pinpoint it at first, but then it progressed throughout the day. Navigating the school hallways got harder and harder as the hours went by, his tired limbs protesting every move. Looking in the bathroom mirror after having splashed some water on his face, Peter noticed he - thankfully - didn’t look that bad, only a bit paler than usual. Still, his friends noticed something was up, if their worried glances were anything to go by.

At lunch, he laid his head on his arms, relieved by the cold surface of the cafeteria table.

“Are you sure you’re not hungry?” asked Ned.

Peter only grunted in response, not even looking up at the boy.

“Seriously, I’m taking you to the nurse” said MJ, “This has been going on for too long now.”

“‘M fine, just a headache” the boy retorted, trying to dodge her hand reaching for his face.

“And a fever” she retorted after feeling his temperature.

And she was right, but that didn’t stop Peter from being stubborn enough to endure the rest of the school day. It was a Monday, for Thor’s sake, he wasn’t about to start his week by missing chemistry class. His fever didn’t quite agree with his decision, though, as it only got worse. By the time he got home, all he could do was curl up on the couch and sleep.

______________________________________________________________

That’s how May found him hours later, coming back from her shift at the hospital. Peter being asleep when he’d usually go on patrol was odd enough, but his shivering form was what really made her concerned. He didn’t even stir as she felt for his temperature, and she couldn’t help but wince in sympathy at his warm skin.

She gathered everything she needed before gently squeezing the boy’s shoulder.

“Peter, baby,” she said quietly, “can you wake up for me?”

Peter groaned but complied, opening his eyes and looking at his aunt in confusion as he took in her concerned gaze.

“May?”

“Hi, honey. You have a fever. Can you sit up for me?” she asked, motioning for the medication on the coffee table.

The boy complied, but she couldn’t help but notice how he could barely hold himself upright, leaning heavily on the cushions. She handed him the medication created for his metabolism and he took it with no complaints, desperate to get rid of whatever was causing him to feel this bad.

The thing is, for Peter, getting sick was more than feeling icky and under the weather. Each symptom could easily trigger his sensory issues, not to mention how frustrating it was to not fully be able to determine what exactly were those symptoms. 

So for the next couple of hours, Peter whined in distress about the feeling of his feverish sweat all over him. And by the pont his stomach could no longer hold onto the crackers he had finally been able to eat at May’s insistence, a meltdown was inevitable. A very slow, agonizingly lethargic and painful meltdown. May tried her best to calm him down, but his high fever wasn’t helping with his ability to process her words, so all she could do was let him ride it out, and feel her heart break in the process.

He curled up on his bed under his weighted blanket, one hand by his mouth as he bit his knuckles - May had tried to get him to use one of his chewables, but Peter only gagged at the texture.

With a sigh, frustrated that the medication clearly wasn’t working, May pulled out her phone.

“Tony, I need your help.”

______________________________________________________________

Peter arrived at the Tower’s medbay with a 103 degree fever, an empty stomach and an aching body. After the doctors got him set up with an IV line and a quiet room, Tony finally got in.

“Hey buddy” he said quietly, closing the door behind him as he entered the room. “Not feeling too hot, huh?”

“I’m getting sick of this,” he deadpanned. “Pun intended.”

Tony snorted, sitting next to the hospital bed.

“The doctors got you some nice medication, it will help soon,” he reassured the boy and himself. “Do you need anything?”

“I need to not feel gross and sticky anymore” was Peter’s response, and Tony could see he was fighting the urge to scratch at his arms, which were already littered with scratch marks from minutes before.

“I’m sorry, underoos. Wish I could help with that.”

He could see the energy draining out of the kid, so he attempted to reassure him and lighten up the mood.

“Well, you heard the doc, though. Soon we’ll have the test results. Once we figure out what’s going on, we can make you feel better in no time” he assured. “In the meantime, we can watch any Star Wars movie you want to. I’ll grab the remote.”

“Great, ‘cause the force is definitely not with me at the moment.”

______________________________________________________________

And it wasn’t, indeed. Halfway through the movie, Peter had his second meltdown of the day, just as sluggish as the last one.

