#gaang lite

[the-badger-mole]

Who do you think Dark!Aang would have in his entourage? Do you think he would have bodyguards?

His entourage would probably be new characters. Of course, his fan club from the comics would be in there, but most of them would be low level devotees. Some of them would be part of a harem, but a lot of them would probably be regular acolytes(who would of course have ambitions to be part of Aang's harem). Many of them would probably end up helping to raise any children among them, and with the upkeep of the temples. the more artistic and savvy among them would be part of Aang's propaganda campaign. I don't think that's something he would come up with himself, but someone would see a need to hep Aang's message spread.

As for his inner circle, he'd have to completely replace his original friend group, eventually, so lets give him 4 new "friends". He'd probably have a politically ambitious, but low ranking noble from one of the 4 monarchies with him. This person would be looking to make a name for themselves, and think that being part of the Avatar's retinue would do it for them. What would ultimately lead them to follow Aang down the path of corruption would be a thirst for power strong enough to override any good sense they had.

The next would be an orphan who has the potential to be a strong bender, but is untrained (this doesn't necessarily mean that they are very young. I see this being a young adult rather than a child). Aang would take them in and teach them their element. This would be Aang's main muscle. They would feel indebted to Aang for "rescuing" them. It wouldn't take a whole lot for Aang to gain their devotion. This would be the person responsible for handling Aang's more...distasteful tasks. Not that Aang would ever actually ask them to harm someone, but as he will always tell his friend, accidents happen...

The third person in the group would be someone well connected, and probably very rich. This person found Aang while they were looking for fulfillment spiritually. They clicked with Air Nomad philosophy (Aang's version) and went as far with their studies as they could without being an airbender. They probably started as an acolyte, and probably knows more about Air Nomad philosophy than even Aang himself, but still don't actually see how wrong Aang is about so many things.

The last person in the group is...let's face it, Katara's replacement. She is as loving and nurturing as Katara towards Aang, but without the stubbornness and simmering rage. She defers to Aang readily and completely, and never questions him. Unlike Katara, she has no problem with his harem. But she's still cunning, and she uses that cunning to remain as close to him as possible. If another acolyte, or any other woman Aang messes with starts to get above themselves, she is in Aang's ear turning him against them. At a certain point, there will probably be a power struggle between her and Entourage Member 1 and/or 3, but 2 will probably see her as a mother figure, and will protect her almost as devoutly as they protect Aang.

As potentially strong as 2 is, I don't think they'll ever get to be a great bender. I don't think Aang would want any benders stronger than him in his new group. Not after last time...

[atla-confessions]

Nonbinary people are not just "women lite". Please actually talk to some nonbinary people instead of being weird about us again

,,,,,, my guy, I'm nonbinary. Every nonbinary person is different and approaches gendered gatherings like 'girls night' or 'boys night' differently, even in different situations. If my siblings are doing a 'sisters' or 'brothers' outing, I exclude myself from both, but in family photos, I am included in both the girl and boys photos. For friend outings, I am often invited with both groups and it really depends on how my dysphoria is acting up whether I join them.

For me, Aang seems like the person who'd feel comfortable fitting with both the boys of the gaang and the girls of the gaang, so if I am ever thinking of the gaang doing a 'boys' hangout or a 'girls' hangout, I include Aang with both because, as I said, the nonbinary aang brainrot has gotten to me so much that I have forgotten that he is, in fact, a boy, and not neither boy nor girl.

X

[firelxdykatara]

*sigh* why do people keep comparing r/eylo to zutara and putting them in the same group? Were they not paying attention to the show? Did they not see Zuko's evolution?

Honestly, I really don’t know.

Like, ok, superficially, I can almost kinda get it. Angry boy with a scar on his face and the girl who could kick his ass offering to heal him? Ok, fine. Even aesthetically, red and blue, tol and smol, fine. I can sorta see it. But the instant you dig even a little bit deeper, they just… aren’t the same at all???? Not even remotely????

And, ok, I’ll admit to some measure of bias, because I don’t ship reylo and I don’t like it as a ship, nor do I want it to happen in any way in canon, but like, part of the reason Zutara works so well is that it’s not a hero/villain ship. It’s enemies-to-lovers, for sure, but the vast majority of us ship it because of Zuko’s redemption arc.

Yeah, you’ll see ‘I’ll save you from the pirates’ UST jokes, and a lot of us started shipping it back in book 1, but it was obvious from the beginning that Zuko was going to get redeemed. He may have been a villain, but he was never the villain–he was narratively placed as the secondary protagonist (deuteragonist) of the show from his very first appearance. He was given his own narrative arc that had little to do with the main plotline of Aang’s journey, because while his own journey ran parallel to the gaang, it was separate and distinct because he was on his way to his own redemption even then.

