#He is putting together an instagram reel of a documentary so he can talk about it with his crush Insane

[chucktaylorupset]

This meta is amazing and on a completely tangential note: kabrus main interest is in understanding people; the fact that he took this complex drama of human desire, theoretically all of the things that he is interested in, and focused on simplifying it says INSANE things about how much he is obsessed with Laios. I need a long rest.

"mithrun is the only real monsterfucker in dungeon meshi" is objectively the funniest bit you can get out of his everything, but in all seriousness i think his attraction to his love interest is deliberately overstated—and that makes sense, because romantic jealousy is a classic and digestible motive, which is explicitly what kabru was aiming for in condensing mithrun's backstory, and also because until chapter 94, mithrun wasn't willing to admit to the true nature of his desires.

but because romantic envy is both classic and digestible, it probably isn’t a unique enough or complicated enough desire to tempt a demon’s appetite. mithrun’s wish, as far as we can figure from kabru’s reduced retelling, was to have a life in which he had never become one of the canaries, and that carries like 3857 implications and desires within it. that’s delicious. his love interest acts as sort of a red herring to his motivation for making it, though. (side note: i'm saying "love interest" here because, keeping in mind that i barely speak japanese on a good day anymore, "想い人" is something i'd usually take as just kind of an old-fashioned and romantic way to refer to a lover, but in context i wonder if both the connotation of yearning and the vagueness are intentional, and i think this phrasing gets those aspects of it more effectively. anyway.)

mithrun considered his love interest to be untrustworthy. there was a minute where i thought that comment might be about a similar-looking elf (yugin, one of his squad members), but comparing the two…

the "sketchy" arrow is definitely referring to the elf we know as his love interest—the bangs go toward her right, she only has the one forehead ornament, and, most notably, her ears aren't notched.

every time she’s given a full-body depiction in his dungeon, she’s drawn as a chimera, with the body of a snake from the waist down. (side note: the “what if a dungeon has chimeras before reaching level 4?”/“then the dungeon lord is unstable” exchange just being mithrun grilling his past self alive is so funny. he’s so. but anyway) there are a couple things about this.

first, the snake part of the chimera appears to be modeled after some species of coral snake mimic

which, in the biology-for-fun manga, i… doubt is a coincidence, especially with the added context of the “untrustworthy” comment. the dungeon’s conjured illusion of mithrun’s love interest was a harmless copycat of a venomous original. for whatever reason, he felt this person was a threat and made up a "safe" version of her to be in a relationship with, and while it’s definitely possible to be attracted to or even love someone you find to be toxic and/or intimidating, when you take that into consideration alongside the configuration of her body, you get some interesting implications.

which brings us to our second point: if we assume that mithrun was not in fact fucking a snake, then sexual attraction, at least, was so far removed from his idea of a relationship with this person that he did not even bother to keep her dungeon copy human enough to maintain the illusion of the option of a sexual relationship. this is somewhat echoed in the depictions of their interactions, which also imply a frankly unexpected romantic distance. she kisses his cheek and he doesn't seem to react; she's at the edge of a narrow bed with only one set of pillows, on top of his blankets while he's underneath them.

the kiss is particularly interesting because it seems to contrast the text. kabru's narration tells us this was everything mithrun could have asked for, but mithrun is there looking unreadable to pensive, likely because this is right before the panel that makes it clear things in the dungeon are beginning to go wrong.

walking through this backwards for a minute, we have the physical barrier of his bedding and the spatial separation inherent in a bed made for one person, the emotional barrier of his mounting anxiety getting in the way of his ability to enjoy the affection he sought, and... the snake, which historically carries the connotation of temptation, yes, but also mistrust, barring physical intimacy. okay. ok. if a dungeon reflects the mentality of its lord, all of this might suggest that mithrun was not able to have any real desire for a relationship with this person. his unwillingness to be vulnerable or let another person in was insurmountable. but in that case, why was she such a focal point that she remained to the end, after his dungeon had stopped creating iterations of his friends to come and visit him? why would he get so upset over her meeting with his brother that he became lord of a dungeon about it?

well. mithrun's brother was also interested in her, probably genuinely. and mithrun had to win.

you have an older brother who your parents completely ignore, probably in part because he is chronically ill/disabled and almost definitely in part because he received a ton of recessive traits that resulted in rumors that he was an illegitimate child. you are aware, most likely because those same parents fucking told you, that you actually are an illegitimate child. but they keep you around because you had the good fortune of looking just like your mother. what can that possibly teach you but that you, like your brother, are disposable?

it's utterly unsurprising that mithrun, under these circumstances, developed a pathological need to be better than everyone around him. people don't keep you otherwise. i'd argue this is also why he says he looked down on everyone he knew while milsiril claims his dungeon reeked of feelings of inferiority—he sought out people's worst traits and prioritized them in his mind to protect his already extremely fragile sense of self-worth, and all the while he tried to be as likable and high-performing as he possibly could be. his parents disposed of him anyway, but even then he tried to keep up the performance. he was kind to everyone. he never once lost to a dungeon.

when he saw his "love interest" meeting up with his brother, what he saw was himself being replaced by a person his parents had always treated as worthless, and if that was what they thought of the child they'd kept, what value could anyone possibly see in the bastard they'd given away to die? mithrun and kabru tell the story like he wanted to win this unnamed elf's heart, but it was never about being with her. it was about cementing his worth, proving that he didn't deserve to be thrown away.

and so it's particularly cruel that his demon discarded him, too. but maybe it's also particularly gentle that, in the end, there was someone who refused to even consider giving up on him.

kui laid it out in three panels better than i could hope to.

yeah. it's love. you wanted to be loved, even when the only way you were able to understand it was through the desire to be wanted, and you wanted that so badly that the idea of being consumed felt like the promise of finally mattering to someone.

