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shieldofrohan · 3 years

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I agree with your opinions on pov struggles. Bran and Sansa had least chapters considering the starks are heart to asioaf. Heck Jaime had more chapters than bran. I think Sansa really had to have much more to do in last two books if we think about last 3 seasons so maybe she will got more povs. I don't know how she will deal with her trauma but one thing is certain that she will not end up with her abusers. I'm more curious about how will grrm handle bran arc.

[for previous ask about this: PoV struggle ]

Hello Anon,

Sometimes Martin's "claims" and his writing don't match.

For example; he insists that he tried to create a historically accurate world but fans who know what they are talking about can easily find the historical errors in his world. Sometimes a simple Google search can prove him wrong. His world is ironically filled with historical cliche myths. Or him saying that Arya was the odd bird in the family but the writing tells that Sansa is the different one with no family support. His whole Jaehaerys the Ideal King with Tax Policy failure and etc.

Long story short: He might say that Starks are the heart and centre of the story, and don't get me wrong he totally loves them and sees them as his centre characters, but without his "Starks are the heart" statement or "Bran is the protagonist" explanation these two aspects of the series could have been easily missed.

Some "simple" (!!!) reader would see Tyrion (he is everywhere), Arya (because of her high number of chapters), Dany (has her own arc and story) and Jon (for his parentage secret and Others drama) as THE protagonists. And Arya and Jon alone are not enough to support his "Starks are the heart" claim. Yes we had Ned and Cat too but they died and they were never the protagonist characters in the first place. Starks are definitely in the middle of major plots but tbh Tyrion IS THE ASOIAF. Not Bran. Not the Starks.

Btw when he says Starks are the heroes/centre he only means the "current" Starks. Not House Stark. I would say House Targaryen is his main (?) house. He builds his entire world around them and their history. At this point we should stop kidding ourselves. Martin adores his problematic weirdos. All of his side books are still about Targaryens (TWOAIF -the lack of House Stark content in this book was really insulting... they were kings for 8000 years ffs-, DUNK & EGG, FIRE AND BLOOD).

Well it's his choice ofc, if he wants to build everything around the villain house then he should do it. But a bad choice... Imagine Tolkien focusing on Melkor and his minions instead of the Children of Iluvatar. He could at least give us their Valyrian era but nah... we had to learn about Westeros through them.

You might say: "But he ended that house and look at House Stark ruling the whole Westeros in the end". And I would say: "So what?". We will never learn more about House Stark's history or FUTURE. We don't even know why "exactly" they became legendary kings in the first place. We don't know how their history shaped the current Starks... Cat and Ned (and other influencer characters they meet during their journeys) shaped our current Starklings... NOT House Stark Legacy.

Ned was raised by Jon Arryn and you see Lord Arryn in his honor and everything (Martin literally refused to give info about Ned's mother because she was irrelevant) and Cat is a Tully lady. We see "so little" House Stark influence in our Starklings. Like "our way is the old way" kind of stuff.

And please compare this how Targaryen ideals had a part in Dany's characterization/story and how we can draw parallels between her and her ancestors (thanks to side books). When I say current Starks are the centre characters but House Targaryen is the centre House, I mean this exactly.

I said that we'll probably never know about House Stark's future and I want to explain in further and it will also give my answer about how lack of Bran and Sansa chapters are going to be a problem in the end.

OK. So we don't know much about House Stark but they (some Stark characters) will end up victorious. "END UP" is the key phrase. There is no way that we'll see a lot about Bran and Sansa's reigns. After 300 years Starks are monarchs again but we still won't know more about their ruling. WHY? Because the lack of Bran and Sansa chapters in the books. With Sansa we can at least imagine her queenship thanks to her KL and Vale education. But Bran was a boy lord of WF for like... "one book" (??) and his story became very mystical and paranormal later thanks to Bloodraven (HEY! Another Targaryen... can you believe?)

And we have (?) to assume that they will become King/Queen in the "end" (I have my own theories about this but right now show is my only canon material). I doubt that Martin will give us an "after 50-100 years epilogue" for us to see Bran/Sansa's influence in the Westeros/North.

If Sansa and Bran are his final monarchs they should have been at their last corner of their journeys by now (again compare it with Dany's bad but still narrated queenship). Sansa should have been in the North long ago and Bran's mystical arc should have ended in the beginning of ADWD. Because Martin can't suddenly start focusing on them in the last TWO books without cutting his other 50+ POVs entirely.

People were SHOCKED when Bran became king because right now his story has nothing to do with being a Westeros King. Will only two books be enough to redirect his story? Sounds unlikely. Martin needs at least 3 books to put everything in order to create a well developed story but we'll only have two.

OR he should have focused on them LONG AGO to remedy this. More Sansa and Bran chapters in the previous books would had been helpful but a little too late.

And especially when I look back at Sansa's chapters I see so many unnecessary drama. Like all of her interactions with Sandor. What did they add to Sansa's story? Sandor couldn't break Sansa's spirit but in the end Sansa shamed him so all of their interactions were about Sandor... not Sansa. They shaped Sandor.. not Sansa.

Martin giving too much attention to Sandor in Arya and Sansa chapters is so annoying. I would rather read Sansa being sad and bitter about her father and Robb abandoning her tbh. It would be a better subject for a young lonely little girl instead of her being molested by some old pervert(s). Like I said... even in her limited number chapters she was misused by the author.

And Bran simply doesn't exist when you compare it with other characters. Everything starts with him but Twincest drama handled without him. He has no part in that or anything that is happening in Westeros right now. And this is our future King of Westeros.

Back to your ask... Sansa will deal with her trauma in subtext like she did(n't) with whole Unkiss thing. And hooooop she will go back to North, deal with LF, rebuild WF and her legacy---- BOOOM!!! War and Others etc. Homegirl has a lot to do. And her healing will have a very little part in her future chapters because author didn't deal with them when he should have in previous books. Instead he threw one trauma after another to crash her more. I guess she'll magically be OK and ready to become a Queen. And yes... she won't end up with any of her abusers. Does anyone still believe that sh*t?!!??!

Like I said, lack of Bran and Sansa chapters will be another part of missing House Stark history. If Starks were truly the heart then Bran STARK and Sansa STARK would had more chapters (between 30-50: Dany has 31 and Tyrion has 49).

Just saying they are the heart/centre doesn't do the job alone. If characters who are not the heart have more chapters than them, this will tell me that focus of story is on them and not on so called heart characters. And this brings me back to my first sentence: Sometimes Martin's "claims" and his writing don't match.

I repeat: Starks might be the heart and in the centre BUT the amount of focus that Martin shows for some Stark characters (Bran and Sansa) is not enough to make them surpass the characters who are not the heart.

So we are talking about an imbalance here. And this is creating a problem. Two main characters aren't getting the attention they need and therefore fandom ignores them... and these two are THE characters that will shape future of the Westeros. They are actually the most important characters but author treats them like they don't matter as much as other main characters (And I know that this was not his intention.. just a mistake in his writing plan). Sad.

Anyway, we'll see how he will deal with Sansa and Bran problem in next books. I hope he'll manage it well.

Thanks for the ask.

#mine #ask #asoiaf #grrm critical #anti house targaryen #just to be safe #reply #answered

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dangerous-disposition · 4 years

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On Tragedy vs. Bad Endings

[Image ID: user @frostyfrogz replied to your post “my mag171 #thots: I fully agree with. I love jonmartin I want nothing but the best for them. I know my answer today was an obvious twisting of dialogue but its just frustrating sometimes because it seems like people dont understand some sort of tragedy will indeed happen. I have never and will never suggest that something will happen to Jon and Martin’s relationship I’ve just been saying the shows not going to end well no matter what.]

So I have a lot of thoughts about this very subject, and too much for the replies on my post, so allow me to try to articulate what I mean, and what a lot of us mean when we say “it does not make sense for either Jon or Martin to turn evil in the end,” even in a show that has been advertised from day one as a tragedy.

First of all, no one thinks this is going to end happy. The few who do are usually unaware that this show is billed as a tragedy, and are quick to be corrected. I didn’t know it was a tragedy until I was on season 3 and someone told me. It’s overall just best to assume that the OP knows it’s not going to be a happy ending, because “reminding” people or “explaining” to people that the ending is going to be sad is a fast way from people to get annoyed and defensive.

Anyway! It appears, above all, that people have either fundamentally different ideas of what a tragedy is or accomplishes, or that people have a fundamentally flawed understanding of tragedy and it’s place as a narrative device/theme.

My thoughts are that tragedies hurt, and tragedies can be devastating, but they have to have a message and they should not be cruel to the audience.

A cruel ending would involve leading the audience to believe one thing for the entire book, show, movie, podcast, what have you, just to rip it away at the last minute like a big “fuck you” to the audience. Those sorts of endings are inherently mocking of the audience, and ultimately disrespectful. The only people in the audience that “benefit” from this sort of writing are the cynics who spent the entire show talking down to everyone for seeing the silver lining in the impending tragedy, even if, up until the finale, the silver lining was always part of the narrative. Like it took actual twisting and outright ignoring of the narrative as it’s written to be cynical and sceptical all the way until the end.

That is, plain and simple, bad writing. Jonny Sims is not a bad writer.

