#i don't want to piss off more ppl with all that discourse

[olderthannetfic]

Im neither a proshipper nor an anti at this current stage in life, but at one point i was an anti i guess? And I hate it say it, but looking back, I understand why. I don't think I actually gave a fuck about Harmful Fanfic or whatever, it was just a substitute for therapy that i couldn't get at the time (because "literally neurodivergent and a minor" or whatever, but like...actually literally neurodivergent and a minor LOL).

As weird as it sounds like, no one cared about my ACTUAL PAIN, and that made me feel EVEN MORE PAIN, so i took it out on ppl who shipped "abuse", or whatever.

It's so stupid now, as an adult who is mentally better than I was then, but as ridiculous as it was, seeing someone ship an "abusive" ship or a "queer erasing ship" (like a canonically gay character with someone of the other binary gender)...it felt eerily similar to the actual abuse I was facing and the stress that everyone was putting on me to find a boyfriend or ask why my (closeted lesbian) self didn't like any boys.

But it was so much easier to keyboard warrior about how people who ship Bad things are Bad people, than it was to fix any problems in my actual life because...well, the actual problems in my life COULDN'T be fixed. That isn't a learned helplessness thing, there was genuinely nothing I could've done. So pissing off Shippers was, like, a vessel for that, and it *felt* like I was getting to lash out at the same people who were ACTUALLY hurting me, even though that obviously is not the case. Funny thing is, it wasn't actual fandom discourse that made me switch sides, it was getting to learn more about youth liberation movements and stuff, because it was then that I recognized the actual structures that were making me hurt.

I think one silver lining is it's made me more compassionate an adult. While I don't have any defense for the antis who do actual horrendous stuff like doxxing or sending death/rape threats, etc, I do have a lot of defense for the ones who were like me and would just make posts talking about how Wrong it is to ship certain things. I know that not all antis are in the same place that I was once was, and some are just genuinely immature brats, but it's like. . . I get it, you know?

The cycle of abuse/bullying is weird and it's not often a 1:1 "I had an abusive parent so now i'll be an abusive parent", sometimes it's the chronically online stuff like I did. It's also why I'm careful-careful to not engage and to just block or, even try to have a mature discussion if I can, and if the person I'm talking to is just "a little bit annoying" rather than "actual bully doing/sending illegal stuff". A lot of them just want to be heard, I think, and it really makes me sad that this is the way they choose to be heard...but also i get it, because i was that.

--

Yup. We often discuss anti tendencies in this framework.

People want control over their environment when they have none. They want the world to make sense and for there to be simple rules they can follow to Never Mess Up. This is a very common reaction to trauma and also typical of brains that like order and neat boxes and a world full of justice and logic.

The trouble is that a critical mass of "I'm just pointing this out" type posts does tend to make all the other teens with an issue around moral scrupulosity implode. (And let's be real, plenty of the antis themselves are secretly into dark content and are trying to pray the gay kink away.)

I have some sympathy, but I'm still going to tell people they're sealioning when they are and tell them they're flat out wrong about how fantasies work, not sugar coat it because they're probably a delicate teen. There's no need to be excessively mean or treat people as irredeemable, but I also don't like how we talk endlessly about compassion for teen antis and not for teens targeted by antis. It's similar to how there are all those complaints like "Hey, I work hard to manage my mental illness, but all the support seems to go to people who are letting their issues rampage..."

[darkship-selfship-confessions]

I wish the proselfship community was more creative. Most of the posts I see are like "oh an anti said x thing" or just talking about incest only. Meanwhile, antis posts are a lot more cool and creative, but I can't interact with them. When I finally see a nice post in the proship tag, it's usually written "stolen from an anti", this is quite sad.

ill skip queue to talk about this, because this pisses me off. i wholeheartedly agree, by the way.

i complain about antis a lot, sure, but pretty much my entire for you tab is filled with screenshots of antis accounts, poking fun at them (even if they are in the wrong), making fun of the shit antis say, talking constantly about how much we hate antis and how they ruin fandom, and its frustrating because, if you're going to complain about that, why don't you do anything about it? its just a constant stream of "I hate antis, I hate antis, I hate antis" without contributing anything to fandom even a little bit. i have this account which I use as my contribution to the selfship community.

and with the stealing posts, sure, sometimes its nice, especially if its from an account that's pretty popular, but its so frustrating because sometimes that's not all I want to see. and there's so many people that do that.

the proship community can be worse than antis sometimes. do you know how many antis I've scrolled through the blogs off that don't say a word about proshippers? and these are the people that make creative and fun posts too. do you know how many people I have on my blocklist that are proshippers that almost all they do is post about antis? i would wager that's harassment. just because you post something with a name blacked out doesn't mean you cant find those accounts in seconds. and I have, and I've seen proshippers on their accounts posting mean and rude things.

i hate antis, let me be clear about that. but over the last three or four years, I've started to grow so resentful towards this community because its FILLED with regurgitated discorse. its all we ever talk about anymore.

and this as well, i like incest as much as a lot of proshippers do, but there's recently been this wave of ppl either A) shitting on people who like darkships or B) shitting on people who don't. this community has become so split that its overwhelming sometimes. no one has to like darkship! and its tiring having the narrative of "either you like it or you don't and one of you is in the wrong" pushed as heavy as it has been recently.

because this isnt what proship is. if we really wanna be the good community that we can be, stop filling every stereotype that antis push on to us. try to make a space that people like to be in, stop bringing discourse into everything! "but antis do that-" yes! you are no better than them. id wager you're worse.

i am a proshipper through and through, but with the rape threat I got from another proshipper literally yesterday pretending to be an anti, coupled with all of this nonsense, sometimes I think about leaving.

