#i thought i'd at least get a cut scene with the character afterwards | Explore Tumblr posts and blogs

zhansww · 9 months ago

Text

After nearly 99 hours, I finally finished FF7 Rebirth yesterday. As far as the story goes, it left me with more questions than answers tbh. Mind you, maybe I'd know the answers if I'd played the og but I haven't. I only played FF7 Remake and now Rebirth. Anyway, I'm just writing down my thoughts on it and this might get long so I'll put the rest under a cut.

I'm gonna start with what I disliked about the game before getting into what I liked. Gameplay-wise: first and foremost, the mini games. The sheer amount of them annoyed me to no end. As someone who loves exploring every inch in a game, having to learn how to play and get good at minigames to complete certain side quests or explore certain areas definitely put a damper on my usual enjoyment of, well, exploring. And that's just the optional ones, there are also minigames that you can't skip. Instead of just letting me play the actual game, you have to, in between the normal gameplay, git gud at fifty different minigames. And ofc, I stopped (playing the optional ones, at least) at some point cuz it simply became too much but that just sucks. It again takes the fun out of it. The only minigames I enjoyed were Queen's Blood and the chocobo races. Maybe others like this variety of games within their game but to me, it became obnoxious. I actually usually love getting every trophy in a game but I already know I won't do that with this game mainly because of, you guessed it, the mini games. Which is a damn shame.

Another thing I disliked is the illusion of choice. Why bother giving me any choice at all regarding Yuffie when my answers ultimately don't matter? You can reject Yuffie three times but she'll join you anyway because obviously, it's not like they developed two whole different games, one with Yuffie and one without her. Same with the relationship counter thing. I did my best to get close to Aerith, to get that intimate date scene on the skywheeler in chapter 12. But Cloud can also have an intimate date with T*fa. And does the characters' relationship change afterwards? No. Cloud treats them exactly the same as he would have. Again, it's not like they bothered to make different cut scenes or add different dialogue in the rest of the game, depending on who you have that romantic date with. But then why even bother giving us a choice? Imo, you may as well get the date with Barret or Nanaki or Cait Sith. It's not like anything at all changes anyway. The story pretty much makes a romance between Cloud and Aerith canon, regardless. Which in itself is definitely not something I'm complaining about, but it's the illusion of choice or having choices that don't actually matter that annoys me. Also, what's with all the characters being spawned in all the time? I'm guessing they do that to make it more immersive but when you're in a group of seven people, they keep getting in your way, even more so when we're all on chocobos. And it's not even like the characters have any meaningful or important dialogue while you're out and exploring so it just feels completely unnecessary to have them around at all times. It was fine in FFXV cuz there were only four characters and they mostly walked behind Noctis anyway. But in this game, it was yet another point of annoyance for me.

When it comes to the story, there's a lot that I let slide cuz it's a game and cuz it's a fantasy world ofc... but Sephiroth is a really lame villain. Everyone else seems to be impressed by him but I don't find him special at all. Not to mention, he can conveniently teleport anywhere he needs to be at any given time. Also, the characters of Yuffie and T*fa really got on my nerves. Yuffie was just unlikeable with her stupid arrogance and materia-obsession. While T*fa is still a whole nothing burger. She reminds me of any basic, empty, supportive wife character. There's simply nothing else to her. I can't say I was too impressed by Cait Sith either but whatever. Cloud, Barret, Aerith and Nanaki are all good characters at least.

On that note, I wasn't too interested in any character in Remake but Rebirth really fleshed those four aforementioned characters out to the point that I feel way more invested in them now than before playing Rebirth. What I wonder about the most is who exactly Zack is and whether his whole section was even real or if that was all part of Aerith's "dream". Also, there's definitely something wrong with Cloud's mind... he seems to respond to trauma by pretending reality is something different..? Which makes him an unreliable narrator which in turns makes me wonder what else and how much of what he knows is distorting reality. When Biggs talked about Cloud to him, Zack seemed confused and said smth like "are you sure we're talking about the same Cloud?" which immediately made me wonder just how different Cloud was with Zack. If he really lost (or thought he lost) Zack, it could make sense for his personality to have changed afterwards. My point being, I am very intrigued and way more interested in Cloud's character now than I was before. I'm also really interested in Vincent Valentine. I saw him and I immediately wished he would join us. That didn't happen unfortunately but hopefully in the third part.

Anyway, the story and characters were an upgrade for me in this game. The gameplay is still mostly solid. The open world, with the different regions and terrains and climates and chocobos was gorgeous to explore albeit difficult to navigate sometimes. The minigames brought it all down, unfortunately. But I still ultimately enjoyed this and also still look forward to what's next in the FF series~

#final fantasy #final fantasy vii #ff7 rebirth #text #really wanna play stellar blade next #and hopefully finish it before the ER dlc

3 notes · View notes

missizzy · 10 months ago

Text

A Game Novice's Baldur's Gate 3 Log, 3 1/2 Hours In: I would like to rage; is that really so complicated?

(Note: this will definitely contain spoilers for all I've played through, and probably quite a bit of the later stuff I've also seen.)

It has now been two weeks since I purchased Baldur's Gate 3 and started a playthrough attempt, despite my not really having enough experience for that. Previously, I had struggled to get the game, and then struggled with lag, but actually not with the gameplay all that much. I spent the week attempting more things to reduce the lag. Friday night, I found myself thinking they might have all helped a little, but two days later I'm no longer so sure.

It may have not helped that after a week and a half of not playing, I had lost track of where the helm of the nautoloid ship was, and so wandered a little more around the ship before realizing the entrance had been right behind us. That did at least result in my looting a few more things I'd missed earlier.

I had already watched one streamer reach the helm. He had chosen to linger to fight Commander Zhalk in order to get Lae'zel his sword, and I had watched him fight and struggle, but hadn't seen the end of that scene. So I actually didn't know the combat would end-as would all activity on the ship-as soon as someone reached the transponder.

I would have played through it differently if I had known. At the very least, I would've done more looting! But instead, especially with Lae'zel urging it, after an initial turn of them killing imps, I just sent her and Shadowheart running for the transponder as fast as dashing would take them.

Sara, on the other hand, I had activated rage for. I'm pretty sure it was activated; there was a visual effect. But the effect didn't stay up, and I was left unsure if it had stuck. She'd done it at the end of her turn, and while in D&D, it would've stayed had someone attacked her, I fear that here, it dropped before the imps could. Just in case it had, I had her lingering to attack whoever came into her range. She also did loot an onyx stone while she was at it.

When the sequence of cut scenes was far enough underway for me to realize my error, I briefly thought I should reload. But as I watched that truly spectacular sequence, even the lag not affecting it too much, I found myself feeling like I shouldn't. By the time I had passed over shots of characters vaguely familiar from other people's streams and watched Sara fall to earth, I felt like that part of the story had now happened to her, and it wouldn't be right to go back and try and rewrite it.

Also, I realized afterwards, I didn't know what key to press to reload anyway. Homework before I resumed yesterday included looking that up. Also looking up how rage worked in the game, but that didn't help me as much.

I resumed to more lag. It made the scene where Sara woke up Shadowheart borderline painful. We lingered around the beach to try to loot the various corpses, though they didn't have much on them. When I read the letter on the fisher from his sweetheart with their plans to run together, I left it on him. It would've been too sad to take it away.

I made Sara rage again when we ran into more imps, and this time made sure to do it right before she attacked. I figured that would have to make it stick. The battle didn't last long enough for me to be sure it had, though. After meeting Astarion and leveling up, I decided to call it for the day.

When I resumed this morning, my first thought was to find Gale. I'd seen his first being found, but the speedrunning streamer I was watching then accidentally killed him instead of freeing him. Also, I hadn't paid close enough attention to know which direction to go in. And I went in the wrong one, and instead came to the entrance of the Emerald Grove, requiring me to do the goblin fight with only three people in my party.

I may have bungled it during that fight, too. The three of us did at least take down the bugbear, but Wyll and the NPCs killed most of the rest on their own. I never even got Sara in melee with anyone, which meant she couldn't rage without losing her needed ability to throw firebolts.