Zuko Alone, in book 2, drove this home even further. You don’t give someone who isn’t the primary protagonist of the show an episode all to themselves (literally none of the gaang shows up for even a second) unless this is a character who’s meant to have just as much narrative significance as the main cast. Zuko was always going to join the gaang, and so much zutara meta and fanfic rests on how amazing and emotionally fulfilling their relationship development was, as friends, and that it would have made so much sense for their friendship to go even further.

Reylo doesn’t have any of that.

First of all, Kylo Ren is not Zuko–not even close. Kylo has far more agency in being dark than Zuko ever did. Ben Solo had loving parents and grew up in a supportive environment. His uncle ultimately made a mistake, sure, but a) we see three versions of that particular story: the sanitized version (luke), the demonized version (kylo), and the truth, and b) kylo already had the knights of ren all ready to go and slaughter a bunch of kids.

He was already dark. You don’t go and murderdeathkill a bunch of kids and people you’d ostensibly been raised with just because you saw your uncle standing over you with a lightsaber he clearly wasn’t going to actually use unless you were already making plans to do just that. You can blame as much of it as you want on Snoke and his influence, but that would be a little like blaming Palpatine for Anakin–yeah, he gets some of the blame for manipulating the situation, but Anakin’s still the one who made the choice to kill a temple full of children and choke out his own wife. Darth Vader may have, in the end, chosen to return to the light, but that doesn’t absolve him of the evils he chose to commit.

Kylo is, tragically, in the same narrative position as Darth Vader was in the original trilogy–and Vader couldn’t even bring himself to kill his son.  But Kylo chose to kill his father. And that, incidentally, is one of the places where Zuko and Kylo are essentially diametrically opposed. Zuko turned on Uncle Iroh, yes, but he didn’t cross a line from which there was no coming back–he didn’t kill him. He, in fact, kept going to see him, trying to figure out why the choice he’d made felt so wrong when it was supposed to be everything he’d always wanted. Meanwhile, Kylo murdered his own father because he was hoping to destroy that last link to his own humanity.

And he succeeded.

Furthermore, Rey is not Katara. I love them both, so much, but they are very different people, and different characters who fulfill different narrative spaces in their own stories. In Rey’s position, Katara would probably have killed Kylo in the throne room when he turned on her after killing Snoke. Or, placing Kylo in Zuko’s place in atla, if he’d killed Hakoda (remembering that Han was the only father figure rey’d ever known)? She would have destroyed him. No fucking mercy

Katara does not forgive easily. It took Zuko not only proving that he was on the side of good (which he did multiple times, one of which he even saved her father), but specifically proving to her that he cared for her and genuinely wanted to help–by helping her gain closure for her mother’s murder. She emotionally connected with Zuko in the crystal catacombs, sure, but when he turned on her she hated him and had no intention of turning back. (Even though, from Zuko’s perspective, it wasn’t a betrayal at all–he’d made no promises, and it was his sister offering him everything he’d ever wanted. As far as he was concerned, the only person he betrayed there was his uncle, which is why it took him so long to realize just why Katara hated him so much. And even then he needed her brother’s help to figure out how to fix it.)

On the other hand, Rey was ready, willing, even eager to believe that Kylo could be returned to the light side–could become Ben again. This after he’d done something utterly unforgiving right in front of her, and tried to kill her multiple times. (Notably, at no point during Zuko and Katara’s antagonistic relationship was Zuko actually trying to kill her. He was trying to capture Aang. The worst thing he did was burn down Suki’s village, and that was largely an accident, because he was trying to get to Aang to capture him–alive.) She wanted to believe there was good in him. Katara couldn’t have cared less, throughout the first two books–and then, when confronted with the fact that Zuko had suffered something to which she could relate, she connected with him… and he turned on her. (From her perspective, she’d just reached out and offered this boy a chance to prove he’d changed… and he threw it in her face. So yeah, she took it incredibly fucking personally.)

Even now, it’s possible that if Kylo comes at Rey with some ‘I’m really light now’ story, she’ll probably want to believe him. But even if Reylo happens (and I’ll stress that I really don’t think it’s going to, and if it does I’ll probably be bitterly disappointed, but what else is new) it won’t even remotely resemble Zutara because they are, at their core, incredibly different relationships. Katara didn’t start warming up to Zuko, after that book 2 betrayal, until after he’d proven himself again and again, and helped her begin to heal from the trauma she’d suffered as a child. Furthermore, Zuko was never that evil to begin with. He was being primed for a redemption arc from the start, and he never even came close to the sort of moral event horizon Kylo pole-vaulted over when he murdered a whole bunch of students in their beds and then killed his own father.

