#i tried to make alyn look like corlys

[raidark]

Look, i'm not saying that Jacaerys' insecurities are not interesting or that he has legitimate worries (which will be proven right if they stick to the book... though i'm unsure on whether they will blame his behavior with Them for the betrayal).

But i'm still angry at everything they did to him. Especially since Book Jacaerys is my favorite character of Fire and Blood, of the whole Dance.

It makes me furious how many people are saying we the angry Jace stans have 0 media literacy and asking if we rather have Jace still doing nothing as he did for the whole season.

THAT is exactly the problem. That he didn't do anything in the show while in the book he did SO MUCH.

"And now you say you will strip that from me too" could be perfectly something Jacaerys says to the writers of this mess.

They sidelined all of his alliances achievements with the Vale, the Three Sisters, White Harbor and the North (the lack of Pact of Ice and Fire hurts the most). All the time that could have been spent to develop his character had they wanted and show his potential. Instead we only got a little show only scene with the Freys that barely proved anything about him.

I loved Baela's scene with Corlys, but it was Jace who mediated between Rhaenyra and him in the book, it was by his order that he was made Hand of the Queen.

It was also him who had the Dragonseeds idea... and before you say that he was also the one with the idea in the series, take into mind that in the book he called for the Dragonseeds (Valyrian ascent bastards) from the very beginning. The whole thing with nobles only is only in the show. Book Jacaerys didn't have any prejudice or apparent problem with bastards at this point of the story. It's obvious that he had already accepted this fact and it's in fact because he knows his origins that he gave Dragonseeds a chance and his faith. He leaded them for the love of god.

Yes, it's true that due to the nature of the book we don't know exactly what was he thinking. But it's the complete opposite reaction to his show version. Whether Book Jace understood or not the danger this plan posed on long-term, he did so just like Rhaenyra did, because they had no chance at the moment. Not to mention that while in the series all the candidates come from Kings Landing (?¿?), in the book they're taken from Driftmark and Dragonstone (which is populated, not only a castle for Targaryen), so there's a bit more of trust on them as subjects than on completely unknown people from the city taken and ruled by your enemy. (It also weren't so many who tried in the book)

I've seen some people say that Jace was besties with Addam and Nettles... and while we actually don't know their relationship, we do know that they mourned him badly while Ulf and Hugh weren't that affected. I really don't think they would be that affected if they didn't have some kind of bond before, even if it wasn't told to us. And I mean, it was Jace who supported legitimizing Addam and Alyn and make Addam heir to Driftmark ahead of Joffrey. Which, well, doesn't seem likely in the show.

The thing is that Jace DID a lot of things in the book, supporting his mother, basically leading the Blacks on the name of Rhaenyra Targaryen, who couldn't do it since she was RIGHTFULLY grieving during a lot of time after everything that had happened in quick succession, both Luke and Visenya's deaths.

And you know, THAT'S NOT BAD. It gave time to have other characters doing things like Rhaenyra's sons. It explored a side of Rhaenyra and how much her children's death affected her, explicitly showing how much they mattered to her and how brutally it broke her inside (while filling her with pure unadulterated rage after the Gullet). But well, playing devil's advocate, I understand a bit why they didn't go with this since I don't have any faith most watchers would try to emphatize with the grieving mother part of Rhaenyra, and would instead call her a weak queen.

Jace was a supporting and loving son, an extension of Rhaenyra, heart of the Blacks, responsible for the alliances that would bring them to victory by the end of the war. A boy who came to understand and accept his status in the world and used it on a positive note for her mother's cause. A worthy heir to Rhaenyra, one of the few people in this whole period that was worthy of becoming King in the future.

This wasn't about wanting him to do nothing in the show. It was about not butchering his character and be faithful to all the stuff he actually does. But because the writers couldn't (or didn't want to) understand it wasn't Rhaenyra's turn in the characters front lines right now (it would have come later), instead they had to underline him and strip him of everything he did and give it to other characters, while giving him traits and opinions that has made a lot of people despise him.

His fate was meant to be a tragedy that made an apparent victory for the Blacks as hollow and catastrophic as a defeat. And now there's almost no more time and Jace will be remembered by show onlys just for his self-hating identity crisis (which he could have had in the book as well, or before in the show, but not anymore at this point) and his bordering hypocritical classism. Not for everything he actually did and the traits you could imagine of him from what is said in the book.

But hey, apparently a certain part of the fandom thinks that's the only thing that makes a character, a human, complex and interesting.

I don't hate show Rhaenyra. I don't hate show Jacaerys. I will always support Rhaenyra's claim. But I can't just stand after so many decisions that go against them. Especially in the case of Jace who is already receiving such amount of vitriol hate while receiving love just from being victimiced and poor sad boy.

Ah. My boy needs his own sub-team inside Rhaenyra's supporters at this point -- not putting him against Rhaenyra or anyone else. But. Seeing Rhaenyra's stans wishing for his death...

I don't hate the characters. I hate the writers. I hate the changed dynamics, the change in characters' ages, the erasure of Nettles, how Jace was striped from everything his characte is, the stupid decisions....

[laenaism]

Something that really bothered me about Corlys and Baela’s scene was the fact that Corlys ‘wanted’ to make Baela heir in the first place. Corlys has made it clear he does not value women, in the book and in the show. He was angry Rhaenys was passed over because he himself was also snubbed from that position of power. Corlys has shown no care for either of his children, he married both Laenor and Laena off with no care for their safety (you cannot tell me he didn’t have some hand in Laena marrying Daemon, at least in the show). All he truly cared about was his ambition which unfortunately is something that can be said for a lot of men in this universe. He loved Rhaenys, but Corlys definitely valued himself and his needs over everyone else in his life, all that matter was what he wanted. He only told Baela that he wanted to make her heir because that’s what Rhaenys asked of him the night of Laena’s funeral. And you know what happened? Corlys had the audacity to get mad at her for that! He felt guilty, so he decided he would honor Rhaenys and offer Baela the role of being heir. He didn’t actually want her to be so, he didn’t do it as an acknowledgement of her strength or leadership, he did it to honor Rhaenys because she died. He may not outright say it but he values men in a position of power way more than he ever would a woman. If Baela were to have accepted (which I believe she should have considering she has a better claim than Addam or Alyn) no doubt Corlys would have tried to worm his way out of it down the line. He was not a good grandfather to his granddaughters, he didn’t even know them, look at the way he spoke of Rhaena! She was Laena’s daughter and you don’t think she knew about ships or dragons? Okay deadbeat… I think Baela turning it down made sense, but I hate the reasoning she gave “I am made of blood and fire, Driftmark must pass to salt and sea,” like she is also made of ‘salt and sea’ 🥴 granted, she’s only a quarter Velaryon, but her mother was literally the only true parent she had before she died, why would she not care about carrying on that legacy? It doesn’t make sense considering Baela is all about family and loyalty. This isn’t hate on her, I love her, but I have to be honest, that line made me cringe lmao. That’s not Baela’s fault though, that’s Ryan Condal and Sara Hess’, fvck those writers! Regardless, Corlys should have offered it to Rhaena first in my opinion, she was going to be Lady of Driftmark with Lucerys, why shouldn’t she still be? Baela was going to be queen, the Lady of Driftmark would have been perfect for Rhaena if Corlys was just going to skip over Joffrey.

