#and it's ALL BECAUSE OF LLOYD FUCKING FRONTERA

[lynn-tged-posting]

sorry i haven't been posting or reblogging much i've been cooking tged fics but like all of the premises i wanted to write hit me All at Once so i've been hopping around all of them like mad

for some reason they're all very consistently about lloyd Going Through It and then javier having to deal with the consequences and i think that's really funny

i'm really glad people liked my other posts btw, i like to think i am funny thanks everyone /gen

[lloydfrontera]

In my opinion, the reason the reunion scene was skipped was because the author couldn’t figure out a way to write it non-romantically and gave up after a while

honestly. i kinda agree with you nonnie.

it just. the set up to the scene is sooooo romantic. you have lloyd being absolutely devastated at the thought he's not going to see any of his loved ones ever again and that he's been dropped back into his terrible life, to the place he admitted he'd rather die than go back to,,, and then someone knocks at the door and when he opens it this is the sight that greets him:

his best friend, the person he's closest to, the one he's spent years with, the one he promised a peaceful life at his side, the one he wanted to grow old with, the one he sacrificed everything for, the one he effectively gave his life to save, the one he thought he'd never see again, standing at his door, having crossed literal dimensional barriers to get to him, a soft and teary smile on his face as he tells him "i missed you"

like. c'mon.

i'm all for platonic interpretations, i'm aroace, i love me a good best friendship as much as the next guy, but,,,, isn't this,,, like,,, really fucking romantic??? extremely so??? am i??? reading too much into it?? because it feels really, really romantic to me.

and like you say. where do you go from there. what response could lloyd give that doesn't involve throwing himself at javier and clinging to him with all of his strength. what conversation could these two have that doesn't involve them seeing how truly devoted they are to each other. what resolution does their arc together have that isn't them spending the rest of their lives together, at each other's side, like they so dearly wanted to.

but. alas. that wasn't the story bk moon wanted to tell. and that's very much his right. i just think that if he didn't want me to assume there's no in-character and narratively satisfying version of that conversation that doesn't end with them kissing he should've at least tried to give us something. and not completely skipped it lol

but that's just my opinion too :]

[web-novel-polls]

Smartest WN Character Submissions

Last Checked: February 18th, 2025 - Please check the original post for updates

Submissions End: TBD

Rules:

One character per response. Submit as many responses as you want, but please don’t submit the same character more than once unless you forgot something important (can also be fixed via asks).

Must be from a web novel or similar media (Ex: manhwa/manhua) with a web novel adaptation/source. 

“Smartest” can be based on anything from studies to martial arts to strategy to emotional intelligence. If you think they’re smart in any way, they’ll qualify & compete

Tournament Tag: #smartest WN character tournament

Major Spoilers for TYK/WOH, SVSSS, MDZS

Submissions

No Propaganda

Chang Geng from Stars of Chaos: Sha Po Lang

Cui Buqu from Peerless: Wushuang

Gu Yun from Stars of Chaos: Sha Po Lang

He Xuan from Heaven Official’s Blessing / TGCF

Jing Beiyuan from Lord Seventh / Qi Ye

Jin Guangyao from Grandmaster of Demonic Cultivation / MDZS

You Huo from Global Examination / QQGK

Fei Du from Mo Du / Silent Reading

Submission: idk what to say without spoiling the whole novel

Carrd Link

Gu Mang from Yu Wu / Remnants of Filth

Submission: He is intelligent and clever enough to rise from a slave to a general and then become a high-profile spy in the enemy's camp. His intelligence is only compromised by his idealism and its resulting naivete. Even so, he's a genius. 

Ji Yushi from Mist [Unlimited]

Submission: He is somehow able to figure out and understand all the super complicated things that go on in the novel. Incredibly intelligent (and not just because of his hyperthymesia).  

Klein Moretti from Lord of Mysteries

Submission:

i'm not done with the novel yet but he's literally so smart!!

the way he can process information and make connections so quickly, the way he's always great at adapting his way of thinking and doesn't hesitate to change his conclusions when new information comes to light,,, (and the way he can use that to make others believe he knows everything when he's literally hearing about stuff for the first time and doesn't know shit? incredible)

i'm just so impressed by him all the time, i love him sm

Lloyd Frontera / Kim Suho from The Greatest Estate Developer / TGED

Submission: Excels in both long-term and immediate planning, if the standard for excelling is 'how to get the absolute most benefit out of the situation'. WILL use methods no regular person could ever think of.

Nangong Jingnu from Clear and Muddy Loss of Love (JWQS)

Submission: Let's hear it for character development, baby! She starts out as a naive pampered princess and ends up as the Female Emperor. She is initially unable to comprehend even the most basic of political concepts but manages to mold herself into becoming a master schemer who is able to ascend to the throne amidst heavy opposition and use that position to greatly better her country. She is not unintelligent in the beginning of the novel, but still proves that it is never too late to improve one's mind through learning.

Wiki Link

Nie Huaisang from Grandmaster of Demonic Cultivation (MDZS)

Submission 1: He delicately wove a ten year revenge plot, manipulating people and evidence behind the scenes so deftly that even after having pulled his plan off, only a few people ever even learned of his involvement. 

Submission 2: Bro was several steps ahead years ahead all to get justice for his brother. bro was a lazy student in childhood, faced incredible loss, and decided fuck this im gonna plot my way to vengence. he did this all while not fighting people's assumption he was dumb from his school days, let them think the worst of me, it will only benefit me.