Now tragedies often have “happy endings,” they just also have an element of sadness colouring that ending. A good, tragic ending should, in my opinion, feel bittersweet. We should see it coming, we should know it will hurt, but it should be for the greater good and should further the narrative that has been told from the beginning.

I said a few weeks ago that a tragic ending without a silver lining is just torture porn, and I stand by it.

Now, if Jon or Martin are revealed to be Actually Evil in the end, where is the silver lining in that? What narrative has even possibly hinted at this outcome, without putting on cynic glasses?

Every single plot point and plot “twist” in TMA has been clearly detailed, never relegated to pure subtext that you would have to comb through a single interraction and analyzing the tone in which it was said (which could easily be actor shortcomings or error). They have always been obvious, at least in hindsight. This is why, for a while, I subscribed to the Web!Martin theory, but due to recent episodes I’m more inclined to believe those “obvious things” were red herrings.

Throughout The Magnus Archives, the common theme in every. Single. Season finale is that “we are stronger together.” What do I mean by that? Well, here’s the general idea:

Season 1: The one time someone gets separated by the group for any significant length of time, like I mean the main group, she gets killed by the NotThem and replaced.

Season 2: Jon is alone, due to his intense paranoia and his reluctance to reach out for help. This leads to a disastrous series of events that leaves him a suspect of murder, and his friends even more doubtful of his character.

Season 3: In the episode just before they deal with the Unknowing, Jon literally says that isolation was his downfall, and he was going to work on trusting his friends more. When they got separated during the Unknowing, things went to shit. When they found each other again, they were able to rally and they “succeeded.” Conversely, they are also teamed up with Melanie and Martin who hung back to bring down Elias. They were successful, working as teams on separate objectives, etc.

Season 4: This is, by far, their most “successful” feats while simultaneously their least. The whole season was again showing the downfalls of isolation. In the season finale, Jon has Basira and Daisy’s help, and while bolstering himself with their strength, and the strength in his conviction to save Martin to be with Martin, Jon was successful in stopping Peter Lukas and saving Martin. Conversely, Martin and Jon’s isolation in Scotland could be, theoretically, implicated in how Jonah Magnus was able to succeed in the end like that.

Now evidence of this same train of thought in season 5? Jon literally says it: Gertrude would not have done well in this post-apocalyptic world, because she had no friendships, no anchors, no reason to stay human. And then Jon says “you are my reason” to Martin.

It is in the text of the story that the only way to succeed, or win, or survive, is through trust, friendship, and love. One of the main factors in so many of the statements, on why the statement givers succumbed to the fear in their story, for even a moment, had to do with very little personal ties to anyone else. Many of the statements feature isolation and, as Jon put it, “lack of corroboration.” On the flipside, many of the statements that ended with the statement giver escaping successfully, and surviving long enough to be reached out to for follow-up questions, involved them having close personal ties to someone else that kept them safe, somehow. Like the girl from Italy; remembering her mom saved her from the Lonely. Or, more ridiculously, the guy and his dog that escaped the spiral because he was so distracted by his dog and had to be home for dinner. In MAG170, it was Martin’s love for Jon, and his trust in the love from Jon and his friends, that saved him from the Lonely again. Jon’s incredible amount of love, and respect, and trust in his friends is what’s kept him from becoming another Jared Hopworth or Jude Perry. In MAG155, Cost of Living, he expresses open disgust in how that particular avatar of The End justified her actions, killing and killing and killing again because she viewed herself as more worthy of life than that person. In that same episode, he talks of not blinding himself because he hopes to use his powers to protect his friends, that without them they’re too vulnerable. Honestly, this is the same reason Peter Lukas is unsuccessful, because Martin only helped him at all to protect his friends. The fact that he didn’t see his failure coming was hilarious.

Gerry said in Family Business that there is no “entities of love”, and that might be true, but love and trust is literally what saves you from fear. How many of us deal with things that are scary in our lives, if only because we have some level of trust in the people or things around us. How many of us have been brought out of a panic attack by someone we love and trust?

So all of this has been presented to us, over and over and over again, which is what I, and others, mean when we say “it does not make sense for one of them to be evil.” That’s what we mean when we say “it would be Bad Writing to make one of them evil in the end.” The entire show has driven home the message that we need love, we need personal connections to survive fear. To rip that away from the main characters at the last minute and call it “tragedy” would be a spit in the face of every single listener who took the story at face value, without picking it apart and reading lines out of context. And Jonny Sims and Alex J. Newall have both said they hate lazy writing.

Now, none of the JonMartin fans I follow are deluding themselves to think this show will have a happy ending outside of very self-indulgent fix-it au fanfics.

The way I see this going down is that Jon and Martin will figure out how to put the world back to the way it was, but Jon will not be able to be part of the new world with Martin. That’s the tragedy; that the world gets saved, and Jon helps save it, but he doesn’t get to benefit from his efforts in any way. The tragedy is Jon loves Martin so much, and they deserve their happy ending, but they don’t get it. But, they still saved the world so others can have their happy endings.

Idk about you, but between the “Jon turns evil in the end” and “Jon stays good and sacrifices himself to save the world” endings, only one of them has me in tears right now as I type this out, and it’s not the former.

I’m not against sad endings,I’m against bad endings that punish the audience for having even a bittersweet hope. I’m against sad endings that are just sad for the sake of being sad, with zero pay-off or reason to happen, especially when those endings throw out 5 years of hard work.

And hey, I might just be forced to eat my words in the end, but not before I fly all the way to England and make Jonny Sims eat a knuckle sandwich.

This was a lot longer than I meant for it to be, but I just have a lot of feelings.

#jonmartin #the magnus archives #tma #tma spoilers #THE POWER OF LOVE AND TRUST WILL SAVE THE WORLD #also idk the proper format of like image id's but i didn't want to NOT type out the reply #my mag thots #500 notes

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thattimdrakeguy · 4 years

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I’m honestly so confuse if Tim is really Robin again or not. In joker war, he was called Red Robin despite having a Robin costume on and he was called Drake in one of the nightwing issues. Also Jorge Jimenez and Tom Taylor have been hinting a new supersons project, so maybe Jon will be deage and Damian will be Robin again unless it’s just out of continuity. Do you think it’s possible that Tim and Damian are both going to be Robin?

I'm pretty sure Tim is Robin again. Editorial just messed up and didn't keep it consistent. Cause Joker still referred to Tim as "Little Robbie", while in Batman he got the "Duck Boy" joke. So I think they just didn't know.

Cause Tim is still Robin in future slate, was said to go back as Robin in Y.J., was called Little Robbie by Joker, and was referred to as Robin by Babs in Batgirl.

More things point to Robin than Red Robin or Drake. So it's easier to me to just assumed the others are errors. Robin Eternal seems pretty blunt to me and that's still months from now.

And I sure hope Tom Taylor doesn't get another series with Damian, cause even though people like him, I don't like his Damian cause rather than a genuine sense of development (at least for younger Damian. Lots can happen for older Damian) he just panders to people. And I know that's what's in his head because he panders a lot.

He wrote a Joker story were the Joker set up a child's birthday because he felt bad for the kid. The Joker set up a birthday party.

I don't like his uses of false sentimentality to make it seems like his work has more depth, despite it not properly connecting to the characters actual dynamics or personalities, and rather fan service to get himself attention or "make the fans happy" or what ever his goal is. It just feels cheap and ooc to me.

I heard his Spider-Man stuff was good, but that's generally irrelevant given his present stuff.

I figure the hypothetical series would be out of continuity given he already writes those two.

Plus idk if it any longer makes sense for Jon to be aged down, because he's currently getting his own life and finding love. At this stage it would feel kind of uncomfortable because it would be now taking away from Jon rather than giving him something back.

Like I feel like it's gone on for so long now that it wouldn't work anymore storywise, and if it did happen it would be insanely awkward and uncomfortable.

They're in a corner with that.

As for rather for not they could be Robin at the same time they already were last year when Tim was Robin again the first time before they retconned him back into Red Robin before "Drake".

I'd rather Damian not be Robin again even if he becomes good again, cause he didn't really do anything Robin is supposed to after awhile. Like I get he's younger, but Robin doesn't actually have anything to do with age, and regardless Tim is still a kid. It's just how Dick felt, but not how Tim felt or anything. I feel like Damian quickly became his own thing so fast that he doesn't actually need to be Robin, as it doesn't have a purpose for him anymore. Where as Tim is the kid that says Batman needs a Robin.

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rest-upon-the-morning-light · 4 years

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JonMartin fic

So I’m trying to get back into fic writing, especially for TMA, and have a multi chapter fic planned but wanted to start with a smaller one shot style fic to warm up. It’s been an age since I’ve written anything, much less something that wasn’t just reader based or smut lmao. I’ve added trigger warnings but if I missed any do let me know!

Any feedback would be great and if you like this, please send me prompts! Happy to write anything from fluff to smut, just as long as its TMA based :D

So! Here is my cute fluff JonMartin fic! Enjoy~

Everybody Wants To Be A Cat

Word Count: 2240

Trigger Warnings: Mentions of Animal Abuse, but nothing to graphic. Anxiety. Self Worth Issues. Season 1 Jon being Season 1 Jon. Season 1 Martin being Season 1 Martin.