[disasterbuck]

Buck, you have food on your face

706 words inspired by this instagram video: https://www.instagram.com/reel/C72LNWTNb82/

read Eddie’s version here

Wiping his hands on his napkin, Eddie turned to look at Buck and see how close he was to finishing his burrito. The two of them were sitting on Eddie's couch, a documentary on bees playing on the TV while they ate.

Buck had already finished eating and was now simply absorbed in the film, eyes glued to the screen. He had a smudge of sauce on his cheek which he seemed unaware of, and Eddie smiled fondly before tapping his shoulder to get his attention.

It took a moment for Buck to tear his eyes away from the screen, engrossed as he was. When Eddie finally had his attention, he pointed at Buck's cheek and then tapped his own to indicate where the sauce was.

Without pausing, Buck leaned over with a smile to kiss Eddie's cheek.

Eddie froze.

"That's… not… You have sauce on your face!" Eddie stammered.

"What?" Buck frowned and put a hand to his cheek, finding the sauce. Looking extremely embarrassed as he reached for his napkin, he muttered, "Oh."

Heart racing, Eddie was silent as Buck cleaned his face. The documentary kept droning on in front of them, talking about how bees would use different dances to communicate information to the rest of the hive, and Eddie tried resolutely not to think about how natural it had felt to have Buck kiss his cheek.

"Are you okay?" Buck asked after a moment, and Eddie was surprised to see him staring not at the TV but at him.

"I'm fine," he said weakly.

"Are you sure?" Buck pressed. "Cause you look like you've seen a ghost."

"I just wasn't expecting you to kiss me," Eddie admitted, then instantly regretted his words as his mind provided him with an image of a very different kiss to the one that had just happened.

"Sorry," Buck said, his face flushing a beautiful pink. "I don't know why I thought that's what you wanted me to do."

"It's okay," Eddie said quickly, not wanting Buck to get down in his feelings. "I liked it."

"You did?" Buck looked over at him hopefully, eyes so wide and blue that Eddie didn't have a chance to chastise himself for letting the words slip out. Buck was so beautiful and so eager. How could Eddie do anything but tell the truth?

"Yeah," he said quietly. "I did."

A shy smile slowly curled Buck's lips and Eddie swallowed nervously when he realised they were getting closer to each other. He wasn't sure which of them had moved, or whether it was both of them, but soon Buck's nose bumped against his and Eddie parted his lips in an uncontrollable gasp.

"Can I kiss you?" Buck whispered.

"You're missing the documentary," Eddie murmured, inwardly cursing himself for saying something so inane.

Smirking, Buck shifted to graze his lips across Eddie's cheek again. "Yes or no," he breathed, the words hot against Eddie's skin.

Eddie meant to answer, to say yes. But when he tried to he found that his lips were otherwise occupied. Without consciously deciding to, he'd taken Buck's face in his hands and pressed their lips together eagerly and now he couldn't make himself stop.

Thankfully, Buck wasn't objecting.

Surprising himself with his boldness, Eddie found himself climbing onto Buck's lap and deepening the kiss, swallowing every groan and gasp that came from Buck's mouth. The kiss turned slightly feverish, lips sucking and tongues searching and hands gripping, clutching, touching. Buck tasted like the burrito he'd just eaten; it was delicious.

Suddenly, the room was plunged into darkness as a power cut killed the lights and the television. Eddie sat back on Buck's thighs, staring at the outline of his face in the darkness.

"Was that us?" Buck asked with a delighted chuckle.

"Sure," Eddie said sarcastically. "Our kiss was so powerful it killed the lights."

Buck's hands slid to Eddie's ass and gave a gentle, teasing squeeze.

"That was like getting struck by lightning," Buck whispered reverently. "But better."

Eddie wanted to tell him off for referencing the lightning strike, but there was a lump in his throat. So instead of speaking, he leaned in for another kiss.

As their lips met, the power came back on.

-

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[dippedanddripped]

A mark that you’re in the midst of a particularly historical moment is that the present feels timeless. This is perhaps why a walk through LA’s current rap renaissance seems less like a chronological timeline than a bricolage of highlights. Leading the reel are singular talents like 03 Greedo, Shoreline Mafia, Drakeo The Ruler, Ron-Ron, and Rucci, each of whom have carved avenues out of the city’s underground and received critical acclaim, notable profiles, documentaries, and, in the case of Shoreline, million-dollar recording deals with Atlantic.

So, sure, the city’s resurgence didn’t exactly begin in August at a crowded show at The Echo—an intimate venue on the edge of Sunset Blvd.—but that’s where A&R and producer Jeremiah “Picaso” Aubert likes to pinpoint it.

For the last three years, Picaso, 32, and TK Kimbro (“40 something”) have been pulling the strings on the backdrop of the LA rap scene as R. Baron. The name, short for Robber Baron (a testament to the “self made industrialists during the late 19th early 20th century,” Kimbro tells me via text), represents the duo’s wholly independent outfit specializing in management, marketing, creative direction, A&R, and production. Its roster features nearly every artist mentioned above (They assist Inglewood rapper Rucci and his co-manager Tuck, but he’s under Mackk and Co.) as well as the Stinc Team, the Hit Mob, Drummer Gang, DJ A-Tron, emerging DJ Cypress Moreno, and Atlanta’s ManMan Savage.

