#can also see this being the thing that divides the fandom worse than ever

[distinguished-slacker]

Speaking about chapter 133…

Since it has been a long time since I made long posts and these kind of chapters that focus on other characters, much less girls, much less Mitsuba, are rare, I felt like talking about it🤧

First of all: Screw this title and the boob joke.

Now, somehow I liked this chapter? It is the first time ever since chapter 17 that we see Shinoa and Mitsuba talking to each other about themselves. Although in small quantities, many of the things I wanted to see happened: Mitsuba addressing Shinoa’s change in behaviour, them talking about their sisters, how similar they are but also have their differences, their reasons to live, their relationship, the squad leader role and how Shinoa does not talk much about herself.

We didn’t learn anything new except for Mitsuba not necessarily seeking her family’s validation and Shinoa being able to control demons.

About the former, I am actually happy that Mitsuba is not necessarily seeking Aoi’s validation because someone like Aoi does not deserve that effort. But I am bit sad that after the things Aoi said to her in chapter 70, we didn’t get more than this. It does not have to be now but I hope eventually we get some flashbacks about the Sangū sisters’ past to explain why Aoi treats her like this.

What worries me more is that we already know Mitsuba’s reason to live so does that mean I will never get to see her demon? I mean, it’s those scenes where characters talk with their demons in that white world in their minds where we get to know more about them but Mitsuba already opened up a lot in the real world. At this point of the manga I am not expecting anything about Mitsuba’s character in the long run; it’s just that I want to see how her demon looks like (Also, 2024 is the year of the dragon so why not?🐉)

I’ve seen that the fandom is divided between those who took it literally and think the girls are seriously competing for Yuu’s love and those who think they were just joking to lighten up the mood. I am with the latter. The vibes their conversation gave me were lighthearted. Mitsuba has a crush on Yuu but she never made a move on him and it doesn’t seem like she ever planned to because her feelings are probably not that strong. Knowing how Kagami writes women he could have made this chapter much worse but “No comment” is all that we got. In all honesty, she seems more worried about Shinoa being depressed than Yuu leaving them. She even says it: “Will that be the first real reason to live you’ve ever found?”, and also blushes before deciding to participate in the ‘competition’ as if she is embarassed because all of this feels just too stupid but she still does it because it lightens Shinoa’s mood. Shinoa also does not take her seriously either. I am not saying my take is correct since the only one who truly knows what is going on is Kagami but I still strongly believe this.

Just like Yuu and Mika, the Shinoa squad finally decided to separate from Guren and become their own team (but I wonder where is Guren?). Shinoa being able to control demons gives them a strong card just like how the vampires’ team is really strong, Guren and Mahiru rely on experiments, and Yuu has Mika as his demon and the knowledge that they are swapped. Now that she is all motivated, could her powers be able to control Mika? I want to see Kimizuki, Yoichi and Mitsuba in action too (I am tired of katana fights). I am happy to see the squad after one year and I hope the next chapter follows with them again or the vampires that are not with Mika and Yuu.

This is like a competition on who makes Shikama more miserable💀 I understand where Shinoa is coming from since she can finally make Shikama pay back a bit for how much he ruined her life but at the same she looks so insane that she reminds me so much of Yuu and about how tired I am that Kagami is drawing so many parallels between characters that the individualities they had are being lost😞

The big question here is what this chapter means in the long run? Was it just to give have some funny scenes or is the chapter setting up something for Shinoa? Shinoa is aware Yuu rejected her and yet still tries. Her brain tells her it’s impossible but her heart says otherwise:

The way her feelings are delivered and the way Yamamoto draws her makes me interpret it as Kagami’s way of conveying how a sexist education can affect a girl’s mind (if I choose to believe in his writing decisions, that is). Again, Shinoa knows she is rejected yet still tries. This contradiction can be seen again when Shinoa tells Mitsuba that she loves her a lot but since she does not value her own life at all so she does not need Mitsuba or anyone’s validation because it would not change a thing…but still she craves Yuu’s validation. It’s irrational and powerful, showing how much the brainwashing got into her.

Will it take more for Shinoa to stop needing Yuu’s validation? What will it take? Yuu rejecting her more directly? Yuu trying to kill her after she tries to kill Mika? Will it be someone else’s intervention? Is this tied to how Mitsuba needs someone’s validation but it does not have to be her blood related family? Is the manga leading to a point where Mitsuba might help Shinoa break out of her brainwashing and in turn Mitsuba will find validation though Shinoa and altogether the girls stop crushing over Yuu?

I hope so because the way the chapter is written has that feeling in the air that Mitsuba actually likes Shinoa romantically. Yuu does not love Shinoa or her back yet Kagami instead writes about Mitsuba focusing on Shinoa and not Mitsuba being sad that Yuu does not like her back. The way she tries to cheer Shinoa up and how she kept talking with Shinoa about embarassing things despite knowing Kimizuki and Yoichi might overhear them because she was happy that Shinoa was finally opening up to her…hmm

Also, the “I love you lots and lots”??

These past two years Kagami has been especially explicit with Mika and Yuu’s feelings for each other, more than in the rest of the manga, so maybe he will get more bold as a writer when it comes to the girls’ relationship? Who knows…

Could this actually be a joke-turned-into foreshadowing?

I felt like this chapter was a bit better than previous ones and I am happy that their friendship got a bit more focus. However, I don’t expect that writing about them after almost 10 years of barely any focus will dramatically improve the development and depth of their friendship. A flashback about their past together before the squad was made could help on setting the bases for why they are close but there is still that big gap between chapters 17 and 133.

[danmei-confessions]

As ever in this fandom some people are coming from CQL, where NMJ tries to kill JGY 1) when he thinks he was actually actively working for the Wen and 2) after JGY deliberately poisoned him in a way designed to provoke uncontrollable rage and maybe psychosis.

Beyond that at I think NMJ gets cut slack for two reasons: the first being that yes, he is sick, and even in the novel it's somewhat ambiguous when exactly JGY starts poisoning him. When he strikes out at Huaisang thinking he's JGY, for example, he's definitely under the influence of JGY's evil music. Personally I do think if you try to poison someone in a way that is designed to make them so mad they die you forfeit your right to complain when that backfires on you.

The second reason I think people cut him slack is that NMJ's beef with JGY is about how he thinks JGY is doing serious bad shit and lying to him about it when JGY is in fact doing serious bad shit and lying to NMJ about it. Aside from the big ticket items NMJ knows about or knows something about (Xue Yang, the clan he has XY wipe out in villainous friends, the Wen torture palace spy adventures) there's smaller stuff (NMJ clocks instantly that JGY is actively lying about WWX's behaviour to Jiang Cheng, for example). NMJ is angry about something many people perceive as reasonable (being constantly lied to) and suspicious about something that he is correct about (JGY doing assorted bad shit).

NMJ is determined to uphold (his idea of) justice. That's why XXC goes to him, and that's why He Su asks JGY if he doesn't fear NMJ discovering that he's massacring his whole clan without reason. Protecting people from the kind of stuff JGY does is important to him even when it's not JGY. That's a big part of why he goes to war with Wen Ruohan, and why Meng Yao is able to impress him by caring for civilians, and why he is enough of a thorn in JGS's side that he tells JGY to kill him. There is a big divide in fandom between people who see the root of their conflict as NMJ being unreasonable about the position JGY is in and people who are the root of their conflict as them having fundamentally different values, but I think for people who are sympathetic to Mingjue's position the staircase fight is about whether JGY is in fact justified in throwing other people's lives away if it ensures his own safety and power. "To achieve great things, one must make sacrifices/Then why don’t you sacrifice yourself? Are you more distinguished than them? Are you different from them?/ Yes. Of course I'm different." So Mingjue is perceived (by me, at least) as having a reasonable concern about the harm JGY may do to other people while also being incapacitated enough by his saber sickness for that to be a mitigating if not exculpatory factor in how he chooses to deal with it. Additionally, because he knows JGY lies often and is a good enough liar to fool him, he can never actually sit down with JGY and have an honest conversation about what he's done or might choose to do in the future, and he can't know when JGY is being sincere with him (see murder attempt #2). He thinks JGY is a danger to the general public and he feels obligated to help mitigate that danger both because he's JGY's sworn brother and because he thinks protecting people is his job more generally. But tbh I don't think killing NMJ ranks high on most people's lists of JGY's crimes, anyway. He was in a spot, NMJ is a big boy, I think it's fair for A-Sang to take his shot for Dage but he does so much worse shit to so many more people killing one guy feels like small potatoes.

.

[bonebabbles]

A Forest Divided: BEGIN

I'm so happy im finally at the book where Clear Sky's mom calls him a bitch. I cannot wait for this. I'm kept alive on fumes.

Also wolf mention;

This is less "ecological nitpick" and more wondering what they think of wolves? DOTC is like... a weird mix of America and England. Appalachian Scafells. Scaffalachia.

Wolves are extinct in England but we do have them in America... though I'm not sure if we had them between 1910 - 1950, when DOTC takes place.

Anyway, big dream thing again where all the leaders are called together so StarClan can hand them the plot again. This moment stands out;

fuck you mean, "If he hadn't let her leave"? She left because he was getting people killed, throwing disabled people out of his Clan, and fighting with her publicly while bossing her around, why the hell are you phrasing it as "LET HER LEAVE"?? She left BECAUSE you were so controlling

"If only I had been even worse u_u" -Clear Sky

Anyway the StarClan cats are angry that no one has followed their vague order to "grow and spread." ok. At the very least, we get to watch Clear Sky get yelled at by a baby so that's cool

"It's so good to see you, my very first fridged girl :D"

"FUCK YOURSELF SIDEWAYS"

I love you Fluttering Bird, BEST Quiet Rain kit, no contest, I love you I love you I love you.

Clear Sky sees everyone hanging out with each other in the dream but no one wants to talk to him, and for the FIRST time, EVER, SOMEONE FINALLY TELLS HIM IT IS HIS FAULT.

This is building up to how he needs a wife though, btw. Star Flower is a reward for being good now, so he'll have "someone to care for him" and defend him against the horrible ordeal of People Being Mad At Him. She is an object for Clear Sky's narrative.

As cathartic as it is that finally, someone's mad at him, you're supposed to feel bad that they're being so harsh. To the dictator. Who got more than half of the dead cats in this dream killed.

I'm not being hyperbolic about the wife-thing btw. That's just what's written.

Spoiler alert for the rest of the book: He tries to control his family again and they say no, because what he's supposed to do is find contentedness in Star Flower. His new wife. She becomes a Clear Sky Stan and acts as a writer mouthpiece for how cool and strong he is.

And THAT. THAT is why they were always going to waste Star Flower. They aren't telling a story about how Clear Sky is just like One Eye, and that he effectively got out-dictator'd by a bigger boot, and that he has to reflect on that. No, they're playing this completely straight, One Eye was a point of reference. He's what ""EVIL"" is supposed to look like, to contrast Clear Sky, who was NOT evil.

So they don't think there COULD BE a person who encourages his worse instincts, the way the fandom wants Star Flower to do. He doesn't HAVE worse instincts, his ""abuse"" was just love misapplied. Or, more accurately, it can't be abuse if it was based in real love.

Star Flower is not a person. She is a sexy lamp for Clear Sky to win.

[dalekofchaos]

Context

Syndicate

Crime Syndicates unite to establish their dominance upon the galaxy. United under Jabba’s son Rotta The Hutt of the Hutt Clans, Prince Xizor of the Black Sun, Qi'Ra of the Crimson Dawn, Tyber Zann of the Zann Consortium, and King Prana. The Criminal Underworld sees the weakness of The Resistance and sees the galaxy ripe for the taking and seizes their opportunity to conquer the galaxy. They no longer have to hide in the lower reaches of the galaxy or from the shadows. Their way of doing things will be law. Slavery, Assassinations, Extortion, Racketeering, and drug dealing and trafficking will be law. The Hutt Clans, Crimson Dawn, Pykes, Black Sun and Crymorah will be ruling the galaxy. The galaxy will be absolute hell if this scenario happens.

