#fluke dff

[raelle-writing]

Dead Friends Forever as text posts (episodes 1-4)

Bonus:

[srnileforme]

miobump being inseparable in the DFF Behind the Scenes.

[fracturediron]

I think Fluke's unhinged behaviour and massive freakout in the present makes more sense now that we've seen him in the flashback.

In the past, Fluke - although not bullied by the others - seemed to be the lowest in the hierarchy, and aware of it, too. In the group, all of the others had much bigger personalities than him: Por was the leader, Tee the second-in-command, Jin the charisma, and Top the clown. Fluke was quiet, and just kind of... there. A hanger on and follower who managed to get accepted into their group.

Although he never actively bullied Non (so far anyway), he also never intervened or spoke up like Jin did, instead keeping quiet. And when Non was framed for the camera breaking, he didn't speak up either, despite knowing it was really Top. To speak out is to go against the group, to go against your friends. You're accepted here, but only if you go along with the status quo. Stick your neck out and you might become the next Non. So Fluke turned a blind eye (especially as unlike Jin, he didn't care about Non).

Now, in the present, he's being punished and terrorised with the rest of them, likely for what happened to Non. And so Fluke's pissed. Fluke never wanted to be involved in any of this Non bullshit, he didn't get himself any more involved than necessary! The only reason he was involved in any of this was because of Por, Tee and Top! And from Fluke's perspective of an angry, resentful teenager, doesn't that just seem fucking unfair that he got dragged into this mess he didn't even want? And now he's getting hunted down by a crazed killer/ghost, has responsibility for one and then two lives on his own hands with hardly any medical training, White's snooping around and his future as a doctor - everything he's worked for, his mother's pride and love - might be jeopardised? By ep 4, that kid was barely hanging on. No wonder he lost his shit.

[everytimeigetmoody]

You stated all my thoughts about White. Up until this point he has no stakes in this story. They better do something with his character quick because there are only three eps left and I could not care less about whether he lives or dies right now. I even want Fluke’s selfish crazy ass to survive more than White at this point.

they just aren't giving us anything about white. as far as we know, he's just boyfriend. he has no ties with non and has done nothing to harm him or the investigation. he just doesn't have many ties to the main story with non. let's be honest. it makes him a little boring and bland. i kinda care about him cause he seems nice. he's innocent. there's nothing wrong with his place in the story and i feel like he does have his seat at the table even if he's not involved with non. he plays detective with phee and tan and he does his best with trying to contact the outside world. we see how fluke is going crazy through how he interacts with white. we get to see tee fleshed out a little through white.

i just don't think it would be satisfying to leave him as final girl. i mean, it's just too cookie cutter to leave the "innocent" one alive. this doesn't really seem like a story that's so rigid in its sense of morality. a lot of the characters we see are very much not black and white. you have phee who cares very much for non, but sleeps with jin and, at least the way i see it, kind of likes him too. he's on his mission to seek the truth about non or kinda get revenge but he gets distracted and veers off course. we have tee who is a major bully and does fucked up things to non which could have landed him in jail and did land him into deep shit with his uncle, but he also ultimately asked for mercy for non and tee is dealing with a lot of shit at home. i mean, he has the health of his dad on his shoulders (if i remember correctly) and his uncle was stepping on his neck threatening him with money or the lack of it. i am a tee hater but when i really think of his situation, i can't help but feel bad for the guy and everything that he's going through. and i love phee, but man was it fucked up to sleep with jin without knowing the full story.

with all of these complex and interesting characters to really dig into and analyze, white just seems bland in comparison and i feel like that's probably the point of his character. i mean, maybe i just haven't caught onto any foreshadowing, but white isn't going to turn out to be some great mastermind or part of the conspiracy with phee and tan in the end. that would feel like such shitty writing. i think this is more or less confirmed by white getting the hallucination of boils on his skin. he's not in on the plan and he didn't use this to throw off suspicion like tan did.

i think he works best as a tragic death. he would work best as collateral in the end. he has done all that he can and that is still not enough sometimes. you can do all the right things but circumstances get you sometimes. that's just what life is.

white is not final girl material. this story ultimately isn't about him, and i think that's what seals his fate. no part of seeing him coming out of the woods bloody and crying would be satisfying as an ending and would honestly create the most basic ass theme. it would make me actually angry if the "innocent" one got out alive. in a show that works so hard at being morally complex, that is such a slap in the face as an ending. it sends the most basic theme of "if you do bad things, bad things happen to you, and if you do good things, good things happen to you." the story would say nothing interesting. it is such a tired theme that doesn't take into acount the cemplexities and nuances of life.

i believe dff will do better than that. i think it will give us a story that leaves all of us speechless and satisfied. white being the final girl will not give us that.

sorry anon that i unloaded all of this on you. i never really got into it in my original post, and i still didn't fully get into it here but this was getting long.

