#Goth is and always will be a “music” based subculture

[gothiccharmschool]

Happy World Goth Day!

Remember, there is no one way to be goth.

Be aware of the bands that helped form the subculture (Bauhaus, Siouxsie, The Cure, etc.), but also know there are all sorts of goth music subgenres, so explore!

Goth is for everyone. If someone tells you that you have to be thin, white, young, able-bodied, etc. to be a Real Goth, ignore them. They're wrong.

Goth fashion is based in DIY and combining random bits until you have a look that makes you happy. Goth fashion isn't about spending huge amounts of money at various big 'goth lifestyle' websites.

Always support indie bands, artists, clothing designers, jewelers, etc. when you can. Posting about/promoting them is support!

With much love,

Auntie Jilli

[girlishguitarist]

I always feel so weird when I see companies making mega expensive “punk” and “goth” clothes. I used to know this other person who kept on wanting to get into the goth scene, and another one of my friends literally was so willing to help her and get her started out with like music recs and clothing tips and she’d constantly tell us. “Oh, but dressing goth isn’t accessible for me. I don’t have the money.”

Which y’know makes sense, not everybody has the money to drop on getting goth clothes. Especially when your priorities are literally keeping a roof over your head and paying bills. We’re all from working class families here. But then we just kind of realised she was referring to the shit you’d find on like… Killstar or Dollskill and everything made a lot more sense. It’s been making me think. Ever since alternative subcultures such as goth, such as punk, even grunge tbf have made their way into mainstream fashion trends on the internet it’s made people believe that the only way you’re able to get clothes to “dress the part” is to fork out shite tonnes of money to these ridiculously overpriced online clothing stores. (You don’t even have to dress goth for example to be goth because it’s a music based subculture but that’s a whole other thing.)

The way trends are today with this whole, “aesthetic” thing along with the consumerist HELL that is fast fashion sparks a wave people just buying swathes of overpriced clothing to hop onto a clothing trend that is actually ripped from a subculture they don’t really understand? Like part of the whole core of these subcultures is that we are anti-consumerist and anti-capitalist. You are a fucking joke.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m not talking negatively about people who truly want to get into these subcultures. There is nothing wrong with that at all, of course there isn’t. I’m talking about people who will see a fashion trend and just hop onto it and really have no idea what they’re doing. (This is part of the reason why I believe it’s unlikely we’ll ever have a new subculture as big as previous ones ever again because of just how everything is a trend now.)

Fashion that has been born from these subcultures has always been DIY. Making your own battle jackets, thrifting pieces of clothing and tweaking them to be how you want. Like… I don’t know about you babes but I don’t think goths in the 80’s were getting their clothes from fucking Hot Topic.

The fact that companies are now and have been making ridiculously priced pieces of clothing to capitalise off of: 1.) People who want to hop on trends because they don’t want to make the clothes they just want the style now, and 2.) People who want to genuinely get into subcultures such as punk and goth but may be misguided as to where to get clothing just makes me so fucking mad because it makes getting into the fashion within these subcultures seem inaccessible and consumerist-ridden when they’re absolutely not meant to be.

[kogyalies]

GUIDE TO YABI!! 亚比

‘yabi’ is a compound word made of 亚 ‘ya’ (meaning ‘sub-,’ as in subculture) and the derogatory word 逼 ‘bi’ (often found in many insults such as shabi (傻逼) meaning ‘idiot,’ and zhuangbi (装逼) meaning ‘poser’ or ‘fake’).

inspired by subcultures like punk, goth, hippie, grunge, and cyberpunk as well as cultural aspects of the neo-chinese style and the too cool movement, the aesthetic was born from china’s underground music scene.

some of the yabi staples include — but are not restricted to — intricate and ripped stockings, colorful hair, tattoos, maximalist accessories, and loose thigh-high socks inspired by the kogal schoolgirl style. but these are not limitations to the style.

styles can vary significantly across the yabi community: some incorporate goth-inspired total-black outfits or hippie-looking handmade accessories, as well as tight y2k tops and varying accessories such as headphones to fur leg warmers. how you dress depends on personal preference!

When it comes to yabi styling, the only thing that seems to stay the same is the mix and match of other styles and aesthetics — from iconic subcultures like gyaru and y2k to recent trends such as e-girl, cybercore, and abg. you will always find a unique style that differs from person to person in this subculture.

although it is heavily based on fashion, it's a show of breaking free from the normalcy of life as well as a symbol of youth rebellion and lifestyle liberty, almost like the offspring of shamate that was popular years back.

makeup will vary from preference, but often you'll see big lashes, aegyosal, bold eyeliner, and white liner seen in styles/subcultures like gyaru and e-girl. xiaohongshu and douyin are great places to get inspo for makeup!