[fatcatlittlebox]

I see so much discourse on X about Celeborn and as a multi shipper it's quite annoying. I don't think people realize that Haladriel isn't going anywhere. In fact, when you compare all the established canon couple fanworks against all the protagonist/antagonist (even anti-heros) fanworks in ALL SERIES/BOOKS/SHOWS/ETC TO EVER EXIST, there will always be more of the latter simply because of 2 reasons: the what if's to be explored and the forbidden aspect of it. I wish ppl would calm down. I also find it silly when I see my own mutuals dunk on Haladriel over the 'toxic' aspects and it bothers me too since I like both ships. Unlike Celedriel, you guys can take a Sauron & Galadriel relationship (in all sense of the word, not just in a pairing context) and take it in ANY direction you want, with enough creativity. You can write them as friends in an AU, or even before they became known by their names (like her meeting Mairon before he became Sauron). You can write S1 and S2 (even 3-5) divergence fics, redemption arcs, dystopia fics, crack fics, dead doves, or even fluff (like off-stage AU where they're not enemies off screen). Heck, since you guys got the mind palace thing, and with her growth over the ages, you can even find ways to make non-AU fluff/hurt&comfort (maybe when they're both tired of this endless fight of the ages because it's a stalemate and he wants to repent but he can't due to Morgoth's corruption and he knows it?). Haladriel has a cosmic connection, and I think this implies that even if one of them dies, it will still exist somehow even when they pass into the Undying lands. Haladriels don't understand how much advantage they have with being portrayed by actors with amazing chemistry, an established and growing fanbase, an entire season without any kind of background conflict that takes the focus away from them as their relationship was explored and developed, having it all: UST, 'acquaintances fighting alongside each other to become friends' and the 'friends-to almost?-to enemies' aspect, and there are even Tolkien's writings that confirm he is capable of redemption. I've even seen well-written fan theories on ways that he can redeem himself too. It's like star-crossed lovers baked into every kind of trope that ppl like to explore. Really, I don't understand how it's not obvious enough. Yes, she ends up with Celeborn, and they are happily married and their relationship is secure and comfy. I know that may sound boring to some, but that's why I like Haladriel too, because their relationship isn't confined to only one narrative, unlike Tolkien's works. Yes, you can argue that Haladriel has a doomship narrative because they don't end up together, but the appeal of doomships is that you can DO so much with it in fanon, even completely reverse it (as I've seen in fanfics already). If you tried to do something similar with an established canon ship where they are supposed to be happily married, it doesn't make much sense, unless it's for angst. Celeborn is just a humble normal elf and he doesn't have any that. He just trying to vibe, support Galadriel, and not piss anyone off lol. And I say all of that as a pro-Celeborn fan lol. Sorry for this long rant, I just wish they would leave my poor silver clam alone ;_; and for fans to stop fighting.

I agree 💯 with all of this. That’s why I can happily digest all forms of haladriel. Modern AU, canon divergence, coffee shop fluff, Sauron redemption arc, socially awkward Mairon. All of it. And thank peanut butter and bagels the fanfic writers in this fandom are bar none some of the best fucking writers I have ever read. We are so lucky.

[coolspacequips]

I think it's so reductive to say Shuro only liked falin while disliking laios bc he wanted to "fuck her", kind of a bad faith read and needlessly crass like...

It's a good point that ppl react to autistic traits differently depending on how attractive they perceive a person, but I think what happened w shuro and laios is a larger conversation about how boy autism manifests and is treated vs girl autism, a conversation I've seen gaining traction re: the fact that ppl filter their Perception of autism thru a male white filter, and that girls have a drastically lower rate of being clocked early if at all, and that ppl struggle to even conceive of say a brown girl w autism (this of course being in the simplest language without getting into a more complex look at genders and other social dynamics and how that intersects w neurodivergence)

Also along those lines, I think it's a larger conversation on how men socialize vs women, stereotypically. Of course men feel deeper feelings than they are often given credit for, for patriarchal bullshit reasons. It's common for ppl to express that "men don't need/want to talk about their feelings", which they do and benefit from of course, but that doesn't remove the fact that they often are socialized not to, and don't always get the support they need to talk about them well. It's a common thing and used to be a common media trope that bad tension might simmer between two guys, then they get into a physical fight and the air is cleared and they are friends again, hell it happens it shonen all the time, and in text that's a version of what happened with Shuro and laios. They didn't know how to discuss it, things came to an emotional head in a charged moment, they threw hands for a bit, then that release cleared Shuro's head enough to reconsider his perceptions and the two have a much more level conversation.

This of course all without touching on how I and a lot of others read Shuro to be autistic as well, and how lots of fans are determined to read him in as bad as faith as possible and can once again only clock white boy autism, where laios gets a pass for any boundary pushing that he does, but Shuro is evil for not being able to express or understand some of his feelings until they come out at crit mass, or struggling social conventions

This also discredits his feelings for falin so much where I get everyone wants to hate him for being het or whatever, but I get the impression that he saw the things that were strange about falin and liked her because of those things, that she was someone who was kind to him without the same over the top energy that overstimulates him when it comes to laios, and having shown no romantic interest in anyone in the past, fell in love. He isn't creeping on her and trying to see her body and grope her for comedy beats or anything, we see him looking at her with eyes full of love as she plays w a bug she found on the ground, and we know she saved him from a nightmare in the past, which we saw involves waking someone from a dream about their greatest trauma and helping them cope with it. This stance that he's just trying to fuck her undermines these things, misinterprets what is overall a pretty chaste romance, and cheapens the fact that falin is THAT LOVABLE. He loved her because she's lovable, and despite having a horrible childhood where she was assigned no worth, the reality is that a group of people love her so deeply as to risk everything, which is something you often kind of wish for when you were an ostracized nd person like she was

IDK this whole post is a rambling unedited mess I just saw some post about this that pissed me off LMAO IDK why this fandom is so determined to deny shuro any personhood, I try to just brush this discourse off but it's hard when the topics of discourse can remind u how rampant fandom racism is constantly 😔

