#casteism discourse

[metamatar]

anurag thakur (mp most known for "goli maaron saalon ko" tr: shoot them [protestors] down) yesterday addresses rahul gandhi in parliament with "jiski jaat ka pata nahi wo ganna ki baat kar raha hai" (tr: he whose caste we don't know dares ask us to count caste) on the requests for a caste census. love the implications – mixed caste marriages (his mother was an italian) leave you casteless or that children of intercaste marriages should have no right to speak on caste or that only if your caste identity is recognisable (something dalit people go lengths to obscure) do you deserve space in public discourse on caste.

modi endorsed this message. tell me again how modi is obc and hindutva is aligned with a new anti caste politics. mixed caste marriages lead to honour killings in this country. intercaste marriage and dining have been central to the public repudiation of casteism bc it relies on caste endogamy and untouchability!

[whatrasudeep]

I'll get so much hate for this but idc. Just read through before spewing brain rot. Open to discuss obviously.

I need y'all to stop with this cultural appropriation shit with bharatanatyam.

For people who don't know the discourse,

"Bharatanatyam is a culturally appropriated and sanitised form of Sadir-attam, a dalit art form".

Wrong on many levels.

1. Bharatanatyam is not the same as sadir. Sadir is considered a precursor but today's Bnat dancers are NOT dancing Sadir. In fact I can say that it is not even Natyam we are doing but that's another discourse

2. Sadir and devadasi/mahari culture was never dalit specific. Members of all castes learnt dance. Padmavati, Jayadeva's wife, was a devadasi and the daughter of a priest. Shantala Devi, the queen of the Hoysalas, was a former devadasi. I forgot the name but an Odia king (simha something. I read it for my junior exam) was a dancer. @ramayantika will know who I'm talking about being an odissi dancer. Y'all can be delulu about this but the proof is literally engraved in stone.

3. Bnat cannot be said is appropriating Sadir items into its fold with hundred percent certainty. Many of the items we perform now are introduced very recently. Many are taken from Kuchipudi. And Sadir itself is a product of Natyashastra. Devadasis danced to padams and javalis written by Brahmins.

5. Upper caste girls are predominantly dancers cos maybe they are the ones who stay in class. Y'all haven't had to sit on a desk convincing a parent to keep their recently "matured" daughter in class or try to tell them that boys can dance too (cos you naively assume misogyny) and them telling you in their caste "oNLy PrOstITuTes DaNcE".

And the worst part is y'all won't know shit about these things if you don't attend classes. This is not something you will find in Quint or whatever. You have to be there to know it.

Don't think that I am in any way denying casteism. I am way too well-read to do that shit atp and I have seen enough. But y'all wanna talk about caste in dance, talk about how lcs can't afford to attend classes because of systemic economic difficulties. Talk about stagnated uc male centric narratives in abhinaya pieces. Talk about the rampant superstitions and misogyny that keeps lc students from pursuing their art. Talk about the nepotism in the field and how it makes the system inherently rigged against outsiders, especially lcs who can't even claim a surname. Those are conversations worth having. Not your hot-takes with no basic fact checking.

[hissterical-nyaan]

What do you hate about desiblr, sorry I got lost

Many many things

I understand that most people on desiblr are still school going teenagers or at least have never been in college and participated in discourse and debate, but you have to realise when you're talking about sensitive topics you have to be open to criticism and you also have to realise there are a lot of impressionable minds around who are reading what you post. What I have seen recently is a very big surge of right-wingers and conservative rhetoric that too coming from these 16-17yr old kids who are encouraged by other adults here. It's wild how people are literally romanticising casteism and communalism 💀 I don't think you guys realise what kind of posts you are reblogging. This is the case with many of my mutuals too and it's worrying because they're kids and they're eating up RW content

I think many parts of desiblr are just not ready to talk about serious issues and discourses cause they have 0 knowledge of the actual world or even theory. They're just saying whatever they *feel* is right. This is not how debates work. I understand most of us grow in a conservative environment but it's on you to read up stuff before opening your mouth

Apart from that it's just annoying because people keep fighting and sending hate on petty things 💀 maybe I've just outgrown desiblr

It's definitely nice having more Indian friends who can understand me but the whole desiblr? No thanks

[genderjeopardy]

the hindutva fascist regime has picked up a considerable amount of steam since jan 22, the date of the consecration of the ayodhya ram mandir (which stands on the site of the now-illegitimately-demolished babri masjid; watch the events leading upto the demolition here).