[miss0atae]

Saturday is so far away so I do silly memes for fun.

[blu-eyed-freedom]

Thinking of sharing the DFF playlists me and my GF have been making on Spotify if anyone's interested? So far we have a general show one, a Non specific one and a PheeNon one.

And song suggestions are very welcome too!

[melodydrifts]

words cannot express how much i love him

[ancestor-qirong]

I really can't look forward to DFF at all now as a Jin biased person😭 wasn't it supposed to be a show made for him to be the main character 😭 but why then did it turn out like this. Either they should have made him the main villain or the main villain. Why is he stuck in the middle now with no backstory or characteristics of his own

[crysta1ized]

the fact that fluke put out his own eyes is so smart and symbolic.

he’s the (only) one who saw everything, therefore knows everything.

but his guilt ended up eating him alive, like tee, so he put them out so he couldn’t see anything that would put him in this position again.

damn, he got his eyes privileges revoked!

[syrena-del-mar]

Selfish Desires and the Class War: Dead Friend Forever

Ever since @nyxelestia's great additions to my tags about how Phee has been able to process his grief in comparison to Tan, and succinctly stated how class theorists regard poverty as a type of violence, I can't help but take a bit of a socio-economic look at the DFF's group of friends. Particularly, episode 10 really served to solidify my theory on the underlying commentary DFF is making regarding selfishness and the different abilities to skirt punishment dependent on class.

For this one, I'm going to break this down in a couple of categories: first, I'm going to explain Hobbes' theory on human nature and Marx's theory on class wars. Then I will be listing out the 'class types' each one of the DFF boys are in (sans White). Finally I will be analyzing the THC gang with Non, then Phee and New.

Keep in mind that here I will be defining 'selfish desires' as to the innate human inclination to prioritize one's own needs, wants, and interests over that of others. Meanwhile class war/conflict will be in reference to the societal divide into different classes dependant on their relationship to their means of production and value.

Human Nature According to Hobbes

In Hobbes' 'Leviathan', he delves into understanding human nature. His conclusion is probably best summarized by his most known phrase, "'the state of nature." In this state of nature, where Hobbes hypothesized about a life where there is no government, no laws, or state of order, just simply individuals that are able to live without constraints. Hobbes found that life would be "solitary, poor, nasty, short, and brutish."

Hobbes' comes to the conclusion, that absence of societal constraints, humans are driven by desire to secure their own survival and fulfill their desires. Hobbes states that there is an universal, fundamental drive for self-preservation that leads to a state of equality among humans. Yey, instead of being able to live in harmony, the equality, particularly in vulnerability to harm and death, breeds competition since it is human nature to scrounge, secure, and vie for resources— even when it means taking advantage of one another.

Central to Hobbes' theory of human nature is fear—fear of others, fear of harm and fear of uncertainty. Without structure, humans are trapped in a perpetual state of insecurity, creating a 'war of all against all'. Hobbes acknowledges that individuals have natural rights, particularly the right to self-preservation but with a lack of governing authority, the enforcement to this right is essentially meaningless.

Tldr; there are four main components to human nature: self-preservation, fear and insecurity, equality and competition, and natural rights.

Theory of Class Wars

Now, enter Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels and we have the theory that a society is divided into two classes: the bourgeoisie and the proletariats. The bourgeoisie, own the means of production and are able to explore the labor of the proletariat for profit, which ends up leading to human alienation and inequality.

When it comes to the relationship of selfish desires and class war, at its core, the idea instills that a capitalist system incentivizes and rewards the selfish pursuits among the bourgeoisie. The accumulation of wealth and exploitation of labor and the quest for profit are the driving forces between constructing and maintaining class inequalities.

