#and she just repeated the same thing

[aspeckof-stardust]

.

[knockknockitsnickels]

I think this is one of my favorite lines from the Wraith route because of (imo) how much the meaning changes depending on if you got there via Spectre or Nightmare. For Spectre, it honestly strikes me as a genuine question. Why are you doing this to her? If you're on the Spectre route, you presumably already know the Narrator can't really be trusted, since you had to reject his reward to get here. What are you hoping to gain from continuing to hurt her? For Nightmare, it honestly just makes me sad. As the Shifting Mound describes her, "She desires only companionship, but the only thing she knows is how to hurt." This line feels like a plea from someone who genuinely doesn't understand why you keep rejecting her. She wants to be with you, but she just can't understand how to do that in a way which doesn't hurt you.

[jkriordanverse]

.

[yardsards]

the true lumity dynamic is just

(luz is the btw and amity is the tbh)

[prolibytherium]

I never touched it but I feel like i only ever hear positive things said about song of achilles.. in (rough strokes at least) what makes it dogshit to you?

Okay it's been a while since I actually read it so some of this might not be spot on accurate. Sorry if at any point I say 'the book never does xyz' and it actually does once or twice but I think my underlying criticisms are accurate

-Patroclus is made into like this soft gentle tender quivering little yaoi boy. In the source text, he's shown as compassionate and moved by the suffering of his own men (and apparently having some medical skill, tending to the wounded in the camp), but very much invested n combat and very, very good at it (pages worth of descriptions of the guys he's killing left and right). In this, the arguably more complex character from this 8th century BC text is flattened into Being A Healer, he doesn't want to go to war he just wants to help people, he only goes because Achilles has to but he doesn't want to fight he's a HEALER he's a gentle lover NOT A FIGHTER who just wants to help he just wants to help everyone around him he HEALS while Achilles is a doomed warrior who is so good at fighting and KILLING its a DICHOTOMY GUYS!!!LIKE THE BEAUTIFUL SUN AND MOON DOOMED LOVERS SO SAD patocluse HEALER . (I Think he's specifically characterized as being BAD at fighting but might be misremembering)

-I don't remember much about Achilles' characterization I think it just makes him less of a jackass while not adding anything of interest and levels out into being mad boring.

-Not getting into the literal millenias old debate whether the mythological characters Achilles and Patroclus were being characterized as some type of lover by the original oral sources of the Iliad or its Homeric writers. We will never know. We don't even know what (if any) culturally accepted conventions of male homosexuality existed in bronze age Greece (we know much more about their descendants). But there are some interesting elements of their characterization in this direction, with how unconventional their relationship is WITHIN the text itself- Patroclus is described as cooking for Achilles and his guests (very specifically a woman/wife's job), Achilles chides Patroclus like a father, but there's also scene where Achilles' mourning of him directly echoes a passage of Hector's wife mourning her husband, Patroclus is explicitly stated to Achilles' elder, and is overall treated as his equal or near-equal, closest confidant and most beloved friend (to the point that pederastic classical Greeks would debate over who was erastes (older authority figure lover) and who was eromenos (adolescent 'beloved')- many took it as a given that this text depicted their present-day cultural norms of homosexual behavior but it existed so Outside of these norms that it had to be debated who was who). Their relationship is non-standard both within the text and to the descendants of the civilization that wrote them.

Basically what I'm saying is this book had opportunities to like, explore the unconventionality of the relationship (being presented here as explicitly lovers), explore the dynamics of why Patroclus wants to do 'women's work' (besides being a tenderhearted softboy), the weird dynamics where they take on paternal roles to each other but also roles of wives, how they feel about being this way, and just kind of Doesn't. Which I guess isn't an intrinsic fault (because it omits much of what I just talked about to begin with). it's just like.... Lame. This book takes jsut abandons everything interesting about the source text in favor of flattening it into bland Doomed Yaoi.

-The conflict that sets off the core story of the Iliad is Achilles and Agamemnon fighting over Briseis, an enslaved Trojan woman taken by Achilles as a war-trophy, Achilles spends most of the story moping because he was dishonored by his 'trophy' being taken. Achilles and Patroclus and everyone else are raping their captives, all the women in the story are either captured Trojans (or in the case of the free women within the walls of Troy, soon to be enslaved, and are slave owners themselves). Slavery as an institution and extreme patriarchal conventions are innate to the text and reflective of the context in which it was developed. You cannot avoid it.

But obviously you can't have your soft yaoi boys doing this, so the author has them capturing women to Protect Them from the other men. Their slaves are UNDER THEIR PROTECTION and VERY SAFE (and they might even Like And Befriend Them but I might be misremembering that. Briseis does though). Our heroes have apparently absorbed none of the ideals of the culture they exist in and the author seems to think "they're gay and aren't sexually attracted to their captives" would translate to them being outright benevolent (also as if wartime sexual violence is just about attraction and not part of a wider spectrum of violent acts to dehumanize and brutalize an accepted 'enemy')

In the source text, Briseis mourns Patroclus as being the kindest to her of her captors, who tried to get her a slightly better outcome by getting her married to Achilles (which probably would be the Least Bad of all possible outcomes for a woman in that situation, becoming a legal wife instead of a slave), and wonders what will happen to her now that he's gone. This is a really really sad, horrible, and compelling dynamic which could be fleshed out in very interesting ways but is instead is tossed entirely aside in favor of them being Besties. Like brother and sister.

