#baptism for the dead

[daisydisciple]

for the record. baptism for the dead isn't "nonconsensual" in any way? like doctrinally it's an offering that the dead person is free to accept or reject.

and:

if you don't believe in an afterlife then why do you care at all

if you do believe in an afterlife but don't believe in baptism according to the lds tradition/priesthood authority in the lds church/that the baptism is going to do anything then why do you care

if you do believe that the baptism is real and valid but that it's wrong to offer it/it's somehow forced upon that person and a violation of their agency I don't believe you. I don't think that's a position that anyone holds for real

more likely people are uncomfortable with a possible disrespect of the living by dishonoring their dead or something along those lines

but:

you are supposed to submit the names of your own ancestors. We are doing this for OUR dead

hence the whole genealogy thing. you know. FAMILY search

what I believe to be the main criticism in this regard is not current events

in conclusion:

USE the church's genealogical resources for whatever you want! you are not participating in anything shady

if you are freaked out by the concept of baptism for the dead because "it sounds like a weird cult thing" or something, maybe get over it and open your mind a little bit?

you can compare it to like. praying on behalf of a dead person. honoring your ancestors. a normal and common thing across many cultures

[artthatgivesmefeelings]

Heinrich Hofmann (German, 1824-1911) Christ at 33, 1889 Full painting called "Christ and the young rich ruler" Riverside Church Baptism of the dead is referred to by Saint Paul in 1 Corinthians 15:20. The text requires careful reading in the context of the whole of Chapter 15 concerning the resurrection of the dead. The Corinthians seem to have had a custom that if a catechumen (someone under instruction but not yet baptized) died without baptism, a member of the community would receive baptism in his name. This was not sacramental nor did it affect the dead person but simply celebrated his intention to be baptized and the saving effect of his grace-supported intention. (God saves all who sincerely wish to be saved.) This custom was born of a belief in the resurrection. When Paul came to speak of the resurrection, therefore, and to calm the fears of those who were beginning to doubt it, one of his lesser arguments amounted to this: How can you express belief in the resurrection through baptizing the dead and at the same time not believe in it? All he is doing is pointing to an inconsistency in their thinking. He passes no judgement on their harmless custom. As time went on, certain heretics like the Montanists taught that baptism of the dead was sacramental and effective in saving the dead. This was condemned by the Church as heretical. Faith: Quest & Answers Father John V. McGuire, C.Ss.R, General Editor: Father Juan-Diego Brunetta, O.P. The Knights of Columbus Supreme Council

[judahmaccabees]

[trueconservativepundit]

A Troublesome Verse and a Glorious Future

By Donald Whitchard 1 Corinthians 15:29,1 Corinthians 15:35-49,Luke 9:24,John 12:24,Galatians 2:20,Colossians 3:3-4,Revelation 1:18   Summary: What did Paul mean when he wrote about a “baptism for the dead” in 1 Corinthians 15:29?  How should it be interpreted?  What does it mean in light of further teaching on the resurrection of Christ?  Let Scripture speak concerning these and other matters of…

[phoenixandthestral]

-staring down at your list of random names and trying to ✨feel✨ their presence

-scrunchie actually from the 80s with zero elasticity left

-you and all the other teens trying to be Solemn and Spiritual while changing into your white jumpsuits

-Laundry chute

-Alone in a small room with several men as they put their hands on your heads and name you as the proxy for the dead and your like "this definitely isn't a cult or weird in anyway"

-"...I baptize you for and on behalf of ____, who is DEAD..."

-the cards are conveniently color coded pink and blue so a girl doesn't accidently get baptized for a man that wouldn't work don't be ridiculous

-lining up for the temple worker to verify everyone's recommend to make sure all the teens are worthy and in good standing

-THE BULLS

thinking about baptisms for the dead.

- that man's ™️ hairy arm

-the fucking water dripping down my neck at confirmations

-safety pinning the key to my jumpsuit

-whatever the fuck underwear those where

-ouch my eyes

[peppermint-rat]

Today in Exmormon Thoughts: Remember being so offended that anyone would call your church a cult, and then going to the temple as a teenager and doing Blatant Cult Shit

Remember going into the basement (which I'm pretty sure was soundproofed because it was always so quiet you could hear each other breathing), putting on pure white jumpsuits (with a weird little cloth one piece under if you were afab to conceal your sexy teenage body), having your name called and entering a room with just you and a man (possibly a stranger) waiting for you in a tub of water that rested on the backs of intricately carved marble oxen, with one wall made of glass so all the other teens could watch while this man held your hand, recited a prayer that included a name of a dead person that /definitely wasn't a white American let's say that/ so that person could "be given a chance to see the truth after death and join the church when they might not have in life, to keep things fair and save people from ignorance-based damnation" (read: so the church could add their name to their list of members and lie about the actual size of the church), and then clamped both your hand and his over your mouth before shoving you under the water and pulling you back up, repeating the ritual about fifteen times with different names, then coming out, drying off, and shivering while you watched all your friends also get shoved underwater fifteen times