[dayurno]

sorryyyy for bringing some type of discourse to your inbox but I just giggle whenever anyone brings up the fact that nora soad andrews a misogynist and their only argument is the fact that he's friends with renee and dating neil who said women are the strongest ppl i know, like i don't personally think he's a misogynist, but i feel like there has to be better arguments for it😭

maybe it's bc the fandom gets on my nerves so I'm more sensitive to any attempts a defanging and making characters more palatable bc I'm not a fan of the widespread fanon versions of the characters also it's sad I feel like the fandom made some sort of progress where discussions were being had about the problems in the series and now after tsc came out it feels like we're back to where the author can do no wrong and it's hard to criticise anything

what do you think about tsc being a triology, I feel like two books can hopefully give Jeremy the depth he needs i remember you found him a bit flat as well when you read the book, I see a lot of people saying he needs to have a mean side or a traumatic past but I feel like a kind, nice character can be interesting without those things and not every kind character needs to have this secret mean side anyway, personally I groaned out loud when I found out it was a triology bc that would mean the fandom would be alive for longer and it's so crazy out of any book fandom I've ever been in for some reason the aftg fandom feels the most obnoxious maybe it's bc the books deal with heavier topics close to the heart so there's more feelings involved🤔the only book fandom who has pissed me off a comparable amount would be asoiaf but that's a whole different thing

I really do try and be happy I'm not even in the fandom anymore and I've never followed aftg twitter accounts and I don't even check the tags I just go on certain blogs but i still see things it's horrible💔like I can't believeeee we're still discussing if Kevins a coward or not and how selfish he is for leaving the nest like we've already argued about this to death on tumblr back in like 2016 now it's the same thing again💔

LOL i understand honestly so many of these discussions are repackaged wide-spread 2015 opinions which don’t reflect the original text that it’s hard to do anything except use the we have this thread every week comrade image and let it go. andrew being misogynistic is not even hard to come to terms with considering it’s not an interpretation or a headcanon it’s the author’s own words and will for the character incorporated into canon. there are things to disagree with nora sakavic for, but ultimately there is a difference between disagreeing with the author and willfully ignoring the intention with which a character was written

& i didn’t really care much for the news, i think the lack of planning and the rushed way the books are coming along are grating on both the author and the fandom, but i don’t blame her for wanting to get this done and over with. it will show more insight on jeremy hopefully, but unfortunately i already don’t care 😭 i think the route tsc took was in general uninteresting and pedestrian enough to not warrant a second thought, and i’m not particularly interested in any plotline beyond what pertains to kevin and the ravens. what surprised me really is the total lack of impact tsc had on the fandom, which is to say, i think it was so in line with the same 3-5 headcanons passed around the last 10 years that it has genuinely done nothing for anyone aside from the people who were already very invested in jean and/or jeremy. it feels like a different fandom from aftg altogether, which i’m happy about if only because it keeps us all locked in different cages, but it still baffles me to see people dedicate so much thought to a book whose characters bar jean are, as of now, the very definition of Nothing burger. all in all the answer to that question and most questions pertaining to tsc is Who cares. because literally who cares

LMFAO staying away from aftg twt is really good for you & honestly all of us. it’s still so funny to me that not even nora sakavic herself wanted to touch that mess. mentally ill white suburbanite teenage shut-in echo chamber ass fandom

[sethdomain]

want my shipping takes that ill still probably get hanged for??? here we go. theyre basically all "everyone chill out" ...it seems like most people are just submitting ships theyd get cancelled for, not takes on shipping. ill do that after in case i completely misread what you were asking for

if ccbeeduo didnt want to get shipped they shouldnt have made their characters get married and have a son and fall in love. natural byproduct, really shouldve expected it. i still think ppl should have chilled fr but like, they both had plenty of examples of what fans were like, they shouldve taken that into account before making those character decisions.

cdapduo discourse was absolutely batshit insane and everyone who posted with a banner saying either "slime is quackity's son and if you ship them you're weird DNI" OR "they keep flirting, if you call slime quackity's son you're weird DNI" pissed me off. how about no one's weird because actually its a roleplay with lots of different perspectives and you can do whatever you want forever . obvs i understood people who were like "i believe this thing, dont fucking yell at me for it" but it sucks that people had to make banners for that fr.

in the same vein, the discourse with emeraldduo. though that one i dont/didnt see as much, i did still see those same banners. even as a family sbi fan, i never saw someone shipping emduo and thought "yeah let me go yell at them and tell them not to interact with me because i personally think theyre family-coded." the devotion is ambiguous but powerful.

Heat Waves was the funniest fic ive ever read because idgaf about either of those guys so it was just like 20 chapters of some guy crying and jacking off and then getting rejected.

i think rarepairs are based as fuck and mischaracterizing guys to fit your ship is fine do whatever you want forever!!!!!!!! people complained to hell and back about fanfics tagging characters and ships and them being ooc . WHO GIVE A FUCK THEY WROTE THAT SHIT FOR FREEEEEEEEE!!!!!! ALSO MANGOBALL'S MONSTER/CHEATER CHEATER WAS A MASTERPIECE

karlnapity was not perfect polyamory i see people glossing over the fact that when they first talked about polyamory quackity started attacking and biting when karl and sapnap kissed and thats fucking FUNNY i want to see more of THAT.

sorry for writing so much i have a lot of opinions

JESUS ANON, honestly idgaf bro i take any spicy opinion as long as its not going straight to 'i love pedophilia/incest' territory that my only rule man

For beeduo, idk if u mean the cc ship or the c ship cause honest to god i was a huge inniter back then and dont follow their stuff closelt that much, but im just gonna assume u mean the rpf cc shipping. Honestly, I don't really agree with ur take, its a bit victim blamey, both ranboo and tubbo were like young and in their naivety expect their fans to uphold their boundary to just not ship them in a rpf way and i think you should've respected their wishes man. You sometimes gotta be reminded that dsmp was just them guys having fun and if they want to rp as a husband then whatev man :p

I agree bruh, i think people were just sscared of a little doomed faggot in action

phil and techno doesn't even act like father/son in the dsmp canon anyway, they act like old bestie

imma be fr idgaf abt heatwaves but that sound awesome

sometime the back of my mind say that, but the evil demon that wants everything to be perfect take over anon.. its hard... I need to get mad at people...

no cucking is allowed in karlnapity... #lame

[yutaholic]

i feel like you’re the only person who might not take offense to this but I feel like jaehyun would be just a liiiiittle too self centered to be a good partner to anyone. He’s 26, insanely famous, and a global campaign model for one of the most famous fashion houses of all time. I catch strong vibes from him that he knows just how cool and hot he his and ppl like that usually don’t have the humility they need to be good partners. Idk. Thoughts?

