#and i loved their story in s2 even more so i don't think the writers would ruin it 🤞🏻

[crazykuroneko]

I knew people are still anxious about how much Louis' involvement will be in the future seasons no thanks to Anne, so let's go back to Day 0.

"I really wanted to write a love story". Yes, Rolin said TVL season is the part he's most looking forward to, but even before looking at The Vampire Chronicles, he wanted to write a romance first. Only after he saw there's enough he could build on from TVC that he said yes.

You can see this from each decision the writers have made so far. And just like how they changed Madeleine so she'd fit the AMC Claudia, they gave AMC Louis a lot more "meat" to go against Lestat (due to the big disparity in the amount of material available on each character, again no thanks to Anne)

So, unlike the books where IWTV is about only Louis' grief and being lost and the rest of the books are just Lestat going "fuck around and find out", AMC IWTV has been about Louis, Lestat, and Loustat since Day 0. And we still have the S2 finale, which Rolin says will show what they'll do with Louis next. Louis we know now is a lot more of Rolin and co's son than Anne's imo (Mark said Rolin feels like a proud parent of them both here), they've been painstakingly building him, so I don't think they'd just sideline him.

(And we already have the confirmation they'll explore the relationship between Loustat + Gabrielle. In TVL, Louis really only has one scene with her)

Added:

There's also this. It's originally in Spanish, I had to look for it first OML

[love-byers]

one of the things that makes me so confident in byler is the sheer amount of byler scenes compared to mlvn. and ESPECIALLY the final byler scene

we get like 2 solo mlvn scenes

their fight in el's room

and their talk at surfer boy's pizza

now let's count byler:

rink o mania fight

talk in jonathan's room

talk in will's room

talk on top of the car

talk in the van

talk in the cabin

SIX. COMPARED TO TWO

the last big scene/interaction we see of a character/couple in a season is super important and says a lot about what's to come

like at the end of s1, the last interaction we see nancy have is kissing jonathan on the cheek and going back to steve. she ends the season with steve. HEAVILY foreshadowing that the story is not over between them and there is more to come, there will be a big plot point related to nancy and steve in s2.

in s2 the couples are together by the end, like literally together.

lumax are dancing, mlvn are dancing, nancy and jonathan are both volunteering at the snowball, and hopper and joyce are hugging.

and the last solo interaction we see dustin have is with steve, implying their friendship will continue and be important in what's to come, which it did in s3. 

it's the same at the end of s3. the last 4 solo interactions we see are will and mike, jonathan and nancy, el and mike, and el and joyce. 3 couples, and then the moment that begins hop's letter. all very important.

in s4 we get a solo jancy interaction, a solo byler interaction, and a solo el+ hopper interaction. the final scenes. the jancy scene isn't exactly happy, they're awkward and jonathan is still lying to her about college.

so in the same episode that mike confesses his supposed love to el, the last time we see them in the same room she doesn't even spare him a glance? the final time we see a couple together is important. and they give us nothing. not only do we not know if they're together anymore, it's making us lean towards them not being together at all.

then there's this:

in s2, jonathan and nancy take a big leap from friends to lovers. HUGE leap. but after that, it's not acknowledged at all. things continue as normal. i remember watching 2 for the first time and getting a teensy bit worried that no one was talking about it and more drama would happen.

but then we get that last look, and we know without a sliver of doubt that they are officially together, and in love.

this is more proof that the final scene together between a duo is very important. imagine if they hadn't give us that jancy moment, we would've been so confused and upset. we'd think they were together, i mean they legit smashed....but then they don't acknowledge each other? that would've implied trouble.

it's slightly different for mileven because mikes monolgue wasn't their leap from friends to lovers, it was supposed to be their leap from childish, puppy love to real love.

but it WASNT

after the monologue, we don't see them speak. and this may have been okay if they'd done something. something to let us know they're still together in love.

with jancy, we did see them have moments before the snow ball scene, like nancy comforting jonathan and jonathan seeking out her comfort (a hug) when he saw will unconscious. but the last scene was still so important. they didn't leave us with nothing

with mlvn, we aren't left with nothing, we're left with less than nothing. we get to see them in the same room, and el doesn't even spare him a glance. she even seems annoyed by mike. it leaves mileven unanswered.

the jancy snowball scene is living breathing proof that the writers know how to leave 0 doubt surrounding a couple. they know it doesn't take much. all it would've take. was one look, one smile, to let us know mlvn are okay. and they chose not to.

not only did they choose to have el not acknowledge mike, they chose to have his last scene be with will.

let me repeat that. after mike confessed his supposed undying love for his girlfriend, his last solo scene with another character, the last we'll see of him for years until s5 is him with will, the person who's in love with him.

and it's intimate. it's mike reassuring will during a moment of fear and weakness that they'll kill vecna and save hawkins, putting a comforting hand on his shoulder as sunlight cascades down on them.

and the final scene of s4 reinforces everything i've said.

this has always given me the vibe of, 'there'll be petty arguments, drama, little crushes and lies, but when the world is ending, who do you grab despite all of it?'

jonathan and nancy grab each other. joyce and hopper grab each other. mike and will grab each other.

once again i want you to imagine you confessed your supposed love to your girlfriend, and then a week later the apocalypse starts. wouldn't you go to her?? stand by her??

mike didn't. he stuck with will. because mlvn just aren't that kind of relationship. but byler is that kind of relationship.

[markantonys]

i'll be interested to see if this holds true for WOT s3 since the s1 finale had so many extenuating circumstances and can't really be included in the comparison, but based off of the s2 finale, i believe that season finales tend to bear the brunt of "It's Different From The Books!" ire because they are the culmination of all the smaller changes made throughout the season.

this turned into a bigger analysis post than i expected lmao par for the course with my blog! read on for exploration of how the 2x08 conclusion of each season-long arc is the the most emotionally satisfying conclusion and/or the most thematically appropriate conclusion possible based on the show's particular version of the story, plus a bonus tangent on the nature of adaptation.

for a finale episode, the writers' prime concern 100% has to be "wrapping up all the season's arcs in a way that feels satisfying with everything that's happened in the first 7 episodes, using the book version of the finale event as the framework" rather than "recreating the book version of the finale event exactly as it is with all the same scenes and themes". the nature of storytelling inherently means that every single person who tells the same story will focus on different themes (just think of how many versions of the hades & persephone story there are), and a good adaptation knows that being internally consistent with its own Emphasized Themes is more important than copying-and-pasting scenes from the source material without making any changes to account for the specific way this adaptation is telling the story.

(but a lot of people can't even get past this first point because they don't understand that this is how adaptations - how storytelling in general - work. like, person B literally cannot tell the exact same story that person A told without putting their own spin on it. it's not possible! unless they're simply reading out the exact words that person A wrote, which can't be done when putting 14 massive books into maximum 64 hours of tv. so many readers like to meet this point with "but why does the books' version of the story need to be changed at all?" which is just a non-starter because a) medium differences require a ton of changes, and b) even if no changes were *required*, they would happen anyway because that is human nature when it comes to storytelling. when it comes to story-listening too! ask a hundred different book fans what WOT is about and you'll get a hundred different answers. rafe & co can't possibly make an adaptation that captures every single reader's idea of What WOT Is About, and nobody in the world could ever re-tell the story of WOT in the exact same way that RJ told it, not even the most die-hard book fan; all rafe & co can do is focus on making sure the show honors the core of the books' story while also telling a good story in its own right, independent of the source material.)

i was a classics major, okay? it gets to me! anyway, corralling myself back on topic.

for 2x08, it's very telling just how far Minority Reader Opinion deviates from the general audience opinion. general audiences fucking LOVED this episode (it's the highest-rated on imdb out of the entire show, currently at a 9.0; most episodes are in the 7-8 range), but a bunch of readers call it disappointing and one of the worst episodes of the show. if it was actually a poor quality episode of television, the general audience ratings would reflect that too (as they do for 1x08, currently at a 6.4 (i personally think 1x08 gets way more hate than is deserved and i thoroughly enjoy that episode, but i accept that's just me)), but they don't.

so what does that mean? to me, it means that 2x08 is objectively a very good episode of television which general audiences found satisfying, but which some readers disliked because it prioritized the emotional & thematic needs of its own version of the story over the exact nature of the falme events in the source material. which is exactly what a good adaptation should do! if you forget the books and just look at the show (which the vast majority of viewers are doing), then every resolution that happens in 2x08 is the most satisfying resolution possible and/or the only resolution that was thematically permitted for that particular season storyline.