Qiyan Agula from Clear and Muddy Loss of Love / JWQS

Submission: She's an excellent schemer and manipulator, and is even able to easily adapt her carefully calculated plans when faced with major setbacks. Also able to rank first in very difficult scholarly exams among numerous other candidates. Incredibly clever and cunning.

Wiki Link

Shang Qinghua from The Scum Villain’s Self-Saving System / SVSSS

Submission: 

Hear me out: he created the world he transmigrated to and managed to not get caught for spying on his sect. He worked for MBJ and CQ (at the same time) becoming the most trusted advisor of one and a peak lord in the other. While he didn't remember EVERYTHING from his novel, it was a literal life time before. He's a mental swiss army knife, jack of all trades. He's not the best at anything, SJ and SY are definitely smarter, LBH is for sure super clever, but SQH is able to keep up with them. (And not get murdered! Way to go Airplane!) 

Shen Qingqiu (Shen Yuan) from The Scum Villain’s Self-Saving System

Submission:

He literally learned how to be a peak lord of the scholarly peak within months, even though his loveable unreliable narrator self makes it unclear how much knowledge he got from the original goods (cultivation and muscle memory are in tact to some degree, at least)

Textual evidence: “ As Shen Qingqiu had, since his arrival, been furiously reviewing various manuals, he had also recently seen a description of it.”(ch1) where he recalls a specific technique and uses it in the moment. “Shen Qingqiu had no say in any of it. As such, he had diligently trained for numerous days, single-mindedly seeking to make his abilities second nature…” (ch 1) yeah so this goes into the having to relearn everything category.

He’s also a walking monster/PIDW encyclopedia. I think his most impressive memory feat [spoiler] is navigating the Holy Mausoleum’s traps better than Tianlang-Jun. note that at this point it’s been years since he read the original book, the Mausoleum is very large, and yet he’s familiar with all the main rooms he encounters, and it’s been years since he read PIDW (the source book). He uses this knowledge to escape/outsmart Tianlang-jun.

Any intelligence he has is made up for by his loss of IQ points around the protagonist, though. And his general obliviousness to those around him.

Shen Zhuo from Hui Tian

Submission: He's a genius in biological engineering, genetic engineering, etc., and is also able to see through others' schemes and craft his own.

Shen Zechuan from Qiang Jin Jiu / QJJ

Submission: He is the schemer of all time. Schemes within schemes within schemes. Incredibly clever and an excellent manipulator. He is everything. 

Song Qingshi from Mistakenly Saving the Villain

Submission: The scholar tyrant himself! He knows everything there is to know about medicines and poisons. A very well-read pebble. 

Wei Wuxian from Grandmaster of Demonic Cultivation / MDZS

Submission: He is a genius and a visionary. He's invented numerous things that make it easier for the cultivation world to do their jobs. He also figured out how to control resentful energy.

Mod Propaganda: He grandmastered that Demonic Cultivation, man

Wen Kexing from Faraway Wanderers / TYK

Submission: 

Saw that someone submitted him without propaganda so here I am with propaganda! Wen Kexing is pretty much responsible for all of the plot stuff happening in Tian Ya Ke. At the same time, he does absolutely Nothing for the duration of the novel for his massive-scale revenge scheme to work out. And that's because he set it up so brilliantly that he didn't need to lift a finger for his enemies to deliver themselves up on a silver platter.  It was genuinely a domino fall: he only created the inciting incident, and then the pieces slowly but surely fell into place. Except the pieces were people, and if any SINGLE one of them decided they didn't want the Lapis Armor - the treasure Wen Kexing baited them with - then Wen Kexing's scheme would just fizzle out on its own. BUT. None of them could give up the pursuit of power. None of them could be satisfied with what they already had. And Wen Kexing perfectly understood those people's psychology and built his scheme based on that.  He really created this poetic justice situation where his enemies walked themselves to their deaths on their own, and only because they wouldn't stop doing the things that he wanted to take revenge for in the first place. Moreover, he set it up in such a way that he didn't need to commit attrocities while in 'the human world', and instead let his enemies expose themselves by 'not conducting themselves like human beings'. Wen Kexing only started killing when his enemies entered his world, the Ghost Valley. So it was not just poetic, it was also theater-level dramatic! Moreover, his scheme worked so perfectly that when Wen Kexing left partway through the final battle, one of his enemies actually finished up everyone else FOR HIM. And while Wen Kexing baited everyone with Lapis Armor, he also ensured that his father's promise to 'not let it fall into wrong hands' is kept - by destroying the key to it prior to kicking off his scheme. So ultimately, even if Wen Kexing died, his revenge would still be completed, AND the last man standing would receive a big fat Nothing for all the murder and plotting they did. And this is just about his revenge plot. He also sussed out a literal spymaster's true identity within like 11 chapters! Not to mention the whole, 'tricked a bunch of crazy murderers into thinking he was even more insane than them', which he did at age 9 (NINE!). Oh, he also staged a perfect coup within three years or less, somewhere between ages 18-21. And ruled over the Ghost Valley for 8 years when no other Valley Master before him lasted longer than 3.  Tl;dr: A LITERAL EVIL MASTERMIND! AND WE LOVE HIM FOR THAT! 