[literaryxbones]

This is a great deep dive on goth history and how it's intertwined with the Satanic Panic. The Satantic Panic was a mass-hysteria that spread during the 1980's. With the subculture flaunting a darker dress, individualistic attitudes, and rebelling against popular authority, goths were unfairly branded as Satanists. While satanist goths do exist; most of them do not worship or believe in the literal devil.

Goths are minding their own business and want nothing to do with "corrupting the world." They have always been. We always will be.

Goth is a music based-subculture. It doesn't revolve around being depressed, lonely, vengeful, mad at the world, or creating destruction. Though they may look a little different, goths are just regular, nerdy people. Black contour, eyeliner, and bold makeup is never a requirement for being in the subculture. Elaborate looks are only worn some of the time.

Video produced by Cal Does Life on Youtube.

[detectivehole]

i've never been able to convince myself people into music-based subcultures exclusively for the fashion are entirely posers. these are music based scenes so yes it's a little odd, and sure they're more likely to fall into consumerist habits- but you (generally) have to pay for music or access to clubs and venues so it's not like the rest of us are immune (and none of us have to fall into consumerists habits anyway). if fashion is a type of communication and self expression through art, and is so deeply associated with most subcultures as to be almost a dress code, then i see no reason why it's significantly less valid a mode of participation than a shared and publicly displayed love of music- another form of communication and self expression through art. if you can be goth but not dress the part i feel like you could make a good argument that you can be goth and not listen the part. i understand defending the origin of a subculture you care about but it's not 1979 anymore things have changed. definitions are always reshaping themselves around time. sometimes it feels like it's just a rejection of fashion as a legitimate art form more than anything, which is absurd because it's one of the loudest and most immediate forms of cultural connection, communication and self expression we have as a species. i don't think it's what anyone means, but i always wonder

[mossheadmandy]

A useless metal history lesson because I'm intense and I love Eddie Munson

Featuring: Billy Hargrove.

You know...

I've always loved metal, from my early teenage years to now that I've turned 30. And since I started watching Stranger Things and Eddie came into my life, I don't think I've ever felt prouder of being a passive part of the community, but as much as I love fanfiction, understand and respect the need to write an OoC Eddie, mostly to be a little self-indulgent, there are things that I just WANT to share with you, simply because I can and I've been thinking about lately.

So, if there's something that always makes my soul burn with love, it's music; making it, practicing it, listening to it, study it in a philosophical, anthropological way, appreciating it in a peformative way, doesn't matter, I love it, and I love watching documentaries about the history of it, mainly, you guessed it: metal.

Now, I love me a Rockstar!Eddie fanfic every now and then, but I recently read a -very- unpopular opinion that rubbed me the wrong way about Eddie not actually liking metal, but pretending to like it while enjoying other music. Now, they're unpopular for a reason, and this is by no means a statement to dismiss a mere opinion, but it seems like someone discovered liking other artists while being actively part of a subculture. As a goth myself, and it being a music-based subculture, we know it's pretty much impossible to listen to a single music genre forever; you have to listen to the music to be considered part of the subculture, but that doesn't mean it's the only genre you have to listen to for the rest of your life. I'd go crazy if I only listened to a single music genre, no matter how much I love it.

Eddie LOVES metal, but not just any kind of metal, not the kind to come across when you look for "Accurate Eddie Munson Playlist" on spotify, for example. I'll tell you a little story:

Back in the eighties, when metal funded the bases of political views, sound, aesthetics and the public that felt drawn to it, was also the time it was mainstream. Many musicians were earning a good bag by making rock/metal, and to a lot of other aspiring musicians, it was never about the passion but about the money, they wanted to become rich by playing music that was being well-paid. Why do you think so many songs about **certain** glam rock bands are so trivial? Not that there's anything wrong with that, but when most metal bands sing about politics or fantasy stories, it looks like there's a stark difference between how metal started vs. how it ended.

In the history of metal, there are a lot of bands that want nothing to do with the genre because they wanted nothing to do with bands like Poison, Mötley Crüe, Quiet Riot, Twisted Siste, Jetboy or KISS, because it took the main purpose of the message of what metal once was.

Now, although not all glam rock bands talked about the same things, there is a difference with bands like Iron Maiden, Dio, Metallica, Megadeth, Anthrax and King Diamond/Mercyful Fate. W.A.S.P. was one of the glam rock bands that Eddie liked that had really interesting lyrics.