I'm not offended lol none of these boys pay my bills I ain't dick riding for any of them. Idk why people would get pissed off over harmless discourse but... actually yeah some get pretty amped up defending their idol's honor so to speak 😅

I think it's important to remember everyone has a dark side but idols are not allowed to ever show or express theirs. They gotta be the perfect boyfriends caricature to fit into the SK culture over there of being products and not actually people. They're not allowed to make mistakes. They get criticized for not shaving for fuck's sake

That being said no one is perfect. We all have negative aspects to our personalities. At the end of the day, we only see a glimpse of the carefully cultivated personas their company wants them to have. That's why with hypothetical questions like this I always say "gives me vibes like" instead of saying something definitive. It's fun to speculate but beyond that we just don't know.

Do I think he's a raging narcissist? No. That would be pretty hard to hide on camera 24/7. Do I think having pussy being thrown at him from every angle might make him a bit smug? Absolutely lol I honestly haven't gotten super self-centered vibes from him.

If I recall correctly some of the placements in his birth chart have Jaehyun being quite materialistic, so he may be a cold lover that is not in tune with his partner's emotional needs. He also does not take criticism well, has a hard time expressing himself and prefers to stew about it in silence which can lead to big issues in his interpersonal relationships because he's more likely to ghost you than work things out.

(I'm not saying he's like that - I'm just reiterating what I remember from his natal chart for discussion purposes)

[kenobster]

😈💖

thank you for the ask!!

😈 Has there been a point in a story where you did something just to be playfully mean to your readers?

Damn this is a good question, and I am CERTAIN I have done this, but I can't remember examples... and even if I do, I don't think they'd be from this fandom. Maybe I'll come back to this lol.

On a tangentially related subject, I can think of examples of times I wrote things to be playfully (or sometimes seriously xD) mean to commonly held fandom opinions in general. For example, Five Peggats Each was NOT going to be post-Hardeen at all.... not even a little.... not until every single Hardeen fic/post/opinion pissed me the fuck off and I was like "okay we are gonna do this MY WAY now" lol. For another example, Every Shadow (big bang fic) has unfortunately become my antithesis to every single post-Zygerria fic I've ever read (99% of these fics are incredible and favorites of mine, but they have gotten Obi-Wan & Anakin's relationship slightly wrong... in my not-so-humble, unsolicited, biased, and frankly rude opinion lol.)

I often have a terrible relationship with fandom discourse and fanon concepts in general, and I've started unleashing these personal vendettas in my writing lol (mostly to stop myself from unleashing them in public).

💖 What made you start writing?

I started writing from the moment my infant hand could hold a pencil lol, so this is an impossible question to answer. xD But "what made you continue writing?" could be fun.

When I was a kid/teen, it was probably fame-driven, like... "I want to create a story as beloved as [insert whatever book I was obsessed with]."

In my late teens/early twenties, that wish morphed into, "I want to finish something, become published, and make it a career." So still fairly fame/success-driven.

Writing fanfic was partly because it was a low-stakes way to practice and/or a quicker way to get validation aka dopamine. But in the background, fanfic (writing and reading) became a really good way for me to figure out what kinds of stories I love and why....

Thus, began an obsession with trauma and recovery in writing that was enhanced while I studied in university. At that point, it became not fame-driven (finally, thank god), but more "I want to do good; I want to help; I want people to have stories that can heal them, that they can relate to, that can make them feel heard." But I still coupled that goal with the same fame/success-driven rubric I'd been using... which complicated things in an emotionally unhelpful way I think.

Which eventually exploded into a sudden backlash era in my late twenties, during which I rebelled against all of the above reasons... All I wanted while writing was to "satisfy my id/hurt the blorbo/do whatever I want." My joke is that I wanted to write the trashiest fanfic tropes but in a realistic way, like crack taken seriously lol. It was (is?) a lawless time lol.

These days though, I think I just want to have fun. I already know I like writing. I already know what subjects I like to write about. I already know I can get better at certain techniques/tropes/skills that I want to get better at. I already know that ppl can be touched/affirmed/etc by my writing. I already know that the very skewed understanding of "success" that capitalism taught me is optional. So I don't really feel a need to question these things anymore.

At this point, I continue writing just because I want to. It makes me happy. Both to write something and to read it afterward. And that's about it.

[harryshmjr]

I read on another blog that Dominic Sherwood has always been messy though about the Malec ship tbh and regarded Alec's feelings for Magnus as a second choice and said maybe his character should be gay. I could have information from that old interview wrong though. Honestly, I don't want the actor to apologize but shut the hell up. He is so transparent to me. He stans Maia x Jimon and isn't even here for Clace at all. That is nothing but pure bullshit coming out of his mouth. I don't claim him.

I never shipped Clace either but to even try to compare it to a bland, ship with little to no chemistry, development or communication he is trapped in with Clary is just illogical. The discourse is strong and I read some of the interview on tumblr but his comments isn’t surprising even though he is really wrong and clueless about ships that has nothing to do with his character. It isn’t surprising like I said. Apparently he has always been messy about Malec. I just laughed the interview away.             

One more thing! These discussions are great about the interview. I rebooted a SH related post on my blog related to Malec and how fans will disregard a ship that isn’t white or straight. The LGBT and especially interracial/poc ships always have to work harder to be seen as “valid,” acknowledged as a whole compared to others. That post really stuck with me when I see discussions and it so relevant. Malec are in love period. I’m not LGBT but I’m a black fan girl of many things. I get it. I think.            

i haven’t heard much before because i started watching sh right before s1 finished. and i haven’t joined the fandom properly until like 2 months later or sthso i wasn’t following everything the cast said in the pastso i don’t have any opinions on that, unless i get to see/read the interview etc.

the thing is, celebrities often say shit but at the same time they’re just people so i try to give them a chance to apologise and get better. we all make stupid mistakes. but despite that, i still think what he said was incredibly wrong and it shouldn’t have happened because it’s wrong on so many levels

it did came across as simply being petty and jealous because others get more recognition and even though book stans are in love with clace, show fans (in huge majority) don’t care or even hate that shipit’s important to realise that while books are basically about that het ship, the show is not. and a huge part of this fandom consists of lgbtq+ people who will obviously care about same-sex couple. also, a huge part of this fandom consists of poc who will obviously care more about poc characters. we always look for characters that will be our rep and we relate to them so i don’t understand why some people find it hard to understand

but yeah, it’s true that couples that aren’t het and/or white always struggle much more with being recognised.