Fandom: The Magnus Archive

Pairings: Jonathan Sims/Martin Blackwood

Summary: Martin was certain of two things. One, he had an enormous crush on his boss. Two, his boss hated him. Who knew a one eyed beast of an alley cat would bring them closer?

Martin Blackwood has two problems.

Problem number one. He was absolutely certain he was more than a little bit in love with his boss.

Problem number two. His was absolutely certain said boss hated him.

Well, hated was probably a strong word. Hated implied that Jon thought of him at all, and it was far more likely that Jon thought of him very little throughout his day. Except, of course, when Martin did something wrong. Then those piercing eyes of his would be solely fixed on him whilst he shouted about how inept Martin was or how stupid his mistake had been.

It hurt, those moments. It hurt that the only time Jon ever truly seemed to see Martin was when he was angry at him. Not when Martin did an amazing follow up on a statement. Not when he’d created a great rapport with a statement giver or their family. Not when he brought Jon tea. Just when he did something wrong.

It was a running theme in this annoyance Martin called his life.

He still couldn’t help these feelings though. Jon was an arse half the time that much was true. It infuriated Tim to know end when Jon would lash out at Martin. “He has no right Martin. Mistake or not he’s your boss, he’s supposed to help you, not act like a massive dick all the time”

It was harder for Tim and Sasha in a way. They’d been Jon’s equal for a long time, working together. Moving to the Archive was always going to be a bit of a challenge. To have friend become boss. Especially for Sasha, who everyone thought was going to be become Head Archivist. But neither had held any real resentment over Jon for the change. After all, it wasn’t his choice, it was Elias’s.

But Jon’s sudden shift from rude but mostly recluse and occasionally friendly colleague to rude very recluse and stick constantly up arse boss was harder than any of them expected.

Martin could understand. It was big position and Jon seemed like the type to take everything he did very seriously. This meant holding everything in the archive to a high standard. His assistance included.

So yes, Jon was awful to him a lot of the time. But he was passionate. He cared. For all his blustering that none of this was real, Martin could see how much he empathised with the people who had given those statements. How he looked like he’d personally failed them when a follow up revealed they had died not longer after they’d come to visit the institute.

His crush probably wasn’t the most healthy but sue him! He liked being a bit in love. He liked having inspiration for his poetry. He enjoyed the fluttery feeling in his stomach when he came into work.

He just wished Jon didn’t quite hate. No. Didn’t quite dislike him so much.

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There is a cat that has been hiding the alleyway behind the Institute for several days now.

Martin noticed the poor thing when he’d been taking out some rubbish that accumulated in the Archive. Usually that sort of thing wasn’t his job, but he’d been done for the day anyway and he liked to be useful, even if no one really noticed.

It was a mangy young thing. Light brown fur matted, one eye seemed to be damaged and it hissed every time Martin so much as approached it.

He couldn’t just leave it though. Poor thing needed help. It was out here, lonely, forgotten, damaged by the people that probably at one point said they’d love and protect it.

Was he projecting onto a stray cat now? God this was a new level of sad.

So he did what someone in his position did best. He researched.

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There is a surprising number of places to buy cat supplies near the Institute and the workers in the shop were incredibly helpful with his questions.

Approach slowly. Don’t try to touch or hold the cat. Leave out food and water. He’d also bought a small plastic hut and shoved a warm blanket inside for the large cat. He didn’t know what breed it was. Just that it was grumpy and hurt.

It didn’t take a great deal away from his own funds either. His job paid well enough and he didn’t exactly go out with people very often, buying expensive drinks or tickets to shows.

His special treat was usually some sugar drenched coffee.

He couldn’t see any physical injuries on the cat, apart from its eye, so he put some treats in the hut, left out the food and water, then left.

He came back everyday with more supplies to keep the large growling cat comfortable. Every day that passed the cat came a little bit closer to him. He grinned at that. Hoping one day it would come close enough to pet.

He’d read somewhere that when cats blink, once and slow, it was a sign that they trusted you. Martin waited for that day with bated breath.

Tim and Sasha were a little bit suspicious as to where he was going on his lunch breaks. He told them he just taking a long walk, getting some fresh air away from the dusty old archives but he knew it wasn’t the best lie.

Lying for the sake of his job was one thing. Lying to his friends for no good reason was another.

It wasn’t like he doing anything bad. It was more that he wanted this for himself. He wasn’t even too sure why. Part of him wondered if he was worried the cat would somehow take some natural liking to either one of them or both. He didn’t want to lose all his hard work.

Or, if he was being more honest with himself, he didn’t want the cat to abandon him for someone better.

Yeah. New level of pathetic had been reached.

But one lunch, a few weeks after he’d first spotted the broken but massive feline, that the lying and the ill feeling became absolutely worth it.

Because the cat approached him.

Martin didn’t move a single muscle. He was sat on a small wooden box in the alley. Far enough away as to not frighten the poor thing, but close enough that the cat could make contact if it wanted to.

And today it did.

He held his breath the closer it got, keeping eye contact with its good eye the whole time. It paused for a moment, right in the front of his bent legs, before it let out a small mirp noise and butted its head against his knee.

“Oh hello” Martin laughed, chest feeling lighter than it had in an exceptionally long time.

He reached out his hand slowly to pet its head and let out another sign of relief when the one eyed cat let him.

“Well” he began

“I can’t very well keep calling you cat or beast in my head, you’ll need a name”.

It didn’t acknowledge his words in any way, just continued to let him scratch behind its ears and watched him with its one working eye. He could almost imagine its thoughts.

“Silly Martin, just come up with one already. Stop wasting time”.

He let out a soft chuckle at the thought, a name ready on his lips.

“Jon” he smiled gently.

“I think I’ll call you Jon”.

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It went well after that. Martin made plans to keep the cat. It would help the dreariness of his lonely flat, and he was lucky his landlord allowed pets in his building.

He couldn’t afford proper insurance but the workers at the pet shop knew an emergency vet that wasn’t too expensive, so he could get Cat Jon’s eye checked out soon.

Giddy as he was with his newfound friend, he didn’t realise that he’d been less subtle than usual about where he was going on his break.

It was one grey, wet Wednesday that it all came to ahead.

He’d been sitting crossed legged on the ground, his coat below him as a sort of makeshift blanket to keep his trousers dry, when Human Jon found them.

He hadn’t even noticed Jon had followed him until the backdoor that led the alley burst open with a bang that echoed down the narrow way.

“Martin” shouted Jon, looking at some papers in his hand.

“I need you to take your lunch late and follow up on this report. You made several errors in your research that, frankly, a child could spot. I don’t know what you’re doing out here but if you have time to sit around then –“

Jon’s rant was cut short as he finally looked up to the picture that greeted him.

Cat Jon had leaped into his arms from the loud noise, clinging to Martin’s bright yellow sweater.

Martin froze, cat in arms as Jon stared at him with a look of equal shock.

“Oh” began Jon softly

“Sorry” Martin practically shouted.

“I – eh – this is, well um, a cat, I found? A few weeks ago, actually. I’ve been sort of taking care of it? Getting it food and water and um” he gestured to the plastic hut and blanket he’d laid out.

“He was hurt you see. Only one eye and really badly taken care of. Abandoned, I recon. So I’ve been out here on lunches making sure he’s, um, that he’s okay? Is that..is that alright?” he trailed off nervously.

He couldn’t look at Jon. It wasn’t exactly something to be ashamed of, taking care of a stray cat. But he could imagine Jon being the sort of serious no nonsense person who would see it as a waste of time, his lunch break or not. God would this make his relationship worse? Would Jon scold him for it? Did it make him seem more pathetic than before? Christ, was that even possible?

He didn’t notice the movement until Jon was sat beside him on the floor.

Jonathan Sims, Head Archivist of the Magnus Institute, sat on a dirty alley floor with Martin K Blackwood.

He watched with bated breath as Human Jon reached his hand out to Cat Jon and let out a small sound of relief when Cat Jon didn’t bite, scratch or run away.

“You poor thing” murmured Jon, eyes only on his (unknowing) cat counterpart.

“What have they done to you? Well, you look better now than you probably did before. Thank to our Martin here”.

Martin couldn’t help but blush deeply at that. Hot all over his face. He couldn’t handle this. Jon being all, all soft and gentle and calling him “our” Martin.

“You’ve been taking care of him then?” Jon looked up at Martin now. Eyes soft and kind for once. It nearly took all of Martins brain power to respond after receiving such a look.

“Yes” he began.

“Like I said, I found him a few weeks ago. Planning on taking him back to mine soon, get him out of the cold properly”.

Jon nodded, eyes never leaving Martins, hand firmly petting the cat in Martins arms.

“I’m sorry, about the work” Martin nervously bit his lip.

“I’ve been really worried about him so I rushed it to get out here on time. It’s no excuse and I know you don’t exactly think highly of my work in the first place. I’ll make sure I stay late tonight so I can catch up”

“Martin” interrupted Jon, eye straying on the bitten lip, a slight flush to his cheeks.

