#Rose of redwall

[rose-of-redwall]

I crocheted a portrait of Martin the Warrior!

A part of the Redwall tapestry based on its depiction in the Nelvana show! It's based on my own pattern of that image. If anyone remembers the necklace I cross-stitched, it's an adaptation of that same home-made pattern.

Do you think anyone would be interested in purchasing one of these tapestries?

[oldfashionedbooklove]

I honestly don’t think there’s a single character death in all the thousands of books I’ve read that affects me as much as Rose. I want to cry every time. It just shreds me 💔 poor Martin. Every time I hear this song, every time I think of her death or read about it, it breaks me all over again and I feel as sad as if she was someone real…

You will find me at Noonvale on the side of a hill When the summer is peaceful and high, There where streamlets meander the valley is still, ‘Neath the blue of a calm cloudless sky …

Look for me at the dawning when the earth is asleep. Till each dewdrop is kissing by the day, ‘Neath the rowan and alder a vigil I’ll keep, Every moment that you are away …

The old earth gently turns as the seasons change slowly. All the flowers and leaves born to wane. Hear my song o’er the lea, like the wind soft and lowly. Oh, please come back to Noonvale again.

—Martin the Warrior

[rose-of-redwall]

Me ☺️

Louis Sargent, Wild Beasts of the World, 1909

[eleanorose123]

who says i am dead, knows not at all i am that is two mice within redwall

(redbubble - matthias - martin - warrior) (ko-fi)

[spanakorizzo]

Redwall doodles

Martin is learning how to rizz

[stearleart]

Brome's pirate disguise

Digital illustration Brome in his his pirate persona, Bucktail! This is an interoperation of a scene from Brian Jacque's classic, Martin the Warrior. I've adopted a spanking new style when it comes to the shading.

[rose-of-redwall]

Hi!! Congratulations on finishing!!

What you say about colonization is a very very interesting perspective that I'm excited to think more about as I read. Some of the books definitely emphasize the fact that the vermin are not on their own land, and they're unfamiliar with the nature around them, and I know in two books at least the goodbeasts "won" because of their knowledge of the land. Amazing analysis.

I love the idea that Maudie serves as abbess, absolutely adopting this!

I'm glad that you spoke about the time that passes between these books and things which are lost and rediscovered; the incredible time scale in Redwall is one of my favorite things about the books!

And, I had never phrased it as you did, but you're very right that Loamhedge is a mournful book. In that, I think it's a really valuable addition to the books as they shape Redwall culture. Good thinking, friend.

I have to admit, I haven't agreed with everything you've said as you've read through these books. I was sad to see some of my favorites disliked. I suppose we have different tastes, which is good, isn't? As much as we disagree, we also agree on other things. Friend, been a delight reading your thoughts, learning and discussing, and being allowed to participate! Thank you! I'm sure I have more thoughts for some future post, but that's all for now.

Thoughts on the Redwall Series overall 

What started as a walk down memory lane ended up being a multi month reading project. With notes!

A lot of how these books are stereotyped is not true. Only a handful of them end in Babies Ever After. There may be a riddle or a poem but it's not taking up most of the story.

The lack of immediate continuity after book 6 is a little sad but it gives a real sense of time to things, which I like. The Lord of Mossflower exists in Mattimeo, but hundreds of years later in Loamhedge, it doesn't. Brockhall is rediscovered twice! That’s kind of what I liked about Mistmantle, it was only 5 books but there were enough characters that yes, some became parents, but the young ones didn’t. It’s only at the end of the series where some even get married, and it’s not EVERY animal.

Until I reread these, I didn't look at these from the point of anti-colonialization. But, yeah it's THE recurring theme.   

colonizers (vermin) are harassing the people who already live there. Who are native to the land. They're trying to enslave or kill them.  

They're trying to take over either redwall, or mossflower, or basically any place mentioned. 