(Just a PSA) I’m not denying Baela and Rhaena are Targaryen, I know they are, but there’s no harm in acknowledging their Velaryon side as well. I’ve seen way too many people act like being a Velaryon is an insult and it’s very sus. As long as people aren’t being fvcking racist about it, I love when their mother’s Velaryon side is appreciated (though Laena was Targaryen as well which a lot of people somehow seem to forget considering the fact that Laena was prideful in being a Targaryen). The only reason I’d ever acknowledge them as Velaryon’s is because their mother was their main parental figure before Rhaenys, it was never about their skin color. The people who call them Velaryon’s because of their skin color, that’s when it’s racist and stupid, and unfortunately those people do exist.

[tweedfrog]

I am very curious to hear your thoughts on Rhaenys and Corlys, because I don't think we ever discussed them much. Also hope you feel better soon <3

Thank you!!!

Rhaenys - for book Rhaenys tbh there isn't a lot to hate because once again like a lot of Fire and Blood characters she's more the outline of a character than an actual person. For show Rhaenys I HATE the little moment she had with Alyn down at the docks. You heard my rant about how stupid it was to even plant the seeds of nominating Alyn to a higher office in the head of Corlys the grand-daughter hater who apparently would rather cut off his own leg than ever consider Rhaena for Lady of Driftmark but here's another angle: it makes corlys look even worse than he was in the books.

Like ok book Corlys was an unfaithful creep but he did provide for his illegitimate children. Apparently show Corlys is such a deadbeat his WIFE is promoting his illegitimate children's interests more than he is. Why?

For book corlys - i could say I hate the creeping on 16 yr old Rhaenys when he's like middle aged but that's probably a complaint everyone has so I think I'll say that it annoys me that he never tried to claim a dragon. He's a very ambitious person and craves power. And clearly he passes down enough valyrian blood to his kids for them to attempt claiming a dragon so why didn't he just cut out the middle man? Was it that he felt too old? Was he secretly scared of dragons? Idk couldve been something interesting to explore.

For show corlys I hate the fact that he's just inexplicably supporting rhaenyra because??? Vibes????? Bro your 2 kids are dead and you still think Rhaenyra had a hand in your sons death. Why are you stanning her so hard? Maybe it's going to turn around if Rhaenyra threatens Addams life but as the show is clearly diverging in path from the books idk if that will happen. Also why would Corlys finally snap over the threat of death for the illegitimate kid he never spent any time with vs the actual deaths of laena and laenor who he helped raise?

[horizon-verizon]

I think people misunderstand medieval understanding of "bastard" as the modern understanding of "the" medieval understanding of "bastard". Which is this solid, unchanging, oversimplistic definition or condition of "not born into wedlock" and that's it. As if people had the power to even make it stick to that even in real life European politics.

Yeah, some wanted such a hard definition for their own interests and there were....but real life doesn't conform to human desires very well.

Bastardry is not a biological state. It is a legal identity that people have had many different conditions that changes throughout human history. How do these pre-modern people confirm or witness that the child is the claimed father's? Humans cannot magically understand a child is a man's just by looking at them, our eyes are not microscopes capable of seeing the DNA, much less are we able to--even if our eyes were--of understanding which genes show parentage for comparison. Thereby we always had external tools and practices and social mechanisms to confirm parentage and we always will need such if that is our objective. Like the relationships of the parents to other agents, timing, place, degree of time spent b/t the parents, looks, even the status of the parents and possible candidates of fathers themselves (William the Conqueror)!

The very institution of marriage making so that the medieval/Westerosi wife historically cannot have public lovers or even travel far from her castle like her husband can bc she is not the head of said household and all her "work"--or a huge valued part of it--is in the castle.

"A bastard is a person born out of wedlock! It doesn't matter if a father claims them!"

While yes people try and have tried to use "proven parentage" to define bastard as such, often they are forced to rely on other elements to prove such parentage or to confirm it and make it matter politically, legally--there IS a "becoming" process to bastardry because it is solely dependent of previous sociopolitical conditions such as gender inequality and resource handling in the instituion of Westerosi feudal/general marriage prior to that child's existence.

Like someone on TikTok said, "You can't 'pardon' someone who hasn't been convicted of a crime!" which is an excellent way to quickly describe Rhaenyra's kids' situation: at no point were they ever legally or politically known as "bastards", therefore Viserys (the monarch) had no need to "legitimize" them as Aegon IV did for Daemon Blackfyre and all his other bastards who everyone witnessed born to different mothers than Naerys. Or when Rhaenyra legitimized Corlys' supposed grandsons/sons Alyn and Addam of Hull-turned-Velaryon.

Since often people who argue the bastard thing and use show!Laenor's looks to make a "REALISM" point, I have to point out that REALISTICALLY, HotDLaenor, who is "biracial" and could have looked all manner of ways: could have had all manner and variety of hair textures, skin tones, features, etc. bc of that phenotypical heritage. Laenor could gone even lighter, with much looser curls, than any of his actors. Laena, too. And still, with the actors that we do have, what i will say below would still be true.

If such, by marrying a "white" woman like show!Rhaenyra and impregnating her, their kids can and usually would look very pale or have curlier hair, etc. Yes, ALL of them. Adding to this, Baratheons are knwon to be dark haired even if Rhaenys in the show is not. Which is why HotD insisting on their looks being a dead giveaway and then making Laenor unable to impregnate Rhaenyra being DEFINITE proof is weird and UNREALISTIC. Again, I'm saying that to make as if the looks are a dead ringer is too black-and-white if you want to be "realistic" about it.

Now, I argue myself that bk!Rhaenyra's kids are likely not Laenor's, BUT it doesn't matter to me nor even for the Targs' politics (if Alicent and Otto had not been there, and I say these two and not random/any noble bc yes you very much had real nobles of real life keep such "secrets", look it up or go read) because those kids were never "witnessed" as "bastards". REALISTICALLY, not every lord's son/child is his. It's statistically impossible AND the very socio-political conditions of Westerosi feudal marriage and the inequality of it rather guarantees it--women are human, they will search out comfort even if they come across dangers in it just as Robb with Jeyne Westerling or Cersei x Jaime getting it on.

[darklinaforever]

"she is a character who serves no purpose other than feeding yet another Mushroom's sexual fantasy"

Of course - everything that Mushroom says about the greens is true, and about the blacks is false lol.

When did I talk about Mushroom's comments about the Greens ?

For information, there are quite simply rare things (but in general, Mushroom's comments are bullshit) that Mushroom says that make sense and others that don't, regardless of side.

