#and not by my immutable identity and what i tell you i am?
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Idk who needs to hear this but a man and a woman being in a relationship together does not automatically equate to being hetero as in "not queer" and the sooner you get this thru your thick skulls the sooner LGBT+/queer spaces will be tolerable for bisexuals, pansexuals, etc
#squiggposting#im so tired IM SO TIRED IM SO TIRED IM SO TIRED OF IT#you shouldnt be making fun of ppl for being straight anyways but i digress#bc the problem is like. that ppl treat a man and a woman being together as some sort of...#inherently toxic or sexist or heteronormative or cisnormative thing? and it's not#like idk the number of ppl who act like opposite sex relationships are inherently boring#or inherently doomed to abuse or to be emotionally/sexually sterile or whatever#idk just please stop it#if not for general equality then at least for the fact that other queer ppl#are getting caught in the crossfire of you shitting on opposite sex relationships#i'm sorry but if i (cis woman) got in a relationship with a man i would not stop being queer#bc saying that i wouldnt be queer is literal conversion therapy rhetoric#oh so youre saying the validity of my sexuality can be erased based on who im together with?#and not by my immutable identity and what i tell you i am?#okay then i guess gay/lesbian ppl who are closeted are actually straight#if they date a person of the opposite sex due to homophobia or other outside dangers#whoa wow is that stupid? IT IS and it's stupid when you unthinkingly do that shit to bi/pan/etc ppl#get over yourself. not everything that's opposite sex is cishet
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This is a really good interview with Jac Schaeffer about episode 7 of Agatha All Along.
Schaeffer orchestrates “Death’s Hand in Mind” to unfold with an emotional clarity that allows LuPone to shine in one of her best ever on-screen performances.
[snip]
What sort of feedback would she be giving?
She has a number of mini-monologues, and as we got closer, I tweaked a few of them. She came to me and was like, “Can we please just do it how it was?” And I was like, “You’re the boss, absolutely.” She’s a theater actor. She respects the page. I was trying to streamline and get us moving, and she was like, “No, I want to say all these things.” And bless her, I’m so glad she said all the things.
There are really two different tracks in the episode: the linear timeline as the other characters are experiencing it, and the emotional timeline as Lily is experiencing it. How did you and Patti navigate that?
Patti asked for a script in correct order so she could understand what she was doing. She really did have a solid handle on it, but she would get lost a little bit. Her focus was, “Where is the big emotion? When do I really unravel?” That’s why she wanted to see the episode strung out linearly, but I was like, “You’re the one bouncing around.” She’s the constant, so whenever she’s feeling the deep emotion of it, that is correct, because she’s being wrenched all over the place. So I think her process was finding when the pulling around really starts to trigger her vulnerability.
[SNIP]
The other thing that was very complicated about this episode was the practical part. Those swords are real, and they’re on piano wire. We had to number them and know the order and decide where they went before any actors set foot on the set. So we had this sword map that was nuts, and Ishi was my sword angel, keeping all that in both our minds. And the actors — they were so lovely — they were willing to let me say, “We cannot explore dancing around the space. I need you here right now, otherwise a sword is going to hit you in the face.”
THEY USED REAL SWORDS. When they said that they used minimal CGI… they were not kidding about it!
[snip]
Lilia, Alice, Mrs. Hart — are they all really dead?
I anticipated this question today, and I’ve been thinking about my answer. What I want to say is that this is a show about death. We actually have the character of Death in our show. I am interested in that conversation, and I am fascinated by how death is used in the comic space and in the MCU. Personally, I feel that when a person dies, you can still talk to them and feel them, and they can still be in your lives. But death is immutable. It is permanent. With this show, we wanted to pay respect to that. So this a more earnest and grave conversation about death than maybe you would find in another superhero project.
I like this actually. I like that in WandaVision the show dealt with grief and trauma. This time it’s dealing with death face to face and having an honest discussion what death is.
I think what it will end up showing is that death… is not evil. Death just is. It is a fact of life.
To paraphrase the Ninth Doctor: Everything has its time and everything ends.
So are the Salem Seven dead?
Yeah, the Salem Seven are dead. They’re off the board in our show, is what I will say. Lilia has saved everybody!
And true to my hypothesis, when Jac is fibbing or not telling the whole truth, she answers as succinctly as possible. Because it is technically true the Salem Seven are dead because the remaining Salem members are now just the Salem Two.
Since only five appeared in the Tower.
Lady Death has been a significant character in the Marvel Comics for a long time. When did you decide to include your version of that character in the show?
Oooh, it’s so fun to be talking about this now. We wanted a pursuant character. We wanted somebody who was going to be after Agatha, and therefore after the coven, because we liked the logic of whatever Agatha’s problem is, once they become a coven, it becomes the problem of the whole group. Very, very early, we had this character we called the Debt Collector. Witchcraft is a lot about intention and exchange and checks and balances. So we had this notion of someone being after them for unpaid debts of witchcraft. I don’t remember when we pivoted to death, but it was just so sexy. We were just like, who is the perfect ex-lover of Agatha Harkness? It was just so obviously Lady Death. It felt so right.
It’s so interesting what they conceptualized for the ‘pursuant’ character before locking on to Rio/Lady Death. The ‘Debt Collector’, it says a lot about their initial thoughts and rules for Witchcraft which sounded (to me) something similar to Fullmetal Alchemist’s philosophy of ‘Equivalent exchange’.
The intention of checks and balances and unpaid debts of witchcraft.
Also, I still love that the person, the character who brought Lady Death, the cosmic being into the MCU wasn’t Thanos with his trillions of death via snap. It’s not Deadpool.
The character who brought Lady Death into being is Agatha Harkness.
Executive producer Mary Livanos and writer Giovanna Sarquis were instrumental in the character. Giovanna came in with the Dia de los Muertos [look] and having her be Latinx, and Mary was very much an influence on Rio’s darkness and toxicity and how enmeshed Agatha and Rio are. It was something that needed approval from on high. We had to get the sign off from Kevin [Feige]. There was a moment where we were all holding our breath, worried we weren’t going to get it. We were really delighted that we got the OK.
I love this, @mswyrr pointed out that Santa Muerte and Lady Death actually has similarities. And to know now that it’s deliberate? It’s so amazing.
Also, Mary pointing out the darkness and toxicity knowing that Mary Livanos is a Buffy the Vampire Slayer fan and quite possibly a Buffy/Faith shipper… The knife scene in the first episode feels more like a deliberate reference now!
This is what happens when fangirls become in charge! Wooo!
You said Rio is a “pursuant character” — is she a villain, or at least an antagonist?
Yes, I would classify her as an antagonist. I would classify everyone in the show as a villain and a hero at one point or another.
[snip]
Again with a carefully short answer. But also the emphasis that she is an antagonist and Jac’s insistence that in the show no one is purely a hero nor a villain. Because people are more complicated than that.
we designed this show to really take off dramatically in the back half. I’ve been really interested to see how that lands with people. I think for the most part, people are on the track that we hope they will be. It’s not about the specifics of characters showing up or cameos or revelations, really. But it sounds to me like what people are emotionally interested in, I hope that we deliver on that. There is more Agatha, there is more Rio, and there is a conclusion to this story, and there is some truth to be shared about Agatha.
I like that— for Jac it’s not the cameos or the revelations, it’s the emotional interest and investment. It’s the unpacking of Agatha as a character, its Agatha and Rio individually and together. This is what Jac and the writer’s room are interested in.
I love that in superhero show, they’re tackling the very heavy subject of death. And I trust this team of writers to bring it home.
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Welcome to my blog 𖤐
I am Mera. I am a black and Native American intersex lesbian transfeminist who creates theory on underdiscussed topics. I am an AV (assignment-variant) transgender woman. For more on what that means, see here.
For my other intro post:
https://www.tumblr.com/oddtransfem/760470782157651968/mera-lastname-chimericbeautybskysocial
Yes, at birth I was designated female. That event has impacted my experience with and relationship to transfemininity/transmisogyny. Regardless, like any other trans person, I do not identify with the gender assigned to me at birth. I identify as a woman, which I was not assigned. Yes “female” and the social category of woman are two different things.
On this blog, “female” refers to patriarchal gender assignment which determines that the women should be defined by immutability, subjugation and essential biological traits. Here, it does not describe biological sex or gender identity. Do not misunderstand me.
My essay delves into this further. If that makes you uncomfortable feel free to ignore me, block me or even send me asks with critiques of my analysis. A good theory holds up to scrutiny which I believe mine does. I'm open to conversation and discussion, but I will not tolerate transphobia (associating me with my assigned sex ie. calling me “an AFAB”) or purposeful misrepresentation of my posts or beliefs. If you're here to treat me as “less trans” than other trans women or to tell me I deserve less of a voice or a narrative in transfeminine spaces then frankly fuck off.
I will block TwERFS, transphobes, trans/misogynists, racists, etc. or harassment on sight.
My posts of personal experience are based on my own struggles as a target of transmisogyny, I share them partly because this site needs more black transfeminized narratives but also to show how someone like me exists as a trans woman.
For more information, see my Bluesky, Substack, or Medium.
Block #transmisogyny tw and #transmisogyny cw if that content triggers you. Check my featured tags for more.
FAQ
Is this an AFAB transfem blog?
No, this blog is about transfeminized people in general. Sometimes that does include people who weren't assigned male at birth, transgender people with feminine gender identities that fundamentally don't align with what their assignments and that resist patriarchal gender norms. Therefore I consider them under the transfeminine umbrella.
I have issues with the term “AFAB transfem”, it's not one I like to identify with because it equates us to our assignments which is counterintuitive to the point of transitioning. That is why I created an alternate label.
Do you support AFAB transfems?
I have complicated feelings. While I largely support self-determination, I think there are some internalized issues with the way many people who use the term frame their experience with transfemininity. Transfemininity is often implictly described as some disconnection to womanhood or the presence of masculine characteristics and it should not be. This is a product of the system of transmisogyny that dominates the world, many self described AFAB transfems have internalized these messages. They may actually be transfeminine and not know how to seperate womanhood and female assignment. I have compassion for trans people without the proper language to define themselves but I don't appreciate seeing those sentiments because they deny me of womanhood as a trans woman too.
Are you an AFAB transfem?
Even though technically I was assigned female at birth and am transfeminine, I am not “an AFAB transfem”. Referring to me as “an AFAB” associates with me my gender assignment which is a transphobic position. I would never describe another trans woman as “an AMAB”. Neither AFAB nor AMAB is a social category nor identity. It is a description of the coercive designation society assigns to infants at birth that determines what they're supposed be.
I am a trans woman because I am trans in relationship to my gender assignment — of which I do not identify — and utterly and entirely a woman.
Are you TME or TMA?
Considering that I am often targeted by transmisogyny as someone who both transgresses gender assignment and who is a woman it would be mistaken to consider me TME. This is not me trying to call myself the most marginalized out of everyone, it acknowledges my material reality and lived experiences with transmisogyny that not only target me but also contextualize every aspect of my day to day life. I have lived with the internal experience of being trans ever since I was born and an external one for years now; excluding transmisogyny from an assessment of my marginalization leaves out necessary factors that contribute to my social position.
Transfeminism?
I am a very avid transfeminist. My theory, my accounts, my blog is all based around it. I have done a lot of reading and a lot of living which has defined my own analysis. Do not assume that because of my assignment I am for some reason naïve surrounding topics within transfeminism. I have intricate knowledge of gender assignment and the functions of transmisogyny especially.
#intro post#introduction#transfem#transfeminism#black transgender#black trans women#transfeminist#transgender woman#pinned#transgender#intersex#assigned femininity#assignment variance#gender#analysis#essay writing#writing
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underscores - wallsocket | you don't even know who i am, and how personal music is OR, the trans experience viewed through binoculars
music is something that, for a long time, wasn't important to me. it was an okay form of media, i had songs i liked when they came on the radio, but i never really cared for it. the most annoying, immutable fact about me, however, is that i got my love of music from osu! of all places, which to be both frank AND honest is about as bad as it gets. as time has gone on though, and both my love for music and media literacy have gotten substantially better, music has grown into.. everything for me. self expression, relation, emotional release, narrative satisfaction, music is this perfect form of art to me, made substantially more perfect by how subjective and personal it is (yes, all... one second... 130 of these words were just introduction!! and they're all important, i'll be testing ye about them)
as i've alluded to in my other post(s), wallsocket is an album that holds substantial weight to me. it's an outlet for my growing trans angst, it's allowed me to feel heavy , and has allowed me to process a lot of stuff going on in my head. today's song, you don't even know who i am, is the perfect example of just how subjective music is. the track is a large part of the wallsocket ARG, something i admittedly don't know a lot about, but from what i've gathered, it seems to be about one of the characters, Sonny, breaking into another girl's house, and as she describes, "...wore your clothes, took your pills, cried your makeup off". it's meant to be a song about a stalking relationship Sonny has with this other girl, the music video hints to as much, and like i said, is a major piece of the wallsocket ARG.
however, this is not what i get out of the song. i don't see a stalker, i don't see parasociality (is that a word? it is now), i don't see a tie to a greater story. to me, and what this song means to me, is a song about the negatives of being trans, specifically being in the closet, and, more personally, dealing with my dissociative disorder. it personally means so much more to me if you take the two people of the song (the "you", and the "i") and view them through the lens of being one.
the song begins (beginning, meaning to me, that there's no lyrics of substance before this point) quite slowly, taking an unorthodox 10 bars. i've talked about how much variance April's music takes to get started, how much it matters, and how much it adds to the song. here, it being such an odd length gives me these very cluttered, overthinking feelings, trying your damndest to get your head in order despite every single thought running through them.
when the song does get going, the repeating theme of the song starts, with the vocalist saying "i know", and then telling a hypothetical second person about compromising information they know about them.
"i know where you came from.
and i know who your best friends are."
and while it's very easy to see why this is a song about stalking, it's just as easy for me to see it as your "trans identity", or as an alter. it makes so much sense to me if you think about the person vocalising the song being someone who's in your body, instead of a separate person. there's various lyrics that tie that together for me, stuff that would be extremely difficult for a stalker to find out, stuff that makes more sense to me if you think about this "stalker" actually just being someone inside you, namely;
"i know what you're scared of.
and i know what your blood type is."
especially knowing about blood type, something that you'll definitely find out in life, but isn't really spoken about frequently, it instantly nails it in the coffin for me personally that it has to be about yourself, someone inside, another identity. i relate to this person both as a trans identity and as an alter, used interchangeably. and this song just seems to "get me." a lot of times during my transition i feel like i'm looking through a window, at the person i was, though at times i look at the person i am now, through the identity of who i was, and reflect on that. being trans isn't sunshine and rainbows. it's struggle, it's massive hardship, and it's terrifyingly easy to lose who you are. this song to me is a reminder, to myself, not to forget who i am, to not let myself become a mindless drone too disappointed with themselves to do anything. and in relation to my dissociation disorder, never to let the people in my head feel like they have a reason to be jealous of my life.
edit: want to add one thing quick; the whole ",,,wore your clothes, took your pills, cried your makeup off" line to me, and others, such as "i think i'm in love with the cards you were dealt" and "i know that i scare you. but i'm nowhere near the worst you've seen." can be re-contextualised as this sort of jealousy for an ideal version of yourself, of the person, striving to be something so wholly unobtainable. and, in a slightly more vain way, these lines tie me to my feelings of the song stronger, of it being another identity in your head. it's pretty obvious for dissociative disorders, but for transgenderism it's more complicated. there's a person looking out, seeing themselves living as their ideal gender and being jealous, but also this trans identity looking in, jealous of how simple life was before these thoughts crept in, became overbearing, and they realised just how hard living as their born gender is, and while they're happy to transition, they're living the gender they want to be, it's hard not to look back and naively think "i was happier" when in reality, things were just more simple.
this one was heavy chat, i do apologise!! but like i said, music is so, so personal, and my love for music is immense. combined, it makes it so i have to talk about it, write it down somewhere, and that place is here. feel free to disagree with me, find your own meaning in the music, that's what it's all about!! but if you choose my meaning, thank you.
i promise i'll do a happier song next time. i think im going to do these sort of introspective reviews of wallsocket in its entirety, then talk about other music/media that i love soooooooo subscribe for that!!!
#underscores#wallsocket#you don't even know who i am#this song holds a lot of weight to me#if you're going to be mean to me please do it#in any other post#just not this one
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aaaaa i'm sorry, i should have been specific about the kind of question, it's more related to coming out than bisexuality specifically now that i think about it >.<
i've been identifying as a lesbian for years and for a while now i've been feeling like maybe i'm actually bi but i'm honestly terrified of exploring that and i don't know what to do. every time i try to think it through i get so stressed out that i start to cry because i have a lot of feelings and experiences that feel so hard to sort out but at the same time i know i can't keep pretending forever. the hardest thing is that i've felt my attraction swing so strongly in the other direction after feeling nothing about men for years and it's making me so sad and disgusted with myself. it's i've been sitting on this all year and it's really starting to take a toll on me now that i realized it's almost 2024 and i'm still lying to everyone about this. i was hoping if it's not too much to ask you might be able to give me some advice on how you navigated this bc you seem so confident and i feel really lost and anxious since i can't talk to anyone i know in real life about it. i know that this is a lot so please feel free to ignore it if you don't want to answer, thank you so much for reading whether you decide to answer or not
Firstly a big hug to you, I'm sorry you've been in so much emotional pain and that you have felt isolated in all this 😢🫂 I know that when you're in that place, it can feel like such a big deal even just to say "I'm hurting in this way" to another person, so I'm really touched you came to me 💙
My biggest piece of advice to you would be to do your best to move away from the question of "what am I really?" and towards the question "what do I want?" It's been my experience that approaching questions of sexuality as though there's some fixed, immutable truth to your sexual identity that is just waiting there for you to uncover is little more than a painful, drawn-out exercise in making yourself miserable. That's exactly what I did when I first came out at 20, and if I could change anything about my life, it would be to not quite literally lock myself in my room for weeks doing nothing but dissecting my life and over-intellectualizing my feelings in an attempt figure all that out. Sure I came out of it with some kind of answer, but the experience left me horrifically depressed and destroyed my self worth, and it took a long time to bounce back from that - especially since I felt a lot of shame about the state I was in, and I couldn't bring myself tell anyone else about what had brought it about.
I mention all that because what I see in your message is that you are being similarly hard on yourself, and I want you to know that there is a much healthier way to approach this that will hopefully leave you feeling more comfortable, confident, and in control. Shifting the question to "what do I want?" allows you to consciously dictate the terms of the process instead of getting overwhelmed by your anxieties. It takes your fear out of the driver's seat and puts you firmly in it.
What do you want? What makes you happy? What do you value? What aspects of you and your life do you treasure, what do you want to cultivate, what would be best left behind? What would you do if there were no limits on you? At the end of your life, what do you want to be able to say about how you lived your life?
These are big, essential questions, ones we unfortunately don't often get the space to take a step back and thoughtfully consider our answers to as we deal with juggling school, work, and adult life and obligations. One benefit to being in a state of questioning is that you have already created the space to ask big questions about yourself. Why not broaden the scope a bit? Instead of just asking questions about who you are, these questions give you the space to holistically figure out who you want to be.
You wanted to know how I navigated this — that's how! I didn't want to put myself through what I experienced at 20 again. I asked myself these questions and they helped me understand that if I wanted to act in line with my adult priorities, I needed to let go a bit, give myself the permission to make a change in order to keep growing into the person I want to be. I won't get into all the specifics but it helped a lot to concretely articulate certain things to myself, such as "sex & sexuality are important to how I understand myself and my gender" and "it's more important to me to have the freedom to do the things I want and need to than it is for others to understand them." It helped me establish my own rules of engagement with the sexual identity question so I could make that process a helpful one for me instead of something deeply destabilizing.
Take a deep breath — you are in control here, you are the boss of you. I completely understand how overwhelmed and lonely you must be feeling. Along with re-shifting your focus, I suggest that you find some outlet for those feelings, whether it's a forum or server where you can talk to other people who are in the same boat, journaling, moving your body in a way that's enjoyable for you, playing a game, making something, anything that helps ground you. Even finding a place where you can just say "I feel overwhelmed" without having to get into specifics can help alleviate some of that stress. People will be here for you if you let them know you're hurting, even if you're not ready or aren't able to give them the details.
Lots of love to you. I know you can move forward in a healthier way, some days will be better than others, what's important is that we remember to give ourselves grace through all the emotional ups and downs. I hope this helps a little bit 🫂💙
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Fucking despise the arguments against my identity of "you wouldn't be trans if you weren't traumatised. You just need to go to therapy." and "you're only trans because you choose to be."
First off, literally how do you know? You don't. You don't know that. Nobody does.
Trauma has undoubtedly impacted my identity in ways that will be very hard to unshake, if I can at all, but my transness is not one of those things.
Second, why do you feel the need to argue so strongly against a fundamental piece of who I am? Why do you feel the need to completely prohibit me from accessing things (trans healthcare) which would improve my quality of life immensely? Why do you feel the need to make me miserable?
For the record, a good portion of the trauma I have received has been because I am trans. Because this is an immutable aspect of who I am.
And, also, y'know what? So fucking what if I was choosing to be trans? So what? God forbid someone do something which makes them feel more like themselves.
You can argue with me over it all you want, you can tell me I'm wrong, but you are never going to change who I am.
