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val-of-the-north · 4 months ago

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Caitha's connections to Filianore and Nito

Me and @katyspersonal have been developing more reasons for Caitha to be Filianore's mother, but before we do that we need to establish a different theory about Caitha's parents. I think one of them had to be Nito. Let's go over everything:

Caitha is a Goddess connected with death and darkness

Nito controls death, which is a power aligned with the dark. Caitha is revered as a goddess of grief, who sheds tears for the dead, and allows people a peaceful departure to the afterlife. However, her nature is pervaded by a kind of darkness that makes some doubt her true nature, to the point they even assume she is some sort of demoness/evil goddess. In fact, her chime in DS2 is exclusively an hex catalyst, which are all sorts of dark-aligned spells.

I think the only way to explain Caitha's close ties to death and her conflicting nature as a goddess with dark elements to her is to assume she is connected to Nito in some way. After all, the Gods/Lords aren't naturally aligned with the dark in this universe.

There are some people who might put into question her validity as a goddess, since she was introduced in DS2, and in that game it is insinuated that some people could also go down in history as gods through the passing of lore, which is what happened with Pharis, morphing into Evlana, Goddess of the Hunt. After all, if Caitha had been a normal human her connection to darkness would be a no-brainer! That's just humanity's true nature.

However, Evlana and only Evlana is outright identified as a human-turned-god, and it's the devs who spell it out for us too. And even more damning is her prominence in DS3 as a key figure in the Way of White, which dispells any doubt. Gwyndolin, the new Allfather after Lloyd, would probably know who is and isn't a genuine god, and treat them accordingly. She seems to be the only other prominent goddess at the time outside of him and Gwynevere, so she had to have been relevant to Gwyndolin's family specifically.

Nito is connected to family

There's a belief that Pinwheel is some father trying to revive his dead family, and this is why he is wearing family masks, but I think the idea isn't really that satisfying at all. The masks are designed after Greek theater masks, and simply depict archetypes...

However, they could be depicting something indeed, but instead of Pinwheel's family, they might be depicting Nito's. All the family masks prominently appear in the Catacombs on various statues and traps.

Several Pinwheels also appear to be guarding the room before Nito's boss arena, implying there's more of them than just the one we defeated previously.

These also can't be clones of the first Pinwheel because they have full health and didn't dissipate after his death, unlike the ones he makes during his boss fight. And why would Pinwheel defend the entrance to the lord he betrayed? It's stated that the one found in the Catacombs is a traitor who stole Nito's power for himself.

To me, it implies that all of Nito's acolytes, his powerful necromancers, wear the family masks in reverence to him.

And these masks aren't the only set of three things connected to Nito, he and the number 3 actually go hand-in-hand. Inside his boss room we can find three coffins! The big one, where Nito sleeps, a smaller one (but still much larger than a human coffin) besides him, and a third one, tucked away and hidden from view.

Water's strange prominence

Nito seems to have a passive connection to water. In the deepest part of the Tomb of the Giants, there's a shallow pool of water where an endless army of baby skeletons rises from, there are pools of water in his own boss room, and even the Catacombs feature a lot of flowing water and pools. In DS2 we meet the Milfanito and Brightbugs, creations of the Gravelord who inhabit the Shrine of Amana, a giant underground lake. However, Nito himself does not display any real water powers, but perhaps his wife might have.

Looking at the mask of the mother, we can notice how different she looks compared to the father and child. It's harder to make any feature out, and she seems to be wearing a crown of some sort. This crown features a wave-like pattern too.

Coupled with the large coffin besides Nito's, it's safe to say his wife must have been one of the people of Anor Londo, one of the Gods. It is also very fair that Death would find a partner in a Goddess of Water, an element often connected with life. After all, Nito did create life at some point, with the Fenito, Milfanito and Brightbugs, and it wasn't simply a matter of reanimating corpses like he usually does. Perhaps that was allowed through this specific union. In fact, the pool of endlessly-spawning skeleton babies could have been birthing grounds for these beings. Only, the pool has probably gone dry from her absence, so it's only capable of... that.

Nito is a Giant

Nito himself isn't a Lord/God but rather a Giant, evidenced from his domain (the Tomb of the Giants), the fact he was the first being to die making him incredibly ancient, and his affinity with darkness which is irreconcilable with the light-based humanoids. Sure, in Japanese it's stated that the Tomb of the Giants is where the Gods were buried, but the name of the area is still "of the Giants".

If Nito was a god, and it was a burial ground exclusive to gods, the area could have easily been named "Tomb of the Gods". Not to mention the various Giant Skeletons found patrolling the area, some of them even seemingly more monstrous and primal. The size of his coffin also feels like it's bold-enough evidence to positively make this conclusion.

Giants seem to have been the first humanoid race to rise from the First Flame, and in DS2 we see what are probably the most ancient race of Giants we know of, who don't seem to truly die in the traditional sense, only entering a "different" stage of life and growing seeds to grow new giants from. Their souls also have a small dark core surrounded by a mass of light.