Media, politicians, actors, influencers, and the common hindu upper-caste public has been emboldened, with most mainstream discourse basically sounding indistinguishable to what zionists have been preaching (or what nazis had been preaching); how Muslims are outsiders, betrayers, traitors hatching an evil, treacherous plan to enslave the Hindu majority and interrupt their "renaissance", how Muslim religious associations control the "deep state", how the "Indian" (read; hindu) has been tortured and oppressed by the Muslim kings (mainly referring to the mughal dynasty and the sultanate) and how great the previous Hindu kings were (they weren't; oppression and subjugation based on caste was rife during the gupta dynasty, along with slavery). How Islam is intrinsically a "wrong" faith to follow, with its misogyny and extremism (which is prevalent in like, literally every religion), how central education which teaches about the historical existence of casteism and misogyny perpetrated under/by the upper caste-elite hegemony is part of the "islamist agenda", etc etc, the usual islamophobic points

As if that wasnt enough, the govt has also flagrantly broke the rules regarding the awarding of national honours (theres a limit of three), by awarding the Bharat Ratna (highest civilian honour) to politicians who facilitated the babri masjid demolition in 1992

Even now, the events of haldwani are obvs being spinned by the state (and the mainstream media obvs relays it like its gospel), with baseless accusations of the usage of petrol bombs and arson of a police station being thrown at the muslim protestors. both legacy and social media are being filled with pictures and videos of injured police officers as a way to garner sympathy, but most importantly, to vilify an already hated community in muslims. the thing is, if you dig a little deeper, there are already reports surfacing on twitter that one of the 6 who died was a 16-year old boy, and there are also videos where the police are pelting stones at muslims, manhandling and thrashing muslim women, and shooting at their doors at night. oh and btw the hindutva mobs didnt just appear out of thin air, they were helped and supported by the police, who for some very weird reason spared them from the "shoot-on-sight" orders as they vandalized the muslim neighbourhood, pelted stones, and threatened to r*pe muslim women, while occasionally also invoking the name of hindu deities.

The act of pelting stones becomes even more egregious as the act has generally been associated to muslim communities by the right wing (and thus by all of mainstream media). The act is not just seen as "oh look at these violent muslim protestors", its basically seen as an act of anti-national treason, the definitive "proof" that a social group doesnt deserve to live in this country, is "undesirable", and is thus "plotting" against the Hindu ethnostate (which is smtg that cannot be questioned). Any event which harms muslims either physically (via pogroms like in 2002 gujarat) or symbolically (demolition of mosques and other "muslim" structures, including even "muslim" sounding names of cities and streets), the fascist media mill starts churning out "henious" acts of "treachery" committed by muslim "anti-nationals", which range from stone-pelting to sexual abuse to perceived persecution of "innocent hindus".

while videos of police brutality exacted upon Haldwani muslims are making rounds on twitter, the atmosphere is definitely tilted against the victims, and in favor of the oppressors. the chief minister of the state, Pushkar Singh Dhami, has already given his justifications on the police's actions as "cracking down on riotous elements", with most of the indian public equally supportive in all of their savage, barbaric fascist glee, with open calls of "painting the nation saffron (dogwhistle for a pogrom, if you didnt get it)" if Dhami called upon the Hindutva forces. Heres a senior journalist from our state-owned news outlet, DD News, using disgusting language to portray all Muslims living in uttarakhand as "m*lecch" (means parasitic outsiders, generally regarded as an ethnic/casteist slur)

another thing of note is that if you use the reasoning of "illegality" to demolish Muslim institutions, the structures most in (theoretical) risk are HINDU temples, which ofc can be (and have been) erected almost anywhere without any prior legal greenlight. infact, the hindutva right had erected a makeshift temple right beside the charminar in hyderabad, in order to stoke suspicion that yet another structure made by a muslim ruler was infact, made upon the demolished ruins of a hindu temple. the far-right had already made their modus operandi v clear when the ram temple campaign began in 1992, but now the world can see it take place in front of their eyes. and before you ask, yes, the gyanlakshmi temple had already been deemed illegitimate by the Archaeological Survey of India as per a Right to Information petition.