You are never going to get the perfect daughter, sister, niece, etc. from me, because that simply isn't who I am. You know what you will get, though? You'll get a son, a brother, a nephew, etc. who, upon turning 18, is never going to speak to you again.
If you reject me for who I am, you don't get to still have me around, once I have the freedom to leave.
You cannot outright argue against what I am, tell me I'm wrong about my own identity, and then expect me to just deal with that gladly, and willingly keep you around.
Ultimately, though, I just have to ask;
Why do you even care?
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Hi, sorry if this is too personal or anything—but when did you first realize you were trans? And how did you gain the courage to tell others about it? I am needing to hear others’ stories because it’s scary out here if I’m honest.
no worries, i don’t mind answering! it got a little long, so it's going under the cut. this is a complicated question to answer, but it was fascinating to reflect like this! the world may hate our guts right now, but i am proud to be trans. stay safe out there, anon.
it’s a complicated subject for me honestly. in some ways, i recall always feeling this weird disconnect from the idea of “womanhood”, especially starting in my teen years. i would look at my reflection in the mirror and not recognize myself. i felt like i was wearing someone else’s skin. my family was liberal, but not liberal enough that i was allowed to present outside of femininity. i discovered i was a lesbian, and it explained a lot: so much of womanhood is defined in relation to men with the expectation of heterosexuality - but it didn't explain all of it. i was forced into womanhood by transphobes and alienated from it by lesbophobes.
as i got older, my friends began coming out as different varieties of trans, and it spurred me to do research for myself. the experiences of trans folks were incredibly useful to learn about for a whole host of reasons. in that community, i saw a group of people who were deliberately seeking the parts of my body and assigned gender that i'd always hated, and in seeing their gender euphoria i realized that it didn't have to be this way. femininity didn't inherently have to be a cage. the trans community was living proof to me that i was allowed to leave, and to discover my own identity the same way they did.
i did a sustained investigation for my high school art class in senior year to try and find an answer to what womanhood actually meant. my answer was that womanhood is something constructed from both external factors like cultural and historical context, but also internal factors. i came to the conclusion that in the end, each woman defines womanhood for themselves. i realized that the only connection i felt to it was all the pain it caused me.
gender isn't some immutable prison constructed from hormones and genes. it was made the fuck up. at a certain point, i think i had to really ask myself why, given that's true, i felt so beholden to a gender identity and presentation that made me so miserable all the time.
before i close, i wanted to link this video! i had to go digging for it, but i remember it giving me one hell of an epiphany when i first watched it. i don't know if you're cis, trans, or caught somewhere in the middle - but regardless, i hope someone reading might find it useful.
so here we are. nowadays, i feel most at home with terms like agender, nonbinary, and butch. my identity as a lesbian and my identity as a trans person are inextricably linked. i think i still have a long way to go on my journey, but i am so glad that i started it. i am proud to be trans, and i am proud to be a part of the trans community 🏳️⚧️💕
#personal#taking this in good faith because you seem polite about it :)#questions like this don't really bother me tbh but i do get why some folks dont like em#since transphobes are like terminally asking and then taking the answer in the most mean-spirited and bad faith way humanly possible 💀#but if anyone wants to be transphobic and gross abt this that's a free blocklist for me LMFAO#like gtfo 🧹🧹🧹🧹🧹
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every year, pride month (coincidentally also the month of my birth) rolls around and i am inundated with a flood of hatred and erasure. so, to the people out there who believe that my sexual orientation or gender identity dictates whether or not i am deserving of existence: what is the point of a life spent hated? and for no other reason than identity. it's akin to being hated for your eye color or for having an allergy to nuts. it is an immutable aspect of my personhood, yet people would rather me disappear than exist in my natural state. maybe i will disappear, falling down the void until i land in nothingness. circling the drain. I'm sure you'd like me better then. or perhaps you'd finally realize that WE ARE HUMAN BEINGS JUST. LIKE. YOU. but i doubt it. you didn't come to that realization for brianna ghey or cherry bush or ariyanna mitchell or doski azad or briza garces florez or ebeng mayor or brayla stone or selena reyez-hernandez or alexa luciano ruiz or nex benedict. you didn't care when it was o'shae sibley or club q or kaylen schulte and crystal turner or pulse or mark carson or cece mcdonald or august provost or justin goodwin or lateisha green. if you aren't killing us directly, then you fight every day to force us into killing ourselves. you are hurting people so deeply thay they would rather not exist at all and you are CELEBRATING this. what's worse is more than a few of you think you're doing this in the name of god. the very same god who tells you to love your neighbor, judge not lest ye be judged. the same god who said "let he among us who is without sin cast the first stone." so i ask, are you without sin? my people are vibrant and beautiful and joyous until some asshole who only skimmed the old testament grabs a bunch of his skinhead friends and casts his pale darkness over us. we are not the sinful ones here. you are supposed to be showing us love, always. just as we have always tried to do with you. i ask again. are you without sin?
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The Gender Identity Model
So many discussions around trans people revolve around ‘identity’, whether it’s cis allies or transphobes speaking. I’ve seen a significant number of transphobes assert, sometimes to me personally, that they don’t believe in ‘gender identity’, as if ‘gender identity’ is the fundamental aspect of being trans, and that the whole thing just falls apart like a house of cards if you reject the notion of an immutable, internal ‘gender identity’ from birth.
This is odd, because among the trans women I regularly talk to at least, there is little discussion surrounding a notion of internal identity, at least in the sense these people mean it. The most intimate discussions are of shared experiences, internal and external, shared feelings, shared desires, wants, yearnings. The notion of identity mainly appears when discussing external factors, how others perceive us, treat us, recognise us, etc. This is what identity really is, it’s a social tool, a means of achieving social recognition from others; it is not a magic essence that floats beyond one’s social context within one’s consciousness, immutable and present from birth. Identity relies on the existence of others–identity is used to gain social recognition of something other than the identity.
Here is an excerpt from a poem from a 14th century Rabbi, Kalonymus ben Kalonymus:
Oh, but had the artisan who made me created me instead – a worthy woman.
Today I would be wise and insightful.
We would weave, my friends and I
and in the moonlight spin our yarn
and tell our stories to one another
from dusk till midnight
we’d tell of the events of our day, silly things
matters of no consequence.
But also I would grow very wise from the spinning
and I would say, “How lucky am I” to know how to make linen,
how to comb [wool], and weave lace;
[to design] cup-like buds, open flowers, cherubim, palm trees,
and all sorts of other fine things,
colorful embroideries and furrow-like stitches.
Is she expressing an internal immutable identity here? I’d argue no. This isn’t to say that Kalonymus ben Kalonymus wouldn’t have desired to be recognised as a woman (that desire is obvious from the poem), but rather that this desire for recognition is coming from something deeper, which is displayed in her poem with heartwrenching emotion: yearning. Kalonymus ben Kalonymus is yearning to be a woman, to be a woman physically (she makes reference to menstruation in another part of the poem), to be a woman socially, to dress like a woman, to socialise as a woman, to make love as a woman. External identity is the social recognition of an internal longing, not an internal identity. The poem ends like so:
What shall I say?
why cry or be bitter?
If my father in heaven has decreed upon me
and has maimed me with an immutable deformity
then I do not wish to remove it.
the sorrow of the impossible is a human pain that nothing will cure
and for which no comfort can be found.
So, I will bear and suffer until I die and wither in the ground.
Since I have learned from our tradition
that we bless both, the good and the bitter
I will bless in a voice hushed and weak:
blessed are you YHVH who has not made me a woman.
Kalonymus ben Kalonymus is not lamenting because she has an internal female identity, she is lamenting due to her lacking the markers of womanhood, the physical, biological markers and the social markers in dress, gendered division of labour, socialising, marriage, etc. This isn’t to say no trans woman has ever conceptualised herself as a ‘woman on the inside’–this used to be a very common narrative. But, I’d argue, it is just that, a narrative, a particular means of understanding the feeling of gender dysphoria, the yearning to be a particular gender that brings such agony to the heart, as such a strong, all-consuming feeling demands an explanation from the self in order to cope with it. Kalonymus ben Kalonymus frames her experience through her religion, while others may frame it through other means. This isn’t to downplay the significance of such narratives, I don’t wish to condescendingly presume that Kalonymus ben Kalonymus’ religion was fundamentally unimportant to her experiences. My point is that any particular narrative framing isn’t necessarily getting to the heart of the matter as trans people can express what is so obviously a similar feeling through such different means, and so tearing down particular framings, such as the ‘born in the wrong body’ notion or 'immutable gender identity at birth' notion, doesn’t even begin to tear down the notion of transness in general.
It is clear to me that desire, yearning, longing, is the fundamental aspect as to what makes someone trans. A yearning to change one’s body and in most cases one’s social role to something else. This yearning shouldn’t demand any kind of explanation from others, at least no more than any other kind of yearning should. If someone finds their calling as a writer and another as a painter, am I expected to meet their desires with suspicion, to interrogate where their yearning comes from? No, of course not. The beautiful thing about humanity is how diverse in our desires we are, and criticial interrogation of desire is ultimately a deadend anyway, for one cannot unbind oneself from the environment one was created in.
So, it’s curious that dysphoria, which in my opinion, is the medical term for this yearning (and note that medicalisation is a narrative of understanding this yearning, not the yearning in of itself), has become more and more peripheral in discourse around transgender people, with this shift in focus towards ‘identity’, despite dysphoria being the core of the trans experience. I personally think this is a product of academia–humanities academia is absolutely obsessed with notions of identity, and so much academic work is done through the lens of identity. The internal experience of dysphoria is not particularly relevant to academics, for two reasons. One is that internal experience in general is not of particular interest to academics, probably due to the difficulty of studying it, and two because the internal experience of dysphoria does not serve any kind of progressive goal. The notion of a transgender gender identity can be and is used to problematise notions of gender in general–in other words, a transgender framework which emphasises identity is useful for feminist and gender abolitionist academics. Transgender people are just a useful tool to these people, nothing more, and our internal experiences are worthless, because, if anything, they would serve to reinforce the importance of gender in society and reverse the decades-long attempt by feminist academics to trivialise it.
Why would this lead to a notion of internal gender identity? Well, because so many progressive activists regurgitate what they read in academia, even when it’s wrong, even when it’s in an inappropriate context. They engage with academic analyses of gender and trans people (or engage with people who have engaged with them) and regurgitate them to other progressives and those sympathetic to them. This causes a problem, because many progressive activists want to legitimise trans people, but the framework they’re using serves to do anything but, and so with the focus on identity, they fashion the notion of an immutable, internal gender identity. Many transgender people, who naturally gravitate towards spaces that are at least slightly more accepting of them than anywhere else, will then internalise these ideas and regurgitate them themselves.
At the risk of sounding condescending, I don’t think many of these people give what they’re saying much thought. When they do, I think they inevitably end up trivialising transness, by either staying nominally pro-trans while framing it as something fundamentally absurd, implying that trans people are victims of a gendered system and that we would be ‘cured’ if gender didn’t exist, or by becoming TERFs, who in trivialising trans experiences see trans people as enemies of their dystopian gender abolitionist vision for the world. Most won’t remain fervently pro-trans when thinking further about the subject, because they won’t think to leave the confines of the internal gender identity model, because there is little to no intellectual interest in dysphoria–in yearning–as a lived experience of trans people.
However, this isn’t to say identity–external identity, in which one receives recognition of one’s internal experiences and desires from others–is unimportant. We are social beings, who crave recognition from those around us. I am certainly not arguing that trans men are not men and trans women are not women, and you’ll note that I referred to Kalonymus ben Kalonymus as ‘she’ even as I said I don’t think she had some internal gender identity. Rather, as I said earlier, identity is a tool of social recognition. This heartwrenching yearning, which leaves the deepest imprint on the mind and colours every single experience one has from birth, which when repressed hollows out the soul to its very core, which drives people to upturn their entire lives and radically alter their bodies (bringing their sex closer to the sex they long to be) is self-evidently socially significant and worthy of recognition, and any just society would do all it can to help ease such yearning, especially as it comes at such a trivial cost.
(I apologise for this post not being very well-formed, I wrote it mainly to get some thoughts out that have been bouncing around in my head for a while. I might return to this subject and write a better structure essay about it in the future.)
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Im sorry, but could I ask you about your post muppetings.tumblr.com/post/724861299835731968? I am confused by it. "transgender is what i say i am to piss off conservatives" makes sense to me. "transsexual is what i say i am to piss off liberals" does not. they are (almost) the same, are they not??? Sure transgender is used more often now, but transsexual is still used. theyre both terms that mean the same or almost the same thing. (and, in my opinion, transsexual sounds cooler but thats beside the point)
yeah for all intents and purposes they’re similar enough that a lot of people use them interchangeably. (<- purposefully exhibiting restraint and not going on a tangent about the history of these two words) but that’s kinda part of the joke. i identify as both transgender and transsexual
basically the point was that a lot of people who will call themselves as trans allies actually don’t know that much about what being trans is like and how the words we use to identify ourselves are not just like. Immutable facets of ourselves but can also be like. a statement about how we view ourselves, how the world views us, among other things. Identities can be political. I don’t just identify as a bisexual mlm I identify as a faggot. But these people will assert that transsexual is not only a bad word, but a slur (which it is neither, to be clear. it’s just a word that largely fell out of fashion) They’ll tell you not to call yourself that, thinking they’re helping the dumb trans person who doesn’t know any better from accidentally identifying as a bad no-no word when in reality they’re policing ur identity just as much as a conservative saying there’s no such thing as transing your gender.
and like just to note. that post got pretty out of hand. I’m a really really small blogger. Before I made that post I had a follower count in the teens. my blog is mostly just me fooling around with my friends not like. meant for making jokes for the world at large. It was mostly just a post that was meant to be joke for me and my friends but a popular blogger found it and it blew up big time and it confused some people and made a couple people angry but like. they weren’t really the intended audience in the first place to be honest
Hopefully that all makes sense
#tldr it’s a joke about identifying in a way that makes people upset specifically to make them upset#because people need to learn to respect us even if we use words and identify in ways that they don’t specifically like#if u still don’t get it don’t worry the post isn’t for everyone
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I'd just like to let people know, especially people who've been in my asks, that I haven't been the target of transmisogyny now just because I assert myself as a trans woman. In fact I don't, in real life I rarely if ever bring it up, the only references to it are a trans flag in my Instagram bio and a she/her pin over a trans flag on my bag.
Not everyone sees these things when meeting me, a lot of people think I'm a cis woman at first glance. That isn't particularly weird for trans women and it doesn't stop us from being targeted by or internalizing transmisogyny. It doesn't stop us being afraid in public or scared to use the washroom or okay when we see our sisters murdered or killed or alright when people project transmisogyny onto us when they find out.
I'm really not that different. If you met me in real life, at first you might assume I'm a cis girl, then you might find out I'm a trans woman and assume I'm like any other. Having a conversation with me you would never be able to tell that I was assigned differently and I never lie to the girls that I know. I exist in transfeminine spaces and that makes me happy.
I am a woman who doesn't identify with her assigned gender. I am medically transitioning to affirm my identity, I have been experiencing dysphoria since I knew what gender was. My body looks physically different to others as a result of my transition, I can never go back. It does not define my transfemininity though my intimate experiences with people are impacted by the fact I have a penis. Everyday different thoughts intrude into my mind about my body that make me feel like I'm too much of the wrong gender. I'm trans, I'm a woman, I'm transfeminine and also transfeminized. Those are immutable facts about myself that I cannot change whether I say I am or not.
I am not an AFAB trans woman. I am not AFAB. I am a trans woman who's assignment is unlike those with that same label.
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#oooo i haven't read all of these #off the books i HAVE i read it almost in one go in a trance and then just kind of sat there for a bit it does so many interesting things #and that last one ohhhh yeah “his soul's wandered off and left him behind” is EXACTLY it #whenever he has sex i like to just stare at his face and contemplate like. Why is he doing this and what's he getting out of it #the Why of solange in casino royale is easy because he straight up says it lol (and then doesn't actually go through with it the second #he's gotten the information he wanted). and then next is vesper and in qos miss fields i.e. at least ostensibly the the first times he #sleeps with someone just like for the hell with it. and in that context i think a lot about the way he watches vesper go on that last #morning like when she's gotten up and he's still in the bed. and also with fields the moment where he's just got his chin on her shoulder #AND that one kiss with camille. all three of those to Me (<- probably some level of ace) feel much less like Horny and more. cat bumping its #face up against yours so that you keep petting it. it feels like it's about TOUCH in and of itself much less than it is about Fuckin. #if you're in a situation where the only times someone touches you is violence or sex and you're a guy who Likes to be touched (which i do #think he is) and you're used to sex being what you do when you can tell that the other person wants that from you and you can use it for #something. of course you'd initiate sex if you want someone to touch you even if you don't actually feel very much in the mood for the sex #itself. and add the layer of like. living weapon and everything you touch seems to wither and die etc and it just gets VEYR messy. which is #delicious obviously. anyway my point is mostly. scene where he and q are having sex maybe not for the first time and q's like OKAY THIS #time we're figuring out what YOU want instead of you giving me what i want (which was excellent last time good job). and bond evades the #question and gets this vaguely trapped look because what he actually wants right now is to like. lie on the sofa with his head in q's lap #while q just sort of pets him snd he doesn't have to think about anything or calculate anything but you can't just SAY that like why would #someone want to touch him unless they're getting something out of it. you don't touch a weapon unless you plan to use it right #and q does get this out of him and they cuddle and if bond could hed be producing the single loudest purring you've ever heard in your life
@weidli i am kissing u on the mouth, this is literally it all of this it's like u read my mind, this is exactly yes down to the like ace/ace adjacent thing (the director's cut version of this post had some thing about, like,... hey can we talk about like either a sort of ace/demi or like ace/demi-adjacent Bond-- but I was also trying to figure out how to be like, yes this is due to his life experiences I'd think, but without it sounding like the "aces are ace cuz of trauma" wrongtake. I don't know that desensitized to it was exactly the right term to use but like,.. that's kind of what I was trying to get at.. *gestures* in another post I may have followed that sidebar and tried to add in all of the qualifications but this post was already so long lmao so I was like. this is going to have to do... anyway I guess I will sidebar here. but I was trying to be like. I don't mean he is ace or demi as an immutable label the way I feel like sometimes these sexuality/identity labels are used/seen but as more of like, a functional categorization(?) term so to speak. like not in the sense of he was Always that and is discovering it now but in that he, like, experiences the world differently now due to everything he's been through but also as a natural product of aging and changing w time and now his experience more aligns with what people would define as ace/demi ....oh god wait I had a half-formed branching thought that I discarded before it fully percolated - it was going to be something like going on about yeah also part of it could be like he's had so MUCH sex already too that it's like, he doesn't really want/need to have sex just to have sex, and the word sated came into this somehow which is what reminded me--- but yeah it reminds me of another fic I need to add to the web-weaving-- okay, see end for it // )
also ur so galaxy brain for this image: ... feel much less like Horny and more. cat bumping its face up against yours so that you keep petting it. it feels like it's about TOUCH in and of itself much less than it is about Fuckin YES. YES he is cat shoving his nose into your nose and mouth to show his affection and cat BOMPING you to keep petting (also. continuing my hey where is my ACTUAL catboy/catman Bond?? campaign. like. we gotta get on this and start makin it happennn)
100% to the he seeks sex more for the touch than the sex itself but sex is a way he can get the touch, and 100% to the "we are going to figure out what YOU want" and then he just wants to be cuddled and petted, I probably have some like half-formed stuff jotted down exactly of this floating around somewhere lol 🤝🤝🤝
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Okay one more fic for the Further Reading / Web-Weaving / You May Also Like:
Everyone presumed that he always was sated, with all the sex he had out in the field; they didn't seem to realise that those encounters were planned to the detail, that sometimes he wasn't even attracted to the people he had to seduce and bed and even when he was, it still wasn't about him: it was about subtly manipulating the mark and attempting to turn them against whoever they were working for - sex during missions was a dangerous game, one that he had grown very good at playing but that hardly ever was enjoyable in the way people thought it would be.
