#Danzo and Fugaku deserved each other I will die on this hill

[adhdnojutsu]

Your opinion? https://www.tumblr.com/dranosh-haran-of-paleoworld/766237407554273280/why-do-you-hate-itachi-so-much?source=share

Had to use a different browser because this pleasant person has me blocked lol anyway.

TL;DR: Itachi had no right to do the things he did, but he also had no choice. Even if adult onlookers could come up with choices, he was a child trapped in a mindset his authority figures hammered into him in his formative years, and then he was put under additional duress. Come the fuck on.

"This guy willingly betrayed his own people and family, selling them out to the government who wanted to destroy them all."

"Willingly" when talking about a 11-12-year-old brainwashed, groomed, traumatized child under duress is kinda wild. Yes, Naruto is all about normalizing child soldiers, but there's a line and that's Itachi having his horrible "milestones" at an age where others are still in school.

And it's not treason to report a conspiracy to commit, well, treason.

More after the break. Enjoy this screencap of a literal child and one of the many adults who chose to fail him.

Itachi was 11 when he joined the ANBU, 12 when he killed the clan. His incompetent piece of shit father dragged him into a "kill or be killed" situation at 4, and he already had the muscle memory of slitting throats ON REFLEX?? What the everloving fuck did Fugaku do to his toddler? He was encouraged to leave school and enter the field for more death and horror at 8. All for the alleged greater good that was peddled to children and adults more aggressively than America's magical sky cloth. Fugaku and Danzo played a grooming tug-o-war with a literal prepub child and actively, deliberately, had him believe the weight of the world rested on his 3 inch shoulders. The fuck did anyone think was gonna happen when Itachi joined the ANBU everyone encouraged him to join, and did the work he was taught to admire - BY Fugaku, by the way. Fugaku wanted a peacemaker, then tried to start a war. Hm.

Also, Itachi didn't "sell out" his clan. If I know a family member is about to start something with predictably catastrophic ramifications, like, you know, a glorified terrorist invasion ("coup"), I have a moral obligation to report that. "Family" does not matter. Blood, water, starting a war is something you deserve to have sabotaged. And if you're willing to kill, you better be ready to be killed. Everyone who cheered for the coup willingly risked death and willingly doomed their families. "Bloodless revolution" my ass, that is delusional. As if Konoha is just gonna accept Fugaku after a COUP!? Fucking TREASON!? Oppressed or not, you sow violence, you reap violence, and public perception matters. The public's perception of the Uchiha coup would probably be *checks notes* treason :)

"His own people"? They all treated him like a trophy and an attack dog when they didn't outright abuse him for speaking his mind, when he was clearly old enough to let them exploit him. All they had for him was demands to make them proud and bring them glory, at the cost of his well-being. Chapter by chapter in Itachi Shinden, you can watch him wither and crumble. When Itachi's comrade was killed when he was 8, Fugaku literally said "He'll get over it" while his boy was falling apart in the next room. Those are not "his own people", they're one big, bubbling cunt stew with very few exceptions, judging by the novel.

Whether the government wanted to destroy the Uchiha clan or whether it was racist or oppressive ultimately doesn't matter when the active threat to world peace and countless lives is coming from the other side. Two things can be true at the same time, so yeah Konoha sucked, but also yeah, the Uchiha posed a threat. The clan's lives weren't in danger when they decided to endanger everyone over discrimination that isn't even as egregious as what fat people on airplanes have to deal with. Defunding the police (LMAO), not letting a latent traitor run for president, surveillance, and a dedicated, OPEN compound none of the other clans who got one bitched about. Wow, what a compelling reason to set the world on fire!

Yes, Konoha failed the clan, yes, Konoha is scum for that. But two wrongs don't make a right. I'm tired of this whole nonsense of "they're oppressed so they're allowed to act like total barbarians and be the next oppressor". I'm tired on a personal level which you can probably guess.

This is not a responsible adult:

"He knew about Obito and that he was behind the 9-Tails attack but said nothing to anyone. He discriminated against his own people and slaughtered them all to the last child."

