#and antis “ reclaim ” terms that DO NOT need to be . COULD U JUST FUCKING USE IT THE WAY IT ITS ? ! please . u dont need to reclaim

[vocalux]

tbh the problem is not even creating alternative terms , because even i , as rqtransid , use them , the problem is saying that you are anti that term and identify with the same thing that it is

i feel bad for some of em idk

Always remember that the ONLY reason anti rq's came into existence is because they made a bad assumption about a group and THEN piled on excuses to why that assumption was real and based

Let's not forget, they aren't ACTUALLY against the message radqueer tries to send, they love it actually! But because of the assumptions and ideas they have about the rq community is built up so thick, they could never admit being wrong lest they rethink their entire identity

They keep making transID alternatives because it turns out! The group they hated happened to have validity and kept losing friends over it!

They took over multiself because it turns out! They felt exactly the same!

They had to stop shitting on para's cause it turns out a lot of people are themselves para's!

They LITERALLY just made an alternative to conabuse relationships because so many people related to that and WANTED that!

They will KEEP remaking things we have because, as it turns out! WE WERE EXPLORING IDENTITIES A LOT OF PEOPLE ACTUALLY HAD!!!

Miscommunication and malice are the only reasons why the mogai and radqueer community are divided

Antis took everything too hard and strict when it came to radqueers fiddling with things that needed fiddling YESTERDAY!

[chongjojunsalsa]

mon chérry

word count: 2694 words

pairing: seokjin/jimin (jinmin), seokjin/everyone (super mild, they’re just thirsty as fuck and exist through the group chat)

summary:

park jimin would no doubt consider himself to be the biggest fan of eatjin, but he doesn't have a fucking clue what to do when the rest of the world starts competing with him for that title.

or, seokjin leaves jimin tongue-tied.

note: best if you read on mobile or read it on ao3 and leave a cheeky kudos!

Park Jimin would no doubt consider himself to be the biggest fan of EatJin, even more so than the thousands of people that come online just to watch him shove spoonfuls of cheap ramyeon and packaged kimchi into his mouth, all the while spouting out the lamest (and in Jimin’s opinion, severely under-appreciated) uncle jokes. He wears this title proudly.

Park Jimin is also the regular guest.

And Park Jimin more often than not finds himself having a hard time doing both at the same time, trying to maintain a cool façade and a safe distance away from Seokjin while admiring his side profile. Most of the time, he manages, settling for a pat on his knee. Sometimes, he gives in to lowly temptation, throwing himself into Seokjin’s chest in a fit of laughter whenever he tells a joke. One time, just one, he kind of maybe overdid it a little, allowing his hand to slide from Seokjin’s chest down to a careful amount of centimetres away from his crotch just because Jeongguk was flush against Seokjin’s chest, giggling away, and he kind of maybe felt a little territorial. (He still doesn’t know if he regrets what he did.)

Mostly, Jimin’s an EatJin enthusiast because Seokjin only ever considers doing fanservice with a camera in the vicinity. Whether it’s unintentional or on purpose, Jimin takes it all.

Except that he doesn’t, because he doesn’t own the untouchable title that is the maknae.

Not that he ever acts like one, Jimin would think bitterly when Seokjin and Jeongguk play around, Jeongguk overpowering Seokjin in terms of sheer strength by wrestling him to the ground, their laughter mixing together like chimes in the wind. And yes, Jimin wants to be Seokjin’s favourite dongsaeng, that’s why he’s always his special guest on EatJin, seizing every opportunity he can get to get closer to his hyung, especially when Jeongguk steals all of Seokjin’s attention at any other given time. The same Jeongguk who tells him that trying to gain Seokjin’s favour by appearing on EatJin all the time is cheating. Taehyung absolutely agrees, Jimin absolutely doesn’t.

Fanservice, Jimin learnt, isn’t all about sliding your hand over your hyung’s crotch, it’s grazing your hand over his knuckles for a split second, only to crave contact immediately, it’s the gaze of adoration sent in his direction whenever he does something goofy and everybody else cringes. And while their fans do appreciate it when they act out lines from a makeshift script together, it’s the subtle moments that really sends their minds reeling.

Or that one time they almost kissed on a Gayo. That sent their minds reeling too.

Today, it’s fruits, and when Seokjin says fruits, he means one bowl of cherries and no bananas in sight. Remind Jimin to never get his hopes up with Seokjin.

(“It’s barey a mukbang if all you eat is a bowl of cherries,” Jimin had snorted, earning him a flick in the forehead.

Seokjin puffed his cheeks up in annoyance, crossing his arms over his chest and huffing, “It’s EatJin, not EatJimin, so I get to decide what I eat.

Jimin simply threw his hands up in defeat, an amused smile playing on his lips.)