Dead Friends Forever: The Intersection of Social Class Divide and Selfish Desires

The thing about Dead Friend Forever is that there is a visible class division between Por and Non, which drowns out the undercurrent class differences between the rest of the DFF gang.

Por: He is born into power and higher class. His mother ever states "Do you think I'll be in trouble for kind of thing?" He is born into awareness of his status and the privilege.

Jin: Just from the house that he lives, you can tell that he is relatively well off. The finishes in the house both interior and the exterior show that his family, while not as rich as Por, are likely more than financially stable.

Phee: His dad is a police inspector, which likely provides decent money, as he is able to send his son to a private school on a single household income.

Fluke: We're given enough information that we know he wants to be a doctor and make his mom proud, he's attending tutoring classes and there's no mention of money issues.

Top: No mention of struggling for money, can safely assume that he lives comfortably.

Tee: Struggling, has a lot of debts to Uncle Joe in order to keep his dad alive.

New/Non: Their whole family is struggling even before Non went missing. What little money they had was sent over to New, even taking on debts to be able to provide for him abroad. They were one paycheck away from losing everything, which they eventually did.

Non and the THC Gang

Aside from Tee, the main group are all born into various levels of wealth and privilege, whether it be purely monetary or with the jobs of their parents, so they're able to navigate their life with an air of entitlement. Their desires are all shaped by the comforts and opportunities that their status affords them. Por's family alone was able to get their high school film reported on and with a viewing, merely with the mother's flippant mention of the project. Not to mention that Por's mother explicitly sets the tone of how she would be treated compared to Non's mom. It's a stark contrast, Non stands out as the outsider, not only due to his lack of friends in the school, but also marginalized by his lack of wealth and social standing in comparison to the rest of the gang. And in an odd way, it's likely why he felt a certain degree of kinship with Tee, who is the only other individual visibly struggling to survive, even if he mostly keeps his money troubles away from his group of friends.

The whole reason Non even gets involved with the group is because the group, particularly Por and Fluke, are driven by their hunger for success and recognition. Por likely wanted his parents to find some pride in him and Fluke needs it to round out his resume when applying to medical school. They desperately want to win the sponsorship, so they need and use Non— not as an equal but as a means to an end. They exploit his talent in scriptwriting and they use him as a pawn, not even inviting him to the presentation when its Non's script their using. Hell, they barely could stand being close enough to take a picture with Non. They quite literally use him as a pawn, an easy exploit, reminiscent of Hobbes' notion of self-interest as a driving force.

As the show continues on, the exploitation of Non takes on darker shades, echoing Hobbes bleak depiction of the state of nature. The initial bullying, that is rooted in class-based prejudices, transforms into a calculated campaign of cruelty. While Tee might be struggling financially, he's actually the true leader of the group. Sure, Por may have the money, but the guys only follow what Tee wants. Top and Tee use Non's marginalization against him, almost as if vultures feeding on the weaker. Top doesn't have to pay for the camera and Tee is able to find Uncle Joe's next victim for the horse accounts, a complete parallel of Hobbes' description of the strong dominating the weak in the absence of a social contract. In doing so Non, the 'marginalized' becomes fodder for the selfish desires of Tee and Top, initiating a chain-reaction event to Non's detriment.

While Por, Tee, and Top have the more obvious benefits with how Non is treated, so does Fluke. Fluke, in the hierarchy of status within the group, is at the bottom rung. With Non there he's able to be treated better and he no longer is the scapegoat. He admits it in this episode. He needed Non to be mistreated, because he feared being targeted by the rest of the THC gang, and having Non around kept everyone else's attention off of him. He was no longer the one being harrassed. He's able to sacrifice Non for his own benefit.

The thing about Fluke is that he doesn't overtly try to harm Non, not in the same way that the others do. No, his covert damage that he causes Non is in his silence. He sees Top destroy the camera, Tee come up with the idea to target Non, he sees Jin film Non and Kru Keng, he even questions Jin's intentions to film, but he's spineless. He cares more for himself, he prioritizes his self-preservation. He maintains the status quo and utilizes Non's weakness so that he isn't the next target.