👆 thiiiis specific quote this specific bit from this fic (also this fic has CBT in it which I find to be severely underrepresented in this fandom given Casino Royale. like. I think I watched that back when I was into Hannibal cuz Mads was in it and was like. .......what am I seeing, is this just. gay porn. lmao)
(also yeah why AREN'T there more cbt fics in this fandom. I think I tried looking for, like, bond/le chiffre even and it's a desert out there, guys.)
thinking about, like... the exploration of James Bond × the tangled messy web of complications he'd pick up around sex given like past relationships and also the inherently fucky sexual politics of honeypot missions and etc.
it's like. when your body is as much a tool in your aresenal as any of your skills so you're able to handle/tolerate/work through levels of what, in another context, may be considered personal violations, that would be overwhelming to untrained civvies-- but at the same time that very training that gives you some level of divide/partition/insulation from said trespasses on your person, also rather inherently creates bifurcations in your autonomy which then conversely and maybe ironically, still unavoidably act as violations against your personhood
the interesting added layer to that is to go deeper into exploring how honeypotting is/can be inherently traumatic not just to the victim but also the perpetrator, and the resulting psychological effects on the honeypotting agent
anyway here are some fics that I either reread recently, or I remember noting about, that go into these topics
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Further Reading / Web-Weaving / "You May Also Like":
This fic imo does a great job of exploring/interweaving PTSD through the narration in an organic-feeling, believable, and very visceral way. Towards the end-ish of the currently available chaps there's a section where Bond is thinking about sex and like doomspiraling cuz he's assuming what Q would want and having a crisis about it because he's like, I can't provide that without panicking or dissociating - which I find suuuuuper interesting and complex, and it's especially interesting to have this level of exploration on the subject from Bond's POV.
the specific aspect I find really interesting about this is the way I can see this Bond as becoming, like.... desensitized? in a sense, to sex, on a more emotional level, but also how it becomes even in general sort of a trauma in itself, with his concerns about either reacting violently to a trigger, or dissociating during the act and how he worries if that happens that Q will find it hollow and falling short.
the dissociating bit really sticks out to me because it reminds me of an anecdote my high school psych teacher told about a friend of hers who through therapy realized that she was dissociating during sex with her husband and like mentally taking a walk down.. some sidewalk or other, but basically I can't remember if any other fic had this like, aspect of explicitly mentioning dissociating (others do talk about like him going a bit dead-eyed when putting on his TM Seduction act which is like adjacent to this, but not like specifically from inside Bond's head reflecting on this specific type of trauma response)
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Has this banger section that, like, puts the *points above* into words from a third party's POV:
“Part of what makes it work -- with Scar and me -- is that I have no expectations on that front, so she doesn’t have to... perform. It’s second nature to them, to figure out what you want and give it to you…” The pause was horrible, and her expression deeply sad. “Whether it’s what they want or not.” Q felt a little sick. People sometimes joked about the honeypot missions, calling them ‘plush’ or talking as though they were somehow easier. Q had never really thought about it, except to think that it wouldn’t be easy for him. But now…
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the warmth of your doorways:
has whole sections of James reflecting introspectively on honeypot missions. also has the added spicy layer of James being tapped to train/guide the guy who is meant to replace him for honeypot missions, and the added turbulance of all that (this fic also has a lot going for it on other levels that I enjoy a lot- this post us just specifically about JB × his fucked up sex politics stuff)
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Bond and Q talk about sex stuff and Q is horrified to realize how bad Bond's training for honeypotting male targets was, which eventually leads to them talking about sexualuties, which leads to Q introducing Bond to the Kinsey scale lmao, and etc. also this banger from the author in the comments:
Craig has this one facial expression that makes me think, as Q put it in my fic, like Bond's soul has wandered off and left him behind. We see it occasionally when he's laying in wait to kill but most commonly when he's seducing a female mark. The best example of the face I mean is when he's seducing the widow in Spectre. It's a little dispassionate, a lot distant and it really makes me think very hard about what that means. To me, that facial expression makes me think perhaps Bond has a certain distance from his own actions. His body belongs to England, he is Her weapon and he will do as She needs.
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idk maybe i need to start identifying as transsexual because my gender is not a social construct. my identity as a man is not a social construct.
i could have lived in a void for 29 years with no concept of society or its constructs and my brain would still tell my body that my sexed traits were incorrect. i would still be distressed, i would still be aware that something wasn't right.
even before i knew what gender was, i knew that my body wasn't right. my earliest memories are of discomfort with my female sexed traits. i never believed i could get pregnant because i never believed i was a woman. i lost my shit when i started my period because i genuinely thought i wasn't supposed to have one.
i didn't know what being trans was then. i was in middle school. gender wasn't something i understood or cared about. all i knew was that i was in the wrong body.
my brain and body are mismatched on a biological level, and that has NOTHING to do with society or its constructs. you cannot imagine how frustrating it is to have the language i used to be able to use to explain my identity to others be taken from me.
i grew up during the era of gender being what was in your brain and sex being what was between your legs, and that helped so much, that described me PERFECTLY. i am innately a man. i didn't choose to be a man, and society did not designate me a man. me being a man has nothing to do with society.
i AM a man. i don't just IDENTIFY as a man. that is what i AM, at my core, innately and immutably.
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a twenty-five thousand word post about a twenty-three year old “debate”
As time goes on, I’m baffled that it remains a commonly held opinion that:
The LTD remains unresolved
SE is deliberately playing coy, and are (or have been) afraid to resolve it.
To me, the answer is as clear as day, and yet seeing so many people acting as if it’s a question that remains unanswered makes me wonder if I’m the crazy one.
So I am going to try to articulate my thought process here, not because I expect to change any hearts and minds, but more to get these thoughts out of my head and onto a page so I can finally read a book and/or watch reruns of Shark Tank in peace.
To start off, there are two categories of argument (that are among, if not the most widely used lines of argument) that I will try NOT to engage with:
1) Quotes from Ultimania or developer interviews - while they’re great for easter eggs and behind-the-scenes info, if a guidebook is required to understand key plot points, you have fundamentally failed as a storyteller. Now the question of which character wants to bone whom is often something that can be relegated to a guidebook, but in the case of FF7, you would be watching two very different stories play out depending on who Cloud ends up with.
Of course, the Ultimanias do spell this out clearly, but luckily for us, SE are competent enough storytellers that we can find the answer by looking at the text alone.
2) Arguments about character actions/motivations — specifically, I’m talking about stuff like “Cloud made this face in this scene, which means be must be [insert whatever here].”
Especially when it comes to the LTD, these tend to focus on individual actions, decontextualizing them from their role in the narrative as a whole. LTDers often try to put themselves in the character’s shoes to suss out what they may be thinking and feeling in those moments. These arguments will be colored by personal experiences, which will inevitably vary.
Let’s take for example Cloud’s behavior in Advent Children. One may argue that it makes total sense given that he’s dying and fears failing the ones he loves. Another may argue that there’s no way that he would run unless he was deeply unhappy and pining after a lost love. Well, you’ll probably just be talking over each other until the cows come home. Such is the problem with trying to play armchair therapist with a fictional character. It’s not like we can ask Cloud himself why he did what he did (and even if we could, he’s not the exactly the most reliable narrator in the world). Instead, in trying to understand his motivations, we are left with no choice but to draw comparisons with our own personal experiences, those of our friends, or other works of media we’ve consumed. Any interpretation would be inherently subjective and honestly, a futile subject for debate.
There’s nothing wrong with drawing personal connections with fictional characters of course. That is the purpose of art after all. They are vessels of empathy. But when we’re talking about what is canon, it doesn’t matter what we take away. What matters is the creators’ intent.
Cloud, Tifa and Aerith are not your friends Bob, Alice and Maude. They are characters created by Square Enix. Real people can behave in a variety of different ways if they found themselves in the situations faced by our dear trio; however, FF7 characters are not sentient creatures. Everything they do or say is dictated by the developers to serve the story they are trying to tell.
So what do we have left then? Am I asking you, dear reader, to just trust me, anonymous stranger on the Internet, when I tell you #clotiiscanon. Well, in a sense, yes, but more seriously, I’m going to try to suss out what the creator’s intent is based on what is, and more importantly, what isn’t, on screen.
Instead of putting ourselves in the shoes of the characters, let’s try putting ourselves in the shoes of the creators. So the question would then be, if the intent is X, then what purpose does character Y or scene Z serve?
The story of FF7 isn’t the immutable word of God etched in a stone tablet. For every scene that made it into the final game, there are dozens of alternatives that were tossed aside. Let us also not forget the crude economics of popular storytelling. Spending resources on one particular aspect of the game may mean something entirely unrelated will have to be cut for time. Thus, the absence of a particular character/scenario is an alternative in itself. So with all these options at their disposal, why is the scene we see before us the one that made it into the final cut? — Before we dive in, I also want to define two broad categories of narrative: messy and clean.
Messy narratives are ones I would define as stories that try to illuminate something about the human condition, but may not leave the audience feeling very good by the end of it. The protagonists, while not always anti-heroes, don’t always exhibit the kind of growth we’d like, don’t always learn their lessons, probably aren’t the best role models. The endings are often ambivalent, ambiguous, and leaves room for the audience to take away from it what they will. This is the category I would put art films and prestige cable dramas.
Clean narratives are where I would categorize most popular forms of entertainment. Not that these characters necessarily lack nuance, but whatever flaws are portrayed are something to be overcome by the end of story. The protagonists are characters you’re supposed to want to root for
Final Fantasy as a series would fall under the ‘clean’ category. Sure, many of the protagonists start out as jerks, but they grow through these flaws and become true heroes by the end of their journey. Hell, a lot of the time even the villains are redeemed. They want you to like the characters you’re spending a 40+ hr journey with. Their depictions can still be realistic, but they will become the most idealized versions of themselves by the end of their journeys.
This is important to establish, because we can then assume that it is not SE’s intent to make any of their main characters come off pathetic losers or unrepentant assholes. Now whether or not they succeed in that endeavor is another question entirely.
FF7 OG or The dumbest thought experiment in the world
With that one thousand word preamble out of the way, let’s finally take a look at the text. In lieu of going through the OG’s story beat by beat, let’s try this thought experiment:
Imagine it’s 1996, and you’re a development executive at what was then Squaresoft. The plucky, young development team has the first draft of what will become the game we know as Final Fantasy VII. Like the preceding entries in the series, it’s a world-spanning action adventure RPG, with a key subplot being the epic tragic romance between its hero and heroine, Cloud and Aerith.
They ask you for your notes.
(For the sake of your sanity and mine, let’s limit our hypothetical notes to the romantic subplot)
Disc 1 - everything seems to be on the right track. Nice meet-cute, lots of moments developing the relationship between our pair. Creating a love triangle with this Tifa character is an interesting choice, but she’s a comparatively minor character so she probably won’t be a real threat and will find her happiness elsewhere by the end of the game. You may note that they’re leaning a bit too much into Tifa and Cloud’s past. Especially the childhood promise flashback early in the game — cute scene, but a distraction from main story and main pairing — fodder for the chopping block. You may also bump on the fact that Aerith is initially attracted to Cloud because he reminds her of an ex, but this is supposed to be a more mature FF. That can be an obstacle they overcome as Aerith gets to know the real Cloud.
Aerith dies, but it is supposed to be a tragic romance after all. Death doesn’t have to be the end for this relationship, especially since Aerith is an Ancient after all.
It’s when Disc 2 starts that things go off the rails. First off, it feels like an awfully short time for Cloud to be grieving the love of his life, though it’s somewhat understandable. This story is not just a romance. There are other concerns after all, Cloud’s identity crisis for one. Though said identity crisis involves spending a lot of time developing his relationship with another woman. It’s one thing for Cloud and Tifa to be from the same hometown, but does she really need to play such an outsized role in his internal conflict? This might give the player the wrong impression.
You get to the Northern Crater, and it just feels all wrong. Cloud is more or less fine after the love of his life is murdered in front of his eyes but has a complete mental breakdown to the point that he’s temporarily removed as a playable character because Tifa loses faith in him??? Shouldn’t it be the other way around?
Oh, but it only gets worse from here. With Cloud gone, the POV switches to Tifa and her feelings for him and her desire to find him. The opening of the game is also recontextualized when you learn the only reason that Cloud was part of the first Reactor mission that starts the game is because Tifa found him and wanted to keep an eye on him.
Then you get to Mideel and the alarm bells are going off. Tifa drops everything, removing her from the party as well, to take care of Cloud while he’s a catatonic vegetable? Not good. Very not good. This level of selfless devotion is going to make Cloud look like a total asshole when he rejects her in favor of Aerith. Speaking of Aerith, she uh…hasn’t been mentioned for some time. In fact, her relationship with Cloud has remained completely static after Disc 1, practically nonexistent, while his with Tifa has been building and building. Developing a rival relationship that then needs to be dismantled rather than developing the endgame relationship doesn’t feel like a particularly valuable use of time and resources.
By the time you get to the Lifestream scene, you’re about ready to toss the script out of the window. Here’s the emotional climax of the entire game, where Cloud’s internal conflict is finally resolved, and it almost entirely revolves around Tifa? Rather than revisiting the many moments of mental anguish we experienced during the game itself — featuring other characters, including let’s say, Aerith — it’s about a hereto unknown past that only Tifa has access to? Not only that, but we learn that the reason Cloud wanted to join SOLDIER was to impress Tifa, and the reason he adopted his false persona was because he was so ashamed that he couldn’t live up to the person he thought Tifa wanted him to be? Here, we finally get a look into the inner life of one half of our epic couple and…it entirely revolves around another woman??
Cloud is finally his real self, and hey, it looks like he finally remembers Aerith, that’s at least a step in the right direction. Though still not great. With his emotional arc already resolved, any further romantic developments is going to feel extraneous and anticlimactic. It just doesn’t feel like there’s enough time to establish that:
Cloud’s romantic feelings for Tifa (which were strong enough to launch his hero’s journey) have transformed into something entirely platonic in the past few days/weeks
Cloud’s feelings for Aerith that he developed while he was pretending to be someone else (and not just any someone, but Aerith’s ex of all people) are real.
This isn’t a romantic melodrama after all. There’s still a villain to kill and a world to save.
Cloud does speak of Aerith wistfully, and even quite personally at times, yet every time he talks about her, he’s surrounded by the other party members. A scene or two where he can grapple with his feelings for her on his own would help. Her ghost appearing in the Sector 5 Church feels like a great opportunity for this to happen, but he doesn’t interact with it at all. What gives? Missed opportunity after missed opportunity.
The night before the final battle, Cloud asks the entire party to find what they’re fighting for. This feels like a great (and perhaps the last) opportunity to establish that for Cloud, it’s in Aerith’s memory and out of his love for her. He could spend those hours alone in any number of locations associated with her — the Church, the Temple of the Ancients, the Forgotten City.
Instead — none of those happens. Instead, once again, it’s Cloud and Tifa in another scene where they’re the only two characters in the scene. You’re really going to have Cloud spend what could very well be the last night of his life with another woman? With a fade to black that strongly implies they slept together? In one fell swoop, you’re portraying Cloud as a guy who not only betrays the memory of his lost love, but is also incredibly callous towards the feelings of another woman by taking advantage of her vulnerability. Why are we rooting for him to succeed again?
Cloud and the gang finally defeat Sephiroth, and Aerith guides him back into the real world. Is he finally explicitly stating that he’s searching for her (though they’ve really waited until the last minute to do so), but again, why is Tifa in this scene? Shouldn’t it just be Cloud and Aerith alone? Why have Tifa be there at all? Why have her and her alone of all the party members be the one waiting for Cloud? Do you need to have Tifa there to be rejected while Cloud professes his unending love for Aerith? It just feels needlessly cruel and distracts from what should be the sole focus of the scene, the love between Cloud and Aerith.
What a mess.
You finish reading, and since it is probably too late in the development process to just fire everyone, you offer a few suggestions that will clarify the intended romance while the retaining the other plot points/general themes of the game.
Here they are, ordered by scale of change, from minor to drastic:
Option 1 would be to keep most of the story in tact, but rearrange the sequence of events so that the Lifestream sequence happens before Aerith’s death. That way, Cloud is his true self and fully aware of his feelings for both women before Aerith’s death. That way, his past with Tifa isn’t some ticking bomb waiting to go off in the second half of the game. That development will cease at the Lifestream scene. Cloud will realize the affection he held for her as a child is no longer the case. He is grateful for the past they shared, but his future is with Aerith. He makes a clear choice before that future is taken away from him with her death. The rest of the game will go on more or less the same (with the Highwind scene being eliminated, of course) making it clear, that avenging the death of his beloved is one of, if not the, primary motivation for him wanting to defeat Sephiroth.
The problem with this “fix” is that a big part of the reason that Aerith gets killed is because of Cloud’s identity crisis. If said crisis is resolved, the impact of her death will be diminished, because it would feel arbitrary rather than something that stems from the consequences of Cloud’s actions. More of the story will need to be reconceived so that this moment holds the same emotional weight.
Another problem is why the Lifestream scene needs to exist at all. Why spend all that time developing the backstory for a relationship that will be moot by the end of the game? It makes Tifa feel like less of a character and more of a plot device, who becomes irrelevant after she services the protagonist’s character development and then has none of her own. That’s no way to treat one of the main characters of your game.
Option 2 would be to re-imagine Tifa’s character entirely. You can keep some of her history with Cloud in tact, but expand her backstory so she is able to have a satisfactory character arc outside of her relationship with Cloud. You could explore the five years in her life since the Nibelheim incident. Maybe she wasn’t in Midgar the whole time. Maybe, like Barret, she has her own Corel, and maybe reconciling with her past there is the climax of her emotional arc as opposed to her past with Cloud. For Cloud too, her importance needs to be diminished. She can be one of the people who help him find his true self in the Lifestream, but not the only person. There’s no reason the other people he’s met on his journey can’t be there. Thus their relationship remains somewhat important, but their journeys are not so entwined that it distracts from Cloud and Aerith’s romance.
Option 3 would be to really lean into the doomed romance element of Cloud and Aerith’s relationship. Have her death be the cause of his mental breakdown, and have Aerith be the one in the Lifestream who is able to put his mind back together and bring him back to the realm of consciousness. After he emerges, he has the dual goal of defeating Sephiroth and trying to reunite with Aerith. In the end, in order to do the former, he has to relinquish the latter. He makes selfless choice. He makes the choice that resonates the overall theme of the game. It’s a bittersweet but satisfying ending. Cloud chooses to honor her memory and her purpose over the chance to physically bring her back. In this version of the game, the love triangle serves no purpose. There’s no role for Tifa at all.
Okay, we can be done with this strained counterfactual. What I’ve hopefully illustrated is that while developers had countless opportunities to solidify Cloud/Aerith as the canon couple in Discs 2 and 3 of the game, they instead chose a different route each and every time. What should also be clear is that the biggest obstacle standing in their way is not Aerith’s death, but the fact that Tifa exists.
At least in the form she takes in the final game, as a playable character and at the very least, the 3rd most important character in game’s story. She is not just another recurring NPC or an antagonist. Her love for Cloud is not going to be treated like a mere trifle or obstacle. If Cloud/Aerith was supposed to be the endgame ship, there would be no need for a love triangle and no need to include Tifa in the game at all. Death is a big enough obstacle, developing Cloud’s relationship with Tifa would only distract from and diminish his romance with Aerith.
I think this is something the dead enders understand intuitively, even more so than many Cloti shippers. Which is why some of them try to dismiss Tifa’s importance in the story so that she becomes a minor supporting character at best, or denigrate her character to the point that she becomes an actual villain. The Seifer to a Squall, the Seymour to a Tidus, hell even a Quistis to a Rinoa, they know how to deal with, but a Tifa Lockhart? As she is actually depicted in Final Fantasy VII? They have no playbook for that, and thus they desperately try to squeeze her into one of these other roles.
Let’s try another thought experiment, and see what would to other FF romances if we inserted a Tifa Lockhart-esque character in the middle of them.
FFXV is a perfect example because it features the sort of tragic love beyond death romance that certain shippers want Cloud and Aerith to be. Now, did I think FFXV was a good game? No. Did I think Noctis/Luna was a particularly well-developed romance? Also no. Did I have any question in my mind whatsoever that they were the canon relationship? Absolutely not.
Is this because they kiss at the end? Well sure, that helps, but also it’s because the game doesn’t spend the chapters after Luna’s death developing Noctis’ relationship with another woman. If Noctis/Luna had the same sort of development as Cloud/Aerith, then after Luna dies, Iris would suddenly pop in and play a much more prominent role. The game would flashback to her past and her relationship with Noctis. And it would be through his relationship with Iris that Noctis understands his duty to become king or a crystal or whatever the fuck that game was about. Iris is by Noctis’ side through the final battle, and when he ascends the throne in that dreamworld or whatever. There, Luna finally shows up again. Iris is still in the frame when Noctis tells her something like ‘Oh sorry, girl, I’ve been in love with Luna all along,” before he kisses Luna and the game ends.
(a very real scene from a very good game)
Come on. It would be utterly ludicrous and an utter disservice to every character involved, yet that is essentially the argument Cloud/Aerith shippers are making. SE may have made some pretty questionable storytelling decisions in the past, but they aren’t that bad at this.
Or in FFVIII, it would be like reordering the sequence of events so that Squall remembers that he grew up in an orphanage with all the other kids after Rinoa falls into a coma. And while Rinoa is out of commission, instead of Quistis gracefully bowing out after realizing she had mistaken her feelings of sisterly affection for love, it becomes Quistis’ childhood relationship with Squall that allows him to remember his past and re-contextualizes the game we’ve played thus far, so that the player realizes that it was actually Quistis who was his motivation all along. Then after this brief emotional detour, his romance with Rinoa would continue as usual. Absolutely absurd.
The Final Fantasy games certainly have their fair share of plot holes, but they’ve never whiffed on a romance this badly.
A somewhat more serious character analysis of the OG
What then is Tifa’s actual role in the story of FFVII? Her character is intricately connected to Cloud’s. In fact, they practically have the same arc, though Tifa’s is rather understated compared to his. She doesn’t adopt a false persona after all. For both of them, the flaw that they must learn to overcome over the course of the game is their fear of confronting the truth of their past. Or to put it more crudely, if they’re not lying, they’re at the very least omitting the truth. Cloud does so to protect himself from his fear of being exposed as a failure. Tifa does so at the expense of herself, because she fears the truth will do more harm than good. They’re two sides of the same coin. Nonetheless, their lying has serious ramifications.
The past they’re both afraid to confront is of course the Nibelheim Incident from five years ago. Thus, the key points in their emotional journeys coincide with the three conflicting Nibelheim flashbacks depicted in the game: Cloud’s false memory in Kalm, Sephiroth’s false vision in the Northern Crater, and the truth in the Lifestream.
