#deadbeat talks. | Explore Tumblr posts and blogs

possamble · 7 months ago

Note

What are your headcanons about Marcille's mom if you have any? It's interesting that what drew Donato to her was cause she lived the history he studied, or that was said somewhere at least. She must've had an interesting life.

so this was going to be just a normal answer but then I realized I have a Lot of Things To Say. so here goes, a compilation of what we know for a fact from the canon, what I've extrapolated from the visual cues and details, and my theories based on all of that.

Things we know for a fact about Marcille's mother because they were explicitly stated in the manga and supplemental materials:

She was a court mage for a Tall-man kingdom at the southern part of the Northern Continent

Donato, a court historian, fell in love with her because she had lived through the history he was studying, and he courted her for 17 years (age 15 to 32) before getting married

She was a cheerful person who rarely showed extreme emotion and took things as they came

She always cooked a huge meal for Marcille on her birthdays

She remarried a gnome after Donato's death and a short distance away from Marcille's childhood home

Pipi, Marcille's pet bird, was actually older than Marcille and originally belonged to her mother (bird died at 62)

She was extremely heartbroken when Donato died and ultimately ended up instilling a deep fear of mortality in Marcille with her words

the only time she showed extreme emotion in front of her family was when Donato could no longer eat his favourite dish near the end of his life.

She scolded Marcille for being cruel to ants (implying she can have a stern side when needed)

Things that are explicitly shown but mostly through visual cues

She has a very distinctive style of dress always involving a ribbon choker (mirroring Marcille's habit of always wearing a matching choker with any of her outfits that don't cover her neck)

She was almost stereotypically good at housekeeping and traditionally "wifely" things (very frequently depicted wearing an apron or doing some domestic chore when not at work, seems to have been an avid cook).

She knits? (also, note the affectionate smile as she's looking at Donato and Marcille reading a book together in the full panel)

She was as excited for Marcille's milestones as Donato was.

She didn't tell Marcille much about elven food

(there are a couple things that this panel in particular implies:

She lived a good deal of her life (if not being born and raised) in a mainly elven country in the West, implied by her knowing enough of an elven region's cuisine to prefer Tall-man food over it

seems to have a pretty carefree and casual demeanour overall, if this is how she replied to Marcille asking her about it (sounds like she never gave her culinary preferences that much thought to begin with)

slightly related to number 2, it seems like she and Marcille had a fairly casual parent-child dynamic (especially in comparison to the Toudens' memory of their father)

(local elf tastes Italian food once and never goes back))

However, she seems a lot more... serious in most of the other times we see her? Almost like the very stereotypical archetype of a graceful elf.

Subsequent conclusions about her personality:

Usually pretty carefree and cheerful at home, has been a loving and attentive parent throughout Marcille's childhood (while not being so doting that she didn't discipline Marcille).

Slightly more conjectural theories on her personality:

Had a much more graceful and professional personality at work, which would explain the more serious portraits we see of her.

Given that both she and Donato had positions at the royal court, it seems a little odd that she'd go out of her way to do all the housework herself, so maybe she just enjoyed doing it?

Now taping all the evidence together and toeing the line between analysis and fanfiction:

It's clear that she loved Donato very much and was utterly devastated by losing him. But there's one thing that really stuck out to me in what little we see of her:

Doesn't she seem... angry? The way she's gritting her teeth, clutching the tablecloth, and how this is the first and only time we see her eyes opened that wide. In the following panel, you see her being quiet and dejected after her initial outburst. She's still crying very intensely, but her brows are furrowed, and she's not really responding to Donato's affection in her body language.

We're not told the details of how she felt about losing Donato other than that it upset her. But this, to me, implies that she was angry and resented that he was aging, that the end of his life was approaching. An "it's not fair" type of preemptive grief. And if this was the first and last time she cried like this in front of her family, she was either very good at coping in private... or very bad at letting herself feel unpleasant emotions until they become unavoidable and end up overwhelming her.

It's not too remarkable a detail on the surface. It's even reminiscent of what the audience has seen of Marcille. But... when it comes to the big picture, you'd think an elf who voluntarily chose to marry a tall-man and have a half-elf child would have been better prepared for this.

It kind of recontextualizes her cheerfulness to me.

"I'm sure everything's gonna be okay!" (or some variation thereof, depending on what translation you have).

And this is stated to contrast her extreme grief when finally confronting Donato's failing body and eventual death. But I'm wondering if... maybe this optimism was why she was so upset. What if she went into all of it thinking "everything's gonna be okay"? What if she was a little young by elven standards, and just followed her heart thinking that her own resilience would get her through anything?

Of course, only to get completely overwhelmed when she actually loses Donato. She turns into a completely different person. And that's heartbreaking on its own-- but what the audience sees is the effect it had on Marcille. Can you imagine being her, watching your invincible and upbeat mother suddenly lose all the light in her eyes in one go?

I've already made a huge post about how I think Marcille models her "work persona" off her mother, but another thing that stuck with me as I was looking for more details in the manga was this:

copy pasting from the other post i made about it lmao it's like... the second she resigns herself to lifelong pain and terror, there's another portrait of her mother facing her like this. with their heads bowed, in mirrored body language of resignation and despair and sorrow. Except it's posed like Marcille is still looking at her mother but her mother is looking away.