Why am I mentioning Billy Hargrove? Patience, my darling, I'm about to start.

Eddie, like I've said in a past post, is a storyteller. He's a Dungeon Master, meaning he has to get creative about writing stories for his campaings, dig in fantasy worlds, that's why he likes TLOTR, that's why he likes Dio and Iron Maiden, because their lyrics feed his wandering mind (likely ADHD) to keep him creating. I'll leave some verses of songs to make a point.

"...In the land of the lost horizon

Where the queen lies dark and cold

And when the stars won't shine then the story's told, yeah

When the world was milk and honey

And the magic was strong and true

Then the strange ones came and the people knew

That the chains were on

That the chains were on..."

Dio - Egypt (the chains were on). (The Last in Line, 1984)

____________

"...When you're lying in your sleep, when you're lying in your bed

And you wake from your dreams to go dancing with the dead

When you're lying in your sleep, when you're lying in your bed

And you wake from your dreams to go dancing with the dead

To this day, I guess I'll never know

Just why they let me go

But I'll never go dancing no more

'Til I dance with the dead..."

Iron Maiden - Dance of Death (Dance of Death, 2003)

_____________

"...You have been dying since the day you were born

You know it's all been planned

The quartet of deliverance rides

A sinner once, a sinner twice

No need for confessions now

'Cause now you've got the fight of your life..."

Metallica - The Four Horsemen (Kill 'Em All, 1983)

The fact that Eddie was a drug dealer and was two years behind graduation make people believe he wasn't smart, but the creativity needed for what he did, plus the amount of reading he probably did gets ignored constantly, because we think Eddie doesn't read, that Eddie doesn't have a sharp mind, that the only thing he does is play guitar (as if that enough wasn't to be praised, he likely learned Master of Puppets in a week with no internet and no youtube tutorials. I don't think you understand how skilled he was) and play DnD (and some authors don't know how sharp and smart DMs are).

Eddie was way more than that, and every time I think of his artsy nature, I can't think of anything else besides how much I want to lick his brain. Eddie was a genius, one dominated by the right side of his brain. Do you not remember his speech at the cafeteria about false comformity?

Billy, Billy... How are you featured in this post?

Oh, because the post about Eddie pretending to like metal made me think that it's actually a real thing. People pretending to like certain music genres because of the public image it gives them.

There are a lot of people in the community (mostly men) who like metal because they think it makes them look intimidating, badass and smart, like they like to brag about how the bands they like talk about things that matter in their lyrics but these fans don't live up to what they listen to; they're still homophobic, racist, fascist and a lot of awful things in between, while listening to music that's highly political. Billy liked Metallica, I rememer his "Kill 'Em All" poster stuck on his wall, but he was a douche. Do you know what he listened to? You might guess... Yeah! Glam rock! Ratt, Mötley Crüe, all the bands you think Eddie would listen to just because it says 'metal' and it happened in the eighties. Billy was a man worried about looks and getting laid, things that these musicians talked about in their lyrics. He wasn't sharp-minded, he wasn't interested in being creative, in bands protesting against war or telling fantasy stories about pharaohs, dancing with the dead or princesses and castles. The current image of the misogynistic rockstar surrounded by groupies and wasted on substances was an image created by musicians bragging the life they could afford thanks to rock and roll, nothing to do with the initial message of the genre. If you know anything about the main bands Eddie likes to listen to and Corroded Coffin's potential influences, you'd know they weren't really interested in living their music in Mötley Crüe way, where the main focus was, like I said, bragging about the things money from rock and roll gave them or the women (using them and stop seeing them like people while happily married), but in a sillier way where they focused mainly on writing creative music, writing lyrics for the outcast like them the way Metallica did.

Although there were a lot of iconic metal figures who were nothing but polite when asked about 'looks metal', who would roll their eyes at the question because the wording was disrespecftul towards those musicians, there is an undeniable rejection too. Lemmy Kilmister from Motörhead was respectful, he'd say he wished he was pretty too, that he didn't mind 'being copied'. Cliff Burton said that it worked for them, but wouldn't work for Metallica and that was fine. But James Hetfield said during a concert that they weren't 'a band who sang about girls and shouted rock and roll every few seconds'. I wonder who they were hinting at. (I'll look up the video to leave it here or to at least quote it verbatim).