To conclude, things are really, reallly, really getting terrible here. Yes, indian muslims are not facing a collective opposition of the Great Western Powers in US, UK, France, Germany, etc., but indian muslims make one of the largest muslim communities in the world, despite being a minority. And this fascist project endangers them ALL, not just the poor, the isolated, the "bigoted", the extremists, the "undesirables". and also it has its crosshairs away from muslim communities as well, including the oppressed castes, indigenous tribes, christians, buddhists, women (incl. upper caste women ofc), queer people, and almost anyone who dare opposes (or could potentially oppose) the Hindu ethnostate, which includes the political opposition, academics, journalists, writers, influencers (incl. actors and sportpersons), etc. As a matter of fact, a recent Supreme Court ruling has tweaked the UAPA (Unlawful Activities Prevent Act), (which has been much abused over the past 10-15 years to illegitimately throw "anti-national/seditious" protestors of the regime into prison with little to no investigation or justice), so now jail has become the "rule", while "bail" has become the "exception"; basically meaning that an already draconian, repressive, undemocratic and brutal law has become even more repressive.

The entire nation, including the oppressed and the oppressor classes are bracing for a descend into pure fascistic totalitarianism, and i dont need to tell you how much innocent blood would be shed, how the very identity and culture of muslims and other minorities in india is dangling on a tightrope. i am again begging anyone who comes across this post to spread it as far as they can; friends, family, relatives, school/college/work mates, journalists, political representatives, influencers, whoever you can grab. an entire state preparing to brutally subordinate Indian muslims (which alone amount to a population of around a 100 million) and other minorities is newsworthy, worthy of international attention and concern. ofc it wont be easy, as the hindutva right not only has spread its poisonous wings overseas, but the money they earn there is sent back to Hindutva organisations in India (there was actually a big kerfuffle in the late 90s-early 00s abt legitimacy of such "donations"; the bureaucrat standing in opposition to those orgs was then institutionally boycotted and booted out of the Indian Tax department). as such they have gained considerable social capital there as well (vivek ramaswamy running as a GOP candidate, Sunak is a sitting UK PM, etc). still, i request you all to show the same energy and effort that you have given rightfully to palestine, to indian muslims as well. they have already suffered a lot, but we are all afraid that worse is yet to come 🙏🙏🙏

so far, nearly 3 weeks on from the inauguration of ram mandir, indian authorities have demolished as many masjids and/or madrasas.

30.01.24 - akhoonji masjid & madrasa in delhi, also destroying a cemetery, shrine and all the students’ belongings in the process.

01.02.24 - a madrasa in maharashtra despite facing opposition from local muslims and one day before its scheduled court appeal.

08.02.24 - a masjid & madrasa in uttarakhand. this comes one day after uttarakhand became the first state to pass the uniform civil code (x, x) which aims to apply a ‘hindu code’ to all indians, infringing on the rights of dalits, adivasis, sikhs, christians, buddhists and muslims (i.e. anybody non-hindu) to practice their religion/lifestyle. muslim women protesting the demolition were lathi-charged (beaten with sticks) by police, a shoot-on-sight order was given resulting in 6 muslims killed and 300+ injured in the riots that followed, a curfew was put in place during which hindutva mobs burned down muslim homes and businesses while shouting abuse at muslims.

as always, no prior notice was given and bjp used it’s gold-standard excuse for each demolition, citing ‘illegal encroachment’.

in addition to these masjid demolitions, indian authorities bulldozed 2 neighbourhoods (ghettos, really) in the same timeframe and also without prior notice:

01.02.24 - jasola slum, which, having been around for at least 16 years, should not have been demolished without providing alternative housing, as the delhi slum policy states for slums which came up before 2015. obviously, housing hasn’t been provided.