It took me a second to realize, but I think that it's a visual metaphor for the fact that Marcille's mother was the only long-lived role model she had-- and she failed to model healthy grief for her daughter. I don't say this as an accusation or to disparage her as a character, but just as a matter of fact. In her, Marcille was seeing herself older and losing a short-lived spouse or loved one of her own, and all she saw was hopelessness.

But her mother didn't mean to instill hopelessness and terror in her. She wasn't really thinking of how it would truly affect Marcille at all (at least, that's how I'm interpreting her looking down and away from Marcille in the metaphor), she was just sad. And she, in her own way, was trying to protect her daughter and help her prepare for future losses.

What she meant was "loss is inevitable, and you have to learn how to be in pain but live on anyway." What Marcille heard was "loss is inevitable, and you will be scared and hurt for the rest of your life."

Again. Marcille's mother doesn't feature explicitly in the story the way her father does -- but in so many ways, her shadow, her silhouette, her reflection is always hanging over Marcille.

All that to say... headcanon-wise (everything from here on is 100% without evidence lmao), I'd like to think that she matured and realized that she failed Marcille. I imagine her being regretful about it, wanting a chance to fix it but never finding a way to insert herself back into Marcille's life when Marcille is so so so busy becoming the most accomplished mage possible. I imagine her being herself again, now, so many years after her loss and after remarrying -- but with her cheerfulness tempered with a lot more wisdom and the pain of having gone through loss like that. I think the second Marcille actually tells her what happened in the dungeon, she'd want to go running to her daughter again -- if Marcille tells her the full truth instead of just being embarrassed she let things get that far. (oh, the tragedy of her wanting to be more like her mother and an accomplished adult who doesn't need to be babied... being embarrassed to actually tell her mother how much she fucked up...)

There's also the tension of her having remarried -- I know that there's at least a little bit of resentment that Marcille harbours about that, because she's childish like that at heart even if she makes an effort not to externalize it. I think that her mother would be aware of that, potentially adding to her sense of guilt and apprehension at trying to reappear/intrude on Marcille's life. I honestly don't think Marcille has met her stepfather -- or even considers him a stepfather rather than "mama's new husband" and kind of a total stranger. I think she and her mother actively don't talk about it in their correspondence, like an elephant in the room.

but, ultimately, I think her mother is on her side no matter what. Ancient magic? Dark necromancy? Sure, she'll feel guilty and like she was partially responsible for setting Marcille down such a painful path, but she wouldn't care. that's her daughter!! she would've moved back west and been petitioning for her at the court, buying a house right next to the Canaries barracks and visiting her every day that she wasn't on a mission. And if her husband had opinions on Marcille becoming a "dark arts user," he either gets over it or it's divorce with him. Yes, she might have had her optimism completely humbled by losing Donato like that -- but she's still headstrong and self-assured and she doesn't care what people think of her. It's her way or the highway and she's always going to be in Marcille's corner.

(She also needs a name lol. I went with Juno, just to be cute about "Marcille"s closest real life equivalent being Marcella, which is the female version of Marcellus, which in turn is a diminutive of Marcus, which was derived from Mars. Absolutely in love with Marcille potentially being named after Ares/Mars the fucking god of war btw)

#asks #she could easily be interpreted as distant or neglectful after Donato's death too #with how little involvement she has in Marcille's life/the fact that Marcille doesn't even mention her when talking about her life prospect #and that's fair! I will argue to hell and back that she was a loving parent when Donato was alive #but there's nothing that suggests she remained a loving parent afterwards #I just think that like... parental relationships are so complicated in dungeon meshi #you cannot deny that the toudens' mother loved them dearly but that she failed them both miserably as a parent #and i think it'd be more compelling if Marcille's mother was a little like that too #not a totally and easily dismissable deadbeat #but someone who truly loves her daughter but was only human herself and couldn't be what Marcille needed at a crucial moment #and regrets it deeply #and that the distance between them is mutually self-imposed by complicated feelings of guilt and fear #and a little resentment from Marcille's side that she hasn't really properly processed #I don't know if I'll ever get around to writing it but i had this idea where Marcille does finally spill the beans to her mom and she just #immediately arrives in Melini #and its awkward for a bit but they do finally have a heart to heart and air it all out #and marcille starts freaking out that her marriage is rocky rn bc her new husband wants her to distance herself from marcille #on account of the crimes and all #marcille's like no you can't blow up your marriage for me and her mother just shuts that shit down #'you didn't choose to be born. i was the one who made that choice for you'#'i brought you into this world and i'll be damned if i don't take responsibility for that the entire way'#'you are entitled to *nothing less* than my unconditional love.'#and obviously that's not a sentiment that's exactly healthy as a universal statement about parenthood #but i think its what her mother would believe and what marcille needs to hear #and dungeon meshi does such a fantastic job at just... letting imperfect things just *be* without having to justify it immediately #it expects the audience to do their own critical thinking #and know that its not trying to make sweeping universal statements in every instance #marcilleposting #marcille donato #junoposting

121 notes · View notes

diamondsunbursts-and-marblehalls · 11 months ago

Text

I love the way that Grover wouldn't even have been able to protect Percy the way he did when they met in school if Percy wasn't the kind of person to befriend and look after someone who he thought couldn't do that themselves.