Tony cleaned the boy’s sweat with a smooth and cold cloth, knowing that the sensation of sweat all over his body was one of the aggravators of Peter’s current state. It  wasn’t an easy task, though, as Peter’s head kept going back and forth to slam into the thin mattress, pillow already forgotten on the floor where it had fallen minutes before. Tony winced in sympathy.

He didn’t even know how the kid had the energy to do that, as all his movements have been slow, his body having no strength to spare. His eyes were glazed over in a feverish haze and all he could do was whine and grunt to express his frustration.

“You gotta keep that there, buddy,” Tony said patiently, prying the boy’s hand away from the IV still in his arm, providing him with much needed fever reducers. He worried about how sluggish the kid’s movements were, though, as it had taken him about 5 attempts to finally reach the offending object.

Peter cried in frustration, moving his other arm so he could bite down into his fingers, head still banging onto the mattress below him.

“Stop stop stop, make it stop” he sobbed weakly, and Tony’s heart sank.

“I wish I could, kiddo” he lamented, “just a few more minutes and we’ll figure out what’s going on.”

“No more minutes, I can't,” the boy hiccuped.

Despite his pleas, it took 10 more minutes until Peter’s body finally lost all its energy, and he fell asleep with tear tracks still on his face. It only took 5 minutes after that for the doctors to come back with answers.

______________________________________________________________

“Pesticides?” asked May incredulously.

“I’m afraid so,” confirmed the tall brunette doctor. “We found traces of ethyl chloride in Mr. Parker’s system, along with other common components of pesticides. My team did some research and we got the information that his school has used such products over the weekend, and Mr. Parker must have had a reaction to its remnants, as his system is very sensitive to it.”

Tony and May looked at each other, not sure how to react. She was the first to break the silence, turning to the doctor once again.

“So what is our next step?” 

“Well, from the latest exam, it seems that Peter’s metabolism and his healing abilities have already taken care of the substance itself, but it took a strain on his body. The fever and vomiting were probably caused by his body trying to expel whatever was affecting him, so what’s left for us to do now is treat those symptoms. We’re keeping him on fluids and fever reducers still, as well as medication for his stomach. The ideal is that he’s able to eat tonight, or we’ll have to take some more drastic measures due to his fast metabolism.”

The lack of food and dehydration were indeed big concerns, Tony knew that. The boy was already so weak he could barely sit up on his own, and he’s seen firsthand what a couple days with not enough food did to his metabolism.

The doctor reassured them that, despite the concerns about his food intake, Peter was on the track to a speedy recovery. Tony and May thanked her, finally exhaling in relief as they at last knew what was wrong.

May returned to Peter’s room where he was still deeply asleep after his meltdown, and Tony decided to make himself useful by cooking him some soup, a recipe his mother used to make when he was ill.

The kid did manage to eat about five spoonfuls of the broth before pushing the bowl in Tony’s hands away from him, turning his head the other way.

“You have to eat, kiddo.”

“No more” he cried weakly in response, hands shaking, “please.”

“Okay, we can try again later” Tony gave in.

‘Later’ turned out to be early afternoon of the next day, as Peter slept all throughout the night. It was a relief, as he didn’t have to go through any more meltdowns during that time. Overnight, his fever finally broke, and May was quick to help clean the sweat it caused, hoping to avoid any more distress for her nephew.

The doctors kept him in observation for the day, only letting him go upstairs to the living room once he had managed to eat half a bowl of soup. Their orders were that he get more rest and drink water to avoid getting dehydrated once again.

Ned and MJ visited him after school, and although Peter was quiet and would doze off from time to time mid-conversation, they stayed with him until he actually fell asleep.

May sipped on her tea in the corner of the room as she watched the two teens whisper their goodbyes to their sleeping friend. Between them, herself, and the man currently asleep on the smaller couch while holding a 3D model of an ethyl chloride molecule he was converting into a stim toy, Peter had a good support system. They would be okay.