That show in August, part of Passion of the Weiss’ August residency and co-hosted by Rosecrans Avenue, was a showcase for LA’s new wave. It featured some of the city’s most talented—Cypress, Ralfy the Plug, Ketchy the Great, Desto Dubb, Gusto Leimert—as they performed before a crowd including a number of A&Rs and notable critics.

The moment was seminal, an inspiring display of the collectivism upholding LA rap’s next generation. Though seven months later, it feels like a snippet of what R. Baron has gone on to accomplish. Since, Kimbro and Picaso have aggressively negotiated deals and collaborated with industry professionals and label executives to cultivate the most singular and aspirational group of artists and producers offered by any region in rap.

“I want to be remembered as the incubator,” Kimbro told Modern Life in January. “The talent finder and the one who brought the most quality artists to the rap game and made the most money off of it.”

A conversation with anybody tapped into the scene would suggest he’s long fulfilled that. Shoreline’s million-dollar deal? That’s TK. Greedo, Drakeo, and Shoreline all with high billing at Rolling Loud? TK. Numerous Noisey premieres and Fader profiles? TK. Meanwhile, Picaso, who most recently headed creative direction and A&R for Greedo’s commercial debut The Wolf of Grape Street, has been a pivotal bridge for maintaining their smooth relationship with each artist.

For the duo’s first public interview under the R. Baron company name, I met Kimbro and Picaso at a restaurant in Playa Del Rey, an affluent neighborhood situated just along the Pacific coast. Our early discussion centers around Rolex bezels and jewelry, which, as the only Black men inside a predominantly white space, it becomes difficult not to take the dynamic as a metaphor for not just Kimbro and Picaso’s own success, but their greater intent to translate the culture of rap music to corporate America.

It also reminds of one more thing most people notice about Kimbro: he likes to talk. A lot. But, as we dive into their background, the state of hip-hop culture, and industry specifics, it becomes clear right away that he’s offering a whole lot of game.

Myles Andrews-Duve: So how long has R. Baron been in the works?

Kimbro: We realistically worked on this for three years. When we first came together, it was Young Nigga Records. It was me and Picaso always doing the business and having the vision, but we not the young niggas. So, we brought in DJ A-Tron and we brought in Cypress Moreno. This is from the beginning, bro.

Andrews-Duve: Only three years go?

Kimbro: Three. We tried distributors, they didn't respect what we was talking about, in the sense that we always had artists around us that had numbers. It was the best west coast numbers but the analytics are based on shit in the East, based on shit down South. We didn't have them numbers, let's keep it real, so nobody was looking at us. That all changed with FrostyDaSnowmann. Am I lying?

Picaso: Nope.

Kimbro: Frosty was the first young nigga in LA to have over 2 million plays ("Milwaukee Bucks"). I would say that song is probably somewhere over 5 million right now, and it was produced by Ron-Ron. So, after that last attempt three years ago to do an independent thing, we both fell back and said, let's do what we do best. We both grinding. P's grinding, I'm doing 20/20—grinding. We looking at the music as an extension of our grind. We're not solely committed to anything, we don't manage any artists anymore, we're just fans of music. And, I guess from being fans, me and (Picaso) would just talk about music. From talking about music, I just started to tell P...you ever seen Superfly?

Andrews-Duve: Of course.

Kimbro: I was on my Superfly shit. It was like, every time P would call me and talk about music, I'd be like, 'Shut up, man' and he'd be like, 'You shut up nigga.' I'd be like, ‘I don't wanna hear that shit, how are we gonna make some money off of it?’ And eventually P and J-Hyphen, shout out J-Hyphen, they made the first version of Young Niggaz Rule the World. Toby (Maxo Kream's manager) hosted it, we had exclusives from Maxo, who else?

Picaso: Yeah there was a Maxo song on my tape that never came out. It's amazing, it's like a go-go record. Check [Young Niggaz Rule The World] Volume 2. Volume 1 was straight fan shit, so we had Timmy—shout out Timmy, who models for Babylon, Gucci, and Nike—he hosted my first one. The second one was hosted by Maxo's manager, Uncle Toby, and his brother, KC. They did African scammer skits on the tape [laughs]. And that one was hosted by him, but, through TK, Vice put up a piece of it.

Then for Volume 3 is when I reached out to Drakeo through social media. He was in jail. There's a picture of Drakeo getting arrested where he's talking shit to the bailiff, I used that as the cover. I reached out to Drakeo and Drakeo gave me four freestyles over the phone,  hosted the tape from jail, and he gave me an exclusive record with Desto Dubb.

Andrews-Duve: How did you get Greedo on the tape?

Picaso: So around that same time, while I was doing that, I seen 03 Greedo's video through @CuhCuhCuh's Twitter. He tweeted Greedo's video when it was at 30,000 hits...I seen the video, seen he was from Watts, reached out to Bad Luccand Bad Lucc told me, 'This is the shit, this is Watts, and I'm letting you know this is the most authentic shit we got going.' So I met with Greedo, he was putting up records by people on his Instagram. One song was called "Never Bend." Everybody in the projects was singing it, but the music wasn't out yet, so that's how I got "Never Bend," basically. The first time "Never Bend" was ever played was on that tape with Drakeo, and it was played three months before it even came out.

Andrews-Duve: Wow so you didn't even know Greedo until 2017.