When he says Corlys is Alyn and Adam's father, it makes sense. When he talks about the case of Aegon II with the 11 / 12 year old girl it makes sense too, especially because Eustache, pro greens, never denying the event or the age of the girl, he just tries to make everything this less serious mess.

Either way, it's common sense to think that Sara Snow doesn't exist.

She literally has no other mention anywhere as a character in the GRRM texts.

And I ask you, what is the crucial role of Sara Snow ? Beyond adding more sexual things to be told by Mushroom ?

And then it's still cheeky to tell me something stupid like I'm validating everything Mushroom would say about the Greens and not the Blacks when I've already proven the opposite several times.

And in any case, in general, when I look at your team, not only do you tend to believe the worst things about Blacks but also to invent them !

Just like you tend not to believe the bad things done by the Greens by trying to make believe that the text is in favor of Blacks and that all these bad things against your favorites are just nasty pro-Targaryen and anti-Greens propaganda, which is bullshit, and without forgetting all your Headcanons to soften the Greens of course !

So don't try to lecture me and instead go sweep in front of your team's door before.

[alleyskywalker]

I finally got to writing down my thoughts/feelings/notes/reactions on S2E1 of HOTD. Under cut because spoilers.

Thie episode – but really just this show – had pacing issues, which was one of its biggest problems, very reminiscent of what entirely killed of the seeds of good or at least decent plot points in GoT S8. IDK what genius decided to cut the number of eps to 8 – or why, given that this show is very popular – but then they had this issue somewhat last season too. We are also starting to see how recklessly cutting characters comes back to bite you in the ass, at it’s just the start here.

With the episode/season paced as it is, there was no time to spend on Jace’s diplomatic endeavors. Were they strictly necessary? No, I guess, but they could have been…interesting? And helped him grow/develop/showcase to the audience as a character. Like, I actually want Jace to be a character this season, yk?

So given that, as much as I am sad that they cut my girl Sara Snow, I can’t be too mad about it because they just kinda…cut all of it for the most part.

The North intro was kinda funny tho. For a second I was so confused because I was like “is the KIT narrating this?” Cregan is very Northy-North lol. Is that sword Ice? “You, at least, have the mercy not to threaten me with your dragon.” – lol, I’m glad Cregan got this little snipe in at Jace for his Targ revisionism. Like, yea, sure “treated” aha. Also, I liked the little Decimation reference, complete with the white/black stones.

The Daemon and Rhaenys scene was good. I like that she takes no shit from his ass. Also liked her little monologue about how hearing of Laena’s death made her go into denial and she couldn’t start grieving until she actually saw her body. It feels very realistic.

This is not what I ever envisioned Alyn to look like lmao. He feels kinda too old? But on the other hand, I guess it maybe makes sense if he’s meant to be Corly’s son. Another question though: why are we getting introduced to him and not Addam first, given who the dragonrider will be? Are they…for some reason…merging the two brothers but keeping Alyn of the two???

AEGON this ep/season! Wow, this show is truly bipolar. First, they character assassinate him in S1 and now he’s so…idk, likeable isn’t really the word. But, compounded by TGC’s charm, he really, really has the potential to be a kind of sympathetic or at least fascinating character here. Excited to see this develop.

Loved seeing him as a father. Really, we needed more interaction between Aegon, Heleana and the twins, but you know. Pacing issues. The council scene with  Jaehaerys was adorable – that Aegon cares to bring his son into council, even if he’s a bit young for it now, but you can really see him trying to be the father he never got to have in Viserys. And you can see how much he adores this kid.

Really, Aegon, for all his impatience and lack of true competence is so clearly trying. He’s impatient to go to war, but brashness of youth of course, plus it’s not like Aemond is not chomping at the bit as well. But Aegon can be restrained (for now) and does listen to his councilors. You can say that’s a sign of his weak will, and yea in part it probably is, but it’s not a terrible trait really? For a young, inexperienced king to listen to more seasoned counsel.

AND THE PETITIONS SCENE. He genuinely wants to be a good king to the smallfolk, acknowledges them as a necessary backbone. No, he has no idea what he’s doing, but really who’s fault was that? (Looking at you, Vizzy.) It was a great bit of comic relief, especially with TGC’s acting, but also just a great portrayal of what an idealistic but really inexperienced, naïve, and not naturally-suited young king might be like. “He came all this way.” Awww. He tried lol.

Aegon and his buddies! I love seeing him have friends. Will be interested if they play any more significant roles (like during the war) than just background chatter. The banter was cute. Very dumbass teenage boys vibes.

Dalton Greyjoy mention!

Fuck Larys. That’s all I’m gonna say on that.

Aegon and Helaena’s conversation njglgjls. He really has not way how to communicate with her and she doesn’t really know how to convey her thoughts/feelings in general. But of course she’s afraid, poor girl :( But as estranged/kinda awkward their relationship is it doesn’t seem…terrible, yk?

The Alicent and Otta scene was nice. It felt like they found some understanding and a way to work together. But I do get the sense that yea, Otto is not completely satisfied with it (maybe Alicent’s definition of “victory” seemed lacking to him, which he’s not…entirely wrong there).

Luke’s funeral montage was very touching – the music was gorgeous. (I can only hope they allow Jae the same respect next ep…) Speaking of that montage, ahhhh Alicent in the sept praying for the dead… The fact this girl prays for Vizzy ffs. And also Luke. She recognizes that he was just a teenager and even though it pains her, she affords him his respect. As Criston says, “she has a gentle heart.”

Criston and Aemond’s conversation was so great on several levels!

First, of course, Aemond and his father-that-stepped-up making battle plans was great! They really do just have such a great camaraderie and dynamic of trust. Aemond believes in Criston’s excellence; they trust each other with secretive plans and vulnerable conversation. Loved the bit of Criston putting his hand on Aemond’s shoulder briefly before leaving the room.

The “that makes her a fool” line actually comes across better in context than it did in the tailer. (Although, still, who calls their mother by her name??) For one, Aemond’s frustration is understandable, he feels misunderstood and unfairly so (given that Alicent and the small council did start this whole thing, as he points out) but also he’s probably hurt, given his history with Luke. Remember how he had wanted to make a present of Luke’s eye to Alicent? He thought she was on the same page with him on this and she’s…not. Second, Aemond actually doesn’t realize this is what might be going on with Alicent – he seems kind of surprised after Criston’s explanation, the way that line is delivered. He’s having his realization out loud but he’s also not had time to digest it yet.

Ok SO I am in no way one of those weirdos who thinks that Alicent and Criston’s relationship is all about Rhaenyra (lol). BUT she is a point of common trauma for them. What Criston describes – Rhaenyra being a “cunning spider” and having an emotional influence over Alicent and Alicent capitulating to her because of her “gentle heart” is, yes, a description of Alicent, but it’s also a description of his own relationship with Rhaenyra, at least how it had felt from his POV. He understands Alicent’s feelings here so well and can empathize with her and defend her to Aemond because he loves her, yes, but also because he’s been there too.