“I’m the one who should be sorry. I haven’t been fair to you these past few months. It’s been unprofessional at best and, well, and downright cruel at worst”

“Your job is stressful” Martin tried to defend

“And we both know I’m not exactly at the same standard at the others”

“Still” Jon continued.

“It’s my job to help you, not, berate you at every mistake. You came from the library, not research, so you have different skill set and – well, its been hard for us all. Not fair of me to put all that blame on you. God knows Tim could stand to be a bit more professional at times” Jon grumbled out the last part, a small pout to his lips.

Martin laughed at that, smiling wider than he could last remember.

“Tim just likes to keep you human, I think” he winked and watched with fascination as the flush came back to Jon’s dark cheeks.

Cat Jon leap out of his arms after that, toddling off to who knows where.

“Well” Martin began, getting up from his cross legged position on the floor.

“We still have time for lunch, we could, um, maybe eat together? If that’s okay I mean! You could help me figure out a name for him?” “You don’t have one already?” replied Jon, surprise in his voice “Uhhh not any suitable ones, no” Martin laughed awkwardly.

He couldn’t exactly say he’d name the poor blighter after Jon. He doubted Jon would take it as a compliment and he didn’t want to ruin whatever fragile peace they’d stumbled onto.

He held out his hand to help Jon off the floor. Jon eyed it, before bringing his own hand up and placing it into Martins larger ones. Martin pulled him up and held back a small gasp as Jon shot forward quicker than intended, his smaller hand landing on Martin chest.

Jon looked up at him, a small shy smile gracing his lips.

“Beautiful” Martin couldn’t help but think, face and ears bright red.

Jon pulled back, coughing every so slightly into his fist.

“Yes, well, I’ve named a cat or two in my time, it won’t be too hard” “Oh?” teased Martin

“What about Magnus? We did find him here” Jon shook his head at that, crinkling his nose slightly.

“Absolutely not, something more dignified. The Captain maybe?” “Captain?” countered Martin

“The Captain” continued Jon as they began to head back inside

“I suppose the one eye does give him a bit of a pirate look” Martin couldn’t help by laugh slightly as he said it.

“Yes” Jon laughed back

“Dignified but still fitting his nature” And off they went, back into the Institute. Unaware of any monstrous eyes watching them as they simply watched each other. A new, wonderful feeling developing between them.

Neither noticed that they still held each others hands as they made their way to the break room.

And if they spoke of cat names, and toys and flushed deeply when they did notice the hands still entwined, well.

Those moments were only for them.

#the magnus archives #tma #writing #fanfiction #jon and martin both project onto the same cat #cats just sat there like #pls someone fucking take me home #kiss already #jonmartin #god i love soft moments for them #hope you guys enjoy!#pls send me prompts they feed me #my writing

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not-a-space-alien · 4 years

Text

[Best attempt at] A summary of The Magnus Archives. Contains major spoilers up through the most recent episode (168: Roots).

A kind soul wrote this out for me and put it in my submissions box to help me understand the Magnus Archives. THANK YOU SO MUCH and SORRY it took me so long to publish this Dx

Major spoilers ahead for anyone else who wants to read!! But this helped me a lot and I feel like I could keep listening now! Thanks again!!!

Basic worldbuilding details: There are 14 extra-dimensional Entities that feed on fear (Eye, Web, Corruption, Stranger, Spiral, Hunt, Slaughter, End, Vast, Buried, Desolation, Lonely, Dark, Flesh). Various people serve them, and are trying to bring about apocalypses by bringing them into our dimension.

A Victorian guy named Jonah Magnus thought serving the Eye and bringing about its apocalypse would make him immortal. Through trial and error he learned that an Entity cannot be brought through alone, and he needs to bring through all 14 at once. To accomplish this, he needs to take someone (The Archivist) and have them experience EVERY entity - "experience" in this case means "be afraid it's about to kill them."

Until he manages that, he's been possessing various people over the years by means of sticking his own eyeballs in their heads. When the show starts he's possessing Elias Bouchard, Head of the Magnus Institute.

SEASON ONE: Jonathan Sims becomes the Head Archivist after Gertrude Robinson dies. He's set out to make audio copies of all the statements in the Archives, and he uses a tape recorder for the ones we hear because they won't record digitally. He has three assistants, Tim, Sasha, and Martin. He trusts Tim and Sasha but thinks Martin is incompetent.

Martin gets attacked by Jane Prentiss, who is infested by parasitic worms. Jon lets him live in the Archives because it's safer than going home. The worms start showing up around the Institute, but don't attack anyone (yet).

Sasha meets a man(?) named Michael and learns that the worms can be killed with CO2 gas. They start stocking up on fire extinguishers.

Two deliverymen named Breekon and Hope deliver a spooky table and a cigarette lighter with a spiderweb design on it to the Archives.

Jon smashes a hole in the wall of his office trying to kill a spider, and finds a network of tunnels under the Institute. The tunnels are filled with worms, which attack. Over the course of the attack, Jon and Martin bond a bit, Jon and Tim get partially eaten by worms (mark 1: Corruption), Martin finds Gertrude Robinson's corpse in the tunnels (she was murdered), Sasha gets killed and replaced by a monster that was bound to the spooky table (Not!Sasha), and Elias triggers the Institute's CO2 fire represent system, killing Prentiss. Jon swears to find out who murdered Gertrude if it kills him.

SEASON TWO: Paranoia time. The whole season is basically one long "who killed Gertrude" murder mystery, in which Jon suspects literally all of his coworkers. He works with Basira and Daisy, the two police officers assigned to solve the case, and starts to realize that Gertrude was deeply embedded in the supernatural world (and had access to explosives).

Major events include: Jon investigates the tunnels and doesn't find much. Martin frets a LOT, Jon thinks it's suspicious, but it's pretty clear that he just cares about Jon. It's also revealed that he lied on his CV, and isn't actually qualified for this job, hence his incompetence. Tim becomes very bitter about Jon suspecting him of murder and basically stalking him. Michael shows up again, traps a woman named Helen in a maze of unending corridors, and stabs Jon (mark 2: Spiral). Basira quits the police near the end of the season.

In the season finale, Jon realizes Sasha has been replaced and smashes the spooky table with an axe. This does not kill the monster, instead setting it free to try and kill HIM (mark 3: Stranger). Michael appears and offers him a door into his corridor maze to escape the Not!Sasha, and drops him in the tunnels to fend for himself. Martin and Tim try to find out what Jon's doing, and end up trapped in Michael's corridors themselves.

Jon is saved from the Not!Sasha by a man named Jurgen Leitner, who has a book that can move the walls of the tunnels around (he basically traps it in a wall Cask of Amontillado style). Leitner collected tons of these supernatural books, which are now called Leitners, and has been living in the tunnels for decades. Jon is convinced he's evil, but he reveals that he was working with Gertrude before she died and that Elias killed her. He begins to explain about the Entities, and the fact that Jon works for one (mark 4: Eye), but Jon leaves the room because he needs a cigarette. Elias appears and murders Leitner. Jon returns, finds the body, and flees.

Tim and Martin find their way out of the corridors, find the body, and call the police.

SEASON THREE: Jon is on the run from the police because they think he killed Leitner. He gives a statement about why he always hated Leitner. When he was a child, he found one of Leitner's books, which nearly got him eaten by a giant spider (mark 5: Web). His childhood bully got eaten in his place. Jon is living with his ex-girlfriend, Georgie, while he's in hiding.

Back at the Archives, Daisy (police detective) is convinced Jon is guilty of killing Leitner and Sasha. She's not looking for evidence, she just wants to catch him. Tim is also pretty sure he did it. Martin thinks he's innocent. Elias shows his first hint of supernatural powers by giving a statement about Daisy's first murder, which he just knows without her telling him.

Melanie takes a job at the Archives. She previously appeared to give a few statements. She's the former star of a ghost hunting YouTube show, and now has lost everything due to the circumstances of a few genuine encounters. She recently came back from a trip to India, where (as is revealed later) she was shot by a ghost soldier. She is friends with Georgie.

Basira visits the Archives to try to find Daisy, and runs off again looking for her when she realizes Daisy wants to kill Jon. Martin starts recording statements to "pick up the slack" while Jon's away.

Elias sends Jon statements while he's staying with Georgie, and in a bid to learn more about the supernatural he seeks out various servants of the Entities. Jude Perry nearly burns his hand off (mark 6: Desolation), Mike Crew nearly suffocates him by simulating the feeling of falling off a building (mark 7: Vast), and then Daisy catches him. Daisy kills Crew, and threatens to kill Jon (mark 8: Hunt), but Basira shows up and stops her. They drag Jon back to the Archives.

Everyone confronts Elias. We get confirmation that Jon can "compel" people (force them to answer his questions) but it doesn't work on Elias. Elias confesses to killing both Gertrude and Leitner. Everyone finds out Sasha was replaced during the Prentiss attack. Elias blackmails Basira into joining the Archives under threat of getting Daisy arrested; then turns around and blackmails Daisy into doing his dirty work in exchange for Basira's safety. He reveals that if he dies, or if the Archives are destroyed, anyone who works for the Institute dies too. Elias tells Jon he needs to stop the "Unknowing," which is a ritual the Stranger's servants are trying to complete to bring about the apocalypse.