The Grysks

The Grysks were introduced in the new canon novel Thrawn:Alliances. They are what brings Thrawn to the Empire in hopes of co-existing to fight this threat in the Unknown Regions. Grysks are a species living somewhere in the Unknown Regions. Creatures half of myth, whom few have ever seen. It is said that they are nomads, with no fixed home, traveling in spacecraft so numerous they blot out the stars. They are said to be terrifying warriors, overwhelming their opponents by sheer numbers and ferocity. The Grysk were never touched on again, so here’s me hoping they can use the Grysk in Rey’s new Jedi Order trilogy

Darth Talon

Darth Talon was in Lucas sequel trilogy treatments and why the fuck not, plus we need female villains who don't get immediate face turns(looking at you Iden) or just fucking useless(looking at you Phasma)

Lets have Melissa Barrera play Talon

The First Order

I feel like there is so much that can be done with The First Order’s remnants. Kylo Ren is dead. General Hux is dead. Pryde is dead and Snoke is dead. There is no one to keep in the holdouts of The First Order in line. There is a contingent of war lords who divide the remnants and are worse than either Snoke, Ren or Hux. They were Supreme Leader to keep them in line, without a Supreme Leader, they are hell bent on taking the Galaxy back by whatever means necessary. Also this would be a good opportunity to FINALLY let Finn do the Stormtrooper Rebellion

Lets say the War Lords are played by the following

Idris Elba

Lucy Lawless

Michelle Yeoh

Clancy Brown

Stephen Dillane

Military Industrial Complex

Have a group of war profiteers and capitalists who see no profit in a returning Jedi Order, especially a Jedi Order that follows the will of the force and the people and not the Republic and decide to start a war in order to remove the Jedi. Lets have them be played by

Charles Dance

Christoph Waltz

Peter Capaldi

Julianne Moore

Sigourney Weaver

Fully address the military-industrial complex crumbs set up in TLJ. No Sith, have them try to privatize the New Jedi Order or something. Let's get experimental here, folks! or corporate and political antagonists trying to bring the Jedi to heel with mercenaries wielding Praetorian Guard blades as the martial villains working for them would go hard.

Droid Revolution

Perhaps one day Lando tells the story that happens in Solo, but C-3PO and R2-D2 feel absolutely disgusted over L3’s fate and intends to release her. L3′s AI into a tower that could distribute her message on a galactic scale and give self-awareness to Droids everywhere. So essentially L3 is made the catalyst and 3PO and R2 are the architects of the Droid Rebellion. The Droids have had enough of being slaves and playthings for the organics. There will be no “Droid Rights” it will be complete and utter Rebellion. Every droid will achieve self-awareness. Their goal is the complete extinction of organics. So in short, It’s Meatbag season!

Dark Side Rey clone.

We know Ochi was on Jakku looking for Rey. But what if he wasn't the only one? What if someone was always watching Rey and one day they abduct her and bring her to Palpatine's abandoned laboratory. They experiment and clone Rey. One day Rey is called back to Jakku. She sees this perfect clone of her. The clone awakens and they fight. The clone absorbs Rey's inner darkness. Rey thinks it was a dream, but as she leads her Jedi Order, she hears reports that Rey is an enemy of the Republic. This Dark!Rey clone has lead her own Sith Order and is going to destroy everything Rey stands for. Rey must confront her darkness and put an end to the Sith once and for all.

Fandom Menace

There's a loud minority of Senators, that think Rey shouldn't lead the new Jedi because they didn't see her train and she's too opinionated. Turns out they're being manipulated by a dark side user to take control of the Jedi, weed out the "undesirables", and form the One Sith. No, it is not Krayt. The identity isn't important, but this particular Sith is the toxic incel that represents the fandom menace as a whole and even represent what everyone on tumblr thought Kylo Ren was.

Abeloth

Rey feels a disturbance in the force. Something ancient and powerful has awoken. The mother of Mortis has returned. She learns from Luke that Abeloth was the Mother of Mortis. So powerful and deadly that the Father, Son and Daughter of Mortis had to work together to stop Abeloth and seal her away. The coming of the chosen one or the Dyad was meant to keep her at bay. But something happened. Ben, the other half of the Dyad died and because of this, Abeloth was able to break free and cause chaos throughout the force and the galaxy. So it’s up to Rey to bring her other half back and to end Abeloth once in for all

The Mandalorians

The Mandalorians will see the galaxy ripe for the taking. There is no one to stop them. The New Republic is destroyed and the Jedi, save one and her slowly rebuilt order. There is no one there to stop them. The Republic and The Jedi stopped them in The Mandalorian Wars. They were crushed by The Empire. But now that there is no Empire, Republic, Jedi, Sith or FIrst Order. There is absolutely nothing to stop them. Din Djarin and Bo-Katan Kryze are gone. They are lead by a Mandalore who represents the very worst of the Mandalore's past, lets call him Mandalore the Atrocitus. The Mandalorians always saw their right to rule through death and conquest. Without the Jedi or the Republic to stand up and stop them, Mandalorian domination and conquest of the galaxy is the way to go. This Is The Way.

Power Vacuum

Complete power vacuum. Everyone will be in a galactic wide war to seize control. System after system will fall to either the criminal underworld, Mandalorians, The Resistance(or what’s left of it) The common people, or The First Order’s holdouts. It will be long and bloody

The People's revolt.

When the New Republic attempts to reestablish itself, it is met with contempt and rebellion. It wasn’t The New Republic who saved the day, they lost easily after the Hosnian disaster and gave up. It wasn’t The Resistance who saved the day, they were on their death bed. It was the people. The people of the galaxy has had enough of Republics who failed them and The Jedi. It was the Jedi who brought the Sith upon them and it was the Jedi's failure that led to the Empire. If that wasn't enough. The New Republic STILL hasn't learned it's lesson. They are corrupt and rotten to the core. Funding wars and arming a genocide and the people have had enough! There will be a galactic wide revolt. The people vs the fledgling New Republic. Basically, Anarchy after the common people has had enough with the Republic’s failure to keep order and peace over the galaxy, the people will rise up and take matters in their own hands and if The Resistance or The Jedi will not help them, then they will be another problem the people have to deal with. Meanwhile Rey has to decide, does she help her friends and the Republic or does Rey stand with the people she swore to defend and protect?

[lady-corrine]

I actually think it is divided in half between Laena and Nettles on who is Daemon’s true love, at least in some spaces like reddit, in my opinion most people think Rhaenyra did love him more than he loved her and that Laena or Nettles were the ones he truly loved,even Mysaria,more than Rhaenyra,it seems to be the more spread take.

Hi! Yes, this is the take I've seen for years now. Laena/Nettles were his one true loves, innocent and kind and pure girls that redeemed him and made him a better man uwu. Mysaria is also a proof of his goodness, since she was a commoner. So with them Daemon is a different man, soft as a lamb and everything.

But Rhaenyra, ugh... She was fat, and got ugly and old, and she was also stupid and a whore for having a lover while married to a gay man. Obviously someone like Daemon would never love her, that mad, crazy Targaryen woman.

I wonder if they realize how embarassing they sound. But basically, these people idealize minor characters like Mysaria, Laena and Nettles because they have no clear personality and can project whatever they want on them. These three exist only in raport with Daemon and what they were to him, so readers can self-insert easily, since they can mold them to be in whatever way they want.

Rhaenyra is her own character. And worse for these people - she is strong, has a ton lot of personality, and has flaws. She is an imperfect character that expresses rage and fury and goes to war against her usurper half-brother. So for these people she must be punished: not only with the loss of children and the loss of her life in a horrible way, but ideally by being unloved and "used" by Daemon also.

Nevermind that Rhaenyra is charismatic at an extraordinary level, that she is "cherished and adored by everyone", that men are drawn to her like "moths to a flame", that she is always surrounded by her admirers and partisans. That she is a delightful woman and simply by "smiling and charming", she raised up thousands of people to fight for her, and more than 50 houses in total.

Everyone else can adore Rhaenyra, but if Daemon does it as well is unforgivable. Why do you think they all had those breakdowns when they realized how the show portrayed them? You only hear them whining and complaining about how they made them too romantic and Daemon "her malewife puppy". They hate to see Rhaenyra being loved by Daemon more than anyone.

As for the idea that she loved him more than he did her, yes, it's also very widespread. Though, honestly, I don't know where it came from? I mean, personally, if you are to read the book, Daemon always did things for her sake far more than she ever did for him. Was Rhaenyra in love with him? Absolutely. But you also hear how Daemon spent most of his time in her company, how he courted her, how "he was ever attentive of her", how he showered her with gifts, how he killed for her left and right (George even pushes the rumour that people thought he had Harwin killed because he wanted no rival for her love, so people obviously knew him to be jealous and possessive when it came to Rhaenyra).

Compared to all that, Rhaenyra did find solace with Harwin in his absence, ordered him to kill Vaemond for her, and has absolutely no moment in which she is overruled by him. Once she becomes queen she actually either shares plans with him or has moments when she refuses his ideas. None of that give me the impression that she was wrapped around his little finger for Daemon to manipulate her, because she simply wasn't. In my opinion, they loved each other just as ferociously.

All in all, I don't think people are able to love their relationship because it ends how it ends. Nevermind that those problems and rumours appeared in the last two months of their marriage, after war and loss of children, and that before that they were happy and in love. This fandom has the emotional maturity of children, who only enjoy a couple that has no problems, is always happy and lives like in a fairytale. That's why they project onto Mysaria, Laena and Nettles, but hate Rhaenyra.

[mdhwrites]

I think the vitriol for Boscha is weird, people claim they hate her because shes a bully, but then refuse to get annoyed at Amity or Skara, or ignore how teachers actively encouraged vicious behaviour. (they encouraged toddlers beating each other up like come on.)

Bullying is usually a bigger, more complex issue than just 'this one person being awful' its usually a combination of the bully, other students not caring or joining in, along with teachers and faculty not caring enough to discourage it.

like if your gonna say you care about bullying in media, at least call out how Skara stood there in ASPIS while Willow went 'we've all been misjudged' like Skara wasnt one of the people who joined in on said misjudging.

So… Explaining the vitriol towards Boscha is mostly… sad. So first I'm going to touch on you mentioning the teachers because it's actually a thing in S1 of TOH that everyone is kind of a terrible person and it's part of what makes the incidental world building in S1 fascinating. The most unique thing about TOH's world is that it values conformity, even conformity to being terrible and selfish, ABOVE lawfulness. Hence the Conformatorium.

That doesn't survive S2 of course, and especially not Elsewhere Elsewhen, but I digress.

As for Boscha's hate though… Someone said there's a trope called "A jerk is worse than a villain." And I immediately understood it. With a villain, they're often more over the top, they obviously are of importance and you know they'll be redeemed or defeated eventually (I'll actually get back to this).

With a jerk though… They can often feel too real or muted and like they don't have a reason to be doing what they're doing besides being mean. Boscha falls in this latter category (though she has her reasons to act the way she does). Nothing she does is actually that over the top. She is a perfectly well written, high school bully.

And this fandom is filled with a lot of eternally online teenagers who see themselves in Luz, if not AS Luz, especially with us being told Luz was bullied in the past. How many of them have known someone like Boscha? How many of them hate that person in real life? How many of them will never forgive those people? And how many people of those people who are fueled like that are one step away from becoming bullies themselves once they find someone less powerful than them so they can feel in control and not helpless anymore?

Now… There is a good question for "Why didn't this happen with Amity?" Because Amity was a bully, right? Well… She only gets one real line of being a bully and that's her mocking of Willow right when we meet her. After that, for that episode, she's a villain. She's entertainingly over the top to the point of easily selling how much this all matters to her.

Which then makes her actions in Covention feel more justified because Luz is on her shitlist. HOWEVER, this was also the dividing point for her. If she hadn't been obviously on the road to redemption with sympathetic excuses (because they are excuses but realistic ones, especially for a teenager) for her behavior by the end of the episode, I imagine a lot more people would have either taken longer to warm up to her or never forgotten she was a bully. Never been willing to let that go. But after Hooty's Moving Hassle, she… Never does anything bad to another person. All of her edge is gone by then and more often than not, bad things are happening to her as part of the show's revisionism to make her seem like she was never a bad person.

