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iamanartichoke · 3 years ago

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[please blacklist spoiler tags: #loki tv series spoilers, #loki series spoilers, #loki spoilers]

I need to talk about the Avengers.

I just want to express how much I hate that the Avengers aren’t on the hook for all their time travel nonsense bc they were “supposed to” do it and Loki is on the hook bc he wasn’t.

I mean, I am glad that they addressed it right away - that Loki was inadvertantly caught up in the Avengers' time meddling, and that apparently they were doing what they were supposed to and that's why none of them were on trial, but - there are two things going on here that I have issue with. One is, of course, the scapegoating of Loki once a-fucking-gain, but the other is that there's a legitimate problem inherent in framing the Avengers' deeds as The Right Thing So There Are No Consequences, especially because it directly leads to Loki (and only Loki) being scapegoated since, apparently, someone's got to answer for all of this.

Why Were The Avengers Supposed to Undo the Snap??

Of all the possible options they could have gone with (such as reversing time back to just before the Snap happened), going back through time to gather the stones and use them to undo things five years later is, like, one of the worst?? Best case scenario, it implies that the TVA is ridiculously incompetent in managing the sacred timeline and worst case scenario, it implies that the TVA is ridiculously adept in managing the sacred timeline, if their goal is to have it be the worst possible timeline anyone could end up in.

The Avengers may have done an arguably good thing in undoing the Snap - I don't disagree that those people should've lived - but they also royally fucked over a lot of things in the process and left Earth (and presumably many many other worlds) in total post-Snap chaos while fucking off to die be with their families and/or start new lives.

This goes back to the plan itself. One of my many issues with Endgame is that not only is the plan convoluted and, frankly, stupid, but also I have a real problem with the concept of the Avengers just saving the world as they see fit, regardless of whether or not that's actually the best thing to do. (If the Russos hadn't done such a shit job with explaining what the Accords were actually supposed to do, then maybe this could have been addressed somehow - like, okay, together we may have the brains and resources to carry off this plan but does that mean we're the ultimate authority on whether or not we should? Maybe we should check with, like, the UN or something about this? [and it’s entirely possible the UN was mentioned and I have forgotten it bc I’ll be honest, I watched Endgame once and have bitched about it ever since.] I digress.)

The narrative in Endgame and into the MCU beyond plays like the Avengers only care about saving the world when they stand to personally gain from it (they want their friends and family back, they want to feel like they didn't fail, they have unilaterally decided that what they want is the Best Thing for everyone) and once the Good Deed is done and the smoke clears from the battlefield, there's no concern with saving the mess of the world they created.

TFatWS addressed so many of the problems with the post-reverse-Snap, which implies that the MCU (both in-universe and out) is aware that things are fucked up now. People's lives were literally ruined by what the Avengers did. Refugees are displaced. Humans are coming back to a world where they've been dead for five years and their loved ones have moved on and their homes have been sold and their bank accounts have been closed and they have no jobs. And that’s just on Earth. Yet no one (again, both in-universe and out) feels the need to hold the Avengers accountable for any of this.

Plus, what about the people who died as a result of the Snap but not from the Snap directly? What about the planes that fell from the sky when the pilots turned to dust? The cars that crashed and collided when the drivers poofed? Etc. Like, fuck all of those people I guess?

And who, exactly, is "supposed to" clean up the Avengers' mess now that the actual Avengers are either dead, old and living on the moon, or retired? Is it on Sam's shoulders alone (or, rather, Sam and Bucky's)? Is Peter Parker (yknow, the 15 year old Nick Fury went and recruited bc there was no one else) supposed to be fixing things?

The TVA takes responsibility for none of this. They sit back in their nightmare DMV-esque office and claim that all is as it should be but my question remains: please explain to me how the outcome of the post-Snap universe is ultimately satisfactory to anyone besides the Avengers?

There's also the fact that Loki figures out right away that the Avengers were engaging in some time travel shenanigans ("the cologne of two Tony Starks is hard to miss” lmfao Loki you snarky shit). Loki recognizes that there's been an opportunity created of which he can take advantage, but he isn't responsible for creating it. The Avengers messed up and created that opportunity so, even if they were supposed to be doing what they were doing, there are still no consequences for the fact that they made a mistake that allowed Loki to then branch off and create a new timeline.

Let's also say that we accept that the Avengers were supposed to undo the Snap exactly as they did. Okay, sure. BUT:

- Was Steve, then, also supposed to decide to fuck back off to the 1940s and marry Peggy (which created two Steves, right? The one who was married to Peggy all along and the one who was in the ice?? The TVA is just okay with two Steves?)?

- What is the actual point of Stephen Strange having the time stone and using the time stone both to gain the advantage over Darmammushumuuyourmom (I’m sorry, I can’t remember his real name) and to look at all the possible timelines to figure out how to defeat Thanos?

- How is it possible that there are 14 million potential timelines in which the Avengers failed if the TVA’s entire thing is that there can only be one true ring timeline to rule them all? The fact that Stephen can look ahead and determine so many outcomes based on the choices they're making would mean that people do have free will and that their actions aren't automatically dictated by what's “supposed to” happen. They had to make the right choices in order to get to the one timeline in which Thanos failed.

- What’s the point of Stephen having to protect the time stone, anyway, if there are presumably a few others in Casey’s drawer?

- On that note, if there are a lot of infinity stones hanging around in the TVA’s desk drawers, what makes the original six the specific, correct ones that Thanos had to collect in order to pull off the Snap and why is it then those specific six the ones that the Avengers had permission to go back through time to get in order to undo the Snap as the Timekeepers intended?

- And actually, in fact, if there’s only one sacred timeline and anyone who fucks it up without permission gets “reset” (aka made nonexistent, along with their timeline branch) then, again, why does Stephen have to protect the time stone? Either anyone who steals it was supposed to, or their timeline gets eliminated and the theft ceases to matter.

- Less significant but also still kinda significant is how Agents of SHIELD figures into all of this. The TVA knows that Loki killed Coulson but they don't know (or don't care?) that Coulson was brought back to life and proceeded, with his team, to go on and get heavily involved in time travel and going back and forth and bringing people from the past into the present? So the TVA is okay with Daniel Sousa leaving his timeline but not with Loki leaving his?

... I have literally confused myself with all of this, so if anyone followed my train of thought here, congratulations and maybe you can explain it to me lmao.

But here's my ultimate point: the sacred timeline that the TVA is tasked with maintaining is not sensical or linear. It's full of gaps and holes and people taking matters into their own hands to determine both their own fates and the fates of others. As a result, a lot of people suffer kinda needlessly based on the events in said timeline, and apparently it's perfectly fine for all of this nonsense to occur so that everyone else has some element of control -

- but Loki is literally the only one who is told uh, actually, no, you are supposed to live a shitty life and die a pointless death and there's not a goddamn thing you can do about it bc it's supposed to happen.

What in the actual fuck kind of logic is that???

Thus, either the TVA (and the Timekeepers) are grossly incompetent, or else they're extremely competent and also really fucking shitty beings who just enjoy the needless suffering of others.

And somehow this is all Loki's fault!!

And then Mobius has the fucking audacity to say, to Loki's face, “you only exist to prop up everyone else and you, Loki Odinsonson Laufeyson mischief god and king of space lol, do not have any inherent worth or value as your own person. You were born to be a scapegoat and you will die a scapegoat and there's no getting around that, if we have anything to say about it.”

To quote Loki, in a very twisted way - yes, it's funny. It's absurd.

Does, uh, does this make sense? At some point I crossed over from meta-writing into straight up ranting and so, well, here we are.

#loki tv series spoilers #loki series spoilers #loki spoilers #loki series: glass half empty #loki series: glass half full #loki pokey artichokey #loki series meta #so. many. tags. ugh #i no longer know what my point was #i'm sorry #so it begins #the rambly nonsensical meta lmao #some of you tell me sometimes that you enjoy my meta and my takes and i just #i love you but srsly who is paying you bc #*waves helplessly at the above word vomit*#loki series negativity #not really negativity so much as criticism (that i think is valid) but yknow fandom #also i recognize all of this as issues that i - if no one else - have a problem with #but i still liked the show????#i am not hating at all #i am just acknowledging that this whole premise is fucked up and i'm not sure if it's supposed to be #or if the writers just don't realize all of the implications in their decisions #to be fair i'm sure that they're working with what they had - ie the original nonsensical endgame events #but is this really the *best* they could do? cause i beg to differ that they were written into this small of a corner #ANYWAY #i gotta go do some actual work now #tag rambles

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devilsskettle · 3 years ago

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hi @pedropascalvstimotheechalamet sorry for responding to you this way, this got too long to send via dm and it was easier to add the links this way, also hopefully other people might have some thoughts about this topic as well!

i might not be the best person to ask about this tbh, my base of knowledge and opinions are mainly around horror movies for one thing and i know there’s been a lot of criticisms of this phenomenon from other genres, like superhero and action movies where there’s the Strong Female Character trope where people try to write feminist characters but end up making them empty, unrealistic characters with no flaws or characteristics other than being “strong” (in action movies, typically physically strong/good at fighting) and a lot of times they still end up being sexualized or objectified (like black widow in the mcu, especially when she’s first introduced. she’s a “role model” because she can fight but she has no personality, she’s a plot device, and she’s hyper-sexualized for the male gaze). i don’t have any good sources for this though! i’ve just seen people talk about it on the internet lol. i can point you in the direction of some other posts on here either that i’ve posted or seen and agreed with but also i’m definitely not an expert, i just have strong opinions, they’re mainly based off my judgment of what i’ve seen other people say and my personal analysis of a lot of media, not on like peer reviewed academic sources for the most part. some of the things i can refer you to might only be tangentially related to this, tbh i remember the post you’re talking about but i can’t find it now lol so i hope i can point you in the direction of some opinions that will be interesting to you

that being said, one example is the autopsy of jane doe, i wrote about it a bit here and have some links to other people’s reviews (and why i think they’re not quite accurate lol but you can judge for yourself of course)

and the witch and midsommar are also movies that gets this “girl power” treatment and i simply think it’s insane to think either of those have happy endings or ultimately that the protagonists of either film end up in a good place so: 1 & 2

i would also suggest reading men, women, and chainsaws by carol clover for the original way she defines “final girl” characters, here’s the introduction to the most recent edition that talks about how that term gets used now and why it’s been sort of co-opted to have a “girl power” meaning when that’s not inherent to the phenomenon she’s discussing, the rest of the book goes into more detail but i think the intro gives you a pretty good idea

i’ve also talked about gone girl ad nauseum, there’s a lot out there looking at the reception of the book and film that wants to make the conflict very gendered, either absolving amy of all her faults or completely demonizing her when she’s a complex character and there are other issues in the book including class and race that end up getting overlooked in favor of talking about gender as men vs women which i think is overly simplistic and lends itself to gender essentialism and is also sexist in the way that gillian flynn as an author isn’t afforded the same complexity as comparable male authors (stephen king is terrible at writing women, some of his stories DO posit gender essentialist ideas of what it’s like to be a man, but if you criticize him for it people will shrug it off. but gillian flynn is a misandrist for writing characters like amy and nick dunne! when she’s just writing complex unlikable interesting characters lol it has way less to do with gender than people make it out to be) and also it affords her female characters less humanity than male characters. anyway here’s some things i said about it before so i’m not just ranting at you lol: 1

and how i think other stories avoid “girl boss-ing” their female characters: 1 & 2

and some other things people have said about it: 1, 2, & 3

and what gillian flynn herself has said about writing women

here’s some refs for women in horror more generally, i don’t know if any of it will be of interest to you but it may be

so yeah those are some things i can think of off the top of my head, if anyone else has any thoughts or resources about “girl boss” or the “strong female character” trope, please feel free to chime in!