[aetherknit]

He literally said "I don't want people to take this any way"

He would "feel weird if people were talking directly to him or talking about him in a conversation.." (He trailed off but it's clearly like about other pronouns)

He said - and guys pay attention to this - "I feel like my pronouns are he/him". he did emphasize "my", and only said he/him in this sentence

Just because he doesn't feel uncomfortable doesn't mean it makes him comfortable!! Your pronouns are valid no need to force them on other people!!

This isn't directed at you ofc I just wanted to give some quotes from the stream when I saw you didn't watch this part haha

actually super appreciated anon thank u so so much for the direct quotes like i cannot brave the embarrassment of those donos ToT <3333 i wish desperately that ppl could read subtext.... im not trying to argue dream will scream and die if u call him a they/themmie but if it feels like he (for some reason) wont BLATANTLY say hes against they/them for himself there might be a reason beyond "omg hes trying to communicate to 70k ppl secretly that hes nonbinary and im the only one smart enough to pick up the vibes"

anyway. MORE PRONOUN DISCOURSE ASKS BELOW

no okay because smth that pissed me off sooo bad about ppl getting defensive about "omg dream is all pronouns he told me himself" is that i never said ANYTHING abt what ppl do in their own priv spaces like.... personally i find it a bit odd if its beyond jokes but if i went crazy over everything i found "a bit odd" in mcyttwt i would never stop. BUT ASKING DREAM DIRECTLY...... like IDDDCCC ur justification -- ITS WEIRD!!!! anyways in essence: i agree

yeah thats the right term dont worry!! i agree.... ultimately it kind of sucks because i know a lot of these ppl come from a desire for validation and i empathize but its suchhh a terrible outlet for it </3

^ grouped because i have nothing to add except i agree and u are all so smart.

OMG no worries + i appreciate u supporting me....... to be honest i would do it if i was fighting on tumblr but those twitter ppl are bloodthirsty like ive seen what they can do (shivers) im not afraid to admit that i will lose to a mob of stans crying wolf(self)

but genuinely u bring up a great point about how equally dehumanizing it can be to project onto ur streamers like they arent real people with feelings. tbh i dont really understand why those ppl are in this fandom at all sometimes if they arent satisfied with who their CC actually is

THATS WHAT HE PREFERS . USE THOSE. how hard is it :sob: its funny bc twitter stans are genuinely so afraid to speak out against this kind of thing too -- despite getting absolutely destroyed (100+ qrts in 30 minutes im honestly still in shock that my tweet could be SEEN by so many in such short time ?!?!?!?!) i ended up gaining ten followers...... like i was expecting to be on 50 blocklists but ppl who agreed just silently followed to avoid joining me in the depths of hellfire ifg

[ijhyo]

may i ask why are you ot6 ? i’m only curious !! i come in peace 😊 [ also that emoji was sincere istg 😭😭 ]

PLSGFDHDD don't worry ur okay 😭

im gonna use this as My Official response to this question so i can redirect ppl here if they ever ask me again.

simply, the whole nword thing with heeseung way back in 2021. if u don't know what happened basically in a now deleted (or at least the part is gone idr) en behind video thing, somebody was singing sza’s love galore and sang the nword. lots of discourse about whether it was heeseung who sang it or just some other person and blah blah blah but i think it was him (like u know what he sounds like, let's be real)

now is that my whole reason for not liking him? not really but even if it was i think its enough, but yk there's MORE 😯

honestly the handling of that situation was literally so shit and every time i think about it i get so pissed off. you had nonblack engenes gaslighting and being so fucking racist to black engenes expressing their disappointment (the shit they were posting they lucky i never passed them in the street), you had the pisspoor damage control being done by the members (how convenient jake got a photo with layla to share and won going live in the same 48 hours) and the icing on the cake being belift completely ignoring everything and releasing a statement talking about how they "protect their artists" and blah blah

i dont gaf if u (engenes in general not u specially anon) think he did or didn't say it, but i dont want to hear anything if u aren't black. even if it were to come out that he didn't say it as much as i would be like "oh okay sorry for shitting on u and stuff" i still wouldn't be able to like him again bc of all the other stuff that surrounded it yk? (bc what do you mean u going to post pictures of l*nchings to defend somebody who's TOO DAMN GROWN to be saying the nword like okayyy)

so yeah that's just #ME i dont fw him bc as far as im concerned he DID say it but even if i thought he didn't his fans and engenes r nasty as fuck and i dont like them and he gives me the ick now

[aprillikesthings]

For the ppl who peek at my Tumblr after reblogging my landlord post:

“#landlord discourse” is my tag for posts on the topic

“Your post is very us-centric” yeah I know but the problem is everywhere

“Not all renting is bad” I know, but housing is a human right and shouldn’t be used for profit

“What do you propose as a solution” besties I did not intend to make myself an authority on housing or renting, I made a rant post because I was pissed off and it blew up

This is not a discourse blog as a rule, it’s mostly fandom and random shit and things about my life, but if you want to follow anyway that’s cool

Edit: If you came here because of my queer love post: I don't generally have a specific tag for queer-related things in part because ...well my whole tumblr is basically Gay Shit. But you can probably just search "queer," just be aware there's fuck-tons of discourse. "our queer history" isn't one I always remember to use but there's history stuff (...and discourse) there!

Edit pt 2, as of Nov 3, 2023: "why can't I reblog the queer love post" bc I got tired of people intentionally misreading my intent and assuming things about me and my life experiences, more info here, it might not be permanent but we'll see, also for the record I don't want that post screenshot and reposted, here or anywhere else, thanks.

[space-1z-cool]

Rant/Vent

trans discourse, transphobia, bullying, sui tw

You wanna know what i've seen?

I've seen truscum telling non-passing trans people they're cis. I've seen truscum telling ppl to kts for existing as a genderfluid person.