Anyway, if you're curious about bands Eddie would have liked from the eighties, I'll leave a very scarce list so you can use them for prompts in your fanfics, just in case you want to be a snob like me and use bands with contents he'd appreciated:

Helloween

Ronnnie James Dio in any band (Rainbow, Dio, Heaven&Hell, maybe even Elf)

Savatage

Death Angel

Dark Angel

Sepultura

Witchfinder General

Cruel Force

Armored Saint

Diamond Head

Metal Church

Saxon

Crimson Glory

Just a name a few, I actually had a longer list I can't find and I'm not in the state of mind to search or try to remember, also to not make this post longer than it already is. BUT if you want more bands I'll be posting the list in a different post, and if you want me to tag you, just ask ♥

[magpod-confessions]

I really hate the "is Gerry still goth in tmagp" debate, for several reasons. (This can be taken with a grain of salt because I love goth Gerry in both archives and protocol)

We don't know that he's goth in tma- we know he has badly dyed black hair and tattoos. Leitner called him a goth, but does Leitner know what music Gerry listens to? Goth is a music based subculture, and it irks me that people immediately made Gerry goth- it feels like they're reducing this entire subculture to fashion.

People can headcanon what they want. This is fandom, we are playing with dolls. Why should it be universal fandom law that Gerry should always be goth, in the same way people will call you islamophobic for not hc-ing muslim Basira.

The argument of "oh, you think he's not goth just because he's happy" that's always used to shut people down. Idk man, maybe they just don't think he's goth because they know NEXT TO NOTHING about him in tmagp canon. Protocol Gerry might be completely different to Archive Gerry, we do not know.

Tldr: people can hc what they want and to act like not hc-ing Protocol Gerry as goth is some sort of cardinal sin is irritating to me. 🗣

Ppl rly need to chill abt hcs its actually insane

Psa: Harassing ppl is never ok. Block and move on it is not that hard. If there is an actual genuine issue, politely inform ppl of it

[bitter-hibiscus]

I absolutely your Robin Jason headcannons, do you have any more? Maybe some Red Hood ones as well?

!!! im so happy to be getting these asks this is so fun

More Jaybin hcs (part one here):

He has a bunch of 1960s style clothes because Rena likes dressing like a mix of Amy Winehouse and Twiggy

baby goth in the making thanks to Natalia. she gives him a collection of Edgar Allen Poe's poems and he's just hook, line, and sinker into the subculture

He usually listens to metal bands but his guilty pleasure music is slow ballads and gayboy pop (think Kevin Atwater and Troye Sivan)

His favorite rogue to fight is KGBeast because of sentimentality, since KGB is the first rogue he ever defeated as Robin

He has pimples on his thighs and neck but somehow never on his face

He hates having his nails painted because of sensory issues, but lets Rena paint them anyway

His favorite of Dick's teammates is Vic, because he let Jason watch him fix one of Kori's alien weapons once, and he's super patient and kind and answers all of Jason's questions

Red Hood hcs:

Still mostly listens to metal but his favorite band is Rainbow Kitten Surprise (his favorite song is Finalist)

He has a journal where he writes shitty, angsty poetry with a fountain pen

He can never quite resist petting dogs during patrol, so there are multiple pictures online of Mafia Boss Red Hood playing with civilian's puppies

Has a tattoo of a wilded rose on top of his batarang scar to hide it. It's corny and ugly as hell but that was kind of the point. After he starts dating Rose he tells her it's because they were destined to meet. She gags every time

full-fledged romantic goth now. I'm talking manic panic white base, big eyeliner, and fake fangs. I'm talking huge messy hair with about a ton of hairspray. I'm talking "hates that every goth clothing he can find has bats on it"

His main mug is one of those corny millennial "don't talk to me until I've had my coffee" ones that Roy got for him during the outlaws. Jason uses it ironically but Roy thinks he also finds it funny

Sometimes when he's feeling nostalgic Jason will lay down on a rooftop and try to find where Oa is up in the sky, because he and Kyle looked for constellations together during Cosmic Mistake

Contrary to popular belief, his favorite superhero isn't Wonder Woman, it's Black Canary. Which is too bad because she hates his guts

Sent Sasha to live with an ex-con he trusted in South Dakota. He still sends her gifts often but they don't talk anymore since they realized how bad he was to her mental health

Deathstroke's #5 hater. Loses only to all 3 Wilson children (minus Res), Cassandra Cain, and Oliver Queen

Really wants to meet Connor Hawke because he was actually being genuine in GA Vol3 when he told Ollie he'd always wanted to meet him, and has since really really wanted to meet all of the Arrows even though none of them like him. He's the world's worst fanboy