#i don’t mean to sound so self absorbed about my own opinions but hey i’ve got some thoughts about that lol #i hope some of this is what you were looking for #also if you want me to take this post down i can try to dm this to you in smaller parts this just seemed more efficient

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parkers-gal · 3 years ago

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oh my god ok- I agree with you in that homecoming was better than far from home, I think over all just the little mannerisms and lines peter had were more true to his character, and I liked the portrayal of all the characters at that- like....it had RDJ and Michael Keaton, who I’d rather see as side characters in comparison to Jake Gyllenhaal... which I know may be an unpopular opinion, particularly in the eyes of gyllenhaal stans. But other than that, the plot line was a little more cohesive in my opinion. I just remember coming out of Far From home in theaters with family and friends and we were all like, wtf? Drones? Holograms? Making waves? Fake elemental monsters? The plot line felt a little stretched. (Although the effects were great, I just think fake monsters are a little hard to convey to an audience in general.) And it felt like it was more suited for a teen audience if that makes sense. I know the characters are awkward and all but some parts felt like a kids movie. But going off that, if I were to have a sleepover or hangout per say- I’d choose far from home to watch out of the two- because it is fun, and enjoyable to watch with friends. But my own personal preference is Homecoming, and I downloaded it to watch at any time. I also remember sitting with my dad to watch far from home one night and him saying, nope couldn’t really watch that again, but he’s seen the first multiple times. Anyway sorry for a little rant but that’s my view on the subject. But seriously though- What was the water monster in Venice? Prior to Mysterio getting the stark drones? Maybe I’m not throughly educated on the details. AND IM SORRY THIS IS A REAL MOUTH-FULL!

i totally agree. homecoming overall just feels SO peter parker, and the way the plot flowed was so much smoother and well fitted for all kinds of audiences? yk? we had some tony stark / avengers themes for the mcu fans, but then we had the typical spiderman traits for og fans.

for ffh, i feel like they approached a mature plot for a younger audience (like, frozen 2). you'd really need to pay attention to understand it because they didn't leave room for scenes that build the plot — everything was sorta just essential to understand the plot. that's kinda what makes it a bit of a turn off, because you can't enjoy the movie without watching it a few times.

also the drones aren't mr. stark's, the computer program (barf) is. the drones and holograms were always part of mysterios plan just so he could gain the trust of nick fury + peter.

i feel like with homecoming, it was SO cool the way they took like, the old plot and put it in a new setting. like the enemy is the girlfriend's dad? GENIUS. it's osborn corps all over again

and sure, ffh might be more fun to watch with friends and family, and it's nice for action and stuff, but it feels so unnatural? idk something about throwing peter in europe for a random summer trip with the girl he likes lol. I JUST WISH THEY BUILT THE PINING MORE DONT COME FOR ME

#inbox #ask #anon #answer #nonnie #keo's inbox

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americashielded-a · 3 years ago

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Hey I bet you missed my OOC MCU rants. What’s that? You didn’t? Too bad I’m on another one anyway.

Okay but seriously setting any romantic ships and stuff aside can we just talk about this scene for a minute and why I think Steve and Nat’s friendship is probably the most important character relationship Nat has in the entire MCU, or at least the one that makes her grow the most as a person?

youtube

I’m still a bit upset they cut out the bit with her talking about finding her biological parents’ gravestones because I guess they wanted to save that mom mystery (that really didn’t amount to much in the end) for the Black Widow movie, but that aside, there’s so much important about this scene that speaks volumes about how far they’ve come and how close they are now.

Literally the only other member of The Avengers that was there was Sam, and I mean, of course he was, he’s Steve’s best pal and is only hanging around because of him, not to mention he’s not going to sign the Accords, but no matter how good friends he is with anyone else, literally nobody else goes to the funeral...except for Nat, and yes, she only shows up after Peggy’s funeral is done, but the fact that she was there to begin with says a lot, especially when it’s to talk to Steve. It was hard enough for her to watch Nick “die” (I never believed they actually killed him in TWS for a second tbh), but going to the funeral of someone she didn’t really know and without anyone else going with her? Even if you consider Peggy founded SHIELD, that actually would’ve made it harder for her because of the stuff that happened in TWS and what SHIELD meant to Nat. No, she wouldn’t normally go anywhere near that.

But just the fact that she knew what Steve was going through and couldn’t let him be alone, even being aware he wouldn’t change his mind on the accords even though she was going ask him one more time, and that she hugs and consoles Steve, and shows some of her own vulnerability at the same time...even if The Avengers are her family, she’d almost never show that sort of vulnerability to anyone else (and have it feel in character for her *coughAoUcough*) except maybe Clint and I just love this sort of growth for her, and this leading to her choosing her loyalty over the mission at the airport later on. Nat having this sort of connection with someone and trusting them this much is so rare for her, especially with the stuff she’s been through before, and that it means enough to her that she would let him and Bucky escape says so much about how close they are and just how much she values Steve.

And again, going back to the deleted part of that scene where she talks about going back home and finding her parents’ graves to make a point about being lucky to have what you do when you do have it, just to comfort him and sympathize with him on a level she’d probably be hesitant at the very least about letting almost anyone else see (except Clint, obviously) just displays how she’s changed as a character and how his friendship has left a big impact on her.

Also, I feel like without this moment and this friendship, some of Black Widow might not have happened, or at least, she wouldn’t have been as willing to let her first ‘family’ in so close again after so much time. I really feel like she needed someone like Steve to draw out that side of her and help her feel like she could leave all that red in her leger behind.

The only reason I’m not talking much about Steve here is because I’ve already ranted about how she’s had a major impact on him before, and I’d like to keep this wall of text fairly small, if that’s what you can call this :’D Anyway that’s all for now.

#~I'm Always Honest~ ;; OOC

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quu-kii · 5 years ago

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Jake Gyllenhaal Filmography Ranking

My personal ranking of all Jake Gyllenhaal movies from October Sky onwards with some brief thoughts on each of the movies. Honestly the exact number ranking of these movies is probably not super accurate and could be liable to changes, but I tried my best with the ordering.

Amazing Tier (My favorites)

1. Brokeback Mountain - This is such an emotional and heartbreaking movie. I knew it was going to have a sad ending going into it, but still I was not prepared for how strongly it hit me in the feels. And it’s not just the ending that is sad; you can tell that the love between the two leads is doomed from less than the midpoint of the movie, and it keeps going downhill from there. Overall, I think the movie is a perfect tragic love story. As well, there’s this very subtle and natural feeling to the whole movie that is difficult to describe but works really well. There’s just something truly special about this movie that makes me want to place it as the #1 best of Jake’s movies.

2. Nightcrawler - A highly suspenseful movie with an amazing lead performance by Jake as the sociopathic lead character Lou Bloom. Jake is really a big part of what makes the movie great, as he is such a strong focus of it. Lou acts so off, but it’s just impossible to take your eyes off him, and he is so interesting to watch since you keep wondering what he will do next. The other part of what makes this movie great is the writing and dialogue. There are just so many memorable and great lines, especially for Lou. Along with these factors, the subject matter of the movie, that of the career of selling violent news footage to news stations, is pretty unique, and there are some interesting ideas and themes in the movie as well relating to success and the news media. Overall I really love this movie. If there’s one thing I would say I might not like about the movie, it is the music. It can have an uplifting and hopeful vibe in dark scenes, which lessens the tense mood of some scenes. But I understand that the music was made to reflect Lou’s mood in the scene, which is a very interesting decision in itself and helps add to Lou’s character, since you can notice the contrast between how disturbing the scenarios he is in are and how Lou himself feels in such scenarios. So I at least admire the music for this aspect.

3. Enemy - A tense and psychological movie. I really love the heavy and surreal atmosphere of this movie, added to by the yellowish filter which is present throughout the whole movie as well as the score, which is ominous and used to amazing effect in the movie to enhance the dark mood. Also, I think this movie is both enjoyable when taken in at face value, being about a man who finds that there is a doppelganger of himself, and when looking deeper at what the “real” story is, taking into account the symbolism and various small details placed throughout the movie. It’s an interesting movie to think about due to its openness to interpretation. And lastly, Jake does a great job playing the two lead characters in the movie; despite the characters looking the same, they give off quite a very different vibe.

4. Spider-Man: Far from Home - My favorite MCU movie. I love so many things about this movie: how it deals with the aftermath of the Blip in a light way, how it deals with Peter Parker’s character after Endgame and his desire to just be able to have a normal life, the overall story, the setting being Europe and having this fresh vacation feeling, the fight scenes, and of course Mysterio. Along with this, it has great music (especially Mysterio’s theme) and probably the best mid credits and post credits scenes in the MCU due to their plot relevance. All of the characters are very likeable too, from Peter and all his classmates and teachers to others like Nick Fury and Mysterio, which is important to me since likable characters is one of the most important aspects to me in any kind of story. This movie was such a pleasant surprise after Endgame, which was a great disappointment to me. Also, this movie is special to me because it’s how I discovered the awesomeness of Jake and thus indirectly the reason why I watched all his movies and made this list in the first place. I’m not sure if a future MCU movie can top this for me, but who knows.