Rejected

Ballister Blackheart from Nimona

Reason: Not from a web novel

[go-against-fate]

It's weird how i enjoy writing fics from Javier's POV more than i do with Lloyd (⁠￣⁠ヘ⁠￣⁠;⁠) but when it comes to art, I'll only draw Javier when Lloyd is included in the artwork

After discussing about it a bit with discord peeps, i arrived at the conclusion that I like drawing Lloyd more because he's literally just some guy. Draw a generic character base, make them have a side bang hair style. Boom. Lloyd Frontera. Now compare that with Javier Asrahan who is described as someone so fucking gorgeous, an otherworldly beauty, his looks and personality (but mostly looks) is to be envied and admired by all. How the fuck am i supposed to draw that? Not to mention his hair?? I havent complain about this here yet but i DETEST drawing his hair. I have to constantly have a reference of him because in each drawing that i did of him, he looks different!! Why? Because his hair looks different everytime!! I get his looks right ONCE and then never again!! It drives me insane!! I'll only draw him if Lloyd is also there!! That's how much i dont like drawing him!!! Ik this sounds like a major skill issue but idgaf i only like him by proxy

HOWEVER. I just. Cannot. Write from Lloyd's POV. idk. I can never seem to get it right. The thing with him is that despite his average looks, he's extremely fucking smart. His knowledge is vast and otherwordly. and i'm just someone with slightly above average scores. I cant fucking put myself in his shoes because i literally cannot do it. He's too smart for me. Im not smart. I prefer to scroll my phone for unprecedented amount of time, rotting my brain, while Lloyd will plan out ways on how he's going to change the lives of the masses. I dont know what tf hes going to do next. Fucking. Build an amusement park because thats somehow related to preventing the world from ending or some shit I DONT KNOW

That's why I like writing fics from Javier's perspective!! because he's also just a normal guy. His way of thinking is interesting, but still comprehensible to me because I can put myself in his perspective. I can imagine myself having to take care and protect my dumbass of a friend boss from accidentally dying. He's observant, not compulsive (something i can very much relate to). His motive is that of a stereotypical hero protag. I need to save the people even if i die in the process type shit. Hes honest, but willing to lie when it comes to Lloyd. Again. Traits that the average person can . probably. relate to. Probably not the i'll sacrifice my life for the people part. But still. Javier is a pretty sensible guy

Anyway In conclusion. Javier and Lloyd go together like peanut butter and jelly or however the word goes. They compliment each other in so many ways. I love them. They make me sick. Thank you for coming to my teh talk

[sunflowercider]

In an AU, Do you think Suho would enjoy taking over Lloyd's body if the Fronteras are rich and powerful from the start (maybe a count/duke) but they aren't the loving people they are? Like if the Fronteras allow og!Lloyd to be drunk and abusive to lower class since they have the money to sweep all his misdeeds under the rug and no one would oppose the Fronteras, and since in noble society what og!Lloyd could be the norm?

Also with Javier if he got saved by these rich people who use their money and status to oppress will he still be willing to be loyal to them?

HMMMMMMMMMMMMMM

Gonna start with Javier because that's easy for me. No! The Fronteras caring nature wasn't the only reason Javier is who he is, but theyre a damn big one, and if Javier doesn't have a kind noble family to lose, the fates would move him elsewhere! Hard to angst over a buncha assholes. But if the fates didnt intervene, I think he might still be loyal to them but like. Only by technicality. It'd be hard to say if his personality would still shine through.

For Suho........ hmmmmmmmmm. I think initially, he would be out of his mind delighted. This man is fucking traumatized from being poor, so suddenly having a huge security net and no responsibility?? BIG WIN.

Buuuut... I don't know if the delight would last that long. Maybe a year or two if he really stretches it. Suho isn't knightly noble like Javier, but he doesn't appreciate lower class people being put in bad situations by those in power. Especially by him. He never wanted to be like the people who took advantage of him as a poor person. So I think he'd still make some little waves by using his silver tongue to improve shitty situations he sees. Including the family he joins if need be (though delicately! He wouldnt want to be kicked out).

Really makes me think nonnie. Damn, without the Fronteras being kind, so much would change.

[littleravenette]

Welcome to the "i have finished the tged novel and is going insane" club! How do you feel about Kim Suho being Lloyd frontera and Lloyd Frontwra being Kim Suho? Also, how do you feel about the reunion scene at the apartment in the end?

eyyyy thank you thank you, also im gonna answer below read more because there are spoilers

IT'S A LOOP!!! that's what i was screaming when i read that part. i like it but i actually don't have a lot to say about it? it's like a neat detail that i go insane from time to time. i wanna analyze the shit out of it though but honestly i really can't put it into words, so i'll sit out on this one. just know i go insane over og!lloyd's promise to be diligent.

