#anyway this is how destiel can still win

[secondbeatsongs]

the temptation to reblog all of the "Remember to vote on November 5th!" posts just so I can add "this is how destiel can still win" is. staggering

[artemis-pendragon]

Cannot believe that this year's election day falls on Nov 5th and everything is already falling apart in July. Anyway here is how Destiel can still win

[dontwanttochoose]

Reddit struggles to get their posts to anything above like 200 upvotes. That is a very small faction of the fandom. I’d hardly use that to win your argument. That’s why i keep bringing up twitter and tiktok, hell even tumblr. Where destiel trends on the daily.

That’s just the extent of it. You can’t argue facts. No one cares about anything other than Destiel on a large scale regarding the show now that it’s over. Destiel is the only thing that holds any relevance.

Anyways. I just send you anons because i like to, seeing that you’re a blog who runs an anti-account that can’t even get a note on a post. Whereas i can get thousands of likes and comments on a destiel post wherever i go. It’s fun on my side, lots of interaction and people to talk to. Celebrities who ship it. Rob and Rich talking about it on their podcast. Oof. I’m living the high life.

Also, Jared just said this last con that there’s no confirmed role on the boys yet, just that he wants to be in it. And he’ll never be as big as Soldier Boy, which is gonna be really embarrassing for him, because everyone is gonna see how bad an actor he is compared to Jensen. Huffing and puffing his way to that cbs role while Jensen continues to become an a-lister lol.

Look anon, I understood yesterday that you love me, but I'm sorry I don't date through social. 😞

Maybe in another moment of our lives destiny will bring us together....

But I'm sorry... Jensen an A-lister actor? Jack Nicholson, Marlon Brando, Clint Eastwood, Al Pacino, Robert De Niro... these are true A-lister actors... Jared and Jensen are at best C-lister. And also Jared was Dean in Girlmore Girls that's why he is popular outside the world of SPN.

I have 10 friends of my age who watch or have watched SPN, you know how many of them have tumblr or ships Destiel? Zero, they don't even know the ship, I think you forget that we are 8 billion in this world.

Well Jared is constantly huffing and puffing while Jensen is always talking with his Batman Voice and doing the model face. Sometimes he really looks like Derek Zoolander.

Are you really a fan of Jensen? I don't understand why you still insist with Destiel. You can like the non-canon ship but why are you trying to force it. You are saying the OG Wonder Woman ships it, Rich and Rob (I don't know why you care about the extras), while Jensen said that is never going to be true. It's like a person likes you but you hate them, and all you friend are insisting that you hang out with them even if you don't like it.

Rob and Rich do this because they are unemployed and need some fans for the podcast because is not doing well. It's all marketing, and you are not capable of see it.

Try to get out of the destiel bubble and apply what is happening, simplifying, to yourself.

With love to my first and best fan 😘

[shallowseeker]

Hey shall, what's your favourite/fun headcanons on why cas keeps getting resurrected at first I tought it was cause god/chuck liked him (like remember when ppl in the destiel fandom talked about how chuck ships them... good times) Then yea, that just didn't turn out to be true lol

Ohh, this is fun. I have some nice uplifting ones and one very evil one. I could probably come up with a ton of these, and I'm not feeling super eloquent this week, but have my mental popcorn instead:

CHUCK/NETWORK NEEDED CAS -> Popularity ...and it bit Chuck in the ass because he accidentally allowed Cas to grow more and more powerful, even when he (and the writers) worked so hard to weaken him and kill him off. I don't have the exact quotes, but I know there are numerous instances that imply the writers worked hard to weaken Cas.

When the writers have to work to make Cas weaker, and to make Dean and Sam stronger, it shows that Cas is the bigger threat, in terms of cosmic power.

Emotional consequences: Because Cas is important to Dean, Cas is often resurrected specifically because Dean loses hope without him. After his first death, Cas literarily functions as The Lost Husband/The Animal Bridegroom/The Artificial Husband for Dean specifically. Unlike characters like Sam's Amelia (season 8), Dean is obsessed with clinging to his loved ones, saying to CAS: "I did not leave you!" and to NAOMI through CAS: "Take it! But you're gonna have to kill me first. Come on, you coward. Do it. Do it!" In his insistance to look for Cas in Purgatory and keep not giving up on Cas, he sets himself apart from his many mirrors. He's a lot like the human consort in many of the “supernatural spouse” tales, brave and insistent in his trials, even when death separates him from his lover. NOTE: Amelia Novak also becomes a heroine in this regard when she decided to go looking for her "lost husband," Jimmy Novak but becoming ensnared and dies in season 10. ANYWAY, Dean and Cas tend to die when the other isn't around, and they both get so depressed it makes for pretty abysmal watching. Chuck doesn't like Cas, but he needs Cas because Dean needs Cas. Dean won't behave unless he has Cas with him. DEAN from 13x03: "This life, hunting, monsters, there’s no joy in it. There’s nothing but pain, horror and death." And DEAN from 13x05: BILLIE: Maybe you’re not that guy anymore, they guy who saves the world, the guy who always thinks he’ll win no matter what. You have changed. And you tell people it’s not a big deal. You tell people you’ll work through it but you know you won’t, you can’t and that scares the hell out of you. Or… am I wrong? DEAN: What do you want me to say? Doesn’t matter. I don’t matter.

///

TETHERED TO A BROTHER or TWIN -> Functions as a thrown lifeline; i.e. one shield must fall before the other can

Not Cas-specific, but so long as your "tethered" twin is alive you cannot die. We see this with Amara and Chuck, that taking out Chuck requires killing Amara. This appears often in SPN, like with Charlie and There's No Place Like Home and the Wizard. It makes you wonder if Michael and Lucifer are similar. If you squint, Chuck does not seem able to kill Michael in 15x19 until after Lucifer has been killed. Makes you wonder if that was his intent on having them kill each other all along. That by having one kill the other, he could finally take out the son-rivals, as in the style of archetypical God-father who, because of their immortality, sees sons as threat to power. So what does that mean for Cas? Not sure, but he could be tethered to an angel that's still living. Maybe jack himself? (Or Dean's soul, for that matter.) It's assumed that Jack wakes up Cas, but there's juicy potential for it to have been Dean doing it all along, something Jack tapped into when Dean was screaming in grief during the Sam fight: DEAN: He manipulated him, he made him promises, said, ‘paradise on earth’ and Cas bought it and you know what that got him? It got him dead! Now you might be able to forget about that, but I can’t! [JACK looks distressed outside the room.] JACK: Castiel. [JACK’S eyes glow gold.]

///

MANY OF CHUCK'S REBELLIOUS CHILDREN ARE ACTUALLY CURSED TO BE RISING-AND-DYING GODS

As to quote Gabriel, "they are like cancer," he has to eradicate them, as they represent wars of old which are no longer needed. I know the rising-and-dying deity motif is something of a modern configuration, but since it appears in Remember the Titans, you have to wonder if this is a nature intrinsic to Cas himself. As angels are unable to sleep, they are unable to die. From 8x16: ZEUS: Tell me, has Prometheus experienced the child's death yet? [HAYLEY gives a nod.] How did he take it? Did he hurt? [HAYLEY nods again.] Good. ...I never get tired of watching you die. [ZEUS, holding SHANE up, says it right into his ear.] Your boy is going on the mountain. (Interestingly, the mountain forward-references to the episode Moriah.) From 14x08: COSMIC ENTITY: Stop interrupting! Start paying attention. I'm taking him. And where I'm taking you is worse than Hell… because at least Hell is something. Ohh. Ohh, God, they look scared. Does that hurt you? Good… because I want it to. In this interpretation, the Shadow is a higher God, and it has cursed Castiel for helping humanity the same way Prometheus helped humanity. It uses similar linguistics!

///

EVIL CAS/SHADOW MEANING -> God's most trusted double agent

Cas is resurrected by Chuck because he's secretly an intractable agent of Chuck, God's most trusted, analogues to how Ruby was "the best of those sons of bitches." This would take on a Christian overtone, that Chuck and Jack are the same person. Evil interpretation where Cas having been an agent of Fate all along. With this shadow meaning, "Cas helped" from 15x20 becomes especially ominous. But there's also "it's not the bait, it's the fish, I think they're beginning to anticipate me" from 15x06 right after Dean accuses him of being "the something that always goes wrong." There's something eerie in the idea that Chuck and Jack are in fact the same person, and Castiel is loyal to Him above all. "This lie won't hurt them," from Gimme Shelter etc etc. This would make Dean, like Sally in "Last Call" the real symbolic fish. If hunting is recklessness, fishing is patience, and Cas/God/Jack were being patient and fishing Dean's soul all along, baiting him with Love. Cas as a honey trap is a frightening thought, honestly, and although I don't prefer this shadow interpretation, it IS scary if someone wanted to explore it or have Dean simply fear this possibility, you know? Dean has an inherent fear of large powers, like Godstiel, and Jack's power, and he's right to fear it. At the end of the story, Cas and Jack are the only main characters still alive, so there's a real possibility that it is Cas who won the long game, not Chuck.

edit - there’s also cas has a soul theory, that he cannot sleep in the empty the sand way jack becomes aware of heaven in byzantium

[eightbitpale]

hi !! i’d love to hear about S7 rewrite boo tomato tomato 👀

Thanks for the ask!! That one’s actually a destiel fic, because I’m never truly going to escape my 16 year old self. Sorry if that’s not quite what you were imagining 😅

Hence the name, it’s a rewrite of season 7 of spn. S7 tends to get (rightfully) dunked on pretty often, but it’s always been one of my favourites despite its flaws. It has potential!