I love that it didn't occur to Grover that Percy was protecting him because it's not humans Grover is scared of. He's bullied but he just brushes it off because he's never had experience with the kind of monsters that humans can become, Percy didn't let it get to that point.

I love the way it didn't occur to Percy that Grover was protecting him because Percy isn't worried about monsters or gods, Grover protected him from that, but Percy knows people. He's lived with Gabe for years, and that's the kind of monster he's had experience with.

A huge reason that Percy has always been so fearless facing the gods, and continued to be able to protect people the way that he always did, is because of his experience with both kinds of monsters.

He doesn't hesitate to fight Ares on the beach because he recognizes that kind of monster. An arrogant and cruel man who preys on anyone who he thinks can't protect themselves. He's fighting Ares, but he sees who he's been fighting his whole life: Gabe.

Percy never had an issue putting the gods in their place because he was never the type of kid to lay down when someone was walking all over him, and never the type to let anyone else do that. The gods acting the way they did closed the gap between the type of monsters he was used to and the type of monster that came with the job description as a demigod. Everything he went through with Gabe gave him the power he needed to start the fight, and the force he gained as a demigod gave him the power he needed to finish it.

He grew up with someone like Gabe, and instead of following in his footsteps, Percy became the exact opposite of him. Not only that, he became the type of person who won't stand for anyone to be treated the way Gabe treated him and Sally.

He's a force to be reckoned with not only because of his abnormally strong powers as a child of the big three but also because of his worldly experience and understanding that hydras, furies, chimeras and minotaurs aren't the only monsters and that any monster can be beaten.

#i just think he's such a powerful character #we need to talk about the impact that gabe had on his life a little bit more #i also think that posidon being the deadbeat dad who abandoned him and his mom contributed to the percy grew into #he became the type of person who would never abandon anyone #in fact that's his achilles heel #something something #sometimes you become the person you needed when you were at your lowest #percy jackson #grover underwood #gabe ugliano #percy jackon and the olympians #the lightning thief #rick riordan #pjo #pjo series

136 notes · View notes

doublel27 · 4 months ago

Text

@lurkingshan I loved your tags. Hope you don’t mind me stealing them to use here because

Mostly because, Yak gave the biggest younger sibling energy here and I was reminded why, as the oldest, I nearly always vibe harder with the elder sibling. I’m not even mad or disappointed. Younger sibling fails to see the sacrifices that have been made on their behalf or how they’ve been protected from the worst of their family, or worse is mad about it:

Like, the whole fight that Yak and Yei are having is about Yei not involving Yak and treating him like a baby and here is Yak failing to see anything from Yei’s perspective because he’s been sheltered. (This is not all younger siblings but it’s not uncommon)

Dad is only the enemy if you both see him as the enemy and as Yei has been largely shouldering his burdens alone that his parents have left him with, I don’t think Yak ever viewed Dad as the enemy we all did. Yak seemed genuinely pleased that their dad showed up in the boxing gym a few eps ago even if it was to mostly yell at Yak for failing. He seemed upset when Yei cut the conversation short and made him come practice instead of continuing to engage with their dad. As an audience we all got it but, Yak didn’t realize how much Yei had on his plate and what he was struggling with. Some of that is on Yei, but most of it is on their parents (including mom who was like it’s up to you now to take care of your brother) rather than tasking her husband with that, and Dad for just dipping. Some of that is that Yak honestly has never actually thought about it because Yei and Cher take care of everything.

But it’s also easier to make Yei the villain and be mad at Yei because Yei isn’t going to go anywhere. Yei is the most stable adult in Yak’s life (after Cher of course). Yei will take the punches and keep showing up because that’s who he is.

Dad on the other hand is wet paper who cant take a punch and Yak still wants something from him, approval, a second chance at goodbye…which is common amongst the younger siblings.

Yak won’t come around for real until Dad survives cancer and dips on them again. Because that’s how that usually works. Or you know, asks for the deed back or suggests that the boxing gym is part theirs now because his wife helped. 🫠

Anyway, team Yei should stay mad at dad and everyone should have backed him. My bluest boy remains the best and deserves the whole world.

#wandee goodday #wandee goodday the series #yoryak phadetseuk #oyei phadetseuk #phadetseuk boxing #this felt so very real to family dynamics I’ve experienced and witnessed #that I was like no the baby going to bat for the deadbeat parent and fighting the older sibling on their stance #this feels so very honest that someone in the writers room has been here #on either side #someone thought it looked cute #and I hope someone else knew all the eldest siblings would be enraged on Oyei’s behalf #look at everything he’s done for you and will keep doing for you #out here accusing this man of gambling when he’s either in the gym cooking dinner or sexing up cher #he doesn’t have time he has a husband and a bunch of queer gym children #doublel27 talks #I don’t hate yak #but yakdee is a youngest/only relationship #and it shows all the damn time

31 notes · View notes