#for reference /r means romantic im just being lazy

[qtoosh]

c!quackity: doesn't think tntduo is /r

c!wilbur: does think tntduo is /r

cc!quackity: does think tntduo is /r

cc!wilbur: doesn't think tntduo is /r

[octopodian]

1 2 3 4 5 :)

1.) how would you describe the world your story takes place in?

i usually go for "just the real world, but with whatever changes i need to tell the story i want to tell" i am VERY lazy by nature. the characters r usually more important than the world. which is the antithesis of this ask game i get it. i wont apologize. im a rebel.

you say somethings a golem and people know what that is already, same with robot. i dont rly need to invent the wheel for what i do.

when i make a diff world (i.e. Eden, or a sci-fi setting) im usually vague and simply reference the genre as a whole. no one questions nanobots when Everything does nanobots, you just say nanobots and carry on.

2.) if you gave an in depth description of your story to someone who was not all the way paying attention, what would their takeaway be?

the abels (aaron and leah, horrorverse): "ok its single fatherhood. i got it. no i know its- i know its about gender and viscera yes i got that--"

aide: ok so the robot has dad issues

terpsichore: what the fuck is wrong with her. she did WHAT with a hammer?

airborne spore: ok so the mushroom has dad issues

3.) any recurring images/elements?

uhh a lot of my ocs deal with death in diff ways. you get it. im morbid. theres also Gender in various ways, and theres always robots or constructs or cases where Humanity vs Personhood are mixed up.

4.) what would you say is the message, if there is one.

this is so corny but i think love, but not like romantic love just like, for the world and for people and for your goals. passion mb? idk. caring about SOMETHING bc if you don't what else is there. you can hold onto anything but you need SOMETHING to hold onto.

the real message for terp and AC (eden) is The Ice is Coming. The Ice is Coming. The Ice is Coming.

5.) pick a theme song for the tv adaptation.

THIS IS THE HARDEST ONEEEEEEE i mean most oingo boingo songs can work for anything involving aaron/leah... weird science being the Easy one, but private life/sweat/same man i was before/gray matter/no spill blood/no one lives forever work too. mostly these r aaron songs, not about his daughter, but i havent found good music about father daughter love, soooo,

terpsichore would be icarus by jason webley, it has sickness as a female lover AND the voices of angels, it fits the best.

aide is get your shit together by pillowfight, im sure it could apply to other characters too but to me thats the core of their story thus far and probably in the future.

airborne cordyceps spore has his own songs but the GENERAL STORY would be animal skin by bryan dunn. hes a minecraft oc. you wouldnt know it.

[catradoraism]

R/ylo vs Catradora: What Do We Like About Enemies-to-Lovers Romance? (or: I Can’t Believe Someone Paid Me $6 To Write This)

I am never putting this much effort into discourse again, i dont even like discourse whoever commissioned me for this i hope this is worth ur money fdjndjdnfd

(tw: mentions of r*pe and abuse)

Ok les get into it yuhh. Enemies to lovers 101 

1. Power balance.

Despite everything shadow weaver says (and what catra believed), Catra and Adora are equals, it’s reiterated over and over again in the show. Even in the theme song itself where Catra and Adora are butting heads, they’re clearly intended to be framed as equals. R/ylo, in spite of all narrative attempts, never really seem to come off as equals. It is just not executed well. They tried.

imo, r/ylo was doomed the second they had literally their first conversation. there's a lot of things a pairing can do to each other during the enemies stage of enemies which falls under ‘Extremely Awful But We Are Enemies So This Is Kinda Expected’ territory. it’s why theres always attempted murder and sometimes even a bit of stabbing during this stage but this is not abusive (a word antis seem to love to throw around a lot, i’ll get into why this isn’t abusive later). however, there is a certain (but hard to define) line that if Crossed, the enemies should never have a romantic arc. kylo crosses this line in their first interaction.