egwene: her season arc was about learning to stand on her own two feet and not cling onto her mentor figures or compare herself unfavorably to others. thus, her freeing herself from the a'dam is the most satisfying possible conclusion to her season arc. nynaeve and elayne freeing her in the books is nice, but in the show version, thematically, it would've undercut egwene's Overcoming Impostor Syndrome arc to go "yeah actually it's true that she's not good enough on her own and when it comes down to it she does always need nynaeve to help her out". that version worked in TGH where she didn't have an Overcming Impostor Syndrome arc, but it wouldn't have worked in the show where she did. (but, yes, egwene learning in 2x08 that she doesn't have to rely on others is a double-edged sword, which nicely sets up her later-series struggles with trying to shoulder too much herself and not letting even her friends or partner help her.)

rand: his season arc was about learning to lean on others and not isolate himself or try to protect his friends by withholding his burdens from them. thus, him failing to defeat ishamael until all his friends come to lend aid in various ways is the most satisfying possible conclusion to his season arc. rand defeating ishy singlehandedly in the books is nice, but in the show version, thematically, it would've undercut his Learning That Strength Is In Numbers arc to go "yeah actually it's true that rand is capable of winning his biggest battles all by himself and thus it's no problem for him to push his friends away". given the themes that s2 emphasized for rand, the only appropriate finale outcomes were either success with his friends' help or total failure on his own, and they chose the former. (that being said, rand pushing his friends away is a continuous issue for him throughout the series, so i doubt he's perfectly learned his lesson after 2x08; we shall see!)

interesting to note that rand and egwene have inverse arcs in a way (foils!) and that some elements of their book falme climaxes were swapped, and that the way the show has done it subverts the expected gender roles. typically, men are expected to be Lone Wolves and women to be Team Players, and the WOT books absolutely play into these stereotypes throughout the series (sometimes intentionally as social commentary, sometimes unconsciously as an accepted truth of the world), but 2x08 and s2 more broadly did the opposite with our yin-and-yang co-protagonists. it's egwene who has the arc about learning to be a Lone Wolf and rand who has the arc about learning to be a Team Player. and imo these subconscious gender role expectations are a part of why some readers (esp reddit) got SO heated about "how come egwene can succeed by herself but rand can't", because it feels Wrong to them and Not How Things Are Supposed To Work (they've never questioned why rand can succeed by himself but egwene needs her friends' help in TGH, or all the other times in the books when men succeed by themselves and women succeed by relying on each other). but it's a totally apples-to-oranges comparison because egwene and rand had totally different season arcs and focal themes (but many paralleling & foiling moments within that), and so they each get a conclusion tailor-made to their individual stories.

mat: his season arc was about realizing he's a good, worthy person, finding the inner strength to overcome his worst impulses and temptations, and coming through for his friends after leaving them at the waygate. thus, him getting his Big Damn Hero moment with the horn of valere, getting validation that he is literally a hero, and overall spending the episode doing all he can to support his friends is the most satisfying possible conclusion to his season arc. (but stabbing his bff just as he was flying on a confidence high and trying to save the day was a downer note to end on, so we've complicated his relationship with heroism and set up some more internal issues for him to wrestle with next season.)

perrin: his season arc was about learning to acknowledge his inner wolf but also coming to regard it with fear and to believe that wolf & human sides can't coexist and he must Choose One (.......suddenly being struck by the bisexuality metaphor of it all. nice!) thus, him giving into violence to murder a human to avenge a wolf is.....well, it's pretty upsetting for him and serves to reinforce his growing belief that his two sides can't coexist, but thematically, it's fascinating and sets him up for some really great internal (and external) conflicts in s3. he's just gotten what he thinks is pretty strong evidence to corroborate ishy's claim that embracing his wolf side means embracing the shadow, so he's set up for a season 3 of deep-diving into his relationship with violence and his inner wolf. it's also a neat parallel with 1x08: there perrin's avoidance of violence allowed fain to escape, whereas here his embracing of violence has traumatized him (again), so our poor guy is really feeling conflicted in the pacificism-or-violence question because both sides seem wrong to him right now. huh, i guess perrin's full-series arc is about finding a middle ground rather than one extreme (pacifism/tuatha'an/human) or the other (violence/aiel/wolf). i feel like i've just had an epiphany lmao this is why i love the show! it tells the same story as the books, but tells it in a different way that makes me think about it differently and gain new insights!

nynaeve: her season arc was about learning that she, on her own, as she is today, is not enough to protect her loved ones. this is a tough pill for both her and the audience to swallow! but it's needed for her character, and we see it in the books too. nynaeve has an incredible amount of power, but she's terrified of having that much power and wants to pretend it doesn't exist. she's resistant to change, she's used to being in charge, and she's very "my way or the highway". these are all things she needs to grow out of (or moderate, at least) in order to be able to step up and do her part for tarmon gai'don. she has to learn how to embrace her power instead of being afraid of it or being too stubborn to let other people guide her and teach her, so s2 shows her what happens if she doesn't, first hypothetically in the accepted test (everyone she loves dies because she's blocked and refused channeling training) and then for real in falme (she couldn't help elayne fully or rand at all because of her block). so her 2x08 conclusion being Total Failure is not emotionally satisfying, no, but it's thematically exactly what she needed and will goad her into facing her block head-on next season. thematically, like rand, nynaeve only had 2 options for falme: break her block and succeed, or retain her block and fail, and it was too soon for the former (we gotta let her cook a while longer, plus the story will become too easy if nynaeve, or rand, reaches supernova capability too soon), so it had to be the latter. if the show had gone with a third option of her succeeding without breaking her block, then that would've taught her and the audience that it's fine to leave the block in place and she doesn't need to challenge herself to grow as a person, because when it TRULY matters she can always get around the block.

other characters get appropriate resolutions too! moiraine and lan get to work together to succeed after being at odds and failing on their own all season (rand foils!). elayne gets validation that she is an essential and trusted part of the friend group after feeling like somewhat of an outsider earlier in the season. ishamael getting vanquished and lanfear betraying him only to be betrayed by him in turn is exactly where their mutual mistrust was leading them (and it shows us why it's so important that Team Light be able to work as a team rather than as self-interested individual operators; the contrast between ishy & lanfear looking at the seals together while plotting to betray each other vs. rand standing on the tower with all his friends behind him makes me cry your honor. imagine hating that ishy's defeat was a team effort, could not be me!)

(it's also worth noting that the characters who had the least individual success/victory in 2x08 (nynaeve, rand, perrin) are the ones who will have the biggest individual storylines in s3 (tanchico & moggy, waste arc, two rivers arc), whereas the characters who had the most individual success/victory (egwene, mat, moiraine, lan) are the ones who will be taking a bit more of a backseat (of course they all have their own stuff to do, but none of them is *the* lead character of their TSR/s3 traveling group). this is intentional!)

so there you have it. 2x08 is adored by the general audience, and it's because of this: it gives us some damn satisfying conclusions to all the season arcs (and some exciting and visually stunning battle sequences to boot), and all the viewers who AREN'T beleaguered by "But The Books!", which is most of them, recognize that for the good storytelling it is. i for one will always care far more about the show telling a good story within itself than the show being identical to the books, and rafe & co will too, as they should.

the only downside to the episode is that, yes, it is quite cramped for time because there are a lot of arcs to wrap up. this should be less of an issue in future seasons when the season finale isn't "every single major storyline converges in the same place at once". for example, judging by the "goldeneyes" episode title it seems s3 might split it up so that perrin's conclusion in the two rivers is in 3x07 while other conclusions in other locations are in 3x08, giving each more breathing room. whereas 2x08 had no choice but to stuff everything in that episode into that specific episode because it's not like perrin could just do his falme stuff an episode early and take a nap while everyone else was doing THEIR falme stuff in the next episode, nor could the full falme sequence have been split into 2 episodes since that would have disrupted the flow of the story. the only solution would be for 2x08 to be extra long, which is nice to imagine, but we all know that streaming shows almost never deviate from their set episode lengths and so there isn't much point sighing about "this episode should have been 90 minutes long!" because that just is not on the table, never has been, and never will be. the first step to being able to jive with an adaptation is making peace with the limits of its particular medium!

plus, the only things i might deem "missing" from 2x08 are non-essential (ingtar darkfriend reveal - that is NOT important fight me, it's only important in the books as our first example of a morally-gray shadow-aligned person but the show has already been doing that in spades) or will likely be included in 3x01 (the gang spending some time together to breathe and process and catch up). at the end of the day, the show is always going to need to be paced very very tightly with not as much breathing room as those of us accustomed to entire books dedicated to reacting to the previous book might expect. and 2x08 did manage to pack in a LOT of character work amidst all the action and did a good mix of resolving s2 arcs while leaving some unresolved to carry into s3 and introducing some new arcs/issues/conflicts, all within 70 minutes, which i find pretty impressive. in conclusion, 2x08 my fucking beloved <3

[nylloth]

My opinion about Arcane s2 (mostly Viktor)

I'm trying to be neutral on this, but I'm upset with what they did to Viktor.