All of the above pisses me off so much. If you don't want to engage in the icky parts of ancient/bronze age Greece then don't write a retelling of a story taking place in bronze age Greece. I'm not gonna get mad at children's adaptations of Greek myths or silly fun stories loosely based on them for omitting the rape and slavery but it is SO fundamental to the Iliad. If you're not willing to handle it, either fully omit it or better yet set your Iliad inspired yaoi in an invented swords-and-sandals setting where you can have all your heartbreaking tragic doomed lovers plot beats and not have to clumsily write around the women they're brutalizing.

-The author didn't seem to know what to do with Thetis and she made her just like, Achilles bitch mother who spends most of the story trying to separate our Yaoi Boys (iirc her disguising Achilles as a girl and hiding him on Scyros is made to be more about getting him away from Patroclus than trying to save her son from his prophesied doom in the Trojan War) until she sees how much they loooove each other and I think helps Patroclus' spirit get to the afterlife or something in the end?

-This is more of a personal taste gripe but it has that writing style I loathe where the prose feels less like a story and more like an attempt to string together Deep Beautiful Hard Hitting Poetic Lines that will look great as excerpts on booktok (might predate booktok but same vibe). It's all very Pretty and Haunting and Deep but feels devoid of real substance.

I really like The Iliad and The Odyssey in of themselves. They're fascinating historical texts that give a window into how 8th century BC Greeks told their stories, saw their world, interpreted their ancestors, etc. And genuinely I think these texts have 'good' characters, there's a lot of complexity and humanity to it.

WRT the Iliad- all of the main Achaeans are pretty fascinating, the one singular part where Briseis Gets To Talk and laments her situation is great, Achilles fantasizing that all of the Trojans AND the Achaeans die so he and Patroclus alone can have the glory of conquering Troy (wild), Achilles asking to embrace Patroclus' shade and reaching out for him but it's immaterial (and the shade being sucked back underground with a 'squeak' (the squeak kinda gets me it's disturbing and sad)), Hecuba talking about wanting to tear out Achilles' liver and eat it in a (taboo, exceptioally pointed) expression of rage and grief for his mutilation of her son's corpse, just one tiny line where the enslaved women performing ritual wailing for their dead captors are described as using it as an outlet to 'grieve for their own troubles' is heartrending, etc. A lot of grappling with anger and grief and the inevitability of death, a lot of groundwork laid for characters that could be very interesting when expanded upon in the framework of a conventional novel.

And Song Of Achilles really doesn't do much with all that. I know a lot of my gripes here are kind of just "It's different from the Iliad", I would have thought of it as mostly mediocre and forgettable rather than infuriating if it wasn't a retelling (and I DEFINITELY have strong biases here). But I think the ways in which it is different are less just a product of a retelling (of course there's going to be omissions and differences) and more a complete and utter disinterest in vast majority of its own subject matter, to the book's detriment. I think a retelling has a point when it EXPANDS on the source, or provides a NEW ANGLE to the source. This book doesn't Really do either, it just shaves off the complexity of its source material, renders the characters into a really boring archetype of a gay relationship, and gives very little else. Its content boils down to a middling tragic romance that has been inserted into the hollowed out defleshed skeleton of the Iliad.

Bottom line: I definitely would not be as mad about it if I wasn't familiar with the source material but I think it's fair to expect a retelling to Engage with/expand on its source, and I also think it's weak purely on its own merits. This book was set up to disappoint Me specifically.

[dan-whoell]

had a dream that Phil worked in an arcade by the beach (and he looked like he did on Weakest Link) and some teenage girls asked if he had a youtube channel, and when he said yes one girl very excitedly told her friends it used to be called 'AmazingPhillie, aka s*ane d*wson'. Phil looked so offended to be mistaken for that shithead and everyone started shrieking bc they knew she'd gotten it unbelievably wrong

[romanticatheartt]

What if I say Rhys doesn't hate Nesta, then what?

What if I say Rhys is jealous of how Nesta had the chance to protect her sister the way he never had it? What if he's angry at her for missing it? What if every time he sees her, he curses the Mother for giving this opportunity to Nesta Archeron and not him?

What if I say Nesta doesn't hate Rhys?

What if I say she hates him because he was and is a good brother and he's the one who's now protecting Feyre the way she couldn't, the way she didn't? What if he's a living example of what would've happened if Nesta had cared for her sister, the way Rhysand does for Feyre? What if every time she sees him, she realises how much she had failed Feyre?

Then what?