Before they enter the Lifestream, both Cloud and Tifa are at the lowest of their lows. Cloud has had a complete mental breakdown and is functionally a vegetable. Tifa has given up everything to take care of Cloud as she feels responsible for his condition. If he doesn’t recover, she may never find peace.
With nothing left to lose, they both try to face the past head on. For Cloud, it’s a bit harder. At the heart of all this confusion, is of course, the Nibelheim Incident. How does Cloud know all these things he shouldn’t if Tifa doesn’t remember seeing him there? The emotional climax for both Cloud and Tifa, and arguably the game as a whole, is the moment the Shinra grunt removes his helmet to reveal that Cloud was there all along.
Tifa is the only character who can play this role for Cloud. It’s not like she a found a videotape in the Lifestream labeled ‘Nibelheim Incident - REAL’ and voila, Cloud is fixed. No, she is the only one who can help him because she is the only person who lived through that moment. No one else could make Cloud believe it. You could have Aerith or anyone else trying to tell him what actually happened, but why would he believe it anymore than the story Sephiroth told him at the Northern Crater?
With Tifa, it’s different. Not only was she physically there, but she’s putting as much at risk in what the truth may reveal. She’s not just a plot device to facilitate Cloud’s character development. The Lifestream sequence is as much the culmination of her own character arc. If it goes the wrong way, “Cloud” may find out that he’s just a fake after all, and Tifa may learn that boy she thought she’d been on this journey with had died years ago. That there’s no one left from her past, that it was all in her head, that she’s all alone. Avoiding this truth is a comfort, but in this moment, they’re both putting themselves on the line. Being completely vulnerable in front of the person they’re most terrified of being vulnerable with.
The developers have structured Cloud and Tifa’s character arcs so that the crux is a moment where the other is literally the only person who could provide the answer they need. Without each other, as far as the story is concerned, Cloud and Tifa would remain incomplete.
Aerith’s character arc is a different beast entirely. She is the closest we have to the traditional Campbellian Hero. She is the Chosen One, the literal last of her kind, who has been resisting the call to adventure until she can no longer. The touchstones of her character arc are the moments she learns more about her Cetra past and comes to terms with her role in protecting the planet - namely Cosmo Canyon, the Temple of the Ancients and the Forgotten City.
How do hers and Cloud’s arcs intersect? When it comes to the Nibelheim incident, she is a merely a spectator (at least during the Kalm flashback, as for the other two, she is uh…deceased). Cloud attacking her at the Temple of the Ancients, which results in her running to the Forgotten City alone and getting killed by Sephiroth, certainly exacerbates his mental deterioration, but it is by no means a turning point in his arc the way the Northern Crater is.
As for Cloud’s role in Aerith’s arc, their meeting is quite important in that it sets forth the series of events that leads her to getting captured by Shinra and thus meeting “Sephiroth” and wanting to learn more about the Cetra. It’s the inciting incident if we’re going to be really pedantic about it, yet Aerith’s actual character development is not dependent on her relationship with Cloud. It is about her communion with her Cetra Ancestry and the planet.
To put it in other terms, all else being the same, Aerith could still have a satisfying character arc had Cloud not crashed down into her Church. Sure, the game would look pretty different, but there are other ways for her to transform from a flirty, at times frivolous girl to an almost Christ-like figure who accepts the burden of protecting the planet.
Such is not the case for Cloud and Tifa. Their character arcs are built around their shared past and their relationship with one another. Without Tifa, you would have to rewrite Cloud’s character entirely. What was his motivation for joining SOLDIER? How did he get on that AVALANCHE mission in the first place? Who can possibly know him well enough to put his mind back together after it falls apart? If the answer to all these questions is the same person, then congratulations, you’ve just reverse engineered Tifa Lockhart.
Tifa fares a little better. Without Cloud, she would be a sad, sweet character who never gets the opportunity to reconcile with the trauma of her past. Superficially, a lot would be the same, but she would ultimately be quite static and all the less interesting for it.
Let’s also take a brief gander at Tifa’s role after the Lifestream sequence. At this point in the game, both Tifa and Cloud’s emotional arcs are essentially complete. They are now the most idealized versions of themselves, characters the players are meant to admire and aspire to. However they are depicted going forward, it would not be the creator’s intent for their actions to be perceived in a negative light.
A few key moments standout, ones that would not be included if the game was intended to end with any other romantic pairing or with Cloud’s romantic interest left ambiguous:
The Highwind scene, which I’ve gone over above. It doesn’t matter if you get the Low Affection or High Affection version. It would not reflect well on either Cloud or Tifa if he chose to spend what could be his last night alive with a woman whose feelings he did not reciprocate.
Before the final battle with Sephiroth, the party members scream out the reasons they’re fighting. Barret specifically calls out AVALANCHE, Marlene and Dyne, Red XIII specifically calls out his Grandpa, and Tifa specifically calls out Cloud. You are not going to make one of Tifa’s last moments in the game be her pining after a guy who has no interest in her. Not when you could easily have her mention something like her past, her hometown or hell even AVALANCHE and Marlene like Barret. If Tifa’s feelings for Cloud are meant to be unrequited, then it would be a character flaw that would be dealt with long before the final battle (see: Quistis in FF8 or Eowyn in the Lord of the Rings). They would not still be on display at moment like this.
Tifa being the only one there when Cloud jumps into the Lifestream to fight Sephiroth for the last time, and Tifa being the only one there when he emerges. She is very much playing the traditional partner/spouse role here, when you could easily have the entire party present or no one there at all. There is clearly something special about her relationship with Cloud that sets her apart from the other party members.
Once again, let’s look at the “I think I can meet her there moment.” And let’s put side the translation (the Japanese is certainly more ambiguous, and it’s not like the game had any trouble having Cloud call Aerith by her name before this). If Cloud was really expressing his desire to reunite with Aerith, and thus his rejection of Tifa, then the penultimate scene of this game is one that involves the complete utter and humiliation of one of its main characters since Tifa’s reply would indicate she’s inviting herself to a romantic reunion she has no part in. Not only that, but to anyone who is not Cl*rith shipper, the protagonist of the game is going to come off as a callous asshole. That cannot possibly be the creator’s intention. They are competent enough to depict an act of love without drawing attention to the party hurt by that love.
What then could possibly be the meaning? Could it possibly be Cloud trying to comfort Tifa by trying to find a silver lining in what appears to be their impending death? That this means they may get to see their departed loved ones again, including their mutual friend, Aerith? (I will note that Tifa talks about Aerith as much, if not even more than Cloud, after her death). Seems pretty reasonable to me, this being an interpretation of the scene that aligns with the overall themes of the game, and casts every character in positive light during this bittersweet moment.
Luckily enough, we have an entire fucking Compilation to find out which is right.
But before we get there, I’m sure some of you (lol @ me thinking anyone is still reading this) are asking, if Cloti is canon, then why is there a love triangle at all? Why even hint at the possibility of a romance between Cloud and Aerith? Wouldn’t that also be a waste of time and resources if they weren’t meant to be canon?
Well, there are two very important reasons that have nothing to do with romance and everything to do with two of the game’s biggest twists:
Aerith initially being attracted to Cloud’s similarities to Zack/commenting on the uncanniness of said similarities is an organic way to introduce the man Cloud’s pretending to be. Without it, the reveal in the Lifestream would fall a bit flat. The man he’s been emulating all along would just be some sort of generic hero rather than a person whose history and deeds already encountered during the course of the game. Notably for this to work, the game only has to establish Aerith’s attraction to Cloud.
To build the player’s attachment to Aerith before her death/obscure the fact that she’s going to die. With the technological limitations of the day, the only way to get the player to interact with Aerith is through the player character (AKA Cloud), and adding an element of choice (AKA the Gold Saucer Date mechanic) makes the player even more invested. This then elevates Aerith’s relationship with Cloud over hers with any other character. At the same time, because her time in the game is limited, Cloud ends up interacting with Aerith more than any of the other characters, at least in Disc 1. The choice to make many of these interactions flirty/romantic also toys with player expectations. One does not expect the hero’s love interest to die halfway through the game. The game itself also spends a bit of time teasing the romance, albeit, largely in superficial ways like other characters commenting on their relationship or Cait Sith reading their love fortune at the Temple of the Ancients. Yet, despite the quantity of their personal interactions, Cloud and Aerith never display any moments of deep love or devotion that one associates with a Final Fantasy romance. They never have the time. What the game establishes then is the potential of a romance rather than the romance itself. Aerith’s death hurts because of all that lost potential. There so many things she wanted to do, so many places she wanted to see that will never happen because her life is cut short. Part of what is lost, of course, is the potential of her romance with Cloud.
This creative choice is a lot more controversial since it elevates subverting audience expectations over character, and understandably leads to some player confusion. What’s the point of all this set up if there’s not going to be a pay off? Well, that is kind of the point. Death is frustrating because of all the unknowns and what-ifs. But, I suppose some people just can’t accept that fact in a game like this.
One last note on the OG before we move on: Even though this from an Ultimania, since we’re talking about story development and creator intent, I thought it was relevant to include: the fact that Aerith was the sole heroine in early drafts of the game is not the LTD trump card so people think it is. Stories undergo radical changes through the development process. More often than not, there are too many characters, and characters are often combined or removed if their presence feels redundant or confusing.
In this case, the opposite happened. Tifa was added later in the development process as a second heroine. Let’s say that Aerith was the Last Ancient and the protagonist’s sole love interest in this early draft of Final Fantasy VII. In the game that was actually released, that role was split between two characters (and last I checked, Tifa is not the last of a dying race), and Aerith dies halfway through the game, so what does that suggest about how Aerith’s role may have changed in the final product? Again, if Aerith was intended to be Cloud’s love interest, Tifa simply would not exist.
A begrudging analysis of our favorite straight-to-DVD sequel
Let’s move onto the Compilation. And in doing so, completely forget about the word vomit that’s been written above. While it’s quite clear to me now that there’s no way in hell the developers would have intended the last scene in the game to be both a confirmation of Cloud’s love for Aerith and his rejection of Tifa, in my younger and more vulnerable years, I wasn’t so sure. In fact, this was the prevailing interpretation back in the pre-Compilation Dark Ages. Probably because of a dubious English translation of the game and a couple of ambiguous cameos in Final Fantasy Tactics and Kingdom Hearts were all we had to go on.
How then did the official sequel to Final Fantasy VII change those priors?
Two years after the events of the game, Cloud is living as a family with Tifa and two kids rather than scouring the planet for a way to be reunited with Aerith. Shouldn’t the debate be well and over with that? Obviously not, and it’s not just because people were being obstinate. Part of the confusion stems from Advent Children itself, but I would argue that did not come from an intent to play coy/keep Cloud’s romantic desires ambiguous, but rather a failure of execution of his character arc.
Now I wasn’t the biggest fan of the film when I first watched a bootlegged copy I downloaded off LimeWire in 2005, and I like it even less now, but I better understand its failures, given its unique position as a sequel to a beloved game and the cornerstone of launching the Compilation.
The original game didn’t have such constraints on its storytelling. Outside of including a few elements that make it recognizable as a Final Fantasy (Moogles, Chocobos, Summons, etc.) and being a good enough game to be a financial success, the developers pretty much had free rein in terms of what story they wanted to tell, what characters they would use to tell it, and how long it took for them to tell said story.
With Advent Children, telling a good story was not the sole or even primary goal. Instead, it had to:
Do some fanservice: The core audience is going to be the OG fanbase, who would be expecting to see modern, high-def depictions of all the memorable and beloved characters from the game, no matter if the natural end point of their stories is long over.
Set up the rest of the Compilation - Advent Children is the draw with the big stars, but also a way to showcase the lesser known characters from from the Compilation who are going to be leading their own spinoffs. It’s part feature film/part advertisement for the rest of the Compilation. Thus, the Turks, Vincent and Zack get larger roles in the film than one might expect to attract interest to the spinoffs they lead.
Show off its technical prowess: SE probably has enough self awareness to realize that what’s going to set it apart from other animated feature films is not its novel storytelling, but its graphical capabilities. Thus, to really show off those graphics, the film is going to be packed to the brim with big, complicated action scenes with lots of moving parts, as opposed to quieter character driven moments.
These considerations are not unique to Advent Children, but important to note nonetheless:
As a sequel, the stakes have to be just as high if not higher than those in the original work. Since the threat in the OG was the literal end of the world, in Advent Children, the world’s gotta end again
The OG was around 30-40 hours long. An average feature-length film is roughly two hours. Video games and films are two very different mediums. As many TV writers who have tried to make the transition to film (and vice-versa) can tell you, success in one medium does not translate to success in another.
With so much to do in so little time, is it any wonder then that it is again Sephiroth who is the villain trying to destroy the world and Aerith in the Lifestream the deus ex machina who saves the day?
All of this is just a long-winded way to say, certain choices in the Advent Children that may seem to exist only to perpetuate the LTD were made with many other storytelling considerations in mind.
When trying to understand the intended character arcs and relationship dynamics, you cannot treat the film as a collection of scenes devoid of context. You can’t just say - “well here’s a scene where Cloud seems to miss Aerith, and here’s another scene where Cloud and Tifa fight. Obviously, Cloud loves Aerith.” You have to look at what purpose these scenes serve in the grander narrative.
And what is this grander narrative? To put it in simplistic terms, Aerith is the obstacle, and Tifa is goal. Cloud must get over his guilt over Aerith’s death so that he can return to living with Tifa and the children in peace.
The scenes following the prologue are setting up the emotional stakes of film - the problem that will be resolved by the film’s end. The problem being depicted here is not Aerith’s absence from Cloud’s life, but Cloud’s absence from his family. We see Tifa walking through Seventh Heaven saying “he’s not here anymore,” we see Denzel in his sickbed asking for Cloud, we see a framed photo of the four of them on Cloud’s desk. We see Cloud letting Tifa’s call go to voicemail.
What we do not see is Aerith, who does not appear until almost halfway through the film.
Cloud spends the first of the film avoiding confrontation with the Remnants/dealing with the return of Sephiroth. It’s only when Tifa is injured, and Denzel and Marlene get kidnapped that he goes to face his problems head on.
Before the final battle, when Cloud has exorcised his emotional demons and is about to face his physical demons, what do we see? We see Cloud telling Marlene that it’s his turn to take care of her, Denzel and Tifa the way they’ve taken care of him. We see Cloud telling Tifa that he ‘feels lighter’ and tacitly confirming that she was correct when she called him out earlier in the film. We see Cloud confirming to Denzel that he’s going home after this is all over.
What we do not see is Cloud telepathically communicating with Aerith to say, “Hey boo, can’t wait to beat Sephiroth so I can finally reunite with you in the Promised Land. Xoxoxo.” Aerith doesn’t factor in at all. Returning to his family is his goal, and his fight with Bahamut/the Remnants/Sephiroth/whatever the fuck is the final obstacle he has to face before reaching this goal.
This is reiterated again when Cloud is shot by Yazoo and seemingly perishes in an explosion. What is at stake with his “death”? We see Tifa calling his name while looking out the airship. We see Denzel and Marlene waiting for him at Seventh Heaven. We do not see Aerith watching over him in the Lifestream.
Now, Aerith does play an important role in Cloud’s arc when she shows up at about the midpoint of the film. You could fairly argue that it’s the turning point in Cloud’s emotional journey, the moment when he finally decides to confront his problems. But even if it’s only Cloud and Aerith in the scene, it’s not really about their relationship at all.
Let’s consider the context before this scene happens. Denzel and Marlene have been kidnapped by the Remnants; Tifa was nearly killed in a fight with another. This is Cloud at his lowest point. It’s his worst fears come to pass. His guilt over Aerith’s death is directly addressed at this moment in the film because it is not so much about his feelings for Aerith as it is about how Cloud fears the failures of his past (one of the biggest being her death) would continue into the present. If it was just about Aerith, we could have seen Cloud asking for her forgiveness at any other time in the film. It occurs when it does because this when his guilt over Aerith’s death intersects with his actual conflict, his fear that he’ll fail the the ones he loves. She appears when he’s at the Forgotten City where he goes to save the children. The same location where he had failed two year before.
This connection is made explicit when Cloud has flashes of Zack and Aerith’s deaths before he saves Denzel and Tifa from Bahamut. Again, Cloud’s dwelling on the past is directly related to his fears of being unable to protect his present.
Aerith is a feminine figure who is associated with flowers. That combined with the players’ memory of her and her relationship with Cloud in the OG, I can see how their scenes can be construed as romantic, but I really do not think that it is the creators’ intent to portray any romantic longing on Cloud’s part.
If they wanted to suggest that Cloud was still in love with Aerith or even leave his romantic interest ambiguous, there is no way in hell they would have had Cloud living with Tifa and two kids prior to the film’s events. To say nothing of opening the film by showing the pain his absence brings.
A romantic reading of Cloud’s guilt over Aerith’s death would suggest that he entered into a relationship with Tifa and started raising two children with her while still holding a torch for Aerith and hoping for a way to be reunited with her. The implication would be that Tifa is his second choice, and he is settling. Now, is this a dynamic that occurs in real life? Absolutely. Is this something that is often depicted in some films and television? Sure - in fact this very premise is at the core of one my favorite films of the last decade - 45 Years — and spoiler alert — the guy does not come off well in this situation. But once again, Cloud is not a real person, and Final Fantasy VII: Advent Children is not a John Cassavettes film or an Ingmar Bergman chamber drama. It is a 2-hour long straight to DVD sequel for a video game made for teens. This kind of messy, if realistic, relationship dynamic is not what this particular work is trying to explore.
(one of these is a good film!)
By the end of Advent Children, Cloud is once again the idealized version of himself. A hero that the audience is supposed to like and admire. We are supposed to think that his actions in the first half of the movie (wallowing in his guilt and abandoning his family) were bad. These are the flaws that he must overcome through the course of the film, and by the end he does. If he really had been settling and treating his Seventh Heaven family as a second choice prior to the events of the film, that too would obviously be a character flaw that needs to be addressed before the end of the film. It isn’t because this is a dynamic that only exists in certain people’s imaginations.
If the creators wanted to leave the Cloud & Aerith relationship open to a romantic interpretation, they didn’t have to write themselves into such a corner. They wouldn’t have to change the final film much at all, merely adjust the chronology a bit. Instead of Cloud already living as a family with Tifa, Marlene and Denzel prior to the beginning of the film, you would show them on the precipice of becoming a family, but with Cloud being unable to take the final step without getting over his feelings for Aerith first. This would leave space for him to love both women without coming off as an opportunistic jerk.
This is essentially the dynamic with Locke/Rachel/Celes in FFVI. Locke is unable to move on with Celes or anyone else until he finally finds closure with Rachel. It’s a lovely scene that does not diminish his relationships with either woman. He loved Rachel. He will love Celes. What the game does not have him do is enter into a relationship into Celes first and then when the party arrives at the Phoenix Cave, have him suddenly remember ‘Oh shit, I’ve gotta deal with my baggage with Rachel before I can really move on.’ That would not paint him in a particularly positive light.
Speaking of other Final Fantasies, let’s take a look another sequel in the series set two years after the events of the original work, one that is clearly the story of its protagonist searching for their lost love. And guess what? Final Fantasy X-2 does not begin with Yuna shacked up and raising two kids with another dude. And it certainly doesn’t begin with his perspective of the whole situation when Yuna decides to search for Tidus.
Square Enix knows how to write these kind of stories when they want to, and it’s clearly not their intent for Cloud and Aerith. Again, the biggest obstacle in the way of a Cloud/Aerith endgame isn’t space and time or death, it’s the existence of Tifa Lockhart.
A reasonable question to ask would be, if SE is not trying to ignite debate over the love triangle, why make Cloud’s relationship with Aerith a part of Advent Children at all? Why invite that sort of confusion? Well, the answer here, like the answer in the OG, is that Aerith’s role in the sequel is much more than her relationship with Cloud.
In the OG, it wasn’t Cloud and the gang who managed to stop Sephiroth and Meteor in the end, it was Aerith from the Lifestream. In a two-hour long film, you do not have the time to set up a completely new villain who can believably end the world, and since you pretty much have to include Sephiroth, the main antagonist can really only be him. No one else in the party has been established to have any magical Cetra powers, and again, since that’s not something that can be effectively established in a two-hour long film, and since Aerith needs to appear somehow, it again needs to be her who will save the day.
Given the time constraints, this external conflict has to be connected with Cloud’s internal conflict. In the OG, Cloud’s emotional arc is in resolved in the Lifestream, and then we spend a few more hours hunting down the Huge Materia/remembering what Holy is before resolving the external conflict of stopping Meteor. In Advent Children, we do not have that luxury of time. These turning points have to be one and same. It is only after Aerith is “introduced” in the film when Cloud asks her for forgiveness that she is able to help in the fight against the Remnants. Thus the turning point for Cloud’s character arc and the external conflict are the same. It’s understandably economical storytelling, though I wouldn’t call it particularly good storytelling.
As much as Cloud feels guilt over both Zack and Aerith’s deaths, it’s only Aerith who can play this dual role in the film. Zack can appear to help resolve Cloud’s emotional arc, but since he has no special Cetra powers or anything, there’s little he can do to help in Cloud’s fight against the Remnants. More time would need to be spent contriving a reason why Cloud is able to defeat the Remnants now when he wasn’t before or explaining why Aerith can suddenly help from the Lifestream when she had been absent before. (I still don’t think the film does a particularly good job of explaining this part, but that is a conversation for another time).