I was wrong about their relationship with Sky (but I had hope), you can see he never really cared for her and the animators put their all into conveying that. Plus, let's say Sky represents Viktor's humanity and Viktor himself gives up on her. And it's a lot easier for him to give her up than it is for Jayce, who he's trying to show this new “world” to.

They have a lot of gay moments with Jayce, I don't know why the writers call it “family”. It's really hard to see family in that. It seems like at some point they decided to change the plot, because at the end Jayce and Viktor just disappear and no one just doesn't care what Jayce has with Mel.

The thing I didn't like the most was how they changed Ryze, that now Ryze is Viktor, the all-powerful mage. We know from the documentary that it was Ryze at one point. That would make more sense than Viktor traveling through time and constantly dooming himself to a series of miseries. But then again, they added the “all for Jayce” aspect to it.

You can see it's supposed to be a different character, right?

I really didn't like how they treated Sky because obviously she wasn't an evil manipulative core. Viktor killed her twice for his own purposes. Once by accident, the second time on purpose. Look, you add a girl who is IN LOVE with a man, make her die twice for him, and show WHY he doesn't care. It's a dirty act. Amanda said she was “proud to write Sky”, I don't know what there is to be proud of. As a woman, it was painful for me to watch. You didn't have to do that. Did you mean to say the character is gay? You don't have to humiliate women to do that.

I always hoped Viktor wouldn't have any romantic innuendos because feelings, for Herald, are a weakness. But the fact that they're indulging JayVik fans makes it look NOTHING like that. Like, I'm not a fan of this ship, but even I don't consider what they showed as brotherly feelings. Especially from Viktor's side. He is literally too concerned with Jayce's opinion.

I also think that the writers largely emphasized the clips and fights, but didn't add to the story itself. I mean Silco's deep thoughts in the first season on political topics and the theme of family in general was shown much better.

Herald is essentially non-existent. It's a character for the last two episodes who is immediately killed off because of a few words from Jayce. Viktor returns and they vaporize somewhere. I take it this is starting a recurring time loop.

They kind of tried to put in Viktor's “here he's come to the realization on his own that humanity is bad”, but they did it SO FAST and literally because of one event that it looked bad. Yeah, it's not about hexcore. VIKTOR SUPPOSEDLY CAME TO THIS ON HIS OWN. Why? Because Jayce shot him, and then Jayce helped him realize otherwise. No, really, what was that?

I also didn't like the redesign. I was hoping the mask would look different, but it looks HORRIBLE.

It's supposed to give the impression that Viktor “shut down and withdrew into himself”, they also tried to make him a “deity”, but since it only lasted 20 minutes before he went back to his normal state, it didn't make any sense… Anyway… I sympathize with everyone who loved Viktor specifically, outside jayvik ship (happy for you guys). I know they are excited, but this is not Viktor's story. You see, Viktor doesn't have his own personal story now, he's too connected to Jayce. You could say he did everything and nothing at the same time. Because he keeps running this time loop, but he's running it because of Jayce's influence.

Waiting for his updated lore to read….. idk I'll read it and forget it like a bad dream.

[miwiheroes]

Dropping Byler Evidence Every Day Until Season 5

. ݁₊ ⊹ . ݁˖ . ݁ Day 10: End of Season 3 pt 1/3 . ݁₊ ⊹ . ݁˖ . ݁

Yep, there are going to be three parts to this because there simply is just so much to talk about regarding the ending of S3, and I think it's one of the most pivotal scenes for byler and mileven. I'm going to start off by talking about the contrast between Mike and Will's goodbye scene versus Mike and El's.

Prior to this scene, we see through the whole season that Mike and Will drift apart due to Mike being in a relationship with El and prioritising that over anything else. The story really is about Will being sad that he's drifting apart from Mike, DND being the medium that it's being told through. Basically, DND is the symbol for their relationship and we see that, immediately, Mike is worried that Will is going to throw away their friendship/connection when he goes to California.

This whole scene is literally just a double meaning. It uses DND and childhood memories like that as a stand-in for how they feel about each other.

Will then saying this^^ basically is him asking if him and Mike will still be friends when he comes back to Hawkins and whether things will still be the same between them.

With this, Mike could just be asking if Will is going to make another friend group that he prefers to the original Party. But I don't think he alone is worried for Dustin and Lucas as well, they could have easily had a group scene, but this whole DND arc has really focused on Mike and Will, showing that their relationship is special, and that DND is more of a stand-in symbol of their relationship too.

He sounds worried and anxious, and this makes sense to close their arc in season 3, since it leads into the next season where they have problems about Mike being worried that he's 'losing Will'.

This scene is basically:

Mike: "What if you want to be friends with someone else? Not just friends, but have our specific friendship?"

Will: "LITERALLY NEVER. WILL NEVER HAPPEN."

This scene really erases any doubt that they're just gonna have Will get a new love interest, especially at the very end of season 5. This scene is just another scene to perpetuate the idea that Will is committed to Mike, and the fact that the creators knew in this moment that Will was in love with Mike, just proves that even more. Along with the quote 'Yeah [I] need you, Mike. And [I] always will' in S4.

Afterwards as well, the smiles they give to each other are literally the flirtiest thing ever I can't even watch it without getting some vibes I don't know how anyone could ever think that they are just straight dudes having a moment yea sure

Now onto my next point about this scene. The end of S3 has all these little scenes because they are transitions scenes from S3 to S4, kind of like at the end of S1 and S2 to show you which stage the characters are at in their relationships with other characters and what needs to be addressed in the next season.

There are moments where they try and show you that there needs to be a next season. The writers have these little moments with a couple where you think there's going to be a turning point, but it ends up being the opposite. Instead, one of the characters chooses the 'safe path' where they were at the beginning of the season, BUT things have changed in their character, meaning if feels a bit wrong/off.

This exact thing happens with Jancy in season 1 and it happens with Byler in season 3.

Exhibit A: Nancy and Jonathan have a moment that implies something between them, satisfyingly rounding out their arc for the season, but still leaving the audience wonder what's about to happen next.

Nancy then chooses 'the safe path' with Steve, which is where she started out in season 1, but her character has changed enough that we see a moment of uncertainty in her:

Exhibit B: Mike and Will have a moment that implies something between them, satisfyingly rounding out their arcs for that season surrounding each other and their friendship, but it still leaves the audience wondering if they'll be okay next season.

Mike then chooses 'the safe path' by getting back together with El. Mind you, when Mike and Will had the first conversation, he thought he was broken up with her. But now she's saying they're back together, which is where they started out in season 3, but Mike's character has changed enough that we see a moment of uncertainty just like with the Stancy scene.

After this, in both their respective next seasons, we have Jancy and Byler talking about the missed opportunities from these two scenes:

Jancy's is: "I waited" "Only like... a month."

Byler's is them talking about how they barely called each other and everything, so they're clearly similar and a very obvious parallel. I mean we even have the Stancy and Mileven arcs where one of them can't say I love you to the other!!

(also while making this my tumblr started to freak the fuck out what is HAPPENING CHAT)

[perseidlion]

So I am a certified Catwin shipper. I have written a series that currently sits at 90k words that is casefic but also them getting together. But I am also a multishipper and have written some Payneland stories as well.

So I was understandably quite happy to hear we would've gotten Catwin in S2 because I love the dynamic and I love Lukas Gage and his performance.

But it has made me very sad to see how some people are genuinely upset by this news. I don't think it's justified, frankly. People are doing a lot of filling in the blanks, guessing, and supposition. Just because Catwin would have happened doesn't mean Payneland wouldn't have. Also, we have no idea the context in which all of this would have gone down.

It's important to remember that The Cat King also went on a journey and changed as a person throughout season 1 (as did all the characters.) He is not the same person who slapped the bracelet on Edwin when they first met and not just because he died and was resurrected.