Great Tier

5. Nocturnal Animals - A harsh movie with an interesting structure of having two main stories, with one of the stories being a story within the main story (I will call this story the 2nd story for brevity). I think the 2nd story is where the movie really shines. This story was so tense and much more interesting to follow compared to the main story, and Jake portrayed the emotions of anguish and despair so well in it. It’s also interesting to think about how the 2nd story links with the main story, which gives more depth to the overall story of the movie. I find this and Brokeback Mountain to be the most emotionally harrowing of Jake’s movies, which is definitely a compliment since I admire when a work is able to make me feel so strongly. Also, I have to note that I disliked that there was a random jumpscare in the middle of the movie. It doesn’t lower my opinion of the movie, but I really don’t like jumpscares and did not expect one in this movie.

6. Source Code - A really solid sci-fi movie about Jake’s character repeating through a time loop. It is the only Jake movie to make me cry due to me being a sucker for tragic scenarios involving time loops/parallel worlds. It was just a very engaging movie to watch due to the intriguing premise and the very good execution of said premise.

7. Zodiac - I didn’t know that this movie was based off true events until almost the end of it. So the whole time, I was expecting there to be a conclusive ending when there was no way this would be the case, since the Zodiac killer case to this day hasn’t been solved. Because of this, I felt initially disappointed about this movie from a story perspective, since all the clues from the movie seemed to lead to nothing. This is my biggest “flaw” about the movie (and it’s not really the movie’s fault), but this factor aside I really liked this movie. Jake, RDJ, and Mark Ruffalo are all great in it, and I love murder mysteries so much, so the story had me hooked on this alone. It’s so interesting to watch the characters piece together clues for the case and try to unravel the mystery, as well as seeing how the case progresses (or well, doesn’t progress at times) over the years. Also, this movie just feels really good to watch; as in, the scenes and shots flow together so well. It’s a great movie overall I think.

8. The Sisters Brothers - A western with a kind of laid back feel to it. Also supposedly it is a comedy, but I found it not funny at all. It’s not that I see the movie attempting jokes and find that they don’t work; it’s more like I don’t see the attempt at humor at all, unless maybe it’s kind of a weird dark humor thing. Anyways, I really like this movie, and it’s mostly because I really like the main four characters and their dynamics with each other. Jake does a great job playing his character John Morris and has an accent which is pleasant to my ears, though I was sad that he (as well as Riz Ahmed) wasn’t in the movie more. Even though I was watching the movie for Jake, I found myself liking John C. Reilly’s and Joaquin Phoenix’s characters, the two leads, a lot as well. It’s a movie that shines because of the characters for me.

Very Good Tier

9. Donnie Darko - A pretty unique coming of age story with sci-fi elements. I’m still not sure what to think of this movie, though I think I liked it. Some of my favorite scenes are where Donnie goes off on these rants about what he believes to be the truth. These scenes are amazing to me.

10. Prisoners - I actually find the story of this movie to be not that great. However, what elevates the movie is Hugh Jackman and Jake and their amazing performances. Funnily enough, I found myself siding with Hugh’s character and against Jake’s as they both simultaneously tried to solve the case. Also, this movie is just really exciting and engaging to watch and is maybe one of the easiest to recommend movies on this list due to these factors.

11. The Day After Tomorrow - This isn’t a very deep movie or anything, but it’s a really solid disaster flick in my opinion. I love the visuals, and Jake is such a cutie in this movie, a factor that really elevates it for me.

12. The Good Girl - It looked like a comedy or something from the outside, but actually this is a rather bleak movie. It’s one of the duology of the Jake-being-into-older-married-women movies (and the much better of the two for me). I find this movie pretty underrated.

13. October Sky - It’s an uplifting and inspiring movie, and I love how Homer’s relationship with his father is portrayed here.

14. Okja - I love the stylized vibe of this movie. Jake isn’t in the movie that much, but I really like every time he shows up. He goes full wacky here and it’s fun to watch.

15. Brothers - Tobey Maguire is the real star here. I think he was great in the movie and I could really feel the emotions of his character, especially after he comes back from the war and is in a troubled state of mind.

16. Stronger - A good based on real life movie about a survivor of the Boston Marathon Bombing. Jake does a great job as usual, and I think the emotions of the story came through well.

17. Wildlife - A really simple and subdued story about a family, but I think it works well in the movie. It has a very quiet and natural feeling to it.

Ok Tier

18. Demolition - A quirky feeling movie about a guy trying to deal with the death of his wife. The scene with Jake dancing in the city is my favorite part. Also I thought Jake��s friendship with the kid in the movie was a highlight.

19. Bubble Boy - It's kind of a dumb movie with some maybe offensive humor, but I thought it was pretty enjoyable regardless. Jake is so adorable as the main character Jimmy, and it was fun to follow his journey across the country and seeing all the interesting characters he meets.

20. Proof - I thought it was pretty good, but then the movie ended just when I thought it was starting to ramp up the story to the conclusion. This factor brought the movie down for me.

21. Life - The monster design for this movie was pretty cool, and I liked the ending and the general space horror vibe. However, I didn’t feel much for any of the characters.

22. Everest - It was ok, but I wasn’t really into any of the characters here.

23. Southpaw - I think this movie is very impressive for Jake’s resume, considering how he trained a lot and learned boxing for it. However as a movie itself, I didn’t really feel much for it and felt like it wasn’t doing much special in the story department. I liked some of the parts in the earlier half though.

24. End of Watch - I just wasn’t feeling this movie. Maybe it was the found footage style or something. I feel a bit sad about not digging this movie since I see it is generally one of the more well liked ones in Jake’s filmography.

25. Jarhead - I really don’t like the vulgar tone throughout this movie, but I do like the general story and message. Also the movie looks really good.

Not That Great Tier

26. Velvet Buzzsaw - I love Jake’s character Morf so much as well as the general premise. However the movie itself wasn’t too great: I found most of the characters besides Jake’s to be unlikable, and also the movie felt cheap. It’s very disappointing since the concept for the movie (horror in an art gallery) seems so promising.

27. Prince of Persia - This was the first Jake movie I saw back in the day around the time of its theater release. I have to say I find this to be Jake’s weakest acting performance out of all his movies. For me, good acting is when the actor feels very natural as the character and is somehow magnetizing to watch. But for some reason I did not get a very natural vibe from Jake as Dastan in this movie. I do think he looks very beautiful in this movie though with his long hair, so that’s a big plus. The story of this movie feels pretty cliché and kind of lifeless in a way, but I still liked it alright.

28. Highway - I don’t really like the sleazy tone of this movie. However, I think Jake is very adorable in this movie and has this pure wide-eyed vibe about him (despite him being a drug dealer and sleeping with prostitutes and such).

29. Rendition - I found this movie to be aggressively boring for the most part. There’s this subplot which I was unsure why I should even care about until a reveal near the end of the movie, when it was too late to start caring at all. However Jake in a bloody shirt towards the beginning of the movie makes for some good screencaps and gifs, and I learned about the term extraordinary rendition through searching about it after the movie.

30. Moonlight Mile - I guess this movie might be considered technically good because it tells the story it sets out to do fairly well, but I just found it very boring. There is a part towards the end with Jake’s character being very emotional which I really liked.

31. Lovely & Amazing - It's actually decent, but really not my type of movie. It’s the 2nd of the duology of the Jake-being-into-older-married-women movies.

Just No Tier

32. Accidental Love - I actually enjoyed the beginning parts of this movie (though what’s with the constant dutch angles in the earlier parts?), and ironically it is around the point of the introduction of Jake’s character where I felt like it started to nosedive. I felt my soul slipping away and my IQ dropping by the end of the movie.

33. Love & Other Drugs – I really, really don’t like this kind of raunchy sex comedy movie. That’s all.

#jake gyllenhaal #text #brokeback mountain #nightcrawler #enemy #spiderman far from home #nocturnal animals #source code #zodiac #the sisters brothers #donnie darko #prisoners

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dabatcavebyhonie · 5 years ago

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Marvel's Runaways- an example of a BAD idea

So imagine you wanted to a great comic book show. You buy a great cheap comic so you break the bank. But then you feel the pressure to have your loved characters appeal to a more modern audience. But there is a rift between the movie universe and the TV universe. So now you are left with a half baked story filled with holes and it is almost unrecognizable to the comics. Let us also not forget their horrible idea of re-writing the perspectives for the mass audiences. This is how you get the "cringy" monster that is the Hulu's adaptation of Runaways.

The first thing you must understand before tackling Runaways is that this Marvel property is heavily ingrained into the Marvel universe. In fact, one character from the comic book cast is the son of Ultron. Ultron, who MCU wrote off as someone short series of events. Then that means that most of the events that occur in the comics become void. This leads to a rewriting of the events that occur in the TV show.

I broke the aspects of this ongoing show into three parts : Angst- the teen and the parent, stereotypes- I promise we're different, dialogue- Who am I?

“I had choosen the path of the black sheep rather than that of the unicorns and puppies.”

― Magenta Periwinkle, Cutting Class

Angst- The teen and the parent

When you are first introduced to the nouveau-rich families of PRIDE you see parents with a wide range of jobs. This includes tech mongers, bio-chemists, and even spiritual leaders. By each family you see various color schemes graced across the screen. I assumed this TV show would be promising. Until you meet the children. I first became frustrated by the dynamics of the children. They're all stereotypes written out of a high school rom-com. At least for shows that Have stereotypes like Daria you understand they're there to be unrealistic and mellow-dramatic. However this idea isn't valid for Runaways. The show is supposed to be relatable and fanciful at the same time. They're also not stereotypes in the graphic novel they're just themselves. This adds angst to the angst . Which this edgy behavior is supposed to replace the depth in their character. Take the biggest example of this: Nico. Her stereotype is that she's a goth so she's mean and does witchcraft and always cries about dead sister. Then in the later seasons she's hopelessly devoted to Karolina and this is supposed to add depth to her one dimensional personality.Her senitive love for Karolina is supposed to add depth- I just...No,no, no, UGH, Stop, please. I can't with her. The big thing that makes her DEEP is that she's actually sensitive and gay. They use queer-bating to have her be more appealing. Then her stereotypical goth-ness solidifies the Goth norm-perception, it says,"Yes all goths are this way. They're all tortured and filled with teenage melodramatic behavior.".Her Wicca worship is another Goth stereotype. As a goth myself I do not condone the stereotypes that aren't accurate. I wish her character was more inspired like Abby from NCIS. The actor wantesd the character to be more authentic and not just a stereotype like numerous other shows have. Just no. Every time she slams her door a front of her mother's face or steals her mother's staff I'm just dumbfounded.