There is a minor fighting force but the majority just want to chill. A few outliers exist because they've lost families or communities. And they get stopped. This book series is essentially a minimally colonized world.

 Green Isle is a colonized area where the indigenous population fights back and eventually succeeds. Mossflower is eventually freed from the Greeneyes. 

Rhulain and Taggerung come at this from different angles, and while both are hampered by the series structure a bit, enough good shines through. (I lurked the r/Redwall subreddit and a lot of people seem to dislike Taggerung, maybe they were thinking about it from my angle initially - see my thoughts on Taggerung post in my Redwall tag for how my mind was changed).

There's also the heavy religion (Western Christianity) parallels which is why so many conservative kids and young adults attached themselves to this series. And yet they miss major parts of the entire concept. Ah well. 

 I did find it tiresome that as soon as a maid is mentioned to be pretty she's going to be the wife of the male protagonist. They all prove capable and varied but the immediate reaction of pretty is tiring. Note how Mariel is never referred to as pretty by Dandin, and they don't get married but remain partners presumably through their lives. Doomwyte is terrible about this. Come to think of it, Rogue Crew is like a homage but is done much better than Doomwyte, and it works on expanding the world in ways  we never get to see officially :( Maybe we should work on it ourselves. We could do that.

While the squirrels have no subculture, the shrews only have a subculture (arguably two worth pygmy shrews) There's not lone shrews simply existing outside of Redwall or the Guosim. 

Any headcanons about things in story?

I choose to believe Martha spent a time as Abbess after Fenna died. She would be the only noted hare ruler of Redwall. 

There was a squirrel society in Mossflower but it eventually migrated to the area where Sunflash and Skarlath stayed the winter with the mole and hedgehog families.

What books were your favorite?

I've ranked them in groups of 5 of published order (or in the case of the last 2, just 2.) 

*Lord Brocktree was my favorite as a child and frankly it’s still enjoyable. I won't include it in any ranking to keep it fair. 

The Pleasant Surprises

Loamhedge (probably bc I listened to the audiobook. I liked how there was quite a mournful tone throughout, from going to a place full of life to a dead Abbey.)

Eulalia!

The Long Patrol

Martin The Warrior (while it felt a bit long, it was so nice to see a different side of the continent. It wasn't just Mossflower.)

Taggerung.

The Rogue Crew

Side note; I’d love to see someone superimpose the map of some of the books on others. Like where did Martin wander in his book with Grumm, the hedgehog, and Rose compared to the Patrol in The Rogue Crew? He was born on the northern shores - are they the same shores as the Crew? 

The Disappointments

High Rhulain - It’s just not interesting outside of what Green Isle existing implies.

Mariel of Redwall - I think he got better at writing female characters, and it’s not as if Mariel is awful - she’s fairly well rounded, being headstrong and angry as well as needing support - her personality is just kind of There.

Half of the Bellmaker. The part with Southward is dull as dishwater the part with the seafaring is almost enjoyable. The Redwall part is, oddly, the best part.

The one with more than meets the eye lorewise 

High Rhulain 

The one with the best songs 

Loamhedge (the spring song)

High Rhulain (the honeybee song and the calling of the clans)

Marlfox (Mother Nature Dear)

The Long Patrol (over the hills)

Lord Brocktree (a hare is a marvelous creature)

The Rogue Crew (The song Lancejack Sage sings at the funeral)

The best

Mice: Rose, Lycian, Nimbalo

Hare: Maudie, Dottie, Boorab, Martha, Rockjaw

Squirrels: Fwirl, Song, Doogy 

Shrews: Basically all of ‘em, if I had to name one, Flib, if I had to name two, Dandy

Moles: again, most of ‘em. Though it’s funny how they’re championed as beings with good sense, but apparently not good enough sense to ever be elected as Abbott or Abbess.