Another reason why Zack could not play this role is because at the time of AC’s original release, all we knew of Cloud and Zack’s relationship was contained in an optional flashback at the Shinra mansion after Cloud returns from the Lifestream. If it was Zack who suddenly showed up at Cloud’s lowest point, most viewers, even many who played the original game, would probably have been confused, and the moment would have fallen flat. On the other hand, even the most casual fan would have been aware of Aerith and her connection to Cloud, with her death scene being among the most well-known gaming moments of all time. Moreover, Aerith’s death is directly connected to Sephiroth, who is once again the threat in AC, whereas Zack was killed by Shinra goons. Aerith serves multiple purposes in a way that Zack just cannot.
Despite all this, though Aerith is more important to the film as a whole, many efforts are made to suggest that Zack and Aerith are equally important to Cloud. One of the first scenes in the film is Cloud moping around Zack’s grave (And unlike the scene with Aerith in the Forgotten City, it isn’t directly connected with Cloud’s present storyline in any way). We have the aforementioned scene where Cloud has flashes of both Aerith’s and Zack’s deaths when he saves Tifa and Denzel. Cloud has a scene where he’s standing back to back with Zack, mirroring his scene with in the Forgotten City with Aerith, before the climax of his fight with Sephiroth. In the Lifestream, after Cloud “dies,” it’s both Aerith and Zack who are there to send him back. Before the film ends, Cloud sees both Aerith and Zack leaving the church.
Now, were all these Zack appearances a way to promote the upcoming spin-off game that he’s going to lead? Of course. But the creators surely would have known that having Zack play such a similar role in Cloud’s arc would make Cloud’s relationship with Aerith feel less special and thus complicating a romantic interpretation of said relationship. If they wanted to encourage a romantic reading of Cloud’s lingering feelings for Aerith, they would have given Zack his own distinct role in the film. Or rather, they wouldn’t have put Zack in the film at all, and they certainly wouldn’t have him lead his own game, but we’ll get to the Zack of it all later.
The funny thing is, in a way, Zack is portrayed as being more special to Cloud. Zack only exists in the film to interact with Cloud and encourage him. Meanwhile. Aerith also has brief interactions with Kadaj, the Geostigma children and even Tifa before the film’s end. Aerith is there to save the whole world. Zack is there just for Cloud. If it’s Cloud’s relationship with Aerith that’s meant to be romantic, shouldn’t it be the other way around?
Let’s take a look at Tifa Lockhart. What role did she have to play in the FF7 sequel film? If, like some, you believed FF7 to be the Cloud/Aerith/Sephiroth show, then Tifa could have easily had a Barret-sized cameo in Advent Children. And honestly, she’s just a great martial artist. She has no special powers that would make her indispensable in a fight against Sephiroth. You certainly would not expect her to be the 2nd billed character in the film. Though of course, if you actually played through the Original Game with your eyes open, you would realize that Tifa Lockhart is instrumental to any story about Cloud Strife.
Unlike Aerith’s appearances, almost none of the suggestive scenes and dynamics between Cloud and Tifa had to be included in the film. As in, they serve no other plot related purpose and could have easily been cut from the final film if the creators weren’t trying to encourage a romantic interpretation of their relationship.
It feels inevitable now, but no one was expecting Cloud and Tifa to be living together and raising two kids. In the general consciousness, FF7 is Cloud and Sephiroth and their big swords and Aerith’s death. At the time, in the eyes of most fans and casual observers, Cloud and Tifa being together wasn’t a necessary part of the FF7 equation the way say, an epic fight between Cloud and Sephiroth would be. In fact, I don’t think even the biggest Cloti fans at the time would have imagined Cloud and Tifa living together would be their canon outcome in the sequel film.
Now can two platonic friends live together and raise two children together? Absolutely, but again Cloud and Tifa are not real people. They are fictional characters. A reasonable person (let’s use the legal definition of the term) who does not have brainworms from arguing over one of the dumbest debates on the Internet for 23 years would probably assume that two characters who were shown to be attracted to each other in the OG and who are now living together and raising two kids are in a romantic relationship. This is a reasonable assumption to make, and if SE wanted to leave Cloud’s romantic inclinations ambiguous, they simply would not be depicting Cloud and Tifa’s relationship in this manner. Cloud’s disrupted peace could have been a number of different things. He could have been a wandering mercenary, he could have been searching for a way to be reunited with Aerith. It didn’t have to be the family he formed with Tifa, but, then again, if you were actually paying attention to the story the OG was trying to tell, of course he would be living with Tifa.
Let’s also look at the scene where Cloud finds Tifa in the church after her fight with Loz. All the plot related information (who attacked her, Marlene being taken) is conveyed in the brief conversation they have before Cloud falls unconscious from Geostigma. What purpose do all the lingering shots of Cloud and Tifa in the flower bed in a Yin-Yang/non-sexual 69ing position serve if not to be suggestive of the type of relationship they have? It’s beautifully rendered but ultimately irrelevant to both the external and internal conflicts of the film.
Likewise, there is no reason why Cloud and Tifa needed to wake up in their children’s bedroom. No reason to show Cloud waking up with Tifa next to him in a way that almost makes you think they were in the same bed. And there is absolutely no reason whatsoever for a close-up of Tifa’s hand with the Wolf Ring on her ring finger while she is admonishing Cloud during what sounds like a domestic argument (This ring again comes into focus when Tifa leads Denzel to Cloud at the church at the end - there are dozens of ways this scene could have been rendered, but this is the one that was chosen.) If it wasn’t SE’s intent to emphasize the family dynamic and the intimate nature of Cloud and Tifa’s relationship, these scenes would not exist.
Let’s also take a look at Denzel, the only new character in the AC (give or take the Remnants). Again, given the film’s brief runtime, the fact that they’re not only adding a new character but giving him more screen time than almost every other AVALANCHE member must mean that he’s pretty important. While Denzel does have an arc of his own, especially in ACC, he is intricately connected to Cloud and Tifa and solidifies the family unit that they’ve been forming in Edge. Marlene still has Barret, but with the addition of Denzel, the family becomes something more real albeit even more tenuous given his Geostigma diagnosis. Without Denzel in the picture, it’s a bit easier to interpret Cloud’s distance from Tifa as romantic pining for another woman, but now it just seems absurd. The stakes are so much higher. Cloud and Tifa are at a completely different stage in their lives from the versions of these characters we met early on in the OG who were entangled in a frivolous love triangle. And yet some people are still stuck trying to fit these characters into a childish dynamic that died at the end of disc one along with a certain someone.
All this is there in the film, at least the director’s cut, if you really squint. But since SE preferred to spend its time on countless action sequences that have aged as well as whole milk in lieu of spending a few minutes showing Cloud’s family life before he got Geostigma to establish the emotional stakes, or a beat or two more on his reconciliation with Tifa and the kids, people may be understandably confused about Cloud’s arc. Has Cloud just been a moping around in misery for the two years post-OG? The answer is no, though that can only really be found in the accompanying novellas, specifically Case of Tifa.
Concerning the novellas, which we apparently must read to understand said DVD sequel
I really don’t know how you can read through CoT and still think there is anything ambiguous about the nature of Cloud and Tifa’s relationship. The “Because I have you this time,” Cloud telling Tifa he’ll remind her how to be strong when they’re alone, Cloud confidently agreeing when Marlene adds him to their family. Not to mention Barret and Cid’s brief conversation about Cloud and Tifa’s relationship in Case of Barret, after which Cid comments that “women wear the pants,” which Barret then follows by asking Cid about Shera. Again, a reasonable person would assume the couple in question are in a romantic relationship, and if this wasn’t the intent, these lines would not be present. Especially not in a novella about someone else.
Some try to argue that CoT just shows how incompatible Cloud and Tifa are because it features a few low points in their relationship. I don’t think that’s Nojima’s intent. Even if it was, it certainly wouldn’t be to prove that Cloud loves Aerith. This isn’t how you tell that story. Why waste all that time disproving a negative rather than proving a positive? We didn’t spend hours in FF8 watching Rinoa’s relationship with Seifer fall apart to understand how much better off she is with Squall. If Cloud and Aerith is meant to be a love story, then tell their love story. Why tell the story of how Cloud is incompatible with someone else?
Part of the confusion may be because CoT doesn’t tell a complete story in and of itself. The first half of the story (before Cloud has to deliver flowers to the Forgotten City) acts as a sort of epilogue to the OG, while the second half of the story is something of a prologue to Advent Children (or honestly its missing Act One). And to state the obvious, conflict is inherent to any story worth telling. It can’t just be all fluff, that’s what the fanfiction is for.
Tifa’s conflict is her fear that the fragile little family they’ve built in Edge is going to fall apart. Thus we see her fret about Cloud’s distance, the way this affects Marlene, and Denzel’s sickness. There are certainly some low moments here --- Tifa telling Cloud to drink in his room, asking if he loves her -- all ways for the threat to seem more real, the outcome more uncertain, yet there’s only one way this conflict can be resolved. One direction to which their relationship can move.
Again, by the end of this story, both characters are supposed to be the best versions of themselves, to find their “happy” endings so to speak. Tifa could certainly find happiness outside of a relationship with Cloud. She could decide that they’ve given it a shot, but they’re better off as friends. She’s grateful for this experience and she’s learned from this, but now she’s ready to make a life for herself on her own. It would be a fine character arc, though not something the Final Fantasy series has been wont to do. However, that’s obviously not the case here as there’s no indication whatsoever that Tifa considers this as an option for herself. Nojima hasn’t written this off ramp into her journey. For Tifa, they’ll either become a real family or they won’t. Since this is a story that is going to have a happy ending, so of course they will, even if there are a lot of bumps along the way.
Unfortunately, with the Compilation being the unwieldy beast that this is, this whole arc has to be pieced together across a number of different works:
Tifa asking herself if they’re a real family in CoT
Her greatest fear seemingly come to life when Cloud leaves at the end of CoT/beginning of AC
Tifa explicitly asking Cloud if the reason they can’t help each other is because they’re not a real family during their argument in AC. Notably, even though Cloud is at his lowest point, he doesn’t confirm her fear. Instead he says he that he can’t help anyone, not even his family. Instead, he indirectly confirms that yes he does think they’re a family, even if is a frustrating moment still in that he’s too scared to try to save it.
The ending of AC where we see a new photo of Cloud smiling surrounded by Tifa and the kids and the rest of the AVALANCHE, next to the earlier photo we had seen of the four of them where he was wearing a more dour expression.
The ending of The Kids Are All Right, where Cloud, Tifa, Denzel and Marlene meet with Evan, Kyrie and Vits - and Cloud offers, unsolicited, that even if they’re not related by blood, they’re a family.
The ending of DVD extra ‘Reminiscence of FFVII’ where Cloud takes the day off and asks Tifa to close the bar so they can spend time together as a family as Tifa had wanted to do early in CoT
Cloud fears he’ll fail his family. Tifa fears it’ll fall apart. Cloud retreats into himself, pushing others away. Tifa neglects herself, not being able to say what she needs to say. In Advent Children, Tifa finally voices her frustrations. It’s then that Cloud finally confronts his fears. Like in the OG, Cloud and Tifa’s conflicts and character arcs are two sides of the same coin, and it’s only by communicating with each other are they able to resolve it. Though with the Compilation being an inferior work, it’s much less satisfying this time around. Such is the problem when you’re writing towards a preordained outcome (Cloud and Sephiroth duking it once again) rather than letting the story develop organically.
Some may ask, why mention Aerith so much (Cloud growing distant after delivering flowers to the Forgotten City, Cloud finding Denzel at Aerith’s church) if they weren’t trying to perpetuate the LTD? Well, as explained above, Aerith had to be in Advent Children, and since CoT is the only place where we get any insight into Cloud’s psyche, it’s here where Nojima expands on that guilt.
Again, this is a story that requires conflict, and what better conflict than the specter of a love rival? Notably, despite us having access to Tifa’s thoughts and fears, she never explicitly associates Cloud’s behavior with him pining after Aerith. Though it’s fair to say this fear is implied, if unwarranted.
If Cloud had actually been pining after Aerith this whole time, we would not be seeing it all unfold through Tifa’s perspective. You can depict a romance without drawing attention to the injured third party. We’re seeing all of this from Tifa’s POV, because it’s about Tifa’s insecurities, not the great tragic romance between Cloud and Aerith. Honestly, another reason we see this from Tifa’s perspective is because it’s dramatically more interesting. Because she’s insecure, she (and we the reader) wonder if there’s something else going on. Meanwhile, from Cloud’s perspective it would be straightforward and redundant, given what we see in AC. He’s guilty over Aerith’s death and thinks he doesn’t deserve to be happy.
Not to mention, the first time we encounter Aerith in CoT, Tifa is the one breaking down at her grave while Cloud is the one comforting her. Are we supposed to believe that he just forgot he was in love with Aerith until he had to deliver flowers to the Forgotten City?
And Aerith doesn’t just serve as a romantic obstacle. She’s also a symbol of guilt and redemption for both Cloud and Tifa. Neither think they have the right to be happy after all that’s happened (Aerith’s death being a big part of this), and through Denzel, who Cloud finds at Aerith’s church, they both see a chance to atone.
I do want to address Case of Lifestream: White because it’s only time in the entire Compilation where I’ve asked myself — what are they trying to achieve here? Now, I’d rather drink bleach than start debating the translation of ‘koibito’ again, but I did think it was a strange choice to specify the romantic nature of Aerith’s love for Cloud. I suppose it could be a reference her obvious attraction to Cloud in the OG, though calling it love feels like a stretch.
But nothing else in CoLW really gives me pause. It might be a bit jarring to see how much of it is Aerith’s thoughts of Cloud, but it makes sense when you consider the context in which it’s meant to be consumed. Unlike Case of Tifa or Case of Denzel, CoLW isn’t meant to be read on its own. It’s a few scant paragraphs in direct conversation with Case of Lifestream: Black. In CoLB, Sephiroth talks about his plan to return and end the world or whatever, and how Cloud is instrumental to his plan. Each segment of CoLW mirrors the corresponding segment of CoLB. Thus, CoLW has to be about Aerith’s plan to stop Sephiroth and the role Cloud must play in that. In both of these stories, Cloud is the only named character. It doesn’t mean that thoughts of Cloud consume all of Aerith’s afterlife. Case of Lifestream is only a tiny sliver of the story, a halfassed way to explain why in Advent Children the world is ending again and why Cloud has to be at the center of it all.
Notably, there is absolutely nothing in CoLW about Cloud’s feelings for Aerith. Even if it’s just speculation on her part as we see Sephiroth speculate about Cloud’s reactions in CoLB. Aerith can see what’s going on in the real world, but she says nothing about Cloud’s actions. If Cloud is really pining after her, trying to find a way to be reunited with her, wouldn’t this be the ideal story to show such devotion?
But it’s not there, because not only does it not happen, but because this story is not about Aerith’s relationship with Cloud. It is about how Aerith needs to see and warn Cloud in order to stop Sephiroth. By the end of Advent Children, that goal is fulfilled. Cloud gets his forgiveness. Aerith gets to see him again and helps him stop Sephiroth. There’s no suggestion that either party wants more. We finally have the closure that the OG lacked, and at no point does it confirm that Cloud reciprocated Aerith’s romantic feelings, even though there were plenty of opportunities to do so.
I don’t really know what else people were expecting. Advent Children isn’t a romantic drama. There’s not going to be a moment where Cloud explicitly tells Tifa, ‘I’ve never loved Aerith. It’s only been you all along.” This is just simply not the kind of story it is.
Though one late scene practically serves this function. When Cloud “dies” and Aerith finds him in the Lifestream, if there were any lingering romantic feelings between the two of them, this would be a beautiful bittersweet reunion. Maybe something about how as much as they want to be together, it’s not his time yet. Instead, it’s almost played off as a joke. Cloud calls her ‘Mother’, and Zack is at Aerith’s side, joking about how Cloud has no place there. This would be the perfect opportunity to address the romantic connection between Cloud and Aerith, but instead, the film elides this completely. Instead, it’s a cute afterlife moment between Aerith and Zack, and functionally allows Cloud to go back to where he belongs, to Tifa and the kids. Whatever Cloud’s feelings for Aerith were before, it’s transformed into something else.
Crisis Core -- or how Aerith finally gets her love story
The other relevant part of the Compilation is Crisis Core, which I will now touch on briefly (or at least brief for me). In the OG, Zack Fair was more plot device than character. We knew he was important to Cloud — enough that Cloud would mistake Zack’s memories for his own -- we knew he was important to Aerith — enough that she is initially drawn to Cloud due to his similarities to Zack — yet the nature of these relationships is more ambiguous. Especially his relationship with Aerith. From the little we learn of their relationship, it could have been completely one-sided on her part, and Zack a total cad. At least that’s the implication she leaves us with in Gongaga. We get the sense that she might not be the most reliable narrator on this point (why bring up an ex so often, unsolicited, if it wasn’t anything serious?) but the OG never confirms this either way.
Crisis Core clears this up completely. Not only is Zack portrayed as the Capital H Hero of his own game, but his relationships with Cloud and Aerith are two of the most important in the game. In fact, they are the basis for his heroic sacrifice at the game’s end: he dies trying to save Cloud’s life; he dies trying to return to Aerith.
Zack’s relationship with Aerith is a major subplot of the game. Not only that, but the details of said relationship completely recontextualizes what we know about the Aerith we see in the OG. Many of Aerith’s most iconic traits (wearing pink, selling flowers) are a direct product of this relationship, and more importantly, so many of the hallmarks of her early relationship with Cloud (him falling through her church, one date as a reward, a conversation in the playground) are a direct echo of her relationship with Zack.
A casual fling this was not. Aerith’s relationship with Zack made a deep impact on the character we see in the OG and clearly colored her interactions with Cloud throughout.
Crisis Core is telling Zack’s story, and Tifa is a fairly minor supporting character, yet it still finds the time to expand upon Cloud and Tifa’s relationship. Through their interactions with Zack, we learn just how much they were on each others’ minds during this time, and how they were both too shy to own up to these feelings. We also get a brief expansion on the moment Cloud finds Tifa injured in the reactor.
Meanwhile, given the point we are in the story’s chronology, Cloud and Aerith are completely oblivious of each other’s existence.
One may try to argue that none of this matters since all of this is in the past. While this argument might hold water if we arguing about real lives in the real world, FF7 is a work of fiction. Its creators decided that these would be events we would see, and that Zack would be the lens through which we’d see them. Crisis Core is not the totality of these characters’ lives prior to the event of the OG. Rather, it consists of moments that enhance and expand upon our understanding of the original work. We learn the full extent of Hojo’s experimentation and the Jenova project; we learn that Sephiroth was actually a fairly normal guy before he was driven insane when he uncovers the circumstances of his birth. We learn that Aerith was a completely different person before she met Zack, and their relationship had a profound impact on her character.
A prequel is not made to contradict the original work, but what it can do is recontexualize the story we already know and add a layer of nuance that may have not been obvious before. Thus, Sephiroth is transformed from a scary villain into a tragic figure who could have been a hero were it not for Hojo’s experiments. Aerith’s behavior too invites reinterpretation. What once seemed flirty and perhaps overtly forward now looks like the tragic attempts of a woman trying to recapture a lost love.
If Cloud and Aerith were meant to be the official couple of the Compilation of FF7, you absolutely would not be spending so much time depicting two relationships that will be moot by the time we get to the original work. You especially would not depict Zack and Aerith’s relationship in a way that makes Aerith’s relationship with Cloud look like a copy of the moments she had with her ex.
Additionally, with Zack’s relationship with Angeal, we can see, that within the universe of FF7, a protagonist being devastated over the death of a beloved comrade isn’t something that’s inherently romantic. Neither is it romantic for said dead comrade to lend a helping hand from the beyond.
SE would also expect some people to play Crisis Core before the OG. If Cloud and Aerith are the intended endgame couple, then SE would be asking the player to root for a guy to pursue the girlfriend of the man who gave his life for him. The same man who died trying to reunite with her. This is to say nothing of Cloud’s treatment of Tifa in this scenario. How could this possibly be the intent for their most popular protagonist in the most popular entry of their most popular franchise?
What Crisis Core instead offers is something for fans of Aerith who may be disappointed that she was robbed of a great romance by her death. Well, she now gets that epic, tragic romance. Only it’s with Zack, not Cloud.
If SE intended for Cloud and Aerith to be the official couple of FF7, neither Zack nor Tifa would exist. They would not spend so much time developing Zack and Tifa into the multi-dimensional characters they are, only to be treated as nothing more than collateral damage in the wake of Cloud and Aerith’s great love. No, this is a Final Fantasy. SE want their main characters to have something of a happy ending after all of the tribulations they face. Cloud and Tifa find theirs in life. Zack and Aerith, as the ending of AC suggests, find theirs in death.
Cloud and Aerith’s relationship isn’t a threat to the Zack/Aerith and Cloud/Tifa endgame, nor is it a mere obstacle. Rather, it’s a relationship that actually deepens and strengthens the other two. Aerith is explicitly searching for her first love in Cloud, revealing just how deep her feelings for Zack ran. Cloud gets to live out his heroic SOLDIER fantasy with Aerith, a fantasy he created just to impress Tifa.
There are moments between Cloud and Aerith that may seem romantic when taken on its own, but viewed within the context of the whole narrative, ultimately reveal that they aren’t quite right for each other, and in each other, they’re actually searching for someone else.