Will do anything Talia asks of him but spits on Ra's face if he so much as looks in Jason's direction

Calls Damian "little prince" in Arabic (Amir Le-Zghir) specifically because of the book, but ALSO because it was what Willis called him when he was a child

Duke is his favorite bat because he isn't afraid to make fun of Jason, gets into a shit ton of trouble, and swears around Bruce like it's nothing

Whew, I think that's enough for a single post. Still have a lot more though lmao

[franzzz-writes]

— jason dean headcanons. ──────────────── ୨୧ ──────────────── intro + reqs rules here | reqs open. . genre(s): general headcanons, angst-y | sfw (non-smut). . warnings: heathers typical stuff, mentions of: self harm, mental health problems, abuse, bullying, suicide and smoking. . a/n: he has NO right to be that fine,, why does he look like that 😐 pathetic little malewife ugh. needless to say it's my opinion and y'all shouldn't attack me for it💥💥💥 ──────────────── ୨୧ ──────────────── - bisexual trans-male, he/him (i don't give a single shit they were in the 80's, lgbtq ppl have always existed) - has undiagnosed impulsive and self-destructive bpd, along with psychosis/psychotic episodes. - he's originally from texas, but doesn't have the accent because he lived there for like a year and only interacted with his non-texan parents, so he didn't have anyone to catch it from. talking about it, not trying to be racist but he has like a lot of extended family he doesn't even know. the kind of people to come out of nowhere and tell you "you've gotten so big! i used to change your diapers!" and jason'll be like "bitch who are u???" - suffered from bullying like, all his life. he had always been an outcast and people thought it was so funny to tease him for it or throw paper balls at him. also bc he was such a nerd and people didn't like it. but the teasing morphed into punching him behind school and doing worse things and that's when he started to stand up for himself and fight back. at one point he moved schools and at that new school he was the one starting fights desperately so ppl would see they shouldn't mess with him so he could save himself from bullying. didn't work. - talking about bullying, he never had any friends neither. vero was his first real friend, (i mean, he had friends when younger but they weren't actual friends, and if he ever got a real friend they didn't last long bc he moved constantly) that's why he got so obsessed w her. stalking part is not cool tho... - skips classes constantly and when he does attend he sits in the back of the classroom and stays silent until the class finishes. the only reason why he does good in school is bc he reads a lot ig. - TW: tried to kill himself by overdosing when he was fourteen and his dad won't stop teasing him about it. like whenever he locks the bathroom door he's like "don't try it again, champ!!" and laughs. in addition to it, he started self harming when he was eleven. -> i'm using "freeze your brain" as a base ("when the voice in your head says you're better off dead, don't open a vein"). - probably worked at a 7/11 at some point hehe. - he had a nice relationship with his mom; she loved him completely and she tried her best, but was a really troubled woman and a victim to bud's abuse, so she couldn't be perfect. despite this, jason still remembers her with love and nostalgia. - started smoking at 12-13. his dad knows but doesn't give a shit like anything else in jason's life. - would've been good friends with duke if he didn't want to kill her. moby dick buddies or idk. - is goth. goth is a music and politics-based subculture. i think jd would listen to goth music and share the goth subculture general thoughts and opinions. however i don't think he'd do goth makeup. the 80's goth makeup wasn't similar to today's trad goth makeup but still. - if i didn't hc him as trans, i like the thought that everyone thought he was going to be a girl but was born male (credits :: @raviankaivao) ──────────────── ୨୧ ──────────────── . today's headcanon question; what are your headcanons for jd?

[rivetgoth]

Seeing someone try to cheekily bad faith argue against goth being a music based subculture with “but that would exclude deaf and hard of hearing people from being goth since they can’t listen to music” is soooooo wild to me. No it literally does not. I KNOW Deaf and HoH people who go to concerts and clubs. There are Deaf and HoH people who love music. There are tons of posts on r/goth from Deaf and HoH goths: “I think it would be pretty cruel of a community to strip me of an identity I've held since I was conscious because of a physical disability, and I will continue to call myself goth. However, when I see this question, I don't think it's really in consideration of deaf people in general, and a way for the Instagoths to justify taking a culture and making it something it isn't. I refuse to be a catalyst to justify your Killstar partnership.”