It still felt awkward to then use the waypoint to effectively go backwards to where we'd started, but while I'm willing to let loot go, I was very determined to at least get Gale. But I was tired enough of it I cheated and looked up exactly where he was. Even then, I fumbled trying to get to said coordinates, initially getting convinced we had to break through the locked door. And then I couldn't figure out how to get Astarion to pick the lock. I walked him right up to him, clicked multiple times, even went into his inventory, right-clicked on his thieves tools, and selected "Use." No result. Then I consulted the map for a way around, clicked on the trail above the rocks to get the party to go there, and watched Sara stride right past the telltale sigil on her way to where I'd clicked.

Knowing Gale could get killed at this point, I was tempted to further cheat and look at how to safely extricate him. But ultimately, I didn't have to, at least once Sara critted on her strength check and pulled him out easily. The dice roll lag wasn't even too painful. The ensuing interaction lag, on the other hand, was very annoying. Though it did give me time to admire Gale's looks, and also Sara's reaction to him. It might be my imagination, but I swear she looked flustered. She might be feeling a little something for two of her party members so far.

Except I've got the uneasy feeling I should've retrieved Lae'zel already, and by then I was genuinely tempted to go back to the Emerald Grove without doing so. Which I took as a sign I was done for the day again, so I continued only long enough to level Gale up. For his two new spells, I took burning hands and Tasha's hideous laughter. I don't know if the latter was the most prudent choice, but I want the amusement factor.

Homework will include looking up how to pick locks in the game, exactly, and probably also where Lae'zel is, exactly. I want to get back to the Grove, especially now that I know Wyll's there. He was the one companion where I had no idea when he was going to show up, and the entrance he made into the game was really quite dashing.

#baldur's gate 3 #barbarian tav

0 notes

punklorde-hunter · 1 year ago

Text

Well, since i finished the main story Penacony's first half (still need to do the Companion Mission + finding all those chests), and I took a few screenshots, and I thought I'd show them while also having commentary on the main quest's story beats.

**SPOILERS and a LOTS of words Under the Cut

While I am kinda sad Dan Heng didn't get to join us for Penacony, at least this means he gets a rest. Man was going through it on the Luofu let him have a chance to breathe and relax for once in his life.

This is more of a nitpick for me but I missed the easter egg at the beginning where you could've seen Silver Wolf & Sam chatting and I'm sad i missed it! I can go back in someone's playthrough to see it but man :(

Gotta love not at all ominous red text with Acheron. I'm sure this has nothing to do with anything in the foreseeable future.

That being said, I am kinda intrigued on what's the relationship between the Trailblazer & Acheron. I didn't get to play Honkai Impact 3rd, but I have read the comics Hoyoverse have online. And as the Star Rail's Raiden Mei of course they're going to give her an important role. It's also nice (and depressing) that she sees what I assume is the HSR Kiana of this universe, or someone else entirely. Plus she just seems like a character with a lot of regret. Hard to tell right now, but I also saw the red text does change depending on who you chose & the choices you make when talking to her so cool details!

Also Penacony is HUGE. I spent so much time getting lost in the Golden Hour area alone and i still haven't found every chest & puzzle. they really wanted this area to feel like the Roaring 20's and it shows

Aventurine is a grade-A asshat and good for him. He's very punch-able in a positivity way. Man's scheming something and i don't trust him one bit, but I am intrigued by him. Also his banter with Dr. Ratio was defiantly charged with something. Whether that was sexual tension or them wanting to kill each other, it's anyone's guess. He's also a really good contrast to Topaz as an IPC official whose not above using shady methods to win so I'm intrigued. Still wanna punch him tho.

I hope Misha & Gallagher get more time to shine in later patches, their appearances were so brief I NEED MORE! I do have a working theory on Misha but that's for a later time :)

Despite not being a character I would usually like, I kinda enjoy Sparkle in a "i would hate you irl but i find you fascinating in game' way. Masked Fools always struck me as an cool faction since their Aeon is a trickster god in a way. SO it makes sense of of their most notable Fool being a shapeshifting trickster who loves pushing people's buttons for fun. I'm pulling for her for having more DHIL ultity but man is she a piece of work.

I also really enjoyed Firefly as a character. Even tho I feel we didn't get to explore more of her character before you know what, I liked what we got. She was very cryptic about why she was a stowaway, and a lot of dialogue during her heart-to-heart definitely means something. Even what Clockie said about people being able to see him by being pure of heart probably holds more weight, but i guess will have to wait to see where that goes in future patches.

Nothing much, I just really liked this shot in the Dream's Edge area, and I think generally I enjoy Dream Edge the most out of all the Penacony 2.0 maps. The shooting stars are a nice touch too!

What a cute pic, surely this means only good things for them :)

On that matter, I can't believe Star Rail introduced a sweet cute young girl, had us bond the majority of the quest-line with, ONLY to rip her from us in the most GRAPHIC WAY POSSIBLE!? ALL WHILE PLAYING "If I Can Stop One Heart From Breaking" AFTERWARDS?! WHAT THE HELL

what a way to show Penacony isn't playing games, and that the writers being from Honkai Impact 3rd show they aren't afraid to show that things in Penacony are taking LIVES!!

I also like Acheron in this scene after Firefly passed on and giving some funerary rites. A nice quiet moment after we got are hearts crushed by the Something onto Death entity. I also like how Black Swan has beein a patient guide after all this, trying to get the Trailblazer to a goal but because she can foresee events through Arcana and can see memories, shes been the most helpful on Penacony as of right now despite being an enigma

I also loved Sam's first introduction as he's always been mentioned by the other Stellaron Hunters as 'not picky' with his prey, doesn't play mind games and goes straight for the kill type. And man did he make an impression in the short amount of time he got.

And the end scene with Aventurine, there's a lot going on. While i don't completely agree with him on Acheron, he does have a point on her being suspicious. Especially if she killed Duke Inferno ALONE (rip Ifrit mains) and her Emanator powers truly do come from one of the destructive Aeons. Most likely Finality since KiaMei is as consistant as with BronSeele/lh

Also on a side not I hope Sunday gets to go apeshit soon, dude deserves it since his dear sister is dead too. Otherwise yeah I'm VERY invested in what Penacony has in store later on.

And with that, I leave this post with the MOST EVIL ACHIEVEMENT PT 1 (there's more of them dw)

#my post #txt post #honkai star rail #spoilers #hsr spoilers #2.0 spoilers #hsr 2.0 spoilers

1 note · View note

dialbforbethany · 1 year ago

Text

WCM - Test Shoot Complete

vimeo

The final export of Where Currents Meet has just been complete. This shoot was my first time directing alone so I was most worried about how to best work with an actor, thankfully we had Claire as our actor who I had met before whilst working on Longboard Nights before summer. I sat down with her and went through the script, talked about my intentions and what things were most important for her to bring out of this character. For example that Iris is struggling to fall asleep, but this isn't something that is only happening in this scene, she struggles with this everyday and is used to it/fed up with it rather than sad about it. Afterwards I walked her through the choreography of the scene, as someone that also edits a lot I had this in my mind throughout the entire shoot so I advised her to choose a way to do an action and stick to it so every shot would be the same. Whilst we were shooting I also said she could do a couple takes where she takes her time with the actions, leaving lots of gaps in-between as well as takes where she did things at a more natural pace so that we had the freedom in the edit to cut around these gaps and fill them with well-timed action.

As we got into the picture edit, Tom and I had struggled with getting the film down to three minutes as even though I had shortened the script it still seemed too long. I was also impossible to cut out any scenes/actions as her location in the room wouldn't make sense if something had been missing and this is the main thing I wish I'd seen earlier however if we hadn't been constrained to 3 minutes then we would've been able to include everything we had wanted to without having to mess up the pacing or atmosphere in the film.

As for the sound and colour edit, I gave both Alex and Peer my notes and feedback on their work throughout the process. The main things we discussed changing were:

the warmth of the image, some shots looked a little too warm so we added more blue/cool tones into it

the music at the beginning of the film is really nice but I thought it should've started earlier at the very beginning and should also fade out a little gentler.

the meditation track could start not as the shot of her putting the headphones on begins but when she adjusts the phone to 'play' the video/sound

Overall I'm happy with the outcome of this test shoot. I think the film does everything we wanted it to; explore a character in all aspects of filmmaking, and I am also happy with the fact that the film is almost like a prequel or ends on a cliffhanger for what is to happen next in the full film as we end on the character grabbing the surfboard as if she's about to head to the beach.

I also think it was very beneficial for us to be able practice as a crew and with an actor for the first time, working with the least stressful scene possible. I believe we chose the right scene to film as now we can also use the footage almost as a teaser/trailer on our socials and crowdfunder.