the director of the force awakens, jj abrams described this scene as a “violent mind r*pe.” considering hes,, the Director, it shows that r/ylo was not at all intended to be seen as romantic. At all. (until tlj but addressing that later). (and death of the author whatever but if the author intends this to be a violent assault scene and you choose to ignore that? yikes). not to mention, the fact that this scene is an allegory for r*pe uh,, don’t ship them? also kylo is fuckin 30 and rey is 19, that only adds to the power imbalance. the line “you know i can take whatever i want” is enough to make my skin crawl. 

as this person puts it it’s not romance, this is violation, and That is what immediately established the power imbalance between them.

as a standalone scene, if rey and kylo were only meant to be enemies, this scene wouldve been fine. Its unnerving and highly disturbing, but in the context of an enemies relationship, fine. But considering how they’re being set up to be love interests, Not Very Good!! Also the dyad was an incredibly lazy narrative tool can i say that. It was.

This is such a dumb fucking sentence to write but this is a catradora/ r//ylo comparison so whatever - catra never crosses this line. Yeah she fucking ended the world and indirectly killed angella but she doesnt do anything like this to adora which is a low fucking bar for love interests im aware Okay but i am talking about their relationship as Enemies. Would like to reiterate, im not saying “do not violate ur partner” is the bar here. I am saying that violating ur Enemy is perhaps a Bad setup for a romance. there r a lot of enemies to lovers romances that work bc they dont have this set up.

2. The Fallout

“You’re nothing. But not to me.” / “Let’s be honest, all of this is your fault.”

before I talk about these scenes let’s address smth. an enemies to lovers dynamic, despite what antis say, is not inherently abusive. this is because abuse occurs in relationships that are rooted in trust (I’m aware there’s a more general definition that is used to define all forms of mistreatment in general but for the sake of this argument I’m referring to relationship abuse). For example, mean classmate who you hate tells you that you are worthless. Hurts yes, may lower your self esteem, shitty thing to do but you wouldn’t label them an abuser. If your SO however, said you were worthless, THAT’S emotional abuse. Technicality and semantics i know but they’re important distinctions to make. This is why people can’t say Catra’s actions towards Adora were abusive without taking into consideration the context of their relationship as Enemies. The antagonistic nature of the enemy relationship cannot be classified as abusive since there is no trust during the enemies stage. If Catra and Adora were in a romantic relationship during the earlier seasons then yeah that would be abuse and i sure as fuc wouldnt be a catradora blog lmao. But they were enemies! So their current romantic relationship?? Not abusive. Wow. What A Concept. Now let’s discuss these scenes.

“You’re nothing. But not to me.” / “Let’s be honest, all of this is your fault.”

On the surface? These scenes are parallels, they’re both attempts at manipulating the hero AND they’re in the final lines before the Fallout. but lets look closer at the words and the context of r/ylo and catradora’s relationships during these scenes.

at this point in time, rey trusts kylo, he just killed snoke and they fought off the ?? soldiers ?? together. Here he demeans her, tells her she’s worthless, and says but Not To Me. by doing this hes basically saying oh ur nothing but babey, i am the One who can validate u mamas lemme show u how to get that sexy self worth can u tell i stopped caring fnjdjd. But yes the implications of this line suck bc 1) kylo is saying she’s worthless and that He is the only one who sees her as having worth, 2) since rey and kylo trust each other during this scene (and this scene is also romantically coded, he basically proposed marriage), this can easily be seen as a sign of emotional abuse (isolating the victim from their friends/family, attempting to make them depend solely on the abuser’s perception of them). and bc there is trust, kylo can manipulate rey into feeling guilty. now i know the r/ylos say “read between the lines” bc he’s not saying rey is worthless he’s saying rey means something to him, he is just projecting. and yk what? i agree, i don’t think kylos intentions were malicious i actually agree w their interpretation of this line However. the impact of the words will always outweigh the intention. that may not be what kylo truly means but it’s what rey hears. an unintentional guilt trip is still a guilt trip. it’s kind of the same way someone may threaten to hurt themselves if their partner leaves them, their intentions while not necessarily evil, are still extremely harmful and is Guilting. impact > intention. 

