#antitheism

[womenaremypriority]

i truly can’t think of anything more evil than convincing children they’re going to hell and suffer eternal torture because of their natural attraction to other girls or other boys. every time I think of what religion has unleashed on this world I get unforgivably angry

[a-dinosaur-a-day]

Hi would it be okay if i asked you why you detest richard dawkins?? Cause i also hate him to pieces and would like to share some indulgent hatered of this fucking old ass shit man. Please go off

I mean, to go FULLY into it would require me to write an entire essay, and I just don't want to?

But the short version is

antitheism is cultural genocide and patently bullshit

focusing on genes rather than the whole organism in evolution is patently ridiculous when the minimum unit of evolution is the *population*, not the gene

in fact, when you realize the minimum unit is the population rather than the gene, you see that altruism and social behavior are very beneficial, even across species (see: symbiosis), and "selfishness" "red in tooth and claw" "law of the jungle" are just bullshit things some people made up to justify their crappy behavior (re: racism. their crappy behavior was racism.)

IQ and intelligence are smoke and mirrors we invented to convince ourselves we're more evolved than other animals (we're not, and every organisms has the intelligence it needs for its environment, adapted for its ecology, and that means that a diversity of intelligences is actually a good thing like diversity of anything is a good thing)

the man is a eugenecist and that speaks for itself

I hate him, and I hate that we live in a world where he is still alive and Stephen Jay Gould is dead, zichrono livracha

[earthytzipi]

on that note, to all ex-Christians who are now atheists (to be specific, those of you who are anti-theist): atheism does NOT make you more logical or analytical than people who are religious. if you sincerely believe that it does, you are still working from a Christian mindset that makes you believe that your culture is the best. it is rooted in white supremacist ideals. spend some time deconstructing that.

[intersexfairy]

just because you were raised in an oppressive christian environment doesn't mean every child is being indoctrinated by their religious parents. you shouldn't have to be told why equating religion to child abuse is dangerous to marginalized people. and blanket judgements don't do anything to help survivors of religious trauma; you don't understand what indoctrination means, let alone all the forms religion can take.

[oceanicmarxist]

During the Spanish revolution and the ensuing civil war, Spanish workers and peasants engaged in anti-clerical violence against the Church that spent centuries raping, molesting, murdering, beating, abusing, and oppressing them.

[jessicalprice]

One of the weird anomalous things about Christianity that explains the behavior of both Christians and Christian antitheists is that Christianity requires an Other.

That’s not a given for most cultures.

[nonegenderleftpain]

There are few things I hate more than "Jewish ally" anti-theists and atheists that spout complete bullshit about Judaism and our supposed beliefs as though they know better than we do what we believe. When we talk about cultural xtianity, this is the kind of shit we're talking about.

"You might not believe in hell but most Jews do, my ex-xtian interpretation of your holy texts is correct despite thousands of years of information on the subject, here's a video telling you that you're wrong." Spent several posts calling non-religious people "freethinkers," and continuously dodged the question regarding the harm eliminating religion would do to so many cultures. Not to mention going from "I think the world is better without religion" to "you have an anti-xtian bias that I don't like" as though there's not a reason for that.

Ex-xtian atheists - you need to address and unlearn your xtian belief that your way is the only right way. That you are objectively correct and everyone else is just ignorant. That you know better than the religious minorities you are addressing. People like this want an excuse to talk down to religious minorities under the guise of polite language, and if you don't want to be associated with them, you have to put in the work to not be like this. I say this as an ex-Catholic, and a former anti-theist - do better.

If you are making objective assertions about someone else's religion that you have not studied and cannot answer basic questions about, you're not being critical of religion, you're being an atheist supremacist. If you pull a "gods are more harmful than helpful" like this person but cannot tell me the impact of Kali or Sàngó on their respective cultures, you are not being critical, you're ignorant and self-absorbed. If you have not studied religion, you do not know what you are talking about, and if you are only accepting xtian interpretations of other religions as true, even as a basis for hatred of religion, you're just a xtian with a new wallpaper.