[cyprozombiegirl]

Hi, about your post from around an hour ago about craving sexual desire from everyone

Parts of your description sounded very similar to my experience as someone who is histrionic and formerly hypersexual. For me, a lot of that was about the sexual attraction of others being a form of security for me. The mindset was subconsciously "if I can offer sex appeal, I won't be alone." It applied even to people I found unattractive and it was VERY distressing if I was not successfully seducing people. There were other hypersexual behaviors I had that were behind closed doors, but I'm not sure if they're relevant or not.

There's also the issues of misogyny and transphobia that passively influenced me to feel like me only option to be valuable to people is to be sexual. [I'm tme but I would figure that those oppressive forces would apply even more heavily to someone tma]

I don't necessarily think wanting people to be attracted to you is a bad thing. Parts of what you said resonated with me and sounded very familiar to my lines of thinking, but whether or not it's harmful is based more in whether it's compulsive, causing you distress, or harming your relationships.

[I hope none of this sounds cocky or is redundant. Best of luck with figuring all of this out <3]

Hi this is actually quite useful information. I had never heard of histrionic personality disorder (HPD) before. I’m going to continue my response below but for anyone reading this, just expect highly triggering stuff below:

I’m a CSA victim (childhood SA), by my birth mother (and maybe her best friend, my memories of it are minimal and confusing since I was like 5). But I’ve often felt before that my equation of my own survival with my sexual desirability to be because the mother figure who was feeding me and housing me and literally my mother was also sexually assaulting me. So yes I agree with your analysis that this probably has a lot to do with me equating my attractiveness with security. And I noticed in the description of the HPD on wikipedia that it tends to result from childhood trauma. Although, looking at the symptoms of it, I don’t think I fit many of them. I’m extremely precise in my language (one of the symptoms is imprecision), and I tend not to be dramatic, or show exaggerated emotions. Usually I’m described by others as level-headed and stoic to a fault.

With that said, I do think I’m attention seeking, and I relate to a lot of what you described in yourself. I too find it extremely distressing when I’m not viewed as sexually desirable or I fail at flirting. And I certainly feel the need to be attractive to people and receive sexual validation from them regardless of if I’m actually in need of sex. I’ll have to talk to my therapist about this and see what she thinks.

I also appreciate the reassurance that it isn’t necessarily a bad thing. I think it has some negative consequences, insofar as it makes me rather obsessive about being hot and distressed by the idea of not being hot, and this has led to eating disorder issues in the past (which tbh I blame on my parents being ex professional body builders), and a rigid workout regime. But I as far as I can tell it’s not harming any of my relationships and while I think it is rather compulsive, I’ve found ways (like this tumblr) of acting on those impulses in non-destructive ways.

thanks so much for reaching out and feel free to reply or slide into DMs

[pupil-of-law]

@kit-just-kit (cont.)

David wordlessly took the second plastic cup and drank, noting a sense of satisfaction at not having first been asked whether he could drink or not. In the silence that held whilst Prince was drinking too, David took note that the doctor’s resting heart rate was slightly elevated, trapezius muscles tensed, and cortisol and adrenaline levels were increased. David’s eyes could see more than human eyes could. He could observe heat and electromagnetic energy as well as visible light; calibrated readouts overlaid on the picture of the world presented to him. But it did not take an 80 Series to observe that Dr Prince was suffering from stress and fatigue. He connected the symptoms of stress to something that had happened last night. He had been aiming his basketball at the wall in the Bridge as he patrolled on his night watch, and paused when MOTHER, the ship’s onboard AI, lit up a holographic label on one of the maps of the crew quarters. ‘Attention, David. Distress signal received from Crew Suite 3. Emergency button has been pressed. Immediate response r-' and then, just as David had stooped to carefully put down the ball and respond, ‘Emergency status resolved. Distress signal deactivated. No further action required.’ For the rest of the night, everything on the ship ran as smoothly as ever. David looked at Dr Prince with a placid expression that somehow contrived to be probing. ‘You should try to relax, Doctor Prince,' he smiled. 'Everything’s just fine.' Then, from behind the lip of his teacup, surreptitiously en passant - 'Forgive me for asking, Ma’am. But are you troubled by bad dreams?’