bad. yeah catra fuckin sucks for saying this. demeaning adora. but at the point of fallout, unlike rey and kylo’s fallout, catra and adora don’t trust each other. the guilt trip here is not so much abuse as it is more classic enemy behaviour. also, unlike r/ylo, catradora are still equals. the r/ylo power imbalance kinda makes their fallout scene more gross bc he’s basically exerting power over rey,, again. but catra and adora are always on equal footing. Catra never had the upper hand on adora in the same way kylo did for rey (again referring to the torture scene and many other scenes) now lets look at rey and adora’s reactions

“Don’t do this Ben. Please don’t go this way” / “Now live with it.”

rey’s reaction is rly heartbreaking here, she trusts kylo and believes there is good in him so she begs him not to go down the path of villainy again. this scene parallels a common experience with abuse victims, they see their abuser reverting to their old ways after a period of Good, they think everything will be fine again until, regression.

adora on the other hand, doesnt trust catra and severs her ties. Unlike rey who is placed in a vulnerable position and is reluctant to give up, adora gives up on catra. If im being honest the entire fallout scene in s3 is the reason why catra’s “you have never given up not even on me” confession line didnt rly?? Resonate w me. Like the climax of s3 WAS that adora had to give up on her. Its much more complex than that i know, like adora gave up but still had hope? Idk this isnt a meta about that scene its just smth i thought id bring up. 

Ok so to summarise fallout scenes

Character A and B trust each other and A who has constantly exerted power over B and does so again to guilt B into staying. bad

Character A and B are equals but A goes way too far and the ties are completely severed. better. then they start their separate arcs and wooooo redemption

3. Accountability.  

“I did want to take your hand. Ben’s hand.” / “If you think hiding from the people you hurt is gonna make you feel better, then we’ll drop you off the nearest planet and you’ll never have to see us again.”

Yeaahhhh babey lets talk about all the reasons wrong with THISSSS. Very clever i think. Treating ben and kylo as if they were separate entities lmfaooooo. They r the same fuckin person. Ive seen it in r/ylo chatacterisations, kylo is the evil villain and ben is the soft boy. Kylo ren is his evil persona yes, its a mask he puts on to hide his true emotions (catra does the same, she has a villain persona she puts on) but to treat kylo as if he was a separate being to ben??? Uhhhhh bad. It basically relieves him of all accountability for his actions bc it ‘wasn’t him’. This isnt rey’s intention ofc, shes trying to strip that villain persona away and make him more vulnerable. But unfortunately the impact is that ppl see kylo as a separate entity, ben didnt kill han solo, kylo did, ben didnt slaughtered a bunch of ppl, kylo did. U see the problem here?

“If you think hiding from the people you hurt is gonna make you feel better, then we’ll drop you off the nearest planet and you’ll never have to see us again.” 

Yeah i have my issues w catra’s redemption, like most ppl i wish angella’s death was addressed, as well as catra being terrible to scorpia and her part in taking over salineas. I thought catradora’s development was for the most part, well executed but they certainly sidelined a lot of issues i wish couldve been explored in favour of catra and adora’s reconciliation. Its not rly a surprise that they would be the focus considering they are the main conflict of the show and therefore would have centre focus reconciling but yeah wish the other issues were addressed. That being said i think catra readily takes accountability for what she’s done and faces it head on (obvsly not all of it but yeah mostly what shes done to adora), i also never rly saw her redemption as a complete one, it seemed to be framed as the beginning of a lot more work to be done, but shes getting there. 

Also kylo is a grown ass man who commits murder as his first act on screen and catra (while she did horrible things and was an awfully toxic person) is trapped in a vicious cycle of abuse and is humanised pretty much every season. Choose ur fighter lmao

In summary. r/ylo bad, catradora good. Thank u for coming to tedtalk was this worth $6? I have no fucking idea

[identitycris1s]

so this is the new year

im finally taking time to sit down and reflect on the past few months. the new year came and went and its been a bit of a whirlwind. i suppose i’ll just go by chronological order cos i dont really know how to start...also i dont think im an abstract thinker so really my life isnt ordered by “themes” or “lessons” or whatever but i sort of think of it in terms of events and the epiphanies or lessons that flow therefrom. this is probably just gonna be a stream of consciousness exposition cos im lazy to organise my thoughts and this is basically my journal so WHATEVER!