THE REUNION SCENE!!! PROBLABY MY FAVORITE THING OUT OF THE NOVEL!!!! THAT WHOLE CHAPTER HAS MY HEART!!!!

kim suho realizing the fact that all he did for the frontera estate as lloyd was all for nothing? kim suho who thinks it's so unfair for him to go back like it's nothing? kim suho punches a mirror out of pure hurt? kim suho checking iron-blooded knight to see there are no traces of himself? kim suho going to the namsan tower to see the love lock railing and to see that it's still there? kim suho eating kimbap alone in his gosiwon and realizing that he's gonna rot in there for the rest of his live? mwah perfection

and the reunion oh my god. javier crying and saying "i miss you lloyd" my fucking god. brain worms are wiggling because of them my god.

i have some other alternations i wanna make of that scene because i am like That™ but those are secrets~ also planned fics~ so you won't ever see them. aha.

thanks for the ask! goodbye

[jessepinwheel]

hi. oh my god. I just read your greatest estate developer fic and holy crap. ive also been thinking similar thoughts lately ("hey, isn't it fucked that suho took over this mans identity?") and searching in vain on ao3 for the past few months for anything similar. And magically, today, I found your fic. And it was fantastic. Thank you for providing and I would LOVE to talk about lloyd identity crises with you if you wanna open up your DMs!!

hi! I'm glad you're enjoying rebar, I've been having fun writing it :)

definitely one of the most compelling things about the greatest estate developer (besides lloyd frontera being the most shameless brazen main character of all time) is the acknowledgement of lloyd being not the original lloyd and this tension in trying to fit into this role where kim suho isn't really supposed to be and the other characters realizing that something is Not Quite Right here where a lot of other isekai stories would just brush over it as genre set dressing

the idea of og lloyd having to watch All That is so fucked, so I was compelled to write a story about it, because while everything in canon indicates that og lloyd sucks, that is still a raw fuckin deal to get kicked out of your body and then be forced to watch this literally who take over your life and then be like a billion times better at it than you

[lloydfrontera]

if i think too long about the ending making lloyd leave the home he worked so hard to save behind along with the new found family he sacrificed his life for so he can move to a place he has no emotional connection to where he only knows two people (one of which is actually following him from the aforementioned home) in order to make him get a standard "have a wife and children" 'happy' ending i start wanting to bite people not gonna lie

[lloydfrontera]

actually screaming and crying and throwing up i just realized we never see lloyd calling marbella 'mom' in canon and i'm gonna be sick she deserved that she deserved to hear her talented amazing and kind son she worried so much about call her 'mom' at least once she deserved to have the boy she hadn't raised but had come to love and worry about just as much as if she had look at her with all the love he had in his heart for her in his eyes and call her 'mom' with no guilt for it she deserved it!!! fuck!!! bk moon i'm breaking into your house and leaving your fridge open all night how could you do this to me personally 😭

[lloydfrontera]

mmgghh imagine julian having a zoe murphy from deh style breakdown as he tries to reconcile the brother he remembers, the one that abused him for years and years on end, that never brought him anything but pain, that would beat him up for the slightest provocation, with the one that meets him at the academy, the one that saved a city, the one that is working relentlessly to save their family from ruin, the one that defends him from bullies and tells him it was never his fault that others harassed him

just. julian getting to express the rage and confusion and conflicted emotions that would come with the person that abused him for years changing completely out of nowhere and turning into the older brother he'd always wanted.

so don't tell me i didn't have it right don't tell me it wasn't black and white after all you put me through don't say it wasn't true that you were not the monster that i knew

[lloydfrontera]

Let's give another name for the game: "Webtoon pain" for easier access! So i suggest it goes like this;

-For all webtoon chapters, you may only state 3 points of pain for each chapter released, starting from chapter 1

-the scenes in the novel that will be correlated for points of pain for the webtoon must have happened in between the timeline of the events of the webtoon's chapter(if it was excluded or rewritten)

-scenes for each point of pain must invoke a feeling of pain for it to count by being excluded/rewritten in the webtoon

And finally,

-each webtoon panel drawing may count as a point of pain; limited to 2 images that was just not how it was pictured in the webtoon

Tldr and summary:

5 possible points of pain for each webtoon chapter; 3 scenes, 2 drawings/panels

This is for fun amdnnfnf no need to compile every possible points at once, we have a very very long road ahead! I do hope we get a lot of points, i missed drawing 😌😌

i am so sorry for the late reply! i was paralyzed by the realization that if i wanted to make a comprehensive of changes that have been made starting from chapter 1 i would have to re-read the entire novel and the webtoon and i simply do not have enough time in the day to do it :(

so! instead i offer a list of moments i remember from the top of my head in no particular order, i'm sorry please forgive me </3 i'll try to put the chapters they're from but i don't remember all of them sorry!

when lloyd asked permission to check out the wetlands, arcos not only agreed immediately but he also insisted on going with him and took a basket of food with them because he wanted to spent time with him. and he even brought lloyd's childhood favorite food 🥺 (43)

when working on the wetlands lloyd threatened to have anyone who went to the bathroom in there thrown in jail because hamang was going to drink that water and so help him god if they contaminated it (46)

there's this really one cute scene where lloyd is explaining something to arcos and he notices he seems a bit distracted and when he asks why arcos tells him "I just think I'm blessed to have as my son" which makes lloyd all flustered and embarrassed. plus in that very same chapter he calls him "my dear lloyd" and also thinks of him as 'my smart son' which,,, i'm so soft for,,, he adores him so much,,, (122)

and there's also this other really cute scene with marbella trying to feed lloyd a lot of food before asking him to take a break because they're both very worried for him. and lloyd agrees because, as i've mentioned before, he's a momma's boy <3 (156)

javier introducing himself to ppodong!! it was so fucking adorable he even shook fingers with his little paws T-T and also he calls him sir poddong but i don't remember if he also does that in the webtoon aklsdla (18)

lloyd telling javier his heart exploded from his compliment and calling him a killer. before thinking he's like a beautiful painting: elegant and perfect.,,, c'mon (18)

after the explosion in the mine with the ants, javier doesn't immediately get knocked out and is instead awake and aware when lloyd carries him on his back and they banter the whole time, neither of them saying it out loud but both being grateful they have each other for company while stuck there. (26)