Saying “Deaf and HoH people can’t be goth” feels significantly more ableist than suggesting that a community that was built around a shared love of a specific kind of art… should remain as such, rather than be about fast fashion and corporate commodification, lol. Goth spaces that are inclusive to disabled people have always existed. Deaf goths exist. Commodifying gothness and watering it down to be purely a marketable aesthetic does literally fucking nothing to make it MORE inclusive to disabled people, and the post I saw this in response to was specifically about goth as aesthetic making it LESS welcoming to goths of color due to the way mainstream commodification always = glorification of whiteness/paleness, whereas within an underground music subculture there’s space for marginalized goths to exist and be celebrated... It just so obviously reveals how little this person knows about the community—Goth being centered around the music doesn’t mean all we do is like. Sit and quietly listen to songs anyway. There’s so many facets of the community that someone can partake in without decentering the music. This would be obvious if someone actually partook in the subculture and made an active effort to celebrate marginalized goths and their actual tangible history within the community, rather than making up hypothetical gotchas online to justify the existence of Killstar.

[xxlittle-miss-horrorxx]

So a very minor nitpick on Helluva Boss….

I know I said I should only ramble with a sideblog for Helluva boss and Hazbin hotel to put a lot of u criticisms in (it’s not gonna be like an anti blog or anything, the show is still very much a guilty pleasure for me) but I just feel like getting this out of my system

I recalled seeing a critical post about Helluva boss’s lack of music diversity and how we sadly don’t see much other music genres than generic pop songs and musical numbers… They mentioned how they wish they saw more metal music and all of that and it reminded me why I have a massive issue with the show’s misusage of the word goth.

I don’t think anyone outside of the goth subculture or most people (even critical blogs) know this, but goth isn’t really a fashion aesthetic. Just like with metal, punk, and grunge, it’s a music based subculture that originated from the punk movement during the late 70s and on forward gave birth to goth as we all know.

That being said, it’s why I have a massive issue with the show labeling Loona and Octavia being goth, when they literally don’t even show signs of listening to goth music (like the Bauhaus, The Cure..) and mostly just get emo or pop songs.

Loona to me just comes off more like an emo girl than a goth, not even a mallgoth (since mallgoths are more like metalheads) since she’s shown to like bands like My Chemical Romance and even the song when searching for Octavia gave odd 2000s emo vibe. Why couldn’t y’all just went with calling her emo instead of goth 🙃🙃🙃

Now Octavia to me, could come off as a baby bat exploring the goth subculture but she always plays pop music for her and idk… I get it, most baby bats won’t be familiar with goth music right away but idk it be nice to hear those themes.

That being said, Helluva Boss isn’t the only cartoon guilty of this. Majority of cartoons in general were always made by normie people and they don’t know much about the goth subculture and only relied on stereotypes normal people have about goths.

However, there are adult cartoons that actually did research better when writing goth characters and giving them more accurate music that fits them.

Take the South Park goth kids for an example

In their room, you notice a poster that’s called Skippy Puppy and the Blauhaus, which are spoof bands of real bands called Skinny Puppy and The Bauhaus which are two bands that are very much liked by goths (bauhaus being the first goth band that gave birth to goth, and skinny puppy is more industrial than goth, we consider that goth adjacent since back in the 90s, goth and industries music were very much mashed together in goth clubs )

Even by character designs, Michael and Henrietta were modeled after Robert Smith and Siouxsie Sioux, who were very much the big time iconic goth musicians.

Matt and Trey themselves are huge fans of the Cure and even had a cameo of Robert smith and even hung out with goths before, so you can see why they got a depiction of them to notch. And the whole thing with them and the vamp kids was a real thing that happened with the 90s with goths and mall goths, i suggestion checking out Angela Benedict’s video for that.

Another example is Venture Bros since Triana believe it or not, is very much an accurate depiction of a goth. And they even referenced bands like the Bauhaus, Alien, Nik Fiend, and Deathrock music as some of Triana’s interests.

But the big kicker is Triana herself, is voiced by Lisa friggin Hammer!

For anyone who doesn’t know, Lisa hammer was an iconic goth musician during the 90s and was in two ethereal wave bands known as Mors Siphlitica and Requiem in White. The fact they had her voice their goth character shows me they did their research.

Even Seth McFarlene got this right (yes you heard me) with American Dad with Debbie and her goth peers, not only making her a very down to earth person but they made their main theme “Love will Tear us Apart” from Joy Division

For those that may not know, Joy Division is one of the Big 5 of goth bands along with the the Bauhaus, the Cure, Sioxusie and the Banshees, and Sisters of Mercy. So I was surprised that Seth got this right, since he’s known to stereo things in his shows.