And, if you were short like me, your feet probably left the floor every time you were shoved under so you would have to sort of struggle and fight to get back up

Remember thinking "Man I feel so weird and quiet after that, it must be the holy ghost" and not "I was just repeatedly forcibly pushed underwater by a man for about ten minutes while all my peers voyeuristically watched and I'm a little fucked up about it"

And this whole ritual was seen as so holy and you were kind of wicked if you passed up an opportunity to do it

But it's definitely not a cult, right

When never-mo's drive past temples and think "I wonder what they actually do in there" I just want them to know that they essentially waterboard teenagers in the basement

[b0tsbby]

This was so serial experiments lain of him. The angel’s choir. The boot up sequence. Those air splitting noises jumping from ear to ear. How dead it all is.Terrifying prospect actually.

[tonguetyd]

.

[myownsummer24]

Update on my life!!!

Sorry i’ve been gone so long, I got logged out!!

I got baptized on my birthday (sep 29) !!!!

I got my permit!

I got formally asked to a dance by a guy!!

our band is going to state!

ran regional cross country for the 2 mile and PR by 30 seconds!

I’m going to be strawberry shortcake for halloween!

I GOT AN I LIVE JEFFERY DEAN MIRGAN T SHIRT!!!!!!!

anddddd

that’s it I think…

[the-rockinahard-place]

Do any of y’all know if all the baptism for the dead I’ve done are actually invalid? because like picture this: my friend braydon over here is helping the ghosts of James and John while me (the secretly a boy) person is helping out Linda and Mary. like does the gender really matter? or have I just accidentally condemned a few unfortunate souls. Shittt sorry Martha, looks like your name’s lost forever because some dude was the one that dawned your name in the baptismal font. Our bad 😬

[ynwa4eva]

when i was born the doctor turned to my mother and shook their head and said quietly “i have bad news to share” and my mother was concerned straightening up in her bed going “what’s wrong? did something happen?” and the doctor replied “i would say congratulations, but your child is a twitter footy bro. my condolences.” i don’t think my mother has ever mentally recovered from that — @lee-kangin

Literally assigned twitter bro at birth 😭😭😭 one thing about me this kind of joke set up ALWAYS gets me because imagine what kind of judgy person you have to be to look at those freshly born babies and diagnose them with being cringe 😭😭😭

[just-turn-it-off]

does anyone remember what chapter francesca findabair talks about not being able to have children? i swear it was in baptism of fire during one of the lodge meetings but i can't seem to find it and i need to know for a research paper i'm writing :-((

[83-for-truth]

i wish i could make mormons go inside their temples and spin around and say over and over “i will take care of poor people” and maybe then i won’t hear so many people in utah say horrible things about people who are unhoused

[melonlemontea]

I'm writing a fic rn about Zelda praying in the springs and being very unhappy about it, and strangely enough I have a lot of religious trauma very specifically about praying in pools of water, so this is going great

[env0writes]

Dead End Dirt Lot Diaries 7.8.2023 “Watery Brave"

I often wonder if my baptism would have been a better burial Drowned in the holy waters by holy hands Before all my family and before friends Innocent to the worldly pleasures and leisures To think of not being – not death, but the absence of Before any other sins beyond the Original acquired Retire me from this world, oh Father Send me off on waters too pure The waters scoured from the sea–oceans away Let me drift and sway on currents old Send me far from this Eden, no apple required Spare the child this wormed knowledge To think of nothing means it must exist Beyond what can be understood Where is the before? Drives me forward far greater than what lies ahead Will I die with grace and dignity? Can any of us even? I close my eyes and see the deep black But even this too – exists How might I begin to understand the unimaginable Once I get the thought of it It shall – like I – exist I wonder if my burial will be like my baptism Holy in the hole in the ground – before my family Before my friends Bathed in tears wept in joy and grief Laid down in the arms of someone farther Returned to the Original garden

@env0writes {C.Buck} [Ko-Fi ] & [Venmo]: @Zenv0 Support Your Local Artist! Photo by @mynamemeanscloud

[stonerzelda]

Looking for tangible inspiration for the story in my head is so hard 2 research for what do u do if u accidentally invented a new kind of monster but its lame in the same way i understand vampires get called lame in that they basically just look like people but they r undead but not noticeably ghouls