This quadrangular dynamic reminds me a bit of one of my favorite classic films, The Philadelphia Story. (Spoilers for a film that came out in 1940 ahead) — The single most romantic scene in the film is between Jimmy Stewart’s and Katherine Hepburn’s characters, yet they’re not the ones who end up together. Even as their passions run, as the music swells, and we want them to end up together, we realize that they’re not quite right for each other. We know that it won’t work out.
More relevantly, we know this is true due to the existence of Cary Grant’s and Ruth Hussey’s characters, who are shown to carry a torch for Hepburn and Stewart, respectively. Grant and Hussey are well-developed and sympathetic characters. With the film being the top grossing film of the year, and made during the Code era, it’s about as “clean” of a narrative as you can get. There’s no way Grant and Hussey would be given such prominent roles just to be left heartbroken and in the cold by the film’s end.
Hepburn’s character (Tracy) pretty much sums it herself after some hijinks lead to a last minute proposal from Stewart’s character (Mike):
Mike: Will you marry me, Tracy?
Tracy: No, Mike. Thanks, but hmm-mm. Nope.
Mike: l've never asked a girl to marry me. l've avoided it. But you've got me all confused now. Why not?
Tracy: Because l don't think Liz [Hussey’s character] would like it...and l'm not sure you would...and l'm even a little doubtful about myself. But l am beholden to you, Mike. l'm most beholden.
Despite the fact that the film spends more time developing Hepburn and Stewart’s relationship than theirs with their endgame partners, it’s still such a satisfying ending. That’s because, even at the peak of their romance, we can see how Stewart needs someone like Hussey to ground his passionate impulses, and how Hepburn needs Grant, someone who won’t put her on a pedestal like everyone else. Hepburn and Stewart’s is a relationship that might feel right in the moment, but doesn’t quite work in the light of day.
I don’t think Cloud and Aerith share a moment that is nearly as romantic in FF7, but the same principle applies. What may seem romantic in the moment actually reveals how they’re right for someone else.
Even if Aerith lives and Cloud decides to pursue a relationship with her, it’s not going to be all puppies and roses ahead for them. Aerith would need to disentangle her feelings for Zack from her attraction to Cloud, and Cloud would still need to confront his feelings for Tifa, which were his main motivator for nearly half his life, before they can even start to build something real. This is messy work, good fodder for a prestige cable drama or an Oscar-baity indie film, but it has no place in a Final Fantasy. There simply isn’t the time. Not when the question on most players’ minds isn’t ‘Cloud does love?’ but ‘How the hell are they going to stop that madman and his Meteor that’s about to destroy the world?’
With Zerith’s depiction in Crisis Core, there’s a sort of bittersweet poetry in how the two relationships rhyme but can’t actually coexist. It is only because Zack is trying to return to Midgar to see Aerith that Cloud is able to reunite with Tifa, and the OG begins in earnest. In another world, Zack and Aerith would be the hero and heroine who saved the world and lived to tell the tale. They are much more the traditional archetypes - Zack the super-powered warrior who wants to be a Capital-H Hero, and Aerith, the last of her kind who reluctantly accepts her fate. Compared to these two, Cloud and Tifa aren’t nearly so special, nor their goals so lofty and noble. Cloud, after all, was too weak to even get into SOLDIER, and only wanted to be one, not for some greater good, but to impress the girl he liked. Tifa has no special abilities, merely learning martial arts when she grew wise enough to not wait around for a hero. On the surface, Cloud and Tifa are made of frailer stuff, and yet by luck or by fate, they’re the ones who cheat death time and time again, and manage to save the world, whereas the ones who should have the role, are prematurely struck down before they can finish the job. Cloud and Tifa fulfill the roles that they never asked for, that they may not be particularly suited for, in Zack and Aerith’s stead. There’s a burden and a beauty to it. Cloud and Tifa can live because Zack and Aerith did not.
All of this nuance is lost if you think Cloud and Aerith are meant to be the endgame couple. Instead, you have a pair succumbing to their basest desires, regardless of the selfless sacrifices their other potential paramours made for their sake. Zack and Tifa, and their respective relationships with Aerith and Cloud, are flattened into mere romantic obstacles. The heart wants what it wants, some may argue. While that may be true in real life, that is not necessarily the case in a work of fiction, especially not a Final Fantasy. The other canon Final Fantasy couples could certainly have had previous romantic relationships, but unless they have direct relevance to the their character arcs (e.g., Rachel to Locke), the games do not draw attention to them because they would be a distraction from the romance they are trying to tell. They’ve certainly never spent the amount of real estate FF7 spends in depicting Cloud/Tifa and Zack/Aerith’s relationships.
At last…the Remake, and somehow this essay isn’t even close to being over
Finally, we come to the Remake. With the technological advancements made in the last 23 years and the sheer amount of hours they’re devoting to just the Midgar section this time around, you can almost look at the OG as an outline and the Remake as the final draft. With the OG being overly reliant on text to do its storytelling, and the Remake having subtle facial expressions and a slew of cinematic techniques at its disposal, you might almost consider it an adaptation from a literary medium to a visual one. Our discussions are no longer limited to just what the characters are saying, but what they are doing, and even more importantly, how the game presents those actions. When does the game want us to pay attention? And what does it want us to pay attention to?
Unlike most outlines, which are read by a small handful of execs, SE has 23 years worth of reactions from the general public to gauge what works and what doesn’t work, what caused confusion, and what could be clarified. While FF7 is not a romance, the LTD remains a hot topic among a small but vocal part of the fanbase. It certainly is an area that could do with some clarifying in the Remake.
Since the Remake is not telling a new story, but rather retelling an existing story that has been in the public consciousness for over two decades, certain aspects that were treated as “twists” in the OG no longer have that same element of surprise, and would need to approached differently. For example, in the Midgar section of the OG, Shinra is treated as the main antagonist throughout. It’s only when we get to the top of the Shinra tower that Sephiroth is revealed as the real villain. Anyone with even a passing of knowledge of FF7 would be aware of Sephiroth so trying to play it off like a surprise in the Remake would be terribly anticlimactic. Thus, Sephiroth appears as early as Ch. 2 to haunt Cloud and the player throughout.
Likewise, many players who’ve never even touched the OG are probably aware that Aerith dies, thus her death can no longer be played for shock. While SE would still want the player to grow attached to Aerith so that her death has an emotional impact, there are diminishing returns to misdirecting the player about her fate, at least not in the same way it was done in the OG.
How do these considerations affect the how the LTD is depicted in the Remake? For the two of the biggest twists in the OG to land in the Remake — Aerith’s death and Cloud’s true identity in the Lifestream — the game needs to establish:
Aerith’s attraction to Cloud, specifically due to his similarities to Zack. This never needs to go past an initial attraction for the player to understand that the man whose memory Cloud was “borrowing” is Zack. Aerith’s feelings for Cloud can evolve into something platonic or even maternal by her end without the reveal in the Lifestream losing any impact.
Cloud’s love for Tifa. For the Lifestream sequence to land with an “Ooooh!” rather than a “Huh!?!?”, the Remake will need to establish that Cloud’s feelings for Tifa were strong enough to 1) motivate him to try to join SOLDIER in the first place 2) incentivize him to adopt a false persona because he fears that he isn’t the man she wants him to be 3) call him back to consciousness from Make poisoning twice 4) help him put his mind back together and find his true self. That’s a lot of story riding on one guy’s feelings!
The player’s love for Aerith so that her death will hurt. This can be done by making them invested in Aerith as a character by her own right, but also extends to the relationships she has with the other characters (not only Cloud).
What is not necessary is establishing Cloud’s romantic feelings for Aerith. Now, would their doomed romance make her death hurt even more? Sure, but it could work just as well if Cloud if is losing a dear friend and ally, not a lover. Not to mention, her death also cuts short her relationships with Tifa, Barret, Red XII, etc. Bulking those relationships up prior to her death, would also make her loss more palpable. If anything, establishing Cloud’s romantic feelings for Aerith would actually undermine the game’s other big twist. The game needs you to believe that Cloud’s feelings for Tifa were strong enough to drive his entire hero’s journey. If Cloud is shown falling in love with another woman in the span of weeks if not mere days, then the Lifestream scene would be much harder to swallow.
Cloud wavering between the two women made sense in the OG because the main way for the player to get to know Aerith was through her interactions with Cloud. That is no longer the case in the Remake. Cloud is still the protagonist, and the player character for the vast majority of the game, but there are natural ways for the player to get to know Aerith outside of her dialogue exchanges with Cloud. Unless SE considers the LTD an integral part of FF7’s DNA, then for the sake of story clarity, the LTD doesn’t need to exist.
How then does the Remake clarify things?
I’m not going go through every single change in the Remake — there are far too many of them, and they’ve been documented elsewhere. Most of the changes are expansions or adaptations (what might make sense for super-deformed chibis would look silly for realistic characters, e.g., Cloud rolling barrels in the Church has now become him climbing across the roof support). What is expanded and how it’s adapted can be telling, but what is more interesting are the additions and removals. Not just for what takes place in the scenes themselves, but how their addition or removal changes our understanding of the narrative as a whole vis-a-vis the story we know from the OG.
Notably, one of the features that is not expanded upon, but rather diminished, is player choice. In the OG, the player had a slew of dialogue options to choose from, especially during the Midgar portion of the game. Not only did it determine which character would go on a date with Cloud at the Gold Saucer, but it also made the player identify with Cloud since they’re largely determining his personality during this stage. Despite the technological advances that have made this level of optionality the norm in AAA games, the Remake gives the player far fewer non-gameplay related choices, and only really the illusion of choice as a nod to the OG, but they don’t affect the story of the game in any meaningful way. You get a slightly different conversation depending on the choice, but you have to buy the Flower, Tifa has to make you a drink.
So much of what fueled the LTD in the OG came from this mechanic, which is now largely absent in the Remake. Almost every instance where there was a dialogue branch in the OG has become a single, canon scenario in the Remake that favors Tifa (e.g., having the choice of giving the flower to Tifa or Marlene in the OG, to Cloud giving the flower to Tifa in the Remake). Similarly, for the only meaningful choice you make in the Remake — picking Tifa or Aerith in the sewers — Cloud is now equidistant to both girls, whereas in the OG, his starting point was much closer to Aerith. In the OG, player choice allowed you to largely determine Cloud’s personality, and the girl he favored — and seemingly encouraged you to choose Aerith in many instances. In the Remake, Cloud is now his own character, not who the player wants him to be. And this Cloud, well, he sure seems to have a thing for Tifa.
In fact, one of the first changes in the Remake is the addition of Jessie asking Cloud about his relationship with Tifa, and Cloud’s brief flashback to their childhood together. In the OG, Tifa isn’t mentioned at all during the first reactor mission, and we don’t see her until we get to Sector 7.
Not only does this scene reveal Tifa’s importance to Cloud much earlier on than in the OG, but it sets up a sort of frame of reference that colors Cloud’s subsequent interactions. Even as Jessie kind of flirts with him throughout the reactor mission, even with his chance meeting Aerith in Sector 8, in the back of your mind, you might be thinking — wait what about his relationship with this Tifa character? What if he’s already spoken for?
Think about how this plays out in the OG. Jessie is pretty much a non-entity, and Cloud has his meet-cute with the flower girl before we’re even aware that Tifa exists. It’s hard to get too invested in his interactions with Tifa, when you know he has to meet the flower girl again, and you’re waiting for that moment, because that’s when the game will start in earnest.
After chapter 1 of the Remake, a new player may be asking — who is this Tifa person, and, echoing Jessie’s question, what kind of relationship does she have with Cloud? It’s a question that’s repeated when Barret mentions her before they set the bomb, and again when Barret specifies Seventh Heaven is where Tifa works — and the game zooms in on Cloud’s face — when they arrive in Sector 7.
It’s when we finally meet her at Seventh Heaven in Ch. 3 that we feel, ah now, this game has finally begun.
It’s also interesting how inorganically this question is introduced in the Remake. Up until that moment, the dialogue and Cloud are all business. Then, as they’re waiting for the gate to open, Jessie asks about Tifa completely out of the blue, and Cloud, all of a sudden, is at a lost for words, and has the first of many flashbacks. That this moment is a bit incongruous shows the effort SE made to establish Tifa’s importance to the game and to Cloud early on.
One of the biggest changes in the Remake is the addition of the events in Ch. 3 and 4. Unlike what happens in Ch. 18, Ch. 3 and 4 feel like such a natural extension of the OG’s story that many players may not even realize that SE has added an whole day’s and night’s worth of events to the OG’s story. While not a drastic change, it does reshape our understanding of subsequent events in the story, namely Cloud’s time spent alone with Aerith.
In the OG, we rush from one reactor mission to the next, with no real time to explore Cloud’s character or his relationships with any of the other characters in between. When he crashes through the church, he gets a bit of a breather. We see a different side of him with Aerith. Since we have nothing else to compare it to, many might assume that his relationship with Aerith is special. That she brings something out of him that no one else can.
That is no longer the case in the Remake. While Cloud’s time in Sector 5 with Aerith remains largely unchanged though greatly expanded, it no longer feels “special.” So many of the beats that seemed exclusive to his relationship with Aerith in the OG, we’ve now already seen play out with both Tifa and the other members of AVALANCHE long before he meets Aerith.
Cloud tells the flowers to listen to Aerith; he’s told Tifa he’s listening if she wants to talk; told Bigg’s he wants to hear the story of Jessie’s dad. Cloud offers to walk Aerith back home; he offered the same to Wedge. Cloud smiles at Aerith; he’s already smiled at Tifa and AVALANCHE a number of times.
Now, I’m under no illusion that SE added these chapters solely to diminish Aerith’s importance to Cloud (other than the obvious goal of making the game longer, I imagine they wanted the player to spend more time in Sector 7 and more time with the other AVALANCHE members so that the collapse of the Pillar and their deaths have more weight), but they certainly must have realized that this would be one effect. If pushing Cloud/Aerith’s romance had been a goal with the Remake, this would be a scenario they would try to avoid. Notably, the other place where time has been added - the night in the Underground Shinra Lab, and the day helping other people out around the slums — are also periods of time when Aerith is absent.
Home Sweet Slums vs. Budding Bodyguard
Since most of the events in Ch. 3 were invented for the Remake, and thus we have nothing in the OG to compare it to (except to say that something is probably better than nothing), I thought it would be more interesting to compare it to Ch. 8. Structurally, they are nearly identical — Cloud doing sidequests around the Sectors with one of the girls as his guide. Extra bits of dialogue the more sidequests you complete, with an optional story event if you do them all. Do Cloud’s relationships with each girl progress the same way in both chapters? Is the Remake just Final Waifu Simulator 2020 or are they distinct, reflecting their respective roles in the story as a whole?
A lot of what the player takes away from these chapters is going to be pretty subjective (Is he annoyed with her or is he playing hard to get), yet the vibes of the two chapters are quite different. This is because in Ch. 3, the player is getting to know Tifa through her relationship with Cloud; in Ch. 8; the player is getting to know Aerith as a character on her own.
What do I mean by this? Let’s take Cloud’s initial introduction into each Sector. In Ch. 3, it’s a straight shot from Seventh Heaven to Stargazer Heights punctuated by a brief conversation where Tifa asks Cloud about the mission he was just on. We don’t learn anything new about Tifa’s character here. Instead we hear Cloud recount the mission we already saw play out in detail in Ch. 1 But it’s through this conversation that we get a glimpse of Cloud and Tifa’s relationship — unlike the reticent jerk he was with Avalanche, this Cloud is much more responsive and even tries to reassure her in his own stilted way. We also know that they have enough of a past together that Tifa can categorize him as “not a people person” — an assessment to which Cloud agrees. Slowly, we’re getting an answer to the question Jessie posed in Ch. 1 — just what kind of relationship does Cloud have with Tifa?
In Ch. 8, Aerith leads Cloud on a roundabout way through Sector 5, and stops, unprompted, to talk about her experiences helping at the restaurant, helping out the doctor, and helping with the orphans at the Leaf House. It’s not so much a conversation as a monologue. Cloud isn’t the one who inquires about these relationships, and more jarringly, he doesn’t respond until Aerith directly asks him a question (interestingly enough, it’s about the flower she gave him…which he then gave to Tifa). Here, the game is allowing the player to learn more about the kind of person Aerith is. Cloud is also learning about Aerith at the same time, but with his non-reaction, either the game itself is indifferent to Cloud’s feelings towards Aerith or it is deliberately trying to portray Cloud’s indifference to Aerith.
The optional story event you can see in each chapter after completing all the side quests is also telling. In Ch. 3, “Alone at Last” is almost explicitly about Cloud and Tifa’s relationship. It’s bookended by two brief scenes between Marle and Cloud — the first in which she lectures him about how he should treat Tifa almost like an overprotective in-law, the second after they return downstairs and Marle awards Cloud with an accessory “imbued with the fervent desire to be by one’s side for eternity” after he makes Tifa smile. In between, Cloud and Tifa chat alone in her room. Tifa finally gets a chance to ask Cloud about his past and they plan a little date to celebrate their reunion. There is also at least the suggestion that Cloud was expecting something else when Tifa asked him to her room.
In Ch. 8’s “The Language of Flowers,” Cloud and Aerith’s relationship is certainly part of the story — unlike earlier in the chapter, Cloud actually asks Aerith about what she’s doing and even supports her by talking to the flowers too, but the other main objective of this much briefer scene is to show Aerith’s relationship with the flowers and of her mysterious Cetra powers (though we don’t know about her ancestry just yet). Like a lot of Aerith’s dialogue, there’s a lot of foreshadowing and foreboding in her words. If anything, it’s almost as if Cloud is playing the Marle role to the flowers, as an audience surrogate to ask Aerith about her relationship with the flowers so that she can explain. Also, there’s no in-game reward that suggests what the scene was really about.
If there’s any confusion about what’s going on here, just compare their titles “Alone At Last” vs. “The Language of Flowers.”
I’ll try not to bring my personal feelings into this, but there’s just something so much more satisfying about the construction of Ch. 3. This is some real storytelling 101 shit, but I think a lot of it due to just how much set up and payoff there is, and how almost all of said payoff deepens our understanding of Cloud and Tifa’s relationship:
Marle: Cloud meets Tifa’s overprotective landlady towards the beginning of the chapter. She is dubious of his character and his relationship with TIfa. This impression does not change the second time they meet even though Tifa herself is there to mediate. It’s only towards the end of the chapter, after all the sidequests are complete, that this tension is resolved. Marle gives Cloud a lecture about how he should be treating Tifa, which he seems to take to heart. And Cloud finally earns Marle’s begrudging approval after he emerges from their rooms with a chipper-looking Tifa in tow.
Their past: For their first in-game interaction, Cloud casually brings up that fact that it’s been “Five years” since they’ve last, which seem to throw Tifa off a bit. As they’re replacing filters, Cloud asks Tifa what she’s been up to in the time since they’ve been apart, and Tifa quickly changes the subject. Tifa tries to ask Cloud about his life “after he left the village,” at the Neighborhood Watch HQ, and this time he’s the one who seems to be avoiding the subject. It’s only after all the Ch. 3 sidequests are complete, and they're alone in her room that Tifa finally gets the chance to ask her question. A question which Cloud still doesn’t entirely answer. This question remains unresolved, and anyone’s played the OG will know that it will remain unresolved for some time yet, as it is THE question of Cloud’s story as a whole.
The lessons: Tifa starts spouting off some lessons for life in the slums as she brings Cloud around the town, though it’s unclear if Cloud is paying attention or taking them to heart. After completing the first sidequest, Cloud repeats one of these sayings back to her, confirming that he’s been listening all along. By the end of the chapter, Cloud is repeating these lessons to himself, even when Tifa isn’t around. These lessons extend beyond this chapter, with Cloud being a real teacher’s pet, asking Tifa “Is this a lesson” in Ch. 10 once they reunite.
The drink: When Cloud first arrives at Seventh Heaven, Tifa plays hostess and asks him if he wants anything, but it seems he’s only interested in his money. After exploring the sector a bit, Tifa again tries to play the role of cheery bartender, offering to make him a cocktail at the bar, but Cloud sees through this facade, and they carry on. Finally, after the day’s work is done, to tide Cloud over while she’s meeting with AVALANCHE, Tifa finally gets the chance to make him a drink. No matter, which dialogue option the player chooses, Tifa and Cloud fall into the roles of flirty bartender and patron quite easily. Who would have thought this was possible from the guy we met in Ch. 1?
This dynamic is largely absent in Ch. 8, except perhaps exploring Aerith’s relationship with the flowers, which “pays off” in the “Language of Flowers” event, but again, that scene is primarily about Aerith’s character rather than her relationship with Cloud. The orphans and the Leaf House are a throughline of the chapter, but they are merely present. There’s no clear progression here as was the case with in Ch. 3. Sure, the kids admire Cloud quite a bit after he saves them, but it’s not like they were dubious of his presence before. They barely paid attention to him. In terms of the impact the kids have on Cloud’s relationship with Aerith, there isn’t much at all. Certainly nothing like the role Marle plays in developing his relationship with Tifa.
The thing is, there are plenty of moments that could have been set ups, only there’s no real follow through. Aerith introduces Cloud around town as her bodyguard, and some people like the Doctor express dubiousness of his ability to do the job, but even after we spend a whole day fighting off monsters, and defeating Rude, there’s no payoff. Not even a throwaway “Wow, great job bodyguarding” comment. Same with the whole “one date” reward. Other than a quick reference on the way to Sector 5, and Aerith threatening to reveal the deal to cajole Cloud into helping her gather flowers, it’s never brought up again, in this chapter, or the rest of the game.
