#but i’m thinking of maaaybe making comics? that’d be cool

[x-to-o]

just sat in a call with my partner and talked about a theoretical object show for like an hour straight and it has the most whack characters ever

none of us have ever animated nor voice acted before

we don’t even know how to write a show

but we sure as HELL got some character lore down

[eyrieofsynapses]

First Thoughts on YJ S4 Panel

WARNING: SPOILERS for the DC Fandome YJ S4 panel!

Okay, before I start chattering away, can I just saw how much I love this title poster? Because I love it. LOOK AT IT. LOOK AT HOW BADASS IT IS. 

Warning: this first bit is a teeny bit ranty, but that doesn’t mean I didn’t genuinely love the panel. It was really fun, but I have a few gripes with the amount of information we got. If you wanna cut straight to the cheery bits, check under the cut.

So... uh. I’m not gonna say I’m disappointed? Because I’m not, this was good, we got info, it was nice to see the voice actors. But I’m... underwhelmed. I definitely wasn’t expecting a lot but this was still, mm, not as much as I thought we’d get. No poster, no previews of character designs, not a peep as to when we’re getting the new season, nothing on where it’ll be streaming, nothing as to new characters, nothing as to who’s going to be the villain, and the Q&A session was maaaayyybe 3 minutes long. Oof, guys. Thought you said you’d leave us with something that’d leave us “more than just ‘whelmed.’” 

Essentially all we got was the title, and a few snippets of information regarding what the current status of the Team and its characters is. They didn’t really get the chance to talk to us at all about the actual season, either- I think Brandon spoke maaaybe three or four times? He got the title reveal, but, well, we knew that already, not that it’s their fault, but still. I love hearing the voice actors chat about their experiences and we got none of that, so that was disappointing. I’m wondering if there wasn’t some material cut, actually, because I distinctly recall seeing a clip on Twitter with Phil Lamarr talking about what it was like returning to the show, and it wasn’t in this. So what’s the deal, DC? Short-changing us on YJ again? When are we gonna get some actual news? 

There is the little problem that their big reveal of the title was spoiled, oh, maybe three or four months ago, and that isn’t their fault, but it does make that revelation more of an “okay, well, glad that’s confirmed” rather than an “OH MY GODS IT’S PHANTOMS WHAAAAAAAT” like I think they were hoping. Still, that’s definitely exciting to hear, and the new title poster looks cool. 

I got a “WHAT!!!” moment maaayybe three times, which is significantly less than I thought I would. There just wasn’t that much new info. But I think that’s less of a Grandon/production team problem and more of a world state and DC problem. I’m not annoyed at them, I’m annoyed at DC and at the pandemic, because I’m willing to bet their snippet was cut short by DC and what information they could’ve revealed just isn’t ready yet because of current events. Probably we would’ve gotten character designs if it weren’t for that.

As for the audio play, it was pretty good. They were definitely struggling what with having a distinct lack of people to pull from for a voice cast, but made some tongue-in-cheek references to it to take off the edge. I don’t think I realized just how many people voice for YJ until now... or how many characters each actor does. It’s a bit janky, and weird what with the arguing over who’s narrating the story (why, are they telling us the story, or are they telling it to someone else? Are you breaking the fourth wall, are you not? Make yourselves clear) but I’m blaming that on the fact that they’re more used to scripts than they are audio plays. These are different mediums, so there’s an inherent gap there; this probably would’ve gone better as an actual episode. 

So, FIRST watch-through, here’s my HAPPY cheery thoughts and reactions, in no particular order! I might do a second one later, we’ll see. (Under the cut, because it’s long.)

Return of Bowhunter Security! 

Clipboard makes a comeback!

The Supermartian marriage has taken place and they’re making reference to taking a long journey with Conner, M’gann, Bioship, Gar and J’onn. So... Mars? Do we finally get to see Mars?  

Forager gets to be sassy! And a hilarious narrator! Which, c’mon, it’s Jason Spisak, honestly, I don’t know what I expected.

Ahahah, Jason makes the most delightful faces when he’s voicing Forager. (And a few flubs, but he’s good at covering them.) We all miss Wally, but man, he does a good job with this character. Also, hey, that’s how he does the clicks!

Rocket! Even though she had a relatively minimal presence, sigh. I’m hoping they build her character more this time, she always get short-changed. 

ARTEMIS IS LEADING THE TEAM, repeat, ARTEMIS IS LEADING THE TEAM!!! YES!!! 