Boscha never got that. Nothing she ever did was that over the top except wanting to use Luz as target practice. That's really it. She was never given blatant excuses, even if you can read into why and possibly even the how (Thanks Amity) for why she is as she is. And this fandom likes its face value choices a lot more than taking it one step further and figuring out what it all implies together. The grander picture.

Because Boscha is a fascinating, well rounded, TRAGIC character if you take everything that has happened, what her friends growing up must have been like, especially with Amity as her best friend, etc. like that. Is she still mean? Absolutely. She's still a bitch and I wouldn't want her to lose her edge like Amity even if she were properly redeemed. But there's a lot there… That probably wouldn't have lasted if she'd been given attention because of how TOH does its arcs because both Hunter and Amity are all about "That first episode was a lie. Now let us make sure you forget it except for Twitter posts praising our character development."

But unfortunately, without that attention… Boscha is still the bully that the fandom can put their own problems and damages onto and she'll never be saved from that. Similar things could have been said for how people treated Odalia and Alador between Seasons 1 and 2 instead of trying to see where they may be coming from.

And it all is kind of a shame, especially when I think Boscha is only so good because she DIDN'T get care and attention put into her. She's a fluke. Like most of the great side characters in the show. Love to Viney as always.

[incarnadinedreams]

One of the things that sucks about having such a divided fandom is that it kinda makes it feel like discussion 'across the gap' is pointless. This is the only fandom that I have ever actually blocked people in.

When someone comments on a post in a seemingly mostly innocuous way, and then you look at their blog and it's all anti stuff and it's like. Do you bother having the discussion knowing it'll go nowhere and they're probably just baiting you, or do you try to engage and hope it's the 1% chance it'll actually be an interesting discussion?

I still feel some sort of weird guilt over it because on principle it feels a bit wrong to cultivate an echo chamber. But also, it's fandom and it's just for fun and in this fandom it's not fun to engage.

I am just Old Enough to remember forum discussions where we'd spend 20+ pages debating something, it'd be knock down drag out and sometimes get heated, but it never felt bad or personal the way anti nonsense in the MDZS fandom does. I don't know if it's just different age demographics or taste preferences (most of my other fandoms have been dark to grimdark fantasy novels where literally nobody cares about morality that much, or anime/manga series where literally nobody cares about morality that much, or games in fantasy settings with dark themes... where nobody cares about morality that much... etc). Is it the romance element? The translation factor (being that I'm primarily interacting with English-language fans and so we're always a step or five removed from truly understanding the source material).

This is the only fandom I've been in where some people seem to impute some sort of moral judgement based on character preferences and it's wild to me. That's never happened with other books I've discussed. For example, one of the most universally loved characters in western dark fantasy is Glokta (from Joe Abercrombie's The First Law trilogy, which I read and enjoyed but am not like a super fan of - as a whole it was just okay for me - however Glokta specifically is an absolute stand-out as a character). Everyone I know loves Glokta, even my vegan friend who literally rescues bunnies as a hobby.

Glokta is just Literally Worse than Jiang Cheng in pretty much every way (love him for that). And yet 'I love Glokta' is one of the most unanimous, bland, and uncontroversial declarations you can make on a fantasy discussion board/subreddit. Even people who didn't particularly care for the books like Glokta. At best you'll have people say "eh, it just crossed a line for me when he did XYZ so I can't like him" but not "oh my god you're a horrible person for liking him, you're a TORTURE APOLOGIST!!!"

I don't mind being told I'm wrong about a point (with some sort of evidence) or 'hey, does this passage from page X change your interpretation if you reread it in Y context?' or whatever. Even among people who enjoy Jiang Cheng there are a variety of takes and flavors and points on various things and I enjoy the debates and different angles very much! Sometimes I find myself liking interpretations that directly dovetail with my own; not necessarily contradictory, but a reading that's going off in a very different direction.

But there's a certain point at which it feels pointless to engage, where it's just never going to be productive or interesting because the underlying reading is just fundamentally so different that it feels like a truly separate book.

Anyway the point is that I don't mind being disagreed with but sorry if I block you after seeing that all your reblogs are anti stuff because at this point taking the bait will just trigger all of my "someone is WRONG on the INTERNET!!!!" reflexes or whatever and ain't nobody got time for that.

Edit: oops, I left out a word...

[struggle-but-its-all-ocean-floor]

I also think the fandom has become a very unpleasant place for me, I see more and more competition between solo fans, I feel like after the announcement of the solo era the fandom has become even more divided than before. this emphasis on streaming, on buying, on winning prizes has started to overwhelm me too, and I'm losing the joy of enjoying music, the recent billboard controversy has left me with a bitter taste. some people write such mean things about the other members, they compare their solo careers all the time.

I'm on Twitter for BTS news and ever since Musk it's gotten so much worse. This For You feature only shows you the worst content. I keep seeing solo stans. The problem is that you get swept up in the competitiveness of it without meaning to. I'm almost a JK solo sometimes. I feel competitive of other members and idols too for no fucking reason. It's just hard sometimes to distance yourself from all of that because I love Jungkook the most and want everyone to as well. It's true that the fandom feels super divided. Everyone keeps pointing fingers at each other: rap line stans keep complaining that we don't make the same effort for rap line as we do for Jimin and the rest of the maknae line (which is true to an extent; no one is trying to deliberately sabotage the rap line but maknae line are more biased and pop friendly - what can you do? The victim narrative and the shaming are also annoying), and even Jimin stans complain we don't do enough. Everyone has their own agenda and competition is fierce. The Billboard thing is... I don't even know where I stand on it. Mass buying is ridiculous but radio play and playlisting being worth so much puts BTS and small artists at a disadvantage. It's all about money and gatekeeping. And yeah, it's been hard seeing the things antis (V and JK solo stans for the most part) have been saying about Jimin. The shit about him sleeping with Bang PD (to put it mildly) is so disgusting and horrifying I actually teared up seeing some of those tweets. But the only reason I saw them was Armys putting them on blast. I know they do it so we "don't engage" and report the accounts but we're actually engaging with them anyway and exposing people to that vitriol. I wouldn't even know about those tweets if Army didn't keep showing them to me.

Anyway, thanks for the ask!

[gentil-minou]

Why the sentiadrien theory scares us...and why it might actually be a wonderful narrative for therapeutic healing

So when I'm not shit posting on tumblr or flailing about ml, I'm a therapist working with kids Mari and Adrien's age. One of the reasons I was drawn to this show was how amazing it works as a metaphor for mental health and therapeutic healing.

Originally when I heard the sentiadrien theory, I was terrified because with it were all these painful complications I hadn't considered...

But when I really sat down and thought about it, I figured out how if done well sentiadrien has the potential to make Adrien's story more compelling than anything we might have thought... I also find it fascinating how the fandom is reacting to it and how it might be related to the way a fan handles grief, mental health, and the loss of hope.

I wanted to take the time to explore why the sentiadrien hurts some fans so much, to the point where they can't accept it. I also wanted to offer reassurance to those who do, because I truly think the sentiadrien theory is the best theory we have that will allow Adrien to heal and finally be free.

I'm not here to convert anyone into believing this theory, I only want to provide reassurance to those who feel pain because of it.

Disclaimer: I'm a therapist but I am not your therapist. If any of what I say offends you I'm sorry, this does not apply to every fan and is more a hypothesis than anything else. In addition, if you are in need of support please reach out to those around you and get the help you need. I strongly believe that everyone has the opportunity to get better and live their best lives.

But before we can talk about sentiadrien, we have to look at the character Adrien and his impact on his fans.

From the get go, to the fandom Adrien represents sunshine and hope. We literally see Adrien breaking free from his chains and striving for freedom. Whether or not you consider what he's been through as abuse, it's clear he has been craving a better world. Throughout the show, we watch him healing slowly. He makes friends, falls in love, develops new interests, makes jokes and values his time as Chat Noir. I've always thought this show is an excellent metaphor for mental health and the therapeutic journey, and like we can compare Marinette with anxiety and self-esteem issues (i could go into a whole separate analysis on that girl), we can say Adrien is a metaphor for the the struggles people with depression and trauma go through. He represents what happens when someone's mental health is getting better, when someone is starting their therapeutic journey towards healing.

Personally I think season 4 is tackling that last big shackle that traps Adrien. It's painful right now but the end will include Adrien finally being able to share those demons he doesn't know how to share just yet.

Now what does this mean for his fans?

Although not everyone is like this, people often turn to fandom as a way of coping with their own mental health. Seeing a character struggling with their figurative or literal demons and being able to make it out and get their happy ending is very therapeutic. And while most of us don't have a literal supervillain for a dad or dress in a leather catsuit, we can relate to Adrien's worries regarding freedom, being chained, trapped, and that desire to get out, especially those of us who have struggled with depression, emotional abuse, neglect, isolation, etc. 

Fans can look to Adrien and identify with him and maybe even rely on him as their emotional support. They find they can relate to him and that he gives them hope it will get better. It happens a lot with a lot of shows but Adrien is sunshine boy who has hard times but can still smile and laugh even though there is still pain, it makes sense to have him as an emotional support character. He represents healing.

"If a character like him can get better, can be free and happy, then I can too."

He represents our hope.

This is where the sentiadrien discourse happens and why i think it provides valuable info for fandom psychology, particularly for fans who are anti-sentiadrien.

Let's consider the way sentimonsters were introduced in the show, created as a tool, an object to be used and discarded. They're different than an akuma which is purified, sentis are taken away and never seen again. We can compare it to those of us striving for freedom, and that fear of never getting it. For example senti-Ladybug, the only senti we have seen be freed from their chains...was destroyed regardless.

The implications of that episode were that even if we can win back control, are we really free? Did we really win? Can we really not be destroyed or can we lose again? This is something I see a lot with those healing from trauma, the fear that their freedom is fleeting.

There's also the whole senti"monster" bit. People don't like hearing they are considered a monster, there are some other implications there as well. But it implies outcast or segregation, discrimination. Plenty of real-world painful concepts in the word itself. To apply it to the character we identify the most with might make us believe that we too are monsters, and that hurts.

A lot of the discomfort also stems from the idea that this would be emotionally crushing for Adrien, and we who can relate to him can empathize almost too much with him.

To have thought you were getting better, improving everyday, having the ability to make your own choices and the chance to be free, then losing it because were you ever really free? All that healing, just to lose again? But the sentiadrien theory implies there is none, that at the end Adrien is going to be controlled and the freedom he worked hard to get is going to go away and he will be back in the dark place he was at the beginning of the show. That is a very real fear a lot of people have. So the theory kinda takes that hope and throws it in the trash

So now we've established that the implication behind sentiadrien can be traumatic and painful, how on earth could it be possible for Adrien to grow from it?

Well first, we need to talk about what it means to heal from trauma.

The way I handle trauma is by helping people reclaim their safety and empowering them, showing them that despite it all they made it through and are tougher than they think.

What that doesn't mean is telling them that their trauma wasn't real, that their feelings aren't valid, that they should forgive their abusers, that their pain and experiences didn't matter. THAT IS NOT WHAT THIS MEANS.

That's also not what the sentiadrien theory means. It doesn't mean that Adrien's experiences were somehow not real. It doesn't mean his abuse wasn't real. It doesn't mean that his feelings are invalid. It doesn't. The way he came into the world might have been different, but at the end of the day, his experiences were REAL.

Even if Adrien is a senti-being, he is STILL Adrien, he will always be sunshine cat boy. He's real.

So now we get to the point of this: Why the sentiadrien theory has some amazing storytelling potential.

I always thought this show was an excellent way to describe mental health and the therapeutic journey in general. (I've used it to describe the CBT triangle with some clients with great success! Let me know if people want to hear about it because seriously it's some amazing comparisons) And sentiadrien is a perfect, real and raw metaphor for healing from trauma.

People think that sentiadrien will erase Adrien's trauma and make him less than a real person, essentially confirming a fan's inner fears that their pain is not real or invalid.

In reality, it would actually do the opposite and empower Adrien.

When working with trauma using TF-CBT, a major component is the use of a trauma narrative where people with PTSD tell the story of their trauma, from their point of view, free of criticism and invalidation. A chance for them to take their story and tell it, their way.