[vickyvicarious]

(In order to not derail op's thread, and jic they've not finished reading the books, hope this is ok) The madness/mental illness discussion between Laura and Jonathan made me think about the in-between of Jonathan leaving the hospital and then being validated!

One thing is, pre-Hawkins death, Mina states to Lucy that Jonathan has been working hard, but that he is weak still and placid, and also that he has nightmares. It tells on them both, because Mina cannot get a full night's sleep due to him waking up screaming and she needs to soothe him. Journal aside, Mina says she is so worried about his nerves that she doesn't communicate with him about how tired she is herself. It reminds me of Walter wanting to protect Laura from distress.

Post-Hawkins death, Jonathan gets worse. "He says the amount of responsibility which it puts upon him makes him nervous. He begins to doubt himself. I try to cheer him up, and my belief in him helps him to have a belief in himself. But it is here that the grave shock that he experienced tells upon him the most. Oh, it is too hard that a sweet, simple, noble, strong nature such as his—a nature which enabled him by our dear, good friend’s aid to rise from clerk to master in a few years—should be so injured that the very essence of its strength is gone."

Not a very traditionally ''manful'' picture, but Mina never goes there. Still, he throws himself into work. Mina says her belief in him helps Jonathan believe in himself. Maybe Laura would have benefited from being believed in.

What prompts Walter to do something drastic is when Laura weeps in her sleep. What prompts Mina to break the seal later is when Jonathan faints in public and loses the memory of it.

The way Mina treats Lucy and Jonathan in illness seems equal. She keeps their secrets upon their request too. Walter and Mina take similar active roles for their spouses, though Mina isn't necessarily masculine for it.

An interesting imho comparison could also be when Mina chooses to consult Van Helsing while Jonathan is away for his first work trip and how they communicate throughout it, and Walter with the sisters.

Aside, when she asks Van Helsing to help Jonathan, he says, "I promise you that I will gladly do all for him that I can—all to make his life strong and manly, and your life a happy one." Van Helsing promises to make his life manly, though Mina had asked to make him "well again". So he kind of made it about gender, though it wasn't for Mina.

(I also wonder if we can call Jonathan ''cured'' really, as he doesn't actually return to his former self, but it'd get too long!)

(Tagging @animate-mush because the WIW substack has ended now, hopefully you're all caught up... but regardless no spoilers past where we were last week.)

Anon, you sum up my thoughts incredibly well: "Maybe Laura would have benefited from being believed in."

I think that is perhaps the most major difference between the recovery period for the two of them. Because while they both have remarkably similar symptoms, and both their spouses hide stuff from them for a while... when things come to a head Mina chooses to believe in Jonathan. Not just in supporting him as he goes back to work (which you're right, he has little choice about doing - an external gendered element there, where societal pressures/norms mean Jonathan kind of has to get to work and Laura is never expected to at all); Mina trusts Jonathan with information, with an important role in what follows.

There's obvious contextual differences. Jonathan knew he could access his lost memories and explicitly didn't want to unless it was necessary. He put the power to decide that in Mina's hands (and it was his request but still her choice to share in his ignorance until she needed more information). When she reads his journal, she's trying to better help him within parameters they have both agreed to. When she eventually tells him everything is true, she's trusting that this will be validating for him and help him heal, help him be more "well again" (though you're right both that he never returns to his former self, and that Van Helsing is the only one who brings gender into it with his assumption that Mina's looking to make Jonathan more manly).

Laura never had an equivalent - both in terms of a discussion with the ones leaving her out for the sake of her mental health, and in the sense of some record she knows she can fall back on. She didn't have a hidden journal when she was being drugged or in the asylum. Most of the information Walter and Marian gather is from other people.