06.02.24 - panchsheel nagar in mumbai which, having been around since 2011, entitled residents to paid rehabilitation, which has also not been given. this has left over 110 families homeless.

the demographic of both neighbourhoods, surprise surprise, is overwhelmingly muslim, buddhist and dalit.

bjp is enjoying the cover it is receiving from israel’s genocide in palestine to do whatever it wants and is getting bolder by the day. this ‘bulldozer justice’ has been happening for years, but not at such a rapid rate as it is now.

[artistic-arborealist]

"the professions that got to go to space first are all grey and green ... but it’s not because of their ~caste~, it’s because ~those are the castes that happen to work in space colonization related jobs~!" I don't understand your distinction here. If all jobs that get to go to space first are of a certain caste, then it's *because of their caste* that they get to go to space.

So, what I was trying to say is that no one thought, “I hate purples and oranges! They don’t ~deserve~ to be the first Amentans to see space! And so I’m going to choose other castes ~because I like them better~!”

But they did choose astronauts to go to space first, because going to space is ~literally their job~! And this did result in greens and greys being the first to space! But it wasn’t ~because of casteism~!

So, what I was saying is that it’s only casteist in the sense that ~having a caste system at all~ is casteist! (So not really, in any meaningful sense of the word!)

[enigma-the-mysterious]

Anyone who smugly tells you Hinduism is a religion of peace, the most tolerant of all religions, acts "holier than thou" is lying. Casteism exists. Casteism kills. Casteism produces rape victims. Casteism gives rise to some of the most heinous hate crimes. A Dalit woman is one of the most downtrodden and exploited person in this world.

Signed,

a very tired Dalit Hindu

[churail]

re-blogging so that y'all can access the video. will re-iterate that:

- it's telling that on not getting seats your first thought is about reservations being an issue and not the the need for more colleges

- please question why y'all feel entitled to judge which people from the oppressed castes are deserving and which are not (which if the viva scams in places like JNU are anything to go by, it seems like oppressed caste people will never appear deserving to oppressor caste people)

Call me whatever the fuck you want but the reservation policy and quotas needs to be revised and that revised version should be implemented. The current one should be abolished.

[mithliya]

I think there's also something to be said about how the whole discourse around indigeneity has become chic in the past few years to the point where you now see zionists claim that zionism is an "indigenous" movement... except that the early zionist thinkers very explicitly talked about colonising Palestine.

And also, it's exactly like you said, the term "indigenous" only makes sense in the context of being specifically oppressed for being indigenous. Indian Christians and Muslims are oppressed by Hindutva, and those Hindutva see them as traitors who adapted foreign religions. You could call Hindutva an "indigenous movement" the way some people now use the word indigenous lol.

yeah a lot of people argue that zionism is an indigenous movement despite the fact that palestinians have been proven, over and over again, to be indigenous to palestine. while many jewish people do have middle eastern ancestry specifically in the levant region, enough evidence shows that palestinians' ancestors are of the people who never left the land, whereas jewish people that left (ofc this doesnt apply to the mizrahim that have been in palestine the entire time) have been linked to levantine ppl from 3000 or so years ago and thus have distant ties to the land. framing it as an indigenous movement is truly disingenuous, as it implies either that palestinians are not indigenous or that jewish zionists are MORE indigenous, both being blatantly false.

hindutva are absolutely not an indigenous movement considering there are actual indigenous people in india (adivasi) and they often face racism, casteism, and colourism by hindu nationalists as well.

but yeah this is why framing 'indigenous' as inherently meaningful, oppressed, and good is ridiculous. in germany ive seen people use the acronym "BIPOC" many times and its like.. okay and who are the I in the BIPOC? who are the indigenous people in germany? oh right...germans or "aryans" as they used to call themselves. so wtf does it mean in the context of germany? no idea. and it seems none of the people who use it here have any idea either! it makes absolutely no sense but people treat "indigenous" as = poc from a colonized country or a country with a large settler population and more often than not, they think "indigenous" only refers to indigenous americans. but im indigenous, from bahrain, and i have nothing to do with indigenous americans. some people are indigenous from india, and they have nothing to do with indigenous americans, etc. meanwhile some groups of people that are "indigenous" to their lands are absolutely not oppressed, in fact they're often the more privileged ones! which is why i think people really need to be more clear and not play into this intentional vagueness. "indigenous" alone doesn't mean much. it isn't a race or an ethnicity.