I've seen truscum and transmeds harass nonbinary people and gnc trans people on the internet. I've legitimately seen them bully them on the internet. Because they don't think the person's gender exists. I've seen people speculate whether or not somebody has dysphoria over A SINGLE VIDEO OR PICTURE. and i'm not just talking 'die<3' I'm talking misgendering, harassment, [remember the person who literally almost kts because of harassment from kalvin garrah?? and then proceeded to get harassed MORE at the mental health facility they went to?] like this is extremely harmful. Especially to those who can't pass no matter how hard they try, and to those who may be questioning but are fearful that they'll get called a trender because they can't pass. Or for trans people who have given up on trying to pass and instead dress for joy. [not saying passing isn't joy for some people!!]

Yes, trans people should have easy access to medical care. But that includes ALL trans people who wish to medically transition**, which is something we still have to fight for, especially for BBIA/BIPOC people. [whether they use neopronouns, xenogenders, other microlabels, or they're a binary trans person who wishes to just exist as the gender they know themself as. ]**

But i have also seen people telling truscum and transmeds to "die <3'"

very far, but is also counter productive unless that person has made it very clear that they aren't open to discussion and or has openly harassed and bullied other trans kids/people, then i can see the reasoning behind it although i don't condone it.

I don't understand the exclus point of view at all. /srs it makes zero sense to me. Microlabels aren't harmful to the lgbtq+/queer community. They are to help people find themselves if they want to.

People forcing labels onto others isn't cool either. It's fine to be a binary trans person. it's fine to use non microlabels. But it's also fine to use microlabels, and be a non-binary trans person. I was a transmed when i first discovered the trans community when i was 12.

I have figured out that it was due to internalized transphobia and wanting to be a "good trans" because I really just wanted to be gendered correctly. Now I've realized that i'm genderfaun/gendersatyr, ace-spec, and cinthean/vincean and predominently t4t. And i've realized that I hated neopronouns and xenogenders so much because I knew that if I ever wanted to use them nobody would use them for me. But that is not my fault. And i've accepted that I like neos and xenos.

as a young trans person who couldn't pass due to family situations and i secretly did like skirts still- truscum ideology fucked me up and made me extremely suicidal. and made me hate myself and repress my identity. and i projected that hatred onto others who had the courage to be themselves. [luckily i was 12-13 during this phase so I couldn't harass anyone online for this]

Sure neopronouns don't make you trans, being GNC doesn't make you trans. Using a diff set of pronouns doesn't make you trans. BUT you can be trans and use neos, and be gnc, and use dif pronouns.

Pronouns are a form of gender expression, and therefore do not equal gender. I've never seen a tucute say that "oh ur a tomboy??? no ur actually [insert gender]" In fact i don't think i've ever even heard that from anyone. [for reference me and my entire friend group are tucutes. and we are all trans with some form of dysphoria]

And it really pisses me off, the terf-esque characatures that i've seen truscum use. The fact that they'll go out of their way to misgender people. And if i'm being completely honest

THERE ARE BIGGER PROBLEMS THAT TRANS PEOPLE FACE THAN WHETHER OR NOT SOMEBODY USES NEOPRONOUNS OR MICROLABELS OR IF SOMEONE IS NONBINARY AND ID'S AS GAY OR A LESBIAN.

sOME OF THESE THINGS INCLUDE [tw for m//rd//r, transphobia, hatecrimes, etc]

Transwomen, especially Black, Brown, Indiginous, asian, and other POC trans women getting murdered and hatecrimed and abused for simply existing, and they're the ones carrying the majority of the trans community in activism

Transphobia WITHIN the queer/LGBTQ+ community

Trans human rights

people gettign kicked out of their homes

ppl being outed

Trans rights WORLDWIDE

racism within the trans community

[hotniatheron]

jack rackham

How I feel about this character: I think I ignore him sometimes lol but he's got some iconic lines and he was a fashion icon and also smarter than anyone ever gave him credit for. Also a bitch but every man on this show is a bitch.

All the people I ship romantically with this character: like? the show writers made Anne a lesbian so? Idk I don't like what black sails did with that in regards to Anne and Jack but yeah still think he's just in love with her 🤷‍♀️ they'rethat one skit that'slike we're a semi nonsexual lesbian throuple. Also he was in love with Vane but no one ever wants to listen to me talk about that.

My unpopular opinion about this character: askdjdjsj ppl are gonna jump up my ass abt this BUT re: the above, I DON'T like what the writers did with him and Anne bc in real life they were pretty ride or die for each other and had at least 2 kids that we know of and also had Mary/Mark Read with them so like, by today's definition the real Anne Bonny was probably bi? And it's just like....they fit into the show how the writers wrote them (and like I know okay, I Get It, do not bring discourse into my inbox pls and thx) but also they were even more wild in real life alskdjsk they were so ride or die and yet they were pissing off all the wrong people. Iconic chaotic bisexual energy. Guess I'm just kind of disappointed in that change is all.

One thing I wish would happen/had happened with the character in canon: so (and this is a rough summary so like don't drag my ass for this) in real life Jack had an affair with Anne who was married to a guy who WORKED FOR GOVERNOR ROGERS and Jack had already taken a pardon (and sold out Charles Vane to do it lmfao) and Anne was gonna be flogged for adultery and Jack tried to "buy her marriage" from her husband but he wouldn't have it so they ran off together and I'm just like that's some ride or die shit right there. But also the time period for the show is wrong for that so I know why it's not in the show but like....I would have liked to have Seen It. Also Anne was an adult when she met Jack so that shit in the show was wack anyways.

[istheresomebodywhocanimagine]

Pretty please, would you ship me with the band and the cast? I'm a hetero girl who is a PhD student in Media Discourse. I don't don't like my looks at all and struggle with self-esteem problems. I'm always friendly and kind to people. I hate talking about myself and being the centre of attention. Absolutely clueless in romance and all intimate things, I'm pretty oblivious when it comes to this. Perfectionist. Quiet. I love making jokes and sarcastic comments, books, movies, TV series, walks ^^

HELLOOOOO

hi u sound like a precious BEAN of a human i would genuinely love u if i knew you in person i attach so hard to ppl like you it is 100% my cancer tendencies ALSO HELLO FELLO MEDIA MAJOR I’M AN INTERACTIVE DIGITAL MEDIA: NEW MEDIA MAJOR but not a phd i am a dumb

anyways THE SHIPS R BELOW THE CUT

For the band, I ship you with John Deacon!