Karolina is the church girl stereotype. She waltzes across your screen in all white and reads Her bible-I-mean-her-religious-texts-that-don't-sound-like-Christianity-at-all. Then when she's tempted by the flesh of the witch! Oh no will they, Won't they? Spoiler alert: They will as we assumed with horrible LGBTQ+ characters as always. Her depth is her love for Nico. To the amount that her dreams while she's trapped in the first two episiodes of season three was her wedding with Nico. Granted it was goregous but her love is her character depth which is dissapointing since their relationship ends in season three. They're both always moody and mad at each other but it's fine they love each other even though they only give each other a few pecks once in a while. Like don't make the mass audience mad cause we can't have too much gay! HAHA! For me it's less for the LGBTQ+ masses or to show representation it's written to sound and look pretty for the male gaze but hey!

That's just me spreading my SJW bias like Gert does 24/4! Like is there an off button. Introducing the liberal complete with crippling anxiety and even "NO! I can't love a Lacrosse Jock! I hate the Patriarchy!". While no one shows up for her rally or her bakes sales she crushes over Chase who is rude to her. My father being heavily left-leaning said "Gert needs to go. Like she doesn't stop talking and ruins the show!". Like when I told him I was watching the new season he frantically asked why and asked if I was okay.

I'm getting off track. Anyway, The point is the only ones that love their family to start is Molly, Gertrude and Chase. But don't worry the only one that still loves her parents after is Molly (in some twisted way I guess Karolina.....ehhh). After seeing their parents kill a kid and shove them into a magical space tube instead of calling the police or rationally acting. They gain this amazing attribute called teenage angst. Except for Molly cause she doesn't get it. Granted the first season isn't that bad but the show only gets worse the farther you go into it. I especially have been carrying a special amount of disdain for season two. But I think that maybe the new season has promise since the teenage angst doesn't smell as bad so far but I'll give you guys an update on Tumblr. What was I saying ...So if you don't understand what I mean by the heavy angst take a new scene from season three when Dale (her dad) Has Gert hostage in their cottage. She goes on numerous rants on How much she hates him when like a year ago she was being somewhat rational by trying to think before she shouts and finger wag at her parents but now-speak your mind child! I find the teen vs. parent atmosphere.

However This idea of teenage angst isn't unrealistic. But how general it is over every character is what makes the angst unrealistic. The original hesitation of Gert makes it feel more natural. Karolina's almost disregard to what they saw originally felt more real. The small responses from characters separates their personalities and makes season one much more entertaining.

Stereotypes- I promise we're different

Now that you understand the edgy personality of the show as a whole let's move on to the content. You're introduced to a runaway teenager named Destiny she's mugged but "rescued" by the Church of Gibborim. Little do we realize these muggers were trying to save her. Six months later we're introduced to Alex Wilder, a stereotypical nerd, who loves coding. Nico Minoru the person Alex has a crush; her sister died who was Alex's best friend, so now Nico's a goth. Okay, that's a lot. You then meet Gert, Chase and, Molly. Molly is younger then everyone else so she is disregarded when she tells everyone to become friends. Chase is a lacrosse jock but he's different cause he's smart I guess. Chase loves his family but his dad is emotionally abusive to him and his mom. It gives Chase a leader mentality and he tends to think he knows the right answer.

Gert is a social justice warrior who tries to make her school a better place. But she's different cause she has anxiety. Tell me if my point isn't getting across, tell me. This show's "thing" is that everyone's a stereotypes but, they're different, I guess;Which would usually be fine if it wasn't apart of such a big intellectual property: Marvel. Granted when it comes to movies and TV I never said Marvel story-lines were ever complex but the shows always Go outside the prior assumptions, it's not all stereotypes.

Take for instance, Agents of Shield. Take Coulson who literally was resurrected fro the dead. He is hard and stern like he was depicted in the movies but we learn about his strife and how he worked alongside Nick to build S.H.I.E.L.D. to what it is. He has control issues so he has to adopt the mindset that Nick has. It's new and interesting to the MCU audience. Melinda May, is an Ace pilot and personally my favorite simply due to her character writing. Her divide between her reputation versus who she is. She's known as " The Calvary" after all. She has trauma from a mission that killed a civilian which leaves her emotionally scared. This isn't a new concept but seeing her grow and becoming better emotionally gives the audience connections to the characters.

Every character is written with steady care and good character writing. We feel sad When Coulson dies yet again. We feel the inner turmoil Skye and May feel. The connection isn't there in these hollow stereotypes. The connection to the audience in Runaways is what's making the show stale. The TV show characters are pale imitations of the comic book characters. It's hurts the show in the long run.

dialogue-Who am I?

The most important thing that makes this show salvageable is the dialogue. No, I don't only mean the words coming out their mouths but the story-line that's surprisingly controlled by the parents. The superficial cold teenagers that only show disdain towards their parents and easily toppled by their Parents beckoning and call. For instance in season 2, Chase betrays his whole team to have his family back after his dad dies. He thinks they'll lose so quickly when he's left alone with them. You see their guard come down so quickly around their providers. Yet they can never forgive them. This is obvious in Alex's case. His hatred towards his parents lead him to the arms of his father's enemy become's angry when his mother retaliates and kills Darius, but is vexed when his father is calling him. Responds just by his mother threatens him from jail in season three. Why does Nico stop to talk to her Dad in season three, episode "Lord of Lies". I'm going to keep watching just because of the dynamic of the kids and parents. Especially as the parents are inhabited by parasitic aliens it's changes this complex dynamic yet again. Along with Nico's inner turmoil involving her magic and the forces that are utilized with her staff headlines the dialogue and plot I love so much. I will continue to watch as this tale unfolds.

Conclusion: This show is complex recycling heap. I find it hard to watch and a grotesque figure I can't move away from. I find it a good surface level adaptation. I find it messy but it's not entirely predictable! I appreciate how invested the actors are in their characters! I hope to continue watching the show to see how the plot moves.

#marvel #runaways #review #nico minoru #agents of shield

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atamascolily · 6 years ago

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This article does a nice job of summing up my issues with the MCU’s treatment of Black Widow, while including a few indignities I didn’t know about, such as yet another reason to be pissed at Joss Whedon. Avengers: Endgame spoilers abound, of course, so tread lightly if that’s important to you.

Anyway, I’m too keyed up for a long rant, but suffice to say:

As much as I hate the fact we haven’t had a Black Widow solo movie yet, it may be for the best that it’s happening now, given Marvel’s track record with the character.

Thank goodness it’s being directed by a woman.

Thank goodness there’s a female antagonist.

You know what? Aside from Nick Fury and maybe Phil Coulson if it’s a prequel, I really don’t want to see any other male characters in this film, just awesome women being awesome without being sexualized or infantilized. Fuck that shit.

In conclusion:

#mcu #natasha romanoff #black widow #black widow film #my mcu movie wish list

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slytherinfinity · 6 years ago

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ENDGAME SPOILERS!!

Okay I saw Endgame last night and I need to vent... AHHHHHH!!! haha I have so many mixed emotions and I don’t even know. Also I typed this on mobile so sorry for any typos.