This WIP is plan for a massive episodic fic (think 100k+) that tries to fix some of the bigger structural issues with the season (eg. Cas’s deeply uncomfortable “crazy” arc, Meg’s narrative underutilisation, the shoddy resolution of Sam’s hell trauma etc, fucking EMMA)

Anyway, here’s an excerpt from some of the scenes I’ve drafted. Tw for mentions of “i dont deserve to be alive” type thinking.

Something in Dean’s chest was burning like a road flare. He tried to keep his voice from shaking when he spoke.  “Y’know man, when I first found out you were still alive I was so fucking mad. Because I mourned you.” Cas’ gaze snapped up to his. “I let myself mourn you because you were dead, and you were never coming back to apologise or make it better or tell me how you wished you’d listened. ‘Cause when people are dead — and you’re people, man, just fucking accept it — it's always easier to forgive them.  “But then hallelujah you’re alive, and all that anger I didn’t feel 'cause it didn’t have a point to it? I felt it all. And I thought it'd rip me open." Cas' breath hitched, and Dean’s chest tightened at the sound like it was the cocking of a pistol. "You always seem to do that, Cas. You're always ripping me open.” "I'm sorry. It's never my intention." "That doesn't make it better." "I know that." "Ok, but do you know? Do you get why I was so damn mad?" Cas shook his head slightly, understanding, at least, that this was rhetorical. "I kept thinking: that bastard got off easy. Everything you did, and you were living it up as some kind of a god-powered guru, with a sweet lady keeping’ you happy on the side." "Daphne and I didn’t have that kind of relationship, Dean. It was predominantly about health insurance." "I don't give a shit, Cas! I was mad because I'd already forgiven you, and you hadn't done anything to earn it! So I'm not gonna just take you out like you’re another monster, I'm actually gonna do something way worse. I'm gonna make you earn it.” Cas’s face clouded and he opened his mouth to object, but Dean silencing him with an angry wave of the hand. “Just listen to me! You wanna tell me what you've done, how you've killed people? I'm well aware! And I'm so fucked up that while you were dead, I didn’t actually care. But you’re not dead now, and I swear to God you are gonna make amends if it’s the last thing you do. You don’t just get to peace out again." Dean stepped into the angel’s space, pushing a finger into his chest. "So face the goddamn music." Cas’ eyes remained glued to his feet, and he pushed harder. "Face me, asshole!"  Cas finally relented, and Dean held him there, a thrumming current of something like fury—like grief—like grace—crackled through his body, down his arm and into the angel’s chest until Dean thought the two of them were liable to start smoking like an overloaded transistor. The night breeze picked up, rustling down the hillside where they stood, two silhouettes cut against the sky. Still, they stared at each other, locked in place.  Through that one warm point of connection, hand over heart, Dean willed Cas to understand what he didn’t deserve to hear: I missed you when you were lost, you bastard. Win me back, so you can finally come home.  And even though it had been years since Cas was rude enough to peer into his head without permission, Dean could swear that he heard that thought aloud. Cas slumped down on himself like a string had been severed, the brittle cut of his face smoothing into something softer as he nodded. It was almost dangerously soft, Dean noticed, and he became belatedly aware of the hand he still held to Cas' chest. Hurriedly, he stepped backwards and shoved his hands deep into his jacket pockets.  "Just try, ok? Sam's still on the ropes, freaking Dick Roman is still out there, and I need you on my team. You’ve made mistakes, but I'm not gonna fucking hunt you. Frankly, I don’t have the time." He laughed a little bitterly. "Besides. I don't really want to. So just come back to the motel with us, alright? Come on." He must have said something right, because Cas was looking at him strangely. "Alright,” he said. Dean heaved a sigh of relief, tension unwinding from his shoulders like the uncocking of a rifle. "Alright."

[felikatze]

I know people are mad that feh keeps trying to queer bait with chrom and robin but on the contrary I think they should keep going. It's the funniest and cutest ship ever

(Also at this point, it's on the same level as ninian and eliwood for being implied canon 😭)

me on discord ten minutes ago

the people demand chrobin and if you dont then die mad i guess. the gays keep winning.

i'm just convinced someone on the dev team loves chrobin. i am VERY MUCH looking forward to brave robin's forging bonds bcuz i want to see how blatant it is. i want chrobin to be fe destiel.

elinini canon so true also (<- started shipping it bcuz manakete roy is the funniest shit on earth but just genuienly likes it now)

ngl FE has made a lot of stride with queer rep. like yeah sure it started rough with the gay marriage options in fates with active gameplay downsides, but 3h was a HUGE step up with legitimate gay options (even if us mlm had it. ROUGH. at launch. god) + paired endings for same gender characters, and now engage doing away with the gender lock on supports altogether.

not to dismiss rep outside of supports, too. the tellius games already gave us the subtextually not so subtly gay ike, and the very blatantly gay heather. echoes had leon, who was SO important to me as a kid cuz he made me realize gay people r real, and that i am one of them. well bi but same difference.

post awakening in particular the series has ramped up queerness with every installment (often clumsily, but i believe well intentioned), that at this point it does not suprise me to see chrobin pushed as a gay pairing (especially when a straight version is readily available!)

like. gay marriage was still illegal in the US when awakening came out. gay marriage is still illegal in japan. it has been a LITERAL DECADE since the game launched and the cultural conciousness around queerness has shifted A LOT.

chrobin already reads as incredibly queer within just awakening itself, so rather than baiting it feels like this is all just building on what's present in the game itself. chrom and robin could get married in the game already - if robin's a woman. and if you know me, you know i think chrobin significantly enhances the story of awakening for a variety of reasons. they just took that, said "hey, what if we can do this with male robin too" and then. did.

waxed philosophical on queerness in fire emblem again because FE just played a huge fucking role in my own queerness even before i grew hopelessly obsessed with it this year.

anyway yeah tldr chrobin rocks haters die mad

[nancylou444]

Hi! I hope you’re having a good day/night/morning!

So, I I need to share my thoughts with someone before I burst, and you’re always posting your thoughts, current and past, on destiel, so I’m hoping you can sympathize. Of course, you’re free not to read or post if you don’t feel like it (and I know you don’t need my permission for that either 🤦‍♀️ ).

So, I’m currently watching a reactor watch Supernatural who ships destiel. I’ve almost quit a few times due to annoyance, but they are otherwise entertaining and generally try (or tried) not to bring it up too often, and it’s now on season 15, so I’m locked in until the end. They just watched the episode "Last Call" where Dean is suddenly a good singer. Of course, they mentioned "bi lighting" and "subtext" because of course Dean can’t hang out with a male friend, especially one John caught him drinking with and got "mad" without it being because he was caught doing something "gay." 🙄 Not just because it was, you know, stupid to get drunk on a hunt. Plus being hungover for a hunt isn’t exactly ideal, even if Dean was old enough (he might have been). .

Anyway, this person actually used the words "I’m winning" in reference to the episode because Jensen (not Dean) sang, Sam was hanging back with Eileen, and Dean was chilling under the "bi lighting, " apparently. All I could think was, I’ve been literally watching this destiel shipper turn into a heller before my eyes over the months. And of course, they ship Sam and Eileen and were so happy that Dean went off to give them time alone 🙄 . It’s like heller brains only have one accepted scenario, and once they get in too deep, they become a clone of the rest.

Naturally, they want the show to end with Dean and Cass off on a beach (never mind that Dean mentioned wating Sam in that scenario) and mostly out of hunting, but not to get away from Sam, no. He’s there, too. Somewhere. Teaching the new hunters with Eileen or … something. It’s so ridiculous that they think this will/should happen. 1) When has the show ever hinted at a conventionally happy, or even happy at all, ending? 2) Dean would sooner gnaw off his own arm than semi-retire with Castiel on a beach while Sam continues in the hunting world without him. 3) Dean hasn’t wanted a romantic relationship since Lisa. 4) People who think Sam would want to continue hunting, on his own, if Dean stopped or semi-retired haven’t been paying attention to the show. I even saw one of their idiot followers saying Sam was alway better at adapting to hunting while Dean has always wanted out. 👀.