It’s halfway throughout the liveshow, after six uncle jokes, that Seokjin finally succumbs to the need to satisfy his viewers’ (and Jimin’s, don’t forget Jimin) thirst.

He pops a cherry into his mouth, makes a guttural sound about how sweet this batch is when all of a sudden, his eyes light up like he’s found the cure for cancer and he turns to Jimin. “I almost forgot, I learnt a new special trick.”

“What is it, hyung?” Jimin’s eyes sparkle in anticipation.

Seokjin holds up one finger, giggling under his breath. “You’ll see, give me a moment.”

Jimin’s fingers drum on the glass table impatiently, in patient wait of whatever his hyung had prepared, a mischievous grin because he knows the others would kill to be in his position right now.

Seokjin stares into space for a while, as if focusing on something, and finally, finally turns towards Jimin, a satisfied grin and all, and Jimin prepares himself for something amazing, and underwhelming as it may seem, it’s more intense than anything Jimin could’ve imagined.

But then Seokjin pulls something out of his mouth and sets it in his hand, satisfied grin and all, and Jimin wouldn’t have noticed that that little thing was Seokjin’s party trick if he hadn’t been staring at Seokjin’s cherry-stained lips. Jimin’s smile almost falters.

It’s a cherry knot.

A fucking cherry knot, but that innocent little stalk sitting in the palm of Seokjin’s hand is the least innocent thing in the room right now, not counting Jimin.

“Hyung, do you know what this means?” Jimin asks, lips pressed into a thin line as he lunges for the phone, reading the comments frantically. Oh. The comment section is swarmed with comments, most of them Jimin can read, some of them he can’t, but he can more or less tell that they know exactly what a cherry knot means.

Seokjin senses the panic in Jimin’s voice, and immediately leans in worriedly, pressing the back of his hand “No, Jiminie, is anything wrong?”

Jimin looks up at Seokjin, holding his curious and worried stare for a few good seconds before replying, “It means you’re really good at kissing.”

At this, Seokjin bursts into his squeaky laughter, Pacific Ocean shoulders shaking, hand intuitively reaching over to Jimin’s knee for support, but not before smacking him in the shoulder. “Jimin-ah, you scared me! Of course I’m good at kissing!”

Seokjin blows a flying kiss to the camera.

[ you received a message from eatjin! ]

eatjin yoongi-yah did you watch my vlive~ (◕ᴗ◕✿)

suga&spice no

eatjin ｡ﾟ(ﾟ'Д'ﾟ)ﾟ｡ as expected from my yoongichii

suga&spice just kidding i watched it till the end hyung i even gave you hearts

eatjin ( ˘ ³˘)♡ as expected from my yoongichii~

[ you recieved a message from seaguk @ emergency meeting! ]

seaguk PARK JIMIN THATS CHEATING

chimmers it’s still hyung to you maknae

sunshinehobi it should be illegal to leave hyung with you

taelien I CAN’T BELIEVE YOU WOULD PLAY DIRTy

sunshinehobi how could you make him do that

taelien and oN NATIONAL TV

chimmers fucking drama queens he did it himself just admit yall jealous

seaguk BITCG

chimmers everyone: 0 jimin: 1

suga&spice yoongi: 100000

chimmers bitch pls i did an eatjin with him

suga&spice forwarded a message from eatjin: ( ˘ ³˘)♡.

seaguk YOURE KIDDING mE

taelien WHY DON’T I GET THIS TREATMENT

chimmers I WONT STAND FOR THIS HE GAVE ME A FLyING KISS IRL FIHGT ME

suga&spice FUCKING GLADLY SHRIMP

chimmers LIKE YOURE VERY TALL

sunshinehobi SHUT UP and can i just say yoongi hyung's a lucky bastard only because he's roommates w seokjinnie hyung

suga&spice we’re forever roommates hyung said so so yall dont stand a chance

chimmers wait a goddamn minute im his go-to for eatjin

suga&spice two words roommate privileges

seaguk THATS CHEATING

taelien I DON’T GET WHY JIN HYUNG WON’T INVITE ME ON EATJIn i’m tHE BIGGEST FAN OF EATJIN ANYWAy

sunshinehobi DONT START THIS KIM TAEHYUNG

chimmers SIT THE FUCK DOWN KIM TAEHYUNG

taelien on jin hyung’s lap

seaguk :)

sunshinehobi it was nice meeting u tae

taelien what lol

suga&spice looks like the maknae wants to reclaim his land

suga&spice FJCK HOW THE FYVK DID YUO GET HERE SO FAST

rapmoney wait what’d i miss??? i was sleeping, sorry taehyung’s incessant screaming woke me up it’s as if he’s being bloody murdered

To Jimin’s dismay, knowledge of Bangtan’s eldest member ability to tie a cherry knot spread like wildfire, the flames of the rumour licking at every corner of the internet, sparing nobody from the endless GIFs of Seokjin popping a cherry into his mouth and pulling a perfect little knot out, more often than not accompanied with a flustered Jimin’s reaction and a simple caption: ‘same, Jimin’.