I think there is a period where both Jonathan and Laura have information hidden from them for their own sake. And I don't think that was inherently wrong or anything; in fact I think it was somewhat needed. Jonathan got the chance to explicitly ask for that period of ignorance. We don't quite have any such dialogue from Laura, but the narration still tells us that there were certain topics that were very confusing to her or which she didn't like to linger on (and her experience with Mr. Fairlie even after getting out of the asylum can't have helped), and there's that scene where she says she will "try to get better", showing recognition of how unwell she currently is. I think they both need this time to focus on recovering, and their spouses/loved ones want to support them so they can do so. Again, the societal gender role divides them here: Jonathan has to work and in fact has to take on new/more challenging work, while Laura doesn't and can devote more time to rest and recovery. There's benefits and drawbacks to both of those, in my mind. Jonathan got support from Mina and reassurance that she (and Mr. Hawkins) believed in him, which was helpful. On the other hand, it stressed him out more and he was still suffering from his nightmares, etc. Laura got more time to take it easy without having other stress added on, which was helpful. But on the other hand, she didn't get the same level of trust and belief in her ability to, if not 'return to normal,' at least to be productive and helpful in some way.

Yeah, I'm talking about her drawings. I think that is where the big divide comes. Because when she wants to contribute and help with the household, Walter decides to lie to her and play-act that she is bringing in money. I get that he's trying to avoid letting her stress over money, but it feels so condescending. He's treating her like a child rather than being honest with her - right after she asks him not to treat her like a child. Maybe being honest would just be telling her that she's not well enough to work/that it wouldn't be safe, and that he has the money handled. Maybe they'd come up with some other way she could chip in. At least she'd be involved in the discussion as she clearly wanted to be. And while I don't think she would be involved in the hunting down different accounts or confrontations that follow at the end of the book any more than Marian was, I think they should have told her what was going on. That doesn't necessarily mean giving her all the nitty gritties especially if they're triggering to her; but giving her the chance to speak for herself, to add her thoughts, even to ask to be left out if she thinks she can't handle it. She never gets that. There's no reevaluation later on.

Both Jonathan and Laura were denied validation in a way that made them doubt their sanity. Jonathan's experiences were supernatural and he fears he lost his mind. Laura was lied to and gaslit about her own identity, outright told she was suffering from delusions. Revealing that the supernatural things he remember are real was validating for Jonathan in itself, even as he still had all the accompanying trauma. Laura's (official/public) validation isn't possible until after the villains are defeated and everything is over, which in a sense stretches out that middle period. Similarly, Jonathan getting the information leads right into him getting a change to assuage his feelings of guilt and seek revenge, which could be cathartic for him. Laura probably wouldn't have the same opportunities or even desire to do so, and so maybe looping her in wouldn't have been as helpful. But it feels cruel to me never to give her the option. After a certain point, it's no longer just trying to spare her from distress, but it feels like believing she isn't capable of handling any at all.

I guess that's what feels most gendered to me. Walter, and to an extent Marian too, don't treat Laura like an adult or an equal after her experience. This does happen throughout the book, but it gets so much more egregious after she's rescued from the asylum. Marian talks about women/is kind of treated like an exception to women in general, and Walter is leaving both women out in key moments. So given how women were typically seen as less capable, to me it feels somewhat bound up in that rather than just being about her specifically (I think she handles/is capable of a lot more than she's given credit for). Mina doesn't do really that, she doesn't really bring gender into her treatment of either Jonathan or Lucy in the same way. And while others in Dracula do, it's shown to be more of a mistake.

[acorpsecalledcorva]

Thanks to the amount of systems cringe stuff spamming this tag I finally gave in and had a look at what they're saying, great decision on my part, happy for myself and so grateful for the inspiration lmao.

Honestly fuck all the fake claiming stuff, that's old hat, I wanna talk about the reverse conspiracy theory stuff they got going on. Namely their new automod response to anyone that mentions RAMCOA. So uhhh trigger warnings for discussion on that.

That link for an "archive database"? It points to the Grey Faction website, the Satanic Temples replacement for the False Memory Foundation. It's kinda sad honestly, sparsely populated with old news about Colin Ross' eye lasers and 80s satanic panic stuff to completely discredit the ISSTD as the organisation stands today. They completely deny the concept of repressed memories and don't believe in DID at all, even if they try to hide it with carefully chosen language

Does this kinda stuff happen? Absolutely. But the issue is, unsurprisingly, nuanced and complicated.