Jon goes back to Georgie's; we find out she had an encounter with the supernatural when she was in university and now she literally cannot feel fear. Jon is confronted by Orsinov, a living mannequin that works for the Stranger. Orsinov tells him to find a taxidermied gorilla skin she needs for the Unknowing otherwise she'll kill him. He decides to go back to the Archives to get help, but on the way is kidnapped by Orsinov's goons. Orsinov says she's decided to use HIS skin in place of the gorilla one.

He's trapped for a month, and is eventually rescued by Michael, who reveals that he was one of Gertrudes's assistants before she sacrificed him to stop the Spiral's ritual. He wants to kill Jon, but as they are going into his corridors he is replaced by Helen (the woman he trapped in season two) who decides to drop Jon at the Archives instead.

Jon decides to follow in Gertrudes's footsteps to try and find the gorilla skin (to destroy it). He visits an Archive in China, and several locations in America. He is kidnapped by Julia and Trevor (Hunters) and gets on their good side. They let him talk to Gerry Keay (goth ghost that the fandom goes wild over). Gerry gives Jon the rundown on all of the fears, and explains a bit more about Gertrude. Jon agrees to release him from this world by burning a page of the book he's trapped in (this angers Julia and Trevor, which is important later). Jon goes back to England.

They find the gorilla skin in Gertrudes's old storage unit (and explosives), but it has been destroyed. Orsinov exhumes the bodies of Gertrude and Leitner to use their skin instead. There's a stretch of waiting where not much happens.

Jon, Tim, Basira, and Daisy go to a wax museum with Gertrudes's explosives to blow it up in the middle of the Unknowing. Martin and Melanie stay in the Archives to steal the tape with Elias's confession on it and get him arrested for murder.

At the Unknowing, Basira makes it out alive. Daisy kills Hope (one of the deliverymen from season one) but Breekon traps her in The Coffin (this has shown up in several statements before; it's an artifact of the Buried and traps people underground forever). Tim sets off the explosives and dies, while Jon ALMOST does in the same explosion. He ends up in a coma instead.

At the Institute, Martin distracts Elias while Melanie steals the tape. Elias taunts him about his feelings for Jon, then forces knowledge on him about how much his mother hates him (his mother's in a nursing home: caring for her is why he couldn't go to university and had to lie on his CV). Melanie succeeds in stealing the tapes and Martin barely restrains her from killing Elias.

Elias reveals that Jon is trapped in a nightmare realm where he constantly relives the statements of the people who have told them to him directly (not the ones that are written down). He is arrested, and Peter Lukas (servant of the Lonely) becomes the Interim Head of the Institute.

SEASON BREAK: Six months pass. Three major events occur: Martin's mother dies, Jared Hopworth (servant of the Flesh) attacks the Institute and is trapped in Helen's (Micheal's replacement) corridors, and Peter tells Martin that he'll protect the Institute from further threats if Martin works for him and isolates himself from everyone else. Martin, more than a little suicidal due to his mother's death and the man he loves being in a coma, agrees.

SEASON FOUR: Martin's plotline is revealed in drips and drabs throughout the season, and is easier to tell all at once. Basically, Peter convinces him that there's a 15th Entity, Extinction, that is about to emerge into the world and kill everything. This is based on research done by Adelard Dekker, one of Gertrudes's allies. Peter says that Martin is the only one who can stop it, because he has been marked by the Beholding and he is getting closer and closer to the Lonely as he isolates himself. This is enough of a threat that Martin sticks with his plan despite several opportunities to leave.

Jon's plot starts with Oliver Banks giving a statement in his hospital room and telling him he's too human to live, too much of a monster to die (mark 9: End). If Jon decides to stay human he will die; if he gives into the Beholding he will live. Oliver leaves; Jon wakes up. Georgie is disappointed that he gave into the Beholding, and walks away. Basira is cold and practical, following in Gertrudes's 'ends justify the means' logic. She is watching Jon closely, and prepared to kill him if he becomes dangerous. Melanie is boiling with anger and tries to attack Jon whenever they're in a room together.

Jon reads a Slaughter statement and knows (by supernatural means) that Melanie is becoming a servant of the Slaughter because the bullet that the ghost shot her with is still in her leg. He and Basira perform amateur surgery to get it out. Melanie stabs him in the shoulder (mark 10: Slaughter). She is, understandably, furious, but she becomes calmer as she heals and she starts going to therapy.

Breekon (the surviving deliveryman) drops off the coffin. Jon displays a new power by extracting a statement from him. He learns that Daisy is still alive, but trapped in the coffin. Basira leaves the Archives based on information from a "source" (Elias, though Jon does not know this yet). Jon learns that he can go into the coffin and get out again if he has an anchor to the real world. He tries to cut off his own finger, fails, and under Melanie's advisement finds Jared Hopworth (Flesh servant who attacked when he was in a coma) in Helen's corridors. Jared removes two of Jon's ribs (one to keep and one for Jon) and gives a statement (mark 11: Flesh).

Jon goes into the coffin (mark 12: Buried) and finds Daisy. She is much more clear-headed than before, because she has been separated from the Hunt for so long. Jon cannot feel his anchor (rib) at first, but the signal is amplified when Martin places a bunch of tape recorders on top of the coffin. Jon leads Daisy out, and both are extremely confused by all the tape recorders.

Jon and Basira find out that the servants of the Dark might be trying a ritual in Norway, and head off to stop them. On the way, Jon forces a sailor on the boat they're on to give a statement. Basira is disturbed, but doesn't try to stop him. (Back in the Archives, Martin hears from another person who Jon took a statement from, and is rightfully horrified.) In Norway, Jon and Basira learn that the Dark's ritual failed the same week Gertrude died, though there's still an artifact - the Dark Star - left from it. Jon destroys the Dark Star by literally just looking at it, though it nearly kills him (mark 13: Dark). Helen gives them a shortcut home through her corridors.

Martin leaves a tape of his conversation with the person Jon took a statement from on Basira's desk. Jon confesses that he's done this to five people. He promises not to do it again (from this point on, both he and Daisy grow weaker as they try to resist the Beholding and Hunt, respectively).

Jon, Basira, Daisy, and Melanie visit Hill Top Road (I cannot even begin to explain Hill Top Road, there's so much going on and there's no answers yet. Best I can say is it's been strongly affected by both the Web and the Desolation, and there seems to be some warping of reality in the basement.) They find a statement from Annabelle Cain (main servant of the Web) that's basically one long taunt to Jon about how the Web may or may not be orchestrating everything. Main takeaway from this is that once he starts reading a statement, he cannot stop.

Jon finds out how to quit the Institute, via an old tape from Gertrude. Her assistant, Eric Delano (Gerry Keay's father) escaped the Institute by gouging out his own eyes. Jon runs to Martin with this information and begs him to run away together, but Martin refuses. Jon tells Melanie, Daisy, and Basira. Melanie decides to act on this information, and puts her eyes out with an awl. She goes to live with Georgie, who she is dating by this point. Daisy and Basira stay in the Archives.

Season finale, Peter launches his plan. He and Martin head into the tunnels under the Institute. While down there, Peter frees the Not!Sasha and sends it to attack the Institute. He brings Martin to the Panopticon of Milbank Prison, and explains that Jonah Magnus's original body is still in the center of the Panopticon watching EVERYTHING. Elias shows up (he escaped from jail) and reveals that he IS Jonah Magnus. Peter says that Martin needs to kill Jonah's original body and take his place. From the Panopticon, he will be able to learn how to stop the Extinction (it will also trap him there forever). Martin realizes he's been manipulated and refuses, because even though the Extinction is a threat he doesn't want to sacrifice himself just so Peter can win against Elias. It is revealed that Peter and Elias formed a bet: if Peter could get one of the Institute staff to willingly join the Lonely, he would be allowed to kill Elias and take over the Institute forever. Since he failed (Martin is close to the Lonely but doesn't entirely serve it) he instead traps Martin in the Lonely, and then goes in himself.

Meanwhile, Jon finds out that the Extinction isn't as immediate a threat as he thought, and that Martin has gone with Peter to complete his plan. Jon tries to get help from Georgie, Melanie, and Helen, but all refuse. Basira and Daisy inform him that Elias escaped from prison, and they find a tape revealing that he is Jonah Magnus. All hell breaks loose at this point. Julia and Trevor (the Hunters from season three who he stole Gerry's page from) show up to try to kill Jon, and they run into Not!Sasha, which has escaped from the tunnels. Basira and Daisy tell Jon to run and help Martin. He does. Daisy makes the decision to lean into the Hunt again, and makes Basira promise to find her and kill her once it's all over. Basira agrees (unwillingly) and runs. Daisy attacks the Hunters and Not!Sasha.

Jon finds Elias at the Panopticon. Elias explains where Martin has gone, and Jon dives into the Lonely after him (mark 14: Lonely). Jon meets Peter in the Lonely, takes his statement, and kills him. He finds Martin and manages to save him.