OK, now ALICOLE.

I mean…Am I glad it’s canon? Well, yea, I’ve been shipping it super hard. Do they deserve to have consensual sex that brings them joy? Yes! Do I think it’s “hypocrisy”? Nope, lol, not matter now much TB screech that it is, it just isn’t. I’m pretty sure I’ve rebloged posts explaining why not.

That all said…man did they not handle this well, or at least certainly not in the best, most compelling way they could have. Now, I understand that my love for asexual/courtly love romance is not something most people share, so this relationship was going get physical if it was to be canon at all. Also, this show isn’t really the right genre for a drawn out slow burn romance, necessarily. But. It IS quite a big leap to suddenly go from “implied” and “romantic tension” to…fucking on a regular basis, just because Vizzy has finally kicked the bucket. Especially with these two characters.

Now, Alicent, I can get. She’s a widow, her marital vows no longer bind her. She has also completed her duty as a wife, mother and queen (re: providing heirs). Social interest in her private life is as low as it could ever be for a woman in that society. (So, not low enough really lol but historically, widows had a lot of freedom, compared to unmarried girls and wives.) But Criston? How does this work for him? His vows are still in place and he had been so heartbroken about having broken them the first time. I mean, yes, this is a very different situation and relationship. He’s older, he’s already broken those vows once so it’s like…how much he got to lose there? He can’t go back ever to NOT being an oathbreaker. But I really would have wanted to see some more set up. We should have seen them fight their irresistible pull toward each other, until they finally broke.

I did love her putting the cloak back on him afterward. A nice little anti-parallel to how he takes it off during the sex scene with Rhaenyra.

There really, really was no need to have Helaena walk in on them having sex after B&C. There had to be better ways to establish that this was a regular thing for them now and that the whole “we can’t do this again” is just Alicent/them being in denial. A way that didn’t take away from a moment that is/was supposed to be so horrific and impactful.

I do love the contrast of Alicent and Viserys always doing it missionary style and now with Criston she’s on top!

Blood & Cheese. Oh god. I have spent the last few days so angry about this. I’ve rebloged do many posts about this that I’m not sure I want to spend to much time on it. It’s just depressing at this point. But I will say a couple of things:

Helaena’s reaction does make sense to me. I’ve seen a lot of people, including TG people, saying that it was bad, and she should have been more frantic. But, frankly, she did seem pretty panicked and frantic to me. It’s just this Helaena does not emote/externalize much. At some point it seems like she almost dissociates from the situation. It’s understandable that she picks up her daughter and runs – she can’t save her son but while the assassins are distracted, of course she takes the chance to try to save her daughter. Even the necklace thing kind of makes sense. In the books, she asks them to kill her in part because she can’t stand to make the awful choice between her two boys – she’s rather die than choose. But here she hears them talk about her being a son; when they reject her necklace they also repeat how “that’s not a son.” Only a son will do, so offering her life is pointless, but trying to outbid the person who hired them might not be.

 The people (TB, lbr) shrieking about how this was Alicent and Criston’s fault are just willfully dense. If Alicent wasn’t having sex, she might have been sleeping or reading in her room or preying. There is literally nothing that implies that she would have been with Helaena if she wasn’t having sex, ffs. Also, Criston is not the only fucking kingsguard or guard. Wtf were there like no other guards idk. That’s just a plot hole/devise that looks ridiculous. But nonetheless, he 1) isn’t on duty 24/7, that’s unrealistic, and 2) is Alicent’s sworn shield, so he wouldn’t have been guarding Helaena or the kids anyway.

This is where we see that cutting Maelor was a BAD IDEA. It’s going to potentially create even more problems down the line. Who would have thought that cutting characters left and right might be an issue? /s It really diminishes the horror of Helaen’s situation and sets up this kind of unrealistic replacement choice which makes no sense because like…why would they even need her to tell them which one is the boy? It’s not that hard to feel the kids up and see which one has the right genitals, yk? I’ve seen people try to do some interesting analysis for how this scene is Thematically Relevant but nah. That’s just cope the way I used to cope with things in GoT that went wrong in the last seasons by doing metal gymnastics to try to spin them in a more palatable way for me.

But even if they fucked up on the foresight and found themselves with a situation where they needed to play this without Maelor…They could have still tried harder. For example: framing it less from the assassins’ POV and more from Helena’s, having the scene be longer, maybe in these circumstances have her try to offer her life/emote more like in the book, have Alicent actually be present too, have the rape threat against Jaehaera, have Daemon actually order Jae’s murder or at fucking least have him say “a son for a son” on screen because you KNOW the rabid part of this fanbase will act willfully blind and dumb to pretend he’s not at fault. I really think it’s that last one that makes me the most angry in the end, as the murder of a toddler is awful and horrific even without the Sophie’s choice.

And to piggy-back off that last, it’s the diminishing of the horror for TG and the whitewashing of TB as much as possible that gets to me the most, I think. They made this horrific, impactful event almost a par for the course (for the GoT/ASOIAF universe) sort of thing and with as little responsibility and plausible deniability given to TB as they could. The blatant bias (that they then have the audacity to pretend isn’t there) is infuriating.

In conclusion: there were plenty of nice things, but the disappointments really overshadowed them.

[gwenllian-in-the-abbey]

in fire and blood book, it was written that aegon III had thrust one of jahaera’s dolls at myrielle peake whom had craddled the doll as if a baby on maidens ball

how did you perceive that as?

and its interesting detail that it says aegon thrusts one of the dolls at myrielle

So did aegon keep the other dolls?

Ohh such a good question! I don't think the doll has to do with Aegon III's feelings about Jaehaera at all, at least not directly. My take on the doll is that Aegon III is sending a "fuck you" to Unwin Peake through this "gift" to his daughter. (more below, sorry this got long)

the context of Aegon's regency is important here. Although his ascent to the throne is often seen as a triumphant moment for the black faction, for Aegon III on a personal level it is anything but. He's a traumatized kid suffering from depression, forced into a marriage he's too young to take any interest in, with a girl who is equally traumatized (and I don't think Aegon III bore Jaehaera any particular animosity. This is the kid who forgave Tyland Lannister and held his hand as he died, and whose best friend was Gaemon Palehair. His grudges are personal, not generational). Moreover, the regency strips him of all personal agency. At first, there are a few people, like Corlys Velaryon and Tyland Lannister, who more or less are trying to get the realm back on track and set Aegon III up for a successful reign. And at this point, Aegon is still quite young, grieving, and doesn't take much of an interest in ruling. Then the Winter Fever hits, much of the old guard dies, including Tyland Lannister, and Aegon III, now entering adolescence, decides to step up. Hurray!