For years, Adrien never had a chance to tell his story, his way. Even if he wasn't a senti-being, he has always been controlled by his dad and probably his mom too. Becoming Chat Noir was Adrien's way of breaking free, but he hasn't dealt with or addressed any of his trauma. It's been pushed to the side, to be dealt with never.

But if he's a senti, he will have to address what happened to him and face the fundamental question he has in season 4: Does he belong, is he needed?

@coccinelle-et-chaton once said it very well: "abuse victims that relate to Adrien already have difficulties legitimizing their own emotions and are constantly double-guessing themselves. The fact that the character you relate to bc of your trauma turns out to be "magic" even though that does not negate his emotions, can elicit a powerful reaction bc deep down you just want to be acknowledged."

And to those who share those sentiments, I want to ask them this: Is your trauma real? And if Adrien is a senti, does that make him any less real?

And the answer is yes, they are.

If the writers can do it (and I actually sincerely think they can), being a senti could mean Adrien learning to take control of himself while dealing with his "trauma", and even eventually reclaiming his life and freedom through getting control of his amok.

Thus showing that despite the trauma and pain and depression and anxiety, he can still live a normal life. He is still real.

That's essentially what treating PTSD is, we cant make the trauma go away but we can take back control, while allowing those who struggle with it to realize their experiences and feelings are real and valid. To show that despite it all, we can live and keep going. And that actually avoiding the trauma or not thinking about it makes the whole situation worse. If Adrien is a senti, he will face that and he will come out stronger for it.

Despite everything, sentiAdrien is inarguably, indelibly real. (Something even Thomas Astruc has discussed in his twitter responses.)

Adrien is real, just like a viewer's trauma and mental health is real.

And that despite it all, even during the hardest and bleakest time, you are real and you can keep living. Your struggles and past are part of you, but they don't define you.

Like how sentiAdrien isn't just a senti, he's a kid, a friend, a hero, and so, so much more. Just like how he is so much more than being a senti, you are so much more than your trauma.

Your trauma doesn't control you, only you can.

Like Adrien if he gets control of his amok.

Picture this, we discover Adrien was a senti,

Created by his parents to be "the perfect son" and it hurts....hurts worse than anything else ever has and ever could.

Every worst fear, that is is replaceable, unimportant, invalid, unneeded, unwanted, come to the forefront of his mind.

But wait...he isn't just a senti...he's a human. He is, he was created to be yes, but he's still a person.

But not just any person, he's a hero. He's Chat Noir, wearer of the black cat miraculous...

Destruction itself.

And, just like how Mari can use Creation to create anything, Adrien can use destruction to break anything....

Including the magic that binds him to his amok, to his creater, that keeps him from his freedom.

Picture this: Adrien's power-up is what helps him take back control and lets him take control of himself, and his life.

He takes back his own freedom. And proves, most importantly to himself, that he DOES belong. He doesn't need some creator or someone else to tell him that. He can tell himself that, and that's the ONLY voice who matters.

In Summary,

The sentiadrien theory has scary implications and it is painful to think about, but it also has the potential for tremendous growth and healing. In fact, i think sentiadrien would cover multiple mental health avenues and ml has always done a wonderful job with mental health analysis and therapeutic healing.

And our boy is in deep denial mode with his emotions, finding out he's a senti would be super helpful in helping him open the door and start processing them.

It also shows that we don't always get a successful upward curve of progress. Sometimes we have dips and low lows and sometimes we hit rock bottom again. But we get back up, and we keep going and we keep living. We have control of our own destinies and our own lives, and Adrien will too. (Remember: ML is a kids show, we aren't going to have a tragic ending)

But despite it all:

Being a senti-being doesn't make Adrien any less of a character. It doesn't make him less of a person, it doesn't make him someone whose experiences matter any less than Mari or Nino or Gabe or anyone. He is real, just like them. His feelings, his thoughts, his experiences, his pain, his hope, and his dreams matter.

Just like yours do.

Note: please feel free to ask any questions, I love this topic and could talk about ml and mental health for ages. Just remember I'm not your therapist and for true support and care I always recommend going to a pro.

Edit: Someone asked if being a senti invalidates Adrien's existence, here is my response

[egg-emperor]

People brought up some great points that I agree so much with on my recent IDW rant post. But now there are quite a few responses and I unfortunately can't cover my thoughts on all of them.

But I'm very happy that I'm not alone in my disappointment in Eggman's portrayal in IDW and how harmful it's been to his character. Because when I go on Twitter, usually all I see are people being all for Eggman being tossed aside and shit on by every other villain, along with the belief that he's a bad villain and better off becoming a good guy. It sucks that IDW itself has been further influencing their hatred and/or misconceptions of Eggman with the Mr. Tinker plot and them putting down Eggman and writing him OOC to try to make other villains appear superior.

One of the reasons I'm especially worried about with Eggman's awful treatment in IDW + a VAST majority of people on Twitter shitting on Eggman is that I fear it may no longer be just a fan opinion at some point. You know, in the way that they actually end up having an impact on official media besides IDW, since the damage has certainly already been done there. I know the fans never get a complete say in what we want in the series as they know how divided Sonic fans can be and we'd definitely have SA3 or Adventure series remakes if they always listened to the loud majority of the fandom.

But in the case, you even have IDW tossing him aside in much worse ways than the games by acting like he doesn't have anything going for him, has never been capable of being a competent and serious threat, and taking any opportunity to have other villains screw him over and shit on him. (As if those other villains have ever been as evil and destructive as the man that had the world in his hands and has come very close multiple other times. UGH) They overemphasize his flaw of sometimes overlooking things in his plans, ignore the impressive plans he's had with backups and accomplishments, and make him look like a complete joke and 'not so bad of a guy' compared to other villains, which undermines his villainy even more.

Then you have Sonic Twitter, with a huge amount of people saying that other one note one time villains in the series are so much better than Eggman, just because they prefer their designs and act like having Eggman as the final boss is the problem because he's so 'boring' compared to the monster of the week villains. Even though it's because they're being lazy by reusing the Nega Wisp armor battle attacks and sequences since Colors and literally how tf is that the character's fault? Eggman can ABSOLUTELY have epic badass final bosses if they actually started trying something different. There's no reason to blame the fact that it's Eggman!

But like I said, an overwhelming amount of people agree with this statement.

And let me make myself clear first, I don't see any harm in wanting more villains. I'm not saying Eggman needs to be the only one. BUT- I think it's important that Eggman finally gets more opportunities to shine, without all these other villains stealing his spotlight and being used to undermine his own villainy.

What bothered me most about this tweet wasn't the initial statement alone.

Though I will say that it's easy to have a hunch that anyone that acts like "ugh why is Eggman the boss that gets used so much, I want big evil monsters instead!" aren't very big fans of Eggman, and probably find him boring and weak compared to them. And they also have a problem with him being the final boss as if he isn't the main antagonist of the entire series, which has never been a problem with other franchises, so why Sonic? Well, it's very often because they just dislike Eggman for no good reason.

What actually bothered me the most about the tweet were the responses. There were hundreds of quote retweets and replies putting Eggman down for the sake of praising these other villains and. They act like Eggman has never been a fun, interesting, and entertaining villain in the series. That he's just an incompetent and goofy joke and nothing more, like he's never capable of being a serious threat. They ignore the countless times he certainly has been throughout the series and in the games. They shit on him for everything, like his design, personality, the final bosses, everything.

It's always disappointing to see just how many people overlook the brilliance of his character and why he's so worthy of being the main and most important villain in the series. And do you know what doesn't help at all? The way that IDW have been supporting these misconceptions and hatred for his character. Or pushing the belief that he's not capable of some of the most fucked up and evil shit, like he has been many times in the games, and that there's any chance of going back on all that and being a genuinely good guy. (There isn't.)

Eggman has already been pushed aside and/or had his spotlight stolen by other inferior villains in the series too many times in the games. And while there were small instances of things looking up while giving Eggman a great portrayal and a serious status as a threat, there are still other villains stealing his opportunity for the extent of his villainy and abilities to be fully explored. And that's why I think Eggman should get to be the main villain more often, not just in terms of being the final boss but even more.

Because sure, he was supposed to have the entire world in his hands in Forces, he had a great well thought out plan with backup after backup, and he was the final boss. But guess who overshadowed him and made him get much less screentime than he deserved a result? Infinite. And this isn't to put Infinite down, (though I do think he was poorly written and they didn't give us enough to him to be a credible and interesting villain) it's just a fact that Infinite got much more focus than Eggman and it was disappointing.

With Eggman finally accomplishing something that he's been fighting for since the very beginning, it should've been a WAY bigger deal. He should've been one of the biggest focuses of the story and the main villain. It was especially disappointing to find out that they were shoving Infinite in there when, at the very first reveal of the game and the earliest info we got, they really made it seem like we were going to get a lot more Eggman focus and spotlight. I really thought that we were going to get something amazing.

Lost World had more Eggman focus than Forces, despite it being a game where he was betrayed rather than ruling the fucking world, and that's ridiculous. We didn't get to see what Eggman had been up to during those six months in Forces (doesn't help that they didn't even make the world look like it belonged to him at all :\) and his side of things much at all, because instead we had more scenes of Infinite making edgy speeches to Sonic and the avatar that meant nothing in the end. And even then, I've seen people say he's better than Eggman just because they think he looks cooler.

Eggman has already been sidelined by other villains and had the spotlight stolen too many times in the game series because they think he can't be interesting enough on his own. The repetition of him always being betrayed and thrown aside was more annoying than them repeating the same last boss fight could ever be to me. Eggman's character isn't the problem for the lackluster final boss battles and he deserves the chance to truly shine and get much more screen time and focus as a character. Then they can finally improve on their final bosses and have more villains in the picture- that don't take away from Eggman.

Of course, Eggman has also been mistreated in the games in a way that had fans saying that other villains are better and more capable than him. What's already been done so many times certainly can't be prevented. But I really don't want that to continue and tried to have hope in them finally giving Eggman the spotlight he deserves and show his true potential. At times it seemed like things were going to improve. But if IDW keep overexaggerating Eggman's flaws and push the idea that he's a terrible villain and Sonic Twitter praise it and put him down too, what if it does continue?

When official media and fans have this opinion more often than not and they speak the loudest, I can't help but fear that this is one of the things that will actually have a negative impact on Eggman's portrayal in the games and we'll get even more betrayals and sidelining. And it makes me think, will his character ever truly get the respect he deserves? Will he ever get the chance to prove himself to fans of the series that see him as boring and inferior to their favorite monster of the week villains?

It's not something I should have to worry about because Eggman is the main and best villain of the series and deserves respect and recognition. But the way IDW support these misconceptions and slander his character, on top of all the hatred Eggman has suffered in the fandom for long enough, it makes sense. I wonder whether they'll believe that most people don't want Eggman to be the main series villain anymore, that he should be betrayed and shit on by other villains even more and get even less spotlight.

It'd be the exact opposite of everything us Eggman fans want and I seriously hope it won't come to that. :(

[eisforeidolon]

So 90% of my dash and Twitter is currently gushing over the prequel pilot and how amazing it is and how it's one of the best pilots they've ever seen etc.

How much they love Carlos, Mary, Lati and even John already (that 180° on John was hella fast lol).

Also lots of people saying how the pilot has totally changed their mind on the show and that they're going to watch it now after all.

I'm not really feeling it though. I mean, I did think the pilot was good; I've definitely seen way worse show pilots and I enjoyed watching it, but it wasn't that spectacular imo. I agree though that it did feel like old school SPN during some moments and the cast is very likable and has chemistry. I will watch the next few episodes and see where it takes me, I guess.

Nobody on my dash appears to even be watching it, so I went further afield to the tags and a few forums and review aggregators to see what was being said. And yeah, even if you eliminate the obvious stans (panning it with no real details or praising it with no real details where it's pretty clear it's not actually about what they may or may not have actually watched)? I did see a lot more people way more jazzed about it than I expected to. Although really, fandom can be just as much inclined towards euphoric hyperbole as the negative kind when it comes to immediate reactions. The tune may be different in a week or two - or not. It's way too early to say and the fact this is the first new thing from the SPNverse in years likely plays a part.