PLUS that's the set up for lloyd riding javier during the monster invasion! javier did it first! he even made the same "gyddyap" joke!

oh! and when lloyd asked permission to work on the mine, arcos agreed with the only condition that lloyd wouldn't be in the mine during the construction because it was dangerous. lloyd didn't agree because he needed to be there to prevent accidents and so the workers would trust him but he did give his word that it'd be safe. (21)

also! marbella making lloyd a pink teddy bear for good luck! and lloyd actually keeping it because he didn't want to hurt his feelings! and also asking her to make one for javier to share his embarrassment happiness! (61)

speaking of! did we get the scene with marbella and ppodong?? where she asks him to ask the mice that are eating her plants to please stop? because that was also adorable (28)

the fact that javier fully believed for ten days that lloyd was playing a prank on him because there was no fucking way he was gonna make him fight a dragon. except he wasn't and he totally would. rip javier 😔✊🏽

can we count the change they made to their armor? like when they go to find the elven forest they wear this really cool leather armor that i love and that they completely skipped in the webtoon :(

when they finished paying the debt! lloyd and his family were going to take a family trip!! lloyd was looking forward to it!! actually we were robbed, i wanted to see the frontera family taking a family trip, it's such a cute idea T-T (120)

there's this nice conversation with javier and lloyd where javier tells him he's relieved loyd wasn't born in the capital because he would've become a terrible swindler. but that he's relieved and thankful that he put his tricks to good use. let them have sweet conversations goddammit, the banter is still funny!! (135)

oh! and the bet!! they made a bet where if lloyd was wrong he'd call javier hyung for three years but if he was right javier would use the dress and wig for the trip home. (167)

and of fucking course lady ella my beloved baby they did you wrong i will never stop mourning for you 💔 (167)

the fact we didn't even get javier in a hoodie is a fucking disgrace too ngl (169)

i'm sure there are way more but i don't have a lot of time today so! this is what we get for now! how many points did i get :D??? i didn't get the chance to collect panels from the webtoon tho :( i'll get to it once i have a free moment!!

god i love this game, each of this moments deserve their own post tbh </3

[lloydfrontera]

You know, regarding Lloyd's achievement in history and whether ordinary citizens know him or not made me crave post canon modern au.

Imagine seeing an in universe fanfic authors notes in ao3 or twitter crying about how they simply wanted to write a story set in Lloys time but they just keep diving into rabbit holes.

Kinda like

"So i was writing an historical au set in Alician era where the MC had a detour in Cremo and he was admiring a statue by the sea with a local explaining its history. Of course, I needed to do some research only to found out that Lloyd Frontera, YES, THAT Lloyd Frontera who made the Pantara railroad defeated some sea monster, nearly died and got statue for it"

Maybe someone from Beneto Kingdom being so confused because all he learned from history in school (Beneto history) is that Lloyd is just some brilliant engineer so he got specially confused on why in the movie he was watching set in Alician era is Lloyd fighting a goddamn bone dragon.

I'm interested on how scholars and political figures bemoan and analyse Lloyd's action and achievement but ordinary people's Internet discourse could be so much fun as well.

Javier and Lloyd getting the Alexander and Haphaestion treatment on whether they were lovers or not. The discourse would be so toxic lol.

oh my god forget changing the history of civil engineering forever, sparking the nastiest discourse ever on history/fandom internet forums is lloyd's true greatest achievement akshfksdg

he's the go to historical domain character used to set the time period for a historical movie/book/series. he's the guy writers insert to give their work a more period accurate vibe. everyone knows just enough about him to make really passionate history nerds very angry about all the inaccuracies and made up facts that are taken as common knowledge.

i'm thinking people of completely different online circles all knowing about lloyd in some capacity but regarding completely separate facets of his life and work and being so surprised when they accidentally find yet another whole field lloyd revolutionized. like.

a sword nerd who's really into the concept of the asrahan core technique and knows perfectly well that lloyd helped invent it getting gobsmacked about the fact that's the same guy that laid the ground for modern sewer systems.

a fan of historical romance stories who is used to seeing lloyd as a fun cameo in the background of stories set in the alician period being really confused when they open their book on thermodynamics and see there's a whole chapter dedicated to a method lloyd figured out to create ice without the need of magic.

a train enthusiast who is really fascinated by the rudimentary switchback system lloyd frontera implemented when the concept of a train wasn't even known in the empire being completely dumbfounded when their friends invite them to see a movie about that one time lloyd frontera and his knight defeated a knight of hell in namaran.

i think it's definitely a meme to post "so i was doing research for my asfahan au and went on a rabbit hole and guess who fucking built the qanat that's widely regarded as the only reason the kingdom didn't fall into civil war. take a wild fucking guess" "was it lloyd frontera" "IT WAS FUCKING LLOYD FRONTERA OF COURSE IT WAS"

i'm also certain there would be some guys who think he's overrated and people should really stop talking so much about him when there's so many other historical figures who are just as interesting and not as recognized 🙄. to which people immediately go "mad cause your history blorbo didn't defeat a bone dragon aren't you" at them