And she also makes a reference at some point to being in this fight for ten years, which, HMM, do I hear a reference point for our time jump? They started back in 2010, so this implies that the season’s caught up to 2020. So... season one was 2010, season two was 2016, season three was... 2018, I think? So does this make the next time jump two years too, or am I off? It also takes place on February 23rd. Eh, either way, it’s absolutely not as long as a lot of people were fearing- heck, I’m thinking this might be the shortest jump yet. Yay!

I’m not sure if the Snapper Carr dialogue is cringy or hilarious. I’m going with hilarious because I’m betting this would’ve been great if it were animated. It definitely loses something without the animation. 

Is... is Crispin Freeman playing four characters? Five? Will, Roy, Jim, Captain Boomerang... I think I’m missing someone, I’m gonna have to go back and rewatch this later, but wow. He switches between them so fluidly, too, that’s impressive.

Forget Freeman for a hot second, Nolan North, what are you doing, dude? Conner, Clayface, Mallah, at least one or two others, with a LOT of animal noises included... wow, okay. I definitely didn’t realize how many of these guys do two or three characters. 

Phil Lamarr doing Brick, Black Manta and Kaldur all at once is definitely impressive. I’m gonna take a guess and say he likes doing Brick best. He seems to get a little grin sometimes when he’s playing the character.

Ahhh, Danica McKellar definitely likes playing Terrence Terror. Don’t ask me why, I’m just getting that feeling watching her. Villains are fun to play.

...Wolf? Where’s Wolf? Uhh, guys? Where’s our fluffy doggo? Don’t tell anyone but I’m scared. 

Oooookay, that was unexpectedly gruesome. Dehydrating a man into sand? I mean, okay, it’s Clayface, but we didn’t know that till later. Eeeewww. Y’all, ik you’re going more dark, but that wasn’t an image anyone needed.

Jokes about Dadbod!Will are... hhh, cringy or funny, cringy or funny... I’m going sorta funny for now. Not enough to make me laugh, but enough to make me smile. 

Okay, Will’s definitely still hilarious. Literally that entire scenario with Captain Boomerang was amazing, and only made better by the fact that it was entirely Crispin Freeman. The “are you the Green Arrow fanclub president or something?” “...you have no idea” moment, the “boomerangs are better and Batman said so!” “...okay, FINE,” FLINGING CLIPBOARD, Boomerang teasing Will for his dadbod and Will answering with a wicked uppercut... ah, man. This is 100% Roy/Will Harper and I am here for it. 

I can see some people disliking this humor, but personally, I’m gonna just sit back and enjoy it. YJ has some quirky humor, but honestly, if you’re part of the fandom and you don’t like it, why are you even here?

Huh, Raquel’s a vegan and nobody’s making jokes about vegan burgers? Nice!

Oh, my gods, Forager deciding that Lian and Amistad playing with the food is an educational activity is AMAZING, 100% in character, and something I really, really want to see. 

(Fanartists? Fanartists, pleeeeaaasse?)

Will and Artemis ribbing each other will never get old.

...wait. Hang on. Is Will the comedic relief character now along with Forager? Is this a thing? I guess it is. If you’d asked me who out of the original Team would replace Wally as the comedic relief back when I had finished the second season, I would not have thought of him first, but I think I’m good with this. It’s definitely in character to his comic version. 

Ahh, Conner and M’gann’s relationship is still... interesting. Still not sure how to feel on this one. But hey, they’re married (?) now? Uh... nice? 

Nightwing’s off on some mysterious mission, hmm? I’m assuming that’s because of Jesse McCartney not being there, but I think I’m gonna headcanon that there are Other reasons for this. 

Yay, Clayface getting redemption! I love this in the Rebirth Batman: Detective Comics, so I’m 100% down for seeing it here. 

Tim did that for Clayface! Sweet! Not a plot thread I expected to go anywhere from that one season three episode, but one I am very happy to see used. 

...more secrets. Uhh, M’gann keeping secrets from Conner is... icky... again... but granted, keeping them because of confidentiality agreements is, well, a better excuse than she’s had in the past. Still, this is getting old.

Huh, so Waller will let out the Team’s secrets if they tell anyone about Belle Reve. I think this was already covered in the third season, but maybe not so explicitly. The reactions... hmm. Of course Conner’s okay with letting out all their secrets (and M’gann’s willing to... go along with that? ...okay...?), but the others, maybe not so much? Hmm. I wonder what Dick would have to say about that one. He definitely has something to lose. Not sure about Kaldur or Artemis, though. 

Jason did NOT get to make any Wally references. That makes me even sadder than if he did make one that made all of us cry. C’mon, guys. Let him have his references. 