Soon after, cherry knots became a trend, with idols trying and inherently failing to tie a cherry knot and ambitious fans following suit, to no avail unfortunately. And then all of a sudden, Seokjin of BTS was known for his cherry red lips and what had long dissolved into a simple ‘amazing kissing skills’.

Antis undoubtedly called Seokjin out for faking it, calling it a cheap trick, well, not that it mattered when #CherryJin had been trending as number 1 on Twitter the day they did the livestream, and Jimin is almost sure that Twitter had considered making him a little emoticon.

So how the hell did Jimin not see this coming?

“Why don’t you give us a taste of your amazing ability, Cherry Jin?” the show host – Jimin had already forgotten her name – exclaimed with an enigmatic grin, perfectly manicured fingernails tippity-tapping against the plastic cue cards clasped in her hands.

Jimin had been invited onto a mukbang with Seokjin, their ulterior motive of having the ever so famous Cherry Jin in their studio disguised as clasped hands and charming smiles and the fact that their chemistry on other shows surpass many others. Needless to say,  Jimin was more than delighted to guest-star on another show with his hyung, even if he kind of felt like he was cheating on EatJin.

That day, they had guests from different idol groups come to make some sort of dessert with the theme cherry - of course - in mind. Seokjin and Jimin had won, much to their surprise, because Jimin was pretty sure that the group from EXO had done much better, but the producers probably thought it impolite to let the Cherry Jin lose at cherries.

“It’s nothing special!” Seokjin chuckles, ears tinged red with gratification, the shit-eating grin on his face saying otherwise.

“You’ll do it for the biggest fan of EatJin, right?” she giggles, placing a wretched hand on Seokjin’s godly shoulders, and Jimin grunts in displeasure, fighting the urge to stand up and remind them that this is a mukbang, not a talent show.

Seokjin grins smugly, turning his gaze towards the camera. “Anything for ARMY!"

The woman claps her hands like an overeager circus seal (Jimin is unapologetic), her smile plastic.

Somebody off-stage quickly passes Seokjin a bowl of a-little-too-red cherries, and Seokjin offers a polite nod.

Who cares about Seokjin's cherry knots when Jimin's stomach is tying knots here and there all by itself?

Swiftly, Seokjin slips a cherry into his mouth, plump lips wrapping around it before it disappears into his mouth. Jimin notices that the expression on the host's and the other guests' faces looks exactly like Jimin's when he had been watching Seokjin the first time around, and he doesn't exactly like it.

In all his daze, he hadn't noticed Seokjin had finished his pony trick, content smile and all, until he heard the host lady squealing in what appeared to be incredulity, the other guests gasping along. When it finally registers to him that he's being filmed by a camera to be watched by thousands, he plasters on a smile and claps along with the host. All in good fun.

Jimin can't help when his smile falters a little the moment the cameras turn away from him. Making Seokjin perform something like that - a moment that Seokjin had shared with and only with Jimin just a week ago - in front of a bevy of cameras just rubs him the wrong way. Jimin would rather attempt to tie a cherry knot all by himself than allow Seokjin to go on stage and do that in front of the masses.

But, of course Jimin always speaks (thinks) too soon.

"Jimin-ssi, would you like to try doing what Seokjin-ssi has demonstrated for us just now?" the host interrupts his train of thought with her nasally voice and flicks a clump of blonde hair off her shoulder.

Jimin almost visibly frowns, this host was starting to get on his nerves, what makes her think he'll do it?

... is what he thinks until he sees Seokjin's face, lips pursed into an excited little smile, and he gives in even before Seokjin can utter a single plead. God, he's so fucking whipped.

If Seokjin the virgin (a well-known but surprising fact) could do it, how hard could it be?

Turns out, it's really hard. Jimin accidentally swallows the knot along with the cherry, sending him into a coughing and sputtering mess, and his life flashes before his eyes, until he manages to finally choke it out, tattered with teeth marks. The host's and other guests' cheeks are puffed up with laughter they're very politely holding in, and Jimin realises that maybe it's better if he'd just died. Then again, dying from a cherry knot? He'd be ridiculed by all his ghost friends.

The awkward silence in the studio is finally broken when Seokjin speaks up, voice trembling with laughter. "I hope you finally learn how to cherry-sh your life."

Good news: everybody groans and forgets about Jimin.

Bad news: Jimin himself bursts out laughing, drawing all the attention back to him.

Good news: Seokjin's head is buried in Jimin's chest, allowing for an overwhelming warmth to fill his chest.

Bad news: Jimin is just resisting the urge to get Seokjin to show him just how good he is at tying cherry knots, if you know what he means.

