#i honeslty do think transandrophobia isnt something thats come to fruition but. its important

[transmandrake]

I wrote out a longer version of this that made no sense but. Trans people arguing on whether theyre seen as their chosen gender by others is such a tiresome thing.

Like yeah I do agree that trans women arent seen as men and often are seen as women

But I do not think this is a good thing or that thats a core component of transphobia and transmisogyny specifically

Because

1. the corollary 'so trans men are seen as men' is simply not true. Trans men largely are not seen as men, or even women imo but often as women.

2. Transphobes, largely, when they see trans women as women... Do not. See women as people, or worthy of true personhood. Yes even if said transphobe is a woman.

Transmisogyny I do not like as a word because I think all transphobia is misogynistic. If it wasnt, trans men would be seen as men largely. But they are not.

All trans people are seen as women in typical transphobia, because 'woman' is lower on the ranks than 'man', and therefore are placed as low as possible, where possible.

More specifically, trans people are seen as inhuman, where possible. This often means being seen as women. Because misogyny.

This is also why, even though I, generally, really like the *productive* discussions the concept of transmisogyny and transandrophobia have fostered, I dont think they are useful terms, because all transphobia is an intersection of sexism of all flavours. That is what it is. If men were seen as lesser, trans people would be seen as men. And, while fringe, yes, and not systemic, people who see men as lesser see trans people as men. That's all.

Digging deeper into it, pretty much nobody has discussed enbyphobia as the real intersection of transphobia. Trans people are seen as outside the binary, and this does not contradict people who say there are only two genders at all... because gender is a piece of humanity. To these people trans people are not human enough.

That might sound like im contradicting myself but it isnt. Whichever gender is closest to inhumanity is what people will see trans people as. There are two genders, lesser, and human.

This is also why it causes so many arguments, and why they arent productive. If a trans man is insisting theyre seen as a woman, and a trans woman is insisting theyre seen as a woman, they are not at odds. They are in agreement that they are percieved as our current societies lesser category.

I don't think insisting a trans woman is seen as a man is transphobic, and insisting a trans man is seen as a man is decidedly not gender-affirming, because, while fringe, lots of trans people are, whether theyre aware or not, are in sexist circles, who do, in fact, see men as lesser in personhood. Sure, misandry isnt systemically a thing, but sexism is not purely targeted at women.

This is also why I think the 'Trans X are X' phrase is not useful or truthful. Insisting a trans woman is a woman to many peoples ears is affirming a trans woman's lesserness. Insisting a trans man is a man is often a weapon against them expressing their multigendered experience.

Trans men and women are not always men or women. They are always people. Worthy of personhood. Insist upon this above all.

I think more productive action can be done if all this is kept in mind, and we stop eating ourselves in finger-pointing.