Anyway, I got ready to write a reply arguing against their idiotic ideas, but then I stopped and realized there was no point. There is literally no point trying to talk sense into people who spend so much time looking for hints and parallels pointing to the things they want (less codependent brothers and destiel) that they ignore the very literal and easy to follow canon, or actual text, of the show. It was a breakthrough fir me. There. Is. No. Point.

So, I deleted my planned response and just thought to myself, "You just enjoy your 'winning" honey, while you can." Because they are going to absolutely HATE the end of the show, and I’m just petty enough to be looking forward to seeing it. Does that make me a shitty person?

I realize it’s my own fault I’m annoyed right now, but I can’t just quit watching something once I’ve gotten this far, so I’ll have to suffer through (not looking forward to Despair 🙄) until the end.

Anyway, If you took the time to read this, thank you. I just needed to share this with someone.

This was an enjoyable ask, my darling. ❤️

LMAO, yes it is amazing the way that hellers 'see' the show.

Even now, almost three years after the finale, they still think destiel became canon because of the dubs and THEY had a 'wedding'.

Please let me know how they reacted to the 'confession' and the finale. 😆

[castiellesbian]

it would be kind of funny if jensen did buy the rights to spn for a miniseries, but because of contract stuff jared couldn’t be in it

[greatcheshire]

Scrolling tumblr has me so fucked up that I legit looked at this for a solid minute trying to figure out how it relates to Destiel

[disarminglybright]

My partner hasn't seen supernatural but they listen to me talk about it all the time and especially about the samcas relationship and now when they see a post that clearly meant to be destiel they are like "hey look it's your Sastiel ship" so now I know I've turned them into a Sastiel truther

[dashconstaff]

Hello Tumblypoos 😍

Here is the OFFICIAL list of 2021 Dashcon panels and activities (so far):

Love Wins: Destiel is Canon

Can You Knot? An Introduction to A/B/O

Activism and Kpop: How Fancams Fight Fascism

TWO BALL PITS IN THE SUPER HELL ROOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

a 72-hour Hamilton sing-a-long all weekend!!!

Destiel’s Legacy: Johnlock, Stucky, and Hannigram Next?

Acting lessons with special guest Jensen Ackles (free)

British Men and Their Cheekbones

Why Kylo is Exactly Like Zuko

Big Time Socialists: Why BTS Supporting Black Lives Matter Was the Wokest Moment of 2020

Quarantine and Chill? How the Pandemic Has Affected Fanfiction

Parody Accounts: Tumblr, Trolling, and You

Trump is Just Like Umbridge: Activism For the Woke HP Generation

and a six hour John Green book signing (he said he would also sign printed out copies of the cock monologue for an extra $5)

Additionally, we have unfortunately decided to cancel the Tumblr Prom due to unforeseen circumstances (explanation here). We hope you’ll all still have fun anyway ❤️

Have ideas for more panels? Let us know!

Buy your 2021 Dashcon Badge HERE!!!!!!!!!!

*Masks will not be required anywhere besides the ball pit/Super Hell room.

[halfofmysoull]

I’m obsessed with Gabriel longcon.

[spneveryseason]

Results of the Supernatural Origins Survey: Part 2 of 2

Part 1

Part 2 has finally arrived! I hope you guys enjoy it and thanks again so much for participating.

Have you watched the entire show?

Pretty straightforward here: most people have watched the entire show, meaning here every single episode. However, significant portion (35%) have not. This encapsulates people who have missed and episode here and there, who’ haven’t seen entire seasons, and have barely seen any episodes at all.

Your relevant comments are below:

when i think about supernatural i generally think about seasons 1 to 9/10, because i stopped watching for a while after that but eventually got back into it. so my answers may be skewed in favor of those seasons? if that makes sense? like i love the general aesthetic of supernatural...... when it's about the earlier seasons. i am trying to be kinder and learn to love the later seasons but it's hard! anyways thanks for the survey it was fun <3

I’m curious to see if there are others like me who came into the show with Destiel goggles on, but quickly realized Sam is thee only character and then lost interest in Dean/the Big Ship. Also would like to add that I started with season 13 because I wanted to meet Jack and didn’t think I would end up watching the rest of the show, and I still feel a little guilty about it lmao

It's got a good foundation but it's inconsistent both in worldbuilding and characterization. I guess that's why fandom can just take off with it and make it fantastic

If you answered no, how much have you watched?

This answer was a little more varied, but for the most part people stopped watching up season 9/10. Second is up to season 12, third is the random scenes/episodes, and fourth is up to season 14. The specific seasons mentioned are generally seen as the weakest in the show’s run, so it makes sense that these are the spots where people would get frustrated enough to stop. Also represented here are people who watched the show in a non linear and scattered format.

Your comments are below:

The show was great until season 13. After that point, it lost its footing by trying to placate a vocal but misguided segment of the fandom. Jack was a stupid character that ruined the show. His story eclipsed the Winchesters' story, and that should never have happened. That ridiculous "confession" in episode 15x18 was just to satisfy the Destiel people. And the finale was a horrible disappointment lying squarely on Andrew Dabb's shoulders.

Hope I helped even though I technically havent watched it. Also, absolute worst theory for me personally is the Chuck Wins theory bc that means my baby boy Jack is being puppeted around hurting his family and I CANNOT take that. Also if they had framed the finale as a tragedy instead of a happy ending it would've made more sense.

I gave this show so many chances and it continued to disappoint every time. In the end all my interaction with the show is second hand/fan revisionism

I watched up to season 9 and between how that went and the descriptions i’ve seen of the later seasons, I’m not going to watch the rest.

What do you like most about the show?

Pretty clear winner here: what most people like about the show is the depth of characters, aka the emotional attachement to the characters themselves. Second was the platonic relationships, and third was the general aesthetic. This also tracks: the show’s characters inspired multiple emotional reactions from the audience, and many tended to get attached to one character or the other. Some of the write ins even specified characters that respondents enjoyed. This also implies that people stuck around the show primarily to see the characters and not for the plot or general themes.

Here’s what you guys said:

I really enjoyed how the show introduced one plot point (Chuck is God and he has written/controlled basically everything that has happened so far), then it made me shift my entire view of the point of the series. There's the old idea of the show (brothers fighting evil and saving the world and family) but that's Chuck's back cover blurb of his book summarizing the story. The real plot is underneath the control and puppeteering. It's The Truman Show. It's about these people who go from thinking they have free will, thinking they achieved it, then discover that they were still being watched and controlled. So they go on a journey to look God in the eyes and earn their first taste of free will in their entire lives. I'm just sad that most of them die before they can enjoy the free will or discover who they are once free. It felt like Truman slipped and broke his neck before he could step into the real world and that's how it ended.

While I think the show is terrible at following through on metaplots or character development, I am constantly in awe of how fantastic they consistently were with setups. Whether they show you a character in one scene and make them feel fully fleshed out or if they're starting out a new storyline and it seems so creative and laden with possibilities. Yes, they usually resolve it far too quickly (or with what feels like the most mediocre option) but the creativity behind the concepts is always a genuine source of joy for me.

things i love about the show? boy am i glad u asked!!!! i love sam winchester!!!!!! sam is why i wake up every day and sam is why i go to bed every night, sam is my reason for everything i do. i only apply for college bcs sam would want me to. everything i believe in is due to him. i love him. i am off to listen to my sam playlist now (also i am aware this paragraph implies that i am a destiel hater as per usual tumblr culture, but i am not. some of us are samgirls [gn] AND hellers. we just have the range)

I am incredibly deep into the complex jungian thought process meta for supernatural and although you can kind of lose yourself in the context of that and how much it actually matters, it got me interested in a lot of things i would've otherwise never learned about. I joke all the time and yes truly supernatural is deeply, deeply flawed even at it's core, but saying its a bad show as a reason to degrade myself (as alot of people do) doesn't feel right. I do legit love engaging with supernatural.

i unfortunately am very interested in something that the show itself fell flat on and nobody in the fandom seems very interested in, which is the lore. like we get what they read aloud when planning to gank the motw sure but i'm talking about the bitches we interact with constantly that's right angels and demons which we know actually surprisingly little about idk i might write up my theories one day for a podt that gets like. two notes

Supernatural is a mid-tier show in terms of being a CW drama but is top-tier for being good and camp. I like the serious emotional aspects esp wrt the brothers but would not be this into it if it wasn't batshit insane fun too

This show has really stuck with me because of how real the characters are and how easy you can connect to them and the story contains every genre and there’s always more to go with the story. This really was a show

I like meta analysis that breaks down where exactly characters actions don’t seem like ‘them’ because writers didn’t understand them, but where fans still find some way to make it coherent within canon.

I love how unintentionally and intentionally messed up so much of this show is. The relationships, the consent issues, the unanswered question of what a monster really is, oooh boy are they a lot!

It's got a good foundation but it's inconsistent both in worldbuilding and characterization. I guess that's why fandom can just take off with it and make it fantastic

Honestly one of my favorite parts of the show currently is the brain rot I get if I think too hard about the narrative potential that was never carried out.