I’m always a little meh on M’gann, but hey, M’gann gets to be a 100% certified badass! Saving Clayface AND taking down a ton of baddies with telekinesis, yay!

Oh, my gods. LOOPHOLES. WHAT IS WITH THIS TEAM AND LOOPHOLES. I love them so much.

The Team signing on as Bowhunter Security- oh my gods, all of the Team in fucking Bowhunter Security uniforms- oh my gods, so very in-character, so very true to YJ, so absolutely goddamn hilarious, I wanna hug whoever came up with that. That is the BEST mental image and it is a CRIME that they didn’t animate that. 

And, of course, Kaldur just immediately goes along with it. The Team’s corrupted him fully now. I mean, we knew that, but he’s done now. 

Black Manta attempting to roast Kaldur for his security uniform and Kaldur roasting him back 100 times worse is wonderful. “I wear my dignity on the inside, Father. Where do you wear yours?” KALLIE I LOVE YOU 

Ooooo, Artemis is inviting Roy to the Team? This should be interesting. He’s definitely not totally stable, but it seems to me that Artemis should be able to more or less keep him in check. Hopefully. She had to deal with Wally for five years, surely she can keep Roy in check?

...hmm. We’re all thinking there’s gonna be a Red Hood arc... Roy’s joining the team... Roy and Jason did have that run as the Outlaws in the comics with Kory... and this version of Roy has the sort of temper and attitude that I can just see Jason possibly getting along well with... hmmmmmmmm... 

Hah, villain shenanigans. Having Task Force X argue all the time is in character and admittedly sort of funny, especially as Black Manta’s sort of pulling a Kaldur and playing the absolutely exasperated denmother. I dislike BM thanks to him being a Baddie and all, but watching (listening to?) him struggle to contain them is enjoyable if only because I like watching him suffer. 

Ahh, watching the VAs is fun. It’s definitely nice to see that little view behind the camera. There’s the little smiles, the tiny grimaces at the icky bits, the responses to various bits, the way their demeanor changes with each character, everyone egging Nolan on when he’s yelling for Clayface being disintegrated... I’m sad we didn’t get to see them chat, but watching them interact while they work is fun. Pity Jason and Stephanie didn’t really have any interactions, though, I bet watching them work together would’ve been fun. Ah well. Still fun overall.

There’s a lot of variation in where they are/what setups they have. Some of them seem to have proper studios, some of them don’t but they have mics, Danica’s on the lower bunk of her son’s room with what I’m betting are several sheets hung behind her, and then... well, then there’s poor Stephanie with earbuds and what I’m betting is her phone at her friend’s house XD Also, Greg’s library is really awesome, can I steal it please?

Green title card... I know people have been positing this for a while, but Lazarus Pit? Also, the thing people haven’t talked about: Mars?! Is this a nod to the Martians, since M’gann, Conner, Gar and J’onn seem to be going there? 

Lots of speculation regarding Phantoms, but that’s been going around for a while, so *shrug* I’m not gonna spend any time on that for now.

Someone’s gonna have to write this out, methinks, for further examination. We’ll see if I get around to doing that or not before Fandome ends. I’m betting someone will record it and post it on YouTube, but a written-out version of the script would be useful. If I do, I’ll probably post it, so keep an eye out. 

So... season 3.9, episode 1? Hmm. Does this come directly prior to the fourth season? I kinda wanna say it does.

I have more thoughts, but I think I need to do a rewatch first, maybe in a little bit. Anyway... not what I was expecting, I sincerely miss Dick and Wally, but lots of funny jokes all the same, and lots of interesting information on the fourth season even if it’s nowhere near the amount we wanted. I might be underwhelmed but I’m certainly not disappointed. 

[pluck-my-life]

Hey Snark! Silenda (loverofthebirbs) here. I was wondering why exactly do you like to ship Red x Chuck x Bomb together? I know why you like the polyship itself, but why the separate ships on their own? (Red x Chuck, Red x Bomb, and Chuck x Bomb?) You got me to kinda see some appeal in Red x Stella even if I've never liked it, so I wanted to know because you give good reasons! c:

Oh hey @loverofthebirbs nice to see you! My brain self-awakened at 6 am and is now bubbling with activity, so buckle up for a ride! *stretches hands preparing to type a lot*