Picaso: No. I didn't know Greedo and I didn't know Drakeo.

Andrews-Duve: So this has really all come together in about a year?

Kimbro: Not even. Less than a year. Shoreline is August to now, Ron-Ron is June, and Drakeo is really December.

Picaso: Once we [Drakeo and I] met, and I'm like, ‘I'm the nigga who did the tape,’ he started trippin', he was laughing.

Kimbro: For me, I got on deck with Drakeo like a week before he went to jail. Because Drakeo has a personality that can be seen as disruptive. It's very empowering. It took me a while. We had a way that we wanted to deal with Drakeo that we didn't deal with other artists, 'cause we knew that Drakeo wasn't gonna go for certain shit or do certain shit.

Andrews-Duve: What was that way?

Kimbro: I'm very bullish. That's why we have the bull in the R. Baron logo. It's the bullish mark. You ever seen the Wall Street bull?

Andrews-Duve: Yep.

Kimbro: It's the Wall Street bull, it's the charging bull, it's all that. So, I'm kinda like that. That can be very offensive to certain people. Drakeo—and Greedo—is definitely not somebody who want somebody bullish and somebody talking to them a certain way. And Picaso, who he is as a person, he's mellow. We're like a yin and yang. So P is mellow and he's more of an artist advocate.

Andrews-Duve: Making you more of a…

Kimbro: I'm not necessarily an artist advocate. I used to be an artist advocate, so much so that dealing with artists really fucked me up a little bit to where I don't want to go through certain things with artists again. So I've switched to becoming more of a producer advocate. I'm Ron-Ron's advocate. So, P with Greedo, Drakeo, Stinc Team, all of them, he's like an extension of them dudes. And when we have disagreements or whatever we have, it's usually ‘cause I'm thinking in a sense of the business structure and P is thinking about the artists. So we compliment each other extremely good, it's a great balance.

Andrews-Duve: It's unique to hear you say you're not an artist advocate. But I remember you telling me a while back about producers essentially being where the money is.

Kimbro: That's it. I just had this discussion before I got over here. You can literally break Pharrell's career down. Pharrell at 25 with Noreaga, Pharrell at 30 with N.E.R.D. You can break it down. Then, you can say Pharrell at 35 when...he was Skateboard P, then you can look at Pharrell at 40 when he did "Happy." Those are vastly different periods. The rappers that he was dealing with didn't even have that longevity. Snoop is not relevant as a rapper, he's relevant as the cultural icon and godfather of the West Coast. The Clipse are the fathers of the coke rap, they're not popping rappers. You understand what I'm saying? He lasted longer than the artists that he produced for. That says a lot.

Andrews-Duve: You could argue that a lot of comparable producers haven't matched his staying power either.

Kimbro: Timbaland did it, but he didn't do it with the finesse of Pharrell. Yeah he's very rich and everything, but Timbaland also wanted to be an artist most of his career and he fought with that. Ron-Ron wants to be an artist in the sense of DJ Khaled.

Andrews-Duve: A curator.

Kimbro: In the truest sense of the word. Because I feel like everybody your generation and younger [writer's note: I'm 21], that's all y'all are. So you listen to music that's given to you so you pick up on that and move to the next thing. That's all it is. So I feel like without Ron-Ron we wouldn't have Shoreline. We wouldn't have an intimate relationship with Greedo, who is able to work with Ron-Ron and able to express himself as the creative genius he is. All those things center around Ron-Ron being open to seeing everything and working with everybody.

Andrews-Duve: Could you describe R. Baron for those who don't know?

Kimbro: I would say we are a management, production company, and marketing brand. So we manage Shoreline Mafia, Drakeo, the Stinc Team, Ron-Ron, ManMan Savage. Then, as far as being Creative Directors or A&R, we do that for Greedo, we do that for Ron-Ron, a little bit for Maxo (Kream)...As far as marketing, we assist all the artists that we work with with marketing. So it's a three-step thing that we do. The focus was never on R. Baron last year, it was on what R. Baron presented to the industry. Drakeo, Shoreline, Ron-Ron, Greedo, Picaso working with Maxo—all these things are things we have something to do with.

Andrews-Duve: It was about building the artists up before y'all came out to introduce the company.

Kimbro: It ain't about us. Me and Picaso are here. It's about the artists. So any artists that don't want they manager or CEO dancing all in the videos [laughs]...come over to R. Baron!

Andrews-Duve: How do you feel the game has changed for independent labels like yours to be successful?

Kimbro: I look at it like this. The people I respect that know how to run the game are Top Dawg. Top Dawg don't take no shit, he runs his operations with his family and they're winning awards, they're doing everything. I wanted to create an opportunity that was based on aspirational hip-hop. That's what I grew up on. See I grew up on Big Daddy Kane, EPMB, NWA, they all sold an image that I wanted to aspire to. Say Picaso grew up on Jay-Z, Ruff Ryders, Biggie...

Picaso:...Clipse, Dipset, Beanie Siegel.

Kimbro: Beanie. They all had something that the listener wanted to be a part of, you feel me? I feel like that's all aspirational, and I think we've lacked that for a long time. I don't know if a lot of people out here wanted to be certain rappers. They wanted to listen to certain music and say their slang, but the aspirational thing was gone. I feel like Shoreline...I've seen little kids that wanna be Ohgeesy. I've seen rappers try to rap like Drakeo, I've seen niggas dick ride Greedo, I've seen niggas try to make beats like Ron-Ron. That's all aspirational. We're here for that, we're the business for that, that's a new business mind.