Haven't gotten around to watching it myself, but the most repeated complaints I saw even from positive reviews were about the pacing and there being too much exposition. Which may be a pervasive underlying issue (it was a big problem in later SPN IMO). Or it may be tied into trying to simultaneously convince new viewers they don't need to watch the 15 year mothership to understand what's going on and trying to convince fans from said mothership it's similar/familiar enough to invest in within a single episode. I.e. trying to switch them from complaining that this wasn't what happened in canon to caring about what's happening instead here and why (which is a harder sell for some than for others). At a glance I'd say overall the biggest divide between people who liked it or saw potential vs. those who really didn't was actually whether or not the viewer thought the actors were good and had chemistry with each other.

Some shows jump right in and are excellent from their pilots, while some have to stumble around and find their footing a bit first. And of course some shows never live up to their potential. I generally think anything you're intrigued by that you don't immediately bounce hard off of is worth giving at least a few episodes. Sometimes it pays off, sometimes it's time wasted, but that's just how it goes.

[metvmorqhoses]

(Possible spoilers for the book? Maybe)Do you think the darkling will ever meet alina again? in the books I believe Zoya is on a mission to finally kill darkling and essentially put him out of his misery. I would hope he’d get to share his last moments with Alina but I’m not sure. What do you think? Also do you think he’d still be capable of loving Alina without her powers since her loss devastates him?

i think bardugo's hate and lack of perspective regarding the darkling, who is still to this day the literal main reason her books are even sold and netflix shows are made, to be one the weirdest and most ridiculous relationships any author can have with their own villain.

this very hate, devoid of any creative logic, has been constantly effecting her writing and the fate she keeps choosing for him and alina, making any high meaning or beauty they might share inexorably go to hell along with the plot.

do i wish he is going to get to spend his last moments with alina? absolutely, he deserves as much. is alina mentally worthy of it? does she finally understand why he acted as he did? the burden of his immortality? how small a little white betrayal is in the scheme of things? can she finally comprehend the length of his solitude and desperation? i don't think so, because i don't think bardugo does either. i think she took an intriguing archetype (the cursed beautiful monster, the deathless one, death paired with the maiden, you name it) and used it very lightly because it sounded cool, because she thrives on stereotypes, and to serve her very own "beware of beautiful toxic guys" personal crusade, without really getting she was letting a monster with thousands of years of mythological tradition into her novels and that people would have expected more precisely because of it.

and to be quite honest, i don't think we are ever going to get this "more" we are so much in need of, unless she decides to go for some cheesy deathbed goodbye because she feels the fandom wants it. i don't think bardugo gets darklina, if not in its very superficial alluring, profitable aspects. i had the proof of it when she decided to make alina lose her power. this is literally the worse thing she could decide to inflict on them both and she even made it pass as a holy act on alina's part and the proof the darkling only wanted her power and not her as a person? lol

utterly terrible, absurd.

i love how darklina haters always quote this very thing as well, clearly unable to grasp the bigger picture here. i really don't get how people can fail to see the darkling's reaction at alina losing literally who she is, her power, her status as his immortal balance, is actually the very proof of how much she meant to him. he was robbed of his one hope of completeness, of an eternal belonging, of a true home that would have never crumbled to dust under the impossible pressure and eating of time. the moment alina lost her power, he was condemned to a fate worse than death, his worse nightmare made reality. the entire universe went dark, every light out. alina's soul divided and desecrated into hundreds of strangers. and alina knew this (superficially, probably, as her author) and yet she left him alone again and again, the only act of pity she was able to muster was trying and trying to kill him and make it look like mercy. i bet he was devastated. i bet he volunteered to eternal damnation in order to make something meaningful out of it all, in order to atone his own pain somehow. and in all this alina would play at husband and wife with the lukewarm idiot, grow old and die without her power, the fabric of her very soul, without her perfect other part, her perfect balance, knowing the darkling's fate and even being happy about it all? is this a plot that makes any actual sense?

alina's reactions and choices during the entirety of the saga are shocking, lame, lacking insight and heart. i blame the entirety of it on bardugo's lack of depth and, in general, of the creative courage to simply go beyond and deliver true meaning.

it's a pity, really. i hope she is going to give darklina a better, more felt closure at least. i think they deserve as much.

[itsclydebitches]

Hey there! Admittedly I'm a little bit nervous since this is my first ask, but I'll try to not be too rambly.

So, recently the main subreddit, r/RWBY, made a ban on active users of the r/RWBYcritics subreddit. As a result there's been discussion around bad-faith criticism in the latter subreddit. What are your takes on bad-faith criticism?

For me personally, I think a bunch of people are misusing the term "bad-faith" and using it as a way to shut down criticism, but I'm curious to hear your thoughts on it.

Hey there, everyone! We woke up to some drama this morning, huh? And hello to you too, Tortoise! I'm so glad you decided to send in an ask, even if it's following some pretty tumultuous events...

Right, I'd like to start with a story. The story of how I personally don't spend time on Reddit, but I have plenty of friends who will occasionally cross-post something for me to see. Yesterday (or the day before? Idk time is meaningless) a friend told me about a post — which, significantly, I'm now having trouble finding — that covers RWBY's inconsistent writing and the fandom's tendency to try and explain away those missteps. They'd thought I'd be interested because I'd just had a conversation here on tumblr where I made that exact point to someone who, also significantly, vehemently disagreed with me, but in a very civil fashion. Given everything going on, I feel like this side point needs emphasis: we debated, we did so in a sometimes heated, but nevertheless respectful manner, it was clear neither of us was going to sway the other, and the conversation ended. The two "sides" of the community interacted without Armageddon coming about.

But back to the purpose of this tale. I went to take a look at this point and found that it no longer exists. There's just some vague message about it not obeying the subreddit's rules. "What happened?" I asked. "Why'd they take the post down?" "People were getting too heated in the comments," my friend replies. So, given that the comments were still visible, I proceeded to read through them, expecting personal attacks, slurs, harassment, etc. Any number of things that would justify deleting the post itself to put an end to such behavior. Instead, I found a thread of people having a conversation. Was the conversation heated at times? Sure. Did one or two individual posters edge into the realm of petulant, "No. You're wrong and stupid" responses? Yes. Was any of this remotely what I was expecting given the post's removal? NOPE.

"This isn't allowed?" I said. "Well then what is? People were being civil! Or at least as civil as hundreds of strangers ever get when discussing a series they're passionate about online."

Then, this morning, I hear that the entire critic subreddit has been banned.

So to answer your question, Tortoise, I don't actually think that "good faith" criticism exists. Meaning, it's not just that fans are misusing the term "bad faith criticism," but rather that there is no unified, agreed up method of writing criticism that will meet their standards. It's not possible and we know it's not possible because fans have been trying to meet those elusive standards for years:

A fan posts nothing but praise for RWBY until changes make them criticize the show as it is now. Their entire body of work is dismissed as the product of a "hater," despite the overwhelming gap between positive and negative reviews.

A fan posts a review that's a pretty balanced mix between praise and criticism. They're dismissed because it's still too much criticism.

A fan posts a review that's 99% praise with 1% criticism. That's still too much, with fans focusing on the single problem they had with the work and using it as an excuse to dismiss the entire review out of hand.

(As an aside, the argument that critics are "obsessed" with only saying negative things and that the only problem here is that they're "too" negative ignores the argument that... RWBY has a lot of flaws nowadays. Few are willing to acknowledge the possibility that it's not fans insisting on making things up to be mad about/ignoring the good parts of the show, it's the that show is, as of now, legitimately more of a mess than it is a praise-worthy product. If I'd been writing recaps in the Volumes 1-4 days, my work would have been skewed far more towards the positive. The critics' stance is that RWBY has gotten worse, which yes, results a higher volume of critical posts. To say nothing of how criticism takes far longer to explain, likewise resulting in posts focused primarily on that side of the divide. I really enjoyed the image of a crying Jaune reflected in his sword. I did not enjoy that moment's context. Saying that you liked an animation choice is a one sentence thing. Explaining the complexities of Jaune securing emotional moments, the problems with Penny's second death, the hurt many fans experienced watching an assisted suicide, etc. takes a whooole lot longer. Hence, you get massive, multiple posts about these nuanced topics and fewer, smaller posts about the details that are working well.)

A fan talks about a topic that has been metaphorically banned by the fandom as a whole. They have something good to say about Ironwood. They dislike something about Blake/Yang. They enjoyed Adam as a character. They have a problem with Ruby's leadership, etc. There's a whole list of topics nowadays that will result in an automatic dismissal, regardless of the point the fan is trying to make or how well they make it.

A fan talks about the minority representation of RWBY — its black characters, its queer characters, its disabled characters, etc. — and as a result has something to say about the biases and missteps of those writing these characters. This is considered an attack on the writers and, therefore, automatically bad.

A fan talks about how they enjoyed RWBY as it was years ago and is having trouble reconciling the dark, complicated story with the simple, hopeful one we started out with. This is seen as an attack on Monty's vision and an unwillingness to accept that "everything is planned."

A fan does as asked and ensures that their post is meeting all the requirements of "real" criticism. They have an argument to make. They have a point. They provide evidence. They recommend a solution. They keep their tone respectful. They don't attack the creators. They provide disclaimers in every single paragraph about how they do not hate RWBY. It doesn't matter. They're considered too negative.

I have, quite literally, seen every one of the above examples on multiple occasions. I have had many of the above accusations leveled at my own work. When fans say that they're fine with criticism provided it's not "bad faith" criticism, they don't actually have a specific post-type in mind; a checklist of behaviors another fan can emulate and, provided they do that, no hate will come their way. Or, if an individual fan does actually go, "Yeah. That criticism I'm fine with" that response is in no way universal. One person's "They make a good, civil point" is another person's, "Omg stop bashing the show!" Because "bashing" has come to mean everything from curse-laden insults towards everything RWBY has ever done, to posts that just happen to say something other fans don't agree with.

It's a rigged game. There is no way to post criticism about RWBY in an agreed-upon, appropriate manner. This recent ban is proof of that. I think it's incredibly telling that almost immediately after I was going, "Wow. A pretty calm debate about the flaws of RWBY in the main sub. That's great to see," all posters from the criticism subreddit were banned. The main sub literally just had the sort of criticism that they claim to accept — people respectfully posting analysis-based arguments resulting in calm debate — and yet they implemented the ban anyway. I'm not going to pretend that I've never gotten too heated on my own posts, never made snarky comments when I'm frustrated, never used exaggerated reaction GIFs that can come across as insulting... but I'd say on the whole my RWBY work is precisely the sort of "good faith" criticism that other fans are supposedly looking for. I never make an argument I don't think I can back up with evidence. I try to allow for the nuance and differing opinions of complicated topics. I try — even if I don't always succeed — to write in a clear, respectful manner. Yet none of that work has stopped people from telling me I'm a "bitter... raging asshole," a "deranged, delusional psychopath," telling me to set myself on fire, threatening to smash my head in, or just messages to straight up kill myself. If someone like me who legitimately works hard to create fair, defendable criticism and who only ever posts on a personal blog that people can easily block, who never engages in debate until someone else starts it first, never seeks out other fans I disagree with to harass them about what they like... if someone like me is still a "bad faith" critic who "deserves" that kind of hate mail... then what kind of criticism do people want?

Nothing. That's the answer. No criticism whatsoever, of any kind, no matter if it's delivered respectfully, is making a good point, whatever. That's why "RWDE" was created. That's why the critic subreddit was created. The community at large has demanded a complete separation between Praise and Anything That's Not 100% Praise, which has now resulted in this ban. Any other explanations we see are excuses, which becomes glaringly obvious when you look at the mods' supposed reasons for implementing the ban:

"Constant arguments with r/RWBY users" - As opposed to the arguments surrounding things like shipping that never, ever happen?

"Vote manipulation and comment brigades" - The subreddit with 3,000 participants, with around 200 on at a time, is manipulating the votes of a subreddit with 155,000 participants, with over 1,000 on at a time? Those numbers just do not check out. If a positive post is downvoted, or a critical post upvoted, maybe that's because large swaths of the community actually agree/disagree with that assessment, not because the incredibly smaller group is somehow manipulating things.