[vadergf]

no because if your first issue with reservations is that st/sc/ obc students get preference there is something very wrong and questionable about your perception of India. i've noticed this for a really long time but desiblr has a major issue with casteism and it's in arguments like this that your true perception of caste gets out. India hasn't changed an inch, it's still deeply brahmanical and casteist. ews is literally only made for upper castes falling in an economic bracket shared by most of india. you have the audacity to say they're not represented enough? most bahujans are the ones that aren't fucking given the opportunity to get into these 'elite' colleges and universities because of the very fact that they don't fit the savarna view and also because they aren't financially stable enough to afford it. you can use the argument that dalits now have iphones but you will never see a brahmin cleaning toilets and that's a fact. reservation needs to be implemented because otherwise, Dalits wouldn't even be given a chance to pursue further education. read up about the historic and ever present neglect of dalit students in these elite universities and maybe then you'll understand.

rey im so glad you spoke up against it.

AUGUST THIS IS SOO BASED

Desiblr is sooo casteist and it truly comes out at times like this like even last year a very "popular" desi blog told me they feel they deserve those seats more than the lower caste kids which is such a fucked up thing to say...

Essentially my only hope is that everyone participating in this discourse are sheltered UC minors and I hope that with some experience in the real world they learn how stupid this view is

[hissterical-nyaan]

Thank you for that reblog. Asking someone to explore their sexuality and forcing a sexuality on someone are majorly different things. Their whole point revolving around someone asking them to be more welcoming to other open ideas is very flawed. It's almost as if they like the idea of queerness only to the extent of their insta/online persona bios because suddenly everyone is doing now and then if someone actually suggests anything queer irl it becomes disgusting/"forcing them"

Thank YOU for supporting me and you're absolutely right

Exploring sexuality ≠ forcing you to date or have sex with someone you're not comfortable with. Exploring sexuality is just being open to different ideas and recognising that sexuality and gender is extremely fluid and labels and preferences change over time which is perfectly normal.

And I don't wanna discredit people's experience but real world is so much more brutal for queer people. I started college and actually had to deal with real life interactions surrounding sexuality...... it's so fucking difficult. If I was treated with even a faction of empathy shown on social media, I probably wouldn't be in therapy rn. Social media was a platform for people who previously weren't heard in real life and so they had a safe place to anonymously vent and create a community. Some people really took that as "oh my god they are everywhere!!!!!!"

To the people who think it's easy and cool being queer, spend one day in any queer person's life. Yknow nothing about the pain and trauma we go through. We are not a quirky we are PEOPLE. People with an extensive history of getting abused and oppressed

And if what those two people did is considered a hot take or a fucking joke....idk what to say then. This Tumblr has been a safe place for numerous Desi queer kids and I will not let these people take that away from the kids. I grew up here and saw my older moots standing up against queerphobia and I will continue the same. Repeating rhetoric that is being used by our oppressors is not a hot take, it's a declaration of the hatred you have for actual queer people.

This argument is so similar to every other discourse regarding gender, racism and casteism. People can't handle the marginalized actually standing up for themselves for once. Real life is not like social media. Most people here hide their prejudice because they don't wanna be excluded from groups which is sad once they actually start speaking their "controversial" statements

Imagine being friends with someone and you love them so much but turns out they actually did not believe in the very real experiences and problems you face in life because of your sexuality/gender/race/caste

[artistic-arborealist]

How can you justify the fact that the first amentans who got to go to space were all greens and greys?

ANSWER ME, you casteist green!

So, I understand why you’re unhappy! You want to be in space ~now~, and waiting is no fun at all!