You are genuinely made for John, and he is made for you, for obvious reasons.

The biggest reason is your proclivity towards sarcastic comments. 

You had actually been Brian’s friend before you met Deacon, and Brian introduced you to the him after a show one night early on in the 70′s. You already knew the other boys because they hung around Brian’s so much, but Deacon tended to keep to himself and had his own small friend circle apart from them, so he was never around when you were.

Boy, did he regret that once he met you.

Deacon was very shy at first, as were you, but what caught his eye was the effortless way you managed to roast Roger without disrupting your quiet demeanor in any way.

“And then I said to her, ‘you ever seen the ceiling of the back of my car? would you like to?’“ Roger had said, earning a quiet scoff and eye roll from you that almost went unnoticed, save for Brian’s eagle eye. Brian loved to piss Roger off, and nothing would make him angrier than a girl who was unimpressed by his tactics.

“Not a fan, eh?” Brian asked, elbowing you as John watched you curiously, sipping his drink while you cleared your throat, glancing at Roger almost disdainfully, but not in a mean-spirited way.

“No disrespect, but I’ve heard better pick-up lines from a fortune cookie, Rog,” you remarked plainly, taking a drink of your beer as Roger’s face quickly soured, John almost choking on his drink and holding a hand over his mouth as you looked over at him with a smile and a kind gaze. “You alright?”

“Yeah, m’fine,” Deacon spoke from behind his hand, grabbing a napkin to wipe himself off as Roger scowled, still glaring at you.

“What? You think my one-liners are bad? I personally don’t.”

“Don’t you hate it when people answer their own questions? I do.... Oh wait,” you teased, making Roger roll his eyes before he steered the conversation in another direction, Deacon snickering at the purposeful irony in your comment and gaining another wide smile from you before you happily returned to your quiet observing.

After that, Deacon was suddenly finding time to come around Brian’s, and he only ever stuck around when you were there. Although he claimed it wasn’t because of you, Brian was all too aware of Deacon’s partiality towards you, so he took it upon himself to set you up on a blind date with each other, just for shits and giggles.

Much to Brian’s enjoyment, you both hit it off on the blind date when you got the chance to banter by yourselves, and though John’s more affectionate tendencies confused you at first, you grew to love each and every one of his romantic gestures.

He always knew just how to structure them so you wouldn’t feel too put on the spot, and he never drew attention to them - after all, they were for you to enjoy, not the public, so he never made a big deal out of being showy.

When you were still just casually dating before he’d asked you to be his girlfriend, you’d come to your apartment one night after a particularly long shift at work. 

John had come in during that shift to see you, and you were sad to see him go. His smile had the power to make your day loads better, and when he had to leave, you were pretty bummed. 

So, it was a big surprise when you walked into your apartment to see Brian and Deacon in the kitchen, making what smelled like a heavenly pot of spaghetti. Dropping your bag on the hallway floor, you stared at them in partial confusion and partial amazement as you walked in, Brian turning around and jumping a bit before smiling and wiping his hands on a towel.

“That’s my cue to leave,” he mumbled, passing by and giving you a quick, friendly kiss on the head before he was out the door, leaving you alone with a very smiley Deacon.

“What’s all this?” you asked, genuinely baffled at what laid before you. Your table was cleared off - it had stacks upon stacks of books that you’d read tons of times, but never tired of. There were two sets of plates and silverware set out, and you watched as Deacon brought the spaghetti over to the table, sitting it on an oven pad before doing the same with a plate of garlic bread.

“Saw you weren’t having a good day at work,” he replied, “Figured I’d come cheer you up, but had to recruit a little help.”

“Gosh, did I really look that rough at work? I mean, I know I usually look pretty rough, but I must have been horrifying for you to do all this,” you laughed, rubbing the back of your neck as you ducked your head a bit.

Deacon pursed his lips at your small self-deprecating comment, then shook his head as he wiped his hands on the towel as well. 

“You always look beautiful, sweetheart.” His voice was quiet, but sure, and you found yourself blushing as you sat down at the table across from where he was standing, avoiding his gaze. “Hey, I mean it,” he almost whined, sitting down across from you and waving his hand to draw your attention back to his face. “You’re adorable, and you should know that.”

He asked you to be his girlfriend later that night, and spent the rest of the time showering you in compliments to make sure you knew you were gorgeous and perfect in every way to him.

What a little romantic.

Annnnnnd for borhap.... I ship you with Rami Malek!

GOD his energy confuses/scares me so much ANYWAYS

Rami was always your favorite of the friends in the BoRhap group - he wasn’t snobby (here’s looking at you, first impressions Gwilym), he wasn’t too goofy (@ Joe sorry buddy), and he wasn’t absolutely intimidating (Ben looks like he lives, eats, and breathes gym). Allen, Lucy, and Aaron were closer to the others than they were to you, but then there was Rami. He was just Rami, a slightly awkward, mildly anxious guy who loved to be around his friends, but also valued privacy. 

This value of privacy is what initially attracted you to him, oddly enough. Joe, Gwilym, Allen, and Ben were all having a heyday with their social medias, posting dorky pictures of each other and screwing around while you hung back, not wanting to be involved or in any of the pictures.

“You too, huh?” Rami asked, coming to stand next to you as you watched them goof around with each other. You looked over to Rami, shrugging and smiling.

“Not really my thing, honestly.” He nodded and gave you a reassuring smile, looking slightly nervous as he glanced over to the crew as well.

“I’m right there with you. I think my Instagram has maybe 2 posts on it... or is it 3?” he wondered aloud, his thoughtful face making you giggle and shake your head as you hugged yourself. “Want to go take a stroll around the studio instead?”

Looking up at him, you considered for a moment before nodding. “That sounds lovely.”

And from there, you two clearly became each other’s favorites. As much as the rest of the cast would have liked to insert themselves into your friendship to make fun posts about it online, you and Rami always found a way to keep your kinship (and eventual relationship) under wraps. It wasn’t necessarily that you hated social media, it was that you preferred to stay out of the spotlight as much as possible.