I enjoy the Supernatural the fandom creates and manifests and writes. The actual show… hurts.

What do you hate most about the show?

What most people hated most about the show was the problematic narrative context, aka the elements of the show that had racist, homophobic, or misogynistic elements. Writing and plot were also popular choices. I believe the first part is pretty self explanatory, while the second is no surprise as the writing is well known to be disjointed and a little lost, especially later on in the show’s run.

Relevant comments below:

Sorry, this is a downer, feel free to ignore, lol. I watched the show in a vacuum for like 6 or 7 years, and it was fun. The fandom cult of the show that grew out of control as the show neared its end almost ruined the show for me. I hated the pandering of the writers to shippers, which is embarrassing and nonsensical from a plot perspective, and downright insulting to certain characters. I hate the obvious favouritism of Dean after Sera Gamble left the show, and the bizarre sidelining of Sam that began in season 10 and became ridiculous by season 15 - so ridiculous that people were baffled when Sam was the one to outlive Dean. I hate the demonisation (ha) of Sam for adopting a traditionally feminine role in TV and film, and I hate that he's still mocked or belittled for suffering r*pe, gaslighting and emotional abuse - often by characters beloved in the fandom. Basically, half the people who watched the show consumed it so differently to how it was supposed to be consumed I felt pity seeing their reactions every week. Like watching someone try to eat a sandwich via their rear end. Sad and weird and ruining my experience. Anyway. Stan Sam Winchester

will die mad that sam's addiction wasn't fully realized and i take it personally. i miss what the show was and mourn what it could've been. i used to see myself in sam but i had too much self esteem to keep watching him be victimized and pushed around and his own free will be like.. that. and i used to really like dean but he became so boring and controlling and close-minded and never learned and they didnt feel like brothers anymore. they felt more like cardboard cut outs and no longer like,, individuals. the thesis of the show started feeling like 'if your family is making you uncomfortable you grin and bear it and dont leave, dont change anything, because they are your family, and your family comes first, even before yourself and your own desires and aspirations', and as a gay mexican raised in a religious household that shit is so stinkyyyyy.

I really loved this show for a long time because of Sam's story and his connection to feeling monstrous but honestly the show never fully commits to this and slowly it becomes a deeply tragic story about abuse with the problem of the writers having no awareness of this reality and being able to deal with it effectively. everytime i though the show could go somewhere with sam's trauma or the fracture in Sam and deans relationship as an extension of John's mistreatment of them or even become a horror show where dean and sam's codependency is exposed/utilized as a psychological element. it just never happens. plus the show never crucified sam. lame.

Tbh my least favourite bit was whatever went on bts after/ around Covid. Misha was there but then he wasn’t. He was just breaking the law(?!) for a camping trip. The fact that there was 3 (THREE) montages and an extra ad break in the finale of the longest running sci fi show on American tv. Because they cut out Cas. They cut out the queer because god forbid we actually see ourselves in their all American Kansas red-blooded hunters.

Idk I kind of hate how the plot arcs are kind of abandoned in the later seasons and how the characterizations are not followed through, but in the earlier seasons I thought they did that really well and that’s one of the reasons why I like(ed) it so much.

Still mad about: the special children storyline being dropped/Sam losing his powers, the not-all-monsters are evil not being explored enough, Ruby 1.0 is the superior Ruby and more people should know that, MEG GETTING FRIDGED FOR NOTHING

if some writers & showrunners had stronger skills, cared a bit more abt the show and it’s stories, and cared less abt alienating/pissing off certain groups of viewers i think spn could have been much more cohesive and impactful

Supernatural had such brilliant ideas and plot points they consistently overlooked to drive a simpler narrative that was more able to fill the white man hero complex. It wounds me deeply.

Honestly, I just wish spn fleshed out it's main characters more. Dean has a shit ton of conflicting background information and Sam just doesn't have enough. Sam just deserved better tbh.

I wish I lived in the world where the supernatural writing room was not oddly preoccupied with how their soapy drama cw tv show appealed to white conservative men.

Do you enjoy participating in fandom?

When it comes to fandom, a majority of people enjoy participating only in their specific niche. However, people saying yes to general fandom participation was a pretty close second! This tracks as well, because the participants of the survey are in the fandom and are more likely to enjoy being there if they still engage to this degree.

Comments below:

The thing about Supernatural is- it’s an okay show on a surface level, as casual watching. Go down a level, start paying attention to the acting choices and stuff and it becomes frickin awesome. Another level down, you start noticing narrative inconsistencies and also the racist elements and you realize it’s a terrible show. Yet another level down, connecting the dots and thinking on a meta level and paying attention to the fandom? INSANE BRAINWORMS HOLY SHIT THIS SHOW IS SO AMAZING AND NOT ENTIRELY ON PURPOSE- WHAT THE HECK- In short- it’s simultaneously a terrible show and an amazing show, and you just gotta watch it with the right mindset, and make sure you’re following the right peeps in the fandom and blocking the people who are crappy, and you’ll have so much fun

The fandom is fun but only as experinced through carefully curated discords and only checking tumblr once a week. Probably my favorite thing is the volume of cool fanfictions! The last few fandoms I've participated in are much smaller I'd literally run out of fics to read, but that's never a problem here :) I started watching the show because of the Nov 5th memes. I connected with Sam the most as a character. The brother and family stuff along with the spooky creepy aesthetic is my favorite stuff about the show. Makes me wish I had chosen to watch this instead of the wholock stuff back in middle school when it was the hot thing. Supernatural has a ton of problems but overall I did still enjoy it a lot!

When I say the fandom isn't positive, that's not quite true. I love my corner of the fandom; they make me enjoy the show infinitely more, contribute to my brainworms, and add so many layers to the experience of watching the show. But as soon as I go outside my "section" of the fandom, it gets pretty rancid. The last survey results just reminded me of how much I disagree with so many other fans (how could you hate Cas???) in the other parts of the fandom.

i feel like its hard to talk about the experience in the supernatural fandom bc its like i love being here as in my little corner but also i hate it bc you can never keep to your corner and always have to beat uglies off with a broom… also please for the love of god can these people read anything other than tumblr excerpts from gender trouble and apply queer theory from the 80s to 2000’s television its making me break out in hives

I have a love/hate relationship with the show and the fandom. But I'm not sorry I found it or became part of the fandom. It's been a huge part of my life because I've been watching for 15 years and I still love discussing the nuances of the show whether they were intentional or not.

Honestly at this point I've separated my fandom experience from canon so much it's basically a separate entity by now, especially since my favorite ship is contained in like,, three-five episodes. It's just me and ten mutuals vibing lmao

Its so lovely to me that we have our own vocab and terminology and that we have theories like chuck won theory and the ghostfacers effect like i feel like a scientist kfjfkf

The fandom was significantly more tolerable when it was on livejournal.

Is the overall fandom a positive place to be?

People saying yes were given the edge here. Interestingly, when compared to the previous part, the numbers for yes were almost exactly the same as the numbers for enjoying fandom in a specific niche. However, this answer also indicates that many people enjoy participating in fandom while also believing the general fandom is not a positive place to be.

Here are your comments:

I love the show and i used to enjoy the fandom. maybe i’m just getting old and nostalgic. but i think a lot of the fandom has become too toxic and too wrapped up in trying to make the show something it wasn’t(?) i think there are certainly things that are best left to fanfic. i will always love sam, dean, and cas with all my heart, but the show became so outrageous and far fetched and downright blasphemous at times, and that’s saying a lot for a show literally about the supernatural. i think the show fell out of touch with its origins and the fandom fell out of touch with reality. i don’t know, like i said, maybe i’m just old and worn out from everything. don’t get me wrong, i love it so much, but i honestly keep to myself about it.

I enjoy the fandom, but its very clique-y, and it seems like if you're not in with a specific group you're not really in. I think it's difficult to get to know people and a lot of memes aren't explained unless you already understand them because you're in one of the it-groups. And I don't care about the actors or RPF and there seems to be a lot of that lol. I mainly look at memes, read fanfic on my own, and talk about the show with my irl friends who are also fans. Hope my answers weren't a mess, great survey :)

i know my answers are extremely negative but i really do like the show and fandom quite a bit ghkjfdghfk it is both fascinating and extremely frustrating to be playing in the world's most horrible and pessimistic sandbox, because on the one hand you truly can take any old garbage and turn it into a beautiful gem and that's so satisfying when it works out, but on the other hand the sand you are forced to work with IS soaked in homophobic piss. so.

I think you would all enjoy the show more if you stopped interacting with weird people online. I do Not Know Anything about Jared or Jesen. I cannot spell Jareds surname. And I am happier for it. Every time I think it would be fun to come on the little blogging website and look up the tag, there are people saying incredibly weird things. Also Dean should have gone back to Cassie Robinson instead of Lisa.