He's matured, settled and grown. It's very possible this arc would have continued. Even if you hated TCK in S1, you may have come to love him in S2, or at least hate him less. Redemption arcs are great fodder for stories and I have no doubt the writers and Lukas would have done that kind of arc justice.

Or maybe Edwin would have had his hot girl summer and TCK was the same old lothario. In which case, he'd definitely be no threat to Payneland endgame. This scenario would make me sad for TCK because he does seem to have genuine feelings for Edwin beyond the sexual, but that was certainly a way they could have gone with it.

My point is, we're missing a lot of context. If you were to take plot points of S1 out of context as well, it would be very hard to envision the final product.

I mean:

Niko gets infested with dandelion sprites that nearly kill her. These sprites manifest with cartoon sparkles around her head and they feed on attention. When they get out of her brain, they're tiny snarky humans she keeps in a terrarium.

Jenny gets set up by Niko with a quiet librarian who turns out to be psycho killer stalker.

People jump off a lighthouse and get swallowed up by a giant angler fish who is siren-ing them to their death. Their ghosts linger, and this annoys the ghost who mans the lighthouse so he hires the boys. Charles yeets the Night Nurse into the fish, and inside she has a talk with an oddly calm and optimistic man. Oh, also the fish is called Angie and she didn't do any of this maliciously.

My point is, this show is camp. That's part of the charm of it. Camp plotlines sound absolutely wild when you distill them to one-liners. When you add in inciting incidents, context and character interactions, these turn from wacky scenarios into full, entertaining stories.

Please don't catastrophize based on crumbs! Whether we get a S2 or not, it's really not worth getting that worked up over. We can't draw conclusions based on what we've been given. It's all guesses, and it could have changed a million times before the episodes were finished.

Also please don't get upset at Catwin shippers for being happy about this. We just wanted to see more of Lukas and George interacting. Most of us are Payneland fans, too and understand that would be the most likely endgame.

[bloominglegumes]

judging earthspark s3

contains spoilers!!!

(my own opinion + not that serious :))

not in order bc i sketch-wrote these down while watching first but guys im so im so .head in hands

-15 pts for the character development, relationships, ideas, etc set up in s1 that were thrown out in s2 and s3. war trauma, immigrant experience, ghost aftermath, individuality, healing process, autobot guilt, byebye. so much character assassination still happening

+1 for following through i guess

+1 shockwave 'all are dead' comic cover reference and having him react to it

+5 every appearance of frenzy and laserbeak. theyre professional hecklers i love them

-1 bc of how the art direction was already established having 2d handdrawn effects but obv their animation has been toned down, there are quite a few instances of 3d smoke made to look like 2d shading which is not necessarily bad on its own but doesnt feel like it fits here

+1 rage virus had nice potential for bringing simmering resentments to surface,, wish the show delved deeper into the characters thoughts + fallout

-1 megatron's va sounds like he was given direction to hold back somehow on his delivery ?? idk it just feels like forced gentleness compared to earlier performance like his lines don't fit him

-2 animation lacking feeling of weight, movements are stiff, unnatural esp for huge guys made of metal. how in the world did twitch push megatron over

-2 fight choreo is more generic and plain,, characters tend to fight in similar ways when they wouldnt, considering different sizes, abilities, personalities etc,, everyone is just tossing each other around

-2 teasing us with breakbee and then actually setting it on fire and then killing bumblebee's personality too and while we're here thrash and mo as well

+1 escape room ep overall was kinda fun. i like the idea of leaning into twitchs big sister role but like u dont have to water down the others when highlighting one character?? the maltos are kids, but theyre not like.stupid

+1 optimus pushing megatron down to protect him and megs glancing down where optimus' hand is on him. someone in story room is pushing megop

+1 prowl being a skilled Hater on entrance

+1 "organics" (derogatory)

-1 optimus tells prowl that the war is over in defence of megatron but literally theyre fighting decepticons again two seconds later so make up your mind earthspark

-5 what are the autobots and decepticons even fighting for at this point? let's shoot them into space so we don't have to worry about that conflict anymore except megatron but he's our friend so don't think about that trust us this is earthspark our show was formed on the basis of being the aftermath of the war hasbro im going to kill you

+1 constructicon mention

+3 prowl being huggable and pickuppable (+1 optimus, +1 elita, +1 arcee)

+1 "terran thrash" "terran nightshade" "stygi-terran" "clan malto" can't tell me thats not objectively cute

+5 blaster feature

+2 megop being deeply embarrassing about robby's weird girlfriend

+5 dramatic megop fight. intense music, personal arguments, falling through the ice sinking to the bottom of the lake together, if i'm going down you're coming with me etc i love it

-1 grimmy not having a single speaking line?? am i tripping

+1 thrash throwing the hat perfectly onto prowls antler tip

-2 duller lighting and colours overall </3 my guy was seriously looking grey in ep 6..,.

+1 "romantic entanglements have hobbled many a soldier. ask optimus." thank u es writers

+1 "there are no implications. there are only facts." banger

+1 multiple pronouns used for the shapeshifting quintesson i just thought it was fun

-1 thrash's character being largely reduced to That One Kid

-1 might just be me but the whole plot with the fake girlfriend was just weird as hell ?? what purpose does it have in robby's character development,,,

-1 dot and alex being less compelling as caring responsible parents. like they're still nice,, but the way they've been written just feels less careful

-1 that movie and confession scene sorry i know it was on purpose but i could not handle the secondhand embarrassment

+1 mole-bots tbh i thought they were going to pull scraplets but they were fun

-4 starscream neglect. where is the justice. nothing but a silhouette all season and then finally all he does is go crazy and get pulled back to jail??wtf

+1 quintesson ship entrance

-1 generic character body language/performance

+1 weird al yankovic going so hard

+1 saving civilians

-2 quintus powers being suddenly able to save the day when they need it because plot

-2 how the chaos terrans are not written

-1 environments are sometimes not that fitting for the action taking place there?? like for the final fight i know theyd need a lot of space for the titan but seriously just a green grassy field and blue sky come on?? give us some artistry,..,.

-1 slightly weird voice effects for quintesson characters but that might just be me

+1 sharkticon pit plucked right out of g1 movie i love it

+1 mo being so polite "mr optimus" "ms elita" "mr prowl sir" sweetheart

+5 what the fuck do you mean "i appreciate you, megatron"

+1 hard confirmation prowl is a hugger

+1 epic titan fusion

+1 prowl being nice. dialogue with bee in that scene felt kind of in your face but it was cute

-1 arresting starscream. girlie was probably starving in there

+1 "little bird"

+1 i'm just happy to have an animated prowl having so much relevance to the main story again.tfa prowl i miss u every day

-2 tarantulas never being seen nor heard from ever again. he had an awesome design, fantastic voice acting, super well written just for hasbro to be cowards

-1 again for just dropping pretty big story points from season 1 for unclear reasons. like i said,, current state of earthspark works fine as a kid's show alone but after how mature and well-handled season 1 was it feels like watching the tv spinoff series to the actual thing. sorry but like zero integrity to the shows basis and values and what the original writing had set up for the world and the characters

[piratecaptainscaptainpirates]

I understand the criticisms people have about season 2, I really do. I have my own genuine complaints. But, frankly? I feel like we can pick this show apart too much. I don't expect any piece of media I consume to be perfect so I sure as hell think I should be able to extend my favorite show a little grace.

Literally every problem I have with s2 is almost certainly down to the fact that they had to work with a 40% budget cut and had to keep every episode strictly under 30 minutes (whereas in s1 longer episodes had some breathing room). It's very obvious to me that the writers of this show did their absolute level best to do their story justice with what they had. And at the end of the day, my biggest complaint is always that I wish they had more - more time, more episodes. That's a pretty nice thing, really, that the worst I can say about something is that I wish I had more of it.

Like I said, I get the criticism, I really do! I'm not saying any show is above critique. But I'm also not exaggerating when I say that this show as a whole is the best thing I've seen on TV in a long, long time. I can't make myself care much that s2 was a bit messier than I'd have liked when I think it still runs circles around everything else. And, as if the fact we got s2 at all wasn't enough, they made sure Ed and Stede's story never really suffered for the budget cuts, and they made sure that we ended the season with Ed and Stede in a good, satisfying place. If you haven't watched it since it was airing I couldn't recommend enough watching it again without the week-long breaks and all the fandom speculation and craziness in between; the pacing feels soooo much better that way. I love it even more with every rewatch. We complain a lot in fandom spaces but almost everyone I know irl who watch it casually think s2 was better than s1.