I think they must have been the ancestors of all other beings, born in a similar manner to the golems in Drangleic and Eleum Loyce, back when souls first appeared. Maybe they inhabited the wooden husks of the Archtrees and gave them life. The DS1/3 Giants would come shortly after, still holding both light and dark within, then Lords/Gods and Pygmies, who evolved to lean more towards one of the two elements. Those Giants would be the first beings with the ability to "die" then, instead of living once again like the DS2 Giants, and Nito would be the first of them to perish, as his title suggests. He is, after all, the "first of the dead".

Some people might think the title simply means he is the first among the dead, but Wolnir actually seems to confirm it's meant to be taken literally. While lost in the international translation, his soul mentions a desire to be "the last of the dead", which parallels Nito.

(The retranslation is from LastProtagonist's Bloodborne document, in the Dark Souls WIP section, you can find it here [x])

The translation we got does share a similar sentiment, with him being keen to outlive everyone, but the Nito connection is lost. So yes, Nito was the first to die, and that strenghtens the connection with the Giants, who appear to be the most ancient humanoid race.

This explains why he would be able to withstand the dark that comes with death, and even prefer it to the light, judging from how dark his domains usually are (Tomb of the Giants, but also the Undead Crypt). It would also explain why a potential offspring with a God would be able to harbor both the light and the dark without issue.

Caitha is death and water

So, if Nito rules over death and his wife controls water, their child would show an affinity for water, no? Indeed, Caitha has certain connections to the water element, and the most evident one comes in the form of tears.

Caitha's tears have magical traits, and increase power or defense the closer to death one is depending on if they were shed for the undeserving dead or for those who have lost loved ones, tears of sorrow and grief.

One of her miracles, Tears of Denial, also allowed the dying a few precious moments to say their proper farewells to their loved ones. If her mother was indeed a goddess of water and life, it would make sense she'd have the power to grant such a thing. She would be holding time back just enough for all of this to be possible.

Her last miracle is Caressing Tears, which cleanses the body from all kinds of poisons, from bleeding wounds and even from frostbite.

This one is probably the most interesting, as it shares the same function and (almost) icon with an old sorcery featured in DS1, Remedy, developed by Yulva the Sealer to help the sick in Blighttown.

The spell, similarly to Ingward's Resist Curse, appears to use a blue, splash-like particle. The Sealers of New Londo seem to have been healers prior, and may have had some control over water, since it's what was used to seal away New Londo. The cleansing nature of water is likely what allowed them to heal people, and might also be what allows Caitha to heal the sick as well.

The Cathedral of the Deep was dedicated to Caitha

As I stated before, Caitha gained a lot of relevance in DS3, becoming one of the most important gods in Carim, the new "capital" for the Way of White. This newfound relevance is evident when looking at the Cathedral of the Deep. This Cathedral wasn't always dedicated to the worship of the Deep, as the Deacons once watched over and sealed that corruption away before being touched by it themselves.

Many statues of weeping figures can be found inside the building. The most prominent one is a weeping maiden, seen all throughout the Cathedral both inside and outside.

Most of them are in-fact covered up by a red cloth, as if denouncing their affiliation to her. This enimity towards Caitha is further reinforced through the efforts of hiding away Caitha's Chime, considered anathema by one of the three Archdeacons.

The in-game description mentions the Archbishop but it was simply a bit that the localizers lost while translating the text. In Japanese the kanji used is the same for the Archdeacons as opposed to that used for the Archbishop of Carim. I have a whole post about that actually ahah, and it also gives more insight on the Church of the Deep: [x]

But yeah, in short, the Cathedral was once dedicated to Caitha. The large graveyard outside is probably further evidence of this, seeing as her domain is mourning and grief. But she was also someone who healed and cleansed, which is possibly what the Deacons were doing before turning to the worship of the Deep. The Cathedral also features pools of water within, which feels all too relevant after all our previous discussions about Caitha's potential mother and her own connection to the element of water.

The Deep and water

The Deep itself is strongly connected to water. What Aldrich saw was an age of the Deep Sea, and the Murkmen who dwell within grow all sorts of barnacles and what seems to be mussels on their bodies.

It's said it was once a peaceful place that has been corrupted, and now filth and abominations reside within. Some assume it was Aldrich himself that corrupted it, but I doubt a single man could have such power, no matter how abominable and twisted he was. What likely happened to the Deep is that the stagnant nature of the world caused it to stagnate as well. The concept of "穢れ" (kegare) is very common in these games.

So, the Deep is connected with water. The Deacons of Caitha were safeguarding it in her Cathedral before it corrupted them. I think the Deep was once good, and that spells like Remedy were drawing from it... but signs of corruption were already beginning in the form of the Vagrants. They have always been bizarre creatures, with a very clear sea-life motif to them. It's my belief that they were some of the original inhabitants of the Deep before it went bad.

Vagrants appear where players have died and lost plenty of humanity. These crab-like creatures might have first found the Human Dregs, the heaviest things within the human body, consumed them, and got a taste for them.