November

X told me he liked me and asked me out. i was shocked. but sort of saw it coming (what else could “r u free after lunch, i have some stuff to say” mean...LOL). i reacted awkwardly - distinctly remember saying “huh..what does that MEAN!!!” (LOL) i told him i would think about it but could probably only give him an answer after part b was over. 

tbh this was probably just me stalling for time. i think instinctively i knew that i didnt see him in that way, but he seemed to tick so many boxes in terms of who i was “supposed” to be with - that sounds dumb, but what i mean is he’s a steadfast christian, a good boy, similar values, similar tastes in music / movies / books, same bloody industry LOL...

also he seemed really serious about it - ermmm he brought up marriage on that first day :0 ok i suppose thats unfair and it sounds insane without context - he said it with reference to how dating is always with a view to marriage which i do agree with but yes it was a lot to absorb in one conversation. and then he cracked out this book about dating and marriage and i was like woah. so, given how much thought he seemed to have put into this (he also said he chatted with his CG leader about me yikes) i felt obliged to at least think it through properly and give myself some time to consider rather than immediately rejecting him. 

and so i mulled it over whilst studying for part b. he was overseas for a while towards the end of my studying period (ie when i was freaking out the most and generally being a headless chicken) and this probably contributed to me feeling like i liked him more than i really did hmm wonder what this says about me. i like to feel like someone’s out of my reach i suppose. so fucked up lol! and so during this period we were texting everyday and i would look forward to his replies and he was a real source of comfort during that stressful period and i never told him this and i probably never will. 

December

exams were over and i had to face D DAY!! so i went to meet him to give him my answer and honestly even on that day i didnt know what my answer was. we met at BTM and he literally had written down a list of things to talk about and i think in that moment i knew this probably wouldnt work out. hes so damn thoughtful about every little thing and he thinks everything through and even though he seems to think he “doesnt take things too seriously” I THINK HE DOES...and i really dont...so i felt that showed how incompatible we were. its not a bad thing to be thoughtful. its just that i felt so pressured by how seriously he was taking things...i thought “trying this out” would be casual and chill and we would just hang out as if we were friends but with this overarching agenda of potentially being together but no his conception of “trying things out” is much more intense and serious and thought out and in his words “intentional”. which i realised is some christian dating jargon haha.

dinner was normal until he cracked out that list i was talking about. then he started talking about what he wanted out of a relationship and asked me what i wanted out of a relationship. like it was a damn interview. you know what, im saying this in a really condescending tone and i wouldnt ever be this hurtful if i knew he was gonna read this - in fact i really do think this kind of approach would suit many people and perhaps a more emotionally well adjusted person would think this was normal but i felt so bombarded and i really didnt know what to say in response. so i blurted out some nonsense about wanting to be with someone who was God fearing and “kind and compassionate” and “ambitious” LMAO...what bullshit (that last one i mean). and he had clearly thought out his answers a lot more and he went on a whole spiel about wanting to be with someone who could stand on their own as a christian and who he didnt have to “drag along” on their walk with God and i was like ok cool but i think im not that...im not what youre looking for...but of course i didnt say this. idk why. maybe i enjoy being wanted and sought after and i didnt want to shatter his illusion that i was what he was looking for, even though i was kinda seeing that he wasnt what i was looking for.