Aegon seems to find some motivation and sense of purpose during this period, and he impresses people! He tends to the ill, shows compassion, he's there for Tyland's last moments, and then with his Hand gone, he decides to take action. He makes appointments to replace kingsguard and council members who died during the plague, people he thinks he can count on to be on his side, like Alyn Velaryon and Thaddeus Rowan and Robin Massey. He also called his sisters to court. People start saying he's mature beyond his years, and he's showing promise as a king! However, he is still only twelve and under a regency, and therefor the regents have all the power. Unwin Peake and Munkun, the only remaining healthy members of the council at that point, undid all of Aegon's appointments, and Peake named himself both Hand and Protector of the Realm. And at this point things get very bad for Aegon.

Even though Aegon is the king, Peake is calling the shots, and Aegon now knows that his Hand is actively working against him. He tries to protest, to at least keep the kingsguards he'd appointed (they serve for life, right?) but Munkun says he'd not made the appointments the proper way. Aegon withdraws into himself again and goes into what looks like a pretty deep depressive episode. He shows no interest in anything, barely leaves the keep, and the only person who makes him even a little bit happy is Gaemon Palehair. And during this period, the Hand is a real ass to Aegon. He forces him to go watch public executions, the master of arms, appointed by Peake, bullies Aegon and makes Gaemon a whipping boy, and he appoints Marston Waters, who was there when Aegon II killed Rhaenyra, Lord Commander of the Kingsguard. Aegon is very unhappy with all of this, but what can he do? He's powerless, and if he is openly defiant, the one friend he has gets hurt. Then, to top it off, his wife, Jaehaera, "the little queen," dies by "suicide" although no one really believes it was suicide at all. And suspiciously soon after her death, Unwin Peake decides Aegon is going to marry his daughter. And this is where he overreaches, because it's one thing to name yourself Hand, another thing to possibly murder the queen (no evidence, but word on the street is that it was an inside job) and decide unilaterally that the king is going to marry your child. No one is happy with this, and even though Peake has been going around saying Aegon is betrothed to Myrielle, he is forced by the council to give Aegon his choice of brides.

So the "cattle show" happens when Aegon III is at a low point in his regency, but with this new marriage, he has an unexpected opportunity to stick it to Peake. And this is, finally, where the doll comes in! Aegon at this point is clearly not a fan of Unwin Peake, and yet Unwin Peake is dead set on making his daughter queen. He has Myrielle come and hang out with Aegon practically every day and pays Mushroom talk mad shit about the other girls who might be in consideration. And Unwin Peake is getting pretty cocky about this, saying well Aegon seems to like Myrielle better than he liked Jaehaera (so basically he tolerates her presence-- again, does he have a choice?). Then Aegon III gives her this doll. Mind you, Myrielle is fourteen years old. She's older than Aegon himself and too old for dolls, and this doll is the hand me down doll of a dead girl that her father may or may not have murdered, so this is a weird gift on several counts. And while I don't know whether Unwin Peake gets the message or not, I think Aegon meant it as a fuck you to Unwin Peake. To me, this is Aegon saying "I know what you did, and I know what you're doing. Go ahead and try it." The doll is not just a random doll, it's known that it was Jaehaera's doll. Aegon III may be depressed, but he's not stupid. He knows that he's all but powerless, but in this one thing he's been handed a small bit of agency-- the power to choose his own bride-- and there was no way he was going to choose Myrielle Peake, the daughter of a man he despises.

While the book sort of depicts Daenaera Velaryon is a surprise candidate, an "ace in the hole" from Baela and Rhaena, Aegon knows who his family members are, and he would have known about Daenaera being Baela's ward. Was he banking on his sisters coming through with a suitable bride for him? I think it's pretty likely Aegon knew his sisters would have a candidate for him, and he trusted them to have his back. During the Maiden's Day Ball Aegon again comments to Myrielle about the doll, telling her he's glad she liked it. And isn't it interesting, he doesn't say anything about Myrielle herself, he just mentions the doll? Myrielle brought it to the Ball, cradling it like a baby. When he sees Daenaera, however, he smiles and tells her she looks very pretty. Aegon doesn't get many opportunities to show defiance, and he has to be incredibly subtle when he does because of how little control he has under the regency, but I think that's what the doll was, a small act of defiance right before he makes the one decision he's allowed to make for himself. And Peake throws an absolute fit about this choice too, threatening to resign over it, claiming it was unacceptable Aegon-- only thirteen years old mind you-- would not be able to have children with Daenaera and Baela would remain Aegon's heir (and this is important! and why Daenaera is a strategic choice at this point. If Aegon fathers a child before his regency is over, what are the chances he makes it out of his regency alive?). This time though, the rest of the council calls his bluff. No one is interested in handing him lifelong power through Myrielle, they like Daenaera, Aegon is happy with her, and so Peake resigns. Middle finger successfully raised by Aegon, Myrielle can keep the doll.

[thevelaryons]

Corlys’ relationship with his heir is actually so personal to me. He had taken his family’s fortunes to new heights and now he wanted to pass it on to future generations. A legacy to leave behind once he’s gone and a heir who will carry forward his grand ambitions for their family. As he said, he had come home from the sea for this. 

His eldest son and heir proves to be of a different mind. Laenor is a free spirit not bound to such constraints as duty or ambition. Whatever frustration Corlys may feel about this, it’s not enough to make him put a stop to Laenor’s freedom. Even Corlys’ initial refusal to name one of his grandsons after Laenor’s lover eventually changed to acceptance. It’s okay. He’ll indulge him in his wishes. Then Laenor dies leaving Corlys behind with his anger and his grief. But at least Corlys has Lucerys now. The son will do what the father could not. Even though Lucerys is not Laenor’s son, Corlys loves him all the same. The boy may not be a true Velaryon, taking after the other side of his family more, but to Corlys he is still family. When he looks upon Lucerys, he feels pride at the man he knows Lucerys will one day become. Lucerys dies too. Corlys is left adrift up until the sowing of the seeds. But now at last he does have his golden heir: Addam. The boy is a sailor and a dragonrider, with sea salt in his blood and a complete devotion to house Velaryon. Corlys will lie to the world to claim Addam and he’ll commit treason to keep him safe. It’s not enough and Addam is also lost to him.

In the ruined hall of his home, all that’s left is Corlys and the last reminder of his legacy. Alyn exists as a mirror of Corlys’ past. I wonder how Corlys felt looking upon the boy who is so much like him but that he can never call a son. Everything he has is Alyn’s now. When Corlys’ dies, Alyn readily takes up the role of Lord Velaryon. But there are big shoes to fill. He tries to emulate Corlys in his endeavours in order to live up to the legacy left to him. In the end, Alyn is lost to the sea.