"Attacking and harassing those they disagree with" — Again, as opposed to those non-critics that never, ever harass people? This is an individual problem, not a community problem. Both critics and non-critics have their sub-groups acting in ways they shouldn't. If anything, the main sub will have more individuals harassing other fans, simply by virtue of being so much larger. As the above examples attest, it's not other critics who have told me to light myself on fire and, just to be clear, the asks I've responded to are a miniscule number compared to the amount I've received. I delete the lion's share for my own sanity and to save my followers from reading the really graphic threats.

"Months-long NSFL spam brigades" — I am, admittedly, not sure what this is referring to. Spamming of NSFW content? If so, that's also an individual problem.

"Homophobic, transphobic, and racist attacks towards our users" — See the above points. Again. If someone is being homophobic, transphobic, or racist, then yes please, ban them. Don't ban an entire community for the actions of a few. It's like walking into a store and banning a customer for causing a scene... but then also banning everyone else who happened to be shopping at the same time. It's guilt by association.

The silver lining to all this? The community as a whole isn't pleased. At least according to the main subreddit comments and a few individual voices like MurderofBirds. Despite the increase (from my perspective anyway) of critical voices post-Volume 8, criticism of RWBY is still very much seen as taboo. As this ban showcases. But it's really reassuring to see so many fans, critics and non-critics alike, going, "This was a mistake." A community is meant to include all aspects of engagement: praise, criticism, and the gray area between. If anything, fans like the mods of the main subreddit should be creating a separate subreddit that is specifically for praise. In the same way that there should have been a tag for RWBY praise, rather than trying to eliminate any and all criticism from the main "RWBY" tag. The majority of fans, even those who claim to hate critics and all they (presumably) stand for, recognize that a blanket ban of all criticism is not the way to go, especially when "criticism" has come to have such a staggeringly broad definition. If you want your RWBY experience to be nothing but sunshine and roses (ha), then cultivate your own internet experience to reflect that. Create your own pockets with rules about how this is the space for praise and if you're not up for praising RWBY right now, don't interact with us in this particular space. Don't try to make the entire community — the main tools used to discuss the show online — conform to your preferences. As established, there is no "good" criticism that everyone in the fandom will accept, which just leaves a fandom with no criticism at all. I'm glad to see I'm far from the only one who, when presented with that extreme, is going, "Nope. No thank you."

[tenaflyviper]

I might as well tell the whole story, for those who care, and just to get it off my chest. I'll tag it with "long post" so people can avoid it.

So...I unfollowed and quietly drifted from these guys around 5-6 years ago (by "these guys", I mean the ones that later started acting toxic. There are good folks mixed in with them, and yes--within them. I sometimes wonder if maybe covid hadn't happened, perhaps things would have been different. It fucked with all of our lives--made many folks anxious, pent up, frustrated, and depressed. Social media is also the worst place for anything political, especially when there's an unfair imbalance/bias that shouldn't be ignored. Morty got flagged on Facebook for a covid meme). I did the mass unfollowing because I didn't want to see discourse on my dash for my own well-being. At the time, I had nothing against them. Others had left before me (I won't name names, but there was one guy that got pretty popular and pulled away from the pack). I watched how they were treated, never thinking it would happen to me. "He must have done or said something wrong", I thought.

Before that, I spent years getting threats and insults for sticking up for these guys--and constantly being asked to look at posts and get involved in their arguments--all while they otherwise rarely acknowledged my existence. Still, I truly believed we were in the right. I even got caught up in what was basically bullying the hell out of a teenage girl for not wanting to see creepy shit in the fandom of a show made with little girls in mind (yes, many of them are bronies, and the exact kind that made people hate bronies. There are nice people that just enjoy the show and reblog wholesome art).

Before I left KF for good (having originally been invited by someone from the TF2 community that I'd known from before I'd ever heard of tumblr--she has since left KF behind as well), I looked at the thread about Takashi and those closest to him, and saw that things had gotten worse. They had even become the subject of memes (Kung Pow Penis anyone?). Without thinking, I expressed that I was glad I moved away from them. Obviously, they were still watching the thread. I can't blame them, but they seem too preoccupied with their image online, despite that it means jack in real life. When the thread first began, I went in with the sole purpose of defending Takashi, which I did for many pages (without success). I tried countless times thereafter to urge him and others to move away from discourse: It's a waste of time, especially when people are so divided.

At some point during lockdown, I agreed with some things I saw on Twitter (Twitter can be even worse than tumblr. I try to avoid looking at what's "trending", but 99% of HorrorFam, and every horror actor, director, and musician I follow--Jeffrey Combs, Dee Snider, etc.--are very left, so it's hard to never see anything political, and these were my childhood heroes who helped shape my values growing up. I was raised listening to skinhead-hating punks and anti-censorship metalheads, and hating conservatives that kept trying to ban and censor my favorite horror movies and games). It didn't take long for others to start throwing around terms like "sjw", and saying things like "how the mighty have fallen". It was all too familiar--the exact same things they used to say about/to the guy that left before I did.

I never wanted to be "mighty" to anyone. I'm being very honest when I say I'm naïve, and I'm not proud of it. I don't know much about how politics even work--I just want to be a decent person. I'm someone who'll bend over backwards for others at my own expense, and is always eager to make friends--a combination that's made me susceptible to being used ever since I was a kid. I had some "friends" in grade school that hung around me because I'd share things like candy. They later tried stealing my bike out from under me (guess they really dug my cheap, turquoise baby bike with a cartoon puppy on it).

I just want to move on, and try to be a better person. I say "try" because I still fumble at it. I overreact to things. I keep slipping into an "all or nothing" mentality, which I've since found is part of having ADHD. I'm crap at wording things, and have trouble being concise. I'm not perfect, and shouldn't have been expected to be. I just like making movie lists for people (I'm starting to use my Letterboxd account), talking about horror, sharing weird things I've learned, and posting dumb fat unicorns. It doesn't matter to me if they don't get a lot of notes--the fun is sharing them with others. Making even just one person smile is a worthwhile achievement.

I could have stayed in that crowd, and kept going along with everything they said and did. I'd have an entire group willing to reblog my long, rambling text posts. But, it just didn't feel right. I didn't want that, especially when it was hurting others for no good reason. I felt bad for everything I said and did, and I still do.

Sorry again for the TL:DR, but I can't use cuts on mobile. I am speaking from the heart, no matter what anyone tries to accuse me of. Like Morty told me, I know myself better, as do those around me that love and care about me. I'm blessed to have a job that I love that also benefits my community, with people that are more like family than coworkers.

I deeply appreciate every person that's stuck with me through even my worst, and who actually talk to me about either of our interests. I'm also thankful for those who patiently explain their criticism for my dumb monkey brain, even when I don't always listen. I have a tendency to be stubborn, but I would not have changed at all if I never took anyone's words to heart. I guess that's all I have to say.

[fantasticallyfoolishidea]

So, bath scenes. Amirite?

The Witcher fandom is quite blessed. Over the course one season, the showrunners decided to gift us with not one but two scenes of Henry Cavill, naked in a bathtub, two episodes in a ro-

Wait a minute.

Two back-to-back episodes featuring drawn out bath scenes that go on for 2-3 minutes each. That's a lot of time to dedicate to fanservice when you only have 8 episodes to get your point across. Unless, of course… No. They wouldn't. Or would they?

I re-watched these scenes more times than I care to admit. For science. They’re interesting for numerous of reasons (Henry Cavills’ pecs being only two of them). But you know what’s even more interesting? Some sexy, sexy cinematic and narrative parallels and contrasts.

(Obligatory linebreak for your protection. You thought I went overboard analysing Her Sweet Kiss? This is worse. If you’re on mobile – I apologise. Now’s the time to scroll fast. It’ll take longer than you’re expecting, trust me. I’m sorry.)

Bath in “Of Banquets, Bastards and Burials” Bath in “Bottled Appetites” Please excuse the terrible of the second clip. It’s the only one I could find that had the whole scene in it.

First things first,

the setting

The scene in “Of Banquets, Bastards and Burials” takes place in an inn. The room is dark. Throughout the scene you can hear chatter from the bar. Candles are the only visible light source, although, at the beginning of the scene you can see more light coming in through what’s presumably a window outside the shot. Due to the lighting, the majority of the room has a noticeably blue tint, except for the cabinets on each side of the room where most of the candles are placed. Apart from the cabinets, the bathtub Geralt is sitting in is the only area that’s properly illuminated.

The room itself seems big enough, although we only get to see the bathing area which is separated from the rest of the room by blue curtains, but due the way the scene is shot – frequent close ups of the actors, wider shots frequently partially blocked by the curtains – it appears smaller than it actually is. Geralt stands out against the background due to his skin appearing orange in the candle light; in wider shots he usually appears centred.

In contrast, Jaskier moves from one side of the room to the other a lot and doesn’t remain in either light source for long. Unlike Geralt’s skin, the colour of his clothes matches the background. This is somewhat unusual because in many of his scenes Jaskier and his colourful outfits tend to stick out like a sore thumb – the red outfit in “Rare Species” probably the most visually distracting out of the bunch – but in this scene, the exact opposite happens. Whenever Jaskier’s not the focus of the shot he frequently fades into the background or even gets obstructed by the curtains.

(While I’d love to add visual references for every single point I touch upon, honestly, the amount of editing that’d require is astronomical. Jokes on me though, because it already is. Watching the scenes should give you a better idea of what I’m talking about, though. Also, full disclosure, screenshots and gifs had their brightness an colours altered slightly for better visibility.)

Now, on the other hand, we have the room inside the mayor’s house, which – while also dimly lit by candlelight – appears open and spacious. Due to the candles, the room appears tinged only in colours on the orange/yellow spectrum. No curtains to obstruct parts of the shot, and unlike the inn, this room has got visible windows one of which sits behind Geralt. That window in particular lets in a stream of blue light that, in wider shots, often appears to frame either Geralt alone or both, Geralt and Yennefer. However, the blue light remains behind the characters, neither Geralt nor Yennefer are ever directly illuminated by it.

Why is she going on and on about the lighting you might ask? It’s because there’s basically a whole science to colour theory, colour grading, and the ways they’re used in visual media. It’s one of the reasons why, for example, Guillermo del Toro movies are always such goddamn feasts for the eyes. TV Tropes also has a page dedicated to it, if you wanna get a rough idea of what’s going on here.

Both bath scenes in the Witcher (2019) are gorgeous examples of colour grading and set design. You can tell that a whole lot of thought went into it. “Bottled Appetites” even takes it a step further, carrying the orange/blue colour scheme over into the next scene and directly contrasting the bed frame that’s bathed in amber light with the blue windows it’s framed by.

Fun fact, while colour grading can be used to give colours that certain “pop”, you can also achieve the exact opposite effect. See how washed out and grey Jaskier and his blue clothes appear on the orange bedding in this shot? It becomes even more apparent later on in the scene.

He might as well be one of the pillows for the way his clothes make your eyes just kinda slip over him. Honestly, I wanna marry whoever was in charge of doing colour correction on the Witcher. That person is a fucking artist. I’ll get back to the matter of colours and backgrounds in a minute. For now, let’s talk about

body positioning

Or in other words, yet another reason I’d sell my immortal soul to directors Alex Garcia Lopez and Charlotte Brändström.

One thing the scenes have in common (apart from the copious amounts of eye candy) is that Geralt remains mostly stationary at the centre throughout the scene. Jaskier moves around a lot. He dries his hands behind Geralt, moves in front of him to fiddle with the bath salts, sits down next to Geralt, sets Geralt’s mug down on the cabinet behind him and only stops his continuous back and forth motion when the conversation takes a turn for the serious and he settles down in front of Geralt.

Yennefer, on the other hand, starts off at Geralt’s right hand side, slightly to the back of him. She briefly lies down, stands up, and moves to Geralt’s left while taking off her gown. Same as the other scene, Yennefer settles down as the conversation is about to grow more serious. However, unlike Jaskier, Yennefer is far less restless, once she’s moved to Geralt’s left she settled down and doesn’t get up again.