[pigeonstab]

Doing this to you and then running away hehehe >:3

Bonk! Hehehe, that's such a cute gif, we should be cats together, no responsibilities for you. You'd be a ginger car. Cause you're Irish. And I'm stereotyping you.

Also! Idk how I even got this fucked up but I just woke up at one AM with the light still on and one shoe on in my bed.

I've just spent like 5minyes explaining my dream in the tags and I replaced 'where' with 'were' two times so if you're going to read the novel I wrote be wary of that. Loll this post is a mess, goodnight Charlie!! I love you!

[the-spooky-children]

I was listening to Two Birds again (big mistake it's midnight) and started thinking about what if in a future episode Skid starts getting caught up in all the cult stuff and Lila realises at some point because she looks at her son and sees his dad staring back at her (not literally) and nearly has a breakdown over it because this can't happen again, not to her baby, never to him

[mitamicah]

This is random but Salena has my sticker and even wilder: she noticed me 😱

Sdgkljfsgjutfsvjtd

Context under the line

So back in October I went to käärijä Berlin gig giving out some Bojere stickers I made. Five of those went to Mikke (another story but I had sort of promised to give him some xD).

This was however also the same gig where Salena joined Jere on stage. I didnt meet her in person but had a blast seeing her perform with the boy 🥹💚

Fast forward three months later (here's to me feeling old 🫠) and Salena had an IG live performance yesterday. One friend in that live (hi Niini :3) noticed others speaking about a sticker and got curious: lo and behold Salena had decorated her laptop with the exact sticker I had given people at the Berlin gig 😳😱

My theory is that Mikke must have given one of his five stickers to Salena as a thank you for her coming. And now I have to live with the blessed knowledge that Salena has Bojere art I made on her laptop 😭

But that is not all - when I realised that yesterday I made a story about it and today I got a message that Salena has replied 😱:

This may not seem as huge news to most of you but to me this is wild 😭

I have just gotten used to never being noticed (JO boys seems to look anywhere but at my fanart and the same with Jere *I have had häärijä and Mikke react a few times and dont get me wrong i love that too yet since it was back in November I start to wonder if it was a fluke*) and then she does this 🥺 how am I supposed to react now without coming off as awkward or creepy :'D

[j-1-nx]

I'm sure it's no surprise to anyone that I hate Caitvi with a passion, however. The people on tiktok talking about how "Catradora walked so Caitvi could run" don't realize that mine and Vi's relationship and story is more similar to Catra and Adora than her and Caitler's ever was- only difference is that we're sisters and not romantically involved.

Also Catradora ran so Caitvi could trip and fall down a well, but that's an opinion so

[rookflower]

i do find it really fucking funny how a lot of the bare bones of a starless clan are so blatantly rehashed from the broken code. what if they use the exact same pattern of "insecure boy, girl in forbidden relationship/love triangle with insecure boy, and traumatised medcat apprentice doing their own thing" in the next arc or five as well.

[frenchy-and-the-sea]

There is a very exquisite agony in playing a game you love so so so so so much, and realizing that one of the other players is trying to play a totally different game than you.

[adorawasright]

as i said in the tags, i just rewatched the light spinner episode (i think the most memorable one from s2... other than white out, for entirely wrong reasons). i thought it was an interesting look to shadow weaver's motivations - and i guess catra's too, since despite everything, catra didn't want to send SW to beast island. not to mention her feeling pushed away by hordak in favor of entrapta, which is just history repeating itself in catra's eyes.

i guess my issue with this episode comes from the poor world-building... everything felt too vague when it came to the war, the role of the sorcerers, and how the spells worked. i thought the spell turning "evil" was kind of weird imo. it probably meant that "ooooh light spinner was secretly evil all along!!!". but like, you kinda understand why LS went this far, because she knew the rebellion was losing to the horde, and none of the other sorcerers wanted to do anything to help. they just expected the princesses to solve everything even though they were clearly losing.

i thought light spinner's dynamic with micah was interesting too. like save for her lashing out at him once, their relationship wasn't... outright abusive? i hope i'm not being ignorant or anything. she did use his power and she felt betrayed by him supposedly ruining the spell, which isn't true. but it didn't feel like the way shadow weaver used adora later on. and before disappearing, SW doesn't hurt micah like she did the other sorcerers in the room. she only gently touched his cheek and looked at him with... love? she did seem to care about him. OBVIOUSLY, i'm not erasing her being an asshole overall. i'm just saying.

yeah, basically, i think this is a solid episode, save for the world-building. it's too bad this complexity was dropped in the final season.

[tea-cat-arts]

I'm willing to at least hear out most of the "xyz plot point is heavily tied to abc cultural context" brands of posts but the "wwx isn't meant to be read as morally gray" and "the western fandom made up Sizhui being wangxian's son" brands of post make me feel like my cultural ignorance is being used to gaslight me

[aldasart]

years ago a cleric said to a tiefling "don't touch me!" And it spawned a long frienemyship. Now years later. The phrase is repeated....but between fwbuddies instead