And of course we also have Daria, with having two goth characters and no I don’t mean Daria and Jane. (Having a cynical personality doesn’t make you a goth) But rather do I mean Andrea and Trent

She was so obviously modeled after Robert Smith and Siouxsie Sioux since those two were very iconic with goth fashion back on the day, we sadly don’t see much of her but you can tell they took inspiration.

And you may be thinking, but why Trent? He doesn’t even dress goth and just seems like he likes any music. While he’s that may be true, but I Remeber having this conversation with other goths in Instagram where we had a huge disccuin of goth characters in fiction. And one of my peers mentioned Trent also counts because he’s shown to have an interest in goth music if you look at his bedroom. So I thought I check out and what do you know

There’s a poster of Bauhaus and Sisters of Mercy inside his bedroom :) and honestly guys, there are actual goths like this I knew in real life. Where they don’t dress the part but are still a huge fanatic of the music. Like you don’t need to dress all dark to be goth, that’s optional, you just really need to enjoy goth music to be goth.

And of course we have Serena from Downtown who actually was not only based off of a goth in real life, but she’s shown interests in goth bands like Dead Can Dance and a satire of Sisters of Mercy as shown here.

The Brothers of Creation is basically a parody of sisters of Mercy. But not only that, she even brought up on one episode how she got tired of goths being badly judged and stereotyped by others (even being lumped by Masonites, which we all know how controversial Marilyn Manson was back then and how his fanbase ignited a horrible stereotype about goths. He was never a goth artist, but normies had the assumption that all goths are like him and his fanbase based on how they just dress similar to goths) and her annoyance with neckbeards that thirst over goth women just makes her relatable to me. Since sadly, there are many men that creep on goth women like us and we get tired of it.

Now honestly, it really should not be that hard to add some goth music to give for Loona and Octavia. They do that modern day humor so much with Instagram and tik tok, they literally could had use a parody of Dusty from Vision Video (who’s a very popular goth tik toker and even has his own bad that’s very similar to the cure) and given we have knowledge now, this amount of research to write goth characters SHOULD NOT BE THAT HARD.

But you know, all would be forgiven if they don’t have hints of liking goth music if they just made Loona a lot more likable. My main pet peeve with her is that she comes off as a negative stereotype of goths that a lot of us don’t like. It just gives normies a really bad idea of us that we are all shitty people.

So anyways rant over, Vivziepop REALLY needs to try and branch out different music genres or research alternative subcultures better before making goth characters.

[eldritch-allan-poe]

the thing about being a member of a music-based subculture (which is all of them) is that no matter how long you've been in it or how much you love the music, you always get so fucking anxious whenever someone asks you about the music even if they're not in the subculture themselves. however this time my fear was unfounded because the guy asked me "oh youre goth do you like pierce the veil" and had no idea who siouxsie sioux is when i started explaining what goth music actually was to him

[vanyathedoll]

im like not against scenecore or anything i actually really like it too its a vibe. but its not scene, its distinctly its own thing. i would compare it to goth vs mall goth. mall goth may have some roots and connections to goth, but in the end its a unique thing inherently separate- especially due to it being more based on fashion than music

and scenecore does have its own associated music, and i like it. hyperpop is nice. but its not scene music

not to mention that it kind of just pisses me off how many of these scenecore people insisting its the same deny scene history and shit. "the community has always been kind and accepting to all!!!" except it hasnt and pretending otherwise is fucking stupid and hurts more than it helps.

scene and emo as subcultures communities both have massive issues with racism, eating disorders, and queerphobia. a whole Thing with scenes is that they're catty. there was shit tons of drama and fighting. scene queens, hello ?

and im not saying i WANT it to still be like that. i feel like clawedbeauty is basically the face of scene right now and i think their sweetness to others is really good for the community and everyone. however, i don't think denying the history of the community helps. ESPECIALLY with addressing the still present encouragement of eating disorders and. yknow, the racism that permits every alt subculture

sorry, ranting over im going to focus now

[beetle-goth]

please share your goth jeeves thoughts i am very interested

Goth Jeeves thoughts let’s go!!

I’ll start with my least coherent and go towards my most

Honorable mention: music is tough. The first real instance of goth music came in the 50’s and in the one story that took place in the 50’s we hear no mention of music. However, Jeeves is not a fan of popular music or showtunes and shows preference for classical music. Not goth, per se, but Bach and Beethoven do kinda have some goth-y vibes.