I think because Supernatural has so many episodes and ran for so long it offers a unique amount of longevity to fandom that are on par with Star Trek and Harry Potter, and it will be around for a long time. I met my soulmate through a destiel fanfiction, this show isn't good. Idk. There are SO many layers............... an onion…………

To be clear about the fandom, I definitely think some parts of it are toxic and can make things a drag on everyone else, but other parts of it are very enjoyable and that's why I'm still in the fandom.

I think the healthiest the fandom has ever been was during the superwholock days. We were honestly just having fun and I know it's cringe now but it was just so genuinely fun I look back to it fondly

I enjoyed fandom so much more a few years ago. Not so much anymore. It's gotten so toxic.

Is shipping your favorite part of the show?

A pretty big majority here ruled that no, shipping is not their favorite part of the show. This may be a surprising or unsurprising result depending on the specific parts of fandom that you’ve seen. Of course, the people the survey reached does have an impact on the validity of these results, but this large a skew indicates that shipping is not the overwhelming element of fandom as it may appear to be.

Here’s what you said:

I'm not going to lie, I really do love Destiel, but I get really frustrated when fans act like the show is ONLY about Destiel. Where we robbed? YES. Did the CW behave like a little turd baby? FUCKING YES. But those two are not the end all be all of the show, there are so many other characters and themes and story arcs that are so so wonderful, and those things are not wasted because the CW chickened out and behaved like bratty children. Also I'm sick of the double standard around Jensen and Jared. I see too many people defending Jensen's bad or poor behavior but shitting not just on Jared, but Sam, when Jared behaves badly or poorly. The characters are NOT the actors and I've had to many interactions with fans who don't understand that. I'M TIRED. I adore this show, I really genuinely do, and I've had great interactions with fans. My roommate/best friend/pseudo-sister is literally a 5'5 Ginger Dean Winchester and it's AWESOME, we talk Supernatural all the time even though we have very different views of the show and the characters, but online I've been seeing less and less civilness between people with differing opinions. I've also been harrassed for being a Sam girl over a Dean girl, which makes no sense to me. I relate heavily to Sam Winchester, of course he's going to be my favorite character, I understand his brain space in a way I don't with other characters. But some fans act like I've committed a war crime when I say he's my favorite character, (It gets worse when they find out Cas is my second and that Dean is only like my fourth favorite character, I still love him to pieces but gosh damn it, he does not have to be my favorite character! I've gotten genuine hate in my ask box over this!!!). Sorry this is such a long rant but it weighs heavily on me because it just seems to be getting worse since the finale. It makes me not want to interact with a fandom that I truly love dearly, and one that helped me survive one of the darkest points of my life. It sounds cheesy and fake, but this show genuinely helped me stop self-harming. I can't stand seeing how things seem to be shifting, even as I try desperately to surround myself with positive fans and fannish things. Also, Gabriel is not dead because I said so. He is currently on a date with Sam in the Library of Alexandria. They're going to get lunch in the Hanging Gardens of Babylon later. No one is really dead and rusty nails do not exist. Rowena is the Queen of Hell and Jack and Cas are co-leading Heaven and they are working with Rowena to make the afterlife as good and fair as it can be. John Winchester is still burning in hell though.

I said "Yes" to the "Is shipping your favorite part?" question because it's related enough, but my actual favorite part of this show is the whole "good Supernatural in our heads" bit. I love that there's so many potentially amazing ideas and compelling characters / relationships and instances of REALLY good writing that - even when the execution in the show sucks - we can build something there. Whether it's a "society if..." tumblr post or a half a million word fanfic, there's so many good things in this toolbox (and so many bad things that can be looked at in fascinating ways if you just hold them up to the light and turn them a little). On one site we've written over 100,000 ways for just *two characters* to love and want and deeply affect each other. That's so nuts (in a great way)!

There's a lot good and a lot bad about Supernatural, but my overall feelings on it are very positive. The ship wars that plague Tumblr have gotta be the most obnoxious part of the fandom - and I say this as someone who does occasionally enjoy ship content. To me, what makes the show great is its compelling and charming characters, and solid attempt at a tragic story about family, free will, and generational cycles, although unfortunately I found a lot about the last two episodes disappointing. It didn't quite stick the landing. Also, as an aside, the meta episodes ruled and were definitely one of the things that made the show memorable and set it apart, on my first viewing.

I enjoyed the show, but it got many times deeper and I joined the fandom to start thinking about it all the time when I started rewatching with shipping goggles on :D

If you have one, which ship is your favorite?

Destiel wins handily here with over half of these respondents choosing it as their favorite ship. The second place ship, Sastiel, is a distant second at almost 10%. This isn’t a very surprising result, as the ship is undoubtedly the most represented in fandom. A large number of ships were also represented, indicating that the shipping landscape is actually quite varied here.

Relevant comments below:

when i first got into this fandom in 2013 i was equal parts a sam girl and a destiel shipper but as time passed i became more and more of a bitter sam stan? i mean i still ship destiel (and it’s probably still my otp) but i don’t get people who make it like it’s the show main thing OR the most interesting thing to talk about. you have a show that focuses on PLATONIC relationships and then you go make it all about romance? like, it’s so rare to find shows that don’t focus on sexual or romantic drama as it is. also i wanna add that sam winchester is my main concern and idk who was she (me in 2013-14).

Watching for the first time in 2021 and I keep thinking “this is what the og Destiel shippers have been going through this entire time???” INSANE. Purgatory is gay. Dean absolutely fucked Benny. Hell, I would have fucked Benny.

dean saving cas from empty would have been the ultimate ending for destiel cause like it bookends their relationship with saving each other and the goddamn writers/network were too homophobic to actualize that

I wish the fandom didn’t so heavily focus on destiel or see Dean as a hero. I am a queer neurodivergent fan and while I am disappointed with the show, the fandom itself is so much worse.

Look i don't connect with romance of destiel really as an ace but im so indignant about the homophobia of it all that i ship it out of spite and make whole fanworks about it lmao

I wish the writers didn’t queer bait us as much they did. Destiel is a powerful story and shouldn’t have been treated like garbage.

destiel is endgame but megstiel was real. samwena supremacy

In your opinion, what is the show about?

Interestingly, the top three spots here are family related: first place goes to family don’t end in blood, second to family is hell, third to family and brotherhood. Free will, a main theme, is in fourth place. While these three themes of family are interpreted differently in these answers, the overwhelming consensus seems to be that the show is about family first and foremost.

Relevant comments below:

society if we got spn ending where sam married eileen and start a hunting community where you can go if you're traumatized by supernatural events (humans and monsters alike) it's not about killing monsters it's about sharing resources and helping each other and monster rehab/therapy (i think i saw a post abt sam helping people like magda? thats what inspired monster therapy thing like hes not just gonna be men of letters 2.0 establishing a new hunting network) hunters dont have to be isolated and depressed and alone you have a support system it's about COMMUNITY and monsters can coexist and dont have to killed :( as much as i like destiel if you kept the finale the same but added destiel at the end i still would have hated it, what spn needed to address was how it treated monsters, ultimately it keeps flip flopping on who "deserves" to be saved and if monsters can be "good", and it's pretty anthropocentric idk it's frustrating. i also dislike human!cas because he doesnt HAVE to be human to be accepted, monsters/creatures/angels can live alongside humans you dont have to turn them human :// also I really hated how dabb era in particular treated angels and there was such an easy fix for it in the end like it wouldnt have been hard to write rescuing cas from the empty also brings all the other angels back so heaven isnt practically empty with a three year old in charge. yes im a new fan but it would have been so healing to see the other angels come back anna and uriel and raphael and balthazar and hannah like at this point theres no reason to fight beyond regular insane family drama stuff so they argue and stuff but theres no genuine animosity anymore and it would have been a cool throwback to see them again anyway yeah angels are the coolest part of the show but sadly...... </3 also hated how the show kept insisting on keeping sam and dean isolated and killing off side characters etc. also they left adam in hell for ten years WHAT THE HELL adam and michael deserved better too, anyway i think people often attribute problems with the show itself to dean but it's not his fault and i love him (i hope this was coherent sorry)

I had a really hard time picking a favorite and least favorite aspect of the show! Overarching plots especially, because some I thought were very compelling and there were some that fell very flat for me. Also picking what the show is about is so hard for me to narrow down to one thing. To me, I feel like it’s a show about brothers and their found family trying their best to make the world a better place and save people/keep them safe. Wait actually I would like to say my least favorite part of the show was how overplayed the whole “what did you do to my brother” plot point was. It’s always the brothers choosing each other and it got stupidly repetitive any time they put that to the test.