The host laughs uncomfortably at this turn of events and tries to steer the conversation back on track. "Looks like Jimin-ssi has to take lessons from Seokjin on how to tie cherry knots."

Bad move, lady. The hidden implication behind what she says races through Jimin's mind and he bites down on his lower lip to clear his mind and get rid of unnecessary thoughts in his head. A glance towards Seokjin sends his mind reeling once again as he tries to process what his hyung may have meant by a wink in his direction.

Or maybe it was the trick of an eye, because Seokjin merely turns to the camera, puckers his lips and blows a kiss.

[ you received a message from taelien @ emergency meeting! ]

taelien AHASKJAHAHAHA WHAT THE UFKC WAS THAT JIMn thE WAY YOU CHOKED WAS BRUTAL

chimmers ohmygod dont bring that up

seaguk i could probably do it they shouldve asked mE to go

chimmers of all the things to bring up why THAT PART

sunshinehobi i want to be mad at you for being on the show with hyung but there is only pity

suga&spice maybe we can get #cherryjimin trending

chimmers blocked and reported for cyberbullying

seaguk #cherryjimin

sunshinehobi #cherryjimin

chimmers really

taelien #cherryjimin

rapmoney you did well on the show jimin!

suga&spice namjoon stop were bullying him

rapmoney oh i see

chimmers NO WAIT MY ONLY ALLY

rapmoney #cherryjimin

chimmers left emergency meeting.

suga&spice added chimmers to emergency meeting.

chimmers sigh #cherryjimin

-

In the end, Jimin realises that what Seokjin had meant by a wink was quite literally a lesson on how to tie cherry knots.

"Why? Were you expecting something?" Seokjin has the audacity to ask, spitting out the fifth cherry knot he's churned in two minutes.

Jimin has to stop himself from saying yes, but seeing the keen little smile on Seokjin's face is fulfilment enough for him. He rests his elbow on the coffee table and his chin in his palm, gaze fixated on Seokjin, eyes roaming from his eyes to his nose to his cherry-stained lips, resting on the last-mentioned a little longer than necessary.

"Is anything the matter?" Seokjin asks, worry lacing his voice, bringing Jimin out of his small daze. Crap, he got caught staring.

But he only smiles. "Love you, hyung."

"Love you too, Jiminie!" Seokjin shoots finger hearts at Jimin, smile so wide it forms crescents in his eyes, which sends a pang through Jimin’s heart, when suddenly his face lights up. "Do you want to be my special guest in the next EatJin?"

It doesn't take an ounce of hesitation for Jimin to fling an arm around Seokjin's shoulder (it's a long reach) and nod very fervently. "Of course, hyung!"

Yes, Park Jimin would no doubt consider himself to be the biggest fan of EatJin.

[dandymeowth]

Various screencaps of REGs telling people they can’t identify as queer and/or that queer is not an identity or isn’t real, all taken from this post. This is provided as part of evidence that, yes, acephobes/discoursers are absolutely saying we can’t be or use queer. Also, hey, check out how many of them are transmisogynistis, radfems, biphobes, transphobes, etc! and use a lot of anti-progressive/anti-sj language (like “identity politics”). It’s almost as if their rhetoric is related...

I have removed the REG usernames in the following captions to avoid their interacting with this post, and to slightly no-platform them. Anyway, they read:

bigballofwibblywobbly: Well you created an argument about something that wasn’t being talked about. I was talking about individuals who don’t identify as anything but queer.

Not saying we should apply it to the whole group. But you’re a terf so it all makes sense.

[REG/radfem 1]: queer isn’t an orientation??? its a reclaimed slur like god i love being a part of the lesbian gay bisexual transgender reclaimed slur for homosexual community. you’re an ace inclusionist ofc you want to reclaim slurs never used against you and think queer is a separate orientation. the lgbt community will never be the queer community or the ‘everyone that doesn’t completely conform to heterosexuality’ community lol

[REG 2]:  Yeah queer isn’t really a coherent identity in and of itself. I see “sapphic” being used in much the same way now. Like I understand that figuring out who you are is difficult and people may want to use words that are sort of? Vague and noncommittal? But queer quite honestly does not mean anything in the sense that as it’s own identity it says nothing really about who you are attracted to or your gender identity. It’s [post cut off at this point]

[REG 3]: That and its fucking vague as fuck? What does it even mean? So many non-LGBT people claimed that they’re LGBT bc they’re “queer”, when they’re just cishet polyamorous people or cishet kinksters or cishet aces or cishet aros or cis aroaces like…. that slur isn’t for u. And people who are LGBT but identify as q*eer are still LGBT? Why do u need a slur in the acronym if you’re either L G B or T? What’s the point? What does it add?

[REG 3]: Then you’d go under the bi umbrella Identity politics are so ridiculous jfc u don’t experience some new form of oppression and therefore need a community based around it just because you are mga but don’t like the label bisexual for urself.