I love this show so much. I'm so glad we've got it and for every bit of hate I see about s2 I'm just gonna love it even harder, because even when it's messy it's the most earnest, heartfelt thing out there and I appreciate the fuck out of it for that.

[neyafromfrance95]

I really don’t understand why people are so divided on Celeborn. Like he’s always just been there and I never expected TROP to change that. Sure he’s boring but I can acknowledge that for Galadriel he makes sense and that she does love him. It doesn’t effect the intrigue of her relationship with Sauron which already existed well before TROP. It’s just that the show was smart enough to realize that and flesh it out. I think some fans have a provincial view on love and don’t understand that various layers of it can exist without detracting from the other. I can believe that Galadriel is in love and happy with Celebron and STILL feels a cosmic soul connection to Sauron. I think the writers understand that this is the meat of this adaptation because there’s a reason certain tropes are classics; the whole dark/light, good/evil push and pull. On a different note it also makes me wonder why people feel the need to whitewash Sauron’s character as this man who wants to try to be ‘good’ in order to ship him and Galadriel. I think s2 makes it very clear that he is at his core a dark and evil entity who at the very most finds human morality an interesting curiosity and warps ideas of goodness for his own gain. And monsters can still feel love, like I think he definitely feels connected to Galadriel and will only ever feel as deeply as he is capable for another being, for her. But because he is what he is, he has no problem manipulating her for what he thinks is best for her and ultimately what serves himself. They are on totally different ends in how they perceive the world and yet they see each other so clearly. This is what makes it interesting for me at least. Anyway let me stop rambling now lol

yeah, i agree.

i see celeborn as this emotional support husband who (unlike many other male characters in lotr) doesn't "dominate" his wife and is rather her follower. there is a good malewife potential for him, lol. and he is pretty much just a background "husband" character, not taking away the spotlight from galadriel.

and yes, just bc galadriel ends up married to celeborn and they might have a nice soft relationship doesn't mean that she doesn't have a far more special and deep connection with sauron, more passionate and poetic even.

but the reason why they can't be together and the whole tragic beauty of sauron x galadriel is that her gaze is fixed on the light while he is the darkness incarnate. and the fact that sauron is this irredeemable evil yet still loves galadriel and her only but in his own twisted way is what makes it more fascinating!

i wish we could allow female characters to have complicated, complex and flawed relationships instead of trying to limit them to the simple wholesome and easily digestible ones.

that being said, i don't really think it's gonna be interesting to focus on galadriel's relationship with celeborn in trop. we know their story already, we've seen them together in other media. this is the story of galadriel x sauron and taking the focus away from this relationship by introducing celeborn would be far from compelling or satisfying development. that's the reason i don't really want to see him until the end of the show.

(also, again, the reason for celeborn demand and discourse is that a lot of incelbros want galadriel to be this tame wifey and they think celeborn is going to come and take away her sword, and a lot of moralists want us to stop shipping "taboo" ships such as sauron x galadriel.)

[avelera]

I feel like one unexpected side-effect in the (slight) uptick of queer ships becoming canon (seriously guys it's so slight if you look at the actual numbers) is learning how often slash fandom doesn't actually want the baggage that comes with their ship becoming canon.

I mean, of course they want it. The fandom wants the confirmation that they're not delusional, that they're not mocked, that the sparks they sensed between two possibly-queer characters is real.

But the side-effect of a ship becoming canon with anything more than a kiss to mark the end of the story is that it might become canon not in the way you wanted.

So long as the characters are in the will-they-won't-they, you can imagine what their first time would be like. You can imagine how they act in a relationship together. You can imagine the tone of the relationship.

You can imagine it in ways that are incredibly personal and meaningful to you.

But the minute a ship becomes canon at a point where the story still needs to progress, you're going to get divergence from the way you imagined it going.

They're going to bicker about things you never imagined would be a point of contention between them in the story, that it might have even been meaningful for you that they had never fought over previously, possibly because the story just didn't have the time for them to fight over that beforehand. Or perhaps this writer leans more into interpersonal conflict as a plot point, where you preferred the couple facing an external threat. There's as many ways to imagine the tone of a relatinship as there are people in the world.

They're going to have a different first-something than you imagined. First kiss, first date, first time sleeping together. For it to be canonical it has to be committed to the page which means it has to be set. Maybe you thought it would be awkward where it was smooth, or smooth where it should be awkward. Maybe you though the kiss would be a bigger deal to them than the sex or vice versa. Maybe canonically they flub the romance of that first time for the sake of comedy. Now that's canon too. You can ignore it with fic, obviously that's what fandom is about, but now it's AU, not "what-if?".

There might be interruptions to the love story, breakups, fights, separations, that aren't the end of the relationship but do mark an action beat that is necessary to keep the story moving and interesting. Unless the last canonical beat is them riding into the sunset together, it's inevitable and usually marks the end of a story because domestic fluff where nothing happens isn't actually a genre that can be sustained in original fiction without a plot.

Look, as queer ships become canon, this is going to be inevitable. OFMD S2 was the most egregious example I've seen recently of everyone who had engaged with the fandom having a different version of how they wanted Stede and Ed to behave once they were together. I couldn't help but laugh when I saw that the fandom fervency shifted from the canonical established queer ship (after it had the audacity to move beyond the establishing kiss and then the will-they-won't-they phase of reuniting), to the potential of a character who was never even canonically established as queer (Izzy) because everything about his story still lived in the potential land that fandom thrives in. And I don't entirely mean that as a criticism, just as a bitter irony!

Fandoms don't necessarily want a ship confirmed, they think they do, but that potential which was so enshrined and infuriatingly drawn out with regards to queer ships for so long and that's only just barely breaking just a little from when it was outright forbidden to show queer characters getting together (and it still is in most of the world if you go by population, and heavily discouraged by the mainstream powers that be in most places even where it's not banned, the limitations on international markets you get from having canonical queer characters even as side characters still makes it prohibitive for big budget flicks, since it means cutting themselves off from those markets in terms of recouping costs.)....

ANYWAY the point I'm making is that a few queer ships becoming canon has led to a perhaps predictable but depressing amount of outrage when 1) a popular queer ship doesn't become canon, but that's been building for a while now, but also 2) when the popular ship becoming canon doesn't become canon in the way the fandom wanted. Which was also inevitable but goddamn as a veteran of fandom for over two decades now, I can remember not that long ago when your queer ship becoming canon just not in the way you hoped would have been a damn nice problem to have!

[nyxtsu]

Yap session about Zane~Chan

Zana/Zane~Chan gets a lot of hate as a ship, but I think it's the healthiest romance in the series.

I personally don't think it's THAT rushed, maybe towards the end, but they didn't just come out of nowhere, it was set up in s2 and they had moments here and there in seasons after that. It was clear even before Starlight that it was set up to be something in the future. But that's besides the point. Their relationship shows healthy communication and growth between two people, and an overall good representation of how a relationship should be. It shows mistakes and flaws within the relationship, and how it's important to communicate and try to fix these things.

Despite how Nana is in relationships, and despite how Zane had never been in a relationship before, it's surprisingly the most mature romance we see.

In the beginning, we see Nana sort of trying to rush things, like she's known to do. Zane tells her that it's okay to go slow and that it's best for them. She takes this criticism and tries to better herself. Zane comes out of his shell a bit more thanks to Nana. In the 'Nana accidentally kissing Garroth' thing, Zane showed true maturity in the way he handled that. He was sad at first, but once Nana explained, he said he believed her. He believed her because he trusted her. That kind of trust is so important in relationships. I think they both truly try to understand each other, because they genuinely care. I think that's a great representation of problems within relationships and working past them. For a Minecraft roleplay.

A lot of Zane's growth as a character was on his own or with the help of Aphmau at the beginning of Mystreet, but we definitely see even more of it in his relationship with Nana. This is how it should be! A character going through self improvement on their own, throughout a series. We see him grow as a character, we got more lore as we went on, saw him warm up to the people around him, etc.

But Nana... my babygirl... what did they do to you...

In Starlight, Nana felt like a character thrown in there as a love interest for Zane. Her character didn't have much growth or depth before that, and all of a sudden in Starlight she's telling her deepest darkest secrets to Zane. While I think that they really did grow closer in "Aphmau's Year", and I do not think she was wrong for suddenly telling him about her past, it felt like bad writing on Jessons part. It just gives the feeling of "oh lets finally give this female character some depth so she can be with this male character." If that makes sense. I wish she had that growth or that lore was revealed earlier on, not just for her relationship with Zane.