anyway, being the shitty person i am, i told him it wasnt a no but it wasnt a straight out yes either i.e. i would be willing to try with a view to potentially saying yes. and we left it at that. but even as i said bye to him that night i kinda knew this wasnt gonna work...but i wanted it to! i wanted to like him! i want to be the kind of person who can accept love from a well adjusted person who’s not afraid to be real and to take things seriously...but i suppose i have some emotional growth to work on...or is it perfectly valid for me to not want to be with him? tbh i never found him attractive (physically or even personality wise oops) - he doesnt make me laugh, hes kinda too uptight, he doesnt get my jokes (i have to be like “JUST KIDDING” a lot of the time..ded) but somehow we worked as friends. but to be with someone requires something more than just working as friends doesnt it?? ack

so we met a few times in dec (i think we went on four or five “dates” in total...im so reluctant to call them dates cos throughout i just couldnt see him in that light, but thats what they were i think) and through the course of our interactions i started picking up on things that i didnt like about him / about our interactions. this sounds awfully petty and i dont wanna be mean about this cos im sure i have MANY MANY MANY flaws that one could nit pick but these were just some signs that we would not work (quite apart from my lack of physical attraction to him)

1. our conversations always end up argumentative. i think this probably stems from both of us being law students and so whenever we disagree on something we both cant seem to fucking let it go. i distinctly remember one stupid conversation, i shall put it here (not verbatim but this is the gist of it)

X: what are your new years resolutions?

S: i dont like making new years resolutions because they always end up in disappointment because i never stick to them. 

X: but disappointment isnt always a bad thing because you can learn from it and improve from there

S: yes but that doesnt mean disappointment isnt a bad thing - cos disappointment in itself is bad (like duh the feeling of disappointment is bad) but what comes after disappointment can be good or bad i.e. you can choose to work on yourself and improve or you can wallow in the disappointment.

-some more argument and confusion about what we are even talking about-

S: ok lets not argue on this its a semantic point. 

X: is it semantic? its not semantic.

S: it is semantic. we are disagreeing on what the word disappointment means. i think it is necessarily negative but you are saying that disappointment isnt always negative because of what can come after but i think thats sidestepping the point of disappointment being negative in itself.

do you see what i mean. what kind of petty argument is this? whats the damn point? of course im definitely not blameless in this at all. i perpetuate it. but what im saying is i feel like talking to him brings out this argumentative side of me that im not a fan of. also its fucking exhausting haha.

2. he is so. fucking. serious. every conversation involves some heavy thing like spirituality or self evaluation or Godliness etc. which i suppose is good but i just found it tiring...why cant things be light? why cant things be fun? why do we always have to talk about *important* or *weighty* things? tbh i think he sorta compartmentalises me as a friend whom he can talk about these *weighty* things with cos im also a christian and i get what hes saying when he talks about God but i dont want to only talk about that...

3. we dont have similar senses of humour. i dont think he thinks im funny...but i think im bloody funny ok haha also i dont think im deluded on this? my friends think im funny too? yeah i think its a major problem that we cant really laugh together...hes not someone that makes me laugh at all :( 

ok enough bashing X haha i really do think hes a great person we are just NOT compatible romantically.

ANYWAYS! sometime in dec i also met up w SM for the first time in aaaages. but things were like normal again. sounds stupid but i think ill always think of him as the one who got away LOL....emotionally unavailable and not interested in me?? IM DOWN! haha. ok hes not emotionally unavailable tbh i probably was more emotionally unavailable in the course of our friendship but he defo never really expressed any interest in me other than always hanging out one on one but that doesnt really count for anything does it. anyways! he told me about his BTO plans and im honestly v happy for him :) friends r growing up and moving on in life mang..

sad part was i dropped avo toast on my new everlane pants and that honestly ruined my day lol

January

NYE was spent w S and some of her friends plus R and A (who went home after dinner cos of family drama lmao angie is siao) - we went to AL’s fam friends party at fullerton for countdown and the fireworks were amaaaazing, lasted about an hour (which made us question the budget allocation on this tbh isnt it a bit of a waste?? fireworks are insanely expensive??) and we promptly went home after the clock struck 12 which was perfect haha i have no stamina to stay out late anymore. 

work started on 2 jan! its been fun tbh - back with the trainees and meeting some new people and using my brain again. i like feeling useful and being stuck in a routine...at least for now haha. check in on me in about 3 months and we’ll see. 