The Body Keeps the Score has a great section on this. In one chapter the author recounts a patients sudden recollection of abuse memories after seeing their abuser having been arrested on television. The patient had spent their entire life having no recollection of these events, only for them suddenly to reappear in crystal clear and full sensory detail. It does sound kinda unbelievable, I mean we know how dubious and unreliable memory can be, how can these memories be preserved so perfectly outside of conscious awareness? Well the chapter goes on to explore accounts of traumatic memory around Shell Shock. As it turns out, veterans that didn't get Shell Shock often had very personalised accounts of the war, they would even romanticise their experiences spun as a narrative of personal valour and heroism. Shell Shock patients on the other hand had much more accurate and factual recollections that all corroborated with each other, it would be as if they were back there experiencing it as it was, as opposed to looking back on it from the present.

This is because of how memory is processed. A healthy processed memory is becomes part of your own personal narrative, how you feel about it, the lessons you learned from it, and how it relates to the rest of your life. A traumatic memory doesn't do this, because it is deemed as incompatible with personal narrative, impossible to feel anything about, and threatens the integrity of the rest of the psyche, it sits outside. Like lost luggage at an airport never opened and never claimed.

This isn't necessarily the case for traumatic memory in DID though, at least in a good number of cases what's preserved is the emotional memory, feelings of helplessness or betrayal, body sensations of things happening, but the details, the auto biographical recollection of events can be lost.

In fact, this is one of the key ways the false memory foundation claims have been debunked. You can install the memory of being lost in the mall to someone, but what you can't do is give someone PTSD symptoms around a false memory, those emotional and physical intrusions can't be implanted.

This is to say that the trauma is always real, it deserves attention and validation and treatment, but we do have to be careful about what we do with the content of traumatic memories. And you know what? This is 100% in line with ISSTD guidance for the therapy of patients with a Dissociative Disorder. Therapists are advised not to take disclosures of recounted traumatic memories too literally, not least of all because different alters might have different accounts of events. It can cause a lot of internal conflict and distress to believe one alter over the other and they can't all be right. So what you do is something called Processing. Here's a great video on that from the CTAD clinic

This all relates to the derealisation aspect is DID, and in fact, many have called it a disorder of multiple realities rather than multiple personalities. I guess it depends on which way you wanna look at it from the DPDR continuum. Because of the extreme compartmentalisation of action systems, traumatic memory can be chopped up and distributed among different parts. Some get the emotional memory, some get the physical memory, some transform the content of the memory into something that fits the personal narrative of their created identity. For instance am alter that believes they are a victim of witch trials may have memories of a mob with pitchforks and torches, or a wolf alter might have memories of being surrounded and trapped by hunters in someone who has trauma around severe playground bullying. The emotional experience is retained, but the biographical details are changed into something the brain hopes can be processed, even if it fails in doing so.

Where this gets very messy, is that you can take a compartmentalised emotional or physical intrusive memory, devoid of content, and be suggestible to details that might fill the blanks. This is largely what happened during the satanic panic. Imagining a potential form of abuse, while triggered, can attach those imagined details to the emotional memory. Heck, multiple alters can each attach their own individual narrative of details to the same emotional Intrusion.

And this is a very serious problem I've seen in the community. So many times someone will ask questions about a relatively normal DID experience, and someone will chime in with "well in my case it's the result of programming". This is such a fucking irresponsible and dangerous thing to do. We cannot suggest possible forms of abuse to scared and confused systems that are in the wake of being triggered. This can go SO badly. Many of us suffer from psychosis, paranoia can quickly turn into a full blown delusion, especially when we're talking about organisations of child trafficking and mind control.

Cults exist.

Trafficking organisations exist.

Abusive religious organisations exist.

There's no denial that this happens, but we absolutely cannot just go around suggesting that this might have happened to someone who hasn't yet processed their trauma.