Javier and Lloyd getting the Alexander and Haphaestion treatment on whether they were lovers or not. The discourse would be so toxic lol.

they definitely get the alexander and hephaestion treatment you are so correct. they're also the achilles and patroclus of the modern magentano girlies. there's a bunch of 'queer retellings' of their lives. they're the go to example for homoerotic friendships. there's a bunch of edits that mix historical paintings of them with ship fanart with that 'history hates lovers' song playing over them. dudebros get really angry about it. llojavi truthers pull out their 20 pages long annotations that start with "they fucking slept in the same bedroom for years" and it only gets worse.

there's one poor person online who just really fucking wants to know how and why lloyd frontera changed faces one day out of the blue with no one ever explaining it. there's no official records. no member of the royal family ever made a statement about it. why is everyone acting like the frontera family didn't have one eldest son for 25-29 years and one day suddenly had a completely different one. what the fuck is going on.

so. yeah. i'm a little obsessed with this concept actually ajkshdksa

[lloydfrontera]

we've known for a while that novel lloyd and webcomic lloyd are two different characters but this really shows the kind of character the adaptation team has turned lloyd into.

like. i cannot begin to emphasize how not true this is for novel!lloyd. at all. he's constantly lying about his feelings both to others and to himself, a big part of his emotional conflict with javier is about javier wanting lloyd to show him how he truly feels and lloyd lying straight to his face about it, being dishonest about his emotions and feelings is a core part of his character and him finally letting himself be open and honest is meant to be the payoff of his emotional arc.

the way he feels and the things he shows and says are not the same.

heck not even his feelings and his thoughts are the same!

It was truly a strange thing. He was giving away a tremendous gift without anything in return. Yet, his heart was light and filled with relief. And even though he said it was a wasted opportunity or whatever, truthfully speaking, he didn't feel that way. Tsk. It's not because that hooligan Frontera made me weak, or because I feel guilty. I'm doing this because I'm tired of its whining. It is beyond annoying to hear Frontera whining, insisting, and begging for me to take responsibility and help out. Lloyd thought this was an opportunity for him to get rid of one less burden of his. It was the cost of getting rid of this pesky burden. This was an investment. So, he concluded that he wasn't being a fool. He was doing this for Arcos and Marbella Frontera. Lloyd reiterated these thoughts in his head and pulled himself together.

like. he will lie to himself about his reasons for doing kind things and justify them as actually selfish and self-interested when we know that's not true.

he betrays his feelings with his actions, him being a good person and being unable to hide it or change it despite his best efforts is also an integral part of his characterization but it's not something he willingly shows or something he's even willing to admit to himself much less to other people.

which. is exactly the opposite of what this scene was about? i think? like. the conflict here was,, someone trying to prove that lloyd's actions aren't actually selfless and that he has a hidden agenda and lloyd proving that notion wrong by rejecting. but,, that's exactly the opposite of what lloyd wants to project about himself?

like. this is a man that when told directly to his face that he's a good person who when left to his own devices will help others for no gain to himself by a higher being whose literal job is to judge souls' goodness he will just go "nuh uh" and insist everything he does is for his personal gain and not the greater good or anything like that.

he would not be emotionally honest enough to have this kind of realization and much less to share it with some fucking guy trying to kill him.

i just. i want to know so bad what the adaptation team wanted to prove with this interaction. like. what was the purpose of it. what did they want to tell us about lloyd by having him say this.

personally i find it so diametrically opposed to lloyd's characterization in the novel that i just. i don't understand how they could've come up with this scene if they understood his character in the novel like. at all.

but. is that anything new lmao

[lynn-tged-posting]

tged webtoon ep 154 spoilers n thoughts n all that yeah

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HE DID THE THING HE DID THE >:3 THING YESS YAYYYY YAYAYAYAYY HAHAHAHAA

GOD HES SO FUCKING SILLY WAHAHAHA

jesus christ running from the cops every which way LMAO i really like their faces here javier w exasperation and lloyd just. being him

AND THE UGLY COSPLAYER BIT WHAT 😭 HELP LOL?? i guess cosplayers walking around isnt really a common thing in korea idk i feel like. they didnt really commit an offense until lloyd tried bribing that cop guy lol

like it makes me think back to dkc and how michael and the other guy (I FORGOT HIS NAME SORRY) went to seoul for a bit and kind of caused several accidents and i feel like that fits better w getting the cops attention compared to,,, rummaging thru trash? but also i am not familiar w korea's police system! nor do i know their policies on foreigners n whatnot so who am i to say yknow

EDIT: I HAVE SINCE BEEN INFORMED THAT THE THING THEY WERE LOOKING THROUGH IS A DONATION BOX WHICH IS WHY THE COPS GOT SUS

i also really really wish that besides the cop chasing, we got to see a lil bit more of javier's reaction to seoul and its citizens, the clothing and the culture and how the buildings look, what does he think of them? whats his feelings on an environment so dissimilar to his own, and does he notice anything abt it that reminds him of lloyd and his sudden acquisition of all his knowledge? maybe theres more of that in the webnovel,,, itll be a while before i get there tho unfortunately

anyways thoughts aside more reacting

UUUAGHHHH JAVIER NOTICING EVERY SINGLE TIME LLOYD APPEARS SICK OR UNWELL BUT LLOYD BRUSHING IT OFF. EXPLODES INTO TEN BILLION PIECES. AAGHH AAGHHHH AAGHH screaming crying god that engineer needs a god damn hug

also them in civilian clothes! they look so dorky lmao the hats r super cute tho AND I REALLY LIKE THAT JAVIER HAS GLASSES THATS SO SILLY how can he see though wouldn't it be like vaguely blurry . most glasses are prescription,,, tho they did find this stuff discarded so maybe theyre just,,, decorative??? do people still wear decorative glasses???

i have more thoughts on their attire but it coincides with some thoughts i have for the latter half of this ep so i'll bring it up then!