But I do think it would help to note that while the first Amentans who got to go to space were all green and grey, it’s not ~directly because of their caste~! Because after all, none of my coworkers or I were eligible to join the initial planet search, and we’re all greens! And you aren’t seeing any dancers or arcball players in space either!

And this is because ~none of us are astronauts~, or astrophysicists, or planetary explorers, or xenobiologists, or ~any of the other professions~ that would be in the very first ships!

And so, the professions that got to go to space first are all grey and green! It’s true! But it’s not because of their ~caste~, it’s because ~those are the castes that happen to work in space colonization related jobs~!

And that is unfair, and I’m sorry you’re sad about it! But it’s unfair in the way that empty springs, or hereditary pollution is unfair!

That is to say, it’s unfair in a way that’s going to be ~completely fixed soon~!

So I’m sure you’ll be able to find a spot in one of the ~later colonization waves~! Because once we start establishing actual societies, we’re going to need ~every caste~ to build worlds that work!

So good luck, anon!!! I’m sure that whatever your job is, you’ll get to go to one of the planets soon!

[enigma-the-mysterious]

OP: [posts a meme on Hindu mythology that's clearly a shitpost]

Hindutva gang: THIS IS HINDUPHOBIA! OP HAS COMMITTED THE MOST HEINOUS OF CRIMES! [insert casteist slurs] [insert casteist rant] [insert 13 paragraphs of Islamophobic rant]

OP: Please take your bigotry, Hindu supremacy and casteism elsewhere

Some galaxy brained person in the notes: Everyone is at fault here including OP. These people are getting worked over a meme. OP is calling the people getting worked over a meme "bigots". Yes, they are equally responsible for this mess. Common sense, what common sense?

Just an observation from a hot mess of a desi "discourse"

[indizombie]

When Ali Anwar, one of the leaders of the Pasmanda movement, made up of Muslim backward-castes and Dalits in Bihar, declared during a conference in 2007, “Hum shuddar hain shuddar; Bharat ke moolnivasi hain. Baad mein musalman hain” (We are Shudras first; we are the indigenous peoples of India. We are Muslims later), he was in a sense altering the semantics of Indian politics. By privileging caste over his ‘religious’ identity, Anwar was also upturning the notions of majority and minority that are commonly invoked by the mainstream political discourse. He stressed that the Pasmanda sections were a minority only when they identified themselves primarily as Muslims. But once they begin identifying themselves as Shudras, Dalits or moolnivasis (original inhabitants), they immediately transform themselves into a majority (bahujan). Even after conversion to Islam such individuals continue to be identified with their castes by the upper-caste ashrafiya Muslims. A Dalit who converts to Islam is labelled an arzal Muslim, while a Shudra who converts to Islam becomes an ajlaf Muslim. And does not the insistence on endogamy (marrying within a particular group) on the basis of caste by the ulema perpetuate and legitimise these hierarchies?

Khalid Anis Ansari, ‘A tale of two mosques’, Himal

[fdhfjdafdajfa]

WDYM when u say ur hindophobic... like the religion

It’s not a religion in the traditional sense, it’s an anti-Muslim hate cult which formed in the late 19th century in an effort to protect backwards Brahminical social customs (foremost among them caste and all the abuse towards women it entails) from the scrutiny of social scientists. In India, to say someone is a Hindu has absolutely nothing to do with any beliefs or ritual practice or discursive framework, it just means they’re brown and not a Muslim or a Christian (Sikhs and Buddhists and a few other groups have some wiggle room with complicated discourses regarding whither Hindu or not), which makes it a position of power and privilege in society relative to religiously affiliated people and racial minorities. Most major political parties in India are overtly or covertly (but still obviously) Hindu parties, including Congress and BJP and AAP, the parliamentary Communist party, and the Maoist guerillas. Since the Hindus view all religious minorities in India as either foreign invaders to expel or lapsed Untouchables to resubjugate, this means that all non-Hindu groups in India are under existential threat as long as Hinduism exists. Remember that while Hinduism affirms caste (even when it pretends it doesn’t – this is a rejection of caste consciousness among the lower castes and promotion of casteblindness among the upper castes, which isn’t anti-casteism, so don’t get it confused), both Christianity and Islam as well as certain forms of Buddhism and significant ideological currents within Sikhism reject it as a non-negotiable central tenet. This isn’t a matter on which there can be peaceful settlement.As long as Hinduism stays normalised as a religion, caste subjugation and destruction of anti-caste ideologies, including Christianity, Islam, Navayana Buddhism, and certain forms of Sikhism, are legitimised as a religious and political idea, period. This plays itself out in daily pogroms, lynchings, and hate crimes in India.So, yes. The “religion”.