"Are All Monsters Evil? Yes" made me laugh out loud because that's a great incapsulation of a huge problem I have with the show: no matter how many non-human people we meet and befriend, no matter how many times the main characters deal with feeling monstrous themselves, no matter how much we wrestle with the moral dilemmas inherent in the institution of hunting - we always come back to non-human demonization and Murder Is Cool as our central tenet, to the detriment of the show's story and character arcs :C Not only does it annoy me personally, it leads to nothing making any goshdarn SENSE at the end of the day! Justice 4 Jack

i mean it’s not so much family is hell as it is you are destined to become your father. cycles of violence infinitely more powerful than you are at play and you are completely helpless in the face of it. i think that sam dean and cas are each living out entirely different and contradictory narratives which i find really compelling

To elaborate on the last question: they spent so long on this humanizing the monsters plot that didn’t go anywhere. It was so horrible for real. Sam kept being like “I think this is a person actually” and then repeatedly Dean and other characters and the narrative itself told him he was wrong. What was it all for

that last question was kinda hard cos i honestly do not know what its about at this point. the secret good spn in my head is all about horror, found family and destroying the cycle of abuse but it seems canon disagrees with me :/ anyway love ur surveys ur honestly doing a service for this fandom

i genuinely can’t imagine watching this show for anything but “family is hell” bc like. damn it really is hell for these dudes. all they do is suffer and hurt each other and everyone else. i love it <3

I think this show is an exaggerated study of living with trauma, loss, guilt and redefines the meaning of what love really is ...depending on who's watching. Survival against all odds is a comfort.

I think the writers destroyed everything the show was about with the last two episodes and the only message left was gay love is powerful enough to defy god himself.

In the later seasons, the writers seemed to forget that family didn’t end in blood, wrote scenes for characters that went against their character arcs.

It's a really interesting study in generational trauma and toxic masculinity even though the creators kinda didn't mean to do that lol

Thank you to everyone who participated, and a special thanks to the people that interacted with these results. I really appreciate it! If you have any questions about the data and extra info let me know.

My 26th birthday celebration day 4: possession OR the end

[astermacguffin]

I can NOT believe I haven't encountered a destiel divorce arc amv set on "sick of losing soulmates" yet because it fits sooooooo well

"What a strange being you are" - clips of 4x01 barn scene, Cas' entrance

"God knows where I would be if you haven't found me sitting all alone in the dark" - scenes of Dean in hell and getting out of his grave

"Watch how a cold broken teen will desperately lean on a superglued human of proof" - I can't pick scenes for this yet but it DOES sound very destiel core

"What the hell would I be, without you" - MANY big destiel scenes to choose from

"Brave face talk so lightly, hide the truth" - scenes of Dean gazing longingly at Cas, scenes of Cas' Emptt deal arc

"Cause I'm sick of losing soulmates, so where do we begin // I can finally see, you're as fucked up as me // So how do we win?" - clips of Dean and his previous relationships, clips of the divorce arc

"We will grow old as friends // I've promised that before so what's one more in our grey-haired circle waiting for the end?" - destiel date scenes (their diner dates, the glass clink, etc), scenes with them and their friends

"So which path will you take, cause we both know a break does exactly what it says on the tin" - divorce arc scenes, alternating between their split and their reconciliation

"I won't take no for an answer" - the climax of the amv, with their multiple hug scenes back-to-back

Closing scenes - the 15x03 clip where Cas leaves and the camera zooms out on Dean, alone.

SIDENOTES

One interesting thing about this hypothetical amv is that it highlights the intra- and inter-discursive nature of amvs (and fanworks in general; for a more elaborate explanation for this, please see my essay on the semantic logic of amvs).

I'll explain what I mean. In the typical format for amvs, the song typically holds more narrative force over the visual media (film, TV show, etc). This is evident in the fact that it's usually not the song which you cut up in order to fit the visual media, but the other way around: you cut up the visual media in order to match the song.

This typically entails an asymmetrical relation between the two texts. Functionally, the song recontextualizes the visual media into new and interesting ways: maybe it brings out a novel reading of the visual text, or maybe it reaffirms a preexisting but subtextual meaning in said text. This means that the song tends to function as the more "primary text" with the visual media as the "complementary text."

[Of course, this does have its exceptions. Two examples that come to mind are (1) the abbanatural edit of The Prisoner fight scene by @katebushstandean where the scene unfolds naturally while the song is laid over it. This presents a more equal footing between both musical and visual texts. The other example is (2) the My Heart Will Go On destiel crack vid by @princesscas where a specific portion of the song is repeatedly overlaid on different scenes; this dynamic presents the visual media as the primary text and the song the complementary one.]

This hypothetical amv I'm proposing presents something similar with (2) because in this case, it's the visual media that is recontextualizing the song. If I remember correctly, dodie wrote "sick of losing soulmates" about breaking up with a romantic partner who is also your best friend. The song, therefore, is a plea to remain good friends with this person despite their breakup.

Overlaying it on the destiel divorce arc radically changes the reading of the musical text. It's not just a "I still wanna be best friends" but a "I still want you back, please have me back." While in a formalistic sense, it's still the song that functions as the "primary text", in a more narrative sense it's the visual media that is doing most of the recontextualizing in this case.

Anyways. Someone with better video editing skills please make this real, I'm a better analyst than a creator lol. Also please join me in the dodienatural agenda

[sortasirius]

what makes you think the writers want deancas? not trying to be an asshole, i'm just genuinely curious as to why you think that. i know berens' episodes are pretty heavy with subtext so i can see why you'd say that he wants it, but i'm not so sure about the rest of the writers/dabb. it seems like meghan isn't a huge fan either, given her "they twisted it so fast" tweet :/ of course she's a very new writer (think she's only writing one ep this season?) but still

OKAY this is a great question, welcome to my dissertation.

I’m going to address the end of your question first. Meghan is actually DeanCas positive, she has been for quite a long time. She actually, a few years back, posted a picture of her reading a literal book about Destiel and captioned it “writing reading” or something like that.

This whole thing just comes out of a boiling over of tensions because of how nasty fandom twitter can be. Like I said here, I think this has just gotten blown out of proportion, they shouldn’t have posted all this randomly disparaging stuff, but also like...can you blame them? The fandom is a lot, we always have been, and they’re probably also under a gag order not to talk about the finale, and are annoyed that people keep asking.

So nah, Meg is not anti Destiel.

To the first part!! So let’s take a look at the show runners since Cas has been around.

Seasons 4 and 5: Kripke

Seasons 6 and 7: Gamble

Seasons 8-11ish: Carver

Seasons 11ish-15: Dabb

So starting with Kripke. Okay, yes, I will be the first to admit that we have some pretty incredible Destiel moments in these seasons, but it’s less directly written into the plot and much more from Misha and Jensen’s uhhhh ~chemistry~. The only times it was directly written into the script was when the episode was handled by someone like Edlund (“On The Head Of A Pin,” “The End,” “My Bloody Valentine”). And you have to remember, if in season 5, there are moments here and there where you’re like huh that’s suspiciously romantic dialogue, remember that Cas took Anna’s place. Anna was supposed to be endgame for Dean, but due to a myriad of issues and Misha’s general greatness, Anna was replaced with Cas.

Onto 6 and 7. Hmmm. Gamble. 6 and 7 are my two least favorite seasons and that’s no secret, and that’s not only due to the plain old weird shit in the overall storyline, but also that homegirl killed off Cas in s7 and then Bobby like four episodes later. (Also it ALWAYS rubbed me the wrong way they couldn’t have Baby in that season lol). We still had some great DeanCas moments, but again, it wasn’t really written into the overall arc (until they had to change the end of season 7 because of tanking ratings and bring Misha back lol, anyone remember the fact that Dean kept Cas’ jacket and would randomly dream of him? Yeah.). But we still had those moments, those distinctly romantic moments, probably the best example in these two seasons is from Edlund again, specifically “The Man Who Would be King,” I wrote a little about that here.

We move onto Carver, who gave us, at this point, the most overt DeanCas season with season 8 (season gr8 is a better name imo), and this is the first time Dean and Cas’ relationship is directly written as an arc of the season.  I mean, you have everything in Purgatory, Dean “seeing” Cas everywhere, the fact that he felt so guilty that Cas stayed in Purgatory that he manipulated his own memories to think that he was the one that failed Cas, because he couldn’t comprehend that Cas would want to leave him, and let’s not forget Dean snapping Cas out of Naomi’s hold on him in “Goodbye Stranger.”  It was a very obvious shift, not enough to alert the general audience, but more than enough for most of us in fandom.

It’s also important to note that this is when Andrew stopped co writing with Loflin and started writing his own episodes (”Hunter Heroici” anyone?)  I like Loflin fine, but Dabb was able to stretch his legs a little bit more once he stopped co-writing, and we also began to see some DeanCas themes in his solo episodes.

In any case, them and their issues being a big part of the seasons continued with Carver, and Berens entered the scene, his first episode (”Heaven Can’t Wait”) is one of my favorites, with human Cas and the fanfiction gap and Dean and Cas just generally being awkward and funny and sweet.  This is Bobo’s FIRST episode, remember that.  He comes right out of the gate with it.

Also in Season 9, this is when Dean takes the Mark of Cain, and the Cas/Colette mirror is born, so obviously, Dean and Cas are the fabric of the season once again.  This is also the season where Metatron says Cas is “in love with humanity,” and then immediately refers to Dean as Humanity so uhhhh yeah.

