#i invite you to disagreee

[the-feral-one]

(@ask-the-shiny-pokemons) Rimi approaches both Chester and Peseta. She is looking at their suits and smiles.

"Hey! You're lookin' pretty cool in those outfits! Again, thanks for the invite. So, I didn't spot Wo and Oki here... Are they currently preparing?"

Chester acted a little smug after hearing what was said.

Chester: "Many fanks! You don't look 'alf bad yerself!"

Peseta shook their head and gave Chester a nudge. They then focused on how to answer Rimi's question.

Peseta: "There is a tradition with this get-together. It involves the friends and relatives of the two to get married showing up first before they do. I can't say that I agree with this sort of thing, and I've heard that Ogerpon doesn't like it either.."

Chester: "She says it's dumb. 's hard to disagreee wiv that, t' be 'onest - 's not the best way of runnin' a party.."

Peseta: "...but she has found that there is little to be done that can lead to changes, as the local human population wouldn't like it."

They looked at the list, then back to Rimi.

Peseta: "Wo and Oki should be here soon. I'll make sure to inform everyone of their arrival when I see them."

[gammija]

Does 170 confirm Martin’s domain?

I know, i know, it’s been 5 weeks since MAG170, and meta/discourse online currently moves at the breakneck speed of one week/episode... But! recently while discussing tma theories with people the idea came up that 170 definitively confirmed Martin’s domain as the Lonely.

I don’t think that that’s the case however, so I wanted to write this post to explain why I think that.

(Not primarily to convince anyone that I’m right, though that’d be a nice bonus ;). More just so I have all my thoughts down in one spot that I can link to in the future, hah. Also, this post is not necessarily arguing that Martin’s domain is definitely not the Lonely - though that, to be fair, is my bias - only that 170 didn’t confirm it one way or the other.)

[Spoilers up to 175] Okay so

there are a few other assumptions/theories about domains and avatars I’m using for the final conclusion above! So I’ll first try to prove those, and then show how 170 does or doesn’t fit them.

1) Martin actually has a domain, because the question was raised and left unanswered in 167:

Martin: “What about me?” Jon: “Would you… like me to -” Martin: “No, no. Don’t tell me. I don’t want to know.”

If we aren’t meant to wonder which it is, I’m sure there would’ve been some sort of answer or guess from either Jon or Martin. It would’ve been easy to have either of them suggest the Lonely (or even another Fear), or to simply say that Jon only meant full avatars, and Martin doesn’t have one. So from a meta standpoint, the lack of an answer makes it more likely that there is one, and it’s important.

2) Saying that a domain is “[Someone’s] domain” requires that someone to be (on their way to becoming) an avatar of that fear. This is the only way that the word has been used in relation to people in s5, otherwise it’s used as [Fear’s] domain. Never is the domain the property of the victims.

167: Jon tells us explicitly that domain means “the place that feeds us”, and that Gertrude would “have resigned herself to - ruling her domain.” 168: “This is Oliver Banks’ domain.”  

3) An avatar, while they might be conflicted about their actions, does genuinely like some essential aesthetic of their Fear and indulging in it. That’s shown in basically all the known avatars’ statements, and in 111: 

Gerard: “Do you like [compelling people]? Jon : “[...] Yes, I… I suppose I do.”

The only avatars that don’t follow this are Michael and Gertrude. But then again, the Distortion is a unique case - it existed long before it became Michael and was forced to become him, and was forcibly taken over by Helen, who does seem to follow the trend. Gertrude, I admit I have less of a good defence for, though she’s also just canonically hard to read in general - and it is implied that she’s not (as good) an avatar to the Eye as Jon because she doesn’t really have an affinity for it.

The difficult thing about this one for Martin is that our only model for a full, confirmed Lonely avatar is Peter. We definitely know that he enjoys being lonely - but it’s hard to say for certain whether that’s a prerequisite of going full avatar, or just. peter.

4) Avatars enjoy a position of privilege in their domains. That’s evidenced in basically every domain for which we’ve seen the avatar; Jude wasn’t stuck burning, Jared wasn’t stuck in the ground, Simon wasn’t fleeing ‘Junior’ or stuck in it.

(I realize I’m talking a lot about specific word choices and such here, so, sorry for being pedantic :’D But I’m not going to stop, since in my experience, with tma it pays off to be pedantic. (‘why hasnt any ritual ever succeeded’, ‘why are people being weird about Elias being head of the institute’, ‘hey if you count jons scars he's almost got one from every fear lol’, etc are all questions based on small details that turned out to have legitimate answers. specificity matters.)(... Excluding timeline stuff))

Regarding 170

So, combining those three, if the Lonely really is Martin’s domain and he's partaking in it, I'd expect him to have a position higher than those of the other victims, and to be somewhat enjoying himself (even though he’d definitely hate it if he were) or at least not dislike the core idea of the Lonely.