Aerith also makes a big stink about Cloud taking the time to enjoy Elmyra’s cooking. This is after Cloud is excluded from AVALANCHE’s celebration in Seventh Heaven and after he misses out on Jessie’s mom’s “Midgar Special” with Biggs and Wedge. So this could have been have been the set up to Cloud finally getting to experience a nice, domestic moment where he feels like he’s part of a family. And this dinner does happen! Only…the Remake skips over it entirely. Which is quite a strange choice considering that almost every other waking moment of Cloud’s time in Midgar has been depicted in excruciating detail. SE has decided that either whatever happened in this dinner between these three characters is irrelevant to the story they’re trying to tell, or they’ve deliberately excluded this scene from the game so that the player wouldn’t get any wrong ideas from it (e.g., that Cloud is starting to feel at home with Aerith).
Speaking of home, the Odd Jobs in Ch. 3 feel a bit more meaningful outside of just the gameplay-related rewards because they’re a way for Cloud to improve his reputation as he considers building a life for himself in Sector 7. This intent is implicit as Tifa imparts upon him the life lessons for surviving the slums, and then explicit, when Tifa asks him if he’s going to “stick around a little longer” outside of Seventh Heaven and he answers maybe. (It is later confirmed when Cloud and Tifa converse in his room in Ch. 4 after he remembers their promise).
Despite Aerith’s endeavors to extend their time together, there’s no indication that Cloud is planning to put down roots in Sector 5, or even return. Not even after doing all the Odd Jobs. If anything, it’s just the opposite — after 3 Odd Jobs, Aerith, kind of jokingly tells Cloud “don’t think you can rely on me forever.” This is a line that has a deeper meaning for anyone who knows Aerith’s fate in the OG, but Cloud seems totally fine with the outcome. Similarly, at the end of the Chapter 8, Elmyra asks Cloud to leave and never speak to Aerith again — a request to which he readily agrees.
Adding to the different vibes of the Chapters are the musical themes that play in the background. In Ch. 3, it’s the “Main Theme of VII”, followed by “On Our Way” — two tracks that instantly recall the OG. While the Main Theme is a bit melancholy, it's also familiar. It feels like home. In Ch. 8, we have an instrumental version of ‘Hollow’ - the new theme written for the Remake. While, it’s a lovely piece, it’s unfamiliar and honestly as a bit anxiety inducing (as is the intent).
(A quick aside to address the argument that this proves ‘Hollow’ is about Cloud’s feelings for Aerith:
Which of course doesn’t make any damn sense because he hasn’t even lost Aerith at this point the story. Even if you want to argue that there is so timey-wimey stuff going on and the whole purpose of the Remake is to rewrite the timeline so that Cloud doesn’t lose Aerith around — shouldn’t there be evidence of this desire outside of just the background music? Perhaps, in Cloud’s actions during the Chapter which the song plays — shouldn’t he dread being parted from her, shouldn’t he be the one trying to extend their time together? Instead, he’s willing to let her go quite easily.
The more likely explanation as to why “Hollow” plays in Ch. 8 is that since the “Main Theme of FFVII” already plays in Ch. 3, the other “main theme” written for the Remake is going to play in the other chapter with a pseudo-open world vibe. If you’re going to say “Hollow” is about Cloud’s feelings for Aerith then you’d have to accept that the Main Theme of the entire series is about Cloud’s feelings for Tifa, which would actually make a bit more sense given that is practically Cloud’s entire character arc.)
Both chapters contain a scripted battle that must be completed before the chapter can end. They both contain a shot where Cloud fights side by side with each of the girls.
Here, Cloud and Tifa are both in focus during the entirety of this shot.
Here, the focus pulls away from Cloud the moment Aerith enters the frame.
I doubt the developers expected most players to notice this particular technique, but it reflects the subtle differences in the way these two relationships are portrayed. By the end of Ch. 3, Cloud and Tifa are acting as one unit. By the end of Ch. 8, even when they’re together, Cloud and Aerith are still apart.
A brief (lol) overview of some meaningful changes from the OG
One of the most significant changes in the Sector 7 chapters is how The Promise flashback is depicted. In the OG, Tifa is the one who has to remind Cloud of the Promise, in a rather pushy way, and whether Cloud chooses to join the next mission to fulfill his promise to her or because Barret is giving him a raise feels a bit more ambiguous.
In the Remake, the Promise has it’s own little mini-arc. It’s first brought up at the end of Ch. 3 when Cloud talks to Tifa about her anxieties about the upcoming mission. Tifa subtly references the Promise by mentioning that she’s “in a pitch” — a reference that goes over Cloud’s head. It’s only in Ch. 4, in the middle of a mission with Biggs and Wedge, where Tifa is no where in sight, that a random building fan reminds him of the Nibelheim water tower and the Promise he made to Tifa there. There’s also another brief flashback to that earlier moment in the bar when Tifa mentions she’s in a “pinch.” Again, the placement of this particular flashback at this particular moment feels almost jarring. And the flashback to the scene in the bar — a flashback to a scene we’ve already seen play out in-game — is the only one of its kind in the Remake. SE went out of the way to show that this particular moment is very important to Cloud and the game as whole. It’s when Cloud returns to his room, and Tifa asks him if he’s planning to stay in Midgar, that this mini-arc is finally complete. He brings up the Promise on his own, and makes it explicit that the reason he’s staying is for her. It’s to fulfill his Promise to her, not for money or for AVALANCHE — at this point, he’s not even supposed to be going on the next mission.
The Reactor 5 chapters are greatly expanded, but there aren’t really any substantive changes other than the addition of the rather intimate train roll scene between and Cloud and Tifa, which adds nothing to the story except to establish how horny they are for each other. We know this is the case, of course, because if you go out of your way to make Cloud look like an incompetent idiot and let the timer run out, you can avoid this scene altogether. But even in that alternate scene, Cloud’s concern for Tifa is crystal clear.
Ch. 8 also plays out quite similarly to the OG for the most part, though Cloud’s banter with Aerith on the rooftops doesn’t feel all that special since we’ve already seen him do the same with Tifa, Barret and the rest of AVALANCHE. The rooftops is the first place Cloud laughs in the OG. In the Remake, while Cloud might not have straight out laughed before, he’s certainly smiled quite a bit in the preceding chapters. Also, with the addition of voice acting and realistic facial expressions, that “laughter” in the Remake comes off much more sarcastic than genuine.
It’s also notable that in the Remake, Cloud vocally protests almost every time Aerith tries to extend their time together. In the OG, Cloud says nothing in these moments, which the player could reasonably interpret as assent.
One major change in the Remake is how Aerith learns of Tifa’s existence. In the OG, Cloud mentions that he wants to go back to Tifa’s bar, prompting Aerith to ask him about his relationship with her. In the Remake, Cloud calls Tifa’s name after having a random flashback of Child Tifa as he’s walking along with some kids. Again the insertion of said flashback is a bit jarring, prompting Aerith to understandably ask Cloud about just who this Tifa is. In the OG, this exchange served to show Aerith’s jealousy and her interest in Cloud. In the Remake, it’s all about Cloud’s feelings for Tifa and his inability to articulate them. As for Aerith, I suppose you can still read her reaction as jealous, though simple curiosity is a perfectly reasonable way to read it too. It plays out quite similarly to Aerith asking Cloud about who he gave the flower to. Her follow ups seem indicate that she’s merely curious about who this recipient might be rather than showing that she’s upset/jealous of the fact that said person exists.
For the collapsed tunnel segment, the Remake adds the recurring bit of Aerith and Cloud trying to successfully complete a high-five. While this is certainly a way to show them getting closer, it’s about least intimate way that SE could have done so. Just think about the alternatives — you could have Cloud and Aerith sharing brief tidbits of their lives after each mechanical arm, you could have them trying to reach for each other’s hand. Instead, SE chose an action that is we’ve seen performed between a number of different platonic buddies, and an action that Aerith immediately performs with Tifa upon meeting her. Not to mention, even while they are technically getting closer, Cloud still rejects (or at least tries to) Aerith’s invitations to extend their time together twice — at the fire and at the playground.
One aspect from these two Chapters that does has plenty of set up and a satisfying payoff is Aerith’s interest in Cloud’s SOLDIER background. You have the weirdness of Aerith already knowing that Cloud was in SOLDIER without him mentioning it first, followed by Elmyra’s antipathy towards SOLDIERs in general, not to mention Aerith actively fishing for information about Cloud’s time in SOLDIER. (For players who’ve played Crisis Core, the reason for her behavior is even more obvious, with her “one date” gesture mirroring Zack’s, and her line to Cloud in front of the tunnel a near duplicate of what she says to Zack — at least in the original Japanese).
Finally, at the playground, it’s revealed that the reason for all this weirdness is because Aerith’s first love was also a SOLDIER who was the same rank as Cloud. Unlike in the OG, Cloud does not exhibit any potential jealousy by asking about the nature of her relationship, and Aerith doesn’t try to play it off by dismissing the seriousness. In fact, with the emotional nuance we can now see on her face, we can understand the depth of her feelings even if she cannot articulate them.
This is the first scene in the Remake where Cloud and Aerith have a genuine conversation. Thus, finally, Cloud expresses some hesitation before he leaves her — and as far as he knows, this could be the last time they see each other. You can interpret this hesitation as romantic longing or it could just as easily be Cloud being a bit sad to part from a new friend. Regardless, it’s notable that scene is preceded by one where Aerith is talking about her first love who she clearly isn’t over, and followed by a scene where Cloud sprints across the screen, without a backwards glance at Aerith, after seeing a glimpse of Tifa through a tiny window in a Chocobo cart that’s about a hundred yards away.
The Wall Market segment in the Remake is quite explicitly about Cloud’s desire to save Tifa. In the OG, Aerith has no trouble getting into Corneo’s mansion on her own, so I can see how someone could misinterpret Cloud going through all the effort to dress as a woman to protect Aerith from the Don’s wiles (though of course, you would need to ask, why they trying to infiltrate the mansion in the first place?). In the Remake, Cloud has to go through herculean efforts to even get Aerith in front of the Don. Everyone who is aware of Cloud’s cause, from Sam to Leslie to Johnny to Andrea to Aerith herself, comments on how hard he’s working to save Tifa and how important she must be to him for him to do so. In case there’s any confusion, the Remake also includes a scene where Cloud is prepared to bust into the mansion on his own, leaving Aerith to fend for herself, after Johnny comes with news that Tifa is in trouble.
Both Cloud and Aerith get big dress reveals in the Remake. If you get Aerith’s best dress, Cloud’s reaction can certainly be read as one of attraction, but since the game continues on the same regardless of which dress you get, it’s not meant to mark a shift in Cloud and Aerith’s relationship. Rather, it’s a reward for the player for completing however many side quests in Ch. 8, especially since the Remake incentives the player to get every dress and thus see all of Cloud’s reactions by making it a Trophy and including it in the play log.
A significant and very welcome change from the OG to the Remake is Tifa and Aerith’s relationship dynamic. In the OG, the girls’ first meeting in Corneo’s mansion starts with them fighting over Cloud (by pretending not to fight over Cloud). In the Remake, the sequence of events is reversed so that it starts off with Cloud’s reunion with Tifa (again emphasizing that the whole purpose of the infiltration is because Cloud wants to save Tifa). Then when Aerith wakes, she’s absolutely thrilled to make Tifa’s acquaintance, hardly acknowledging Cloud at all. Tifa is understandably more wary at first, but once they start working together, they become fast friends.
Also interesting is that from the moment Aerith and Tifa meet, almost every instance where Cloud could be shown worrying about Aerith or trying to comfort Aerith is given to Tifa instead. In the OG, it’s Cloud who frets about Aerith getting involved in the plot to question the Don, and regrets getting her mixed up in everything once they land in the sewers. In the Remake, those very same reservations are expressed by Tifa instead. Tifa is the one who saves Aerith when the platform collapses in the sewer. Tifa is the one who emotionally comforts Aerith after they’re separated in the train graveyard. (Cloud might be the one who physically saves her, but he doesn’t even so much give her a second glance to check on her well-being before he runs off to face Eligor. He leaves that job for Tifa). It almost feels like the Remake is going out of its way to avoid any moments between Cloud and Aerith that could be interpreted as romantic. In fact, after Corneo’s mansion, unless you get Aerith’s resolution, there are almost no one-on-one interactions at all between Cloud and Aerith. Such is not the case with Cloud and Tifa. In fact, right after defeating Abzu in the sewers, Cloud runs after Tifa, and asks her if what she’s saying is one of those slum lessons — continuing right where they left off.
Ch. 11 feels like a wink-wink nudge-nudge way to acknowledge the LTD. You have the infamous shot of the two girls on each of Cloud’s arms, and two scenes where Cloud appears as if he’s unable to choose between them when he asks them if they’re okay. Of course, in this same Chapter, you have a scene during the boss fight with the Phantom where Cloud actually pulls Tifa away from Aerith, leaving Aerith to defend herself, for an extended sequence where he tries to keep Tifa safe. This is not something SE would include if their intention is to keep Cloud’s romantic interest ambiguous or if Aerith is meant to be the one he loves. Of course, Ch. 11 is not the first we see of this trio’s dynamic. We start with Ch. 10, which is all about Aerith and Tifa’s friendship. Ch. 11 is a nod to the LTD dynamic in the OG, but it’s just that, a nod, not an indication the Remake is following the same path. Halfway through Ch. 11, the dynamic completely disappears.
Ch. 12 changes things up a bit from the OG. Instead of Cloud and Tifa ascending the pillar together, Cloud goes up first. Seemingly just so that we can have the dramatic slow-mo handgrab scene between the two of them when Tifa decides to run after Cloud — right after Aerith tells her to follow her heart.
The Remake also shows us what happens when Aerith goes to find Marlene at Seventh Heaven — including the moment when Aerith sees the flower she gave Cloud by the bar register, and Aerith is finally able to connect the dots. After seeing Cloud be so cagey about who he gave the flower to, and weird about his relationship with Tifa, and after seeing how Cloud and Tifa act around each other. It finally makes sense. She’s figured it out before they have. It’s a beautiful payoff to all that set up. Any other interpretation of Aerith’s reaction doesn’t make a lick of sense, because if it’s to indict she’s jealous of Tifa, where is all the set up for that? Why did the Remake eliminate all the moments from the OG where she had been noticeably jealous before? Without this, that interpretation makes about as much sense as someone arguing Aerith is smiling because she’s thinking about a great sandwich she had the night before. In case anyone is confused, the scene is preceded by a moment where Aerith tells Tifa to follow her heart before she goes after Cloud, and followed by the moment where Cloud catches Tifa via slow-motion handgrab.
On the pillar itself, there are so many added moments of Cloud showing his concern for Tifa’s physical and emotional well-being. Even when they find Jessie, as sad as Cloud is over Jessie’s death, the game actually spends more time showing us Cloud’s reaction to Tifa crying over Jessie’s death, and Cloud’s inability to comfort her. Since so much of this is physical rather than verbal, this couldn’t have effectively been shown in the OG with its technological limitations.
After the pillar collapses, we start off with a couple of other moments showing Cloud’s concern over Tifa — watching over her as she wakes, his dramatic fist clench while he watches Barret comfort Tifa in a way he cannot. There is also a subtle but important change in the dialogue. In the OG, Tifa is the one who tells Barret that Marlene is safe because she was with Aerith. Cloud is also on his way to Sector 5, but it’s for the explicit purpose of trying to save Aerith, which we know because Tifa asks. In the Remake, Tifa is too emotionally devastated to comfort Barret about Marlene. Cloud, trying to help in the only way he can, is now the one to tell Barret about Marlene. Leading them to Sector 5 is no longer about him trying to help Aerith, but about him reuniting Barret with his daughter. Again, another moment where Cloud shows concern about Aerith in the OG is eliminated from the Remake.
Rather than going straight from Aerith’s house to trying to figure out a way into the Shinra building to find Aerith, the group takes a detour to check out the ruins of Sector 7 and rescue Wedge from Shinra’s underground lab. It’s only upon seeing the evidence of Shinra’s inhumane experimentation firsthand that Cloud articulates to Elmyra the need to rescue Aerith. In the OG, they never sought out Elmyra’s permission, and Tifa explicitly asks to join Cloud on his quest. Rescuing Aerith is framed as primarily Cloud’s goal, Tifa and Barret are just along for the ride.
In the Remake, all three wait until Elymra gives them her blessing, and it’s framed (quite literally) as the group’s collective goal as opposed to just Cloud’s.
In the aptly named Ch. 14 resolutions, each marks the culmination of the character’s arc for the Part 1 of Remake. While their arcs are by no means complete, they do offer a nice preview of what their ultimate resolutions will be.
With the exception of Tifa’s, these resolutions are primarily about the character themselves. Their relationships with Cloud are secondary. Each resolution marks a change in the character themselves, but not necessarily a change in Cloud’s relationship with said character. Barret recommits to AVALANCHE’s mission and his role as a leader despite the deep personal costs. Aerith’s is full of foreshadowing as she accept her fate and impending death and decides to make the most of the time she has left. After trying to put aside her own feelings for the sake of others the whole time, Tifa finally allows herself to feel the full devastation of losing her home for the second time. Like her ultimate resolution in the Lifestream that we’ll see in about 25 years, Cloud is the only person she can share this sentiment with because he was the only person who was there.
Barret does not grow closer to Cloud through his resolution. Cloud has already proved himself to him by helping out on the pillar and reuniting him with Marlene. Barret resolution merely reveals that Barret is now comfortable enough with Cloud to share his past.
Similarly, Cloud starts off Aerith’s resolution with an intent to go rescue her, and ends with that intent still intact. Aerith is more open about her feelings here than before, it being a dream and all, but these feelings aren’t something that developed during this scene.
The only difference is during Tifa’s resolution. Cloud has been unable to emotionally comfort Tifa up until this point. It’s only when Tifa starts crying and rests her head upon his shoulder that he is able to make a change, to make a choice and hug her. Halfway through Tifa’s resolution, the scene shifts its focus to Cloud, his inaction and eventual action. Notably, the only time we have a close-up of any character during all three resolutions (I’ll define close-up here as a shot where a character’s face takes up half or more of the shot), are three shots of Cloud when he’s hugging/trying to hug Tifa. Tifa’s resolution is the only one where Cloud arcs.
What of the whole “You can’t fall in love with me” line in Aerith’s resolution? Why would SE include that if not to foreshadow Cloud falling in love with Aerith? Or indicate that he has already? Well, you can’t just take the dialogue on its own, you how to look at how these lines are framed. Notably, when she says “you can’t fall in love with me,” Aerith is framed at the center of the shot, and almost looks like she’s directly addressing the player. It’s as much a warning for the player as it is for Cloud, which makes sense if you know her fate in the OG.
This is followed directly by her saying “Even if you think you have…it’s not real.” In this shot, it’s back to a standard shot/reverse shot where she is the left third of the frame. She is addressing Cloud here, which, again if you’ve played the OG, is another bit of heavy foreshadowing. The reason Clould would think he might be in love with Aerith is because he’s falsely assuming of the memories of a man who did love Aerith — Zack.
For Cloud’s response (”Do I get a say in all this?”/ “That’s very one-sided” depending on the translation), rather than showing a shot of his face, the Remake shows him with his back turned.
Whatever Cloud’s feelings may be for Aerith, the game seems rather indifferent to them.
What is more telling is the choice to include a bit with Cloud getting jealous over a guy trying to give Tifa flowers in Barret’s resolution. Barret also mentions both Jessie and Aerith in their conversation, but nothing else gets such a reaction from Cloud.
It also should go without saying that if Aerith’s resolution is meant to establish Cloud and Aerith’s romance, there should have been plenty of set-up beforehand and plenty of follow-through afterward. That obviously is not the case, because again, the Remake has gone out of its way to avoid moments where Cloud’s actions towards Aerith could be interpreted romantically.
Case in point, at around this time in the OG, Marlene tells Cloud that she thinks Aerith likes him and the player has the option to have Cloud express his hope that she does. This scene is completely eliminated from the Remake and replaced with a much more appropriate scene of father-daughter affection between Marlene and Barret while Tifa and Cloud are standing together outside.
The method by which they get up the plate is completely different in the Remake. Leslie is the one who helps them this time around, and though his quest to reunite with his fiance directly parallels with the trio’s desire to save Aerith, Leslie himself draws a comparison to earlier when Cloud was trying to rescue Tifa. Finally, when Abzu is defeated again, it is Barret who draws the parallel of their search for Aerith to Leslie’s search for his fiance, making it crystal clear that saving Aerith is a group effort rather than only Cloud’s.
Speaking of Barret, in the OG, he seems to reassess his opinion of Cloud in the Shinra HQ stairs when he sees Cloud working so hard to save Aerith and realizes he might actually care about other people. In the Remake, that reevaluation occurs after you complete all the Ch. 14 sidequests and help a bunch of NPCs. Arguably, this moment occurs even earlier in the Remake for Barret, after the Airbuster, when he realizes that Cloud is more concerned for his and Tifa’s safety than his own.
Overall, the entire Aerith rescue feels so anticlimactic in the Remake. In the OG, Cloud gets his big hero moment in the Shinra Building. He’s the one who runs up to Aerith when the glass shatters and they finally reunite. In the Remake, it’s unclear what the emotional stakes are for Cloud here. At their big reunion, all we get from him is a “Yep.” In fact, when you look at how this scene plays out, Aerith is positioned equally between Cloud and Tifa at the moment of her rescue. Cloud’s answer is again with his back turned to the camera. It’s Tifa who gets her own shot with her response.