#isleswcm #Vimeo

0 notes

robot-roadtrip-rants · 1 year ago

Text

@ajcope12 you've triggered my Media Analysis button! Apologies for the long rant.

Season 1's production was incredibly cursed (in the original sense). You could tell me that the creators ticked off the Fair Folk and I'd go, "Yeah, checks out." I was spitting mad at all the cuts when I first started, but then I thought about all the insane restrictions the crew got slammed with and calmed down a lot. One really obvious example of this would be Rand and Moiraine going alone into the Blight rather than taking the whole party. It doesn't make sense much storywise, but the poor bastards were filming in the middle of a goddamn pandemic. Better a fictional story take a hit rather than a real life person get sick with the horrible new bug ruining everyone's lungs!

But for all the damage done by the pandemic and the short season and poor Barney Harris needing to leave, there are some terrible flaws that just can't be explained away. Let's do some role reversal here:

Say you're watching a fantasy TV show with an apocalypse plotline, complete with a prophecized Chosen One who beats up Fantasy Satan with kickass Chosen One powers. The cast is a group of young folks, and the driving mystery in the first season is which one of them is the Chosen One. At the climax of the season, one of the young women realizes that she's the Chosen One and confronts Fantasy Satan for the first time.

Take a moment and think about what this moment means in the rhythm of the story. This is the first time the Chosen One steps up as the Chosen One and it's the climax of the season. Or to put it another way, it's the creators' first chance to really wow the audience with how powerful and extraordinary the Chosen One is. So you'd expect the Chosen One to manifest her cool Chosen One powers, or make a thrilling speech about how she'll always resist Fantasy Satan, or outwit Fantasy Satan. It's her debut! It's her time to shine!

But the Chosen One doesn't do anything like that. Instead she...talks about her boyfriend's dreams and aspirations. Not even about their mutual dreams, or she's able to stand up to Satan because he's got her back, or how their love can overcome anything. No, she just talks about what a wonderful guy her boyfriend is, how he dreams of being so much more than just a farm boy, how she'll always support his dreams even to the detriment of her own. And y'know, the boyfriend is a pretty great guy, and you are invested in his plotline, and you do want to see more of their romance...but this is the Chosen One's debut! Why is her big moment about her boyfriend, and not about HER?!

If you saw this TV show, you'd probably walk away thinking that this was a super-misogynistic scene. And you'd be right! But this is what happens at the climax of Season 1, only with the genders reversed.

If that fucking scene had been a onetime incident, I'd...well, I'd probably screech my way through it, but afterwards I'd go, "Well, the writers had to rewrite the last two episodes at the last minute to be quarantine-friendly, of course they've got some real stinkers. Shit happens, at least no one got sick." But it wasn't an isolated incident. Throughout the show the plot is rewritten in bizarre ways that don't make much sense, and somehow the male characters always seem to get pushed to the side to make way for the women.

It reeks of shallow feminism to me. See, there's a lot of feminist retellings of older stories where the focus is put on the female characters. Since so many old stories reduce their women to accessories, it's a great technique for making space for women's stories and perspectives where there used to be none. Having watched the TV series, I'm pretty sure the writers were trying to do something similar.

But the Wheel of Time never had this specific problem. Don't get me wrong, the books have their Issues with gender. However, the series is packed with complicated women with their own agency, and they come in all kinds of roles. They have their own plotlines and character arcs independent of the men, or interacting with them on an equal ground. And those plotlines are great! As a teen thirsting for powerful heroines in the aughts, following the adventures of Egwene, Nynaeve, Elayne, Birgitte, and Aviendha was like mana in the desert. It's definitely one of the reasons why I latched onto the series so hard.

So when the show alters the plot to give more spotlight to women, it's trying to fix a problem that isn't there. Instead, it does a disservice to the male characters, who also have compelling, complicated stories to tell, but get fewer and fewer chances to tell them. And these changes are applied so carelessly that they hurt the story rather than helping it. We don't start the series with a short, visceral scene depicting the madness of Lews Therin--we start with Moiraine giving a vague monologue that fucking victimblames the Hundred Companions for thinking they could seal the Dark One. But they did seal the Dark One! And Moiraine would know that! And why is she so hostile and dismissive?? This woman has spent her entire career searching for the Dragon Reborn, and will go on to become one of his first mentors and allies. Don't you think she'd have a better understanding of the attack on Shayol Ghul? Or even just some fucking empathy?

What makes this hurt so much is that the series did need some changes. Honestly, I was kinda glad when I heard that the TV adaptation was going to tweak the story a bit--like I said, the books have their Issues. The Red Ajah are so frequently reduced to queer-coded manhaters--wouldn't it be great if they got more complex characterization? Ebou Dari society is supposed to be matriarchal, but it's a pretty cringey version that was obviously written by a kinky dude--let's change that (and rewrite Tylin from scratch, yuck)! Why do we only see Aiel sworn sisters and not Aiel sworn brothers? And so on and so forth.

But we don't get any of that. Instead, we get one-size-fits-all feminism. Give more of the story to the women, and boom, your story is progressive! But that's not how feminism works and that's not how writing works. If you're going to rewrite a flawed-but-wonderful story, you need to think about how that story works, what makes it great, and what makes it flawed. Blindly copying what other people have done is just laziness.

I have heard season 2 was better. I was actually looking forward to it. But at this point I'm so depressed by what I've seen that I'm not sure that I can continue. Do the boys get the attention they deserve? Do the writers stop dumbing down the lore into nonsense? Do characters get to be flawed without having some dark, brooding past like a CW character? God don't get me started on all the dark and brooding pasts, that's a whole other rant. But yeah, if season 2 can meet those standards, I'll keep watching.

Those last two episodes in Season One were so bad they drove my boyfriend insane. And honestly, I'm halfway there myself. Not sure I have it in me to keep watching, and the boyfriend's definitely out.

On the brighter side of things, he's picked up The Eye of the World out of pure rage.

..........Is there a reason why this show is so bizarrely misandrist? That's not a term I use lightly, but uhhhhh I don't know how else to describe some of the shit I've seen.

#wheel of time #wheel of time tv series #wheel of time season 1 #feminism #lazy hollywood feminism #discourse i guess #......misandry i guess #fml

6 notes · View notes

dancegender · 2 years ago

Text

You wanna know something I wish was talked about more? The possibility of Sammy HATING the Ink Demon. (Spoilers for BatDR)

The Ink Demon was his lord! He told Sammy he'd set the studio free! Sammy devoted so much to the Ink Demon, even going so far as to get a LIVE SACRIFICE, and what happened? He DIED! His lord, the being he thought would save him, that PROMISED to save him, was the first one in the loop to END HIS LIFE!

Sammy must've been LIVID. And he was! He comes back in chapter 5 and he's PISSED! The song that plays during his boss fight is literally called "A Songwriter Scorned". If you listen to what he's saying during the battle, he sounds MAD.

Ex. "I'm going to cut that smile right off your face!" - "He said he'd save me! He said I'd be free! Now I have nothing! NOTHING!"

I don't think he'd just forget about it, either. I mean, Henry obviously remembers at least most of the cycles. We know Allison remembers some things too, albeit less clearly, because in Dark Revival she gets deja vu when she kills Susie the same way she did in Ink Machine. So although Sammy might not remember everything from previous cycles, I'd say his lord's betrayal would be the one thing that sticks in his mind.

But he wouldn't know WHY. He starts to go about worshipping the Ink Demon again, and he gets a feeling in his gut telling him it's WRONG. That this is gonna fail, that it ALWAYS fails. And he'd be confused, just like Allison was after killing Susie the second time. He had no reason to feel that way, right? The Ink Demon had promised him freedom! So where was the sudden, strong distrust coming from?

I dunno though. I just wish people talked about this a little more, because it's definitely present in canon.

(Under the cut is a little bit off topic.)

And that makes me think. What if, In one of the cycles, Sammy was able to get out? What if that twisting, scorned feeling in his gut was strong enough that, upon the first signs of his ritual with Henry going awry, he has enough sense to just book it? He finds a hiding spot and waits it out.

And what if he was ON OUR SIDE afterwards? Maybe not in Ink Machine, his boss fight's pretty cool in my opinion, but in Dark Revival! He could've taught Audrey to do that thing where he walks through walls! And doesn't Allison, at some point in Ink Machine, mention that Sammy has some sort of control over the Searchers? That could've been useful!