Jon and Martin flee to one of Daisy's old safehouses in Scotland. Twenty-two days after they arrive, they receive a package that they think is from Basira containing a bunch of statements and tapes for Jon. Martin leaves to take a walk, and Jon reads a statement. It turns out to be from Elias (Jonah) explaining his whole plan with marking Jon with the Entities and various ways he manipulated events so that that would happen. Jon is unable to stop reading, and at the end of the statement is an invocation that brings all fourteen Entities through into the world. Martin makes it back to the safehouse, and they watch the world end together.

SEASON FIVE: Jon and Martin are still in the safehouse. Martin wants to leave and kill Elias, Jon wants to stay at least a bit longer to grieve the world. They could stay forever: they no longer need food, water, or sleep to survive. Jon's been constantly relistening to the tapes from the package that was delivered, and there's some backstory revealed in them: Gertrude had planned on Sasha being her replacement once she died, and had made a tape with all the information she would have needed to stay alive. She suspected that if the Entities came through into the world, they would be here to stay, and that things like space, time, and the laws of physics would stop working. There's also some nostalgic stuff with Tim and Sasha.

Jon gets hit with the knowledge that the safehouse is not actually safe, and is feeding on Jon and Martin's fear of losing each other. He and Martin agree to leave, setting out on a quest to kill Elias and try to save the world.

The structure of this new world is revealed: each fear has taken up a domain in which it is the primary source of fear for the people trapped in it, and Jon and Martin need to pass through all of them before they can get to the Panopticon and Elias. So far they've been through the Slaughter, the Corruption, the Stranger, the Buried, and the End. People are only dying in the End; in the others, there is no escape from the horror. Any time Jon gets too close to one of these domains he is overwhelmed by the fear and needs to give a statement about it. The first time, Martin just stuck his fingers in his ears, but since then he's been going on walks so he doesn't have to hear.

Annabelle Cain (Web) tries to call Martin via a payphone; he doesn't pick up.

Jon realizes he can know basically anything he wants to, and Martin asks him a series of questions, learning that: Daisy is Hunting between the domains; Basira is chasing her, planning to kill her but starting to doubt that; Melanie and Georgie are in London but he can't see them clearly; Elias is in the Panopticon; Jon and Martin are safe, traveling like they are; Jon can't see Annabelle AT ALL; and the world can be turned back if the fears are removed, but the fears can't be destroyed as long as there are people left to fear them.

Helen shows up to "check up on the happy couple" and try to make friends. Martin asks if her corridors can give them a shortcut to London, but Jon's powerful enough that he would hurt her if he tried to do that. She leaves.

They run into the Not!Sasha in the Stranger's domain. It threatens them, but cannot actually hurt them. It taunts them about Sasha, and Jon kills it. Martin is very impressed.

Helen shows up again, and explains that there are two roles people can take in this new world: afraid or feared. Jon has the ability to make something that is feared afraid, and doing so destroys the feared things utterly (this is how he killed Not!Sasha). Martin wants to go on a murder spree killing any monsters they come across; Jon does not. Helen leaves again.

While Jon is giving a statement Annabelle calls Martin on a cellphone. He answers, and she offers him help. He refuses and hangs up.

Jon reads Martin's mind and learns about the conversation with Annabelle. Martin is annoyed, and Jon promises not to do it again. They stop for a rest. Martin starts wondering about Gertrudes's past, and Jon launches into a statement about it: one of her assistants fell to the Web and killed a bunch of her other assistants, and Gertrude never trusted anyone after that. It is also revealed that if an Archivist dies, their assistants are free to leave the Institute without gouging out their eyes.

Jon and Martin are both disturbed by the statement and by the fact that neither of them could stop it. Jon explains that Gertrude would have lost purpose in the apocalypse without anyone to trust, and that Martin is giving HIM purpose. He also explains that all servants of the Entities have a domain in this new world. His is the Panopticon, and Martin DOES NOT want to know what his own is.

The most recent episode was the End's domain, run by Oliver Banks (the guy who woke Jon from his coma). This statement explained that the End is still killing people permanently, and there is no new life coming into this world; therefore, the End will eventually start stealing victims from other fears. This will ultimately deplete all human and animal life which will kill the Entities themselves and leave an empty universe.

UNADDRESSED TOPICS:

What do the Spiders want? It's surprisingly easy to leave out any traces of the Web's influence from this summary, but Jon is still carrying the cigarette lighter with the web design from season one and he doesn't seem to notice it, several important tapes he's found have been covered in cobwebs, and Annabelle is clearly targeting Martin.

Random plots that have less impact on the main story! This completely skips over characters like Mikale Salesa and Maxwell Rayner, and other oft-appearing but easily missed background people. If there are any in particular you're curious about let me know, but I don't THINK any of them are going to show up again.

Random plots that I don't know if they're going to have an impact on the main story! Agnes Montague, Gertrudes's assistants, everything with Hill Top Road - I have no idea what about their stories is going to be important from this point forward. Maybe everything, maybe nothing.

My askbox is always open if you've got any questions (@cirrus-grey). This is a broad summary that misses out a LOT of details!

#tma #the magnus archives #long post #spoilers #tma spoilers #the magnus archives spoilers #cirrus-grey #submission

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batfamily--headcanons · 4 years

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I really want to understand this universe(the golden era I think) so could you guide me on which comics I should read

I will first admit that I am no expert on comics and I’m not particularly good at keeping track of the different eras. However, I can give you a list of what I think are some of the most classic Batman/Batfam/DC stories and the ones I just adore.

Batman: A Death In the Family-Classic story, everyone pretty much knows of this story but not everyone has read it. This is when Jason Todd (Robin #2) is brutally murdered by the Joker and it is the first introduction to Robin #3, Tim Drake. It gets really weird in the middle, when the Joker becomes an ambassador for Iran, but stick with it because Tim’s introduction is one of the most interesting Robin origin stories.

Batman: Death Of the Family-This is a different story despite the way too similar name. It’s newer and more gruesome than you might expect. This is the story where the Joker taunts the entire Batfamily and kidnaps them all. It has the whole Batfam in it which is what made me want to pick it up and read it in the first place and is definitely a great way to understand the characters as all of their greatest fears are revealed in this story. There are multiple issues spanning across different series from Batman to Red Hood and The Outlaws, so I definitely recommend getting the trade paperback of it because it’s easier than hunting down each issue in order.

Batman: The Long Halloween-This is such a classic story with lots of Batman Rogues running around and causing mayhem. They’re also speculating that this is potentially what the new Robert Pattinson Batman movie is based on, so it might be good to read if you’re excited for that movie (I have mixed feelings, but I’m hopeful). Also as a huge Agents of SHIELD and comic fan in general, I love so much of what Jeph Loeb does.

Tom King’s current Batman run-Pretty good until the wedding issue and then shit goes off the rails fast and it angered a lot of fans, myself included. Nevertheless, it did have some great moments. He also wrote Heroes in Crisis, which I do not recommend at all.

Batman:The Killing Joke-The animated movie did this story so dirty and I will always be mad. It’s one of the many possible Joker origin stories and the most popular by far. It’s not a very long story, but it absolutely regarded as a classic and it is when Barbara gets shot by the Joker so it’s also important for a major change in canon as well. Solid writing, beautiful art. I could go on about this forever. If you do decide to watch the movie, skip the first half, it’s ridiculous filler (with a ridiculous 90′s stereotypical gay character to boot).

Dick Grayson as Agent 37-This was a pretty fun storyline all things considered. It’s great if you want to fully understand Dick’s character without getting confused about the baggage that is having all of the Batfam characters around. For some people, they get the Robins easily confused (part of that is DC’s fault for literally drawing the same character but just taller or shorter) so it shines the spotlight on Dick.

Red Hood and The Outlaws (The one with Roy and Kori)-I so badly want to recommend this because I love these characters together, but Lobdell’s writing is not always spot-on and his depiction of Kori is comic book misogyny at its finest at times. Maybe read the first few issues just to get a better feel for post-Lazarus pit Jason, but it’s not the best series.

Red Hood:The Lost Years:I am a slut for Jason Todd angst, I won’t lie and so this is one of my personal favourites and it helps to establish resurrected Jason’s character to new readers. You really see how he struggled after his death and Talia al Ghul is there too which is even better. Jason is one of the most interesting and complex characters in all of DC comics and they almost never do anything exciting with his character so this series is a breath of fresh air.

Batman:Under the Red Hood-This is about Jason’s return to Gotham after being resurrected and it’s great. The conflict between him and Bruce once he learns that it’s Jason under the hood is so well-written and you find yourself agreeing with both of them to an extent. Another great Jason Todd story. There’s also an animated movie based on this as well and it’s pretty good all things considered (I have Jay’s speech to Bruce at the end memorized so that should tell how much I enjoy it).

A lot of the new 52 stuff is not great. Tim’s new 52 Titans team were just kind of meh and like I said, Red Hood and the Outlaws had potential but was brought down by not so great writing. I wish I could remember some good Tim or Damian stories right now, but I’m blanking. Super Sons is newer, but I liked it quite a bit. It’s about Damian, Bruce’s blood son, and Jon Kent, Superman and Lois’ son fighting crime and going on adventures together. It’s a nice bit of fluff in the darkness that comics has become these days.