Also, this is facts too: we're signing some of the biggest deals ever done on the West Coast ever. Ever done. We not lying, bro. That's facts.

Andrews-Duve: Greedo and Shoreline just to name a couple.

Kimbro: Greedo got signed and he was with us, but Greedo is Golden Grenade. So Greedo and my nigga Runch created that. And I want that to be for the record. I feel like I was fortunate enough to hook them up with situations that made sense to them for their passions and their business. I say the biggest we've done as R. Baron, you have to look at Shoreline. That's over a million dollar deal. Most of these rappers signed, they didn't sign for big money at first, and they got their own money. Shoutout to them but they didn't sign for what we signed for. And Drakeo's deal is not announced. Drakeo got some shit. Game-changing.

Picaso: My mom had a record player at the crib and she would have everything from The Police down to like Run DMC to Snoop's first album and all that kind of shit. When I was a kid coming up, I always loved the radio. My mom worked like 12 to 16 hours a day, so when I left, she would be gone and when I'd come home she wouldn't be there until the night time. So what I would do is I would do is I would make tapes, I would listen to radio shows like Julio G, Friday Night Flavas, and The Wake Up Show and I would record all the underground music on one side and put my favorite songs on another tape.

At this same time, I'm watching Rap City. When Big Lez and Joe was on there—not no Big Tigger basement shit [laughs]—back when they had to go to locations nigga, there was no set location. I would film all them shits, I would buy The Source magazine, I would look for the clothes. There was a clothing store that was infamous to me in my past called New York Looks, it was inside the Fox Hills Mall run by a Jamaican nigga named Smurf who, everything that came out of New York, he would have it in LA at the exact same time. So, me growing up and being engulfed by all that culture is what made my taste in rap.

Also, I lived in an apartment complex, and below me were two Filipino kids who were underground hip-hop DJs, they worked at Fat Beats. They would leave their garage door open when they would leave for work, so they would let me practice on the turntables. So I'm going through records, listening to Showbiz and A.G.'s first EP, listening to Krondon, Pharcyde, Raz Kass, I'm listening to all that shit. I took a liking to East Coast hip-hop, but I loved underground West Coast hip-hop as well. I was listening to all kinds of shit. So really middle school is where my love for rap took off fully. And then into high school is when I actually started as an artist myself and started a crew. And really, between 8th grade and 12th grade that shit took over my brain. It had already taken over my brain but it really took over at that time.

Andrews-Duve: What waves were you on back then?

Picaso: Roc-A-Fella's my favorite wave ever in the history of music. That's what I like. The Clipse wave, the Dipset, Roc-A-Fella, State Property Wave, and then the DMX, Lox wave. All that shit kind of got my taste into what I am now. Like I do things knowing that it reminds me of that. And Wu-Tang too, I can never forget Wu-Tang, Wu-Tang was definitely big.

Kimbro: Peace to RZA!

Andrews-Duve: Greedo has that line on "Trendset" where he says "Drummer Gang lookin' just like Dipset." Do you see some similarities with those waves and what's happening right now with the Stinc Team, Drummer Gang, Shoreline, and them?

Picaso: When I have somebody like the Stinc Team, you think of Dipset 'cause of the jewelry and you think of Wu-Tang because everybody's got a different style. You can think Dipset and Wu-Tang mixed together because Drakeo is reminiscent of Cam'Ron to me

And he's reminiscent of 50 Cent—oh, don't forget the G-Unit era either that was a big era too. Mixtape era: Kay Slay, Alpo mixtape, the Paid in Full movie, all that shit. Belly fucked my life over when I was in 8th grade, City of God, all that shit. Supreme store opening in LA in 2003, that fucked me over, I was in there early. Skateboarding, all that shit.

Andrews-Duve: It's funny because you're talking about a time when everything was very coastal, now we're at a point where even though that's still kind of there, sounds that used to be competing can coexist.

Kimbro: Right. As a collective memory.

Andrews-Duve: Right. How does that affect your business approach?

Kimbro: I would say that if you put all those things together, the one thing I feel that you have is the culture of hip-hop. With us, we're able to translate that in business. So you got somebody that goes to jail, you got somebody that's Black who speaks in certain code—Drakeo speaks in code. But you got somebody like Greedo that's in certain situations. Or you have the Stinc Team, even their name is a code. Most people don't even know what it means, they just say Stinc Team. Or you have somebody like Ketchy (The Great) from the Stinc Team, who is in jail right now. Or you have Shoreline Mafia, who is...I don't wanna say dangerous, but they're definitely not as cookie-cutter as people think they are. They will fuck you up, man. And when people get them isolated or see things, they are going to realize how it is.

Take that approach to hip-hop. We just signed our first Southern artist, ManMan Savage. No matter where it's at, to me it's about the culture. ManMan was in jail all of 2017, but he had the buzz before. We'd go to record labels and they'd be like, 'You got ManMan!' DJ Phat hit me up, saying the same thing. I think it gives us credibility.

Labels aren't supposed to translate the culture, they don't understand it. They just put it out. The bank ain't gonna understand what you put in your house, they just gonna give you a mortgage. That's how they are. And you make good partners with good people.

Andrews-Duve: Who are some people you've connected with and trusted on that end?