There certainly are a few parts in the episode in which Martin admits to not finding this domain so bad: 

“Sometimes I wonder if I forget things on purpose. Easier not to think about them, I guess. Easier to just let them… slip away. They can’t hurt you if you don’t think about them; they can’t shout at you or call you names.”

“I’m losing myself, and I - and I don’t know if I mind? Maybe I deserve it. So much of what’s behind the fog hurts. So much of it just makes me wanna curl up with pain and embarrassment and - Maybe the fog’s here because I want it here.”

“Honestly, I - I wanted to believe it.”

“It’s comforting here, leaving all those - painful memories behind.”

“It’s the Lonely, John. It’s me.”

… Except that almost all of those are followed up immediately with refutals: 

This one peters (hah) off into Martin panicking over forgetting his Mom’s face, and saying he shouldn’t be there.

“Maybe I asked the fog to come. No. No, no - no, no, no, that’s not true!”

“I wanted to believe it. But I didn’t.”

“But - It’s not a good comfort, it’s - i,it’s the kind that makes you fade, makes you dim and - distant.

“Not anymore.” “- No. No, not anymore.”

On top of that, there are all the times that Martin reiterates that he doesn’t like this place, or being alone in general:

This, This isn’t my house! [..] I don’t like it here.

I don’t like it. Why does my house smell like that, I - It can’t be my house. No, no, no; my, my - My house doesn’t smell like this! My house smells… s-smells different.

I shouldn’t be alone; there should be people!

I don’t know why I’d decorate my house like this; I don’t like it! I like - (breaking off) Wh- I, It’s not my home; it can’t be. [...] I don’t like it here.

Where am I? This isn’t right; I shouldn’t be here.

I don’t like this place.

It certainly doesn’t seem like the kind of place that somebody called Martin would live. Martin. It feels like a small name. One that wants to be warm and happy. Not like here.

[The entirety of his last paragraph before Jon finds him]

I should add that a lot of Lonely victims (13, 48, 108) like their solitude, so Martin occasionally liking being alone doesn’t preclude him from being a victim.

Furthermore, Martin doesn’t seem at all to be in any better position than any of the other Lonely victims: 

“They’re all trying to remember. T-To recall, to picture someone, anyone who loves them, and their hearts are all full of fear. Afraid that those people are gone forever. That maybe - maybe they never existed at all.”

That describes Martin’s experience this episode almost exactly, except that he hasn’t been there as long, and has both an Eye avatar and some tape recorders looking out for him.

He doesn’t sound to me like an equivalent to other avatars in their domains: he sounds like the victim.

Other counter arguments: 

I’ve seen the argument that the privilege Martin gets here, is the knowledge of all those other victims.That him knowing that they exist, and what they’re struggling with, proves that it’s his domain. Honestly though, I think that’s not a very strong argument, seeing as he explicitly says he’s seen them, which makes sense as he’s been able to see victims in other domains as well. And describing their experience isn’t that hard either, seeing as he’s just had a similar one (and has prior experience with the Lonely to boot). So there’s an easy explanation for how he knew this, without the Lonely having to be his domain.

There’s also the idea that in 170, “house” is a metaphor for domain, and since Martin occasionally thinks that it’s his house, that means that it’s his domain. Two problems there:

he spends just as much time saying that it’s not his house.

the (other) victim he runs into also thinks it’s their house at first.

So while I think the idea has merit as an analysis, it still doesn’t definitively prove Martin’s domain one way or the other.

*DEEP INHALE*

SO! In the end, 170 to me is anything but conclusive about what Martin’s domain is, and hopefully at least was able to show why I think that way. TL;DR: 

If the Lonely were Martin’s domain, he should be like the other avatars in theirs, not stuck in it as a victim;

Martin in 170 seems to be a victim;

Therefore 170 doesn’t confirm that the Lonely is his domain.

[chickenkooks]

Okay so in light of the most recent chapter I’m wondering what your own real life philosophy/practices are when it comes to the girl code (i.e. you can’t date your friends ex’s and if ur friend calls dibs for a future fling b4 u, you can’t move in on that person even if things don’t work out with ur Friend or they liked u and not ur friend)

well usually i dont have to deal with this because i like to keep my relationships far away from my friends. as in i dont like to date people in my friend group. i meet people OUTSIDE of them and usually keep them to myself for a while before introducing them when i feel comfortable enough to do so!!!!! i have liked my friends or even my friends boyfriends in the past (whoops) but i never said anything just because of how messy it is and i dont usually pursue my flimsy feelings like that bc i get scared when they return my feelings LOL