Even though Rami was the star, he also preferred the same thing. He didn’t want to steal the limelight when he didn’t feel that he deserved it.

The first stroll you’d taken with him? That turned into a regular occurrence.

Whenever you two had the chance, you were taking a walk together, even if you had no particular place in mind to end it. One time, he took you on a walk that he claimed was completely random, but as you got closer to one of your favorite bookstores in London, you started to smell the hint of a planned location by him.

“I knew I shouldn’t have believed you,” you giggled as you entered the bookstore, Rami holding open the door for you. 

“Hey, I may not be a king of nice gestures, but I tried for you,” he complained playfully, bumping your hip with his before he nodded over to the corner, where there was a small coffee bar run by a single barista you’d come to know by name.

“Hello there, lovebirds,” the barista greeted as you came up, making you blush and Rami rub his jaw in slightly embarrassment. “I’m just joking with you, haven’t seen you two in a while. The usual?”

“Well, you know, filming. And yes, please,” Rami had replied, stepping to move out of someone’s way as they came in the door behind you. His hand came to rest on your mid-back, but it stayed there when the door swung shut. 

You didn’t mind, though. Simple little things like that were preferred by you anyways, seeing as you weren’t a big fan of showiness or grand romantic gestures. Things like a hand on the back, or holding hands was perfectly okay for you - they were easier to understand, and easier to pull off without ending up a blushing mess.

Which, speaking of, you were still currently a blushing mess from the barista calling you two lovebirds. Rami noticed, raising an eyebrow at you gently before smiling and pressing his thumb into your back slightly, just to get your attention.

“What’s the matter? Don’t want to be here right now? We can go if you want.”

“No, no, it’s fine,” you laughed softly, pressing your hands to your cheeks and sighing before laughing again. “Just getting used to the dating thing. God, I feel like I look like a tomato right now.”

“It’s cute,” Rami remarked simply, grabbing both of your drinks before heading over to one of the tables near the back, where you could sit in private and just relax. 

“Me being red as a fire truck is not cute, Rami.” He laughed at that, shaking his head and taking a drink of his coffee as he sat back on the chair that he’d scooted over so he could be next to you.

“Everything about you is cute, don’t lie to me.” You turned even redder, if that was possible at all, and Rami laughed softly as he wrapped his arm around you, squeezing your shoulder before kissing your head. “I’m being honest, really! You’re a cutie, don’t ever forget that.”

“Oh, don’t worry,” you laughed nervously, subconsciously leaning into his touch as you sipped at your drink. “Joe lets the entire Instagram universe know that on the daily.”

“If Joe brings you in here and the barista also calls you two lovebirds... I’m fighting him hand-to-hand. And that’s a fact.”

[runaways-withme]

Kink side

"Ur the same thing as a right wing bigot if u have any reservations towards sexual things."

"Kink isnt sexual at all lmao not a big deal I've seen sexual things as a kid" (so did I and it traumatized me .. just bc u can handle it when u were doesnt mean random kids u never met can just handle shit. Hello.. consent ?)

"I hate all kids yet am making actually minors feel bad while acting like they are such this evil force toward this issue when all they do is have access to a twitter account "

Which is it. Is it okay that its sexual bc being sexual is a huge part of (some) lgbt ppl sexualities [hard agree] or is it not sexual n ppl r making shit it up?

"Its just a leash" that has sexual connotations isnt that the whole point... sex =good but know ur downplaying its importance to ppls identities to act like it isnt an issue if minors see adults

"If u want to protect kids then what abt xyz: x:predatory men (we LITERALLY always talk abt how gross this is all year round y. Sexualized billboards in public (I don't see ANYONE actually be pro-those billboards on here. Just sounds like examples of attacking the wrong ppl ?? ) edit: ppl also used this to call out bigots who made lil nas sexual song a big deal bc "think of the children" when they dont say shit abt sexualized shit involving str8 ppl since they are homophobic. N obv lil nas isn't a child star to begin with)

-the ACTUAL problem is corporations *the other side also agrees with this. U cant say someone's criticisms is ruining the sanctity of pride when it's already been co-opted by capitalism lmao. Rmr when ppl were pissed Ariana made it into a concert when she had no indication of being in the community and is a mega celebrity?

The side against it:

Teens who have weird experiences with adults whether they are LGBT or not . Gay ppl CAN be predatory, this obvious doesnt mean all gay ppl are automatically that's OBVIOUSLY HOMOPHOBIC. But are we forgetting KEVIN SPACEY, CMBYN ??

Not all teenagers have sex bc of obvious reasons of not being mature enough or like u know.. sometimes there are dangerous of it.. so smth on the more extreme side (kink) might be off to them... this DOES NOT mean all sex is bad just giving a POV since ppl do not know how to not make the other side seem automatically evil.

I feel like the first half already explains a lot so I'm also going to say like. If the whole thing is that its homophobic to say gay is inherently sexual bc the whole disgusting stereotype that someone saying it's okay for a kid to be gay is bad bc bigots assume ur saying it in a sexual way (predatory stereotype) not.. just being a kid who is not straight and has a crush ??? then ppl shd be able to handle someone saying to not be sexual in areas where there ARE kids. That's not homophobia that's just common sense .

-the actual cishet homophobes both sides hate who arent even the main ppl in the discourse in the first place. They're too busy being violent over lgbt just breathing air in the first place n they have their bigotry so loud n obvious n their bio so I'd know to avoid them.

I'm trying to understand the whole thing n through this I'm talking to a kinkster who says there should be kink gear at pride just know ur limits on actual acts since not everyone can consent to that. Which I agree with.

Before someone says : 1.well yeah obviously no ones literally having sex : many points above

2. Theres rules n regulations etc.: Pride is different based on where u live which makes this whole thing so stupid bc like all discourse multiple things can be true at once (ur experience DOES NOT negate someone else's) n since when did everyone listen to rules.. this ignores the ppl who DO NOT care when kids are involved at all

Genuinely everyone on one technical side of an issue should all talk to eachother before trying to paint the other side as losers or bigots. ppl are saying things that do NOT line up with their co-discoursers at all but I wld actually agree with even tho I'm technically not on their "side" , but ppl forget theres such thing as nuance lmao