Kimbro: I think Max Lousada at Warner Bros. is a great person for the culture. He understands it. He understands music and he understands commerce. I feel like our job is to bring people like Max or Monte and Avery Lipman at Universal Republic, or great A&Rs like Zeke Hirschberg (300 Entertainment), label presidents like Todd Moscowitz (300), Steven Victor over at Def Jam, Caitlin (Def Jam), and Julian at Universal. These are really good people, bro. And they've really stood in the trenches. And I'm tripping man...Austin Rice, he doesn't get a lot of the credit he deserves at Atlantic, man. Shout out to Austin. For a fact, Shoreline Mafia would not be at Atlantic if it was not for Austin Rice. That's a fact.

These are people that Picaso or myself have talked to for hours about the culture. Shit that I would talk to you about, I talk to them about, and they understand it. Maybe to levels that I never could understand it as a participant in this degree of intimacy with it.

Andrews-Duve: When did your participation with it begin?

Kimbro: I'm from a different generation than P. I grew up in the '80s in the South then I moved up North, so you gotta realize I grew up listening to regional New York rap. This is hard for people y'all age to understand, but at one time all rap came from New York. That was it. Whatever happened in the boroughs, that's what happened, and the original rappers in your town, they tried to translate what happened in their burrows to your town. Where I lived at down south, my brother brought hip-hop down there. I don't know what they was doing before, but my brother was definitely the first person breakdancing, rapping, living the culture. And then my OG was the first person from that breakdancing, hip-hop culture that I can personally say was involved in street shit. I know this for a fact. So like, when everybody else would go home and do that, he would look at me and be like, 'We need to go get some money.' I'd be like, 'You goddamn right.'

So, him and my other older brother, they were more of the street people and they influenced me at a very young age to understand that hip-hop is something you do, but the streets are something you do to get money. I'm just being real. I was kind of warped in that sense where I feel like, by the time we got to New York—we had been in New York since the late '80s—it was...not like a fantasy, but it was surreal to us because we don't come from that...Like rappers would be standing in front of record labels and doing certain shit and I'd tell my brother, I'm not standing out in front of Atlantic, I'm not freestyling for anybody, I'm not doing none of that shit. We would do shit for ourselves. It was always driven by who we were. And I'm from that part of the culture to where there was no such thing as a line for a shoe. Man, we ran up in old stores and we made stores hot. Man I'm from the generation where everybody stole something or robbed something or sold drugs.

Picaso: Not gonna lie I'm from the generation of boosting for sure [laughs].

Kimbro: This influences us and the way that we do business because a label can't talk to me or deal with me the way they would somebody else because we don't look at the labels like that. I look at them for what they were. Like, I remember Guru, I remember Freddie Fox, I remember Redman smacking the shit out of these [execs]...I'm talking about open-hand smack to where they knock you down to the ground. I remember that, and it wasn't out of the norm. That was the norm in hip-hop at that time. And that's why white people were scared of it, because anything could happen.

And then, in the generation you guys were talking about, the late '90s, early 2000s. One of the greatest equalizers was TRL (MTV's Total Request Live). People don't give enough credit to it.

Picaso: No people don't give enough credit to TRL fasho.

Kimbro: TRL was amazing. Every 3:00 or 3:30, Carson Daly—everybody would get to see it. And you had every superstar. Every label was vying to get their artist on TRL, it was super important.

Picaso: TRL, MTV's Diary, very important. And...And-1 mixtapes with Skip To My Lou and Hot Sauce, bitch!

Kimbro: So all them things collectively give us the insight and a depth that we can pick people, based on all of that. We're saying that from love, we not saying that from malice. Not like 'Fuck that shit...Fuck TRL!,' we not saying that. We're saying it from a fond place of great memories, of great music, great culture that we replicate. So R. Baron to me, before you can make it this big thing and everybody sees it, you gotta put that work in.

Andrews-Duve: Wanna add to that?

Kimbro: Personally, and I'm the oldest person at this table, I really don't feel like there's too much music. I have a daughter that's nine, I don't feel like there's too much music, I feel like the way that people do music and go through music is so quick now. But I do feel like what Picaso said, you have to have something that stands out. And it's very hard to be a standout artist. You were born and raised in LA, you tell me what was standing out before we met.

Andrews-Duve: Hm. YG, Kendrick...

Kimbro: That's it.

Picaso: Odd Future.

Kimbro: Shout out to Odd Future, shout out to YG, shout out to Kendrick. I feel like anything that sticks out is because it creates its own thing, and our guys are creating their own thing. I don't have a template. I'm not here for that, I'm just here to make sure that I translate the business. Shoreline is nothing like these other [artists]. Shoreline does not record like Greedo, bro. OhGeesy is very methodical in how he records, he's not gonna do 100 or 15 songs in a night—he ain't gonna do that. And then Drakeo is not gonna go to a producer that everybody else might go to. They all think and operate differently. But the one thing that they do is stand out.

You said all of those guys—Kendrick, YG, everybody—they're not at one time in one camp. Like, as a management company we touch the whole industry. As a production company, we touch all our artists through Ron-Ron's production. But singularly, they have something that no one has. So, no, I don't think there's too much music. I don't even think it's too much bad music. I think kids are just going to gravitate towards what they do. I actually think it was more fake when I was growing up, to tell you the truth.

Andrews-Duve: What do you mean by that?

Kimbro: I feel like we were being programmed, because there was only a handful of people and a handful of labels and they're programming you, giving you the same thing over and over again. Nobody talks about that, either. The radio didn't just start playing 15 songs right now, my nigga. They been playing 15 songs for 30, 40 years. I can tell you that, I grew up with that.