[violetbard]

So...this bothered me after the fact so I figured I’m in some rights to ramble a final viewpoint.

Hemoism is a fictional, systematic oppression that places certain trolls of certain blood colors on a pyramid of hierarchy. It stems from which caste's abilities contribute best to the reproduction system, the comfort of the higher class, and which bloods come off more as burdens in the eyes of colder hues.

Classism is differential treatment based on social class or perceived social class. Classism is the systematic oppression of subordinated class groups to advantage and strengthen the dominant class groups. It’s the systematic assignment of characteristics of worth and ability based on social class. X

Stuff below the cut as to why the rpc needs a reminder.

Troll hemoism’s closest allegory is classism, and literally stands as a foundation for all what trolls do and base their life around in canon. Being lazy and calling it troll racism, or making direct, centric allegories for race, is bad. Not that (good) allegories are bad in general, but consider that racism has came from the psuedo belief that people of color perform and behave different in ways that hinder or threaten others. Trolls, meanwhile actually do have biological differences that make them behave or perform a certain way. Comparing a society that literally has biological differences to a discriminaton based off of stereotypes of biological difference is bad.

Please watch these two videos if you want a little more insight on why handling and labeling your forms of fictional oppression is important. : X X

Outside of one bit that wasn’t even race related, the hemoism discourse last night was handled pretty well imo. Context wise. We still need to work on tagging stuff for those who wish to block even one sentence commentary, and if anything the communication was slightly better than normal.

So it’s a shame that when I don’t see the bad racism allegories from the past pop up into this, that I still see people being accussed of writing thinly veiled racism from writing hemoism period, simply because being about oppression and mentioning umbrella words is the key link from white muns that looked at the one sentence definition of racism on wikipedia, no other indepth looks at other discrimnated groups, and called it a day.

More words though I’m sure some people didn’t read past the readmore.

-Words like oppression and liberal were used but is a common word belonging to degraded groups. It is not a race centric buzzword and it’s general enough to not be a shock term. It’s not out of character to be used either because troll culture uses political terminology that can be used for most discriminated groups, for the blood discriminated group. See: Lowblooded Alleys from Friendsim.

-I brought up reverse hemoism first and instead of reading into the actual way it was defined, someone saw “reverse” and instantly assumed it was directly parallel reverse racism’s defintion without reading anything. Homestuck is also no stranger to familiar words that have different defintion. See: Cis6l99d.

- I’ve seen way way worse examples of hemoism in the past. This was fine since it was classism based, and paying reference that may corelate to a certain, less related oppression can work well if it hits the beats of their venn diagram comparisons, unintentional or not. I’ve for example made reference to Signless reminding me of MLK and Summoner as Malcolm X. Not that it was intentional, but even if it was it stands by itself as something that is distant enough and doesn’t relate to the biological race comparision; to just give an idea as to how a Troll rights movement and riot could’ve been played out that still works in their universe, without glaring callbacks.

- Oppression isnt a racial buzzword; when you say that it is a racial buzzword and that it makes you uncomfortable from the use alone while ignoring other marginalized groups who share it, you are basically calling an apple an orange just because they’re both fruit.

What else?

Tldr; Hemoism is classism. It’s called low, mid, and highbloods for a reason. Using reference other “isms” are fine so as long as you know what youre talking about, and it isn’t glaringly standing out as something detached from the fictional alien world we’ve set up.

While people need to play it correctly and avoid writing sloppy reference to specific points in history (especially if they aren’t apart of the group that relates to it), other people need to not cry out racism from the word hemoism alone.