Initially, Jin's treatment of Non seems to defy the expected narrative of class exploitation, since out of the group he's the one that is the most compassionate and understanding. From a Marxist perspective, this initial compassion could be understood as an acknowledgment of the inherent inequalities that exist between the affluent and the marginalized. Jin's actions might suggest a fleeting moment of solidarity, recognizing and acknowledging Non's humanity beyond his status. However, his demeanor shifts dramatically when he realizes that Non doesn't reciprocate his romantic feelings and worsens when he sees him with Kru Keng.

Hobbesian human nature, which is driven by the pursuit of power and self-interest, comes to the forefront as Jin's wounded pride and sense of rejection fuel his actions. In Hobbes' state of nature, individuals are driven by their desires and fears leading to betrayal and conflict. His change in behavior to Non reflects this as he seeks to assert dominance and control in the face of perceived rejection by punishing Non. Jin's betrayal of Non's trust and kindness underscores the harsh realities of class divides, where compassion can quickly give way to exploitation. Hobbes argued that individuals in the state of nature are in constant competition for power and self-preservation, here Jin's realization that Non does not reciprocate his feelings leaves him feeling vulnerable and exposed.

Non's role as a commodity within the framework becomes clear as filming continues. His talent is valued solely for its ability to bring profit and success to the friends. Yet, despite his contributions, Non remains alienated from the fruits of his labor, he's always the worker and never the leader. Continuing this trend of being a pawn in group's quest for recognition. Marx's concept of false consciousness is evident, since Non remains unaware of the true nature of his exploitation until its too late.

The group needs to get rid of Non, because he's become a lose cannon. Tee needs him delivered to his Uncle, so that he can survive and continue to receive the payments he needs to keep his dad alive. The depths of their depravity are laid bare and echoes both Hobbes' and Marx's grim assessments of human nature intertwined with class conflict. Non becomes a victim to their cruelty, to their selfish desires, and the stark reality of coming from a poor family. He disappears into the abyss of the mafia, while the rest of the group continue to live their lives unperturbed, shielded by their wealth and privilege.

Interestingly enough, every single one of the guys that come from a better socio-economic status have begged for Non's forgiveness while under the influence of New's hallucinogens. The only one who doesn't is Tee. Yes, he is under the distress of confessing his crimes since Fluke is holding White hostage, but he's the only one that is willing to admit fault and ask for forgiveness without having to hallucinate Non's face or his voice. All this leaves me asking, what depths of betrayal and exploitation were the THC gang willing to sink to in their quest for dominance? Did Tee's penance begin when attempted to help Non escape his Uncle Joe? Was Non actually able to escape or had they sent him to his death?

2. Phee and New/Tan

Even through Phee and New, we can see Hobbesian and Marxist themes in their different versions of grief they experience over Non's disappearance.

New embodies the the essence of Hobbesian human nature, bringing around the idea of 'war of all against all'. His relentless pursuit of revenge becomes a primal instinct for survival, since he has lost everything good in his life. His brother, his childhood home, his education, his mother, and finally his father, in that very order, over the span of three years. New's grief over the disappearance of Non becomes a consuming force that propels him into a world of darkness. In Hobbes' state of nature, individuals are typically driven by self-interest and the pursuit of power, which New's quest of revenge reflects this fundamental aspect. His quest against the friends responsible isn't solely about revenge, but it's a desperate attempt to assert agency and justice in a world that has denied his family both.

Marx argues that in a capitalist society, the bourgeoisie will exploit the proletariat for profit, perpetuating class struggles. Non was exploited for his script, but New represents the proletariat, the oppressed working class fighting back against the forces of oppression. His revenge is a revolt against the oppressive structures of class inequality that have marginalized his whole family. In Marxist terms, his journey is a symbol of the proletariat struggle against exploitation and injustice, which echos the revolutionist spirit of Marxism.

On the other hand, Phee, who is financially well-off and still has his father, represents the privilege and the detachment from the struggles of the proletariat. He never fully understood why Non wasn't receptive to his help, similarly he's not completely understanding New's own thirst for revenge. While Phee is initially driven by a desire to uncover the truth about Non's disappearance, and while he still loves Non, it's mostly driven by guilt and grief within the context of privilege. Phee has things, people, in his life that still matter outside of Non. Yes, he loved Non, but he's able to move on from his grief, reflecting the detachment and apathy that can settle in with privilege. Under Marx's critique of the bourgeoisie, who exploit the proletarian, it's because Phee still has his Dad and other things he loves in life that he is able to move on from the type of anger in grief that New finds himself overwhelmed in.