First, he’s very into serious literature and poetry. Which isn’t saying much but gothic poetry and literature was very prominent in forming the subculture and it sort of seems like the stuff that Jeeves would be into. He likes philosophy and lots of gothic literature has overarching philosophical thought on the nature of good and evil, man vs creator, the nature of death and mourning. And for poetry, the stuff he quotes in Joy in the Morning makes me feel like he’d enjoy Edgar Allan Poe, especially his more romantic stuff like Annabelle Lee and The Raven

“ "It is indeed, sir. I always feel that nothing is so soothing as a walk in a garden at night."

"Ha!"

"The cool air. The scent of growing things.

That is

tobacco plant which you can smell, sir."

"Is it?"

"The stars, sir."

"Stars?"

"Yes, sir."

"What about them?"

directing your attention to them, sir.

Look how the foor of heaven is thick inlaid with patines of bright gold."

"Jeeves

"There's not the smallest orb which thou beholdest, sir, but in his motion like an angel sings, still guiring to tho young-eyed cherubims."

"Jeeves-

"Such harmony is in immortal souls. But whilst this muddy vesture of decay doth grossly close it in, we cannot hear it."

"Jeeves-

"Sir?" “ —pages 107 and 108

Second: his fashion! My man does not like colors and while we mostly see him in his uniform, I feel we can make some assumptions based on his non-uniform clothes and the way he tries to dress Bertie. His black, calf length outdoor jacket is such a goth win! Bertie doesn’t own anything like that and we rarely see other domestic staff wear something like that so it’s easy to assume that Jeeves picked that out for himself. He will wear tan, we’ve seen him wear tan clothes coming back from his vacations but that could be because of class status and/or the standards of driving clothes. Because when we do see him on his nights off, he’s still wearing clothes that look like his valeting uniform (black waistcoat, black tie, black jacket, ect). Bertie also mostly wears tan when he’s driving bc it hides the dirt better.

What’s interesting is how he tries to get Bertie to wear dark and subdued colors. Lots of navy, lots of greys. It makes you wonder if that’s how he’d choose to dress if he had the option. Also related to clothing, Jeeves shows an interest in both jewelry and silver in Jeeves and the Feudal Spirit and Jeeves in the Offing, respectively. He was a jeweler apprentice briefly under his cousin. Accessories, especially feminine jewelry and silver, is very goth.

Third: he’s simply a spooky bitch! Season 2 episode 5 he immediately knows a local folktale about a boogeyman called Old Boggy who roams the streets. In a town he doesn’t live in, at night where he cannot access a library. Which leads one to believe that he reads about the folklore about places he and Bertie visit with special focus placed on ghost stories. And in Right Ho, Jeeves he has this whole section.

“'You smile, Jeeves. The thought amuses you?'

‘I beg your pardon, sir. I was thinking of a tale my Uncle Cyril used to tell me as a child. An absurd little story, sir, though I confess that I have always found it droll. According to my Uncle Cyril, two men named Nicholls and Jackson set out to ride to Brighton on a tandem bicycle, and were so unfortunate as to come into collision with a brewer's van. And when the rescue party arrived on the scene of the accident, it was discovered that they had been hurled together with such force that it was impossible to sort them out at all adequately. The keenest eye could not discern which portion of the fragments was Nicholls and which Jackson. So they collected as much as they could, and called it Nixon. I remember laughing very much at that story when I was a child, sir'

I had to pause a moment to master my feelings.

'You did, eh?'

'Yes, sir.'

'You thought it funny?'

'Yes, sir.' “ pages 765 and 766 of the Jeeves and Wooster omnibus.

Smiling?? He laughed very much?? This story stuck with him into adulthood?? So much so that he thought it would be funny to tell Bertie this story moments before Bertie has a late night bike ride?? No matter how you interpret this scene, Jeeves is a morbid and spooky bitch for this. Rip Jeeves, you would have loved watching the Final Destination movies.

My point is that if he could, he would have loved being goth. He’s spooky and morbid, he loves dark, subdued colors, his loves poetry and literature with philosophical themes, he likes silver and jewelry and he likes slower, more subdued music without saccharine and cheery lyrics (let us not forget his disgust while Bertie was singing Sunny Disposish)

Hopefully I didn’t forget anything important but I feel like I’ve covered my bases on this headcanon

[gothvideodiaries]

not to be like 'i hate TikTok goths' but why are they always trying to change a 40 year old subculture?? what even are any of these micolabels for makeup and clothes ? wear the white base or not I sure as hell don't care but don't be in my comments like "your makeup is actually neo trad drag goth" cause what the HELL even is that

listen to the damn music, make your own clothes, dress like a freak, express yourself and be true to yourself, it's not that hard