and....i finally mustered up the courage to tell X the truth ie i didnt see this going anywhere and we should just be friends. we had kind of an awkward dinner (i could feel myself being rude to him and being dismissive etc but i think it could partially be attributed to me being tired from work..but mostly cos i didnt wanna be with him!! as a romantic partner!! it felt wrong!) and so i told him after dinner otw to the mrt (funny, we always have these convos otw to the mrt haha). he said he understood and he sort of felt it coming. and i felt bad - he mustve picked up on my coldness and rudeness over text and in our meetings also...why am i like this. i shouldve been up front with him on the first day. but i didnt know!!! i didnt know for sure this is how i felt. ahhh well u live and u learn right. next time ill be better at this. hope theres a next time LOL God pls send me someone whos right for me

ok bye for now! this was a lengthy post haha

[imabookmarkaddict]

trevor is cheesy, markus’ thoughts on hanging and banging

Poor trevor trying to understand anything markus says

puzzlezToday at 3:45 AM

yeh i already have an idea for how markus explains it

[

3:46 AM

]

i was thinking the series could be something like idfk

WelshenToday at 3:46 AM

Yeah okay good i just didnt wanna put u in a place of trying to describe something supernatural

[

3:47 AM

]

Markus is good at recognizing patterns too so series of numbers r p easy to notice

puzzlezToday at 3:47 AM

13 7 21 18 12 1 23 17 6 3 22

[

3:47 AM

]

where it's 3 series of numbers that alternate or smth

[

3:47 AM

]

they all go up by 5

[

3:48 AM

]

13 to 18 to 23, 7 to 12 to 17, 21 to 1 to 6

[

3:48 AM

]

if u can even see it god nowi'm like markus

[

3:48 AM

]

but he has no idea how to explain it to trevor

WelshenToday at 3:48 AM

Oh god yeah exact

puzzlezToday at 3:48 AM

so he just writes it down and shows it to trevor like see u see the pattern

[

3:48 AM

]

and trevor is just staring at a string of random numbers

WelshenToday at 3:48 AM

Its like trevor explaining morning runs to markus

puzzlezToday at 3:48 AM

...tf drugs u on

[

3:48 AM

]

and markus just keeps writing numbers

[

3:49 AM

]

like do u see the pattern?

[

3:49 AM

]

here i'll do another one give me a number

[

3:49 AM

]

and trevor does and markus writes and then says now you do th next one

[

3:49 AM

]

and trevor blinks down at the numbers

[

3:49 AM

]

maybe it can get cute

[

3:49 AM

]

trevor has no idea what markus is doing and decides time to change subject cuz numbers, lol

[

3:50 AM

]

and maybe the last number in the series markus wrote was a 3

WelshenToday at 3:50 AM

Probably? Time for sex education

puzzlezToday at 3:50 AM

and trevor just adds a < to it

[

3:50 AM

]

yeh i see the pattern

[

3:50 AM

]

"<3"

WelshenToday at 3:50 AM

Oh thats cheesy christ

puzzlezToday at 3:50 AM

u asked for it

WelshenToday at 3:50 AM

But markus doesnt use phones he has no clue

puzzlezToday at 3:50 AM

hey maybe markus can call him out on it

[

3:50 AM

]

oh fuck then it's perfect

[

3:50 AM

]

maybe trevor is bad at flirting with guys sometimes??