[atopvisenyashill]

i have to watch everything at least twice to understand it but preliminary thoughts

wigs look good so far even tho aegon’s looks dumb. i get they want to go for like “greasy sadboy” here but it looks like they plopped it on his head 10 minutes before they started filming. crazy bc little jaehaerys looked adorable, helaena looked very nice, and rhaenyra’s fucked up wig was divine.

baela and rhaena crumbs were nice and while i think the dresses on the whole looked better, i’m still genuinely annoyed that they consistently choose to put baela in these random no character targaryen style dresses instead of her trousers. it’s fine at least they were at the funeral up close this time, given that luke is their literal brothercousin.

we could have gotten a wall scene AND the cregan tells jace about luke reveal. imo there was time in this episode to have jace at some sort of small dinner where cregan introduces him to some people, talk about the long night, and see jace Relaxed, Funny, And Politicking like the aegon & jaehaerys scenes.

that said, him crying as he tried to report to rhaenyra was well done, and picking up joffrey actually made me yell out loud. i will take these crumbs thanks.

aliotto fatherhusband and daughterwife scene was really really excellent. i might turn into an alicole hater bc i think those scenes were a waste of time and i want alicent to fuck several relatives And larys before that man, if she must fuck a man. we’ll see going forward.

b&c was kinda disappointing? not married to the idea of helaena picking maelor/jaehaera to die over jaehaerys so much as blood or cheese making sure to get in that “hear that your mommy wants you dead” line. THATS what makes it the tragedy, that helaena chooses a child over the other and has to live with it. i Kind Of get the change here, the continued themes of helaena being ignored, the idea that helaena almost wants to spare jaehaerys from ever being king by letting him die (i mean that’s what i was getting from the earlier convo + “they killed the boy” - spare her boy by letting him die, try to protect her girl by ensuring she lives). but then they should have found a way to work in an extra level of psychological torture there with the choice she made.

i DO like that they chose jaehaerys to kill bc they were kinda rushed. they’re doing this for the money, bc they don’t like the hightowers, there’s a different rat catcher for different floors, they’re not thinking about the politics of whether it’s better to risk killing aemond in a messy way or settle for jaehaerys, they’re just trying to get the job done. i think there needed to be a little more oomph in that decision though - either more gore/sadism during the moment of killing jaehaerys or a longer scene with daemon about what to do if they can’t bag aemond that makes the viewer a bit unsettled by daemon.

rhys looked infinitely sexier to me. he dumped his annoying deadbeat husband (viserys) and glowed the fuck up. i respect the game.

in general, it’s the same issue as last season which is too much plot heavy tb scenes whereas tg has a good mix of character & plot driven scenes. it’s so frustrating that they can get the same information across but in a scene that has more character analysis & humor but seem determined to Only do this for the greens. the only one we really got for tb in that regard is maybe the corlys/alyn one.

i don’t want to end on bitching let’s end these with MY FAVORITE PARTS: ✨🖤jace’s fire new look🖤✨ and every aegon scene!

[maegalkarven]

A future fic carcass I'll write when I write (after I finish 9 ungoing fics)

King Viserys dies at the wedding celebration of his daughter, Crown Princess Rhaenyra Targaryen.

No one else does.

I am a firm believer Otto and Viserys are the rot on the face of the House of the Dragon and without these two everything would be fine-ish.

Unfortunately, we need Vissy T for his kids to be born, so Viserys dies soon after Aemond is conceived. Sorry, Daeron, not this time.

Joffrey doesn't die because he doesn't manage to provoke Criston before the king dies.

Rhaenyra overrules his father's decision and marries Harwin Strong.

Their son Jacaerys Targaryen is the heir to the throne, Lucerys Targaryen is the heir to Harrenhal.

Daemon marries Laena and lives at Dragonstone (Rhaenyra grants him that), their firstborn is the heir of Driftmark.

Laenor joins the Queensguard and is sent to Dragonstone to protect Prince Daemon (ha) and his future heirs.

Criston Cole becomes the Commander of City Watch while still retaining his white cloak (what? He did it in canon, can do it here).

Rhaenyra removes Tyland Lannister as the master of ships and appoints Corlys Velaryon (back).

When Baela and Rhaena are born, it is decided to betroth Prince Aegon and Lady Baela, making him future lord-consort of Driftmark (and successfully removing him out of succession of the iron throne).

When Jace is born, his and Helaena's betrothal is announced.

Baelon is born without an issue and the royal family meets at the celebration on Dragonstone, where Aemond claims Cannibal and loses an eye in the process.

(Kinslayer, everyone. It fits).

Afterwards Luke is sent as a ward to Harrenhal with his father. A huge ass scene ensures there Luke clings to Aemond and refuses to go.

Aegon makes a greasy comment and gets punched.

Both Aegon and Baela are sent as wards to Driftmark.

Lucerys still leaves.

Harrenhal doesn't burn bc even if Larys kills Harwin and Luke, there's still Lyonel and Joffrey in the equation. Lyonel keeps serving Queen Rhaenyra as her Hand.

Years later the royal family meets at the wedding celebration of Baela and Aegon, where Luke and Aemond behave very much like Rhaenyra and Daemon at Rhaenyra's not happened wedding.

Rhaenyra and Alicent clutch at their pearls, Rhaenyra suggests father died because of seeing something like that.

Daemon asks if she implies they killed Viserys, then asks where is Baelon.

Laena replies Baelon is playing knights with Joffrey.

Rhaenyra and Harwin Strong (no) have three more children, Aegon, Viserys and Visenya, all silver-haired like their mother (her uncle).

Laena is fine with it, they have a poly. Laena doesn't have more children because Baelon's birth was a ghasty one.

Baelon claims the Grey Ghost.

Otto is never called back to the capital because (suprise!) Rhaenyra didn't rush to kill her 3 y.o brother or the other one who was born after Viserys' death. Instead she marries Aegon off so he's no threat.

Aemond eventually joins the Queensguard and is appointed to the future lord of Harenhall.

Lucerys refuses to marry and appoints his brother Viserys as his heir, who marries Visenya. They have a very good life in Harrenhal.

The reason Luke skips over Joffrey is because Joffrey is always at the sea (with Baelon), and Aegon the Younger is bethrothed to Baela and Aegon the Elder' firstborn, Laena.

Everyone lives happily ever after, Otto gets to be the head of the house Hightower after he successfully plots against his own kin, since his blood is secured on the throne, if in unconventional for him way.

He once tried to manipulate Aegon, but was cut off sharply by Rhaenys and Corlys, who kind of adopted the boy as theirs.

Aegon enjoys wandering about Essos very much, he, of course, whores around, but he and Baela have an agreement. One of Baela's children is born from Alyn of Hull, but no one is any wiser, since everyone just thinks the child looks like her.

Jacaerys and Helaena have three kids, Jaehaerys and Jaehaera and then Maelor.

Jaehaera is oldest and so is the heir.

Oh, and Rhaena is happily married to Corwyn Cobray. They have a daughter, Rhaenys.

[blue-mint-winter]

Reading Fire and Blood: The Red Dragon and the Gold

The war starts with the Blackwood-Bracken battle, but it was only a tactic to lure out the Bracken's main force, so their castle was easily taken by Daemon and his forces. As we can see in the end of the chapter, the exact same plan worked against the greens when Aemond and Cole were lured out with an army to attack Harrenhal, so the blacks took the undefended capital with some inside help from Daemon's loyalists in the city watch.