Harley Quinn (The Jimmy Palmiotti/Amanda Conner series)-This one is probably one of my favourite new 52 releases. I love where they’ve taken Harley’s character, she’s more than just the Joker’s girlfriend and this series shows it. It’s not too serious and most of the time, it can be downright weird, but it’s so fun you can’t help but love it. I own every single issue from the Conner/Palmiotti run. I haven’t read it since they left, so if anyone has, let me know if it’s any good because from what I did see of it, I wasn’t super impressed.

I do have some non-DC recs too so I’ll put them here as well because why not

House of X/Powers of X-The best X-Men story in recent memory and I love the X-Men so much so this makes me so happy. They’ve done some very interesting things with the characters and I love the acknowledgement that Franklin Richards is technically a mutant and the catty way that Cyclops does it is great.

House of M-One of the best X-Men stories and probably what WandaVision will be taking a lot of inspiration from. If you like alternate universes and reality bending, this is for you.

Matt Fraction’s run on the Hawkeye solo series-This is what made me fall in love with Clint and Kate as characters. It shows that the Hawkeyes are not useless Avengers and it has a bit of humour to it, which I love. The Kate Bishop follow-up to this is pretty good too, but I haven’t finished it yet so I can’t vouch for the whole series.

Deadpool Killustrated Series-This is just Wade murdering his way through the Marvel Universe and then through the classic literary characters that those characters were based on. It’s dark, funny, strange story that’s a whole lot of fun without having to worry about keeping up with 80 years of canon.

I hope this helped in some small way. I am always up for talking comic recommendations since none of my real life friends care about comics. If anyone has any recommendations for me, I am all ears. I read stuff from all over so brand is no issue. I don’t really feed into that Marvel vs DC stuff anymore. Both companies have their strengths and weaknesses and that’s okay. It’s really late here and I’m procrastinating writing a paper so do forgive any spelling errors or completely incoherent sentences :) Stay safe everyone!

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moonlitgleek · 6 years

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Thank god someone finally said it! Catelyn was a HORRIBLE wife, a worse mother, and an even worse person. The most tragic and overlooked aspect of Ned's story is that he got saddled with her. It made his life miserable, and brought ruin to his house and seven kingdoms as a whole. Getting his head cut off might even be a mercy compared to coming back home and living the rest of his life with THAT. Then again, if it weren't for her, his head wouldn't have been cut in the first place.

Sometimes I really hate this damn site.

You know, it’s people like you that cripple discussion of nuanced or complicated characters through the tendency to take every bit of criticism as a confirmation of your hate and an invitation to spew it all over everyone. I shouldn’t be wary of openly criticizing a character for fear that those who hate them would misconstrue my words and use it to fuel their nonsense arguments, which happens near every time I think to criticize someone, especially when it’s a female character. Even when I specifically say that that I don’t think this character a bad person like in this case. Did you miss the last paragraph of my post? Did you miss the entirety of @secretlyatargaryen‘s post? Because it has been reiterated that Cat is not a bad person or a bad mother. The point is not to bash Catelyn as you seem interested in doing but to point out that her actions with Jon are wrong and that they affected more than just Jon. But I guess I shouldn’t be surprised that someone who calls a woman “that” as if she is some thing and who seems invested in blaming her for everything she does is only interested in using our criticism to disparage and vilify Cat.

By the way, your message is as factually inaccurate as it is disgusting, anon. Let’s break it down.

Fallacy #1: Ned was saddled with Catelyn.

In a society that cares not a whit about women’s consent or feelings, it’s almost amusing that you think that it’s the man who gets saddled with the woman. Between Ned and Catelyn, guess which one had any kind of power in the situation? Ned. Hoster Tully might have demanded that Ned honor the betrothal to Catelyn as a price for his support in the war but it was still Ned’s choice to accept or refuse. But the rebels needed the Riverlands if they wanted to win the war, you say. Sure, and Ned made a choice for strategic reasons, but he still had the space to make the choice. Do you think that Catelyn did? Do you think Hoster bothered to ask her if she minded marrying the brother of the guy that she has been betrothed to for years and grew up expecting to marry? Do you think he bothered to consider that it’s callous to marry his daughter off so soon after her betrothed died and to his own brother? And even if he did, a woman who was raised with Family, Duty, Honor so hammered into her psyche and who, like every other woman in Westeros, was raised on how her place was to marry someone of her father’s choosing stands no chance. The system is broken and Catelyn Tully is as much its victim as any other woman in Westeros.

Fallacy #2: Catelyn made Ned miserable and his death was a mercy compared to being with her.

What an egregious (and delusional) thing to say that Ned is better off dead than being with the woman he loves and the children he adores. What an awful thing to say that anything pertaining to Ned’s death is a mercy. The man’s death was a knife to the hearts of his wife and children, but you think it’s better for him than the company of the wife he literally spends a book yearning for. That’s messed up.

I don’t know what book you’ve read or what you’re basing your claims on, but in my copy, Ned Stark is a man who clearly loves and values his wife as a person. He builds a sept for her because he respects her and wants her to have the comfort of her gods. There is a great deal of affection and comfort that shines through their interactions, and clear evidence in Catelyn’s second chapter in AGoT that Ned seeks and enjoys her company. In my copy, I see a guy who shows tremendous political trust in his wife that he leaves Winterfell and the North in her hands when he leaves with the expectation that she would continue Robb’s education and who trusts her to start mobilizing the Northern banners. I see a guy who reacts in wonderment to seeing Catelyn in King’s Landing, and constantly reflects on how he wishes he is with her during his tenure as Hand. I see Catelyn occupying Ned’s thoughts in his imprisonment that one of his regrets is that he’ll never see her again. If that’s being miserable, sign me up. For more of Ned’s so-called misery in his marriage, please refer to this post.

But Jon Snow, right? Yes, but Jon Snow. Jon’s presence has always been a point of conflict between Ned and Cat but that does not change the nature of their relationship. No one says that a loving happy marriage doesn’t have its problems or that it has to be perpetually conflict-free. Also, don’t forget that Jon’s presence in Winterfell was by Ned’s own decision. I’m not saying that Ned was wrong to bring Jon to Winterfell and I’m very sympathetic to his reasons and respectful of his desire to do right by an innocent child, I have a lot of respect for the man precisely because he acted as a father to Jon and gave him a family. But I’m under no illusion that this didn’t come at Catelyn’s expense, which is something that Ned himself was aware of. I am critical of how Cat treated Jon Snow, but it’s important to see that she wasn’t in the best situation either, because this is just another sign of how little control or say she had, even in her own home. The entire situation was inherently imperfect but while I do fault Cat for taking out her lack of control on the one person who had less control that she did and who also happens to be an innocent child, I’m not unsympathetic to her pain and anger over Ned’s indiscretions or to her fear for her children. The patriarchy says that Catelyn should accept that her husband would cheat on her, that this is a situation that she has to accept and has no right to change because her husband has the power, that she can’t be angry and resentful of Ned for the situation. For the sake of her marriage, for the sake of her children, Catelyn had to let go of her anger towards Ned but that anger does not disappear just because she pushed it down, so she redirected it onto the living reminder of her husband’s nominal infidelity who also happens to be a reminder of her lack of control. That is not an excuse for her actions with Jon that are objectively wrong but it is an explanation that shows that Catelyn is not inherently a bad person. She is a victim of her society and its social construct, which is one reason that makes her abuse of Jon gutting to me, since Jon is also a victim of their society and its social construct. Cat took her own disadvantage on the one person who was more disadvantaged than her. I can’t fault anyone for having negative feelings towards her over that particular situation since she was essentially kicking down at Jon and taking her problems out on a child, but this is far more complicated than “Catelyn is an evil person”.

Fallacy #3: Catelyn was a bad mother and person.

People are more complicated than the binary of “infallible” and “monster” that you seem to be operating on. Good people can make grievous mistakes regardless of their good intentions, and it’s not like those mistakes suck out their morality with them. Catelyn’s parenting wasn’t perfect. She pressures Arya to conform out of a conventional viewpoint and a desire to see her daughter lead a good life (as does Ned, btw), but ends up harming Arya. Her grief over Bran’s fall and coma and her exhaustion in keeping a vigil by his bedside puts pressure on Robb and hurts Rickon. Her abuse of Jon echoes through the family and inadvertently hurts her own children. Even the well-intentioned fail sometimes. Would you care to hear about the times Ned did too?

However, it remains that Catelyn’s entire character is build around her love for her family and her dedication to her children. She throws herself between an armed man and her comatose child with no thought to her life. She is constantly tormented by her distance from Bran and Rickon and blames herself for not being there for them. She is literally the only one who thinks that Sansa and Arya’s lives are worth trading against Jaime Lannister’s. She wants nothing but to send Robb to safety when she meets up with his army but recognizes that this would be extremely bad for his position. She bargains for Robb’s life while injured and spares no thought to her own life in the process. She refuses to accept that Arya is dead and holds out hope for her return. She champions Robb’s cause and does her level best to guide him, but also affords him space to grown on his own and is greatly proud of his leadership. No, I don’t consider Cat a bad parent at all, even with her mistakes. Those errors were a result of parental frailty and misguided protectiveness.