WelshenToday at 3:51 AM

Im sure he has never tried in his life

puzzlezToday at 3:51 AM

like maybe he tried cheesy stuff with girls and it worked so whenever he feels lost and confused he just defaults to a cheesey cute one liner

WelshenToday at 3:51 AM

Just dates idk cheerleaders and other sporty girls

[

3:51 AM

]

Omh yah perf

puzzlezToday at 3:51 AM

how would markus react tho

[

3:52 AM

]

would he enjoy it mostly like watching an amusing 5 yo play at dressup

[

3:52 AM

]

or would he just cringe like wtf drugs r U on

WelshenToday at 3:53 AM

He would just be confused until he understands and then embarrassed to heck

[

3:53 AM

]

Markus doesnt flirt much either u kno

[

3:54 AM

]

Its just heres money lets go

puzzlezToday at 3:54 AM

poor thing

[

3:54 AM

]

if i remember correctly, will was a smooth talker flirter

WelshenToday at 3:54 AM

Squint

[

3:54 AM

]

If u mean when he said ur beautiful after like 2mins is smooth

[

3:54 AM

]

Yeah

puzzlezToday at 3:55 AM

so yeah maybe trevor can be bad as heck at flirting until he feels awkward and spits out those one-liner balls of cheese in a rush of panic

[

3:55 AM

]

well i'm p sure will thought he was a smooth talker

[

3:55 AM

]

ppl probs too polite to point out he ain't

[

3:55 AM

]

but yeh thought it might give markus some variation?

[

3:56 AM

]

unless u prefer trevor to be good at flirting

WelshenToday at 3:57 AM

No trevor can be bad but markus is equally bad

puzzlezToday at 3:57 AM

perrrrrrrfect

[

3:57 AM

]

i picture trevor kinda secretly watching markus for cues sometimes on what to do??

[

3:57 AM

]

i mean porn shows u terrible, fake, unrealistic sex

WelshenToday at 3:57 AM

And markus is normally not very perceptive

puzzlezToday at 3:57 AM

at best u learn how to bend your hips back forward in impossible yoga/sex moves

[

3:58 AM

]

and since he tried those and learned nothing trevor knows nada about actual relationships with dudes

[

3:58 AM

]

so i had a feeling he was going to sort of quietly watch markus for leads on what to do

[

3:58 AM

]

so markus being bad at teaching + panicked trevor + cheesy pickup line + markus confused + markus not able to flirt back = a terrible awkward but adorable couple of doofuses

[

3:58 AM

]

and this i can absolutely work with

WelshenToday at 3:59 AM

Markus can do it technically but not very enthusiastically?? If that makes sense

[

3:59 AM

]

He gets better but u kno

[

3:59 AM

]

Yes i hope that works

[

3:59 AM

]

Theyre both idiots

puzzlezToday at 3:59 AM

i think that makes sense

[

4:00 AM

]

maybe squint

[

4:00 AM

]

do you mean he like technically knows how/can think of something flirty to say but has no oomph behind it? like no drive to actually look/sound flirty?? or smth else?

WelshenToday at 4:02 AM

Yes pretty much

[

4:03 AM

]

I mean hes heard it all obv but that was more or less when he got paid so it sounds fake to him i guess(edited)

[

4:04 AM

]

So he can repeat it but i doubt he knows how to mean it? Or that he could stick to things he ACTUALLY means (but hed be too awk to say)

[

4:04 AM

]

And that goes for all relationship hijinks

[

4:05 AM

]

Jo was a weird mix of paid and cute stalker?? They didnt flirt so much as get along

puzzlezToday at 4:06 AM

yeahh okay

[

4:06 AM

]

it makes sense tho

WelshenToday at 4:07 AM

Hey hes a mess

puzzlezToday at 4:07 AM

i made a char who was a prostitute and if deffo made him bad at relationships for similar reasons

[

4:07 AM

]

(my ghost waja actually)

[

4:07 AM

]

(prostitute ghost waja)

[

4:07 AM

]

(v wajas appropriate)

[

4:07 AM

]

so then does markus actually uhh like idk enjoy sex?

[

4:08 AM

]

if he's done all kinds of stuff from vanilla to crazy-whatever-clients want stuff i'm assuming he's tried/seen most if not all flavors of sex?

[

4:08 AM

]

so would it be 100% a chore to get through sex or would he still enjoy it in relationships?