And here’s the thing a lot of these Zuko-lite redemption arcs don’t seem to understand–it’s not a one-size-fits-all storyline. You can’t just slap Zuko’s redemption arc on any old villain, because for a redemption to work, it needs to be tailored specifically to fit the villain in question. And most villains aren’t Zuko–he was a very special kind of ‘secondary protagonist who starts out bad and gets a little bit worse before he gets better and joins the good guys���, which most villains can’t hope to match. If you want to redeem someone who’s canonically done far more atrocious acts, their redemption has to encompass the fact that not only are they getting better, but they are actively atoning for the horrible things they’ve done.

Killian Jones, from Once Upon a Time, had a redemption arc which looked nothing like Zuko’s, because he wasn’t a villain like Zuko. His redemption involved not only coming to realize that he’d been doing bad things for a very long time in search of a vengeance which was, ultimately, not what he really wanted or needed, but also making amends to the people he’d hurt over his very long life (those he still could help, at least). (Interestingly enough, that same show had a great example of a horribly botched redemption, in which we were supposed to take it on faith that the character was Good Now even though she’d never once expressed either remorse for the evil she’d committed [which was a lot more evil than Killian ever had] or a desire to make amends to those she’d wronged. In fact, come the end of the show, she still had a vault full of stolen hearts she’d never so much as made an effort to return, even though many of their owners were, ostensibly, in the same town she’d created through one of her many acts of villainy. It was… kind of strange, to say the least, to see how they could get one villain’s redemption so right and another’s so horribly wrong.)

Anyway, tl;dr: the upshot of this all is, Kylo Ren is not Zuko–he’s not even close–and Rey is not Katara. Their relationships look nothing alike, and even if Kylo is redeemed, it’s not going to look anything like Zuko’s redemption–partly because Zuko was never that bad to begin with and Kylo would have much more for which to atone, partly because their narrative journeys are so very very different–and I have never understood the comparison beyond a very surface-level reading of their character aesthetics.

[fantastic-nonsense]

Late I know, but your "Remembrances" piece: Mako was never there for Korra The Avatar as Book 2 showed while Asami is/was there for Korra as BOTH exactly like Katara in not only being supportive of the job but taking care of Korra The Person in Ultimatum and caretaking in Venom. Like a superhero's spouse that knows of the double-life, Avatar's lover has to be there for BOTH sides not just one/when it's convenient which is why Makorra would NEVER work and why Korrasami, y'know BALANCE.

Okay…here we go.

First: hell yeah you’re late. Three years late, in fact. I wrote that post in the immediate aftermath of the finale back in 2014. It’s 2017. I haven’t interacted with the LOK fandom in a significant capacity in 2 ½ years, since I finally got tired of all the bullshit and fighting and hate. Second of all: you’re wrong and you should feel bad. Funnily enough, I’ve actually already addressed most of what you’ve said in various other posts that I’ve made. So here’s some links to those posts, and I’m going to give you a condensed response. 

On Asami being there for Korra: I’m just going to copy and paste from another response I did, because it makes my point much better than anything new I could ever write:

Where was Asami during the Water Tribe Civil War? Worrying about her company. Who was Korra being comforted by? Mako (or at least, he was attempting to, before they broke up), Tenzin, and Tonraq. Asami was on-screen with Korra for like two scenes during this timeframe. Asami is there and supportive at the beginning of Korra’s recovery, but then again, so is everyone else. We are given only a TINY glimpse into the beginning of that recovery; we don’t know how that went down. All we know is what happened afterwards. And afterwards, on-screen, Korra spent the majority of her recovery surrounded by her biological family, alone, with Toph, or with Mako. 

Who was there during the culmination of Korra’s mental and emotional recovery arc? Mako, not Asami. Mako was there to support her and be with her during her visit to Zaheer, not Asami. Where was Asami? We don’t know, because she got a grand total of two lines in the whole episode, and both of them were to Varrick. That honor went to Mako. You wanna talk about Asami being there for Korra, how about we talk about the conspicuous lack of being there for Korra in “Beyond the Wilds?”Apparently Asami designing the hummingbird mechas (even though Varrick was around) was more important to Bryke than having Asami be there for Korra…weird, since, you know, these girls got together four episodes later.

On Korra being there for Asami:

By the end of Book 4, Asami has now lost a) her mother, b) her father, c) her boyfriend (twice, both times to Korra), d) her company (though she gained it back through chance and blood, sweat, and tears), e) her home and f) all of the hard work she’s put into the city repairing and improving its infrastructure over the past three years. When does Korra comfort her about any of these things (besides the first time with her father, back in Book 1) before the last two minutes of the finale? 