If you see something that vaguely reminds you of racism and that’s the issue, versus whether it’s actually racism or not, and you want to snuff it out because it reminds you of what other people are dealing with, remaining ignorant while polishing your claim as thinking for the comfort of poc people, of which little to none speak up about any issues at all, that’s the white guilt talking, my dude.

Edit: Also casteism is also another literal actual thing that has better backing then centric race stuff.

[truthoftheday]

WHAT DO I MEAN WHEN I SAY I AM NOT A FEMINIST

As someone with a fuzzy sense of gender I have always held feminists in high regard. I felt they hold the key to my existence. My attraction to feminism could have been due to two reasons: one, I was gravitating towards groups / communities of my chosen gender (i.e. female) or two, it seemed to me that feminists would understand the complexity of gender.

As for my desire to be identified with women as a part of their circle, I was confronted with two questions: one, has my privilege of being assigned male at birth given me the freedom to choose my gender; and second, to be able to join the feminist club, I must prove myself worthy of womanhood.

I was initially shocked at these responses. I could not believe that the only ideology that claims to understand the politics of gender was so rigid in its approach. However, I did not lose hope. Accepting my inadequacies, I set about to read and understand the theories of gender in feminism. There are two things that I realized: one, the rigidity towards gender and gender roles was historically inherent in feminist thought; two, feminist theory has progressed much beyond these conventional approaches to gender.

However, this is not an occasion to discuss in detail the problems of gender essentialism, the pitfalls of cultural feminism or the misunderstanding around radical feminism. I have been reading feminist theory just to get to the root of the problems around transgender identity and acceptance. Transgender theory is inspired not just by feminism but by a range of other discourses like Marxism, post-structuralism, anti-caste theory etc. Trans discourse and politics is equally influenced by right wingism, capitalism and neoliberalism, casteism and racism. Influence of multiple ideologies and regional and ethnic specificities and also individual subjectivities have made political organization of transpersons next to impossible.

The non binary transgender movement rejects the binary gender system. Anyone who benefits from the binary gender system will strive to protect it. Transgender people have nothing to gain by preserving this outdated model on the basis of which human beings are categorized and exploited. We will face multiple challenges by protectors of the gender binary. Feudal patriarchy, capitalism, neo-liberalism, liberal / cultural feminism and most importantly men will strive to preserve the status quo of binary gender norms. Even labour movements will have second thoughts about disturbing the gender equation that suits well any model of economic production.

Given these circumstances, a non binary utopia will reject and by that logic radically accept all / most forms of gender expression and identities. Point is, we are not men who don’t want to be men or men who want to be women; or women who don’t want to be women and want to become men. We are more than that. A non binary framework is not just based on individual identities or subjective experiences but it is an adoption of methodology that seeks to understand prevalent gender relations through this framework. It is based on an understanding that the inherent gender binary system is not something permanent but has been going through intense changes historically. In no age men and women or even their relation has been the same as any other generation. The binary gender system is designed just to protect class and caste privileges through institutions of family and marriage. A non binary approach will destabilize patriarchal institutions like family and marriage that serve as the ideological apparatus of control of labour and property. Envisioning new communities of living and being is a project common to anti capitalist movements, feminist movements and queer movements.

Within these, non binary approach must be adopted most importantly and urgently in gender studies disciplines or practice. Non binary theorists and practitioners have been celebrated across cultural disciplines. Non binary approach can be observed in the field of performance art, music, films and performance of politics of protest. Non binary characters have emerged in fantasy, graphic works and animations as ways of being beyond the limited logic of defining human beings as either men or women. Science studies as a discipline has been engaged in theorizing this kind of post human possibilities.  

For the lack of comprehensibility in a binary gendered world, non binary people have largely led private lives or have joined in society without asserting their identity. Feminist, transgender and queer movements have failed to incorporate non binary resistance in their agenda. It seems to me that they are sustaining a patriarchal gender model that kills all gender minorities including women.

To step outside the gender binary is a radical call to individuals who are willing to practice what they preach. It is time that we truly demonstrate through our thought, speech and action that ‘gender is a construct’.

By Rishit Neogi

06 – 06 – 2021