Andrews-Duve: Only then there were less alternatives.

Kimbro: That's all I'm saying, you feel me? So I think people have a tendency to look back in hindsight and see things that are greater or more pleasing maybe than they were. Do you remember when you had to physically count albums being sold? There was a bunch of scams called buybacks, where labels would buy records, bro. We don't really have none of that shit to this day. We still got shit but not to that level, bro.

Andrews-Duve: Part of that is nobody buying CD's, but even the digital can be manipulated.

Kimbro: So if you look at how we make our money, we make our money off of streams and shows and merch. You can't manipulate merch, can't manipulate shows, and the digital, to a certain degree, we put out records independently. So we put out records through a distributing foundation, and they pay us to put them records out. It just makes sense, bro. Like right now in the music business I feel like a lot of people are followers and they're observers. I'm a disruptor, he's [Picaso's] a disruptor and we disrupt based on hip-hop culture.

A lot of people don't even know that hip-hop was created in south Bronx. I asked my daughter when she was five years old, 'Where did rap come from?' and she told me, 'Atlanta.' That's all she knew, rap has been from Atlanta all her life. She'll be 10 and that's all she knows...But it wasn't, rap is a subculture that comes from the south Bronx that was created because they wouldn't give niggas instruments in school. 'Cause niggas had nothing and we made something out of nothing. And even bigger than that, rap is just a reiteration of Black culture: something out of nothing, man. We always do that. We always make something out of nothing, bro. You don't give us instruments? We gonna use turntables. You don't give us turntables? Niggas gonna freestyle.

You can go back into the '50s, before there was rap. My dad and 'em they used to sing Doo-wop, bro...on the corners, five gangbangers singing to one bitch. And the nigga that got the bitch is the nigga that had the highest voice. They had their own codes to it...I remember my uncle and pops told me when I was younger and I was like, 'That shit sound crazy.' But that was the world they were in when they were kids, that's how important it was to them. So, each generation has its own standards, I just try to stay within the standards of that.

Andrews-Duve: So what is R. Baron offering to this new generation?

Kimbro: The greatest thing that I feel like R. Baron adds, not only to West Coast music, but to rap music period is that we're translators. I feel like the Shoreline deal shows what we can do, that's our first deal. I think the Ron-Ron deal will show what we can do. The [Shoreline] deal with Atlantic is a game-changer. Shout out to Craig Kallman, shout out to him and Austin, shout out to my nigga Orlando. Shout out to everybody that believed in the vision and showed up to the party. Shout out to Tom Corson who, at Warner Bros., started that conversation.

So that's us, that's the legacy that we living man. I feel like, when we leave it, people just gonna pick up on it, because I'm nothing without Eazy, I'm nothing without Fly Ty. I remember Fly Ty, I remember when he got that money from Cold Chillin' Warner Bros. I remember seeing Suge and them, I seen that shit, bro. I remember when Mack 10 and them had money. I remember everything that happened in the last 25 to 30 years of rap, and I remember who was in control. I was here and I plan to be here and do business from the artist end. It's so important.

The legacy that we have right now, the top soundtrack is Black Panther, that's from a kid from Compton and a CEO from Watts, you can't make this up—Watts nigga and a Compton nigga, they running the world. And probably some would say the best song is by SOBxRBE. Sound like California to me. I know for a fact that we put a resurgence on it from this point. I met you at fucking Vice, bro. I met you up there doing work with Vice. And they [Noisey] responded to us because Tyler (Benz) and Justin (Staple)understood the music. It wasn't because they was doing this, this, and that...they the homies, but it's about the music, and we know that the music is gonna do it. We just following a great tradition.

Andrews-Duve: Where would you pinpoint the start of this resurgence?

Kimbro: As far as the industry, I would say the Jeff Weiss show [at The Echo] in August. It was us, Vic from Rosecrans…

Andrews-Duve: Greedo was there.

Kimbro: Greedo was there, the Stinc Team, Natia was there, Gusto Leimert was there shout out to Gusto.

Picaso: Desto Dubb...Frosty came in and went out.

Kimbro: Yeah. That show was very pivotal I think because Jeff is so important.

Picaso: That show and then the article he did on Greedo...before the LA Weekly piece [R.I.P.], the Passion of the Weiss piece where he compared Greedo to Kodak Black and Lil Boosie. That was the very first thing that started it. Literally the first thing. Him being a Drakeo fan, too.

Kimbro: Then labels started calling. Then, by November I was in New York. January I was in New York, signing deals last month.

Picaso: Jeff Weiss' dialogue and documentation of the culture is a very big part of what got us to this point.

Kimbro: Facts. And I tell him that, I always say 'Jeff knows.' So we're on Pitchfork, we're on Fader, we're on a lot of critical things and that's why I said I feel like we've been able to kind of play an angle and the reemergence is I think kids are now critics and the kids. And we feeding them that now. Like that is a resurgence. I also feel like as R. Baron as a management group having all these groups around us. I feel like us being able to understand every group, right now we got at least two people working under two different label systems, us doing creative direction for Greedo, Alamo and helping with A&R and then us doing management for Shoreline at Atlantic, it's crazy man.

Like Shoreline is in Vancouver, Canada right now as we speak. Greedo does his promo line for his album in a couple of days. And it's like wow, we came up with all that...in the sense of business, no other sense. They created the music, bro we had nothing to do with that. But the business, that's so important, man, like people don't know.