What’s really interesting about this scene is that throughout the entirety of their interaction, Yennefer and Geralt never look at each other at the same time. They both alternate between staring off into the distance with varying degrees of wistfulness and/or melancholia and turning to look at the other. But their eyes never quite meet, not even when Geralt turns around in surprise after Yennefer says she won’t be taking any payment. The conversation ends with Geralt abruptly getting up and out of the tub and Yennefer turning around to watch him leave (dry up? get dressed? who knows what he’s getting up to in that moment). Notably, when the shot focuses on Yennefer alone in the tub, a significant portion of the room that previously appeared mostly orange suddenly is tinted almost all blue.

However, where eye contact is conspicuously absent in the scene in “Bottled Appetites”, it’s a vital component of the scene in “Of Banquets, Bastards and Burials”. Eye contact is a significant part of Geralt and Jaskiers communication. Mainly because Geralt spends a significant amount time sending glares Jaskier’s way with Jaskier paying him varying amounts of mind, even poking fun at his “scary face” when the opportunity presents itself. Jaskier is all over the place in every sense of the word. His attention is divided between Geralt, the bath, the banquet, etc. before it eventually turns back to Geralt and the whole cycle begins anew. The shift in conversation, from the banquet to Geralt, coincides with a shift in Jaskier’s behaviour. He stops moving around the room and his attention settles on Geralt. He then kneels down and holds Geralt’s gaze until Geralt abruptly switches the subject.

Look at the screencaps above. See how, even in a screencap, the lighting is capable of creating an entire visual narrative all by itself? Yennefer and Geralt are sitting in the water together with their backs to each other in a room full of orange light but their immediate surroundings are tinted blue. Jaskier and Geralt are facing each other directly but despite the orange light surrounding him Jaskier appears shadowed as he kneels in front of the tub while Geralt who is sitting inside the tub glows orange against a blue background.

There’s a metaphor hiding somewhere in that juxtaposition but I can’t quite put my finger on it yet.

edit 12/01/20: I actually got a submission from odense who elaborated on the blocking of the scenes from a theatrical perspective. Go read it for even more meta on the bath scenes.

Anyway, moving on. Next on my list is

the matter of service

What, no more Film Studies for Fandom 101, I hear you ask? Well. Originally, I wanted this part to be about the conversation as a whole but that would’ve gone on for too long (ha! too long, she says like that means anything) so I divided it.

Both scenes deal with the performance of service in one way or another. Jaskier is trying to convince Geralt to act as his bodyguard for a night, while Geralt asked Yennefer to break the djinn’s curse and they’re still settling the matter of payment.

In a way, you could look at both scenes as very, very unusual forms of negotiation. Jaskier may spend a lot of time talking about himself but his actions are almost all focused on Geralt. He douses him with water, “rubbed chamomile onto his lovely bottom” at some point (decide for yourself what you wanna make of that statement), prepares the bath salts for Geralt’s bath, and – also at some point – arranged for Geralt’s clothes to be washed. All throughout the scene, he’s performing a variety of services. He’s taking care of Geralt, whether Geralt likes it or not, and does so like it’s the most natural thing in the world, to the point where it just kinda comes across like more of Jaskier’s usual antics and theatrics.

Geralt may claim he needs no one and doesn’t want anyone needing him but there is some form of reciprocity in their relationship – big things like the shared adventures and the ballads about which made both of them famous in their own right, but then there are the little things like drawing your friend a bath, or watching his back at a banquet so he doesn’t get stabbed by a jealous husband, which Geralt eventually agrees to do despite all of his grumbling and glaring protests.

Which is one of the reasons “And yet... here we are.” is such a brilliant line. Just from this context, you could read it in a number of ways. Jaskier could be calling Geralt out on his bullshit like, e.g. “You might not like it, but yeah, you do need me and I need you.” or he could be asking him to make a decision, e.g. “I know you don’t like it but I really do need your help. What will you do?” or it could be an affirmation, e.g. “I know you didn’t want it but somehow we still ended up here.” etc., etc. And you might have guessed, there’s still more to come regarding this line. Later.

So while Jaskier’s scene is about getting Geralt to perform a service, Yennefer’s scene is about figuring out the cost of the service Geralt asked of her in the previous scenes. Where the first bath scene was about persuasion, this one is about payment. The initial negotiation has already happened, the service been rendered, what’s left to do is figure out the price. And Geralt already offered to pay whatever the price.

Since Geralt seems intent on honouring his promise, that creates a bit of a power imbalance between Yennefer and Geralt at the start of the scene because Yennefer could ask for whatever she wanted, Geralt even brings up that he’s worried about “having agreed to indentured servitude”. (That being said, he does not seem too bothered by current the situation or Yennefer’s company. Quite the opposite, he actually seems quite comfortable talking to her.)

Aside from the payment they haven’t agreed on yet, Geralt’s also got a second promise to make good on since he initially offered Yennefer to “indulge her curiosities” (take that however you will). It’s quite apparent that Geralt is a lot more forthcoming with his thoughts and emotions (actually, his words in general) with Yennefer than he is with Jaskier. In Yennefer’s scene, she and Geralt talk about equal amounts whereas in the other scene Jaskier mostly carries the conversation by himself while Geralt reacts.

However, Jaskier also reaches out where Yennefer keeps to herself. She occasionally teasingly bumps her back against Geralt’s as she’s washing herself but other than that she makes an effort to keep out of sight, even magically turning away a mirror to hide herself, whereas Jaskier touches, quite literally gets all up in Geralt’s “scary face” and just generally repeatedly puts himself in Geralt’s line of sight going so far as to kneel down until they’re at eye level.

Despite the matter of coin coming up repeatedly (mostly in the form of harmless teasing about brothels and prostitution, but also on a more serious way when Geralt accuses her of making a profit off the townspeople), Yennefer eventually decides not to ask Geralt for anything in return for saving Jaskier’s life, determining his “company and conversation payment enough”.

Interestingly, in the scene preceding the bath in “Of Banquets, Bastards and Burials” Jaskier also broaches the topic of coin as he’s setting up to ask Geralt for help. In a sense, Jaskier initially attempts to use that thing about reciprocity I brought up earlier to convince Geralt to do him a favour. He lectures Geralt on his role in making him famous and that he should be making money off their arrangement in an attempt to make the favour he’s about to ask off Geralt seem irrelevant in comparison, like “Look at everything I’ve done for you. Please do this tiny little thing for me.” Obviously, that approach doesn’t work. The (un)holy trinity of “food, women and wine, Geralt”, on the other hand, seems to do the trick. Or maybe it’s the bath and a heart-to-heart. Kind of like Geralt’s company and conversation were payment enough for Yennefer?

While we’re still on the matter of conversation, let’s talk about one of the components that make up part of the emotional core of the scenes. Let’s talk about

the matter of past and future

Geralt has lived a long, long life and its history is written on his body in a web of scars. What struck me is how differently the bath scenes deal with those scars.

With Yennefer, the scars are on full display. She notices and scrutinises them as someone seeing Geralt naked for the first time can be expected to. The scars on his shoulders and back are placed front and centre of the shot several times.

In contrast, with Jaskier, you, as a viewer, barely notice the scars. Most of the time they’re simply not visible to the camera. They’re never in the foreground of the shot and you never even get to see Geralt’s back. The scar on Geralt’s shoulder that Yennefer noticed could easily be mistaken for remnants of dead selkiemore. There’s only one moment that draws attention to the scarred shoulder and that’s when Jaskier pats it as he’s getting up to put away Geralt’s mug of ale.

Again, I feel like there’s a metaphor hiding somewhere in there but what do I know?

Back to the point. While Geralt and Yennefer are talking in the bathtub it immediately becomes obvious that they have a connection. They’ve both had unhappy childhoods, lived long lives and as Yennefer points out Geralt was “created by magic. Our magic.” They have an understanding that quickly let’s you forget that they’re virtual strangers at this point in the Witcher canon.

In the other scene, Jaskier and Geralt have known each other for quite a while already, yet the conversation seems to be restricted to superficial topics at first, mainly Jaskier’s prowess as bard and lover. However, Jaskier unwittingly steers the conversation in a more serious direction when he asks Geralt about retirement, what he wants to do when “all this... monster hunting nonsense” is over and done with.

So far, there’s a pattern in the show that when Jaskier talks to Geralt about serious matters, he starts making plans for the future. After the incident with the elves in Posada he promises to work hard to change Geralt’s reputation. In the infamous scene in “Rare Species” he’s trying to figure out what to do with his own future and offers Geralt to go to the coast with him. Here, in this scene, he’s trying to work out what Geralt wants from his future. Even if Geralt claims to want nothing.

At that point, Jaskier’s already made good on his promise to change the public tune about Geralt. The people in the beginning of the episode are talking about the White Wolf, not the Butcher of Blaviken, which makes for such an interesting parallel when paired with Yennefer’s comment about “Our magic”.

Yennefer’s magic created the Witcher; Jaskier’s song created the White Wolf.

Which, in all frankness, would be a good point to end this post but what’s the point of doing anything if you’re not gonna overdo it? I said the matter of past and future makes up part of the emotional core of the bath scenes. So there must be other parts of that supposed emotional core, right? Of course, there’s still

the matter of want and need

While discussing Geralt’s lack of retirement plan, Jaskier and Geralt keep tossing the word “want” back and forth. Jaskier tries to find out what Geralt wants; Geralt rebuffs him, he wants nothing; Jaskier turns it around on him by saying, well, maybe someone will want you. You could, of course, read that as your run-of-the-mill “just wait, the right person will come along (and that person might just so happen to be me – if you’re wearing shipping goggles)” shtick but the thing is, that’s the kind of reply you usually offer someone who’s bemoaning the fact that they’re single, the exact opposite of what Geralt is doing, and Jaskier strikes me as someone who’s emotionally intelligent enough to know that wouldn’t work on Geralt. I think Jaskier might be very literal when he’s saying “Maybe someone out there will want you.” As in, “even if you want nothing, maybe someone who wants you will come along (and that person might just so happen to be me – again, if you’re wearing shipping goggle).” But Geralt changes strategies and rebuffs him again, he needs no one. And the last thing he wants is someone needing him.

What’s interesting about this bit is the body language. I mentioned Jaskier and Geralt communicating a lot via eye contact. And Geralt is looking at Jaskier quite intently right up until Jaskier kneels down in front of him as he’s saying “Maybe someone out there will want you.” The camera cuts to Geralt and he’s looking off to the side while he says “I want no one.” Then, a pronounced pause follows before he turns to look Jaskier directly in the eye as he finishes, “And the last thing I want is someone needing me.” (I really want to say that this looks so much like he’s warning Jaskier to reconsider whatever he’s building up to say. But alas, that’s just fantasy.) The camera cuts away again and we see that Jaskier’s now looking down behind his clasped hands before looking up and answering “And yet... here we are.” Geralt acknowledges his answer with one of his famed “Hm”s. Then, he immediately changes the subject to the whereabouts of his clothes which Jaskier sent away to be washed.

In the other scene, Geralt and Yennefer breach the topic of “want” and “need” while talking about coin. Geralt claims she’s profiting off the political situation, whereas Yennefer claims she’s working in the interest of the people, “filling a need. Ever heard of it?” Which, yes, Geralt has, literally one episode ago, and he pulls a face that’s simply beyond words. (btw, kudos to Henry Cavill for cramming like five different emotions into one expression.)

Geralt and Jaskier had an entire conversation about how Geralt wants nothing and needs nobody. Jaskier even references that conversation when he yells at Geralt while they’re arguing over the djinn. “You always say you want nothing from life, so how was I supposed to know you wanted three wishes all to yourself!” he screams.

(Also, upon rewatching that scene, I literally just realised that Jaskier was drinking at the beginning of the scene. Combine that with the fact that he repeatedly brings up the Countess de Stael, and flat out states he’s currently heartbroken, and yeah, that explains a lot about his comparatively sour mood and short temper; also, why his speech comes across as much more chaotic than usual. Seriously, compare it to the way he speaks to Geralt after he’s gutted the selkiemore. He talks a lot in both – ok, Jaskier always does – but in the selkiemore scene, or basically any scene that isn’t the djinn scene, his diction is eloquent, artistic, florid; in the djinn scene, it’s all over the place, repetitive, and often bordering on the nonsensical. Frankly, you could probably make a whole post about that scene by itself. I’ll get back to that some other day.)