So many houses in the Reach supported Rhaenyra which must have surprised the greens because Reach is supposed to be so religious and traditional. The way I see it, this is pure politics. House Tyrell was weak at the moment, as the lord was still a baby. Supporting Aegon means for the Reach houses that they support the uplifting of House Hightower which with the backing of the royals could then become the official main power in the Reach (take paramount status from Tyrells). It's clear that Reach houses prefer weak House Tyrell that has to appease them over very powerful House Hightower enforcing its will on them. By opposing Aegon and siding with Rhaenyra, Reach houses seek to actually protect the status quo that House Hightower is trying to change as they rise to the top in the region and the whole Seven Kingdoms.

Criston Cole becomes Hand and his first act is to execute prisoners who won't bend the knee. His second act is sending Ser Arryk to assassinate Jace in revenge for Aegon's son's murder. At least that's the official reason, I'm preparing a theory post about Criston's true motivation.

I fully believe Mushroom's testimony about the Cargyll fight, it's more brutal, down to earth and Mushroom was there in person. The other sources are far removed in time and they made up a romanticized tale about the twins. Why should we believe singers who make up what they think sounds cool for their songs?

I wonder why the blacks sent Rhaenys to aid Rook's Rest 9 days after they got a message asking for help? Were they arguing who would go on dragonback? Rhaenyra forbid her sons and wouldn't go herself, so that left only Rhaenys.

The dragon battle description is a bit lacking, did Vhagar fall on the Sunfyre and Meleys? It sounds a bit like she crashed into them from above and they all fell. Vhagar was on top, so she came out uninjured. It also sounds like she might have ripped Meleys apart after they fell. Maybe Aemond really tried to kill both Aegon and Rhaenys at once with this battle tactic. Two birds with one stone.

Cole's army had 2400 men (600 own + 1800 sellswords - where did they get sellswords if there was a sea blockade?). They lost 800 in the battle against Meleys. That means they lost 1/3 of their army in this one battle.

Sunfyre was feeding on their own dead soldiers. They didn't bury the bodies, but left them to be dragon food. That's so grim.

So Jace is running the show as he named Corlys as the Hand of the Queen. They didn't even have a Hand until now! What was Rhaenyra doing? It looks like she gave reins to Jace after Rook's Rest.

I'm willing to believe smallfolk on Dragonstone were fine with the lord's right to first night. They were getting child support, land and money in return! So yeah, I can see why some common people would think positively about that.

What is going on with people popping up that claim to be a bastard son of Maegor or that son's descendant? I'm talking about this Silver Denys, but there was one that came up during the Great Council. If Maegor had a son, even a bastard, he would legitimize him. Is "bastard son of Maegor" a code for someone else? The only one I could think of is Jaehaerys, they said he looked like Maegor when he got angry.

The whole situation with Marilda of Hull and her son claiming Seasmoke is rather suspicious. If Laenor wasn't the father, but Corlys, then how was the dragon claiming possible? If Marilda was 18 in 115 AC, when she birthed Alyn, that means she was born in 97 AC, same year as Rhaenyra. Her father is a shipwright, we know nothing about her mother. I thought maybe Marilda was secretly Gael's child, but Gael had her stillborn in 99 AC, so the age doesn't match. Marilda must be at least descended from a dragonseed.

What's even more suspicious is that Corlys had a bastard son the same year that Jace was born, and then another one a year later. Looks like he made a plan B for his succession. Or he could have wanted to switch Rhaenyra's sons with his own? Idk ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ I just don't think Corlys had bastards because he couldn't control himself. It had to be something premeditated, a part of a plan, an insurance. Corlys is just too political and I think he truly loved Rhaenys, his rage after her death couldn't be faked and his decision to leave wasn't rational.

Why did Jace support Corlys' petition to legitimize Addam? What about Joffrey, shouldn't he be the next heir to Driftmark? Maybe this was Corlys' condition to continue his support for Rhaenyra.

Every time maester Gyldayn, maester Munkun or Septon Eustace have some opinion about the dragons, you can assume they are wrong. Every time. These guys have no clue and in one of the previous chapters they even contradicted Septon Barth who actually studied dragons and wrote a whole book about them. So yeah, Cannibal is probably an older, wild dragon, that came before Targaryens.

Myrish crossbow claims another victim that was an heir to the throne. Jace died like Aemon.

I kind of like the irony that in the end Otto was a better Hand, because his plan to ally with Triarchy dealt the worst blow to Rhaenyra's powerbase, the Velaryons.

More mysteries: how Sunfyre left Rook's Rest, how Rhaenyra got cut on the throne if she was wearing armor? I need to read more to hopefully find out.

[imaginarianisms]

my& hands are folded. lil review. like. okay. i& didnt think this episode was terrible or anything but there's. a few things that annoyed me. like i figured this was coming but the ..... whole merging of rhaena & nettles (who doesnt exist in the show for whatever reason) plotlines as if they're not completely different characters & acting as if theyre interchangeable just bc they're both black girls & jeyne arryn's lesbianism erasure. yknow. just like they took away rhaena & elissa's whole thing in f&b w/ taking dreamfyre who was the mother of daenerys' three dragons & elissa's whole dynamic w/ rhaena who're canonically lesbians & were together & instead making syrax the mother of those dragons when drogon, rhaegal & viserion dont look like syrax At All and the fact that dreamfyre being the mother of daenerys' dragons is that. thats the One Thing that connected helaena (& the rest of the greens by extension) to daenerys who helaena dreams of & they took that away from her to give to rhaenyra who already Has a bunch of parallels (& antiparallels) to daenerys, she doesn't need more of them & on top of that it would make helaena matter more to the storyline.

& also like ....... ok. in the books corlys was Furious at rhaenyra for a bit & that only seemingly got resolved in one episode?? idk man i dont buy that. rhaenyra's allowed to grieve luke (which is. obviously more than justified) but corlys cant spend more than one episode grieving his WIFE FOR DECADES???? also in the books daemon never Once tried to usurp rhaenyra or challenge her claim to the iron throne ever. like dgmw i love the scenes w/ young rhaenyra, viserys (& w/ aemma hiiiiiii aemma rip bbygirl u shouldve been at the club) but like he's Still stuck at harrenhal. like cmon.

also uh. alicent & ESPECIALLY helaena were well loved by the smallfolk? like canonically yes the common people are angry that there's no food but they NEVER attacked or blamed HELAENA for it, it was the fact that jaehaerys died that the smallfolk were FURIOUS w/ rhaenyra & the blacks & even moreso when helaena dies. like. helaena was BELOVED by the common people, she wasn't attacked in the streets.

on the more positive side of things im glad we got to see viserys again bc paddy's acting is just. literally so phenomenal. larys' whole monologue w/ aegon had me evaporating. aemond calling larys a toad made me gigglesnort im so sorry larys. rip ser darklyn u were a Real One. also rickard thorne is there hiiiiiii ser rickard. i'm glad we got to hear of daeron but imo he shouldve been mentioned a lot earlier. i'm glad we got to see some alicent & gwayne scenes bc their dynamic's rly sweet i think. gwayne told alicent what she needed to hear: "i'm sure you did your best". which. sadly is true, she did her best with what she had at the time (in the show anyway). mysaria's backstory was like. so hard to listen to especially as a .. well survivor myself. but like i like her even more than i already do bc its. sadly relatable in my case (not the exact same situation ofc thank g-d). i'm glad we Finally get to see rhaenyra kissing girls like she was implied to in the books, i just wish they'd done it a lot earlier like she's implied to have been w/ laena (& mysaria for that matter) in the books. addam & alyn i love them sm + addam's whole dynamic w/ seasmoke is so fun but like i have no idea if laenor died offscreen or not (i doubt they'd just kill him offscreen but w/e). so they'd probably have to think of some way where like idk maybe a rider can intentionally sever the bond for whatever reason idk. but also larys' monologue w/ aegon especially as a disabled & neurodivergent person myself was soooooo EUGH.