I had an artist tell me today, he said, 'I never had anybody fight for me or be as passionate as you are with your artists.' And what that is is giving a voice to the voiceless. It's important to know that, when we step into a building, we are on a cause. It's like, we needa get this bread, and how we could do it is, 'This the first offer? nah let's go back...this the second offer? that's that.' That's all it was is good negotiation. And now we have a lot of other people, you don't have to negotiate as much 'cause they could see it. Second, third, fourth deals are way easier...We got publishing people on us, we got label people on us, you 'bout to see us in a lot of movies, a lot of TV shows. The documentary is coming out: The Architects of the New LA Sound and we got a soundtrack with that. People hit me up with streaming right now, and they hit me up on different TV options as well. It's amazing bro.

Andrews-Duve: So fast, too.

Kimbro: I do wanna go over the timeline. Shoreline Mafia's on tour right now 'til March the 18th. Greedo's album came out March the 9th. Drakeo gets out of jail the last week of March, then he goes on tour in April. Shoreline and Drakeo play the Smoker's Club on April 28th and 29th. Greedo, Shoreline, and Drakeo gonna come out, they all do Rolling Loud on May the 13th. Atlantic Records re-releases ShorelineDoThatShit in late April or May. "Musty" is gonna be re-released as a single. Shoreline literally has about 11 hit singles bro that they got coming out...videos and singles.

Andrews-Duve: All unreleased?

Kimbro: Unreleased and already out. Videos that have never been seen.

Andrews-Duve: There are about four or five already on ShorelineDoThatShit.

Kimbro: Yeah at least four or five. And then when you include other songs, it's like 11 songs. They're gonna keep the kids busy. Drakeo has five mixtapes coming out when he gets out jail, we not even talking about an album. Five mixtapes including one with his brother (Ralfy the Plug).

Andrews-Duve: So what's the legacy y'all hope to leave?

Kimbro: Good business, adding something to the culture. I come from another culture outside of hip-hop. I come from Islam. So Islam is a different culture than a religion in America, it's a different culture, you know what I mean? I just know that everything is based down to an energy. We call it the science of life—it's energy. So if you're dealing with the science of life…my energy is to always make authentic music that reflects something. And I always understand the dominance of certain things in a higher form of society versus things in the lower. Hip-hop came from the very bottom, it's hard to understand that now. We came in here today talking about Rollies and shit like that, but we could also talk about being broke. Both of our fathers are junkies. We could also talk about both of our moms working all our lives, we both latchkey kids. We could talk about that. But what the fuck is that gonna do? To the next latchkey kid, I want them to feel like they can do anything.

That's why I said the music is aspirational. So when you see me in a big car or you see P driving something, you can get it. You supposed to have better than us. You supposed to have four or five different artists you're dealing with, you're supposed to have everything. And that's what's missing. Man, I come from a generation...you gotta remember, Busta Rhymes, Jay-Z, these niggas almost 50 years old. I literally watched Busta Rhymes fall off a stage, that was one of the most terrible days of my life. I remember Busta Rhymes at 21 as a ferocious rhyme animal, Busta Rhymes The Mighty Infamous. I remember Busta Rhymes as a kid, skinny with dreads, then I seen him fall off the stage sloppy as a fat old man. Then I seen Jay-Z who was leading as a peer, who dropped a very grown album last year, very grown, very adult. But I saw a lot of our contemporaries still try to be young, they didn't wanna be elders. Like, there was niggas that was 33, 34, 35, 36, 37, they was like 'nah, we wanna put out a new album, fuck that.' They try to act like they wasn't around.

So my legacy is to embrace all that could happen with everything that's going on right now, 'cause it's cyclical homie. And to get mentorship. Shout out Quincy Jones, we need to talk to you, man. I need to talk to L.A. Reid, I need to talk to Clarence Avant; I respect the shit out of Clarence Avant, I respect the shit out of Doug Morris. I respect Birdman and Slim, I don't have nothing to do with Lil Wayne, I don't judge no man house or anything like that. I don't know what goes on. But I know man, they came from nothing and they made more money than Def Jam, more money than Interscope, more money than anybody, and they still around and they still the presidents of the label. So that's somebody I can gain from.

We not arrogant in that sense, but I am to you scumbag sons of a bitches and them other people in LA that's under us, I don't have no love. 'Cause nobody gave us love when we was on the come up. I got love for the artists, I got very little love for my competitors or other people that was doing business, because in the last two to three years, outside of those people that you named that were standouts—the YGs or the Kendricks or the Odd Futures—what were the rest of y'all niggas doing? What was y'all doing? You weren't doing nothing, you feel me? A bunch of bullshit. So we not there. Our legacy is: good business, contributing to the culture, and making stars, that's what I say. What you say, P?

Picaso: I had a Porsche before the deal and I been wearing Louis Vuitton and Fendi for a very long time.

Andrews-Duve: Any last thoughts?

Passion of the Weiss

, CONTRIBUTORWe're here to cover the intersection of rap, business, and Benjamins.

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POST WRITTEN BY

Myles Andrews-Duve

Myles Andrews-Duve is technically a media studies major at UC Riverside but he really studies the ins and outs of the LA rap scene.

Continued from page 18

Picaso: Free Ketchy! Can you put that in there, please? Free Ketchy the Great. Free Ketchy the Great.

Kimbro: Free Drakeo, he's coming home.

Picaso: He's coming home. Free Ketchy the Great.

Kimbro: R.I.P to my little homie, we call him little Kevin, R.I.P. man I love you, man. Out south for life, you'll never die homie.