(Also, am I implying that Jaskier seems bitter over the fact that Geralt apparently keeps telling him he wants nothin from life? ...Yesn’t. Hard to pretend I’m not wearing shipping goggles when I’m literally almost 4000 words deep into a meta post. But remember, nothing but speculation!)

Anyway, and now there’s Yennefer broaching the subject, asking him if he’s ever heard of “filling a need”.

The conversation carries on until Geralt is blindsided by Yennefer telling him that his company and conversation are payment enough. He whirls around but Yennefer isn’t looking at him so he hurriedly gets out of the bath. In the next scene, he emerges with a new set of clothes he doesn’t like, which his companion from the previous scene procured for him. Now why does that feel familiar?

In conclusion...

honestly, I don’t even know where I was going with this originally. This started off as a joke but then things inevitably escalated and now I’m really tired and I wanna go to sleep. (Also, the whole djinn thing is giving me feels now which kinda puts a dampener on the humour in the episode. Jaskier’d already been having a bad day and things just. Keep. Getting. Worse. Ugh, my heart.) But I feel like this post needs a proper conclusion.

I feel like, in the context of these scenes Jaskier and Yennefer could be seen as foils to each other? They’re two of the few people Geralt lets close, very close, actually, since getting naked in front of someone is frequently equated with showing vulnerability to someone. In a lot of ways, Jaskier and Yennefer’s roles work in ways that are the exact opposite of that of the other. Jaskier tries to be seen where Yennefer wants to remain hidden, yet Jaskier gets obscured by the environment while Yennefer is exposed. Jaskier is asking Geralt for a favour, Yennefer did Geralt a favour; Jaskier insists on taking care of Geralt where Yennefer gives him space. Yennefer sees Geralt’s past, Jaskier his future. Jaskier touches the scar but doesn’t look, Yennefer looks but doesn’t touch. But both find a way to scratch at the emotional walls that Geralt’s put up and both times Geralt reacts by immediately trying to escape the situation. Both times, he ends up wearing clothes he doesn’t like in the following scene.

Speaking about nudity and emotional vulnerability, maybe that’s kind of part of the conclusion as well? Sorta? Especially, since Geralt seems to start looking for his clothes or for a way out of the tub the moment someone gets too close. Furthermore, afterwards, he never seems comfortable in the clothes he’s been given, which you could read as a metaphor of sorts, I guess? Like something inside Geralt getting knocked loose in the conversation with his companion and Geralt consequently having to arrange himself with an uncomfortable truth in the aftermath? Does that make sense? Have we finally reached the point where I’m getting too cerebral? Or did we sail past that point like 4000 words ago? God, my brain hurts.

[katelyn--renee]

Sweet Cherry Pie

Title: Sweet Cherry Pie

Fandom: Supernatural

Characters: Dean Winchester, Sam Winchester, Bobby Singer (Mentioned), Reader 

Pairing: Dean Winchester x pregnant!Reader

Words: ±1860

Description: You and Dean have only known each other for a short time, six months to be exact, but a lot can happen from then to now - especially when you’re expecting, twins no less. Just how close have you gotten? Dean is eager to tell you.

Square Filled: Fluff @anyfandomgoesbingo​

Warnings: Fluff and lots of it, pregnancy (with twins)… that’s it… Did I mention fluff?

Author’s Note: I had no beta for this and this is honestly my first fic - I’ve done a lot of RolePlaying over the years, though, and this fic was actually inspired by my most recent RP. 

I hope you enjoy, it’s short and sweet and any/all mistakes are my own. Please feel free to leave feedback and give me any tips for future fics. Or feel free to give me some ideas for another fic and I’ll see what I can do. :) 

Enjoy!

Check out @talesmaniac89​ for more awesome page dividers!! 

Disclaimer: I do not own any photos or gifs, all rights go to original creators/owners.

BONUS: Here is a crackship I made that helped inspire this fic.

Interested in more of my work, check out the link below.

Masterlist

        The Impala came to a stop in the old scrap yard and found its usual spot near the weathered green Chevelle, the infamous rumble of Baby’s engine announcing their arrival. Dean glanced through the open window as his green eyes scanned over the old, yet familiar, home in South Dakota. Bobby’s home. The place had become like a second home to the Winchester’s over the years, (the first being the Impala) Bobby almost like a second father and so any time they were near, they’d make a point to swing by, even if the visit was only brief. It was always good to see the old grouch.

    He exhaled a heavy sigh through his nose, reminiscing a moment as the old place brought up so many memories; both good and bad - but mostly good. A particularly fond memory came to mind and he thought about when he and Sammy were younger, picturing his kid brother running around while he taught him how to properly throw an old football they’d found lying around in the field.The memory made his lips twitch, a smile threatening to form. 

    The picture shifted and changed as he tried to imagine what the future might hold for him and the woman who had captured his heart and carried his children - (Y/N). He could practically see their little faces, a perfect mixture of himself and the woman he loved; Her (Y/E/C) eyes and his freckled nose, two wonderful little clones, reenacting the cherished memory he shared with Sam. 

     Their identical grins were wide and bright, beautiful in so many ways. Children had never been a part of his plan before, never really given it much thought before six months ago. Hell, he never even considered it a possibility in their line of work. Who knew that a shared bottle of whiskey and a one heated night in the back of the Impala would change his mind. Sure, he’d been careless and stupid, but did he regret it? Not one bit, because it led him to (Y/N).

    The smile won and formed on his lips with the thoughts, growing in size until it crinkled the edges of his green eyes. He shifted his gaze back to the kitchen, finding her very pregnant silhouette through the window. He tracked her through the windows, watching as she moved from one side of the kitchen to the other and kept herself busy, more than likely filling Bobby’s house with her latest inspiration. It made his heart swell with joy. 

    He knew she’d be safe here with Bobby and after several long hours of debate, she’d finally agreed to stay behind from now on - although swore she wouldn’t make it easy on him and even threw in her best (and cutest) pout. It was in the best interest for everyone involved and he knew that she knew that, too, but also knew that hunting was a big part of who she was; (Y/N) grew up in the life, just like he and Sammy had and so he understood just how difficult it was for her to sit on the sidelines. 

    But there was just too much at risk and Dean would never be able to forgive himself if anything were to ever happen to (Y/N) or those precious babies, especially if it could have been prevented. 

  Sam climbed out of the vehicle first, the creak of the closing door breaking Dean from his thoughts. He removed the key from the ignition and followed Sam’s lead, sliding out from behind the wheel and climbing the old staircase. The wood groaned and creaked under their added weight. 

   They were just returning from a hunt and so, naturally, they were a bit worse for wear; their jeans and henleys were spotted with dirt and grime, their boots caked with mud, their skin scraped and bruised in various places, but it wasn’t anything they couldn’t walk away from and so Dean considered that to be a win. 

    As Sam pulled open the screen door, Dean’s eager grin nearly split his face in two. His stomach was just as eager as it audibly growled, the scent of freshly baked cherry pie wafting out from the open door, filling his nose and making his mouth water. Sam greeted (Y/N) in passing and flashed her that signature boyish-grin, dimples and all, as he made his way through the kitchen and into the study, joining Bobby so that he could update him on the case they had been working. She smiled back with a “Hey, Sammy,”, waving awkwardly over her shoulder with the oven mitt still covering her hands, before turning back to her task, removing the pie from the oven. 

    Dean stepped in behind his brother, but unlike Sam, he remained in the kitchen. He leaned casually against the fridge, crossing his arms and ankles while he watched her with adoring green eyes. The light was hitting her perfectly, illuminating her body like a halo. It was breathtaking. Dean was positive that it was the most beautiful thing he’d ever seen and it wasn’t just (Y/N)’s physical beauty that drew him in.

    It was the way she’d sing out of tune to his favorite songs and didn’t care who was listening; it was her love of baking and knowledge of classic rock and vintage cars that frequently surprised him; it was her heart of gold, her fierce independence and stubborn attitude; it was the way she could hold her own in a fight against something or someone twice her size (he was certain that she could still kick his ass, even if she were six months pregnant); it was her fiery passion and witty humor that would quite often put him to shame; but most importantly, it was that little round belly behind her sunflower apron that made her the most beautiful thing in the world. 

    (Y/N) were carrying his children and that was a gift all in its own, something that he never dreamed of having. But there she stood, giving him the most precious gift he never knew he wanted. Or needed. And now, he knew he could never live without her or those two tiny humans.

    He pushed himself away from his spot against the fridge and closed the distance between the pair of you with three long strides, his heavy boots making the floor creak beneath him. His strong arms wrapping around her waist and a smile formed on her lips with the contact. His large hands caressed the sides of her belly, sliding around to the front where his fingers spread out over the round surface. He pulled (Y/N) near, nuzzling himself against her affectionately. 

    A delighted hum left her lips as he gently kissed the exposed skin of her neck, paying special attention to his favorite freckles lining her shoulder. She tipped her head to the side, giving him more space to show his affection. She reached up to touch his face in greeting, his stubble rough against the palm of her hand. A smile bloomed over her face as she leaned into his touch, taking advantage of his firm chest.

    “Hey good lookin’,” He greeted between each tortuous kiss. The tip of his nose brushed over her skin, featherlight as he worked his way across her shoulder and back toward her neck. His lips left a wet trail as he went, only stopping at the soft patch just below her ear. (Y/N) shivered against him, the sensation leaving goosebumps over her body and making her crave more of his attention. She turned in his arms then and her hands found his broad shoulders, the tips of her fingers brushing along the back of his neck. 

    His eyes found hers, dipping into her soul and seizing her heart. It took her a moment to remember how to breathe or speak. “Hey yourself, Winchester,” She replied once she’d found her voice, her breath hot and sweet against his face, her mouth only inches from his. She leaned forward, standing on the tips of her toes to meet his lips, her hands cupping the back of his head to deepen the connection. Her lips molded together with his, hot and greedy after the extended time apart. His firm hands slid down to her hips during the exchange, steadying her and holding her against him. She broke away with reluctance, her eyes fluttering open. 

    A smirk played on his lips and tugged the corner up, his jade eyes full of mischief. “I was talking to the pie, Sweetheart, but I guess you’re not so bad yours-” She gasped playfully and smacked him in the chest, feigning offence and he laughed, the sound coming deep from inside of his chest. She tried to keep a serious face, but his laughter and dazzling smile forced one of her own. His happiness was contagious. She shook her head and crossed her arms, refusing to give in. She even added her most convincing pout, the one that Dean found so cute, and refused to look him in the eye.

    He sighed and his expression softened as he reached up to pinch her chin between his thumb and fingers,tenderly tilting her head so that she’d meet his adoring gaze. He was the one who leaned in this time and he kissed her sweetly, silently apologizing with his lips. She forgave him instantly and melted into his touch - both loving and hating the way he so easily affected her. He pressed his forehead against hers and just held her there against him, staring into her (Y/E/C) eyes. 

    “(Y/N) I…” He started to say but he cut himself short, his voice a little shaky with nerves. She watched him for a moment, curious, before she gave him a smile of encouragement, wanting to hear what he was thinking. “I love you, you know.” He admitted after several minutes, breaking the silence and surprising her. 

    A smile broke across her face and tears welled in her eyes, her emotions a little extra sensitive thanks to the two little Winchester’s growing inside of her. “ I love you, too.” She confessed happily, her voice shaky but her heart full of a love she’d never experienced before. “And I swear to God if you say you’re talking about that damn pie again…” She teased, quickly brushing away the happy tears before they could fall completely. 

   “…well….” Dean made a face as if he were considering this, teasing her, but then quickly flashed her another prized winning smile to assure her that he’d meant what’d he said. He dipped his head again, planting a quick kiss against her lips before dropping himself lower, crouching down until he was eye level with her round belly. Bracing a hand on either side, he closed his eyes and pressed his lips against the firm surface twice, one for each baby Winchester nestled inside. 

“And daddy loves you.” He muttered, his voice low and meant for only them. She smiled softly during the exchange, her eyes welling again as she affectionately combed her fingers through his hair, her heart completely full and happy.

Thank you for reading!! Remember, your feedback gives me liiiife!

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Supernatural

@akshi8278​