First of all, it’s inclusivity. I don’t want to imagine a couple snuggling on the couch while there’s a “third wheel” on the other side of it, lonely and awkward and maybe a little bitter seeing all the affection and feeling excluded. And among the three only Red understands from the get-go how PDA can be painful for the onlooker, and what would he do if he’s the one in the relationship? He’d have to persuade his partner to cuddle in private, but! the other two are insanely physical and can’t resist touching him even as friends, and in a relationship? They’d have a hand on him all the freaking time unless he explicitly states he needs to be alone. Now Bomb can exist outside a relationship just being happy for his friends, because he’s got great empathy and maaaybe he could be ace, but that leaves us with your least favorite ship? And I absolutely can’t imagine Red or Chuck being the third wheel, unless Red is totally ace and satisfied with just having friends. I can see ace!Red + Chuck/Bomb, with an effort, because I connect with him the most and I’m not ace, but then the whole thing feel kinda bland. Sweet but bland, like a cookie without filling or icing. Movie!Bomb can’t fully satisfy Chuck in a relationship, he would be left at home while Chuck goes clubbing and picking up someone for the night, and he would sigh about not being cool enough to share Chuck’s adventures (while understanding that you can’t put restrictions on him, freedom is crucial for his happiness) and Red would feel obliged to cuddle with him to make him feel better, but if Chuck sees them like that he’d want to be in that fluff pile, and that would still turn into awkward polyamory, however more dysfunctional than my usual sort. And you can’t have Red/Bomb while leaving Chuck out, you just can’t, not with his obvious crush on Red. Bomb himself would try to talk Red into giving him a chance, because Bomb can’t stand seeing his friends suffer. Chuck’s attraction to Red is the key factor here, he’d want in on any relationship Red is having, whether it’s with Bomb or Stella or both. I can ship all four, connected via Red, and as far as I remember I’ve told you in messages how Red couldn’t deal with his roommates all the time, he’d need a breather and someone he can trust, to be able to fall apart in someone’s arms (and Bomb hasn’t reached the emotional maturity yet, he can maybe nod at Red’s complaints and hug him, but Stella could actually understand, maybe even share his burden of being a self-sufficient bird with needy partners while her own friends are perfectly able to entertain themselves). Red and Stella are both leader types, but Red is introvert or at least ambivert, and these types are said to get “adopted” by extroverts (such as Stella or Chuck). I must say I’m projecting a lot here, but isn’t it the whole point of shipping? to have at least some imaginary relationships when you can’t have it irl for one reason or another? When I was in a social phase and had relationships I wasn’t in any fandoms, I didn’t even draw anything. The whole fandom thing is my substitute for love life, and tbh it’s more reliable and satisfying than 1) trying to meet people, 2) talk to them enough to decide if they’re worth meeting, 3) find out you’re not attracted to them but they kind of are, because I’m the picky side here, and the whole thing turns awkward. And this is how I find friends through Tinder, even when I’m looking for a hookup. And then I’m likely to find a therapist for them via my own therapist, because the only people I resonate with are kinda messed up. In the Bird Village it’s the other way around, Red finds mates through group therapy, but the result is the same: misfits sticking together. And here we get to another reason I’m polyshipping through the character connect to: I can’t really love myself, even on a mentally healthy day I struggle to find myself attractive - but loving a character while simultaneously connecting with him almost takes me there. And here comes the best part: I connect with other characters in my ships as well (I don’t usually ship people I can’t relate to) and then I get to feel for both parts, even for three parts on a good day, and this fills my huge emotional capacity almost to the brim while my mind is involved too, imagining stuff and supporting the connections - unlike in a real relationship, when my brain gets bored and wanders over fantasies or trivial matters even during intimate moments. I’ve never thought of it that way, but it seems like I’m polyamorous because of my neurodivergency. No person I’ve ever had experience with had a personality as multifaceted as mine, ergo I can’t be satisfied with just one person emotionally (not even talking about sex - without emotional involvement it’s plain boring). Just like another character mentioned here, though for a different reason: if I’m a very big computer, and Chuck is a very fast computer, the result is technically the same: the calculations are done quickly and we’re left idle, understimulated. I don’t fully understand my connection with Chuck, or rather I can’t pinpoint it, because… let’s just try to list it. I’m anarchist, Chaotic Good, I love to entertain people with jokes and dorky behavior when I’m in a social mood (especially when drunk), I can be very active and enthusiastic when I have the energy… A lot of my qualities that I don’t even notice because they’re so natural would remind people of Chuck rather than Red, and isn’t that ironic in light of me not initially liking the “sexy and annoying” type? Or maybe it’s just my second-hand embarrassment getting in the way of just laughing at their antics? Most of the time I lack Chuck’s confidence, especially that finding-yourself-attractive brand of confidence, but with some effort I could adopt that quality and it could make me a better-functioning person. Now if I could adopt Bomb’s ability for unconditional love I could become that fusion phoenix we’ve been talking about, maybe even a complete person… but that wouldn’t happen without gaining some femininity from Stella’s flock - good thing it comes mixed in with mischief and badassery, which make it far more palatable than the annoying “tomboy turning into a prom queen” trope that needs to get thrown in a volcano. I’m carefully exploring a straight ship through the most capable character, borrowing some of her confidence to support my weak, underdeveloped female side. I would feel fairly comfortable as Dahlia too, except it makes me self-conscious about boring people out of their minds while being bossy - not the most attractive archetype, though I’m not familiar with her enough to see her good side (gotta rewatch the Stella toons, this time with a more analytical mindset)… Gale is the one I’m most wary of: I have that selfish bitchy side to me that I prefer to keep far away from the front parts of my personality, because I’m madly scared of her - can’t let her take reins of my self-criticism… or maybe I need to befriend her first? Except that’d take a lot of work I’m not yet ready for. I could do with Poppy’s carefree attitude and Willow’s love for the process of art, not the result I can show off in the internet to earn a little bit of attention - I think those qualities can go hand in hand. Less self-consciousness, more enjoyment, and if I can’t feel encouraged and supported whether others provide it or not, maybe I should achieve that through the powers of my imagination. My brain could be a whole world of its own if I wasn’t constrained by depression, anxiety, fear of rejection… things that sound familiar, and they do play a part in connecting me to characters. If I didn’t have them I’d be out in the real world, doing… I don’t know what exactly, if making art is one of my coping mechanisms?.. Crafting, I guess? Eh, my train of thought took a wrong turn… Here is another post about my connection to characters, if you haven’t seen it.