[

4:09 AM

]

i wasn't sure how to write the sorta kinda sex scene with trevor for this reason squint

WelshenToday at 4:10 AM

Im pretty sure hes asexual but not aromantic, he definitely thinks its a chore but if its with someone he has a romantic interest in its a fun chore?(edited)

[

4:10 AM

]

And at this stage its the only way he knows how to connect with people well guys anyway

[

4:12 AM

]

Adam fits him better cuz hes got low interest in sex and markus prefers making out and cuddling?

[

4:12 AM

]

Thats like 10years later when markus has gotten some idea of what he prefers tho

[

4:12 AM

]

Does that even make sense

puzzlezToday at 4:13 AM

yeah

[

4:13 AM

]

like i said my one oc was a prostitute and he's of a similar uh... mind? i guess is the word?

[

4:13 AM

]

in that regard

WelshenToday at 4:13 AM

Yeah

[

4:14 AM

]

Im sure theres plenty of types of people, but these ones just do it as any other job?

[

4:14 AM

]

I think markus referred to it as not much difference to idk toilet janitor, he even prefers this cuz he can lay down and nap lol

puzzlezToday at 4:15 AM

omfgggg

WelshenToday at 4:16 AM

Probably napped while working to be honest

puzzlezToday at 4:16 AM

yeh my char did it purely for money and he's impatient af but decent at acting so an extent to he pretended to enjoy company of his clients for the money but secretly hated most of them and the kinkier ones ruined sex for him in a way? like it's just "pretend and act out these ridiculous things" so he doesn't really enjoy sex, figures it's a chore, just gotta see it through to the end, and that mindset continues with him for a while(edited)

[

4:16 AM

]

but i can see markus napping

[

4:17 AM

]

lazy bones boy

[

4:17 AM

]

so i'm guessing markus wouldn't really initiate sex then

WelshenToday at 4:18 AM

He would if trevor made him uncomfortable enough

[

4:18 AM

]

Cuz at lesst he knows how to do THAT

puzzlezToday at 4:19 AM

yeah okay that makes sense

[

4:19 AM

]

poor kid tho rofl

[

4:20 AM

]

so i'm assuming trevor is bad as gay sex in general because never tried before but

[

4:20 AM

]

would he be the type to be eager to learn, like want to please markus in bed, or would he be a more impatient/selfish lover, like i wanna race to the end and if we figure out how to please you along the way, then good perf

WelshenToday at 4:22 AM

Probably the first

[

4:22 AM

]

If it was the second one markus would start to feel cheated out of money

[

4:23 AM

]

Well i mean its not easy to do but by that i mean even if trevor is done theyd still make out enough for markus to get over it

[

4:23 AM

]

Squint

[

4:23 AM

]

This is very difficult

puzzlezToday at 4:24 AM

omg snort

[

4:24 AM

]

i think i get what you mean tho

[

4:24 AM

]

markus gets "paid" in uh... affection/devotion?idk if that's the right word but

[

4:24 AM

]

trevor focusing on some kind of need of markus would be like "payment" in a convoluted sense for the sex?(edited)

WelshenToday at 4:25 AM

Yes

[

4:25 AM

]

Pretty much exactly

[

4:26 AM

]

Well markus hasnt had a currency free relationship yet

[

4:27 AM

]

Thinks every bit of affection is to be paid or payment for smth

[

4:27 AM

]

This is babys first real bf tbh(edited)

puzzlezToday at 4:29 AM

trevor?

WelshenToday at 4:30 AM

Markus

[

4:30 AM

]

Well trevors too

puzzlezToday at 4:30 AM

okay yeh i thought you meant markus/trevor

[

4:30 AM

]

making sure

[

4:30 AM

]

first real bfs with each other

[

4:31 AM

]

sad the relationship goes up in such flames

WelshenToday at 4:31 AM

Yes well

[

4:31 AM

]

It was really neithers fault

puzzlezToday at 4:32 AM

and yet the flames buuuurn

WelshenToday at 4:32 AM

But markus is the one on his own after

[

4:32 AM

]

Unless u count spencer

puzzlezToday at 4:32 AM

do u count spencer

WelshenToday at 4:32 AM

As a minus i do