I mean, think about it! That scene where Audrey's fighting off all the Searchers (the only scene with Searchers in the game, I think). They just keep coming, she's getting overwhelmed, and then Sammy shows up! All the Searchers just go back to their puddles, and then Audrey doesn't have to worry about Searchers for the rest of the game! That would be the PERFECT way to introduce him as a companion! Hey, he could even help in combat, if he still has his axe.

Again, I dunno. There was so much potential for Sammy to play a role in Dark Revival, and I guess I'm just salty at what actually ended up happening to his character.

#man I really like talking #batim #batdr #batdr spoilers #sammy lawrence #batim sammy #batdr sammy

50 notes · View notes

welcometogrouchland · 3 years ago

Text

The tma TV adaptation essay(?) I promised:

GOD Trying to organize my thoughts on a tma adaptation has been crazy because like.

It could genuinely be so good to look at!!! You could do so much with the costuming of characters, the SFX (sit here with me and imagine practical effects Jarod hopworth and Jane Prentiss. Doesn't that make you go crazy insane??? Doesn't it???), the idea of using pixilation or stop motion and compositing to make Nikola, putting intentional continuity errors in scenes with the distortion, never using closeups in scenes about the lonely so you feel distant, never getting wider than a midshot in scenes about the buried so you feel claustrophobic, using rotoscoping and weird filming techniques and on and on- this is stuff that could not only look cool but could actively elevate the written text through visuals... y'know. LIKE A GOOD VISUAL ADAPTATION IS MEANT TO DO!!!

But as good as it could look, like with a lot of people, it begins to all fall apart at story and structure for me. Because how would they deal with the shows nature as an anthology?? Would it lean into it, or remove it?

Give it hour long episodes (as opposed to 20 ish minutes) that can fit multiple, more plot relevant statements in, with scenes of the characters interacting used to break up the statements and weave the meta narrative in more from the start? Well that's certainly an option and the main one I've been pondering. Giving two statements per episode cuts the 20 episode runtime down almost by half which would fit neater into an average series of television these days. (you could probably finagle the multipart finales into single episodes but idk if that'd be the wisest idea structure and pacing wise) but that format could still be A) unfamiliar to long time podcast listeners who want the show to be formatted like the podcast and B) hard to market to casual audiences?? it takes the podcasts method of gradually blurring the lines between statement and meta plot over the course of the show and instead starts off with them already muddy. That doesn't even solve the problem of how you'd go about filming statements, let alone what the hell you'd do when it came time for season 5.

But you can't remove the statements, they're important to the plot. If you do, you change the show so drastically that you're going to chase away original fans of the podcast, who'd likely male up the first core wave of fans who support your show before it takes off (at least. That's what I'm guessing???) So, back to square one, re: tma is formatted in a way that is built around it's own strengths and limitations as an independent podcast, which would clash badly with current models of TV production.

And in all honesty? TV doesn't usually get the luxury (or budget) for experimentation to the same capacity film (or hell, an independently produced passion project audio drama) does. Any of the more experimental ideas I mentioned would probably be left on the cutting room. It sucks but it's my best guess as to what'd happen (grain of salt: I don't work in film and TV and my knowledge is second hand! All I know is that coming to studios with an idea that's a) hard to film and b) doesn't have big names that guarantee a return on the money put into the series is. Generally considered unwise)

Sigh. It's like. I've tried to make this post at least 3 times now, and every time I struggle to accurately convey how much I think tma could flourish in a visual adaptation!!! and so how much I think the best things about it would hinder it in a TV setting. I get why people want it! tma is (as admitted by Jonny), a first draft, and a really good first draft afterwards. We want to bring our favourite podcast to it's full potential, and I think it has so much potential visually...but I've already made all my points for why I'm not sure I'd want it to be adapted to a visual medium, on a purely technical level. It sucks to be pessimistic about it, because I do love TV as a medium, but fundamentally I think they'd have a very hard time pleasing both new and old fans trying to tell the same story as what we got in the podcast.

So what should they do instead?? I'm not sure, but if you told me to make a tma TV adaptation, gun to my head, this is what I'd do:

Have the show take place Somewhere Else

Not as in, have the show be about Jon and Martin post series. I mean, "somewhere else is an alternate universe where things are Slightly Different, as a meta explanation for the changes made to the story to suit TV". and at the end of the series have the big twist be that not only are they passing the fears on, this isn't even the first time they've done it (BIG cosmic horror potential here). Maybe have Annabelle explain this in universe, have Jon find this out, have Jonny Sims appear at the end like fucking rod sterling, whatever!! Just pay tribute to the original podcast by directing people to the first iteration of this story, to compare and contrast and revel in the tragedy that across universes, our heroes were always doomed, if in slightly different ways.

"We're just going to pass it on" takes on a whole new meaning now, doesn't it?

#ramblings of a lunatic #the magnus archives #tma #jonathan sims #martin blackwood #GOD. this post was a BITCH to make #the conversation is barely relevant now that it's FINALLY FUCKIN DONE #i also doubt that this is the most coherent of posts I've made??? my brain has been absolute fucking soup lately #I've been toiling in agony trying to get a single poetry essay done #but uh. yeah that's my weirdo pitch for a tma tv show #obviously i doubt most people would like a meta route???#but tbh the more i think about it the more I'm into it #it gives the potential series a justification for existing beyond just. netflix or whoever wanting that sweet sweet podcast money #it's a variation on a theme in my mind #i mean it when i say a tma visual adaptation could he horrifying and beautiful #and i mean it when i say that the film and tv industry has the potential to snuff that out with it's hostility towards odd passion projects #idk. I'm probably exaggerating a lot here #and I'm also like. 10000% NOT an industry insider and everything i know is second hand so. like #don't fucking listen to me HDBDJFBFK #the certainty of what happens after the fears are passed on may have an effect on the moral debate in 199??#but tbh if the characters don't know that in universe then it doesn't so 👀#I'm not ready to post this. I'm not ready to post this even a little #I'm posting it #long post

168 notes · View notes

jiangchengneedstherapy · 2 years ago

Text

Canon Jiang Cheng tag, well as stated multiple times, was made for his character discussion based on things he did in the novel as close as possible. So 'but jc did xyz in CQL/Donghua' that were adaptational changes aren't really a source/point of talk, because he never did those things in the novel (such as the cliff scene that didn't happen in the first place and is CQL exclusive) but even then? CQL made sure to highlight he was at least going to injure/cut off LWJ's hand to make WWX fall so seeing that WWX let go. The entire scene afterwards focuses on LWJ's horror and JC's smirk. (maybe other adaptations decide to somewhat go softer on his character but they still carried some novel points in them too) That aside, did JC successfully kill WWX in the novel? Did he land the killing blow? No, but not because of lack of trying on his part, he did his best to kill him. And your point JC not killing WWX in the next life? Dude went around killing anyone who reminded him/he suspected was WWX (who if it were in fact WWX who he thought was possessing those people zidian's strike would've yeeted him back out of life) and even after zidian confirmed it wasnt wwx he would still take them back to torture them. Didn't LWJ take WWX under his protection though? And you know Wei Wuxian never calls Jiang Cheng his shidi/brother even once after resurrection? Much less hold love for him (why would he when jc was the first and foremost force in killing him in his first life.?) And I'd like to ask you for source on the "And most of dc are either up to no good or they lost their minds, how do you know they won’t harm other ppl if you don’t capture them" because novel absolutely does not specify the people he tortured were causing trouble like that but it did specify he'd 'caught the wrong guy again.' And someone else covered Jin Ling and Jiang Cheng already so I'm not going to go into detail, its here. But also, loving someone and hurting them aren't always exclusive, I agree that Jc loves JL and JL loves him, but that doesn't mean JC never hurt him either *(for one there are scenes of him hitting JL in anger in the novel) So you’re not gonna mention that JC tried to save WWX from the wens despite it’s the moment he’s supposed to hate WWX the most. I mean, its just like the time he promised to keep the dogs away, its the tragedy of their relationship, jc cared once about wwx a lot, but then? he declared him an enemy to the entire sects even though he and wwx only agreed to defect, he led the siege and supplied the most disciples to kill wwx, like the reason people dont bring up 'oh but he promised to keep the dogs away or how he rushed out to distract the guards once' is because it stops being relevant when he intentionally brings the dog, and he intentionally leads a siege to kill wei wuxian. Or he still kept WWX’s chenquing clean after 16 years? As a guarantee 'if wwx comes back he'll come for his flute and i'll know' so he can kill him again, alot of your points are explained the novel. Or how he still tried to save WWX at Guanyin Temple? Can you tell me the source/quote for this one too? Or how many dialogues of him telling WWX “Don’t be too reckless, you’re gonna get hurt”?? During their younger days before jc grew to hate wwx

canon tag was made specially because people mentioning his more negative actions/things he did in the novel that were terrible were called anti and harassed to keep the content out of the jc tag, even though novel quotes were provided with the text or even when the post was only novel text. So if you're going to do a repeat of that at least provide source with your interpretation too because it seems like you're just talking about CQL, because just saying 'jc secretly loves wwx because he kept the flute' doesn't make sense when he killed him (yea so what if he didnt deal the final blow? he was sulky about that in the novel too because he wanted to, he was the active leader of 'lets kill wwx' siege) and he continued on to killing ppl who reminded him of wwx? (Highlighted in chap 10 of novel)

And this is a whole separate tag made for all the negative things he did, which you can just, y'know block if you don't want to read them?