[bohemian-nights]

I really don’t ship anything from HOTD. Viserys x Aemma? They’re creepy in the books and her c-section turned me off of both them and Viserys in general. Viserys x Alicent? Once again they’re creepy and he acts as though their children don’t exist. Alicent x Criston? Could be interesting but I have a feeling the writers are going to forget they tried to do that. Alicent x Rhaenyra? It’s a crackship that somehow became canon in the worst possible way. Rhaenyra x Criston? Interesting until they actually fucked. Rhaenyra x Harwin? Didn’t get enough about Harwin to actually care about them. They had great chemistry but we didn’t see their relationship develop and the effects of that relationship caused a lot of damage. Rhaenyra x Laena? They only interacted once and Laena like the rest of House Velaryon was done dirty. Laena x Daemon? The way they did them in the show makes me sick. They both always looked miserable. And poor Laena committed suicide and this awful fandom went “giRL BoSs.” Rhaenyra x Daemon? Just disgusting 🤢. Rhaenys x Corlys? I don’t like Rhaenys or Corlys all that much to care enough about who they’re in a relationship with and im 99% sure he cheated on her. Jace x Baela? They’ve yet to actually interact as “adults.” Also I don’t care enough about them individually (especially since they barely speak) to care who they’re in a relationship with. Luke x Rhaena? Same thing as Jace and Baela. Jace x Helaena? They’re stans while usually nice are naive thinking the Dance wouldn’t have happened and that in turn pisses me off. Helaena x Aegon? Again 99% sure rape “duty” is taking place. Helaena x Aemond? Pretty sure this was someone else’s storyline to begin with and as duty bound as these kids are?? While I have an unfortunate feeling the writers might have done this I don’t really like it like that. I’d also like to point out that almost are the crackships from this show (save Ratched) are better than the canon ships.

The ships are a dud. So far the only thing I ship specifically from this show is Alicole (and yeah I have my doubts that the show will develop them even though they should and let that Rhaeicent die). Everything else is disgusting to unshippable(let's not get into how some of these shippers are racist psychos who make their ship a million times worse).

Bring in Dettles, Alysmond, Alyn and Baela, and my crackship that will become canon Rhaena and Gwayne cause this show needs it.

[pandora2023]

Can you explain more about what personality Alyn is showing in the previous episodes? Is it different from the book?

I'll do my best to explain myself because I'm not good at this but here goes.

The first difference I find that influences his personality a lot is that in the show unlike the book Alyn is older than Adamm, although in the show we are not explicitly told this is implied and also the actor who plays Alyn in the show is older than Clinton. This alone makes us see Alyn as the responsible one as it is also implied later on that his mother is dead (I gather this from the way Adamm talks about his mother, in the past tense), so he must have taken care of his brother, which makes him think more about the consequence of his actions in my opinion, things that don't happen in the book (which we see when he tries to reclaim a dragon).

He also works in the Velaryon fleet when in the book he works on one of his mother's ships, which, like it or not, has an influence because in the show he is a worker while in the book he is the son of the owner of those ships, which gives him much more freedom.

The big difference for me comes when in the book after Adamm becomes a Seasmoke rider, Alyn is determined to become a dragon rider, first it is said that he spends some time looking for grey ghost but not finding him he decides to try to tame sheep stealer, and that is when Adamm saves him. Which from my point of view shows a much more determined personality, and much more ambitious, also a bit more unbridled so to speak.

Later in the book, although this happens once the war is over and he is already lord of the tides, he was somewhat arrogant (but I won't dwell too much on that)

All this contrasts very much with his counterpart in the show, because there we see that Alyn doesn't really seem to want anything from Corlys, that he doesn't even aspire to a higher position because he is afraid that this promotion will be frowned upon by the crew because of his kinship with Corlys (because even if no one says so, everyone must assume that Corlys is his father or at least suspect it).

Besides, in his talks with Adamm he always seems to remind his brother of their position as bastards in some way or another, resigned to simply serving his master like many others.

Those are just some of the points on which I think Alyn is very different in the book and the show, although I do think that given the different stories, both paths are justified in their own history.

[chillyravenart]

There, before the eyes of tens of thousands, Lord Alyn Oakenfist beheld his daughter, Laena, for the first time. After kissing his lady wife, he took the child from her and held her high for all the crowd to see, as the cheers fell like thunder. Only then did he return the girl to her mother’s arms and bend his knee before the king and queen.

Proud papa Alyn had me melting 🥺❤

[tqwnw]

something @queenviserra said has got me thinking in regards to the parentage of addam and alyn. i think despite laenor’s sexuality and difficulty w rhaenyra later in life, it is plausible he IS their true father. this is an era where homosexuality is scandalised and especially so for a member of the close royal family (rhaenys is a princess, and if things had turned out differently he would have been named prince) .. it’s very likely laenor experienced internalised homophobia when the feelings set in. quotes from him (idk if they’re EXACT but close enough), “it’s not from a lack of trying,” and “i hate the god’s for making me as they did.” later in life he is STILL ashamed of his preferences, especially when they taint the legitimacy of his and nyra’s children.

but looking at “it’s not from a lack of trying,” it’s RIGHT there where it states laenor has tried being intimate with woman, more than once i imagine. not to mention he likely frequented the shipyards where he could have met marilda, he would have been 20 and she 16 when addam was born.., certainly a more agreeable age gap than 16 and a married man in his 60s.

and yes the chances of him being successful in siring a child TWICE are unlikely, it’s still not impossible.

+ ofc the whole dragonseed thing. i don’t know the whole ins and outs of it so i could be wrong, but i don’t see how corlys could sire a dragonseed when he himself is no dragonrider, laena and laenor got that quirk from rhaenys. and laenor’s progeny WOULD be dragonseeds. idk, what do you guys think?

++ you have to remember that in the end, fire and blood is built on gossip, speculation and rumor. it’s an unreliable, bias history text. like there’s a rumor that luke velaryon didn’t die at storm’s end, but fell into the water, lost his memory and became a fisherman … lol.