THE HIGHLIGHT OF THE EPISODE THE MOUNTAIN TRAIL AAGHHH AAAHHH

i started tearing up oh my FUCKING god i feel so insane ohhhhhhhh ohhhhhhh my heart ohhghhh

trying to keep his bluff up all the way through even though he's visibly struggling im gonna throw up im gonna throw up

most if not all the panels in this latter half of the episode make me feel like this so i'll try not to be repetitive and jump straight into my thoughts LMAO

i think the way lloyd is drawn in these panels is really, REALLY well done, and not in just an "oh the art looks good" kind of way, but the choices they make with the posing and the camera angle makes me feel insane

because the moment we cut to the shot where they're on the trail, we do not see lloyd's entire face at ALL. the most we see is his nose and mouth, and that makes my heart squirm like a motherfucker, because who else did we see that way in the webtoon?

kim suho, all the way at the beginning.

we don't actually get to know suho's face until way, way later in the webtoon adaptation, which is once he's way more secure in his position as lloyd frontera

so seeing this,,, it's like we're thrown back to then, it's like LLOYD is thrown back to then, back to when he was just suho kim; someone who thought of himself as nothing, as someone who just couldn't function correctly in this world, and god does my heart ache

and lloyd right now feels it too, the anxieties he once had coming right back. and i think that makes the clothing choices for lloyd specifically really impactful too, specifically upper body

the blue poloshirt is eerily reminiscent of the blue tracksuit suho used to wear, and it's the layer underneath a green jacket with a collar similar to lloyd's usual coat. it's like a reminder to the reader that once upon a time, he was just suho wearing lloyd's mask in a strange, new world. i think this experience is a reminder of that to suho, too,,,

also, the bucket hat is able to cover most if not all of his hair. in some of these panels, you can't even tell that it's lloyd underneath. it might not be the same body, with the way the camera is positioned, especially with some of them being from javier's point of view, it's like,,, "who is speaking right now? the face of lloyd frontera, or the heart of suho kim?"

and in the middle of this, we hear javier speak and ask suho if he hated his behavior, blamed himself for his anxieties, and only then do we get to see one of his eyes, but just one.

idk if the timing of this is intentional (i dont know if ANY of this direction is intentional) but id like to think that javier responding in search of clarification (rather than responding in silence or in disgust) helped suho be a little more inclined to opening up and being honest with who he was in this world. i really really like that

AND THIS ARGHHH ARGHHH AAAHHHHH ROLLING AROUND ON THE FLOOR LIKE A PILLBUG HAVING A SEIZURE AGHHHH

it makes it so so telling that he's the type to live for others, he always has been, to the point of being a workaholic. a quiet, good kid, trying to make amends for the struggles he has by burdening himself with the responsibility of protecting his parents names, of protecting the people he loved. he's done that since the beginning and he keeps doing that over and over and over, both here on earth and there in lorasia.

it makes me so upset (in a character drive way! not in a "this is bad" way) that he thinks of himself as nothing without this responsibility, when this ability to move forward and endure and fight for people is something beautiful in and of itself. it's not every day that you meet people like this, selfless and hardworking and tenacious to their core. back then he encapsulated his identity based on his inability to function in a world that requires social and physical interaction - something that isn't his fault! - and while he was able to move past that in lorasia, he was thrown back to this encapsulation once in seoul. he started to think of himself as "suho in lloyd's body" again, instead of "i am lloyd frontera" as he said before his "bluff" failed. MY HEART HURTS.

and i think that's why javier's concluding note, that in the knights eyes he is just the same person, is so impactful too.

because javier doesn't see lloyd based on his anxiety. he sees him for who he is. someone who protects the people he cares about. someone who is brilliantly cunning, quick on his feet, rational and brave and tenacious tenacious tenacious. for all the things suho admitted to javier, these truths haven't changed for the knight. he's the same person.

javier sees a guardian. javier sees kim suho.