.JC antis, you can’t just pick every flaw a character has and leave out anything that makes that character “good”/”morally gray” and claim “This is canon”. This is very one sided view of a character. Your shallow interpretation of a character is not superior.

Every character gets uwu-fied by some parts of the fandom, it’s nothing new, it’s all for fun. Stop trying to act like you have big brain and “THe fANdOM ruINs tHiS ChARActER”. WWX in canon is not a uwu character like the fandom potrays either. JC is not a special girl.

Just use “anti JC” tag. Sincerely, what’s stopping you from doing this??

#mdzs #canon jiang cheng

113 notes · View notes

headspacedad · 4 years ago

Note

Do you think it's safe to say that the majority of people treat the last two seasons of VLD as non-canon? (Or depending on who you ask, anything after season two?)

I don't know if I'd say 'majority'. First off I feel like there were a lot of casual viewers who probably just dropped the series and never gave it any thought afterward (lucky them). And second I would like to add the disclaimer that this is my opinion only, I don't keep a tight grip on the pulse of the general VLD fandom and that I cultivate my dash very strongly so I really only hear a very small part of it that generally tends to ring the same notes I do myself. From what I've gathered though I would feel safe saying the majority of fans who were invested seem to have rejected the last season for sure. Personally? I use how fans feel about season seven to measure whether they're Shiro fans or not. Because the second to last season was - yes, okay, it was shit and illogical writing with a lot of 'boy are we wasting time or what with this episode' and a huge dose of 'why is no one acting IC?' as well as a very firm sprinkling of 'boy, the paladins really all do hate each other, don't they?' - but despite that there were some interesting and intriguing concepts in the second to last season. They were jarring and poorly introduced, they weren't explored or explained but the interesting concepts and hints that It Could Have Been More were all over that second half of season seven. In fact there's a really solid fan theory that season seven WAS written with different characters in parts that other ones ended up playing and when viewed that way, the second half of the season would have made a lot of sense and been a very satisfying story (which makes it that much more frustrating because the story was Right There and the EPs refused to take it). So season seven at least had potential.

Except.

Except for the way Shiro was treated right from the very beginning when he suddenly wasn't piloting Black and no explanation was ever given why - -and all the way through to the end of it where he either sat out fights his team needed him during, was rendered helpless by being handcuffed to his fucking belt, wasn't even drawn into group scenes, was taken out of commission despite the fact 'our paladin armor must have protected us' while he was wearing paladin armor, was left out of that horrible 'we all hate each other' 'game show' only Great Heroes were allowed to play (and frankly, we can all just be glad he wasn't included because - wow, that episode was baaaaad) all the way through to dying two more times, going into screaming torture two more times, not having any family OR friends show up (because the EPs said it would be 'boring'), losing the fight that should have been his resolution fight and otherwise being reduced to a helpless, useless, exposition spouting sudden expert on how Voltron works set-piece. He was given no resolution to any of his issues introduced in the first few seasons and handed a giant robot that wasn't even allowed to be useful because that would eclipse how super special Voltron was supposed to be. Oh, and he's got a boyfriend for rep points but the boyfriend dumped him because Shiro wouldn't give up his long term dream so that he could become a stay at home house husband instead and then, multiple years after the breakup in which he is never mentioned or even vagued about, he dies so Shiro can get a sad. Ah, yeah, and let's not forget that Shiro is also suddenly dying of some disease that was never mentioned before or after or even given a name or resolution for. And finally lets include the fact that at one point the writers literally had Keith actually stand there in front of Shiro and tell him to his face that the team (without him in it anymore) was stronger than ever. So - yeah.

Did I mention they cut off even more of his arm too and gave him an ugly hoverboard there instead?

Basically what I'm saying is that I think the majority of active fans are rightfully upset with season eight (which was a whole other shit show ball of 'we don't know what we're doing' writing) but probably pretty content with season seven or at least don't reject it outright. There were intriguing concepts in it, most of the other characters got to do interesting things in season seven, most of them got moments to shine, they were still the 'heroes' (oh boy at that can of worms) of the story. Lance took some hard hits in season seven and so did Allura - and poor Lotor fans. How dirty Lotor fans were done, though mostly that was season six's ending. Same with Jiro/Kuron fans - that main beef was season six's ending and the lack of acknowledgment during season seven. So absolutely there are a lot of fans out there that are upset with seasons seven (and six). But I suspect, from my limited experience only, that most general fans are probably okay with season seven. (The show was hemorrhaging viewers and fans by that point anyway at an alarming rate). I also suspect that a lot of those fans that got disgusted with seasons six and seven went over to the 'there's no canon after season two' boat and frankly, I tend to paddle along next to it from time to time myself (except I hate to lose Jiro and Sven and Slav).

tl;dr: I think the majority of Shiro fans would like to treat the last two seasons (or everything past season two) as non-canon. I suspect there are several other character's fan bases that feel the same way. But I suspect, and could be completely wrong, that the majority of general fans only reject season eight and are okay with season seven (beyond the regular hiccups of disliking certain parts but still accepting the canon as a whole).

#vld salt #voltron legendary disappointment

48 notes · View notes

ofmermaidstories · 3 years ago

Note

Spoilers for the latest chapter of Something!

I'm gonna go ahead and apologize now because this is long; please feel free to ignore my wordy ass, I just have a lot of feelings about a certain someone that showed up in the new chapter lol.

I am still trying to get my shit together enough to write a proper review, but I did want to come yell at you for making the grape boy somewhat likeable, like...

Firstly, how??? Secondly, why?????!?!

Lmao, in all seriousness tho, it's nice to see him have a personality that isn't just "Mmmm, tits" *drools* I like to think that everyone in the series grows up and (mostly) out of the worst of their habits, and while Mineta is still a bit of a lecher here he isn't nearly as offensive/creepy as he comes off in show. In fact he's actually sympathetic in a lot way. The bit about seeing his first dead body before "getting laid" hit different like... He tries to play it off like a joke, but dude has to have just as much PTSD as the rest of them, maybe even more given that he wasn't able to fight back in the same way as someone like Bkg or Deku would be able to with their super powerful offensive quirks. They were all just kids, but they had to face hell full on from jump, and let me stop before I get too in my feelings lol.

In a lot of ways, he reminds of you the boys from school — crude. Taking for granted the safety from being in a pack, unchallenged. Leering at posters, saying off-colour things because no one corrects them.

That's exactly the way I view him, just a crude little thing that refuses to be put in his place for long lol. Still, with his being a hero I would hope that he keeps a cap on it while he's on the job--in fact I'm sure he does; if he didn't I'm sure that Aizawa would've yanked his licence by now, the likes of Deku and Kiri wouldn't continue to associate with him, and that's saying nothing of the shit that would get posted to social mead and such. I feel like the only reason he says what he says to the Reader is b/c she's a little gremlin herself and he knows he's got a bit more leeway, yanno?