Why are you mentioning separate ships? They all happen in the same headcanon-universe, more or less. Polyamory isn’t always threesomes, and interpersonal relationships all have their own dynamics. Two can entertain themselves while the third one is busy or not in the mood. A fourth can spice up the picture once in a while, with or without intimacy. Pairings mix in my brain like colors and flavors, add a mood and it’s a different picture every time. I’ve drawn frisky Red x Chuck and passionate too, in my drafts there are unfinished comic panels for a fluffy first time and a quirky first time (that would be AUs from each other but whatever, how exactly their intimate life starts out doesn’t matter in the long run) as well as some scenes implying that Chuck has been annoying Red to get the rough treatment for a change (more on sexual dynamics here). Some of my scenarios involve Bomb walking in on the pair and they insist that he should join, even if he’s embarrassed, because it’s definitely better for his psyche than trying to go back to whatever he was doing before he heard the noise and went to investigate. He worries and even explodes when the two upset him by bickering with each other (in the comics), how would he know the noises weren’t arguing and fighting if he’s so socially inexperienced? Again, that makes Red x Bomb first time a separate AU, but those are just scenes their eventual life doesn’t depend on, I draw them to convey moods and emotions rather than to mark an event in the birds’ life. Maybe it’s not Bomb’s first time per se, maybe it’s his first time trying to be active rather than being pleasured by his mates, and he still needs tons of encouragement because he must be so insecure about, well… everything about his appearance! He’s not a conventionally attractive bird, there’s no way he hasn’t been teased a lot growing up, even if he was home-schooled (very likely due to his condition). You’ve mentioned Chuck giving him confidence about his ability by being impressed, same way Red could make him feel attractive (Red far more likely than Chuck, ‘cos the latter is a bit of a thrill-seeker, more attracted to a snarky bird with a temper, while Red would seek solace and relaxation after dealing with the needy, sometimes insensitive little annoyance that is Chuck). Bomb is a good empathetic listener, something both of them need, but Chuck can forget whatever bothers him and move on, while Red would dwell on it until he works things out on his own or Bomb asks what’s bothering him. He might not help to resolve the issue but he can comfort Red without too much talking, platonically or intimately or both, because that’s how moods work in harmonious relationships: people can cry after sex, or cry into their lover’s shoulder until they’ve dealt with that feeling and then get horny, or they could get overcome with feelings right in the process - crying is emotional unloading, and sex is… well, you see the parallel. Watching a movie we cry during emotional climaxes. Now I’ll leave these metaphors for potential fics and conclude that Red x Bomb is the emotional aspect of the trio’s dynamics, Red x Chuck is more sexual, and understanding Chuck x Bomb requires me to further my connection to both. I haven’t incorporated Stella in their dynamics, and she may not want to have relationships with all three anyway, but this is fine in polyamory too. It’s all about balance and satisfying everyone’s needs, not the geometry of connections.