So I first saw Iron Man when I was 11, and it was so cool. I grew up watching all of these movies. At first, Cap was my favorite bc he was ~cute~ and I was a young teen girl and so were all my friends. I also loved Loki for this reason haha. Then I saw Iron Man 3 and LOVED IT. I bought it on DVD as soon as it came out. Tony Stark was amazing, but also he dealt with anxiety and panic attacks? His and Pepper’s relationship was everything as well, and also his and Happy’s and Rhodey’s friendships. Tony felt real and human and relatable, and it was cool he was able to overcome so much even with all of his trauma. In AOU he just wanted to protect his team, and no one truly listened to or respected him or tried to understand him, and he ended up with more trauma and guilt. I just wanted him to have a happy ending. Then he met Peter and it brought me hope, after all the Civil War crap. Infinity War was crushing but not completely because I knew another movie was coming out, so there was still some hope. But then Endgame. Honestly... I’m still processing, but I don’t think I’m happy with it. And for more reasons than just Tony, though I’ll talk about that first. His storyline just seemed... blah. He gets back, gets to yell at Steve, and then goes and lives in seclusion with Pepper and has a kid. Yet you know that even with that life he’s still depressed and guilt-ridden. It’s how Pepper knows he won’t stop. So he does his best to help, time travels or whatever (honestly that whole part is still kinda confusing to me- it created alternate timelines, but what are the implications of that- and also for the rest of the MCU??) and then Tony comes back and it looks like they’ve succeeded. I was expecting him to notice something off about Nebula, tbh. But anyway, final battle, and we all know what happens. He makes the sacrifice play. He dies. Pepper says it’s okay, but I just can’t agree. He already made the sacrifice play in the first movie. I think it should have been Steve or someone else in this one to do it. If all Tony’s pain and trauma has been building to this- I just feel empty inside. It’s not a satisfying end. Sure, he saved the universe, but I feel like Strange literally could have like left a message saying don’t send Nebula to the past and all of that would have been avoided. It felt so pointless. They’d already won. Tony also only got to reunite with Peter for like 30 mins, which is lame, and will bring a whole lot more trauma to him. He didn’t even get to see Morgan again. Ughhh I’m just annoyed. And then Steve?? He just goes to live in the past?? The whole movie he’s been saying he doesn’t move on, and then he literally never does, he never grows from there. He doesn’t really develop at all. It’s true- he never truly moved on from the past, and so that means... he’ll just go live there??? I think a better move would be to have him grow to accept his life and try to be happy and actually move on. Or, like I said earlier, he could have realized he can’t move on and made that sacrifice play himself in order to allow others to live and move on. I think that would have been a more satisfying arc to his story. And it would show the love he actually has for Tony- to allow Tony to live with his family and show that he heard and understood what Tony said at the beginning of the movie. (Also, they never had a real conversation where they made up. It was like they kind had that “do you trust me” moment but Steve never truly apologized and I feel like we got jipped out of a good heartfelt moment between those two.) Also- the Natasha sacrifice was sad, but I’m not totally surprised by it. It feels like a very her thing to do, to save her family and Clint’s. But then after everyone got mad and had a quick moment of silence, it was kind of forgotten?? Like they could have even had a memorial or small tribute at Ton’s funeral or elsewhere but like put something in?? It feels like she was just kind of brushed aside. (Also- I didn’t like BruceNat at first but grew to be okay with it, but then it never became anything? Bruce made himself into Professor Hulk and there was no real closure or conversation between him and Natasha? So like... what. was. the. point???) Again, everything with her just wasn’t that satisfying, but it’s something I may grow to view differently. I did enjoy Clint’s arc and I actually think they did a great job with him. Probably the strongest arc of the movie, actually. The way they handled Thor kind of annoyed me. I think it’s perfectly understandable that he would end up like that. He’s lost his family and most of his kingdom, and he feels responsible. I don’t have a problem with that. I have a problem with how the movie and the characters responded to that. Judgmental looks and jokes... like I’ll be honest, I did chuckle at Rhodey’s Cheez Whiz joke, but now I regret that. Like being fat is funny, haha look at Thor, he’s out of shape! Uhh yeah he’s depressed! And Rhodey should know better, being friends with Tony, he should know how to handle anxiety and depression. Nobody was really trying to help or even talk to Thor much, they really just wanted him to help them. Like he was clearly struggling, and yet that was used as a joke... it makes me sad. And also Thor never even looked back at Loki? The convo with his mom was nice though. But that reminds me? Was Loki’s infinity war death actually real then? Bc ugh. I’d be more willing to accept him being permanently dead if it wasn’t in such a lame way. Daggers, seriously?? Loki has freakin magic, and he’s smart!! He could have duplicated himself or something, and that type of lame death is so unsatisfying. Also. Captain. Freaking. Marvel. I went to the movie in a Captain Marvel T-Shirt, hers is one of the first actual comics I read, and I loved her movie. I was soooo excited to see her in this movie and become part of the team and to have some really fun banter with everyone. But then she just... disappears for basically the whole movie and hardly speaks at all (thinking about it- I think all the female characters speaking overall was wayyy low compared to mens which is sad) and she blows up the big ship at the end and that’s basically it. She didn’t really join the team, and she could have been so helpful! You’re telling me they didn’t make a way to communicate with her and they didn’t want to include her in their time travel adventures?? She could have had a funny interaction with Nick in 2012, or stopped Nebula from getting taken in 2014, or helped out more overall, idk. But she should have been a bigger part of the team. They hyped her up so much when she was hardly in the movie at all, which was extremely disappointing. Like I feel so cheated about this. This is something I’ll probably be bitter about for a while tbh... ugh she’s a queen and deserves so much more haha. Also Okoye and Wong would have been useful assets for the time travel and yet they were hardly in the movie at all? So many underutilized characters smh.... (Also I know this would be impossible and the point of the movie is for the main Marvel characters but you’re telling me that in 5 years, there was no random like French or Chinese or any other country’s scientist that could have developed time travel or another method of reversing the snap? Or someone from one of the bazillion planets out there? Like there have to have been other smart people/aliens who went all Liam Neeson after the snap and were out for revenge and solutions and they could have come up with something in those five years. But again, I know that wouldn’t work for the movie...) I just feel that a conclusion to the first real era and characters of Marvel should be more satisfying. But that’s just me, I know there are people who are plenty happy with it, and I think that’s valid. These are just my thoughts. Also, that was a long rant but I don’t want to be completely negative. Here’s some things I did enjoy. -Clint’s arc. Again, I felt it was really strong and emotional and hit all the right notes. They did a good job with him and I’m glad he got to go back to his family. -Nebula. She’s grown so much y’all. I do wish she got the final blow on Thanos, and that she clicked the button to go to the present faster so Thanos couldn’t come after them, but other than that I thought her storyline was great. She’s awesome. -That moment with all the female characters after Peter got hurt. I cheered. Marvel has so many amazing women and it was great to see them all together. I kinda wish they were given more lines and screen time though but this moment was super cool. -Morgan was adorable and I love her. -Pepper’s understanding of Tony was also great. She knew he needed to do something if he could, especially for Peter, she’s grown so much and she loves her mans I love her. -Almost the whole 2012 time travel thing was great. Some good humor and nostalgia, it was fun, I really liked it. The Loki alternate timeline would be cool to explore and I wonder if that’s what the show will be about. -Wanda had a great moment against Thanos. -Okay, while I do think that whole final battle was ultimately pointless and could have easily been avoided, the moment when T’Challa and the Guardians and everyone came in through the portals was amazingly epic and beautiful and powerful. The audience cheered and I did too. It was a cool scene. -Tony and Nebula in the ship at the beginning was great. -If Steve isn’t gonna be Cap anymore, Sam deserves it and I’m glad they went with him. -The Ancient One, Frigga, and other’s cameos were pretty cool. I liked those moments. -Tony’s convo with Howard was great. I like that he got a little bit of closure with his dad. There’s probably more but I’ve written a lot so I need to be done haha. Let me know your thoughts!! :)

#avengers endgame #endgame #endgame spoilers #avengers endame spoilers #spoilers #tony stark #captain america #Captain Marvel #thor #natasha romanoff #clint barton #I really just needed to vent #sorry y'all #so many emotions #I don't even really know how I feel #ughhhh #mostly just sad I think

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science-lings · 6 years ago

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ENDGAME SPOILERS

I am... fucked up

I’ll just rant for a bit.

Thank god we got the irondad reunion that we deserved even if it was like ten seconds before Marvel Uncle Ben-ed him. Good Hug, you could tell how much Tony loves Peter even after the five years of losing him.

Peter Parker in general just killed me. He’s such a strong boy, and when he awkwardly met captain marvel OOF,

then right after that, GIRL POWER HELL YEAH

seriously I love my girl team, A-Force for the win

It bothered me that Cap was worthy and ended up having a long and happy life, the asshole

CASSIE

HARLEY

TIME TRAVEL

QUEEN VALKYRIE

CAPTAIN AMERICA SAM

PROFESSOR HULK

RESCUE

SHURI UGH

MR. POTTS

“I’m sorry Tony”

Tony with the infinity stones tho

my man

why did it have to fuck you up

IRON FAM

that funeral scene fucked me up

After tony died, every shot of Peter is him being heavy depressed

what is he gonna do now? He has no mentor? (Nick Fury, you better not fuck up my boy)

CAROL

GOD I AM GAY SHE HAD GAY ENERGY DONT @ ME

Nebula and Rhodey, an unlikely but awesome team

yo when Clint and Nat were on Vormir I just... I KNEW

Thors mental breakdown was always nice to see

I hated his new look until the braidening

I need a gifset of Thor giving Asgard to Valkarie and the scene where Tony gives Pepper the company.

PARALLELS

2012 Avengers banter

THEY WERE KIND OF FRIENDS

Cap fighting himself was great

Americas Ass (Stevetony with Bi Scott, always a fun dynamic)

What does this all mean for the timeline though? is everything five years in the future... forever? Did Ned dust, is that why he’s still the same age? What about all of the other homecoming kids? Did they all conveniently dust for the sake of the timeline? We don’t want this to get all Days of Future Past on us...

I LOST THE KID

Tony, casually inventing time travel because he misses his kid

I loved every moment with Peter on screen, when he flew with Valkyrie, When Pepper carried him, instant kill, REUNION

NICE HUG

but then they had to ruin it by uncle ben-ing him

With Shuri and Peter and Harley and Kate Bishop (kinda, I think it’s just clints daughter) they almost have a full team of MCU young avengers

pre-time skip, Tony looked so tiny and weak and I was afraid he was going to break the whole time

Tony and Nebula were a great duo for the little while we had them

Professor hulk was a bit of a surprise but I’m glad Bruce worked it out and brought back everyone holy fuck

Thor seeing his mom again

CAPTAIN MARVEL SAVING MY BOY

did I mention that I love Mr. Potts

you can not tell me that Peter is 100% a big brother to Morgan. Also him knowing Pepper and the Ironmom content ugh,

that final battle though, where the snapped came back, god what a scene

If Tony couldn’t die of old age with his kids, I’m glad he died being a badass and fucking Thanos up

Ant-Man desperately looking and the giant monument for Cassie's name but instead found his own

YOUNG AVENGERS AGE CASSIE

WE COULD HAVE STATURE IN THE MCU

I really really want Tony to be someones AI whether it’s Peppers or Morgans or Rhodeys or Peters, I just want him to live on in some little way

WHY DID THEY HAVE TO KILL THE ONLY TWO AVENGERS I LIKED FUCK

AVENGERS ASSEMBLE

Anyway I’m broken and I can’t wait to see it again

#A4 spoilers #endgame spoilers #avengers: endgame spoilers #spoilers #i'm glad that so many people lived but... heck man

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alenalokidottir · 7 years ago

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I have a lot to say about Infinity War (spoilers below keep reading line)

I saw Avengers: Infinity War today. For almost three hours I watched a movie that was supposed to be the payoff for every movie I had invested in for ten years. I walked into the theater knowing that the characters I had grown to love since 2008 were going into a fight that would take everything they had to win. I also knew that not everyone would make it out alive. Even with this in mind, I sobbed through the ending of the movie, not knowing why I felt like something had been torn away from me. I left the theater with a distinct sense of hopelessness but no words to describe why it was there. It’s been a couple hours and I now have the words to explain what I’m feeling, and I’m sure other people feel this way, too.

After the Keep Reading line there will be my rant. If you’ve seen the movie, feel free to read it. If you haven’t and you’re okay with reading spoilers, feel free to read it. If you haven’t and you don’t want to be spoiled, read this after you’ve seen it. Feel free to reblog this post or leave a comment with your thoughts. I want to know what other people think.

This isn’t a review of Avengers: Infinity War. It’s just a venting session that I may delete later if I end up not liking how it turned out. Before I start I want to make it clear that I loved every moment of this movie. The Russo brothers have made a fantastic film. I didn’t write this to bash Marvel or the Russo brothers or anyone else involved in the the production of the movie. I just needed to get my feelings about this movie out somehow, and writing is the only way I can do that. I’m writing this late at night and I may wake up in the morning to read this and realize half of it is completely unintelligible, so please bear with me. You can agree or disagree with everything I say here. This is all post-Infinity War feels talking and it’s purely my opinion.

From what I can tell, this movie draws from The Infinity Gauntlet story from 1991, only taking the title of Avengers: Infinity War from the sequel series published in 1992 (I’m a fan but not an expert in comics so feel free to correct me if I get anything in this paragraph wrong). Much like the Marvel Cinematic Universe, many of the comics in print at the time tied into this story. To make a very long story short, the basis of the story was that the Marvel Universe was overpopulated and Thanos was going to use the Infinity Gems to fix the problem. This movie goes off that same premise. The biggest difference between the comic and the movie is that the moment Thanos snaps his fingers and half the people in the universe disappear basically kickstarts the comic story. For the movie, this is the ending. This isn’t my issue with the movie, though.