[REG/radfem 4]:  “Queer” could mean that you are a guy who uses nail polish or that you have a turtle pet.What’s the point of this word?What does it represent?What’s your axis of oppression?What experiences do you share in common?What’s the fucking point of identifying as “queer” other than to pretend that you’re special and oppressed?

feminismandmedia: I love how you say that people who are attracted to multiple genders are pretending to be special and oppressed.

Fuck off you twit.

[REG/radfem 4]: Sexual attraction is about sex not gender.There are only 2 sexes so you’re either heterosexual, homosexual or bisexual.It’s not that deep, trying to give a special name to your sexuality doesn’t make you opressed and it’s actually disrespectful to actually opressed people.

[REG/radfem 5]: You shouldn’t be identifying as q*eer freely without consequence because it’s a slur.

[REG/radfem 4]: Why are you oppressed?What’s the base of your oppression?How is society systematically aimed against you?If you’re actually oppressed why do you use such an ambigous and nebulous terminology with no concrete meaning to describe your community?Since it makes it harder to acknowledge you as an oppressed group? “Fam. I like all genders. I like dick and vagina too. I’m queer too” You’re bi, congrats, you may be affected by homophobia(oppression) if you date a same sex partner.“Oppression” is a strong and assertive word, you can’t just throw it around.

bigballofwibblywobbly: My god I hate TERFs. Fall off a bridge. Thanks.

Seriously? Do we now have a quota of oppression to fill? You want every dirty detail? You disgust me.

Also I’m not bisexual thanks.

[REG/radfem 4]: “Do we now have a quota of oppression to fill” Yes it is called being oppressed.I said that the person who said they liked dicks and vaginas is bisexual, not you. You hate us cause we’re right and you know it, I would hate us if I were you too. Just bc someone called you she instead of zir in the supermarked once doesn’t mean you’re oppressed Bethy, get your shit together.

bigballofwibblywobbly: I love how they erase my queerness to fit their argument.

[REG/radfem 4]: What am I erasing? Lmao, what’s “queerness”?You still haven’t answered what it means, bc it means nothing, it is a word made for straight kids feel special, a homobhobic slur actually.

bigballofwibblywobbly: My pal. I already said. I like all genders.

[REG/radfem 4]: …so you’re bisexual therefore only oppressed if you date a same sex partner like I said.

bigballofwibblywobbly: Wow. That’s some nice biphobia you have too. Bisexual people don’t become straight if they are in a relationship with the other gender.I’m not bisexual anyways.

(Also on that last one, calling being nonbinary a white thing? lol)

bigballofwibblywobbly: Well guess I don’t belong in the community. Congrats your gatekeeping has cut out people who like multiple genders. Top notch. Really.

[REG 6]: Aren’t there other words for liking multiple genders other than a slur?

[REG 7]: Um OP polysexual falls under the acronym without using a slur and is an umbrella term for multi-gender attraction….

Bonus under cut.

The following cap is a separate post made by a REG that is capped for no-platforming purposes and to prevent their interaction. It was shoved into the ace positivity tags because discoursers seriously just straight up hate ace people and don’t want them to exist. 

The post is about how “real” LGBT+ people hate the word queer and don’t identify with it except as a comeback, implying anyone who identifies with or uses it regularly is actually not LGBT+ and instead one of “the mogais”. It compares people reclaiming queer to white people using the n-slur and neurotypicals using the r-slur.

The post uses the phrase “cishets in denial” and I honestly think that truly encapsulates exactly how discoursers are seeing being LGBT+. 

It fits right along with that “if you are attracted to the opposite sex you’re not lgbt” post. 

It fits with the idea that more people are identifying as LGBT+ because it’s “trendy” and are actually fakes and liars, an idea spread and supported by cishets, truscum, anti-sj, radfems, etc. This comes as no surprise as MOGAI was coined by a nonbinary person, and that has been the driving force behind the hatred for it.

It also fits with how “sga” is pulled from conversion therapy because that’s literally how the people behind and supportive of the concept of conversion therapy look at being LGBT+: that it’s a phase, you’re just jumping on the bandwagon, you’re in denial, this isn’t the “real” you, etc. 

The post reads:

[REG 8]: Lol, seriously? There is no better way to show that MOGAI is made up of mostly cishets in denial than how heatedly they fight to use the word “qu**r”. If they paid fucking attention, they’d know that actual members of LGBT don’t really want to be called that, that most LGBT folks only use it to fight the balance of power that qu**r causes and that they aren’t going to cast away the history of the slur just because it’s supposedly a trendy umbrella term.