So, of course Zana has its faults here and there, but I don't think it's because of their relationship dynamic or anything, I think it's the fault of bad writing (especially on Nana's part). If their story had more thought put into it, and the writers weren't so focused on one ship(Aarmau), it would have been much better. I still think it's great, and I love them, but it could have been better.

Nonetheless, they have a healthy relationship, and they send a good message to the young audience about how things work in relationships. They don't have a very suspicious age gap! And they don't punch each other or sexualize each other to a concerning degree!! Stares at Aarmau and Travelyn.

[astral-herald]

my arcane hot takes/predictions

i believe all of these things but! it's all in good fun. there isn't a character i genuinely dislike; every one serves their purpose, their motivations are fully realized, and every dilemma they endure/represent is morally complex and super fascinating!!

i love reading/talking about this show :)

If we had to nominate a single character as the show's villain in s1 (rather than the enforcers as a unit, or silco's shimmer operation, etc.), it would be marcus. if he hadn't taken silco's blood money, none of this would have happened.

jayce is "worse" than viktor in season 1 morally; "worse" comes with a lot of weight, ofc. i think season 1 follows jayce's story especially closely, from starry-eyed genius, to political initiate, to chess-master-in-training. the narrative indulges and displays his darkest traits and contrasts his narrative of moral emptiness with viktor's story of lonesome self-sacrifice. this is why i think it's VERY interesting that jayce allows viktor to break the news about his deal with silco for an independent undercity.

BUT! viktor will completely flip this dynamic next season, and viktor fans like myself will find ourselves in jayce's shoes! i can't wait for this!

relatedly, i am eager for a complete villain arc for viktor. it's mostly agreed upon that his story is incredibly sympathetic, but i'm hoping that the writers push him a few steps too far. i don't want to be comfortable - i want to watch a true degradation of morals to complicate what it means to redeem or condemn someone with such a tragic past. it'll blend very nicely with our initial impressions of vi's s2 story.

jinx is the main character of arcane and i love that for her.

vi's alleged enforcer arc makes Perfect sense, especially when contrasted with her dialogue with vander in act 1: "i grew up thinking that i am less than them." she can't be less than them if she's one of them.

mel hates viktor and was worried that jayce prioritized his relationship with viktor too highly. this comes from the scene where jayce confides in her that viktor is dying and her first remark is: "i didn't know you were so close." not long after, she silently belittles viktor when convincing jayce that the hextech weapons are a necessity by looking down upon him and refusing to consult him. i also want to be So Clear that i adore her character and that this is NOT a criticism; both scenes are phenomenal and are integral into their tripartite dynamic.

caitlyn was way out of pocket for her aggression in ep 9 and it definitely revealed her character's darkest tendencies that i think we'll see more of in s2.

viktor will be the sleeper-agent for s2. i know i'm projecting here but think about it - even visually, he has his own shade of purple amidst shimmer's fuchsia and hextech's blue. much like how powder's stealing was the initial conflict in s1, i think viktor has the same catalyst potential.

the worst things s2 could do are a) killing off a champion too early (save the deaths for ep8/9!) and b) giving viktor a love interest.

[gwenllian-in-the-abbey]

Hey Gwen! Can I ask you something? What do you think of this post? https://www.tumblr.com/philhelaena/757011234089566208/thinking-about-how-hotd-introduced-adult-aegon-as?source=share

I don't really agree with it since Dyana is still present in this season and even in the previous season he was the punching bag and scapegoat of the family, but I can't find the words to explain how I disagree. What do you think?

Hi anon. With no disrespect intended to the OP of this post,. I've seen this take floating around for awhile now, that Aegon is somehow completely different from his S1 character and that it's somehow of fandom pandering, and I disagree.

First of all, the idea that half the fandom decided to ignore the fight pits and the sexual assault and focus on Aegon being drunk and funny is just flat out incorrect. At the end of S1 it was hard to write a single sympathetic word about Aegon without someone accusing you of being a rape apologist, and even now, while the casual audiences are more sympathetic towards Aegon, people can hardly say they've been enjoying his character without issuing a disclaimer, "he's a terrible person but ...". Team green has always been in a minority (I think in the polls HBO puts out team green is consistently under 15%), and even among people who enjoy team green, until recently it wasn't uncommon for people to say they loved all the greens except Aegon. On AO3 were more Lucemond fics than there were fics featuring all of the Aegon ships combined. So the idea that the showrunners were somehow listening to the 10 people who admitted to enjoying Aegon back when they were writing the S2 scripts and changing his characterization accordingly is pretty silly.

That said, I do think the show toned down Aegon's awfulness a bit. I think TGC himself probably had as much to do with this as any of the fans. That man is relentlessly advocating for his character, stating again and again that he not simply a villain, that that he is capable of empathy and love, that he is someone who feels too deeply rather than the opposite. The way he talks about Aegon and his children makes it pretty clear that he has a vision for this character and has advocated for certain character choices, and good for him! He cares a lot about Aegon and takes his job seriously and it shows because he has gotten heaps of praise for bringing depth to a character who could easily veer into cartoon villainy, and is winning over the sympathies of people who 2 years ago wouldn't have pissed on Aegon if he were on fire. In fact, recent poll on the main HotD subreddit of all places placed Aegon as the best written character so far and it wasn't even close.

And this is good! Considering what happens to Aegon in S2, as well as the endgame of the whole entire story, it's pretty important that the audience be able to connect with him on some level and feel some level of sympathy for him.

And to be honest, I'd challenge the idea that Aegon had some huge personality switchup between S1 and S2. People have to remember, we had a grand total in S1 of about 8-10 minutes with Aegon. He was not, at that point, a fully realized character. Some people envisioned a much darker character than the show ended up settling on, but those headcanons are as much headcanons as the silly goofy drunk Aegon was, as "good loyal brother" Aemond was. And I have to stress, people can interpret characters however they like, and they can certainly disagree with the direction the writers go with a character, but a character who has 8 minutes of screentime ending up having more facets to him once he appears in a primary role in S2 is not the same thing as a character assassination. And perhaps, just perhaps, the child fight pits were the OOC part and Condal etc. pulled back on that characterization because it was incongruous with the guy who was genuinely baffled when Aemond threw him under the bus for the bastard remarks, the guy dying of embarrassment when his sister roasted him at dinner, crying over a slap from his mother, trying to run away rather than take the crown, and asking Alicent "do you love me?" before crying his way through his own coronation. Aegon was a depressive alcoholic in S1 and remained a depressive alcoholic in S2. Was there a chaotic element to him? Certainly! He's got massive substance abuse problems which completely skews his judgment and inhibitions, making him self destructively impulsive. Is there a darkness in him? Of course! If nothing else, he's a Targaryen prince, someone who has grown up with the power of life and death at his fingertips. And we see this! The show has not allowed us to forget about the ratcatchers (and as you mentioned OP, Dyana is still there too)!

Finally, I will say that people who think Aegon is being shown to be a pure buffoon this season haven't been paying attention. Aegon was gaslit by his family members for four episodes straight because they wanted to keep him weak, and the way to do that was to undercut his confidence and trash his self worth. He was correct about nearly single issue he raised -- Harrenhal, the blockade, the smallfolk, needing to be informed about the battle plans Cole and Aemond were making. Hell, even the assassination attempt is something that Otto himself was planning, and Otto himself ordered landed gentry executed for refusing to bend the knee before Aegon was even crowned, a much bigger deal than executing a few ratcatchers! Aegon has a class clown demeanor a lot of the time, but he's not stupid. The thing is, Aegon could have been spouting the most eloquently worded arguments and they were still going to resist him because they whole entire point was to discourage him so that he would lose interest, Alicent even says it point blank to Otto. The thing is, Aegon has good instincts but lacks the confidence to not second guess those instincts because he knows he doesn't have the experience or the training necessary to be an effective king on his own. Aegon's ability to listen is one of his better qualities as a king in fact (I'm sure the council is missing it now that they have Aemond), but he is too concerned with winning the approval of not just his subjects, but the people he cares for, including Alicent and Aemond. Aegon is remarkably perceptive, and he does have a good sense about people, but this is his weakness and unfortunately his family has zero problem exploiting it. Now, will that continue going forward? Unlikely! Aegon is still evolving! In the span of a few months he's been crowned king, lost a child, been undermined and diminished, and has become permanently disabled due to the betrayal of his own brother. Certainly, he is going to change, for better or worse.