If you are advocating for anti-theism, you are advocating for the cultural genocide of hundreds of different cultures around the world. If you are advocating for anti-theism, you are inherently anti-Jew. And if you are talking over Jews when they correct you on your blatant misunderstanding of our culture, only to call us *liars* when we counter your misconceptions, or call out your cherry-picked sources for why you know better than we do, you're not just an asshole, you're an Antisemite.

I took this conversation in good faith, hoping that the ignorance was born from misunderstanding instead of malice. I should not have been so kind. And if you're going to come onto this post and whine and cry about "not all atheists," or "cultural xtianity isn't real," save us both the time and block me. I'm done entertaining atheists that will not acknowledge that y'all don't know better than the religious minorities you are insulting by assuming we're all just blind sheep being lied to by some hierarchy that doesn't exist outside of certain religions. My partner is an atheist. I was for a long time, and I chose to return to religion on my own. I'm still an atheist, but I am also very religious. I'm the "smart Jew" that ex-xtians love to talk about; enlightened and no longer clinging to the supernatural. And I'm telling you that you're a fucking asshole and I associate more with the most spiritual Orthodox Jew than I ever would with someone who thinks atheism makes you superior.

[pelagae]

Anti-Theism Rant

I hope humanity does progress past religion someday. It's a future I look forward to, and it is optimistic.

Right now, religion is holding humanity back, inspires all kinds of crimes, and has been used to support almost every form of oppression and bigotry there is. I believe sexism, racism, homophobia, and other forms of bigotry would definitely exist without religion. However, it probably would not have gotten this bad, and starting from where we are society-wise, it's largely religious groups that keep a lot of those going. To move forward, humanity has to get out of the religious garbage we've been swimming in for the past several thousand years.

"The creator is a male figure." "My god made males first / in his image and women secondarily." "My god said women have to dress and behave a certain way, which is different and more oppressive than what it says for men." "My god said women must be subservient to men, especially their husbands." "My god said women are too weak and stupid to be trusted." "My god said becoming a mother is the highest achievement a woman can hope for." "My god said humans must have many offspring, and it's women's duty to comply with this." "My god said married couples must not get divorced." "My god said the opposite sex is dirty and must not be touched outside specific circumstances." "My god said women are responsible for our sins and must suffer for it." "My god said women who have children out of wedlock and those children are dirty and should be punished." "My god said life begins at conception, that life matters more than its mother's life, and abortion is bad." "My god said a man can rape his wife." "My god has raped."

"My god said my people are special and his favorite." "My god said my people are better than your people." "Your people are a different color because my god dislikes you / you reject him." "My god said my people are entitled to the land on which your people live." "My god said it's ok to enslave your people."

"My god said same-sex sexual activities and relationships are bad." "My god said sex should be for reproduction only." "My god said the devil causes homosexual urges."

"My god said having pride and standing up for yourself against oppressors like him and my people are sins." "My god said I must worship him in this specific way or else he will be angry." "My god said I must believe and accept what everyone says he says or I will be punished."

We need no further evidence of religions' awfulness than the things written in their books and the agendas of their followers, which they claim their religions support. All these may sound like a certain religion or group of religions to you, but I dare you to show me a religion that includes nothing like anything in the above. They all have at least some of it. They're all shit.

And this isn't even touching on the anti-intellectualism of unscientific claims in religious texts and teachings, how religion supports ideas like creationism that contradict evidence. Religion wants you to be comfortable believing things that aren't true. It's let humanity become gullible and easy to manipulate. It preys on impoverished and otherwise disenfranchised people by offering false hope in exchange for obedience. Religion is man-made, just like all gods. The motivation of religion is for you to do what the people who made up that religion want you to do instead of thinking for yourself.

Yes, even without religion, males would always exploit women's reproductive power and try to control us for it. In-group and out-group thinking is an innate thought process, as is conquest of land and resources, and we'd likely still have racism. Some people may even be homophobic, though for reasons more relating to sexism than religious decree. But my point is that religion has been used as a tool to support these bad things and otherwise control people, and a world without that tool would be better off.