Hedgehogs: The family of theatrical troupe hedgehogs in Sable Quean, Tansy, Posy

Otter: Mhera, Kroova, Skor, Ruggan, and Swiffo

Birds: Orocca and Tauroc, any bird from the North, Rocangus and MacTalon

Moles: any of the mole Dibbuns. 

Badgers: Sunflash, Cregga, Brocktree 

Major antagonists: the fractured groups of the Juskarath, Tsarmina, Ungatt Trunn, Slagar, Raga Bol, Razzid Wearat.

There was probably going to be more but I got a concussion and forgot

[rose-of-redwall]

I had the luckiest opportunity to observe a little mousey guest at work 🩷

Happy little friend 🩷

They were very brave! They poked their nose out once before I could get my camera out, and I just happened to be looking in their direction to see their little face. They ran out further and further until they crossed the whole sidewalk and didn't turn back ☺️ smart creature~

[incorrectredwallquotes]

Martin: *stubs his toe* Fuck! Rose: Language! Martin: What am I supposed to say, “woe is I”? Rose: Martin: You have to accept that swearing is necessary sometimes.

[stainlesssteellocust]

I remembered Cregga was crazy but wow this girl is crazy crazy

[eleanorose123]

a little Redwall Reanimated for funsies lol

[spanakorizzo]

I literally would have KILLED for just one mention in Mossflower or Legend of Luke that Martin wore a rose on his attire somewhere, like WOULDN'T THAT BE SO SAD.

[afriendofmara]

Was discussing anthropomorphic animals with a friend and I mentioned I would fuck Martin the Warrior so fast bc he's like if a butch lesbian were a mouse. And my friends giggled and went "oh ok, sure. Lol" I said nono, let me show you. Pulled up the character reference for the show. They all said "wow ok you are right thats a butch lesbian mouse. Alright pop off." YEAH THATS WHY I SAID IT.

Anyway. Guys I'd give anything to mouse lesbian date Martin the warrior. She's so beautiful and cool and smart and queer

[rose-of-redwall]

Incredibly written, both of you, friends. I love all of Martin's story; his patronage toward all abbeydwellers and even goodbeasts beyond Mosslfower, and especially the tragedy and unfinishedness of his earlier life. I don't know why, but I find safety in the things that Martin lost and the way that is accepted and respected in the story. I think Jacques writes very good characters.

Also, I find it symbolically interesting that Gonff went on to father many children, while his best friend's life ended with no offspring but generations of Redwallers to call family. Their paths are both opposites and parallel. And Jacques always said that Gonff was inspired by himself.

I remember the thing that most struck me in Redwall as a kid was that I expected Martin to have a wife and kids. He’s the spiritual father of the abbey with Germaine as its mother, he’s a mentor/father figure to the various orphan protagonists even if he is a ghost. The ultimate unattainable dad.

But, hopping back to Mossflower, he’s a virginal hero-knight, kindly but aloof compared to the more involved Gonff. Back further to Martin the Warrior, his relationship with Rose is beyond kids’-book chaste. I can’t even remember if it’s canonically a romance or just by implication.

Some of that may be the Christian influence, Martin as Galahad or a Christ-figure, unsullied by earthly desires. Kid me remembered it more as an abortion or stunting of his role in the story. He’s the hero. He’s supposed to win the day, get the girl, settle down, have a brood. Instead, Jacques takes care to show him as a person missing something. He’s incomplete.

From the earliest point in his chronology, he’s lost away from home. We never see him in his natural habitat. He loses the girl who was supposed to be his great love. He can’t even have Timballisto, who seems like one bright spot and then gets gently referred to in the past tense in Legend of Luke. Martin’s defining characteristic is that he’s an outsider, he’s too late, he’s stopped short, he’s unable to achieve his destiny as the hero, he has to instead become the mentor

[stearleart]

Heh, Butt mole!

[rose-of-redwall]

I caught that fish!! And rescued the baby badger doll!! I've been trying to catch that dang fish for basically years, I came back to it today ☺️

Should I post the formula?