Another instance of the Remake being completely indifferent to Cloud’s feelings for Aerith, and actually priotizing Tifa’s relationship with Aerith instead.
It is also Tifa who runs to reunite with Aerith after the group of enemies is defeated. Another moment that could have easily been Cloud’s that the Remake gives to Tifa.
Also completely eliminated in the Remake, is the “I’m your bodyguard. / The deal was for one date” exchange in the jail cells. In the Remake, after Ch. 8, the date isn’t brought up again at all; “the bodyguard” reference only comes up briefly in Ch. 11 and then never again.
In the Remake, the jail scene is replaced by the scene in Aerith’s childhood room. Despite the fact that this is Aerith’s room, it is Tifa’s face that Cloud first sees when he wakes. What purpose does this moment serve other than to showcase Cloud and Tifa’s intimacy and the other characters’ tacit acknowledgment of said intimacy?
(This is the second time where Cloud wakes up and Tifa is the first thing he sees. The other was at Corneo’s mansion. He comes to three times in the Remake, but in Ch. 8, even though Aerith is right in front of him, we start off with a few seconds of Cloud gazing around the church before settling on the person in front of him. Again, while not something that most players would notice, this feels like a deliberate choice.)
Especially since this scene itself is all about Aerith. She begins a sad story about her past, and Cloud, rather than trying to comfort her in any way, asks her to give us some exposition about the Ancients. When the Whispers surround her, even though Cloud is literally right there, it's Tifa who pulls her out of it and comforts her. Another moment that could have been Cloud that was given to Tifa, and honestly, this one feels almost bizarre.
Throughout the entire Shinra HQ episode, Cloud and Aerith haven’t had a single moment alone to themselves. The Drums scenario is completely invented for the Remake. The devs could have contrived a way for Cloud and Aerith to have some one-on-one time here and work through the feelings they expressed during Aerith’s resolution if they wanted. Instead, with the mandatory party configurations during this stage - Cloud & Barret on one side; Tifa & Aerith on the others, with Cloud & Tifa being the respective team leaders communicating over PHS, the Remake minimizes the amount of interaction Cloud and Aerith have with each other in this chapter.
On the rooftop, before Cloud’s solo fight with Rufus, even though Cloud is ostensibly doing all this so that they can bring Aerith to safety, the Remake doesn’t include a single shot that focuses on Aerith’s face and her reaction to his actions. The game has decided, whatever Aerith’s feelings are in this moment, they’re irrelevant to the story they’re trying to tell. Instead we get shots focusing solely on Barret and Tifa. While the Remake couldn’t find any time to develop Cloud and Aerith’s relationship at the Shinra Tower (even though the OG certainly did), it did find time to add a new scene where Tifa saves Cloud from certain death, while referencing their Promise.
A lot of weird shit happens after this, but it’s pretty much all plot and no character. We do get one more moment where Cloud saves Tifa (and Tifa alone) from the Red Whisper even though Aerith is literally right next to her. The Remake isn’t playing coy at all about where Cloud’s preferences lie.
The party order for the Sephiroth battle varies depending on how you fought the Whispers. All the other character entrances (whoever the 3rd party member is, then the 4th and Red) are essentially the exact same shots, with the characters replaced. It’s the first character entrance (which can only be Aerith or Tifa) that you have two distinct options.
If Aerith is first, the camera pans from Cloud over to Aerith. It then cuts back to Cloud’s reaction, in a separate shot, as Aerith walks to join him (offscreen). It’s only when the player regains control of the characters that Cloud and Aerith ever share the frame.
On the other hand, if Tifa is first, we see Tifa land from Cloud’s POV. Cloud then walks over to join Tifa and they immediately share a frame, facing Sephiroth together.
Again, this is not something SE would expect the player to notice the first or even second time around. Honestly, I doubt anyone would notice at all unless they watched all these variations back to back. That is telling in itself, that SE would go through all this effort (making these scenes unique rather than copy and pasting certainly takes more time and effort) to ensure that the depictions of Cloud’s relationships with these two women are distinct despite the fact that hardly anyone would notice. Even in the very last chapter of the game, they want us to see Cloud and Tifa as a pair and Cloud and Aerith as individuals.
Which isn’t to say that Aerith is being neglected in the Remake. Quite the opposite, in fact, when she has essentially become the main protagonist and the group’s spirtual leader in Ch. 18. Rather, her relationship with Cloud is no longer an essential part of her character. Not to mention, one of the very last shots of the Remake is about Aerith sensing Zack’s presence. Again, not the kind of thing you want to bring up if the game is supposed to show her being in love with Cloud.
What does it all mean????
Phew — now let’s step back and look and how the totality of these changes have reshaped our understanding of the story as a whole. Looking solely at the Midgar section of the OG, and ignoring everything that comes after it, it seems to tell a pretty straightforward story: Cloud is a cold-hearted jerk who doesn’t care about anyone else until he meets Aerith. It is through his relationship with Aerith that he begins to soften up and starts giving a damn about something other than himself. This culminates when he risks it all to rescue Aerith from the clutches of the game’s Big Bad itself, The Shinra Electric Company.
This was honestly the reason why I was dreading the Remake when I learned that it would only cover the Midgar segment. A game that’s merely an expansion of the Midgar section of the OG is probably going to leave a lot of people believing that Cloud & Aerith were the intended couple, and I didn’t want to wait years and perhaps decades for vindication after the Remake’s Lifestream Scene.
I imagine this very scenario is what motivated SE to make so many of these changes. In the OG, they could get away with misdirecting the audience for the first few hours of the game since the rest of the story and the reveals were already completed. The player merely had to pop in the next disc to get the real story. Such is not the case with the Remake. Had the the Remake followed the OG’s beats more closely, many players, including some who’ve never played the OG, would finish the Remake thinking that Cloud and Aerith were the intended couple. It would be years until they got the rest of the story, and at that point, the truth would feel much more like a betrayal. Like they’ve been cruelly strung along.
While they’ve gone out of their way to adapt most elements from the OG into the Remake, they’ve straight up eliminated many scenes that could be interpreted as Cloud’s romantic interest in Aerith. Instead, he seems much more interested in her knowledge as an Ancient than in her romantic affections. This is the path the Remake could be taking. Instead of Cloud being under the illusion of falling in love with Aerith, he’s under the illusion that the answer to his identity dilemma lies in Aerith’s Cetra heritage, when, of course, the answer was with Tifa all along.
Hiding Sephiroth’s existence during the Midgar arc isn’t necessary to telling the story of FF7, thus it’s been eliminated in the Remake. Similarly, pretending that Cloud and Aerith are going to end up together also isn’t necessary and would only confuse the player. Thus the LTD is no longer a part of the Remake.
If Aerith’s impact on Cloud has been diminished, what then is his arc in the Remake? Is it essentially just the same without the catalyst of Aerith? A cold guy at the start who eventually learns to care about others through the course of the game? Kind of, though arguably, this is who Remake!Cloud is all along, not just Cloud at the end of the Remake. Cloud is a guy who pretends to be a selfish jerk, but he deep down he really does care. He just doesn’t show this side of himself around people he’s unfamiliar with. So part of his arc in the Remake is opening up to the others, Barret, AVALANCHE and Aerith included, but these all span a chapter or two at most. They don’t straddle the entire game.
What is the throughline then? What is an area in which he exhibits continuous growth?
It’s Tifa. It’s his desire to fulfill his Promise to Tifa. Not just to protect her physically, but to be there for her emotionally, something that’s much harder to do. There’s the big moments like when he remembers the Promise in Ch. 4., his dramatic fist clench when he can’t stop Tifa from crying in Ch. 12, and in Ch. 13 when he watches Barret comfort Tifa. It’s all the flashbacks he has of her and the times he’s felt like he failed her. It’s the smaller moments where he can sense her nervousness and unease but the only thing he knows how to do is call her name. It’s all those times during battle, where Tifa can probably take care of herself, but Cloud has to save her because he can’t fail her again. All of this culminates in Tifa’s Resolution, where Tifa is in desperate need of comfort, and is specifically seeking Cloud’s comfort, and Cloud has no idea what to do. He hesitates because he’s clueless, because he doesn’t want to fuck it up, but finally, he makes the choice, he takes the risk, and he hugs her….and he kind of fucks it up. He hugs her too hard. Which is a great thing, because this arc isn’t anywhere close to being over. There’s still so much more to come. So many places this relationship will go.
We get a little preview of this when Tifa saves Cloud on the roof. Everything we thought we knew about their relationship has been flipped on its head. Tifa is the one saving Cloud here, near the end of this part of the Remake. Just as she will save Cloud in the Lifestream just before the end of the FF7 story as a whole. What does Tifa mean to Cloud? It’s one of the first questions posed in the Remake, and by the end, it remains unanswered.
Cloud’s character arc throughout the entire FF7 story is about his reconciling with his identity issues. This continues to develop through the Shinra Tower Chapters, but it certainly isn’t going to be resolved in Part 1 of the Remake. His character arc in the Remake — caring more about others/finding a way to finally comfort Tifa — is resolved in Ch. 14, well before rescuing Aerith, which is what makes her rescue feel so anticlimactic. The resolution of this external conflict isn’t tied to the protagonist’s emotional arc. This was not the case in the OG. I’m certainly not complaining about the change, but the Remake probably would have felt more satisfying as a whole if they hewed to the structure of the OG. Instead, it seems that SE has prioritized the clarity of the Remake series as a whole (leaving no doubt about where Cloud’s affections lie) over the effectiveness of the “climax” in the first entry of the Remake.
This is all clear if you only focus on the “story” of the Remake -- i.e., what the characters are saying and doing. If you extend your lens to the presentation of said story, and here I’m talking about who the game chooses to focus on during the scenes, how long they hold on these shots, which characters share the frame, which do not, etc --- it really could not be more obvious.
Does the camera need to linger for over 5 seconds on Cloud staring at the door after wishing Tifa goodnight? Does it need to find Cloud almost every time Tifa says or does anything so that we’re always aware of his watchfulness and the nature of his care? The answer is no until you realize this dynamic is integral to telling the story of Final Fantasy VII.
I don’t see how anyone who compares the Remake to the OG could come away from it thinking that the Remake series is going to reverse all of the work done in the OG and Compilation by having Cloud end up with Aerith.
Just because the ending seems to indicate that the events of the OG might not be set in stone, it doesn’t mean that the Remake will end with Aerith surviving and living happily ever after with Cloud. Even if Aerith does live (which again seems unlikely given the heavy foreshadowing of her death in the Remake), how do you come away from the Remake thinking that Cloud is going to choose Aerith over Tifa when SE has gone out of its way to remove scenes between Cloud and Aerith that could be interpreted as romantic? And gone out of its way to shove Cloud’s feelings for Tifa in the player’s face? The sequels would have to spend an obscene amount of time not only building Cloud and Aerith’s relationship from scratch, but also dismantling Cloud’s relationship with Tifa. It would be an absolute waste of time and resources, and there’s really no way to do so without making the characters look like assholes in the process.
Now could this happen? Sure, in the sense that literally anything could happen in the future. But in terms of outcomes that would make sense based on what’s come before, this particular scenario is about as plausible as Cloud deciding to relinquish his quest to find Sephiroth so that he can pursue his real dream of becoming at sandwich artist at Panera Bread.
It’s over! I promise!
Like you, I too cannot believe the number of words I’ve wasted on this subject. What is there left to say? The LTD doesn’t exist outside of the first disc of the OG. You'll only find evidence of SE perpetuating the LTD if you go into these stories with the assumption that 1) The LTD exists 2) it remains unanswered. But it’s not. We know that Cloud ends up with Tifa.
What the LTD has become is dissecting individual scenes and lines of dialogue, without considering the context of said things, and pretending as if the outcome is unknown and unknowable. If you took this tact to other aspects of FF7’s story, then it would be someone arguing that because there a number of scenes in the OG that seem to suggest that Meteor will successfully destroy the planet, this means that the question of whether or not our heroes save the world in the end is left ambiguous. No one does that because that would be utterly absurd. Individual moments in a story may suggest alternate outcomes to build tension, to keep us on our toes, but that doesn’t change the ending from being the ending. Our heroes stop Meteor. Cloud loves Tifa. Arguments against either should be treated with the same level of credulity (i.e., none).
It’s frustrating that the LTD, and insecurities about whether or not Cloud really loves Tifa, takes up so much oxygen in any discussion about these characters. And it’s a damn shame, because Cloud and Tifa’s relationship is so rich and expansive, and the so-called “LTD” is such a tiny sliver of that relationship, and one of the least interesting aspects. They’re wonderful because they’re just so damn normal. Unlike other Final Fantasy couples, what keeps them apart is not space and time and death, but the most human and painfully relatable emotion of all, fear. Fear that they can’t live up to the other’s expectations; fear that they might say the wrong thing. The fear that keeps them from admitting their feelings at the Water Tower, they’re finally able to overcome 7 years later in the Lifestream. They’re childhood friends but in a way they’re also strangers. Like other FF couples, we’re able to watch their entire relationship grow and unfold before our eyes. But they have such a history too, a history that we unravel with them at the same time. Every moment of their lives that SE has found worth depicting, they’ve been there for each other, even if they didn’t know it at the time. Theirs is a story that begins and ends with each other. Their is the story that makes Final Fantasy VII what it is.
If you’ve made it this far, many thanks for reading. I truly have no idea how to use this platform, so please direct any and all hatemail to my DMs at TLS, which I will then direct to the trash. (In all seriousness, I’d be happy to answer any specific questions you may have, but I feel like I’ve more than said my piece here.)
If there’s one thing you take away from this, I hope it’s to learn to ignore all the ridiculous arguments out there, and just enjoy the story that’s actually being told. It’s a good one.
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I thought I'd taken CM saying E's just figuring out how he feels for Liv ok. But somehow, this has been eating at me all week. Because IF I'm supposed to assume E didn't have romantic feelings for Liv all along, how tf can we excuse his behavior all this time? All the ghosting and avoiding and choosing other ppl only makes any sense if it was too complicated to face. Otherwise he just... doesn't deserve her. Makes me wanna hate him, but I still think he's her happy ending so it's not goin well..
i'm really glad you asked me about this bc it gives me the chance to say something that's been on my mind a lot lately:
it literally doesn't matter what chris says.
it literally doesn't matter. they do these interviews and the actors and producers give what are essentially their headcanons in answer to questions that have not been answered in the text but until those answers become text? they aren't real.
the only things that are real are 1) the actual, textual scenes and 2) your interpretation of them. you know that whole thing about how ten people can see the same thing and describe it ten different ways? that is so true and it applies here. your perspective on the scene is not less valid than someone else's. not even chris's.
chris said, off the cuff, in response to a question he presumably did not prepare remarks to answer, that he thinks elliot is figuring it out right now. does that mean that the actual canon character of elliot literally never thought he might be in love with olivia before now? does it mean that he's never been allowed to be in love with her before and he's figuring out what that means now? does that mean that he's figuring out how to be in love with her?
it's open to interpretation bestie!
what chris and mariska and the writers and producers think the characters are feeling, what they think their motivations are, inform what canon becomes. but again, until those thoughts become text, they are only one interpretation.
i throw a couple of phrases around here all loosey-goosey and i wanna talk about two of them you may have heard me use before. the first is "word of god". word of god refers to statements made by people with power in connection to the show. some fans treat those statements as "word of god", that is, as immutable truth that cannot be questioned and must be taken into account when viewing/analyzing a piece of media. some fans need word of god, want that affirmation that their perspective is the Correct(tm) one. and i understand it! we want to believe the creators are on our side, that our vision of what we think the show is and what it's trying to do is what's gonna happen.
i am not one of those people. i am interested in what they have to say but if i disagree with them i do not think that i have lost something, or that i am wrong bc the creators don't agree. i think we all have our headcanons and mine are as valid as anyone else's.
the second thing you'll hear me say a lot is "the author is dead". this is an actual theory of literary criticism that argues we should separate the work from the context of the author's identity and intentions. whatever an author intends, their work can have multiple meanings, perhaps even some meanings they didn't intend at all.
when i engage with a piece of media, i am engaging with what has been done on screen, and what i interpret from it. it doesn't matter if the producers and writers don't think elliot was in love with olivia, or think he didn't know he was; i've seen fault. whether it was intentional or not elliot's behavior in that episode can be interpreted as him being all too keenly aware of that love, and being afraid of it. that's how i interpret it. no one else, not even chris, saying otherwise will deter me from believing it.
so does elliot love olivia? how long has he known he does? does he deserve her?
you tell me, friend.
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#I feel like it’s different because you cannot transition to nonhuman#you just are or you aren’t like a sexuality#now I do agree that trans people may experience being nonhuman combined with their gender#this isn’t about that in particular#this is about it being the ‘same thing’#plus I think if we say it’s the same thing I feel worried it would reinforce transphobia in some ways#I say this as someone who is both nonhuman and transgender#it’s important to understand that most trans people aren’t nonhuman and I feel worried it would be similar to ‘attack helicopter jokes’
Hi I have a lot of thoughts about these tags.
My sexuality has been all the fuck over the place over the course of my life. As has my gender. I have been everything except completely straight and pretty much every variant on gender. Some of those changes were voluntary and some weren't but they were all absolutely real changes that I went through. It is not my goddamn fault if a homophobe or transphobe looks at me and goes, "Well, I think it's fakey-fakes if you actually chose at some points to present how you present and feel how you feel." Nah. I was tired of men after I got divorced and I voluntarily identified as lesbian for a while. I decided later that I wasn't that disinterested after all and went with bisexual, then decided I wasn't interested in anything and voluntarily identified as asexual. These were decisions for me. At any point I could have changed course some other way or not changed course at all. I have run the entire spectrum of genders or lacks thereof and after having tried them all on, I decided to call myself what I call myself now. Transitioning medically was not a thing that just fell on me from the sky. I chose to do it, I actively took steps, I am fiercely proud of the fact that this was my call and I changed my body because I wanted to.
I have adopted the exact labels and identities I use (and in some places, don't use), intentionally, because they serve a single goal, that of making me the happiest out of all possible labels and identities. I will drop them and assume new ones if better ones that make me happier come along, or if they stop making me happy.
I used to think that too, that if I compared being nonhuman to being trans, it would make trans people look silly. But it is NOT substantially different. Strip off the details and it is still, at its core, someone saying, "I look this way now, but I'm that way actually, and I want to be acknowledged that way in some capacity." If you have the autonomy to declare that your body looks A but you are B, you have that autonomy, full stop. If you don't, you don't.
Also, to challenge the idea that you can't transition to nonhuman: says who? Assuming that a species identity is an immutable biological state is first of all kind of silly from a science perspective (there is literally no single satisfying definition of 'species' to begin with) and second of all, this is the same bioessentialist assumption that would say that since I was born with 'female' characteristics (there is literally no single satisfying definition of 'female') that I cannot be 'male' now (for which there is no single satisfying definiton also). 'Transitioning' is not one single biological event, it is ongoing and multidimensional, and it is both social and internal. If you're trans and you only tell your closest friends that you want to be called different pronouns and be treated as that role, that is not different from being nonhuman and telling your closest friends that you want to be called a different kind of thing and treated as such. You are not less trans if you tell nobody and only refer to yourself by your chosen signifiers, nor are you less nonhuman.
This is 100% about it being the same thing and I also say this as someone who is nonhuman and transgender. These are two prongs of the same root argument, which is that self-determination, no matter how 'weird' or 'normal' it may seem to onlookers, is an inalienable human right (yes we are using that word liberally here, don't worry about it). I do of course realize that most trans people aren't nonhuman. However, there are WAY more of them than you'd likely think because they aren't Participating In The Community, and there is a STRONG counter-cultural undercurrent right now of reclaiming one's dehumanization, and as a group, trans people have had SO much of that particular trauma. But even with that, that isn't really the point.
I am not saying that being nonhuman is being transgender, except insofar as it is a type of generic 'trans' as in 'across from' in the same way that transgender is to cisgender. But what I am saying is that these are two concepts living under the same general umbrella of being allowed to self-identify and self-determine, and it is that umbrella that is being attacked by recent laws and shitty public figures. It does not reinforce transphobia to say that you want to be seen a certain way, full stop. It reinforces transphobia to treat people as lesser than others for identifying in a way that isn't socially approved. We are in this together and we are not and should not be meaningfully separate. Do you see? This is why the attack helicopter jokes are shitty to both groups. If the claim were dissimilar, the disparagement would also need to be dissimilar, but "I'm going to say I'm the dumbest identity I can think of, hahaha, I'm so funny," is taking direct aim at the common denominator: it does not matter what we're identifying as, the haters are going to hate, and if that's what you're basing your decisions off, you've got the wrong end of the snake in your hand.
I used to be like, "being nonhuman is similar but not identical to being trans," but actually I think past me was wrong. It's exactly the same thing and that thing is just "you can do whatever you want forever."
#oh do NOT provoke me to a real conversation on a throwaway post you just know I'll do it lmao#anyway that's the fully-un-origami'd version of what I was thinking#I did manage to scrunch it into two sentences and I was proud of myself for not rambling but you must understand.#I am a highly specialized device made for pressurizing words and statements until they explode in a horrible industrial accident.#and I Cannot change this about myself#(one of the very few things that I consider immutable about me)
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