Onto season 10, Dabb and Berens continue with their greatness (I could write pages on the DeanCas date in “The Things We Left Behind” alone).  And then we have one of the best scenes in the entire show in “The Prisoner” where the Cas/Colette mirror continues and Dean, driven by grief and pain and rage and the Mark, still doesn’t kill Cas.  He still can’t kill Cas.

Season 11 is important because it takes choice away from both Cas and Dean, and shows us, as the audience, how much losing each other takes out of them. We saw in season 10 how much losing Dean takes from Cas, but what about Cas losing Dean?  Dean loses his choice with his connection to Amara this season, and loses even more when Lucifer reveals he’s been possessing Cas, and plays on Dean’s connection to Cas like a mockery.  It’s also worth noting that, similarly to season 8, Dean breaks out of the connection with Amara when he’s worried about Cas, and that’s something that even SHE is surprised by.

But then season 12, the beginning to the Renaissance.  This is when we get the writer’s that become important for what Dean and Cas are today, and, truly, why I believe they want canon Destiel as much as we do.

This is the first season with Dabb’s writers: Davy Perez, Meredith Glynn, Steve Yockey, and of course Bobo all come in with their incredible talents and gave us episode after episode of good content.  “Lily Sunder Has Some Regrets” is probably my favorite, probably the best example of what I’m saying.  An episode where Dean is called out by an enemy directly, told to “roll the dice” on Cas’ life.  And Dean won’t, it’s not even really a hesitation.  And this comes from a character that has known Dean for ten seconds.  I also wrote more in depth about this episode here.  There are also some.....distinctly domestic details we get this season, specifically in “The Future” (written by Berens and Glynn) with the mixtape.  The most tropey of tropes mixtape.  Yeah, I’ll just leave that one here.

And then season 12 ends with Cas’ death, but also with the parallel between Sam and Dean with Jess and Cas.  Sam literally has to drag Dean away from Cas, just like Dean had to drag Sam out of his burning apartment in the pilot.  The episode drives it home in every way that it can: Dean is the one left kneeling by Cas’ body, while Sam goes to find out what is upstairs.  Dean is the one who stares at the sky, finally broken.  This isn’t a random thing, this is Dean’s whole arc, it’s the entirety of the beginning of 13.  Dean’s pain, his anguish, his anger.

Season 13 starts with them burning Cas, with Dean, who has begged God to bring him back, who has split his knuckles punching a door, standing, staring at Cas’ pyre with brokenness on his face.

I mean.....

Anyway, season 13 is where it gets interesting (well, I think all of this is interesting but I’m a writer nerd so).  So Cas comes back from the Empty in “Advanced Thanatology” written by Steve Yockey, and then a wombo combo of “Tombstone” by Davy Perez next (”Brokebacknatural” as the PR said at the time).  Listen.  This is the part that SPN crossed a line that they couldn’t come back from.  With Cas being Dean’s “big win,” the fact that Dean and Cas watch movies together, “I told you, he’s an angry sleeper.  Like a bear.” Talked about it here.

This is where, in my opinion, the network stepped in, but the damage was already done.  They had already established that Cas was Dean’s big win, that Dean’s poor coping was not due to Mary’s disappearance, but solely due to Cas, and that Dean and Cas have more married energy than anyone else.  The network had nixed blatant canon at this point, and they writing room had been pushing the boundaries of what the network would allow. 

After these episodes, we see a marked drop off of DeanCas heavy scenes.  They’re still there, still a part of the fabric of the season, but not as...obvious as it had been in early season 13.

And this continued through season 14, we’re back to scraps of Destiel scenes here and there, but to me it always felt like there was something bubbling under the surface, something distinctly unsaid in the themes of the season, even after the walk back of obvious “Dean and Cas are in love” scenes.

And then we get to season 15, which, y’all know I talk about all the time.  What’s important here is that Bobo and Glynn are both executive producers, calling more of the shots than ever before.  Additionally, it’s important to note that, though they only co write occasionally, Glynn and Berens refer to each other as “work husband” and “work wife.”  Each episode has just turned up the volume, and, not for the first time, but certainly the most obvious, Dean and Cas ARE the season.  Sure, they’re trying to beat God, they’re trying to finally find peace, defeat the final big bad, but really?  This season has been about Dean, and Dean’s relationship to Cas.

And not only do we have obvious and clear Destiel in nearly every episode, but we have episodes like “Last Call” which canonize bi!Dean (wrote about that here).

And, maybe most importantly so far, we have “The Rupture,” the breakup, and “The Trap,” Dean’s confession (both written by Berens).  And here’s the thing.  These episodes feel connected, but also feel like they’re missing something.  Beren’s last episode is 15x18, “The Truth.”  We’ve all spec’ed about what could happen in this episode, and I think *I* know what it’s leading to.  But for it to be leading to that, it means that the network has to have approved what we’ve all been waiting for years for.

Who got this change to happen?  Who got the network to change their minds?  It wasn’t us.  It was them.  I am fully convinced that Dabb and Berens quite literally put their careers on the line for Dean and Cas.  They believe in them, they’ve shown that from the beginning, but the only thing standing in the way was the network, never allowing them to take the final step. 

So, to answer your question: I think the writers want canon DeanCas because they’ve already shown us that they do.  Take a look at their episodes, at Dabb’s, at Beren’s, at Glynn’s, at Perez’s, at Yockey’s.  They’ve been telling us what’s going on with Dean and Cas for years.

Sure, I’m not in their heads, I guess I don’t know for *sure* that this has been their thought process, but if we put it all together, from the marked shift when Dabb fully took over in s12, to the change right after “Tombstone,” to the new shift, the blatantly romantic shift in season 15, what else is there?

I’ve said for a long time that we, the SPN fandom, are beyond lucky to have the writer’s that we do.  They’re all going to go on to have prolific careers and we were lucky to get them at the end of our little show.  I give them a lot of credit for what we have in the show today.

Just remember, they’ve been telling us in all of s15 who Chuck is.  He says he’s the writer, right?  But a writer who doesn’t have control of his characters?  A writer who wants to do the same ending over and over because it “works”?  That doesn’t sound like a writer, it sounds like a network exec.

They’ve been showing us what they want for years, and the way s15 is going?  I think they may have convinced the network to let us have it.

[curlynerd]

You're Bacon Me Crazy Word Count: 2K Rating: T Summary: "I can like more than one kind of burger, you know!" Or, Dean comes out through complicated burger metaphors. Notes: humor, canon-adjacent, coming out, established Destiel, #pray4Sam

Also read on AO3!

"You're really having two burgers, Dean?" Sam asks in his most smug, most obnoxious "I’m eating kale for lunch" voice. Dean really hates that voice.

Dean straightens his back and spreads his hands out, like the two wrapped burgers, the extra large fries, and the soda with two straws are a majestic bounty. “I’m a growing boy, Sammy."

“Uh-huh,” Sam deadpans. He lifts the takeout lid of his salad and starts carefully drizzling the vinaigrette cup over his bed of leafy greens and grilled chicken. “And you’re definitely not going to bully Cas into splitting them with you? You know he doesn’t need to eat.”

Something tight and anxious curls in Dean’s chest. “No!” he blurts out, realizing a second too late that it’s normal for him to share his food with Cas. Just because he’s been doing it more now that he and Cas are finally together does not mean that it’s weird now.

In response to Dean’s defensiveness, Sam raises a self-righteous eyebrow in sync with his salad-laden fork. “Can he even really taste them? I thought he didn’t like food in angel mode.”

Dean swallows down a multitude of answers. He likes sharing the experience with Cas anyway. He thinks the way his face scrunches up at the molecules is cute. It makes him feel all warm and fuzzy inside that an angel -- his angel -- is willing to put up with something so silly and mundane and human as taste-testing different burgers.

He really, really needs to tell Sam the truth about him and Cas. Hell, he’s been trying to for months! But every time the perfect opportunity presents itself, he turns into a fuckin’ coward.

And today definitely is another perfect moment. The conversation has naturally turned to Cas. They’re sitting at a picnic table at the park, with nobody around to overhear Dean spill his guts in the most agonizing and uncomfortable way possible. They’re working a case, so immediately after the conversation Dean can bury himself in research and hunting and not have to deal with Sam’s big, obnoxious “let’s make a huge deal out of this!” puppy dog eyes. And Cas isn’t even here right now to make things more awkward. He’s still checking out the victim at the coroner's office across the street.

Dean tries not to think about what a big baby he’s being by ignoring this golden opportunity. “He just tastes stuff different as an angel. He’s learning how to pick out the nuance.”

Sam rolls his eyes. “Because there’s so much nuance to ‘extra cheese’ or ‘hold the tomato.’”

“Oh like you’d know, Mr. Tofu Burger.”

“You’d eat a burger off the floor. Are you really trying to convince me you care about what kind of burger it is?”