It’s the same way white people whine about their “right” to use “n*gga” when black people say no, or NT people claim “freedom of speech” when calling anyone and everyone “r*tard*d” despite decent human beings explaining why that’s fucked up.It’s so damn annoying…

danni-rants: And this is in ace positivity why again

queerautism: You heard it here first folks. Everyone who fought to reclaim Queer as an act of rebellion and empowerment… was actually cishet all along. Same for neurodivergent people who can’t be more specific than ‘queer’ about their identity. And everyone who keeps trying to turn it into a positive term and build a community around it. Also my nonbinary pan ace ass apparently lol

Simply Amazing.

[fiftycucks-blog]

Fifty Grand & Distance Decay Discuss Antifa and Freedom of Speech

DISTANCE DECAY ok let's un pack this -

FIFTY GRAND It’s easy. I don’t support what antifa is doing Especially last night Gross and embarrassing Bunch of privileged college students breaking shit Then going back to the privacy of their homes And chillin maybe play some video games Nothing revolutionary Sorry Not fixing anything Not helping anyone Protesting milo yiannapoulous of all people It's a sad time for the left If this was coming from the right you damn well know you’d condemn it DISTANCE DECAY other people have opinions too - u can be anti violence urself but to not understand why people would oppose fascism with violence is what i'm not understanding - i believe u said on ur own facebook something about those complicit in the holocaust FIFTY GRAND But dude Milo isn't a fascist Come on This is bad If you can prove to me That milo is a fascist I’ll fall back Forever

DISTANCE DECAY ummm are you speaking for me now? u don't kno my politics - so let's not assume and ask eachother questions the tweet u quoted wasn't about milo it was about anti fascism FIFTY GRAND Right But who destroyed property and hurt people last night Innocent people Antifa So I'm trying to understand Why you think that's ok We aren't talking about literal Nazis

DISTANCE DECAY 1. i believe there's reports of yianopolos supporters and antifa 2. i'm personally not for violence where in do i say i'm okay with what happened last night again the tweet was about anti fascism FIFTY GRAND I'm talking about Milo tho Not his supporters DISTANCE DECAY and i thought we agreed not to assume? i'm all for talking here, ur feelings are valid i don't want u to feel as if they're not FIFTY GRAND I'm just responding to you DISTANCE DECAY i could just as easily say i'm speaking of anti fascism as an ideology not those who carry it out FIFTY GRAND You and I both know what the original tweet refers to Antifa The org And to go back to your original question I'm not neutral or pro DISTANCE DECAY are you pulling tribalism on me? FIFTY GRAND The fuck lmao ?? DISTANCE DECAY i just woke up - i mean this sincerely the "you and i both" confused me to the tweet earlier - i saw the police language tweet - i don't want u to feel that censoring u, just showing how i feel, but i don't want u to feel unvalidated in ur feelings either FIFTY GRAND No I get that. But like. If I wanna say the word cuck I can I'm not politically correct I don't feel the need to be Besides you keep bringing that up, did you not even see who I was responding to that day? Someone who was attacking my character and music as a comeback Yea I shut them down And I don't care It wasn't discourse DISTANCE DECAY yeah u can,  and i've seen u use it other times also on facebook but still i'm not gonna tell u what u can or can not say just so i can understand this we agree people can say what they want - correct? but i don't think that means freedom of consequences from that speech i.e. someone responding to u - which is very different from censorship FIFTY GRAND Let me ask you something What do you think was accomplished last night DISTANCE DECAY honestly - i just woke up so i don't kno the full extent of what happened, outside of the quick search i made when milo kept being brought up so i think that brings us to our earlier point - antifa destruction of property caused harm to innocent people, milos followers emboldened by his speeches brought harm intentionally to those whose identities they feel have no place FIFTY GRAND Ok I see where we disagree I don't believe that speech is oppressive I used to But I don't anymore He has the right to his speech Which is just about feminism and men's rights , sometimes Islam If you listened to his speeches you'd see it's pretty clear he's just a gay Jew supporting free speech on college campuses DISTANCE DECAY i don't think i said the speech was oppressive however i think that to say it's unequivocally not would be against a very common definition of the word - mental stress or despair - as well as not taking into account the way it can spread and be internalized thru socially learned behaviors - and that humans are creatures of socialization - i think u like psychology so think genie, victor FIFTY GRAND Ok true, I think words can be used as violence, psychologically But I think oppression is more systematic DISTANCE DECAY i think defining our terms is always helpful - i do believe systemic oppression is real and bad - so i think ignoring the psychological aspect would be a disservice to how social organization is formed - given that humans run these systems, learn and reproduce these oppressive values from other humans falls chimed in a lil here -milo and his supporters can arguably represent a cultural shift that has happened in the us in the right-wing (i.e. altright). it's fair to say that this shift is also part of the reason trump was elected, as he was championed by the altright. basically: at what point does this ideology and rhetoric stop being systemic when the elected president is  espousing the same type of rhetoric? isn't that the definition of systemic?