[chaifootsteps]

hb could have actually worked Stolas in to the 'Blitz needs to believe people can love him so he won't die alone' plot without it being so disgusting and yucky

OK so hear me out - everything plays out the same up to Ozzie's

then in s2-4 instead of doing The Circus and making Stolas the main character, we stay with Blitz. if S1 was about who he's hurt in the past s2 is the point at which he begins trying to mend fences, but actively instead of the writers just forcing him to do it because he realized in Ozzie's he doesn't like how things are now

have the 'crashed Moxxie's anniversary' actually pay off with M&M being frostier than usual and Blitz being afraid he's about to lose them too. have Loona be annoyed when Blitz is overbearing when she's trying to make new friendships and accidentally sabotaging them with his over-protectiveness

have it be a story of Blitz simultaenously trying to make it up to people from the past (not all of whom forgive him) while he's trying to avoid repeating the same mistakes in the present with his new family

have the circus accident be more directly his fault - maybe he's practicing a stunt to win his father's love and causes the fire that way, even though he obviously didn't mean to

and have him begin to be emotionally vulnerable in small ways and he feels it pay off when others respond in kind instead of mocking or hating him like he fears. Trash 'Oops' as an episode but keep the emotional beat of Fizz forgiving him being the turning point for Blitz forgiving himself a bit, too, because Fizz's forgiveness is the thing he's secretly longed for during the entire show (next to Barbie's, who should also get vastly more screentime). have arcs to handle each of the main cast and flesh out IMP first and foremost

then as he begins to heal and treat people better, return to the Ozzie's plotline. have it be a thread throughout s2 of following Blitz's perspective of the fallout, not Stolas'. Show how confused he is by what Stolas is doing and why he's so happy to avoid him for those months off. have him make small comments to the people in his life about how deeply unhappy Stolas makes him and have them actually notice, because Blitz hated himself so much before he just rationalized what was being done to him as something he deserved

have the full moon argument play out as-is, but instead of what happens during apology tour, have Blitz think what he needs to do is apologize to Stolas to complete his character growth and love someone. Except make it clear to the audience that he has nagging doubts about all this - especially when Stolas pulls the 'I can't believe you didn't ditch taking your daughter to the doctor's office to come save me despite sending your employees to help because I fundamentally don't value your family or your time' card

And then right when it looks like he's about to cave and give Stolas what he wants - he doesn't.

He tells Stolas now he's learnt to love himself and he has people in his life again who've proven to him that he can be cherished and his worst self won't be rejected so long as he puts the work in to make things right when he screws up. He tells Stolas he used to think the owl was the closest thing to real love he could ever have - feeling used, abused and degraded. But he knows better than that now and he isn't about to let a pompous self absorbed royal bully him into being the perfect consort he wants. He goes further than that, even, telling Stolas he was bought to be his friend and pitied him from the start - and even now he wouldn't trade places with him even if he could

Because Blitz has rebuilt his life by looking in the mirror, holding himself to task and trying to be better. Meanwhile Stolas - who has had every advantage Blitz hadn't and could have chosen every step to do things differently - has actively pushed away both Via and Blitz with his 'never my fault, promise to do differently while getting worse all the time' behavior

Then Blitz walks out of his life for good, because now he has regained a sense of self worth he can see that he deserves better than the "love" Stolas was offering

and the one person he does apologize to, besides Barbie/Fizz/Moxxie/Verosika/etc? Striker. He apologizes for calling him a supremacist (still happens in this rewrite but as a sign of how hard Blitz is trying not to think that Striker has a point about Stolas) and that he isn't interested in fighting with him any longer

And Striker just responds with a smile, because he knows it means what he hoped all along would happen, has happened. Blitz is finally free from Stolas - and when he's ready he can move on to a love who respects him instead of just wanting to use him

I want this. If we can't have this in canon because Viv is Viv, I'm glad we have it here and now.

[batsplat]

speaking of smallville now that was certainly a show. how many seasons did you manage and when is it best to stop? I am currently at s2 and already I would kill every other character for lex, wyd it’s only gonna get worse 😭

lmaooo okay so I got to. six. which actually kinda kills me because I swear I poured my heart and my soul into that stupid show, it drove me insane it left me a lesser person and I BARELY GOT HALFWAY

my basic analysis of the default journey with that show that I'm going to pretend is universal is like. it hooks you with something compelling in s1 and you still have enough naive faith to give it benefit of doubt that the writers actually know what they're doing, because you just wanted to have a bit of fun but, hey, these characters are actually more interesting than you expected!! then in s2 you're starting to get doubts but you're already kinda too deep. then s3 breaks your sanity and makes you scream and at this point you just see how far this shit goes. then s4 is.... mid..... but is also in a way the last remotely palpable season? and then at some point in s5 you're just like. wow I don't even enjoy the hate watching any more. and s6 is. yeah. eventually there was one storyline that is so insanely uncomfortable that it's just. enough. enough!

[mild spoilers to follow]

if s2 drives you insane on lex grounds then!! boy!! s3!! the thing about s3 from lex's pov is that. okay it's extremely angsty and does increasingly radicalise you... I have to say I started this show in a very innocent jokey 'oh ho ho I heard they have some good superman/lex luthor queerbait in that noughties show!!' and was ready to be a lex fan like. as a bit. and y'know my readiness to adopt morally dubious characters is pretty high anyway. but the first few seasons made me go?? okay but he genuinely isn't even the villain?? like I'm not even saying this for the bit, he LITERALLY is not the bad guy in this story?? guys??? and then by the end of season 3 I had been completely radicalised to the 'Actually Lex Luthor Should Turn Evil And Kill All Of You People And I Will Cheer Him On' stance. but what really, really, really kills me is that after all that, they still manage to bungle his transition to evil. like, they ignore all the very obvious reasons for why lex would turn evil after all that, and just come up with completely new ones? that have fuck all to do with this character you've been writing up to that point?

and the worst bit. the WORST bit. is that after all that, he literally does not even have fun being evil. like, you know that season one episode where he's being mind controlled and does his gay little swagger. this scene, yeah:

first of all, again, they ended up erasing lex's canonical motivation for turning evil, which is being so queer-coded he might as well be wearing a sign with slurs around his neck while he's stuck in a small town in fucking kansas. like "you think I don't see the way your parents look at me? the way half the town looks at me?" okay, great, love how this entire arc is eventually concluded by having the show say the entire town including clark's small-minded parents were 100% right to be suspicious of him, that there was something fundamentally defect with him basically from birth and he was always going to turn out to be evil. I feel like you definitely thought through the implications of what you wrote here!

but never mind all that, my actual point is that lex is having fun here!! this is one of several episodes where they're 'foreshadowing' lex turning evil by 'having a paranormal reason to make lex evil for a few minutes' (some subtle writing, this), and he's generally having a lot of fun with it!! he's leaning into the camp of it all!! he's freed from all his nasty and completely unnecessary inhibitions like 'not killing everyone in smallville' which. good. and he's just having a great time. and then he becomes a villain and he's literally just miserable all the time!! it sucks!! like omg if you're going to butcher his writing and ruin the character then at LEAST let him have some fucking fun?? at least let him experience joy at his own depravity or whatever? like he doesn't even get to do any fun villain monologues at clark, he's literally just sad clark isn't his friend any more while clark is giving him the homophobic dog slur. and then also about twice a season something paranormal happens to clark and he physically assaults lex to the point where he like, almost kills him, and then after that everyone pretends it didn't happen and clark never apologises and continues to burst into his room demanding answers. like omg?? lex, they hate you anyway, can you please just attempt to shoot clark?? also, obviously the turn to villainy should have been in large part motivated by lex finding out clark's secret and going?? the fuck is wrong with you for not just SAYING this?? (plus finding out everything clark did to lex in season three to keep his secret like it's genuinely so fucked up #lmao) but. I hate to break bad news to you about where we're at with the whole 'does lex know clark's secret yet' situation at the point where I gave up. genuinely what is the point of all this building and perfectly interesting character work if you're NEVER gonna deliver

but quite possibly an even worse sin of the later seasons that genuinely broke my brain was the treatment of lex's father. like, not to give the game away too much here, but the show's philosophical stance on rotten apples ends up being.... well. it's interesting which characters this show feels is worthy of redemption!! also interesting when they retcon several seasons of writing for the show that already very much set up why a character would actually perfectly legitimately go insane and instead settle for 'well his father sure did know there was always something wrong with him'!! watching some season 3 and season 5 episodes back to back would leave your face scarred from the amount of whiplash in the writing. the whole thing's kinda incompetent and dumb but is also like?? actively a little bit evil when you really think about the implications of what they're writing here