Dean huffs and levels an indignant glare at his brother. “I absolutely have a favorite burger.”

“Then why’d you get two different kinds?”

"I can like more than one kind of burger, you know!"

Sam snorts. "That's just an excuse to eat more burgers." He spears a forkful of tomato and spinach with a smug little twinkle in his eye.

"It's so not," Dean insists. He gestures at the two wrapped foil rounds in front of him. “These are two unique burgers that both have their own delicious qualities.”

“Really?” Sam’s expression is so pompous Dean kind of wants to throw a french fry at it. Except that would be a waste of a perfectly good fry.

“Yes ‘really.’ Look--” Dean carefully unwraps his first burger. “This is a pickle burger. And not just any ol’ pickle burger. The best, most amazing, and -- dare I say it? -- sexiest pickle burger in the entire continental US.” He smirks as Sam rolls his eyes. “Now I can tell by that condescending look in your eye, you’re wondering, ‘What the hell is so special about a pickle burger? It’s just pickles!’ But that’s where you’re wrong.” Dean lifts the top bun and points down to the burger, looking almost gleeful at all its toppings. “Fried pickles, pickled red onions, relish…Sour and sweet and crunchy, the perfect compliment to a juicy, meaty burger. And one this big? You’ve gotta have a little something special to handle all this meat.” Sam tilts his head, his mouth twitching like Dean said something embarrassing. Was it waxing poetic about vegetables? Probably. Dean chooses to ignore it.

“Ya know,” he continues, “for the longest time I didn’t think I’d like a pickle burger. For years I’d be at diners and think, ‘...maybe? I dunno. Probably not for me.’” Dean pulls his mouth down into a thoughtful frown and bobs his head to mimic his past thoughts. “And then...I’m not sure, I just figured, why not at least try it? All those burgers I’ve had all over the country; I could at least give it a whirl. And it. Was. Awesome!” Dean gently places the bun back on his burger and gives it a little affectionate pat. “Now I can’t get enough of ‘em.”

Sam's expression does a complicated dance that Dean can't even begin to follow. But it suddenly clears into a look of dawning realization, followed quickly by horrified guilt, before it clamps down entirely.

Weird.

"Well...I can't fault someone for enjoying a good pickle burger," Sam says slowly. He doesn't meet Dean's eye, keeping his gaze down as he delicately stabs at his salad with his fork. He frowns at the cucumber slice he spears and carefully dislodges it from the prongs. "Especially if they really like, uh, pickles?" Sam cringes a little down at his greens. Dean can't blame him. It's a sad looking salad.

"Exactly!" Dean gestures down at the burger. "I'm a meat man and a pickle guy." Sam looks up toward the sky and then down toward the ground below with a sort of pleading desperation. "This is a great burger for me. And don't even get me started on the sauce--"

"Okay!" Sam's voice pitches up several octaves. Dean frowns at him, but before he can ask, Sam takes a deep breath and plasters a warm, understanding smile across his face. "You know what? You're right, Dean. After all this time. All those, uh...burgers. I'm glad you've figured out which one you like best."

"Well, not quite. I mean, this one…" Dean carefully unwraps the second burger. "Is there anything sexier than a breakfast burger?" He practically beams down at the golden-brown bun, the fringes of fried egg drooping over the side, crisp bacon peeking out from under the patty.

"I...I don't know?" Sam has the same terrified expression as when Dean drags him onto ramshackle roller coasters at crappy county fairs. God, he's such a baby about cholesterol.

“Yeah. C’mon, you know they’re great!” Dean says cavalierly, because he’s not going to miss a chance to gloat about the awesome food Sam misses out on with all his salads. “Bacon is, you know, bacon! It’s the best tasting thing in the world! Salty, greasy, crunchy…”

Sam’s brow furrows so deeply it’s like it’s mining for coal, his unfocused eyes searching the empty space between them like he’s trying to figure out the deep, dark mystery of bacon.

Dean rolls his eyes. Of course he wouldn’t understand. The dude eats low sodium turkey bacon. "I know you haven't had good, real bacon in ages--" Sam looks offended. Then confused. Then offended again. "--but trust me, man. It's awesome. When ya got bacon in your burger, it automatically makes the burger a hundred times better. Can’t get enough of it!” Sam groans like he's in pain.

Dean grins and keeps going. “And you’ve gotta admit, a fried egg is a thing of beauty. Give me a good silky, drippy egg all over my burger and I’m a happy guy.” Sam’s nose scrunches up into abject horror. “You get that gorgeous, soft yolk oozing everywhere...It’s creamy and delicious and unctuous and--”

“Dean!” Sam shrieks. He lets his fork fall into his bowl and covers his face with both his hands. His voice is muffled, but it’s definitely a tormented whine. “I know this is a tough topic for you, but can you please just say you’re bi and never use words like ‘unctuous’ again? I’m begging you!”

Dean freezes. “Wh-What?” Did Sam really--? He--? How does he know?!

Sam pops up from his elbows, dragging both hands through his hair as he frees his face from hiding. “I get it, dude. Okay? I get it. I mean...I don’t get it.” He glances down at the two burgers with a perturbed look and holds up his hands in surrender. “But I get it.”

Dean stares at him. “Get what?” he demands. His heart is pounding fast. Bi. Sam knows he’s bi. When did he figure it out?! Why’s he bringing it up now?!

Sam fixes him with a flat look. “The burgers? The...God...bacon sex metaphor? The pickle guy thing? I get it. Please. Please stop talking about eggs like that. I’ll never eat an omelette again!”

Sex metaphors? Pickle guy?! Dean takes a moment to think and...yeah. Yup. He really did say “I’m a pickle guy,” out loud. Wow.

Maybe he should just...roll with it?

Because otherwise Sam is definitely going to mock him for that for the rest of his life, and honestly, coming out is the much better option.

“You got me,” Dean says with a small laugh. He spreads his arms out with a bit of a flourish, and it’s a relief to say it. It feels good. “What can I say? I like all kinds of burgers. And hotdogs. Tacos. Kielbasa...”

“Please stop,” Sam groans, rubbing at his eyes with his hand.

Oh yeah, this is definitely the better option. Dean fell ass-backwards into a conversation he’s been dreading for months, and the only person feeling awkward and miserable here is Sam!

Really it’s a win-win.

Dean grins from ear to ear as he relishes Sam’s mortification. “Hey now, I thought you were supportive! What happened to ‘I’m happy for you and your burgers?’”

“I am happy for you, I just wish this wasn’t happening over lunch…” Sam whines as he drops his hands on the table.

“What’s Sam happy about?” Cas asks, startling the both of them by approaching their picnic table. His eyes are earnest and sincerely curious, which only causes Sam to send a miserable, pleading look his way while shaking his head.

“Sam thinks pickles are gay,” Dean says to Cas with the same sort of smug glee of the teacher’s pet tattling about note passing in class.

Cas scrunches his face in confusion as he sits down beside Dean. “Sam, that’s...nonsensical.”

“That’s what I said!” Dean lies, because the way Sam’s eyebrow is twitching right now is too damn funny. “Wait til you hear what he thinks about bacon.”

Sam drops his face into his hands again. “This is the worst day of my life,” he groans as he massages his temples with his fingers.

Cas furrows his brow at him. “You’ve been to Hell.”

“And I’m still there, apparently!” Sam flings his hand up in exasperation. Cas quietly takes a sip of Dean’s drink, which for some reason just pisses Sam off more.

“You know, you could have just been normal about this. No weird, gross food metaphors. Just--” Sam drops his voice several octaves and bobs his head in a deliberately annoying parody of Dean. “--‘Hey Sam, by the way, I’m bi and totally in love with Cas, no big deal,’ or whatever.”

Dean goes still while Cas tilts his head at the two of them.. “Who says I’m in love with Cas?” Wait. Is that obvious too? Shit, well, looks like he gets to rip two bandaids off today. Thank God for the hilarious panic on Sam's face, because otherwise Dean would be the one freaking out here.

Sam’s eyes go huge, all color draining out of his face. “Oh shit. I didn’t-- I’m sorry, I--”

Dean can only manage to maintain the ruse for a few seconds before he bursts out laughing. “Nah, I’m just messing with you. Where have you been, man? Cas and I have been together for ages. I thought you were the smart one!”

Sam looks like he wants to leap across the picnic table and strangle Dean.

With a glare so sour it could peel paint, Sam snatches Dean’s extra large order of french fries and storms off toward the car to sulk. About three paces away, he stops, turns around, and levels a stern finger at Dean alongside his scowl. “For the record. I’m proud of you. And I’m honored you chose to trust me with this information,” he hisses in a frustrated huff before he spins on his heel and marches away.

Dean wipes a tear from his eye, still chuckling under his breath. Cas stares after Sam in concern.

“Why is he so mad?”

Dean shrugs off the question as he slides the pickle burger in front of Cas and nudges him with his elbow to try it. “Hell if I know. If you ask me, dude needs to have a burger every once in awhile.”