This isn't about disbelieving people, or telling people they are wrong about their trauma, but directing towards what matters, stabilisation from destabilising thoughts during a terrifying and confusing time, grounding, and finding a safe space through which to process the painful emotions so that they no longer intrude on daily life.

Back to Systems Cringe and the Grey Faction, there's something to be said about how faith in institutions can completely broken when we forget, and are reminded, that they aren't some flawless entity but are made up of flawed people that make mistakes

But I think this comment sums up everything I would want to say on that

[ask-a-radfem]

How does radical feminism explain dysphoria? I agree with the basis of 'if the only reason you think you're trans stems from being treated badly as a girl, feeling unsafe and thinking it'd be easier to be a guy' etc, that's probably not a gender thing, that's just being aware of unequality. But what about stuff like dysphoria that is separate from that? I also have never really met anyone who cited those reasons for figuring out they were trans, I feel like I only see it from rad fem blogs talking about it.

This answer is going to be a bit of a mixed bag, clip compilation of videos and reading, because your question sparked like five different responses and reactions in my head haha. (Great question anon.)

So, different types of diagnoses are different, you can have a disease (caused by a single biological thing, like cancer which is caused by uncontrolled cell growth, or AIDS which is caused by a virus) or you can have a disorder which is characterised by a list of symptoms.

Here is the diagnostic criteria for gender dysphoria in children :

I would have met 4-5 of those as a kid. If i had hated my sexed body, i could have qualified for a dysphoria diagnosis. So that's one criticism of the diagnostic criteria, it leaves open the possibility that quite standard gender nonconformity combined with distress over puberty is diagnosed as dysphoria. So is dysphoria completely separate from sexism or being treated worse as a girl? By the criteria themselves, not really.

Here's a video with more discussion about the criteria:

We don't know what causes dysphoria, or if it is one thing. We don't know if distressed teenager who meets these criteria is going through the same thing as a little boy being coached to understand his gender nonconformity as being in the wrong body, like the child described in this clip (the woman speaking is Johanna Olson-Kennedy, who is Medical Director of the Center for Trans Youth Health and Development at Children’s Hospital Los Angeles):

Feminist analysis about dysphoria is relatively new, but some women connect it to feminist discussion about anorexia, the plastic surgery industry and anti-psychiatry. You can start out with this article by Victoria Smith and the books she mentions (may be paywalled, archive link here):

Here is an interesting video by a detrans woman about girls growing up in toxic online communities:

Also no compilation like this would be complete without mentioning the book Detransition: Beyond Before and After by Max Robinson. It may be hard to get a physical copy but there is an audiobook or ebook option too.

[rayssyscourse]

I'd like to clarify, when I say I am anti-endo, that doesn't mean I hate every endo system, etc. My issue lies not necessarily in the existence of non-traumagenic plurality, but the way it is presented.

The OSDDID community has the unique, and often extremely difficult, experience of having the brain forcefully cut itself off from itself (forgive the strange wording, lol) due to severe stress/trauma, and we live with heavy dissociation, amnesia, and many other trauma responses. It is a very difficult disorder to live with. That's not to say that endos never struggle with their plurality, but they do not have the experience of struggling with this disorder. OSDDID spaces and communities were created to support people with the disorder, to give them a place to talk about the rather unique struggles of having it, to share resources to help manage it, to bond and help each other with it.

Endogenic systems have come into our communities claiming to be the same as us, and that they should have a place in these spaces, despite not sharing the fundamental issues that the spaces were created to address/help with. Because of this, it has become increasingly hard--sometimes impossible--to find spaces where we as a traumagenic system can talk about these experiences solely to people who understand and can relate. These days, in most spaces traumagenic systems cannot talk in too much detail about the disorder and its (often scary or upsetting) symptoms, because the science and experiences aren't 'inclusive' of endos.

And yes, these spaces still exist. But they have become much fewer and farther apart, and are more and more likely to be put under fire and called exclusionary for restricting to just OSDDID systems. It has become absurdly difficult to find a space where we can talk about our disorder without censoring ourselves, and when those spaces do exist, there is a constant worry of being harassed for being exclusive just for talking about our struggles.