Korra ‘stealing’ Asami’s boyfriend (and kissing Mako while he was in a relationship with Asami) is quite literally brushed off as “Well Mako.” Korra was busy with the Water Tribe Civil War when Asami was going through all of her company and financial troubles. Who was there for her? Mako and Bolin. Was the fact that the Colossus basically destroyed Republic City and all of the infrastructure that Asami worked so hard on even brought up in conversation? Nope. And Asami’s father merits two lines (“I’m so sorry about your father.” “I don’t think I could have handled losing my father and you in the same day.”) and a hug. Like, I’m sorry, this girl has just lost her father. Why is she even at this wedding? No one would fault her for not showing up. Hiroshi’s funeral isn’t given even a passing mention. It’s implied that the wedding is super soon after the main events of the finale, given that Raiko’s only begun to talk about rebuilding and the city’s still in ruins.

And Mako was legitimately with Korra for every high and low point Korra ever had. Losing her bending? He was there. Getting her bending back? He was there immediately afterwards. Winning the pro-bending tournament? He was right beside her. Fighting Unavaatu? He’s in the Spirit World either distracting Eska and Desna so Korra could focus on Unalaq or protecting Korra’s body from getting killed by corrupted spirits. Taken hostage by the Red Lotus? He’s there leading the charge to rescue her. Confronting Zaheer and working on her mental and spiritual recovery? He’s right there beside her to encourage her or wait outside as she requested. Excepting her ‘Korra Alone’ journey, he was with her the whole way. He was with her as the Avatar and as Korra, and I would love for you to tell me how he wasn’t “there” for Korra in Book 2. 

Like lmao, “like a superhero’s spouse, the Avatar’s lover has to be there for both sides of the person”. Uh…that’s exactly what I was complaining about with that Remembrances post? That Asami WASN’T “there” for Korra as a person? Like…thank you for reiterating my point?

On Asami being Katara and filling Katara’s role: Haha…no. That’s actually the funniest thing I’ve heard in quite a long time. Nah son: Mako is Katara in this scenario, not Asami. ‘Mothering’ the group and all. Mako and Katara is the closest analog between the Gaang and the Krew we have, actually (which is funny, since Mako was originally supposed to be a kind of ‘Zuko-lite’ character). Both are family-oriented characters who essentially act as the parent for their sibling (who fills the comic-relief role) and dedicate their lives to protecting people and the Avatar. Both grow massively as people, carry heirlooms of their dead parents, are bending prodigies, and witnessed a traumatic event at a young age that they carry with them the rest of their life. There’s tons of other parallels I could make too, about their function within their respective groups, but I’m leaving it at that. If Asami has a parallel within ATLA, it would probably be a mix of Suki and Mai, not Katara.

And if you’re going to draw parallels between Katara and Asami based on their ‘caring natures’ and how they were ‘always there for Aang/Korra’, see this post I’ve already made on the subject, where I was asked if Mako going with Korra in “Beyond the Wilds” was basically like LOK’s “The Southern Raiders” episode.

 tl;dr version: 

This is completely different in the case of Beyond the Wilds. Asami does not even have the choice of accompanying Korra. There is no ‘I should stay behind; take Mako with you instead.’ There is no drastic choice between two ideologies for Korra to make. This is a matter of personal healing for Korra due to a traumatizing event done to her person with the intention of hurting and killing her personally. She is going to confront a man who destroyed her, body and spirit. That is an important event. And Asami apparently doesn’t even know about it.

Mako, the man who has seen Korra at both her absolute highest and all of her lowest points, is the one that goes with Korra to confront Zaheer. He plays the role of both Zuko and Aang, by coming with her for support and understanding but also stepping back and trusting her to make her own choices and decisions. Asami may as well be a distant penpal Korra’s never met for all ‘Beyond the Wilds’ and Korra’s spiritual healing arc is concerned. She has no advice, she has no role, and she has no impact on the entire situation.

Also “Avatar’s lover has to be there for BOTH sides not just one/when it’s convenient which is why Makorra would NEVER work and why Korrasami, y'know BALANCE” like no? There is no balance in the Korrasami relationship and they were never really there for each other, and I’m still wondering why the fuck you came into my inbox three years too late with this stupid ask that showed me that you obviously didn’t watch the show, since I can apparently remember events and interactions better three years later than you can?

[atla-confessions]

My nonbinary Aang headcanon has corrupted me so much I just saw fanart of the gaang girls and was confused why Aang wasn't there for a second before remebering oh riiiiiight, he's a boy.

Why would Aang be in a fanart of the girls if he was nonbinary

Nonbinary people are not just "women lite". Please actually talk to some nonbinary people instead of being weird about us again

X