anyway. it's a brave stance on superman to go 'okay but what is being a superhero really about if not a whole whole lot of gaslighting'. and I do love the clark stalking room!! but the problem is, they could've played the clark/lex dynamic in a kinda tragic 'wow clark really has been so blinded by his parents that he's gonna end up destroying his relationship to lex because he just can't be honest with him and lex really needed one person in his corner who actually trusted him but clark wasn't the right person to provide that' way. they could've played it in a sort of fun 'yeah this is kinda fucked up and weird and toxic how they simply cannot stop doing dubious shit to each other' way where you just kinda roll with how terrible the whole thing is. but they don't go for either of those!! they're so stuck with treating clark's parents as the moral centre of the universe, with their "marriage is SACRED, clark" schtick and all that (yeah, there's an episode where clark gets lectured about the importance of the bond of marriage, this is a thing that happens) that they're blatantly unaware of what story they're telling but ALSO just refuse to lean into the batshit insane elements and just have!! fun!! and it's one of those things where you really do feel like an idiot for even thinking about this stupid fucking show so!! much!! but I swear, I swear they had a dynamic that hit like crazy in season one... also some of the fic out there for them is CRAZY like it kinda does make it all worth it but still!! still!! this shit infuriates me!!

anyway, here are some bonkers plot bits I remember happening in this show for you to enjoy if you continue in this endeavour:

the lex luthor slut shaming episode

clark kent slut shaming lex luthor, which is conceptually funny anyway but becomes funnier if you just read it as clark being unable to figure out he is actually just subliminally attracted to his friend. like, okay, clark being disappointed at lex for sleeping with thirteen different women, I see you

like. multiple lesbian lana moments. she's constantly getting herself in lesbian situations. and I get this is some kinda weird fanservice-y shit from the showrunners but, sue me, I thought lesbian vampire lana was cute

which is a thing that happens

they get spike from btvs to tell clark vampires aren't real, which is the one funny thing they wrote in about a season

the native american stuff is always deeply uncomfortable but it becomes even weirder when they invent some native american prophecy *deep sigh* to explain how lex was always evil

clark steals a car from lex several episodes after committing like, one of the most obscene acts of betrayal it is possible to commit against a friend (lex is unaware of this and possibly never finds out? I think the writers maybe forgot about this.) and lex is just like. it's fine <3 I know friends sometimes have to do crazy shit for other friends!! you're my friend, right?? and clark goes... yeah. sure

I vaguely remember lex buying stuff the american football high school team at some point and showing up to the lockers to give a speech and it's just?? this is right after the friendship break up and it's basically lex talking right at clark and he's talking about the importance of fresh starts and it is so fucking funny

the one episode where lana is in paris. they had built up to this for ages as like a whole thing where lana finally frees herself from that miserable town and all the people in it (don't ask how the 'lana knowing clark's secret' situation develops. it doesn't) and then she's there for. one episode

martha kent tells clark how they can't harbour illegal immigrants at one stage?? she eventually changes her mind I think but what even was that all about

the papa kent goes into politics arc. shoot me

lex becomes like. possessed by zod. which somehow manages to make everyone involved more dull

silver kryptonite makes clark paranoid, which ends up being pretty funny because he genuinely talks the exact same way

lex thinks clark can throw him across the room because he's been hypnotised

lex starts capturing various clark super powered friends and delivers these gay villain monologues to them (like genuinely, in one of them he's got shirtless aquaman strapped to a gurney and he's like, leaning over him, teasing him with a glass of water) and they're some of the best bits of the show

clark discovers the clark stalking room, which I will say was very funny

chloe basically saying lex always sends clark these massive gifts as a way of keeping his affections which?? clearly true but I thought we were keeping that the subtext

clark gatecrashes lex's wedding high on red kryptonite

one of lex's old bullies gets killed by like, a statue falling from the top of the building they're standing next to and stabbing the guy and then some of the blood splashes on lex and he's just like ?? bleh. fantastic scene

and THEN there's several scenes with his father where lex is like 'well that sure was a nice shirt :(' and lex's father is berating him for his lack of humanity. or something

there's an episode where lex is split into good lex and evil lex and it's genuinely the only worthwhile thing the show did that season. like the writing is still kinda incoherent but, crucially. it sure is fun

the spirit of lex's mum tells him she thinks he sucks

worst show in existence. I'll never forget it

[nalyra-dreaming]

Hi, I have some loose thoughts, and I would like your opinion, I know that in the books everything is about Lestat (and that the series will be more about him and Louis) but I really hope that doesn't happen in the series because I always ending up hating the characters where everything is about and for them, and i want to keep liking Lestat! it's simply annoying, I would like the series to explore the history of the four characters, I think it would be much more interesting, I also think that people aren't really analyzing Armand and his relationship with Louis properly, people tend to think that Armand controls Louis 100% of the time and the writers and Jacob himself have said that they wanted Louis to have some agency, for example, when Armand suggested new art for the wall, he suggested colorful art and people insist on saying that Armand keeps him in an prison, controlling everything in the apartment, leaving everything dark, I don't know, when at least for me Louis is doing this, because he is unhappy and in a way, he wants Armand to be unhappy too, they are both not with who they want to be, and I think Louis must have really asked Armand to make him forget the first interview because he was no longer able to deal with the guilt about Claudia and Lestat and he didn't really want to try to commit suicide again, but Armand, in order to keep the lies going, had to keep controlling his mind, so he kept increasing the control until he reached a point where he didn't even wanted (obviously i dont know, just especulating) but he didn't know what to do, because I think Armand loved Louis in some way. I also don't see people talking about the fact that Armand thinks that Marius, who is older and more powerful than him, died at the hands of other vampires (who I think were younger than him, I don't remember) so why not they believe that Armand really thought that the coven could kill him, if they were focused, we know that he could have prevented it but I don't think he knew that...anyway, I think we have to listen to what Armand has to say, because until now we only know about lies and omissions that he told, we don't know what was really happening or what was going on in his head until this moment. Sorry, because it's a lot and english is not my first language!

Hey!

Not everything is about Lestat :), but he is the narrator of a lot of them, and is part of the story in most :) Given the books Rolin said he takes from (already) makes it clear that he focuses on the Loustat/Lestat centric books, which carries obviously repercussions for the show. But that just as a note :)

I do think, and I just said this in another ask again, too, that the show is built on the big four, namely Louis, Lestat, Armand and Daniel. These are the corner stones they chose, and the rest of the relationships and stories will revolve around them I think. But... Lestat will stay, and, well... he will be very prominent in the upcoming seasons, let's put it that way.

I... have an idea for when Louis could have asked for his memories to be erased, but I don't think he would have asked Armand. I mean, this is the guy who keeps the stones in his ankles as a reminder. I don't think he would willingly choose to lose the memories, no way. There might be ways to make that statement true, story-wise, but if it is, there is a LOT more to it.

Armand had to constantly readjust Louis, that is no speculation, that is something Assad has said :), and that is clearly visible in s2, too, especially on rewatch. Louis' behavior shifts, radically, from part to part, depending on what is... needed.

As per Armand and the "coven killing/controlling him"... nonny, that part has been proven a lie. It has been proven by the few pages we got of the trial script as well. Armand was never in any danger from them. He directed the trial. He was their master for centuries.

He killed Claudia and tried to kill Louis.

That said, you are correct, the "current" knowledge of the characters has to be taken into account. And Armand might not know yet that Marius is still alive (though I do think that him hanging art of Marius in the penthouse speaks volumes). I say might, because it depends. In the books he sees someone he thought dead at some point, and ... that must have led to a lot of speculation.

And yes, I would love to "listen" to Armand, as you put it. I would LOVE an adaptation of TVA or maybe a spin-off of him and Daniel in Night Island. I'd love that.

But Armand has been giving a very edited tale, that has already been stated, and he has changed the tale in Louis' head, has implanted and changed memories. Daniel latching onto the fact that Lestat could not have spoken in Louis' mind after turning was supposed to be the clue there.

Next season, Lestat will give his account - and whether this fandom likes it or not, but Lestat is canonically doing so for Louis, to make him understand, and he has no reason to lie and he does not soften much either. And that understanding of Louis being the driving motivation will have the "documentary" result in something quite different than what s1 & 2 were - and Louis will understand.

In the books, that is when they reunite - before other things happen. I... no matter the other stuff they put into s3, but I don't think that will be any different here, since they keep quite close to the books for the big emotional points.