This is the 19th film (correct me if I’m wrong) to be made in this cinematic universe. We’ve invested 10 years watching the three phases of the story of the Avengers unfold, and more than half of these characters are now gone. For months, even years, we all joked about the huge amount of death that would occur in this movie. We even had fun predicting who would die. We all knew this was going to happen, and some of us even guessed that the loss would be this big, but I’m left with one question: was it worth it?

I seriously need help answering this question. I look back at all these movies and all these characters and I think, was it all worth it? Does anything that’s happened even matter? If everyone is going to just die in the end, then what was the point? We knew this was going to happen. We just never thought about what it would mean.

Before anyone comes at me with “They’ll just use the Time Stone to fix everything like in Doctor Strange!” wait a second and really think about this. The concept of stakes and tension, the things that keep a story going and make everything worth it, disappears when time travel is introduced. Why should the audience worry if the characters can just go back in time and fix everything? Infinity War doesn’t even matter if this is what ends up happening. If that’s the route the writers take, the why not go back and prevent the civil war? Why not go back and keep Tony from creating Ultron? Better yet, why not go back in time and keep Starlord from fucking up the plan and stopping the group from getting the Gauntlet off of Thanos? The events that have happened over the course of these films have been a chain reaction. Every single thing could be fixed by going back in time. If everything can just be fixed with time travel, then why did any of it have to happen in the first place?

Fixing character deaths with the Time Stone seems like the obvious solution, and that may very well be what ends up happening. We don’t know. I have my doubts, though. That would be an easy way out, and these movies rarely take the easy way out. Loki’s two resurrections, Tony destroying his suits, Odin’s death (basically the entirety of Thor: Ragnarok tbh), Doctor Strange’s victory against Dormammu, and some events during the time skip between Civil War and Infinity War (explained in a comic mini-series) are the only examples I can think of off the top of my head. That’s 5 examples from 19 movies (if you can think of more, add them in the comments). Fixing the Infinity War deaths with time travel would be another, and although the rational voice in my head is saying that’s what’s going to happen, I have a sinking feeling that the writers aren’t going to do that, at least not to the extent that the audience wants.

Does what I’m saying make sense so far? I hope it does. Now on to my issue with this movie: the deaths.

Fifteen named characters died on screen: Loki, Heimdall, Gamora, Vision, Wanda Maximoff, T’Challa, Peter Parker, Doctor Strange, Bucky Barnes, Sam Wilson, Drax, Peter Quill, Mantis, Groot, Nick Fury, and Maria Hill. Eight named characters survived on screen: Steve Rogers, Tony Stark, Natasha Romanoff, Bruce Banner, James Rhodes, Rocket, Nebula, Okoye, and M’Baku. Pepper Potts, Shuri, Wong, Ned, and Clint Barton were also either seen or mentioned in the movie, but we’re left to guess what happened to them. My bet is that Valkyrie (Yeah. Marvel didn’t make me forget about her like they tried to make me forget about Sif.) died with the rest of the Asgardians and Clint is still alive, but I can only hope for the best for everyone else. I don’t even want to think about the characters in the tie-in shows. These deaths don’t just have rippling consequences for the future of the MCU, but they also present a problem when looking back at the previous 18 films.

There are four deaths that occurred in this movie that I think were necessary: Loki, Heimdall, Gamora, and Vision. We all knew Thanos wasn’t going to let Loki live anyway, and I feel that ending his arc with him accepting who he is and standing with Thor, even if it meant sacrificing himself, was a bittersweet end for him. Heimdall was a servant of Asgard, and Asgard is literally dead, so he had nothing to offer the plot anymore and it made sense for him to die. Gamora’s death contributed to the plot in an important way, by getting Thanos the Soul Stone and giving him more depth as a character. Vision’s death (although a result of deus ex Time Stone, which we know how I feel about) meant Thanos would get the Mind Stone, completing the set of Infinity Stones on the Gauntlet and bringing us to the point of no return in the story.

Every other character that died went with the snap of Thanos’s fingers. While this was a satisfying payoff from the foreshadowing earlier in the movie, I didn’t expect the amount of death that would follow. Wanda, T’Challa, Peter Parker, Doctor Strange, Bucky, Sam, Drax, Peter Quill, Mantis, and Groot all disintegrated away. I had a particularly hard time watching Peter Parker cling to Tony as his life drained from him, desperately saying that he didn’t want to go. Nick Fury and Maria Hill couldn’t even escape death in the post credit scene (No, the Captain Marvel Easter Egg didn’t make me feel hopeful like it was supposed to). These deaths were beautifully executed in a way that brought many of the people in the theater to tears, including me. I’m fully aware that it’s the Infinity War, and in wars there are always unnecessary casualties, but from a storytelling perspective, I think we lost too many. Ten characters were killed off, cheapening the experience of every film they appeared in and rendering those stories pointless. The four deaths I mentioned before were necessary to the story. In my opinion, these ten deaths were not. I’m also fully aware that this is a superhero movie and characters never stay dead for long, especially since we know some of these dead characters are supposed to appear in future Marvel films, but I’m still nervous about how the writers are going to get themselves out of this mess. I’m a big fan of the “when in doubt, kill someone” suggestion in writing, but 10 characters at once when they still have a role to play is too much.

Okay I’ve talked too much and I feel like I’ve made no sense. Basically what I’m trying to say is that most of the deaths in this movie were unnecessary, and it makes me feel like the movies that happened before this happened for no reason at all, especially when the only possible solutions are everyone stays dead or everyone comes back or only characters whose actors still have contracts come back, most likely because of the time travel back door that’s always opened. I know that the original story ended with Adam Warlock, who was teased in the Guardians of the Galaxy Volume 2 post credit scene, getting the Gauntlet, and maybe that’s how they’ll end up defeating Thanos in the next Avengers movie. I don’t know. I’m still not exactly sure how to feel or how to respond to this. I’ve been looking forward to this movie for such a long time, and while I feel that I got everything I expected to get in this movie, I still can’t help but feel disappointed.

As I’ve been writing this, something occurred to me. The theme of this movie is that war comes with a cost, and in the end wars are pointless. It’s even brought up in the movie. Thanos has a vision of young Gamora asking him if he did it. When he says yes, she asks him, “At what cost?” Maybe the unnecessary deaths are to prove that point. I don’t know. I could be giving the writers too much credit.

Okay. I’m running out of words to help me get across my worries and I’m half asleep at this point, so I think I’m gonna end this here and add on if I think of anything else. Feel free to add your comments. I really want to know how other people are feeling after seeing this movie. Thanks for putting up with me this long and thanks for reading my rant.

#spoilers #avengers infinity war #infinity war #the avengers #marvel

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hedgehog-goulash7 · 7 years ago

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OK - this is the piece I wrote in refutation of this now-notorious (because of its many, almost hilarious inaccuracies) article on Screen Rant: “15 Reasons the MCU Should Retire Iron Man”

This is:

A Rebuttal to ‘15 Reasons The MCU Should Retire Iron Man” -- or, Iron Man Should Retire Only If and When RDJ Wants Him To

By Hedgehog-Goulash7

I will preface this by saying: I know all good and great things must someday come to an end. We’ve all been blessed now by almost a decade of RDJ in the armor as Tony Stark, and with all the other opportunities in movies, TV and elsewhere calling to him, we can’t expect one of America’s finest actors to stay an active player in the Marvel Cinematic Universe forever.

As Chris Evans -- another MCU player who’s potentially on the cusp of change -- said recently, and more poetically than I ever could, “The passing of time and the passing of torches is part of the experience. Nothing lasts forever. There’s a beauty in that departure, even if it can be sad at times. It’s also joyful.”

But there’s that type of graceful nod to what may and will come, later if not sooner -- and then there’s a completely other type of thing: a pseudo-expert on a movie news site willfully CALLING for a character’s end, and using dubious and easily refuted pseudo-”facts” to back his points up. That’s about when I feel the need to respond. So let’s go.

(Continued under the cut. This is LONG, but it needed to be, to answer a lot of his badly construed points. Your comments are always very welcome -- and I’m sure I missed a lot of things, but had I included everything this would have been 6,000 words long! As I mentioned before, I actually sent this to Screen Rant; they thanked me, turned it down because they don’t accept “guest posts,” but liked it enough to consider me for a staff writer position -- about which we shall see... - Hedge)

I was puzzled and disappointed to read Evan Killham’s “15 Reasons the MCU Should Retire Iron Man.” At first I thought it had to be satire, but then realized that wasn’t the case. And then as I plowed through, I realized that Evan misstated and downright confused so many elements in the MCU’s Tony Stark story that in some cases I wasn’t quite sure what he was talking about.

As a Marvel fan – particularly of Tony Stark/Iron Man – for many years, and continuing to enjoy Iron Man as my favorite character in the MCU, I disagree wholeheartedly with Evan’s article, which seemed a rather mean-spirited attack piece on a beloved character. So please, allow me to rebut point by point and show you the OTHER side, from a much more optimistic Iron Man fan’s point of view.

15. Tony Stark did NOT “create most of his own enemies”

Vanko was “created, if anything, by Tony’s father -- as was Obadiah Stane. The only enemy Tony Stark really “created” was Aldrich Killian, but who could predict the insanity of a dude you barely knew building an entire villain persona inspired by a slight at a party years ago?

Yes, Tony blames himself for creating Ultron, because Tony is all about taking responsibility and blame upon himself (unlike most of his teammates). But Ultron was clearly NOT Tony’s fault. Tony may have been the catalyst who physically added the alien intelligence to the Iron Legion program. But at the time he was under the influence of the vision Wanda had implanted in his brain: of his greatest fear, losing his teammates and not having done more to save them.

And more important, he was ALSO under the influence of the Mind Stone in Loki’s staff, which, as we saw in the first Avengers movie, can sow discord and control the minds of even superpowered beings. The Mind Stone manipulates Tony and Bruce into inserting it in the Ultron/Iron Legion program, and from there it self-promulgates, embodying itself as the evil robot. Tony and Bruce go off to the party not thinking anything of it, because they are being manipulated into thinking nothing’s wrong. The entrance of Evil Ultron is a huge surprise to them.