The little hangout session that they had at the end of the chapter was weirdly heartwarming?? I want a friend(???) that I can be a surly little shit with and draw on and that will call my bf that's not really my bf but should be my bf because he's (that is Mineta) got more emotional intelligence than me lmao. Never thought I'd see the day when the grape would make for such an excellent wingman--tho I gotta wonder what that text he sent to Deku said. Probably something along the lines of "come get yo girl, she must be bored/lonely af because she asked to hang out with me" followed by "are you ever gonna close the deal or not? or have you already hit it??? >:)" just to give the guy an extra push (or maybe he's got a better sense of self-preservation than what I give him credit for, idk lmfaooo...)

Okay, this is WAY too long, I just had to get it out of my system lol. I loved the new chapter lots and I cannot wait to see how things play out in the next one!!

LOL, oh Puck, i adore you sdlkfjsdlkfjsdlkfj

me being a shit-stirrer/asking myself questions i don’t have answers for under the cut

Cat asked me this question earlier today, actually — why Mineta. And honestly? Part of it is the challenge he represents — like, how do you write him into a fic and mature him up so that he’s at the very least, tolerable, but also keep the backbone of his character (which is being a little degenerate). Like, is it possible? One of the most popular tags on ao3 for mineta minoru is something along the lines of “mineta minoru is replaced with shinsou hitoshi” LOL so…….. why didn’t I just use Shinsou? Or Aoyama or Iida, as Cat suggested? And beyond the part of me that delights in giving myself perceived challenges, there were two stark reasons that stuck out to me, when i was first mulling over his inclusion.

1) the fact that he can draw. it’s literally as simple as that. ever since the BNHA exhibition opened up in Japan and it was revealed that there was a scene in there with a class blackboard and the kids having their little drawing competition — and that Mineta was objectively the most skilled — i was like, “i have to include that”. LOL. it’s like you say, Puck, our Reader is a little gremlin herself — i thought if I was going to write a Reader that could handle interacting with him (ie, be in a position to pay him out) it was going to be this one. I think being in the manga industry and starting out on this journey of creating and drawing a Shonen manga sort of put Reader in this unique position of… being in what seems like a boys’ club? So she’d be used to the male gaze within her field. I follow Horikoshi’s assistant (former assistant?) on twitter and let me tell you, that man is not shy about the things that he likes to draw LOL.

the 2) thing was the philosophy i’ve sort of accidentally given myself LOL and that’s the fact that — as a Bakugou stan, if i’m giving grace to a character who was a literal violent bully then………. i can use my magic powers and hand it around to the other characters, too, LOL. and like, i would argue that with Bakugou it’s different, like we’re currently seeing in the manga how he has grown and learnt and is actively changing, which is the key to any kind of redemption. do i think Mineta will ever undergo that in cannon? absolutely not lmao, i see him as being being Hori’s idea of comedic relief, he’s always going to be a horrible little degen. but i want it for him…… if only to justify why the boys of Class-A collectively ignore his bullshit, for the most part? Like, none of them actively call him out on it?? i think of the time he tried to climb the wall to spy on the girls in the onsen — and how it was literally only Iida scolding him and how it took a child to stop him. Or the one when he found the stupid hole into the girl’s changing room and while the boys all looked grossed out….. Jirou’s the one that point an end to that?????? I saw a TikTok (derogatory) suggesting how like, none of the girls of Class-A would trust Aizawa, as adults, because he didn’t do anything to put an end to Mineta’s bullshit, and it was a devastating suggesting. None of us want to believe that our favourites would be passively okay with this kind of behaviour, right?? Which means……. Mineta’s gotta change LMAO. And if Hori isn’t going to do it then imma borrow him and do it myself. Does it work? I have no idea LMAO i can’t judge anymore, my meter is broken. but i’m gonna work with what i’ve given myself and it either will, or it won’t LMAOOOO kldsfjlksdjflkdj fic is about having fun at the end of the day. :’)

But it’s like you point out, Puck — Mineta is also a child, when these kids get trotted out to their first War. And he’s also not as offensively built as the hard-hitters like Deku and Bakugou and Shouto are. Even if it’s not explored in the manga, that War is going to change them all somehow.

So, my gameplan for Mineta was to grab ahold of the tiny things about him — the talent for drawing, the like one [1] observation he has about the wreckage of the war/pro heroes during the war arc, his tears for Bakugou when B wakes up afterwards and how he tells Deku how cool he was and how much he admires him, in the current Bring Deku Home chapters — and try to envision a sleaze bag who learns that the bullshit he pulls won’t be tolerated, even if he’s still ultimately a skeeze LOL. i mean, he’s never going to drop that er…. appreciation for the female form. and i mean, hey, live your best life King, i’ve distinctly noticed a hand-fetish floating around on this site lately so i’m not gonna be like “NO men can’t like ANYTHING”. But the thing with him being a sleaze and open with his leering is like, he’s actively made the girls of his class uncomfortable with that in the past — how do you write it so that he’s not doing that in a position of power with the women he works with (and saves!), as an adult?? Maturity only goes so far. How much can I bank on the war and the subsequent bullshit they’re gonna face from it on…. transforming him??? It shouldn’t be up to the girls he’s learning with to police him, they’re just children. I have a vague gameplan for it — whether or not it works will be one thing; whether i can naturally shove it into the fic is another, LOL. Guess we’ll see. 🧐

SAYING ALL THAT,,,,, i’m actually really glad you liked (???) the ending scene with him because it’s my favourite LMAO lkdjflkdsjflkdjfkldsjf. 😭😭 Reader is by no means perfect, and she and Mineta both need to start treating each other with more respect, but her bullying of him was fun to write and I like imagining a Mineta who considers himself to be close with Deku (whether or not Deku thinks the same is up for debate) going along with it. i could see this version of Mineta being enough of a shit-stirrer to say something like, “gotta lock that shit down” to Deku LMAO kdfjlkdsjflkdsfjdklsfj and then getting left on a skyscraper somewhere…. RIP short King.

#the puckish rogue: adventures and magic 🪄✨🔮#something just like this - fic #mer-spoils-everything #ofmermaidstories-asks #mermaids talks about 🍇#puck you are always thoughtful and lovely with your comments and i want you to know how much i appreciate them — but mostly how much #i appreciate you for existing in this world 😭 and how by chance we exist at the same time and like the same things 😭💕🌷

10 notes · View notes

xiyao-feels · 4 years ago

Text

Nie//yao (MDZS)

So NMJ/JGY is actually getting two versions, because my read on them is wildly different for MDZS vs CQL.

In MDZS I...don't ship it? I mean, there just doesn't seem to be to be anything there at all of a romantic or sexual nature. It's not that they don't care about each other, they clearly do, but it's in a way that is...NMJ as substitute father, JGY as substitute brother, and heavily, heavily inflected by their (current and then former) relationship as superior and subordinate.

Putting this behind a cut because a) it's me explaining at breath length with quotes why I don't think they have a romantic or sexual relationship and I don't want people to have to see that unless they want and b) accordingly it is REALLY LONG and I also don't want to clutter people's dashes, so.

Actually backing up a step, I don't see MDZS NMJ as being attracted to anyone, that's not really specific to JGY. I tend to read him as aspec, tbh. So theoretically he could have romantic feelings about JGY without being attracted to him—I think he may have some quasi-romantic feelings for LXC, though I don't think he conceptualizes it that way—but... honestly, it's not really clear to me that he even likes JGY as a person.

I'm not saying he doesn't like JGY! He clearly does, at least before MY tricks him and flees. But it doesn't seem to have anything to do with MY's personality, as opposed to like—MY being really competent and conducting himself well.

Some quotes about what exactly NMJ values about JGY:

'Nie MingJue interrupted him, “I promoted you not because I wanted you to give back anything out of gratitude. I simply thought that you should stay in this position, since you are capable enough and your conduct is to my liking. If you really want to pay me back, just kill a few more of those Wen-dogs on the battlefield!”'

'After [Meng Yao] left [for Langya], Nie MingJue switched to another deputy. Wei WuXian, however, felt that the new one was always a few beats slower. Meng Yao was an unusually clever talent. He could understand what wasn’t said, and perform to the best with the simplest orders. He was efficient and never slacked. Anyone used to him wouldn’t be able to refrain from comparing him with others.'

'Nie MingJue was never close to people. He rarely opened up to anyone. Though he finally managed to obtain a competent, trustworthy subordinate, whose character and capabilities he approved, he found that the subordinate’s true colors were nothing like what he had thought they were. It was only natural that his reaction was so extreme.'