Questioning Cat’s personality in general doesn’t hold up either. She defends and befriends Brienne. She tries to reassure Edmure that their father loves and is proud of him. She feels guilty after Rickard Karstark kills the Lannister prisoners and feels his accusations acutely. She empathizes with Jeyne and reassures her of her place despite her displeasure with the marriage. She feels sadness for Mya Stone’s innocence over her doomed love with Mychel Redfort. There are places where Cat’s empathy fail her but if I denounce everyone who has a moment of failed empathy or who ever does a morally questionable thing, I’d be dismissing every single character in this entire series as a bad person. There are no perfect people in GRRM’s narrative, so what makes Cat’s imperfections specifically worthy of condemnation?

Fallacy #4: Catelyn should be blamed for Ned’s death, the ruin of House Stark and the Seven Kingdoms.

Right. Tyrion’s arrest. That did not start the war because the war was already in the works before the royal family even arrives in Winterfell.

I’m growing increasingly irritated with the tendency to blame any random Stark for the war which builds on deliberate dismissal of what everyone else was doing that led to the war. Sorry to say but the war was inevitable even if Catelyn never seizes Tyrion. It was inevitable because Stannis knew that the royal children were illegitimate and was preparing for war. It was inevitable because Renly knew that the royal children were illegitimate and was preparing for his own takeover. That guarantees a showdown with Tywin and the rest of the Lannisters no matter what, and puts Stannis and Renly on opposite sides. Don’t forget that Littlefinger and Varys were invested in pitting the Starks and the Lannisters against each other for their own gain as well. The entire situation was a powder keg waiting to blow long before any Stark stepped a foot in King’s Landing.

Blaming Catelyn, or any Stark really, for the War of the Five Kings and all it brought only serves to exonerate those who are responsible for it. Jaime and Cersei have an affair, pass their children as royal heirs and kill to maintain that fallacy. Jaime pushes Bran out of a window and Joffrey tries to have him killed. Cersei plots to have Robert killed and puts her plan into motion before Ned even finds out about the twincest. Baelish encourages Lysa to poison Jon Arryn and frame the Lannisters, then lies about the owner of the dagger used in the attempt of Bran’s life. He betrays Ned to Cersei and conspires till he gets Joffrey to kill Ned. Tywin Lannister sends men to burn and pillage the Riverlands, then plans with the Freys and the Boltons to murder Robb and his army at a wedding. Balon Greyjoy decides that avenging himself on a dead man is the height of power and embarks on an idiotic campaign in the North. Theon betrays the Starks and seizes Winterfell. Imagine having all that awfulness and all these contributing players to the war, but somehow finding the war Catelyn’s fault. Yes, I know the reasoning is that her arrest of Tyrion put the Starks and the Lannisters in open conflict and “made” Tywin attack the Riverlands. Except that Catelyn is not responsible for the fact that the Lannister go-to method is to commit war crimes and go stabby. A normal person could have protested Tyrion’s arrest to the king and painted the Starks as the aggressors but no, Tywin Lannister makes his own laws and he chooses to take it out on the Tullys’ smallfolk. That’s on him. Also, are we going to pretend that the Starks and the Lannisters weren’t already poised for a conflict after two attacks on Bran’s life? Or that Ned’s discovery of the twincest and his execution on Joffrey’s orders wasn’t going to drag the Starks into the war anyway?

Fun fact: of all the fighting factions in the War of the Five Kings, it’s Catelyn Stark who tries repeatedly to put a stop to the war. She pleads for peace in Robb’s council. She tries to broker an alliance between Robb and Renly, and points out that no one but Robb is doing a thing to protect the people against the Lannisters. She tries to get the Baratheon brothers to unify and reach an accord because common sense says that they all of them have the same enemy, and their conflict benefits no one but the Lannisters. Catelyn does not start the war, but she sure tries to end it. Sadly, no one listens to her.

Now please don’t come to me again with your victim-blaming, character bashing arguments.

#asoiaf #valyrianscrolls #catelyn stark #ned stark #robb stark #arya stark #sansa stark #bran stark #jon snow #hoster tully #the war of the five kings #stark family dynamics #ask box #Anon asks

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unexpectedreylo · 5 years

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Vanity Fair Summer Issue: Let’s Break It On Down

reOkay, first off, I can’t think of the last time I was really happy to be wrong about something. I didn’t believe for one second they’d play the Reylo card this early in the game. I didn’t think they’d play it AT ALL before the movie’s release.

Instead, they hopped on a big Reylo semi-truck and crashed it through the front windows of all doubt. Sure VF Senior Writer Joanna Robinson is an admitted Reylo but it’s not like she ordered writer Lev Grossman and photographer Annie Leibovitz to pull a gun on the cast so that they’ll give us all the Reylo we want or else. If you can’t figure out by now that Reylo is central to this trilogy and the answer to life, the universe, and everything, I can’t help you.

The cover photos are of course, stunning. Robinson said there is a hidden meaning in the covers that she wonders if anyone will figure out before the film is released. (I know, LOL, these are Reylos were talking about here.)

They are obviously in the same environment (this new desert planet) and Kylo looks all Lawrence of Arabia/princely/dashing, exactly how you want your villain to appear, am I right? She looks emotional. Maybe they are looking at each other. Notice how light and shadows, twilight and sunrise play across both images.

There’s a lot of debate about this image going on right now. Some are saying they are NOT fighting each other but this looks like it might be the same “duel” portrayed on the Art of TROS cover (notice she’s in the desert, he’s in water) AND on the Loungefly pin art . The difference is in the latter two, Kylo is in a helmet. In this photo, Kylo is not wearing a helmet.

Let me just say this...the above photo is NOT a movie still. Annie Leibovitz always stages her Star Wars photos. It’s not to say this scene won’t happen in the film but it may play out/look differently. For example, look at this photo from the TPM spread in 1999:

Yes, Obi-Wan and Darth Maul fought in the movie but not on Tatooine and defintely not with Obi-Wan leaping about while still wearing his cloak.

Anakin and Padme wore those costumes in a scene together in AOTC and they were standing on that Naboo balcony but they didn’t cuddle in that scene like they do in this photo.

I could point to other VF SW photos that weren’t literal depictions of anything that goes on the movies but are truthful about the character, relationships, and so forth.

What’s really interesting is what the actors and the VF people had to say about Reylo:

“The most important relationship in the new trilogy”

youtube

"Their relationship is the closest thing the new trilogy has to a star-crossed love story on the order of Han and Leia: a source close to the movie says that their Force-connection will turn out to run even deeper than we thought.”

“I think there’s a part of Rey that’s like, dude, you fucking had it all, you had it all,” Ridley says. “That was always a big question during filming: you had it all and you let it go.”

"They’re uniquely suited to understand each other, but at the same time they are in every way each other’s inverse, down to Kylo’s perverse rejection of his family, which is the one thing Rey craves most."

"And then he had been forging this maybe-bond with Rey,” Driver says, “and it kind of ends with the question in the air: is he going to pursue that relationship, or when the door of her ship goes up, does that also close that camaraderie that they were maybe forming?"

"By the emotional logic that governs the Star Wars universe—and also our own—Kylo Ren is going to have to confront the past, and his fears, whatever they are, or be destroyed by them."

"If Kylo Ren can’t be redeemed it will almost certainly fall to Rey to put him down, in spite of their maybe-bond.” (Okay, none of that Jonerys stuff better happen but Rey failed twice to take him out when she could’ve. So that’s something.)

“Will Kylo Ren and Rey reforge their own connection? And if they do, will it be love or simply friendship that unites them? The answer, Driver says, is incredibly complicated: ‘I don’t think it’s any one thing. The strength in what Rian (Johnson) wrote and J.J. (Abrams) wrote is it’s never all one thing.”

From Grossman’s Reddit AMA chat:

“I got a strong sense that this movie goes deeper into the Kylo/Rey dyad but that’s about all I can say.”

From Grossman’s answer to Twitter user Riri:

“I have no spoilery knowledge but I would be surprised if they didn’t take that further. There’s so much powerful feeling and tension there.” Plus a hope that this doesn’t end up like Jon and Dany and being unsure about what Jedi can do with romantic feelings.

Other interesting related tidbits. VF.com first claimed that it can confirm Kylo was fighting the now-revealed Knights of Ren in the TROS teaser but then it claimed it was an error. Riiiight. An error in giving out a spoiler. Driver talks some more about having a clear ending in mind, likely for his arc. Rey finds kind of a quasi family with her pals but is separated somewhat from them because of her Force abilities. Keri Russell was confirmed to be playing Zorii Bliss, who is so obviously a bounty hunter and Richard E. Grant will unsurprisingly play a FO bigwig named Pryde. Fifty bucks says he and Hux will conspire to oust Supreme Leader Kylo. Mysterious omissions: Rose and Palpatine. I think the Luke shot reveals perhaps a full retelling of what happened on the night of Murdergate. Either that or Luke is in hell. Billie Lourd insisted on having scenes with her late mother.

The mag hits the stands on Jun. 4 (May 30 in L.A., NYC, and London) and there’s a crapload of video to pour through over the weekend.

Hat tip to @sleemo, Johnamarie Macias, Riri, klaudia, and benscalligraphy for transcribing, screenshotting, and so forth.

#vanity fair #star wars #tros #reylo #reylo fandom #reylo trash #rey x kylo ren #rey x ben

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