14. Tony Stark is not “overused”

Evan says Tony Stark has appeared in “eight of the 16 released MCU films.” He rushes to clarify that one appearance – in “The Incredible Hulk” – was just a few moments’ worth in a tiny cameo. So then that’s seven of the 16 films, fairly speaking.

So three of those were star appearances in his own franchise. Three were in Avengers movies (because Cap3: Civil War was really an Avengers movie, albeit one that RDJ made a mark for himself in, despite having far less screen time…). And yes, of course Iron Man should be a star player in the Avengers movies.

And most recently he made, oooh, wait for it: a 15-minute guest appearance in Spider-Man: Homecoming.

“Overused”? Hardly.

RDJ, sadly for us aficionados, is only in about one movie per year, of ANY type. So a year in which he makes even a small appearance in an MCU movie is a precious year indeed. In fact many of us think some of the Iron Man-less MCU movies could actually have benefited from a strong injection of Iron Man, which always makes everything that much better.

13. Tony’s teammates really DO like him.

Sure, Rhodey loves Tony and they’re besties from way back. But there have been many, many moments of friendship and affection from his other teammates for Tony Stark throughout the MCU saga.

Natasha practically mouths Russian prayers for Tony to return from the wormhole in Avengers, and in Civil War she holds and massages Tony’s shoulder and asks if he’s OK. Thor apologizes for doubting Tony in Age of Ultron and admiringly admits Tony was right. Bruce Banner warms to Tony’s friendship in the first Avengers movie – yes, the one that launched a million “Science Bros” memes because their affection for each other was so evident. When Tony is jolted back from the dead by the Hulk’s snarl at the end of the Chitauri battle, the smile on Steve’s face could light up a room.

There are countless other little moments like that throughout all the movies. They’re “just” character moments, though – not part of the big bashing action setpieces – so casual viewers tend to overlook them. I don’t get that the heroes of the MCU are generally touchy-feely emotive people (except for you, Thor, you giant puppy). But they DO express their feelings in small, very meaningful ways that are fun to watch.

Does Tony annoy them? Sure, like an annoying brother. But we love that brother anyway, because he’s family and he’s actually pretty entertaining. (If only my brother were RDJ, it would never get old…)

12. Tony loves his teammates, too

Tony Stark sometimes doesn’t know how to deal with feelings of care and affection, so he sometimes tries to buy it – as he’s doing now by providing ALL of the Avengers’ amenities: the Tower and now the Compound, their uniforms and equipment and tech, their room and board. (It’s actually led to a “Team Freeloader” meme among the fans, since Tony is pretty much giving them everything.) He doesn’t NEED to do this, but he does. Because he cares about them, and they’ve become his surrogate family.

But when you really get down to matters of the heart – which these movies don’t very often – look again at the vision Wanda implanted in Tony’s brain; the one of his greatest fear. Of all the Avengers who were affected by Wanda’s visions, only Tony saw a vision of his teammates dying. That is his greatest fear: that he didn’t do enough and then all his friends die. He admits to Nick Fury that he’d rather die than have them die.

I don’t know how much more blatant the MCU saga could get in practically underlining the point that Tony loves his teammates and takes responsibility for their lives and well-being. He FLIES TO SIBERIA all alone in Civil War -- one little guy in an armored suit flying hours and hours through ocean storms -- after braving The Raft and immense danger to find out where Steve is, once he learns the truth about the Vienna bombing. That’s called true friendship, and being there to make things right even after you and your friend both screw up.

Oh, not to mention he designs everything, pays for everything and makes everyone look cooler.

11. Tony may “desperately need a break” -- but he just got one

Yup, we fans have been saying all along that Tony Stark needs a break and a long vacation in some beautiful place where he can quietly heal and come to terms with all that’s happened since 2008. And remember, only about five minutes ago in screen time, he just learned the truth of his parents’ murder and his friend’s betrayal, which probably triggered every ounce of PTSD inside him.

And…he just got a break, thankfully. In Spider-Man: Homecoming he goes to India to rest and recharge and find himself (it’s glossed over quickly in the movie, but in the novelization, based on the script, it’s clear). Hey, if hanging out and meditating in some ritzy ashram is what it takes to get the old Tony Stark back, then yay.

But more than that: in Homecoming he has reunited with Pepper, the “one thing he can’t live without.” And even more than THAT, he has also gained a surrogate son in Peter Parker, the young superhero who is so much like Tony in almost every way: impulsive, mouthy, quicksilver, utterly determined. So now Tony, who probably thought he lost a family in “Civil War” (in more ways than one) has a close cadre of people he loves around him again.

And remember: this is an ongoing saga. Civil War brought everyone to their low point, the nadir of the story. From here on it’s onward and upward for all of them.

10. Tony’s motivations are not “questionable”

You could say everything Tony Stark does has “guilt” behind it, as Evan did in his listcicle. But you could say that about all of them – every last one of the Avengers is either driven by guilt or shame. They’re all broken in some way. But if the story plays out as I think it will, because this is how stories work, they will all find their destiny in working together, as a team, as a family – when the Earth is threatened by a Big Bad only the Avengers can defeat.

Tony is not a perfect person. That’s what makes him a fascinating and compelling character. Yes, guilt over his family’s weapons-making legacy drives him to become Iron Man once he sees that those weapons are being diverted and sold to bad guys by Obie. (P.S.: Evan, Stark Industries NEVER sold weapons to evildoers. They were contracted to the U.S. military only.)

Yes, Tony nearly weeps when confronted by the mom of the young man who died in Sokovia. Yes, he blames himself for Ultron and feels desperate guilt over that, because he’s not aware that he actually WASN’T to blame. And yes, these things and more drive Tony Stark toward advocating the Accords, which (I don’t know, I haven’t read them and I don’t know anyone who has…) seem to simply say that super-powered beings who pack the force of a bunch of atom bombs shouldn’t go tromping across international borders without permission, and should have some oversight. I don’t know – seems reasonable to me?

9. Tony Stark definitely DOES want to be Iron Man

Of course he does, because he’s a hero, and hero-ing is what heroes do. He even admits it to Cap: “I don’t want to stop.” He TRIES to stop – probably to try to be a better mundane man and for Pepper’s sake. But he keeps coming back. Because he wants to. Because the inner drive to be a hero never stops.

We see this most clearly in his interactions with Peter Parker. Peter’s statement that “if you can do the things I can do, and you don’t, and bad things happen, then that’s on you” clearly has an impact on Tony – because it hits him at a time he’s been roped back in after trying to step away from his hero duties. It brings back to Tony that by trying to sit these things out, he’s actually making things worse -- because the world benefits from his actions as Iron Man.

Out of the mouth of this innocent kid – in whom Tony sees an unspoiled version of himself that he feels compelled to protect and guide – comes the entire credo for why he Iron Mans. And why any of them do what they do.

8. He’s NOT “more of a wild card than the Hulk.”

No. Just no. The Hulk can’t help himself. Tony can. Most of Tony’s decisions are pretty rational, when he’s actually thinking for himself and isn’t controlled by some outside force. Tony “submitting to registration” in Civil War was not a wild or unexpected decision. It’s the reasonable outcome of the huge fiascos the Avengers have gotten themselves into. None of it because of anything they’d intended, but the collateral damages happened, right? Massive loss of property, life and limb?

And who was stuck with cleaning it up and paying for it all? Why, it’s Tony Stark, the ONLY one taking any responsibility whatsoever. More on that in a moment.

7. Tony Stark does NOT “actively hold people back” – LOL, what?!!

Where in the world did THAT accusation come from? I’ve literally in all my years of fandom never heard that Tony Stark holds people back. Au contraire, mon Screen Rant frére. Tony Stark revels in being a futurist and in looking ahead to what the future will bring to all of us.

He takes on mentorship of Peter Parker because he knows that this youngster will someday, probably sooner rather than later, be a great hero – and that the kid won’t stop being a hero, whether or not Tony Stark is there to guide him or not. Thus, Peter is in active danger, out there on the streets in his onesie, punching far above his weight.

Tony isn’t holding Peter BACK, he’s keeping him SAFE. Can you imagine the time, effort and thought that went into that high-tech suit and its “Training Wheels Protocol” – Tony spending hours and hours planning how to keep this impetuous young padawan from being killed before he’s 17? Can you imagine Tony’s guilt if he had the ability to protect Peter and he didn’t?

Tony’s only mistake here is not realizing how much like him young Peter is, because of course Peter would disable the protections at his first opportunity. Remember “JARVIS, sometimes you gotta run before you can walk”?

6. Tony does not “refuse to take responsibility” – quite the opposite

Tony Stark is completely DRIVEN by the impetus to take responsibility. There is literally a whole movie about this, called Iron Man, in case you missed it.

Ever since his captivity in Afghanistan, it’s been that way. He immediately shut down Stark Industries’ weapons manufacturing at great expense and danger to himself. He built the suit to avenge the life of Yinsen and take responsibility for the safety of the town of Gulmira, since he blamed himself for the terrorists getting his weapons (even though that was Obie’s deal…). I didn’t see recklessness – just determination and courage, and some awesome pinpoint weapons-aiming, too. No collateral damage there.

In Age of Ultron and Civil War, Tony is completely horrified by the ravages of Ultron, whom he blames himself for even though (as we’ve seen) he’s really not to blame. And really, even though both Cap and Tony are quite a bit right and quite a lot wrong in Civil War, Tony in the context of real-world affairs is MORE right.

The Avengers without oversight by some state or world agency are no more than an outlaw militia traipsing over borders and doing what they wish. No iteration of international law would ever allow that, no matter how much “good” Cap thinks they’re doing by “keeping it in our own hands.”

That sort of thinking is dangerously unilateral, and Cap veers close to America First-ism there (not surprisingly) -- but that doesn’t really work well in an international context. Tony has more of the right idea – that the group needs to be held accountable, as any military would, as any international peacekeeping organization would. There are laws in the world, and they’re there for a purpose.

Also, the only one taking ANY responsibility after the Lagos fiasco seems to be: Tony Stark. Cap is curiously subdued, keeping to his rooms while Tony comes back from his mini-retirement. Tony once again takes on ALL the stress of being the Avenger’s PR crisis manager, lead media spokesman, government liaison and all-around cleanup guy while everyone else apparently lounges around at the Compound.