'Wei WuXian had once found it strange as well. Ever since Meng Yao betrayed the QingheNie Sect, the relationship between Nie MingJue and him hadn’t been the same as before. Then why did they later become sworn brothers? From his observations, aside from how Lan XiChen brought it up, having always hoped that the two would reconcile, the most important factor was probably the gratitude of saving his life and writing the letters. To be precise, in his past battles, he had more-or-less depended on the information that Meng Yao sent over through Lan XiChen. He still thought that Jin GuangYao was a talented person whom one would rarely come upon, and intended on leading him back onto the right path. However, Jin GuangYao wasn’t his subordinate anymore. Only after they became sworn brothers would he have the status and the position to urge Jin GuangYao, like how he disciplined his younger brother, Nie HuaiSang.'

Jin GuangYao spoke with dejection, “But, Brother, didn’t you hear what he said in the oath? Every sentence meant something more. ‘Face a thousand accusing fingers, be torn from limb to limb’—this was clearly a warning for me. I… I’ve never heard of such an oath before.”

Lan XiChen replied in a gentle voice, “He said ‘if one were to think otherwise’. Do you think otherwise? If not, then why should you worry over it so much?"

Jin GuangYao, “I don’t, but Brother has already decided that I do, so what can I do?”

Lan XiChen, “He has always cherished your talent, hoping that you would choose the right path.”

You might notice a recurring theme here: there's a lot of focus JGY's competence and conduct. But anything about who JGY is as a person? Not so much.

They clearly had a good superior/subordinate relationship going on, albeit one in which NMJ was missing a lot of context (see just behave well and show people up, plus the you're missing a solid foundation thing). But it does seem to be basically professional. WWX describes them as conversing "peaceably, even impressively" in contrast to "his future self, always being scolded by Nie MingJue" and "those jokes of how 'LianFang-Zun fled whenever he heard that ChiFeng-Zun arrived,'" and.... that's kind of it. The closest we get to them as friends is them talking together with LXC after NMJ tells MY he will give him a letter of recommendation and send him to his father; as WWX describes it, "The three chatted back and forth, at times serious, yet at times light. The conversation was much more relaxed than when they had been in the living room. Listening to their chatter, Wei WuXian often wanted to get a word in as well, yet he was unable to do so."

That's definitely not nothing! But it's also the most we ever get, only shows up the once, and is explicitly contrasted with their conversation from earlier. Moreover, I'm pretty sure LXC's presence is a necessary part of things; NMJ tends to respond differently to LXC than to other people (even just earlier in this chapter, we're told that while "Nie MingJue had never been one for humour," "in front of Lan XiChen his expression eased"), and WWX explicitly notes LXC's conversation skills in the context of this conversation: "At this point in time, their relationship really isn't bad. Zewu-Jun is actually quite good at holding conversations, so why is Lan Zhan so bad at it?"

In addition, I'd say that looking at the early part of that conversation is quite telling; while LXC and MY are sitting together as equals, MY stand up at once the moment NMJ interrupts, and doesn't sit even after NMJ tells him to do so (I think he probably does take a seat at some point, but the narrative doesn't actually tell us when). Moreover, MY seems to be worried that NMJ will be offended by a possible lack of gratitude on MY's part ("Sect Leader Nie, if you heard everything, then you should've also heard me say that..."), and the only objection he expresses to leaving is precisely that he owes NMJ a debt of gratitude, not anything to do with, like, missing him. To me all the evidence suggests that while they had a close relationship, it was not a /personal/ relationship, but fundamentally one of superior and subordinate.

(For a close read of the scene where NMJ, LXC and MY are talking together, I highly recommend @confusion-and-more's post here)

Moving on, let's look at after JGY becomes JGY. They don't seem to particularly spend time together with each other, certainly not for the sake of it. There's a brief moment at the Flower Banquet where NMJ asks JGY why he's wasting his time with XY (who has not at this point in time committed his crime, he just has a reputation), but after JGY makes his excuse and scurries away, NMJ turns away and doesn't seem to seek him out or even pay him any particular attention for the rest of the scene; he only shows up once more, and that's following WWX. (And although JGY-as-replacement-NHS would be a post all on its own, I do think it's interesting to note that the exchange about XY is immediately followed by LXC and LWJ coming over, described in a way that highlights both their impressiveness and their status at brothers—their Twin Jade-ness, one might say.) During the guqin scene, NMJ only speaks once, and it's to address LXC—to protest the inappropriateness of LXC leaking exclusive Lan techniques. When JGY shows up to play the guqin for him the first time, NMJ asks JGY "what did you come here for," which suggests that NMJ is not generally expecting JGY to come by without a specific, concrete reason. The closest they ever seem to get after JGY becomes JGY is during these guqin-playing sessions, and as WWX describes it, "when playing the guqin, the way that the two conversed and got along even had a hint of the peace they had before they fell out"—which is certainly better than there being no peace at all, but which I think suggests there's still at least some tension, given that it's only a "hint."

Now, NMJ certainly cares about JGY, both in the sense of desiring his well-being, at first, and absolutely in the sense of being emotionally invested in him—even after his death, as a fierce corpse his only desire is to kill Jin Guangyao. But while they had a close superior-subordinate relationship—certainly NMJ seems to have felt close to MY—at no point was it a close personal relationship, and I don't think that NMJ even liked JGY (or MY, I'm using the name expansively) as a person, let alone was in love with him.

But mostly so far I've been focusing in NMJ's feelings. What about JGY? Is /he/ in love with NMJ?

Once again, I just don't read him that way. This isn't to say he didn't care for NMJ—he absolutely did! He goes to quite significant lengths to save his life from WRH in the Sun Palace, including quite a lot of risk to MY himself—I analyze that in a lot more depth in the first part of my post here, if you're interested, though I will also note now that he specifically sent for LXC to help NMJ. (You'll have to scroll down some; I'm responding to someone else's post.) Afterwards, he kneels to NMJ and apologizes, I think sincerely, for hurting him and for invoking his pain about his father's death. He certainly conceives of himself as owing a debt of gratitude to NMJ for recognizing him, and he's so overcome when NMJ offers to send him to his father with a letter of recommendation, saying that he didn't promote MY so that MY would owe him, that he quite remarkably can't even find words. NMJ meant a lot to him, and so did NMJ's not defining him in terms of his birth—until he did, of course, at the stairs kick incident. But as far as I can tell, there's nothing to suggest he has /romantic feelings/ for NMJ, and frankly—how can I put this—it does not at all surprise me that JGY isn't in love with someone with a violent temper who is noted at least twice to react to people explaining themselves when he is angry with even more anger, and that's even without the thing where he nearly killed JGY on multiple occasions and called him the son of a prostitute.

No, I think JGY's emotional journey with NMJ goes through three stages: first, he's deeply grateful to him and respects him a great deal, although he's also aware of NMJ's lack of awareness of certain social realities (see: the teacup scene, NMJ yelling at the other Nie cultivators about their treatment of MY and telling MY not to worry as long as his conduct is upright); second, after Sun Palace, still gratitude and respect but also a mounting frustration with his lack of awareness of the implications of JGY's social position and his hypocrisy re: acceptable violence; finally, after the stairs kick when NMJ kicks him down the stairs, almost kills him, and tells him what else can be expected from the son of a prostitute, he is completely done with NMJ, but is still very much scared of him. The gratitude, I've discussed; the frustration, I think is fairly obvious in the speech he gives back to NMJ at the stairs. But I think the fear is often undervalued, so I'm going to pull a bunch of quotes again:

Meng Yao shrunk immediately after his previous outburst. Watching Baxia slash toward him, he sprinted off at once, scared lifeless. Of the two, one striked with madness and the other fled with madness. Both staggered, still soaked in blood. In such amusing circumstances, as Wei WuXian chopped at the future Chief Cultivator, in his heart he split his sides laughing. He thought that if not for how Nie MingJue was under heavy injuries and lacked spiritual power, Meng Yao would probably have been dead already.

Baxia’s strikes were so menacing that Shuoyue had to unsheath. Lan XiChen stopped him, half to support his figure and half to block his attacks, “MingJue-xiong, calm down! Why bother?”

Nie MingJue, “Why don’t you ask what he did?!”

Lan XiChen turned around to look at Meng Yao, his face was full of terror. He stammered as if he didn’t dare speak.

Nie MingJue remained silent, while Baxia and Shuoyue continued. Meng Yao took a glimpse at the glares from the clashes of the saber and the sword, his gaze full of fear. After a while, however, he still took a step forward. He kneeled to Nie MingJue.