I would also like to add that I've heard every form of "not me though" when talking about this. If you are endogenic and you do not go into OSDDID spaces, this is not about you. I take issue with the community as a whole, because I feel it has become a general community-wide problem, but as I said in the beginning of this (stupidly long) post, I do not hate, or even really take much issue with, many individual endos.

I will say that the word endogenic has gained a connotation of being one of those who invade/impede on OSDDID spaces. So, I will take slight issue with people who align themselves with that terminology, because it implies that one agrees with, or is at least tolerant of, the actions generally associated with the word/the community it describes. The separation of systems into "traumagenic" and "endogenic" also implies that they are the same fundamental thing, just with slight differences in origin. However, I completely understand that a label does not define anybody's beliefs entirely, so that's not really a main problem in my eyes.

In my ideal version of this, endos would have their own community, defined as separate from the OSDDID spaces. I believe that the terminology should be more distinctly separated from that of OSDDID systems. There needs to be the understanding that endo and traumagenic systems, while sharing some similarities, are on a fundamental level different experiences. OSDDID systems should not have to be associated with the idea that they could/may have been formed without trauma or without the distress that the disorder causes, and likewise endos should not be associated with those aforementioned struggles.

I am not saying I think we need to completely divide ourselves or cut each other out. I see no problem with different types of plurals interacting with shared spaces or relating to/with each other. But the situation as it is right now causes harm to many traumagenic systems as it muddles the definition of who we are and puts less weight on the struggles we face, and takes away spaces that many of us take great comfort in. So, when I say I am anti-endo, I am saying not that I take issue with the concert of the existence of non-traumagenic plurals, but with the current community's idea that they are equatable.

I personally do not see how non-traumagenic plurality could work, because there is no science to it the way that there is for OSDDID. HOWEVER, research on plurality is still in its infancy, so that opinion is subject to change as more research is done. Most importantly, whether scientifically proven or not, I will not tell anybody that they are not experiencing plurality, endo or not, because I don't get to tell people about their own experiences. I will respect endos as long as they respect me, but right now, the situation is such that I feel the endo community as a general group is disrespecting us, so while I can respect individuals, I cannot fully respect the community as a whole.

Sorry for how long this got, lol. Thanks to anyone who actually read it all. Have a lovely day, everyone :)

[protectingtulpas]

Idk how anti endos want us to consider ourselves traumagenic if we don’t have all symptoms necessary to be diagnosed with DID OSDD, but only a headmate that’s in my headspace without my desire. Like at least we’re not saying that we have a disorder that we don’t have. I don’t have dissociation, I remember my trauma, my system doesn’t split. However my head companion has different tastes and behaviors than me. Lying that I have did is much disrespectful 💚

FOR REAALL, they just wanna fit us into a box tbh. Endogenic, traumagenic, disordered, and nondisorderd are all DIFFERENT THINGS. Tons of endos say over and over they don't have OSDDID and does anybody listen? Of course not. Not all traumagenic systems are disordered either but they don't fuckin care. People clarify that plurality =/= OSDDID all the fucking time to antiendos, so at this point it's just plain ol willful ignorance. If you don't have the symptoms of a fucking disorder you can't get diagnosed for it, it's that simple. Nobody that isn't a dog of the medical industry is gonna slap a disorder label on someone that doesn't experience jack shit of distress or dysfunction. Also on the "secret trauma" or "if you have trauma you're traumagenic" bullshit - it's like, way to fuckin invalidate peoples' experiences and sense of agency about their own mind and trauma, right??? How fucking condescending you must be to claim you know better than the traumatized person that lived their experiences. Digging for trauma isn't healthy and neither is attributing all things outta the "ordinary" to a trauma response. That's a one way ticket to paranoia town!

Let's not forget the disordered systems that're/were endogenic and then became disordered cuz of trauma after the system's creation, too. Everyone deserves help and support. If somebody exhibits all the necessary symptoms to be diagnosed with OSDDID, then they should get the fucking help they need and not be gatekept by wherever that disorder mighta hypothetically came from