[humnooshop]

Gay the pray away :)

Available in posters, wall art and more on my Redbubble

[raspberryfem]

not to continue to engage in the discourse but tbh the anti-atheist sentiment i hate most is that we don't care abt nature and don't have a sense of 'wonder' or whatever. i'm chock full of wonder! in fact, my lack of belief in god (/goddess/whatever spiritual way you'd put it) makes me feel MORE wonder! nobody designed our universe! the stars, the oceans, the summer rainstorms, the tiny leaf chameleons, the kitty cats, the volcanoes on mars or the great red spot of jupiter! it all happened by chance, and we are SO lucky to live in this very unlikely world where ALL of these things exist!! knowing that the whole universe could have developed and evolved differently if things were even the slightest bit different makes me so thankful for the wonders all around us!! life without intelligent design is beautiful and wondrous!!!!!!

[johnwicklover1999]

yaknow i think the easiest way to explain the harm in anti-theism is that because religion, spirituality, and culture are so heavily intertwined that when you get rid of religion you then get rid of culture. that creates a lot of contradictions when it comes to supporting cultural movements.

you're an anti-theist but you want to support native americans? ok, cool, but what about our culture? are you gonna advocate for our land back and then ridicule us for smudging sage and honoring Creator? great, thanks, that's exactly what colonizers did.

you're an anti-theist but you want to support african american culture? ok, cool, but what about our spiritual practices and our superstitions? do you want to get rid of hoodoo and voodoo? go ahead, but that's erasing valuable black culture.

what about ethnoreligions? where will you draw the line between ethnic culture and religion?

or is culture just as nonsensical? and yeah, some people might say "oh no, you're wrong, i'm not against culture." okay, let's go back to native americans. i'm partially choctaw. if you advocate to give us our land back and protect our tribe will you defend our spirituality? if not, and if you succeed in getting rid of religion then you also get rid of the patterns in our regalia and our beadwork, our mythology, and our Creator.

i dunno, how can anti-theism succeed without destroying culture? if anti-theism truly aims to succeed, it must also destroy spiritually and culture.

[womenaremypriority]

It is traumatic to live in a world where major world religions teach that your very existence as a woman was an afterthought to god, and you only exist to serve men. It traumatic to hear that there are people who think your existence as a gay person is sinful and evil. EVEN IF YOU WERE NOT RAISED RELIGIOUS. Knowledge of those belief systems and their prominence is TRAUMATIZING. It is okay to be angry about it. It is okay to feel grief about it. Knowing millions, if not billions of people, think you are inferior and deserve to die is fucking painful.

[hihiitscai]

Okay I need to yell about antitheism because it’s so painfully rampant in leftist spaces, and there seems to be an emphasis on being antitheist specifically towards the Christian God and the countless denominations that believe in Him. Things like “well if he’s so loving then why xyz thing that’s bad in the world,” or “there cannot be a god that is both all knowing and all loving because xyz thing” or, as I encountered literally today, “you don’t actually love your faith or your god because you misunderstand your religious texts” and proceeding to say that there are no verses about God loving everyone, or “Catholicisms only value is in its aesthetic,” which I also saw today.

Leftist and otherwise progressive spaces seem to be suddenly okay with antitheism when it’s towards Christians because it’s, I don’t know, punching up? People have been hurt by it and the vast majority of oppression in the world is perpetrated in the name of Christianity, and therefore it’s okay to be blatantly disrespectful of something that is important to literally billions of people and brings joy to their lives? My faith brings me joy and hope and love and fulfillment. I am Catholic not for the church, but for the God that I love and who I know loves me. The church is the vessel through which I feel most connected to Him. And yet I am told that I misunderstand my own religious texts (that I have studied, by the way), that I am somehow unintelligent for believing in a higher power. Antitheism of this nature is in largely online spaces, I’ll admit, like in multiple different discord servers that I have been a part of that had “religion” on their blacklist, but really only meant Christianity. Pagans, Muslims, Jewish folks, all were allowed to talk about their faith and their holidays and their beliefs and practices, but as soon as I mention my excitement for Easter, or my preparation for Lent, I’m in violation of the blacklist and get a warning or a kick or whatever the case may be. And why? For those hurt by the church? It seems to be difficult for some to view the situation with any nuance and understand that healing from religious trauma can include deconstructing and reconnecting to your religion.