It's going to be interesting where Phee and New's friendships heads in the last two episodes. Will it New and Phee collide in a violent confrontation that mirrors the clash between the oppressed and the privileged? Is DFF trying to make a comment on the class war where New's relentless pursuit of revenge against the THC gang represents the proletariat's revolt against exploitation, while Phee's detachment echoes the bourgeoisie's indifference to the plight of the marginalized? Or it will show that Phee and New are able to put their social status aside in order to find revenge against the true bourgeoisies, in this case the THC gang, that exploited Non for all his worth until ultimately destroying him.

Final Thoughts

While this episode may feel significantly weaker in comparison to the last five, I think it's providing us with the necessary exposition as we head into our final two episodes. We're seeing the destruction of the 'bourgeoisie' by their own hands with just a little nudge from the sole proletariat. As Hobbes would likely agree, it's a dog eat dog world in that cabin. It always had been with Top, Por, Tee, Fluke and Jin. There was an equality between them, but now with an outside force, their bonds are breaking and they are willing to kill each other just to survive.

Dead Friend Forever is going beyond the standard slasher genre, even beyond horror. I truly think it's making social commentary regarding the classes and human nature. It's going to be interesting to see who comes out the survivor of this party from hell, if there is anyone.

Tagging @slayerkitty for DFF's meta round up.

[the-pink-quill]

Fluke has lost it completely. What do you mean your career as a doctor will be ruined if your crimes are exposed? There's a murderer (human or spectral) in the woods who's out to get you. Fluke, dumbass, you can't become a doctor if you're dead.

On another note, imagine choosing death over disappointing your mom. Those are some solid mommy issues.

[raelle-writing]

DFF Ep9 Recap: Who knows what?

Co-credit for this analysis goes to @kerrikins!

Let's take a moment to remember what, if anything, each of the DFF characters knows about what happened to Non (so far) now that we've made it back to the present.

Disclaimer: this is based on what we know as of episode 9, though there's a potential that any/all characters know more and we'll find that out later!

Por:

As far as we know, Por knows the least, which probably explains why he's so chill about Non coming up in the present. All he really knows is that they stole the script, and that Top and Tee took Non away. And he knows that Tee is the reason Non opened the bank account.

Top:

Top knows Non didn't break the camera. He knows Tee set Non up to take the fall for him. He knows Non was involved with Keng and saw them together firsthand. He knows they stole the script, and he knows that Tee was the reason Non opened the accounts.

Top was also the one who helped Tee take Non away before he disappeared, so he likely knows that Tee's family was involved in that disappearance.

We can speculate that Top might know more than that. Top might know just how shady Tee's family is, because they're very close. We see in episode 6 that Tee asks Top for a "favor" and then Top is one of the only ones who doesn't open an account later... it seems like Top knows better than anyone else just what kind of stuff Tee and his family are into, and doesn't care.

Fluke:

Fluke knows a lot. Fluke knows that Top broke the camera and Tee set up Non for it. He knows that they stole the script and that Tee and Top took Non away. He also knows that Non said that the reason he got them to open the accounts was due to Tee.

Fluke also knows that Jin took the video that was later released... and later in the present, he says he knows that Tee was the one who released the video.

n the present, Fluke also knows that Tee's uncle is the one behind the money laundering. Since he neither seems surprised or upset about the information, it's likely that the rest of the original group knows it as well.

Tee:

Tee knows that Top broke the camera, he knows he framed Non for it, and he knows that he got Non wrapped up in money laundering. He knows that Non was involved with Keng to get money. He knows that they stole the script and that they took Non to Tee’s uncle, and he may be the last one to see Non alive.

Jin:

Jin knows that he took the video, and he also knows that they stole the script and that Tee and Top took Non away. He also knows that Non said that the reason he got them to open the accounts was due to Tee.

Jin also suspected that Non wasn't the one who broke the camera, but he never got confirmation. And he knows that Non repaid Por for the camera, but not where he got the money.

Phee and Tan:

They know that Non’s script was stolen and that Non was supposed to have been on a trip with the boys when they disappeared. They know that Non was caught in a video with Keng.

They've also read over the script that Non left behind, which included details about being framed, being forced into doing dirty work for money, etc.