AND THAT is what gets suho to his feet and we finally see his full face again. AND OOHHHH THE LOOKS THEY GIVE EACH OTHER AGHHHH AHHH

the marks of tears streaked on his face but he's smiling with so much renewed energy and javier softly smiling back IM GONNA THROW UPPPP THESE TWO MEAN THE WORLD TO MEEEE AHHHHHH AAAAAAHHHHHH

exploding. exploding. exploding. exploding. exploding.

anyway that's all (for now. if you see me on twitter i might still be agonizing over this /pos) i will SEE YOU NEXT WEEK! i hope we get a cool view from namsan tower and javier reacting to that that'd be nice :3 ANYWAYS BYE

[lloydfrontera]

javier is so,,, calm about discovering that the son of the man he pledge his life to has been replaced by a complete stranger lmao

i really can't believe this is the reveal scene they decided to give us. just this. a half hearted question about where og lloyd is and whether lloyd replaced him intentionally or not. that was it.

where's the fucking conflict. where's the drama. where's the character development. where's the choice between given loyalty and earned trust. where's my cold hearted knight who weights the benefits to the family he swore allegiance to and sacrifices one son for the other.

what is this.

in the novel this reveal doesn't happen until one arc and a giant revelation later. lloyd doesn't even know it happened! javier outright contemplates whether he should kill lloyd or not! he's so shaken by the reveal that he tried to shut down any emotions he's feeling and focus purely on what the best thing for the frontera family is (he doesn't succeed). it's not that javier doesn't trust lloyd, he does, he trusts him so much it makes it hard for him to do his duty to arcos which is literally the most important thing for javier.

the reveal is a hard moment for javier! he's conflicted about it! he's divided between his loyalty to the frontera family, his trust in lloyd and what he thinks is best for the estate. he's being pulled in all kinds of directions and in the end he has to sacrifice the son of the man that saved him as a child to keep the man that saved them all and he's come to trust more than anyone in the world.

and part of the reason he does it is because after finding out he immediately gets reassurance that not only does lloyd not mean harm to arcos and marbella but he outright commits himself to taking care of them.

javier is loyal to a fault. his loyalty to the frontera family is absolute. for him to react so nonchalant about a member of the family being replaced and maybe even killed by a stranger, however helpful he may be, is just,,, out of character for him.

but what do i know maybe i'm just talking out of my ass lmao

[lynn-tged-posting]

tged webtoon ep 170 spoilers and thoughts that i am again late on because im literally in finals week and i'm actually supposed to be studying/working right now but i can't stop thinking about tged so here we are, and more below the cut

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okay okay i thiiink i liked this episode better than last weeks episode,,, concise but sweet and i liked the panels this week!!

ESPECIALLY THIS PANEL THE HOPE HE GETS WHEN HE REALIZES ARTANIS CAN HELP CIRCUMVENT THINGS UNTIL HE FIGURES IT OUT

his wide eyes and the light all over the panel im gonna sob WAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHH i love hope i love when characters regain hope its so AFLKJSDLKFJSLDKJFLSDF EEEE HEHEHEHE

also more snippets of credos!!! since we know for certain that the demon king of back then was also an isekai'd person, maybe they were a meteorologist, and that combined with the demon king's existing abilities? or possibly an environmental engineer?

there's a good range of jobs/career paths that involve weather forecast and farming specifically,,, there is such thing as an agricultural meteorologist? i wonder what degree that would need? i think that would definitely involve some kind of environmental science,,, we've probably got another stem kid on our hands!!!

i'll probably talk more in depth about that in a future post where i compile all the stuff we know about the prequel (the one i mentioned i'd make last week lol) (it's delayed bc i have finals aahh) but until then, back to episode yapping :3

ARTANIS IS SO SO CUTE WAAAHHHH

i'm actually very glad she's so willing to help,,, though i do wish we got to see more of her thought process/her history, i'm glad we got lyra's later in the ep as lyra's story worldbuilds + fleshes out their reasoning more which is good! but i wanna see artanis specifically,,, im curious abt the extent of her abilities!!!

also lloyd i think you just need to cut ur losses man HAHA

"you're so mean" javier says to the most selfless fucking bastard on this earth rn /lh theyre so silly

ALSO JAVIER BEING THE PROTAGONIST THAT HE IS AND LLOYDS REACTION LMFAOOO

we are getting silly expressions besides the gruesome ones which i am very happy about ~ lloyd looks so fucking serious here HAHAHA

ALSO LYRA'S . PAST EXPERIENCE WITH HUMANS IS SO SAD IM. GHGHGHHH AAAGHHH SHE JUST WANTED TO HELP THEM i think the timing and pacing of this was just right ohhh,,, her expressions im gonna bawl

i can't even begin to put into words how tragic and yet how unfortunately real this is. there are a lot of people in the world who let fears and rumors take control of their actions and it results in innocent people getting hurt simply for being who they are,,, lyra didn't even say a word! she offered food and they reacted with threats to kill her,,, ghghghghgh. i hope she enjoy her time on the frontera estate i hope that helps,,,,,

and lloyd reacting to this story by fucking BAWLING is LAKDJFLSKJDFSDF ITS EVERYTHING TO ME

"yeah i've heard this before" is sobbing his fucking eyes out yeah i know what you are you fucking EMPATH

and then him additionally saying that he wants to make sure these kinds of stories don't happen again WAAAGHHH WAAAHHHHH lloyd u know whats up i love you

ALSO ARTANIS LOOKS SO FUCKING DONE WITH HIS SOPPING WET ASS HAHA

lastly this final bit was fucking hilarious HAHAHAHAHA "oh so ur a demon king too,,, that explains a lot,,," "what." LMFAOOOOO

I LIKE LLOYDS FACE A LOT IN THIS PANEL HAHAHAHAHA

i like that this episode chose for more deadpan/lowkey angry expressions instead of the usual exaggerated ones its a good change of pace,,, YAY

anyway that's all from me this week!!! see y'all next time heehoo