Also, please don’t hear me say that this is equivalent to the systemic oppression of religious minorities or that it is appropriation. It absolutely isn’t. But there’s an important point here to be made about systemic oppression (which this isn’t) and interpersonal prejudice/discrimination (which this is). You can experience discrimination on an interpersonal level and that is what a lot of antitheism is. Devaluing my beliefs and my intelligence on the basis of my being Catholic is interpersonal discrimination. And the fact that it is permissible because it relates to Christianity is as well.

[voxpraxis]

lately i've been... idk if you can really call it "debating" but i've been interacting with some muslims in the comments of an instagram reel in which a young girl was speaking to a young boy (i want to emphasize that they are both children) and telling him that she wasn't allowed to speak to boys until she was married, because her parents and her religion said so. the boy was sad but replied with something like "oh, alright" and the caption & comments were all talking about how "sweet" the situation was. i commented that i didn't think it was sweet, and actually that's a horrible thing to put in a child's mind. the post never directly mentioned islam and neither did i, but everyone who's been replying to me is proselytizing islam, so. anyway, these are the points that have been thrown at me so far:

it's not wrong because both genders are forced apart from each other

in response to me saying it still enforces an extreme divide between genders and encourages them to see each other as opposites rather than equals: the separation is necessary to prevent rape

there is no rape in islam because of the separation between men and women, rape only occurs in western society because men and women are not separated (...because apparently we cannot expect men to not rape women unless they're physically kept away from them at all times)

rape does not happen between family members, it's just not a real thing, ever (incest doesn't exist?)

if you're interested in a girl you should marry her immediately, because dating leads to cheating

men and women cannot be just friends because "islam and science and psychology says so." one guy said it's because "women can't talk about cars and sports"

(i also got called a simp for saying i have female friends. can't make this shit up)

in response to me pointing out that what the girl is saying implies that she won't have any say in who her husband is: arranged marriages are better because they always work out and unlike western marriages, they never end in divorce! (i'll give you one guess why that is.)

similarly, single parent families and suicide are solely western problems

men and women are NOT equal

i need to shut up and respect it because that's their religion

islam cannot be questioned because islam says islam is true

and that's not including all the personal insults and threats i've received, in just a few days.

i will say this is one of the least challenging "debates" i've ever had, in the sense that almost no point brought against me has any logical foundation and is easily refutable. but it's one of the most frustrating because the problem is that they won't hear me at all, because islam teaches its followers to never consider anything else. it teaches them to accept exactly what they are spoon-fed as the ultimate truth. and this is by no means a problem exclusive to islam, but islam does this kind of control better than any other religion i know. people raised into islam are not taught to think in any logical terms - in fact, they're deliberately taught to avoid thinking logically. logical fallacies are the rule. so not only can they barely form a coherent argument in favour of their beliefs, but they have absolutely no clue how illogical they sound sometimes. when i point out a lapse in logic in something they've said, the response i get is "no, that's true because islam says it's true." no other explanation required. at least, i've sometimes heard people of other religions attempt to use logic or science to prove their beliefs, but with the muslims in these comments, those are unnecessary things to be absolutely avoided - it's like they don't even understand why i'd bother to use them. you can't use logic to get through to them because they've been taught to avoid logic and cling to the mantra of islam-is-true-because-islam-says-so.

[frightnightindustries]

Hey. LGBT+ Christian here. Don't do this. All of this came from left leaning spaces.

(TW for a lot of bigotry under the cut)

Do you know how shitty this feels? Honestly, if you do this, fuck you.

[a-dinosaur-a-day]

Re: Antitheism / Just to clarify, I support religious freedom but acknowledge the harm that religious organizations cause. Would you consider yourself the same?

Im an anarchist. I recognize the harm that ALL permanent organisations and institutions cause because they allow the sequestering of power into the hands of a few over time. Religion isn’t special in that.

Also, plz remember the term organised religion is nebulous and essentially one made up by white suprematists to treat indigenous religions as lesser. There’s either no such thing as an organized religion, or all of them are.