i also believe language plays a huge role in shaping culture tho i am a descriptivist at heart 😋 FIFTY GRAND Not everyone who supports trump is alt-right tho. In fact it's majority rust belt people, poor people who hate the establishment. The alt right is a fringe movement and you're only seeing that because the media is blasting it everywhere And I see you co-signing tweets about me being a victim but you've totally ignored the fact that hella people ARE coming at me And bet you wouldn't even publically denounce me being called a Nazi Ur totally silent there And I find that incredibly problematic If you believe language can shape culture why are you okay with throwing the labels fascist and Nazis round so freely? Because now it just means anyone who disagrees with you Trump was not elected by the alt right Half of America is not the alt right Trust me You're a very smart person, how can you not see the irony in what Antifa is doing? How is it you can bend over backwards to justify it all You know it's only going to get worse People will be harmed Innocent people Every time I tweet on my own platform you see how people react. It is not unfair to assume that I might be subject to violence in the near future But this is the climate you support DISTANCE DECAY 1. i think falls said part of 2. wouldn't that be antithetical to ur argument in free speech ? 3. how far does free speech absolutism go for you? in so far as it hurts your feelings? 4. i think it is a problem when people going throwing these things leading to witch hunts etc, as it is to make generalizations about islam, referring to this as an isolated incident etc. 5. no where do i define it as anyone who disagrees with me - i believe the examples i gave lend itself more to those who are white nationalists 6. half of america may not be alt right but that doesn't change that they champion him nor that bannon is in the white house

i don't believe you are actually a nazi or a fascist, however as much as this might make u go "language police!" i think the language u use is irresponsible - as u have people in ur mentions coming at u i had people in mine from our last convo about islam telling me how muslims do not have a right to exist coming at me - i care about u and i'm sorry i hurt ur feelings - i think maybe there's a lack of linear thinking going on here and i'm having an issue proving my point without indulging in ur methods - which ultimately is antithetical to my own but i'm at a loss for getting it across with my words so i'm trying ur method FIFTY GRAND What language of mine is irresponsible? And what are my methods Lol All I have done is talked Used my words And I'm not understanding the free speech absolutism thing. It's actually your belief that if feelings are hurt we should silence Not mine. It seems very shallow to think that changing language will do anything to rectify deep seated beliefs DISTANCE DECAY ur method of saying and doing whatever u want because "i'm not PC" - whatever that means as i find this is another statement that requires careful unpacking FIFTY GRAND Like, do you think telling people to stop saying faggot on the playground is going to stop homophobia? It will not These are deep rooted issues Speech doesn't even begin to cover And I don't say and do whatever I want to defy all that is PC I simply don't think PC culture is conducive to learning and our democratic way of life DISTANCE DECAY not cover - i don't have all the answers here but again i think language has a huge role in shaping culture - so it is a factor FIFTY GRAND Would you police me for calling myself a tranny? Cuz I do I like that word and I reclaim it DISTANCE DECAY no - again you can say what you want i thought we agreed on this earlier? FIFTY GRAND Did we? Ok DISTANCE DECAY but that doesn't mean that others won't say and do stuff as well maybe not that's why i said thought - are you arguing just to argue at this point? we can stop here maybe have a phone call sometime or go to a library FIFTY GRAND No of course I'm not haha I know it's hard to interpret And yea I'm passionate and a little worked up But I don't feel like I'm tryna argue Just lay down my fundamental beliefs DISTANCE DECAY that's ok - i feel broken honestly FIFTY GRAND Me too, and we both feel very strongly that our way is the right one So there is only so much we can say to one another We will have to agree to disagree and I'm always ok with that I think I should say-- I've been very critical of the left recently which you've noticed, and it's because it's my party and I'm seeing so much division I feel like I'm watching it all fall apart And I want to critique it in hopes that people will hear me out Because I've spent most of my time critiquing the right in the past I feel I need to turn to my own party and say what's going on guys??? Sadly I'm not sure how much I can keep doing it, people want to silence me. And I'm not trying to play victim I'm being as honest as I can be, I really do feel ostracized And sure maybe I am getting in my feels, we all are tho DISTANCE DECAY i think where i myself maybe am confused/take issue is when u publicly tweet these beliefs- there is an objective tone taken, doubled by the calling out others for bias - then you  go back editing/rewording them to something at the end after

example : take the "islam is bad argument" which is how ur words read to me and many others at first- i had a lot of people in ny mentions saying muslims should not exist - after hours u reposted ur thoughts saying using religion to justify horrific acts on people is wrong - which i think better portrays what u we're trying to say and i agree with but was not clearly articulated by the first string of tweets - and after so many with hateful thoughts found their confirmation bias already- and felt empowered and yes i think a lot of this stems from us getting emotional - which is fine we are human which i why i don't understand the triggered thing *in general * not with you and i think it's great to critique the left ! but i think your thoughts don't come clearly out at first - like so personally when u tweeted how is no one critiquing obama on immigration? - my twitter is full of leftist who criticized obama and personally i know of and know those who were deeply affected by ICE etc - again i think it's just the words we use maybe confuse us