Crabs are a very common bottom feeder after all, eating all sorts of stuff that sinks into whatever body of water they inhabit. At the time of DS1 there were probably less dregs to be found as the cycle was still young and not as stagnant, so to seek more they must have crawled out in search of fresh humanity. It's worth noting the core of murky darkness inside them, perhaps an early sign of the corruption to come.

Filianore, her powers and her egg

With all of this cleared out, we can finally talk about Filianore, who we believe is the daughter of Gwyn and Caitha. Filianore is a pretty mysterious figure, and her powers seem to be a bit unclear. She has a sacred chime that boosts healing miracles (half of which are connected to Gwynevere), enanchment miracles (seemingly only Sacred Oath, related to the Firstborn) and the one cure miracle in the game, which belongs to Caitha.

Filianore herself seems to have been affected by darkness at least somewhat, with black streaks coming out of her closed eyes, and the large egg with a dark core within, very reminiscent of the Vagrants we discussed earlier.

I think Filianore inherited some affinity with the Dark from her mother's side, which was probably one of the reasons she was given to the Pygmies instead of someone like Gwynevere. Her powers must have also been about the manipulation and distorsion of time itself, which could explain why the Ringed City seems to be in a better condition than the rest of the world, which piled up together into the Dreg Heap. Like Caitha and her Tears of Denial, she might have had the ability to manipulate time, though instead of reversing death for a short while she could make time flow slowly. Both are holding a specific process back (death for Caitha and time for Filianore). I think it's her blood relation to Gwyn that allowed her to master this power so effectively, as time only exists the way it does because of Fire.

Maybe Gwyn sought to keep the Pygmies stuck in a time bubble that would keep them always behind everyone. I believe he didn't lie to Filianore when he said he'd be back for her, but he simply wished to bide his time to find a way to conquer the Dark before the end of his Age, something that never came to pass. So when we see the Ringed City, we are seeing a point in time that's way behind the current one. Despite that, we can tell a long time has passed in this time bubble too by the state of disrepair of the city, as well as the presence of an advancing Deep.

The egg itself is really interesting. If Vagrants are from the Deep, thus are connected with water, her holding one of them since before any corruption would have started polluting the world is very interesting. Maybe this power or gift relates less to her mother Caitha and more to her grandmother. It seems to act as a seal of some sort, as when the egg finally breaks Filianore is able to wake up. However, this causes time to start flowing again all at once, causing us to jump super forward in time and find ourselves in the ashen wasteland that we see at the end of the Ringed City DLC.

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nightcrawlerzincorporated · 1 year ago

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which sea creatures would the gang be

Excellent question!

Obviously Frank would be a pufferfish, one of the super poisonous ones. I just know he thinks the funniest thing in the world is puffing up and floating ominously towards people. But if you make him puff involuntarily he’s super pissed about it, it’s like an insult to his dignity. So of course Dennis and Dee try to make him puff all the time and he screams “this is why you ain’t in the will!” But when Charlie does it he just laughs and says “ya got me!”

Speaking of Charlie, he’s a shark. A smaller shark, not deadly to humans at all, but he does chew on Ethernet cables and mess with the world’s internet because he thinks he’s cleaning up the ocean. I can picturing him feasting from one of the great garbage piles and the others are like “you can just eat fish we won’t be offended” but Charlie doesn’t listen because he’s not even on that level he’s on “I’m saving the planet” level.

Mac wants to be a shark so baaaad. But he’s not. He’s a catfish. Not even one of the cool huge ones, he’s a tiny pleco (the algae eating ones). He often tries to eat other fish and says “See! I’m a shark, like Charlie!” (Charlie literally eating garbage behind him) “Okay, maybe not a shark like Charlie, but”. He’s always bragging about how fast he can swim against strong currents. No one’s ever seen him do it. But he swears he can.

Dennis and Dee are sea turtles. They are an endangered species and will not like you forget it. Their go to excuse when they don’t want to do something is “Um, we’re endangered so 💅”. Frank makes them do whatever scheme anyway. Frank always tells them it would be funny if all the sea turtles died actually. And then he wonders why they don’t like him. Mac eats all the algae off Dennis’ shell and tells him how pretty and special he is and Dennis pretends it’s not his favorite thing in the entire world. They make fun of Dee for not having a clean shell but she swears it’s not her fault (she drives away all the fish who try to help her by insulting them. she doesn’t know any other way to be). Dennis always gets on her about how useless she is in propagating the sea turtle population because she’s so ugly even though she’s the one who’s actually had a successful clutch, unlike him (he’s totally not jealous definitely not). But they helped each other fight off predators to get to the ocean when they were hatchlings and saved each others lives, so they always have that bond even when they’re cruel to each other.

Cricket is a sea urchin being kicked repeatedly across the ocean floor.

Artemis is an octopus and way too explicit about the things she does to Frank with those tentacles.

The Waitress is a bass. Super common, super plain. She’s convinced shark Charlie follows her around because he wants to eat her. He does.

#ask #anonymous #and if I told you Dennis is a sea turtle mostly because of user nailgunstigmata #if someone describes sea turtle Dennis giving birth totally unprompted it sticks with you okay #always thinking about him getting confused and laying them by a pool

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