A moment later, Nie MingJue still raised his saber. Lan XiChen, “MingJue-xiong!”

Meng Yao shut his eyes. Lan XiChen also tightened his grip on Shuoyue, “Please excuse…”

Before he could finish his sentence, the silver light of the blade slashed down violently, onto a boulder on the side.

Meng Yao flinched from the thunder of the boulder splitting apart. Looking over, he saw that it had been sliced into two halves, from the top to the bottom.

Jin GuangYao nodded. Xue Yang had been infamous ever since he was young. Wei WuXian clearly felt Nie MingJue’s brows knit even tighter. He spoke, “Why are you wasting your time with such a person?”

Jin GuangYao, “The LanlingJin Sect recruited him.”

He didn’t dare to protest any further. Excuse being that he needed to care for the guests, he scurried to the other side.

[part of his speech to NMJ at the stairs] You think that I should be afraid of nothing? Well I'm afraid of everything, even other people!

Within the temple, three people called Nie MingJue’s corpse ‘Brother’ but the three tones were drastically different. Jin GuangYao’s face was full of a drowning fear. His entire body began to shiver. No matter dead or alive, the person Jin GuangYao was most scared of was none but this sworn brother of his whose temper tolerated no evil. As his body shivered, his hands shivered as well, and the bloody guqin string he clutched tightly in his hand also began to shiver.

Clenching his teeth, Jin GuangYao struck a few acupoints of his arm. Amidst the dizziness that came from a loss of blood, he suddenly saw Nie MingJue walk a step towards him, his eyes locked on him. He was immediately half-dead with fear.

Collapsed beside Lan XiChen, Jin GuangYao saw this scene as well. Whether because the bleeding and the pain intensified at his arm and stomach or from some other reason, the glisten of tears could be seen in his eyes. But before he had a chance to catch his breath or lick his wounds, Nie MingJue turned around after he pulled his fist back and stared hungrily in his direction.

The harsh, stern expression on his rigid face held a sense of judgement that was no different from before he died. Even his tears had been scared away as Jin GuangYao turned to Lan XiChen for help, his voice trembling, “Brother…”

I think the stuff with, you know, handling NMJ's fierce corpse and hanging onto his head is often viewed as evidence of JGY's continued emotional investment in NMJ, but... I don't really think so? First of all, NMJ's fierce corpse is completely obsessed with killing JGY. I'll spare you another round of quotes on that because this is already ridiculously long and because it's not at all subtle—it's all over the temple chapters, take a look! And second of all—well, there's ways of getting information from a corpse. In this case, NMJ's resentful energy is so strong that without the protection of his body, papernan WWX is actually sucked into NMJ's memories against his will! Sure, maybe no one would risk it, and maybe no one who risked it would survive, but especially given that NMJ's fierce corpse is completely obsessed with killing JGY, that's a heck of a risk to take. And look at the description of the protections around NMJ's head:

Suddenly, Wei WuXian noticed that one of the shelves were blocked by a curtain. The curtain was covered in sinister, blood-red runes. It was a talisman of forbiddance, one of extreme power.

Jin GuangYao walked over and lifted the curtain.

For a split second, Wei WuXian thought that he had been exposed. After the faint firelight made its way through the curtain, he found that he was enveloped in a shadow. A circular object just happened to be in front of him.

Jin GuangYao stood still, as though he was staring into the eyes of whatever was inside this shelf.

After a moment, he spoke, “Were you the one looking at me?"

Of course, there couldn’t be any response. He was silent for a while, then let down the curtain.

Wei WuXian quietly attached himself to the object. Cold and hard, it seemed to be a helmet. He then turned to the front. As he had expected, he saw a pallid face. The one who sealed the head wanted it to see nothing, hear nothing, speak nothing, and so incantations had been crowded onto the waxen skin. The eyes, the ears, and the mouth were all sealed tightly shut.

There's containment, it's suppressed to all hell and back, and JGY quite justifiably expects it to be murderously obsessed with him, but to me it doesn't suggest a reciprocal obsession—just more fear.

I'll also note that as a strategy for containing the information about his own involvement it's a very successful operation! It failed in the end /eventually/, but the failure needed:

someone who could successfully break into his private treasure room and escape without being caught

who could also perform Empathy or a similar tecnnique on NMJ's head and survive it

who could successfully recreate from memory the altered Empathy song

whom LXC would be willing to listen to

That's a heck of a tall order!

As to being done with NMJ after the stairs, well, listen to what he says to LXC:

[...]

Jin GuangYao, “It’s not that I don’t know what’s right and what’s wrong, but that sometimes I really can’t help. Nowadays, I have it bad no matter which side I’m on. I have to ensure that I’m on everyone’s good sides. I wouldn’t care if it were someone else, but have I mistreated our eldest brother in any way? Brother, you heard as well. What did he call me?”

[...]

Jin GuangYao was almost sobbing, “If he could say such a thing when he was angry, then just how does he think of me on a daily basis? Is it that because I couldn’t choose my background, because my mother couldn’t choose her fate, I’ll have to be humiliated by others throughout my whole life? If so, then how is Brother different from the people who look down on me? No matter what I do, in the end, just a sentence and I’m ‘the son of a prostitute’.”

And then of course there's what he says to LXC, in his speech to him at the end: "You, on the other hand, ZeWu-Jun, Sect Leader Lan, are as intolerant of me as Nie MingJue—you refuse to spare me even a single breath of life!"

So—wow, this got very long—I don't ship them, and although I think they have very much mattered emotionally to each other, I don't really see them as ever having been in love with or attracted to each other.

A couple of end notes:

In MDZS, NMJ isn't the first (non-MS) person who recognizes MY's worth, although he is the first person to promote him; by the time NMJ promotes MY MY has already met, rescued, and exchanged intimate confidences with LXC, who respects him greatly and thinks he is highly talented (see again the conversation in Hejian which NMJ overhears/eavedrops on).

I've seen people talk about them not understanding each other, but while NMJ certainly doesn't understand JGY, it's not at all obvious that the reverse is true; he generally seems to understand him pretty well. I think he has two surprises overall: first, that he wasn't expecting NMJ to say he didn't promote MY so MY would owe him, and volunteer to send him to his father with a letter of recommendation—and second, he wasn't expecting NMJ, who for all his flaws did seem to ignore JGY's background in good ways as well as bad, to call him the son of a prostitute.

I definitely don't read the coffin at the end as romantic. Or I mean, uh, there's the romance of an obsessive stalker-murderer finally getting his victim, and that's not nothing (unironically; look, I'm a Hannibal fan), but I don't think it's usually what people mean. This is a shitty end for JGY, part of how thoroughly he loses and is destroyed. I think to some extent it might be that he doesn't want LXC to be the one who killed him, and to some extent it's an act of defiance—now that he has nothing to lose, not even his life, he's going to go out fighting. I would expand on this but this post is ridiculously long and I have way too many quotes, maybe I'll do it in a separate post later on—but if you look at the description of it in the text, plus the subsequent description of it in the coffin...yeah. JGY didn't want to die, he didn't want to be engaged in a mutually destructive thing with NMJ; he wanted to leave NMJ behind in the past, and move on. It's not, for him any kind of fulfillment, is my read.

All quotes are taken from the Exiled Rebels translation: ch 48-50 for everything about NMJ and JGY's past relationship, ch. 47 for the description of JGY's containment measures for NMJ's head, and ch. 106-108 for the quotes about JGY's fear of NMJ's fierce corpse. The description of JGY going into the coffin is at the end of 108 if you want to have a look, and there's more in 109 and 110 about the difficulty of sealing NMJ's fierce corpse/its power and violence.

#ship meme #ship negativity #this is so goddamn long #how many quotes can I fit in one post? dear god #also there's no way the coffin is actually staying shut for 100 years see ch. 113 #also I didn't want to rely on material that isn't in the final text but if you do look at the scene of JGY cutting NMJ's head off #the same theme of NMJ's fierce corpse's murderous obsession + JGY's fear are very much there #also I'm not sure I'd call it a notp exactly? like obviously I don't see it but there are versions of it I can kind of enjoy #but I figured I was being well by all accounts it doesn't make sense enough that I wanted to circle it as like. a warning XP #we can't change places #anger burned in his heart #more than one tag could contain #long meta

27 notes · View notes