And going back just a little further – remember that the MCU wouldn’t have Manhattan and would probably be embroiled in WW3 if Tony Stark hadn’t shouldered a nuclear missile and gone on a suicide mission to deliver it into space. Talk about being the guy who lies down on the wire…

So don’t talk to me about Tony Stark “not taking responsibility.” So often and on so many occasions, he takes on ALL the responsibility.

5. Tony Stark has shown more character development than all the rest of the Avengers put together.

Anyone asserting that Tony “has shown no character development” has had their head under the proverbial rock the past nine years. Tony Stark has had the most continuous character development of any of the Avengers. If you think not, then you’re buying into the motormouth bravado that the character wears like his armor -- and not seeing the man underneath.

In the course of the MCU saga so far, Tony has had his hero revelation moment, soared above the mistakes of his past, been brought very low by both real and perceived missteps along his hero journey, and now is set to fly high again. In fact, judging from Homecoming, he’s just gone through a rather huge glow-up (which makes his fans very happy).

Tony is not a god or an unceasingly good and moral super-soldier; he’s not a Jekyll-and-Hyde rage monster; he’s not a trained assassin or spy. None of them ever really change, because they’re all locked into their types (or they don’t get their own movies so we can SEE them change: *cough*Black Widow*cough*…).

Of all the Avengers, Tony is the most human and most ever-changing, just like all of us. He’s a flesh-and-bones guy whose only “super power” is his intellect, whose armor is both real and metaphorical, shielding his real and metaphorical heart -- and whose entire story is his leaping, upward, optimistic character arc toward the future.

4. His “quipping has gotten exhausting”?! Not a chance.

Listen, if it wasn’t Tony Stark doing the quipping, it would be some other super-dude in the movie. Count on it. It’s a trope. And I’d much, much, MUCH rather have Robert Downey Jr. as on-site quipmeister than anyone else. He’s by far the world’s most qualified.

Also, can you WAIT for the moment when Iron Man, Rocket and Star Lord meet? Quip meters all over the world will shatter, and that, as Martha Stewart says, will be a Good Thing.

3. All those “murders”? What??

Please, point me to any occasion in the MCU where Tony Stark “murders” innocent people intentionally.

I’ll wait.

These are superhero movies – ALL the heroes kill people; hopefully, the bad guys. A lot of aliens bite the dust, but occasionally bad humans do too. And Marvel movies, for all their mayhem, are fairly restrained in collateral damages and actually address the issues of unintended deaths and damage and the human consequences that heroes have to live with.

How many people died as the Chitauri invaded NYC and smashed into buildings? But how many millions more would have died if the World Council had nuked Manhattan? I seem to recall someone in red and gold saving those millions from nuclear annihilation…which is not a small thing. Wanda inadvertently killed 11 innocent people in that hotel in Lagos – sure, “not her fault,” any more than Ultron was Tony’s fault. They both intended to do good and ended up with a fiasco. It’s all become an important part of the MCU story – it’s become a story of accountability and taking responsibility.

I can only defend the Insta-Kill mode in Spidey’s suit with the thought that it was there as an extreme measure of last resort, only to be used in desperation and ONLY when Peter is fully trained and can – yes – take on that heavy responsibility. Tony intended for that training to happen, you know.

2. Tony did not “almost literally get everyone killed”

Again, as I mentioned: Tony – who takes on the responsibility and blame for just about everything, which is his main problem in life – was actually and ironically NOT responsible for Ultron. Wanda’s vision, then the Mind Stone, remember. The Mind Stone, not Tony, was mainly responsible for creating the mad robot. Its intelligence entered the Ultron interface while the Avengers were partying, and no one even suspected it was happening.

1. We not only “want” to like him, we DO.

Listen – Robert Downey Jr. as Tony Stark is the reason a lot of us go to the MCU movies. It’s no coincidence that every MCU movie in which he’s played a major role is at the top of the top-grossing movies in cinema history.

Sure, we fans would love to see RDJ in other roles. That’s coming. But if he wants to be part of the MCU for however long, he’s more than welcome. Maybe he could take on a Fury-like role as Director Stark, a role that would let him be involved in the MCU as much or as little as he’d like so he’d have time for other projects.Or maybe he gracefully bows out, with Tony Stark either ending heroically in a blaze of glory or in simply retiring to that country place he’s been promising Pepper. I’m torn, but what will be will be. That’s up to Marvel and RDJ, not some freelance writer with whatever axe you’re grinding.

Tony Stark is such a beloved hero to all of us because of how he’s portrayed onscreen, by one of the great actors of our time: as a flawed, fallible, searching, very human character who makes mistakes, learns from them, falls down again and again, but gets back up and soars once more toward the future he loves. He’s important to so many fans who have disabilities, mental illness/PTSD, or who suffer anxiety and depression, because of what he has gone through and what he has overcome. He’s important to those of us who study and love science and technology, because he fails and perseveres and that’s what science is about. Because it’s the failures, the attempts, the trying, the falling and the overcoming – all of that IS the story of Tony Stark. That’s why we love him.

Tony Stark is a hero. Not perfect – and that’s the entire point. Tony Stark is us. Long may he be part of the MCU, as long as RDJ wants him to play him – because we’ll be here to watch and cheer him on.

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#tony stark #screen rant #commentary #15 reasons #that article

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charactersadvocatechimata · 8 years ago

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Just A Thought (A Rant About CA:WS)

So I was rewatching Chez Lindsay-Nostalgic Chick: Loose Canon- Captain America and had a sudden realization when the video got to the modern rendition of Cap in WS. That realization being the Winter Soldier would have been a better-written movie if it had a different protagonist, i.e., the Winter Soldier.

Now I don’t know if this has been said before or if I’m the first (HAHAHAHA probably not) but the idea does have weight. Cap as the protagonist makes the whole story weaker because Steve has no strong relationship with anything or at least not compared to the other characters.

Now, I’m not dissing the movie (It’s my favorite from the Capsicle Trilogy), and the idea might seem objectable to some because it’s a Captain America movie or something. (I don’t know) But let the idea settle, and it’s just so obvious that right move.

Okay, first, let’s take the two strongest elements of the movie: the Winter Soldier character and the Hydra is SHIELD reveal.

From Steve’s perspective, these two elements are weak. Yeah, it’s revealed that Bucky is the WS but relatively late in the movie. And only after the Hydra is revealed and Nick’s “death.” And a lot of the emotional impact is lost because the audience already knew who Bucky is from the weird milk scene. (At least for me.)

And the second element made an impact, just not from Steve’s perspective. I mean yeah, Cap gave his life to destroy Hydra (*cough* Red Skull *cough*) but the writers already tread this ground with the comic cube in Avengers. The emotion came from the betrayal just not Steve’s. Steve wasn’t personally betrayed by anyone, all his personal connection stayed true to the Justice Way (Nick Fury, Natasha, and Wilson) and he didn’t trust SHIELD the institution anyway. (Obvious from the Avengers and the beginning of this movie where he confronts Nick about it.) The whole SHIELD is Hydra thing, for Steve is like you’re a temp that discovered the company you don’t enjoy working for is evil. Yeah, it sucks but not reality shattering. As opposed to Nick, Natasha, and Coulson who dedicated their lives to this organization. (Especially Nat with the whole blood ledger thing.) Steve as the protagonist makes the story kinda of meh. (Again a reminder I like this movie.)

Another thing that’s weak with Steve being the Protagonist are the villains. Antagonist usually needs to have some connection with the protagonist based on character development (conflicting motivations) or plot (conflicting goals) which you don’t have with Steve. There are arguably two villains in WS: Pierce and Zola (Cause he made WS). Pierce works as a “twist” villain but only from Nick’s perspective. Pierce is his friend, they work together and have history, making Hydra’s reveal personal, (and reminds me of the relationship between Lex Luthor and Super Boy in Smallville.) Zola obviously only works as Bucky’s villain, a setup we see in the first CA, and the movie treats him as such with his limited screen time.

Now onto my favorite part of the film and the core of my argument: the Winter Soldier. Technically, WS is the subject of the movie from the start, but kind of limited with how Bucky being the WS relates to Steve. Which is kind of meh.

For example, one of the most horrible and emotional scenes of the movie is watching WS being brain zapped and the status quo that he is a weapon to be used by Hydra. But the scene only lasts a moment, and we feel no deep fear because Steve Rogers is just going to come in and save the day. (Not exactly what happens but close enough.) And again we only know this after Rogers finds out, like "Oh, no?! Is Bucky really turn to the side of evil? No, he's just been brainwashed and is still true to the American way." To me, it creates an emotional distance between the audience and the character.

However, if the movie were from WS's view, the story would begin with a brainwashing scene. Perhaps, show the struggle and transformation of Bucky. Similar scenes of torture would happen until they became routine for both Bucky and the audience. This way, when Rogers enters the story, shocked by what has happened to Barnes, the audience would have a startling realization what we've accepted as the norm. Human adaptable is one of the humanity's scariest traits that I feel like could have been exploited in this movie. After all, the cream of the crap that Bucky has survived with Hydra is that he adapted and accepted that he was a weapon. We'd be shown that loss of humanity and feel that loss when Bucky utters those words "I knew him." It would make that line less about Steve failing to gain his BFF back and more a realization for Barnes that maybe he is human before that spark is once more taken from him. (This would be even better with previous scenes that showcased WS almost remembering Steve.)

Another scene that would have benefited from WS's perspective is that Red Room nod that writers put in. You know, the scene where WS tries to take down Natasha but gets the run around then Nat gives a little grin. A grin that some (in the comic know) theorize is implying that WS trained Nat in the Red Room. A grin that is Nat's way of saying I remember this from training, but you don't so I when. Something that most of the audience is obvious about and is kinda forced backstory. (Like that one line in CW.) But if we had a Bucky losing his humanity montage (I don't know, I'm not a film person) with a red head child making a strong appearance it makes the grin less force and adds another layer of loss for Barnes. (Cause he doesn't remember.)

Now the only solid counter argument I can think would be the Hydra is SHIELD reveal. Cause Bucky was taken by Hydra. But I think the twist could still work even from WS's point of view. I mean there could be other evil organizations, right? The movie could have WS helping evil but never say the group's actual name until the big reveal. Hell, they could even give hints like having a SHIELD goon background character showing up in the background around WS. That way we could watch SHIELD/Hydra doing the evil manipulating the world thing instead of having Doctor Exposition Computer Head tell us.

I don't know. Maybe I just don't like that the MCU sort of treats WS as most a moving angst device for Cap.

#captain america: the winter soldi #captain america #Winter Solider #Steve Rogers #Bucky Barnes #just an idea

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