FIFTY GRAND Yeah that's totally a fair critique of my tweets, I concede I need to do better DISTANCE DECAY we all do sorry that was so scatter brained the immigration policy under him really hit close to home - and it hit a weird thing bc getting rid of these binary thoughts/looking at life as grey - sad/anxious DT is coming to office but still not wanting to silence those who really suffered as a result under him - i couldn't find the words FIFTY GRAND I tweet my beliefs and I try to engage w those who disagree to a degree but  also I don't wanna reinforce stuff I don't agree with, so I shouldn't act like I'm so diplomatic lol cuz I'm not DISTANCE DECAY yes i feel u - and finding the perfect words in 140 characters or less is very difficult - but given the current climate is so important FIFTY GRAND Right. But at the same time Usually something will upset me so I tweet about it, ppl inevitably disagree and then it helps me, by the end of the "rant" usually my stance changes a little or at least opens itself to others But I start out hella strong And that's probably not the best way Something that upsets me tho is that the narrative seems to be that bc I don't support the violence, that I'm automatically the opposition And thats a rough one to me DISTANCE DECAY i don't have the answers :/ personally vulnerability has been the strongest key for me learning FIFTY GRAND It does make me angry but I think before that it makes me a bit sad and fearful. Anger is just my cover up DISTANCE DECAY i think it reads that way bc you haven't spoken on other issues in a long time - which can lead to confusion or assumption - and granted left is your party this is twitter and people don't kno that

simple explicit statements grounded in reflectivity and reflexivity - subjectivity of language taken in account - is very hard for me :/ FIFTY GRAND Very true This might sound weird but is there any way I can like, transcribe this convo and maybe share it? Cool if not , it definitely sounds odd to ask DISTANCE DECAY and yeah that's fine thank you for asking FIFTY GRAND I won't alter it in any way unless there's something you'd want me to omit. DISTANCE DECAY umm i think it's good to go idk throw me 2 the lions *joke* ^^ FIFTY GRAND 😂

[noellevanious]

response below the cut. tl;dr: turning anons off. if somebody's shitty please provide more than just "hey this person might be shitty".

so i'm watching her video on proshippers vs antis. really good video. she defines what both terms "are" (in reality they're so vague that they could mean many things), then talks about weird adult "proshippers" that lied about totally Owning a 15 year old in Twitter DMs, and when she said that that's weird on her twitter, was immediately drowned in people comparing her saying that, to saying it's ok for children to die, amid dozens of other whataboutisms, ( one person that threw shit at her re-appropriated the "pink triangle", a symbol reclaimed by gay people in the 80s after it was used to denote homosexuals in Nazy Germany, onto a pin dedicated to Owning the "Antis". ) People even talked about how they knew where she lived and planned to "cancel"/"deplatform" her.

Just because she thought it was weird that adults that ship real life people wanted validation for "dunking" 14 year olds in twitter DMs.

She then launches into an interesting and oddly fitting discussion about how common this "dehumanization" is. It's a lot easier to box people into one or two categories based on emotional moves, even if doing that overly simplifies situations like this into "u good or u bad?".

and i quote:

"we treat the individuals we argue with, not as complex and unique in their views, but as proxies for sets of beliefs we ascribe to them - usually based one or two things we know about them. we just interact with too many people every day now to parse their beliefs as unique wholes, and websites like twitter are perfectly designed to engender this kind of arguing and harassment. this is a phenomenon that journalist Zeeshan Aleem described as 'disinterpretation' in a really excellent thread" - linked here.

It's fucking stupid. You need to think critically. You need to process things properly.

I've had this happen before, rumors and misinformation (or even disinformation! we can't really know because you weirdos love to obscure whether you're knowingly lying) being spread to try and turn people against eachother. i literally had to learn about a whole new internet drama involving one person who might just be a shitty trans girl because somebody that reblogged one of posts had an icon of one of their characters.

so if there are ACTUALLY SHITTY aspects about her, or any other person whose videos i watch, please let me know, and I'll happily not "Support" her (as in spend 3 hours of my life watching videos she made). I'll even condemn her. I'm sure that's what you genuinely want if you airdrop shit like this.

But i'm 25 years old, i'm a college graduate, i've spent a LOT of time educating myself and trying to help and educate others, I see and know a LOT of people suffering for real reasons, at the hands of real shitty people. i'm not really interested in perpetuating lies about somebody that very clearly stem from them literally just saying "i don't like this".

Sarah Z is known to bully people off her discord servers and her best friend is an abuser

receipts and/or come off anon pls. if this is true it warrants more than just dropping it in my askbox without explanation