Phee knows (and I'm sure told Tan) about Non being involved with the accounts. But Non must not have told Phee every detail, because if he did, Phee and Tan would've focused more on going after Tee instead of sussing information out of Jin or the others.

In the present, they know that Non definitely filmed with the boys at some point, but not when. They know that Por felt guilty.

Tan knows that Fluke pointed the finger at Tee for the camera breaking and the video release, and Fluke also says that they "killed someone."

Phee knows that Jin is hallucinating Keng in the temple, but he doesn't know why.

What Phee and Tan don't know:

Why and how Non got wrapped up in the accounts

What and who his connection to the accounts was

Why he got involved with Keng

Who took the video (not even Non knew this, so whoever posted it used a burner)

Who released it

Where Non was when he disappeared or who he was with

White:

As far as we know, so far, White doesn't know anything. All he knows is that Non was a "friend" of the group who disappeared, and he's seen a video of all of them partying.

White didn't even know who Tee's uncle ins, so it's safe to say he's fairly innocent. But now, at least, he knows that Tee's family is into shady stuff, and he also heard Fluke talking about "killing, video releases, and broken cameras."

If I missed anything, let me know!

[timefortee]

[fracturediron]

I've honestly found Dead Friend Forever to be too campy to ever be scary (like the masks look exactly like the sort of paper mache/mod rock thing to be made by highschoolers lol).

Like has it definitely made me highly uncomfortable? Yeah, when it came to more realistic stuff like the bullying and Non's grooming. But I never found DFF scary. It's more of a thriller/mystery with the trappings of horror then an actual scary horror for me.

Bur that scene of Fluke holding the needles in his hands had me going, "No, surely not." And then... yep, he did it. Right in the eyes. That's probably the first moment of DFF that actually horrified me. Nothing to make you wanna crawl up into your own skin more than some good old eye trauma

[everytimeigetmoody]

okay, lots of people think white is gonna be the final girl but i wholeheartedly disagree and hope he's not. let's really picture this together.

white is discovered on the road, crying and bloody, after leaving behind all of these people his boyfriend was friends with.

are you satisfied with that? that is so anticlimactic. white has been wielding a tripod and getting yelled at by fluke for most of this series. he most likely was not involved with non at all considering he only just came into the picture. to have white be the only one get out alive would just be so boring.

i think he's gonna end up being collateral. i think he's gonna be killed in a way that makes tee feel guilty or in a way that shows non has lost sight of what really matters because he's killing an innocent person.

white is an innocent lamb led to slaughter.

[having-conniptions]

Fluke and morals/guilt vs selfishness in DFF Ep 4

I find it very interesting how hard it is to see through Fluke and his motivations, not just in this episode but also the ones leading up to it.

Without context, some of his actions could be interpreted as compassion and even guilt.

His desperate attempts to save Por and Top and his devastated reaction when Por dies could be him truly caring about his friends and wanting them to be okay.

He's repeatedly shown staring at his bloody hands, stained with Por's blood. The imagery of blood on someone's hands is often connected to guilt, which fits especially well the second time he does it. When he's just told his friends that Por is dead and they rush inside, leaving him there alone. He couldn't save Por. The guilt is eating him alive.

But is that really what it is?

Because we've seen what he can be like. Threatening and hurting people so they don't talk about what happened. We know he's terrified of being a suspect, let alone being convicted of anything, because that would squash his chances of ever becoming a doctor. We know that this is the selfish motivation for at least some of his actions.

This puts everything he does in a different light. Him wanting to save his friends might just be the attempt to prevent more people from dying so he won't get into any trouble with the police.

And to get back to the blood on his hands, because I absolutely loved what I thought was very on-the-nose guilt symbolism, there might be a different type of guilt that's being played at here. Maybe, this is not about him feeling guilty. Maybe it is about him being found guilty, the blood on his hands proving that he was involved in his friend's death. So yes, this is about guilt, but possibly not the emotional kind but in a legal sense.

The thing is, none of this has to be just one thing or the other. Not all of his actions have to be selfish just because he is shown to act selfishly. None of his actions have to be purely selfish or purely selfless. They could be a mix of both, with endless possibilities for which reason is stronger in which situation. We simply don't know.

And that's what makes Fluke such an interesting character in my eyes and I'm so excited to find out more about him.