He should definitely have reported Obito. But calling his actions against the clan discrimination is like saying the German police discriminates against that Berlin-based crime family because it happens to be a BIPOC minority. THEY ALSO HAPPEN TO BE THE FUCKING MOB. Of course, most Uchihas probably weren't active combatants and didn't deserve to die, but as horrible as it is, strategically, Danzo had a point when he said there could be no potential avengers.

Plus, outsiders like to focus on numbers as if more dead people means more suffering, but this isn't true. Just because 99 people suffer and die with me, doesn't mean each of us suffers and dies 100-fold. Sasuke was based when he said Itachi should have killed him, too. Outsiders don't want to accept this because it IS horrible, but sparing a young child after killing his whole family, is not kind. What would've awaited any children Itachi spared? The village that ordered their parents' slaughter? A world that clearly doesn't want them and will come after them at the first chance? Yeah sounds ever so fucking merciful. Just because unaffected gawkers think preserving a unique cultural or genetic group is the most important thing, doesn't mean the people actually affected have such priorities when literally staring death or a life of pain in the face.

"He cast Tsukuyomi on his own parents and brutally murdered them, tortured his own little brother beyond imagine with one torture session putting Sasuke in a fucking coma, one he would've never gotten out of if it wasn't for that bitch Tsunade and that's the only good Tsunade did in the series."

When did he cast Tsukuyomi on his parents? And "brutally", well, they surrendered and he cut them down rather quickly. All murders are brutal. Should he have raided the local vet and injected them with anaesthetics first? He was a 12-year-old child, crying, shaking, probably exhausted and barely coherent after having killed all the others, and looking at his final victims, his parents, comforting him. Striking them down quickly was the best for everyone involved at that point, anything more elaborate, "more gentle", would have prolonged this horror. Also what did Tsunade do wrong, and if Itachi hadn't knocked Sasuke out for a while, he would have gotten himself killed. The Tsukuyomi was overkill, 100%.

"Itachi thought he was wiser and more noble than his own people, which was pure and utter arrogance. When brought back as an edo, he said that a 7-year-old Sasuke could've changed the clan. He called himself Itachi Uchiha of Konoha and that he specifically had no regrets he was a massive piece of shit in life and death."

This is called interpretation. Yes, he was an arrogant child, he admitted this, Shisui told him, adults told him. But being an ass at the dawn of puberty doesn't invalidate the fact that he WAS smarter than most and the Uchiha uprising WAS a problem, and the clan was infinitely more arrogant than him for thinking they could just take power and that's the end of it. They were delusional. Being 11 when pointing this out doesn't mean he's wrong.

Vilifying him for calling himself "Itachi Uchiha of Konoha" is silly. Many nations will do horrible things behind the scenes to keep the peace, and just because Sasuke and Itachi were the tragic and ever so pretty victims of this, doesn't make Konoha worse than others. It is a place people actually live in. A place people call home and have a right to call home and feel safe and thrive in. Itachi did what he was forced to do by both sides, to protect people's home and peace, not to get headpats from Danzo and Hiruzen.

He also never said he didn't regret the massacre. The fact that he said he wished he would have confided in Sasuke, the fact of him telling Naruto, Sasuke, and Kabuto that he was wrong to try and solve everything on his own, all suggest he wishes it had been different. His words when he dissolves are "Mou miren ha nai", which can be interpreted as regretting nothing, but this is usually meant in a sense of unfinished business. Itachi could not un-kill the clan. Danzo was dead. What more could he do that he could still have "miren" about? Personally, I think he shouldn't have undone the whole Edo Tensei because he kinda owed Sasuke to stick around and fight the other Edo Tenseis manually, but that's not the point.

Actual footage of Itachi alone with his thoughts, probably:

"None of his plans make any kind of fucking sense. He wanted to save Konoha from war even though the other villages wouldn't have attacked for their own reasons."

Kindly look at Syria, Sudan, or Yemen, because the civil war the Uchiha were sure to start, would have been bad enough, you absolute pinecone. But I agree, Itachi's plans were mostly shit, but who taught him any kind of life skills or coping mechanisms? He wasn't parented, he wasn't guided, he was a trained attack dog. He never grew up mentally because when you're not allowed to feel like a child, know what being a child is, how are you gonna know when you're supposed to be all grown up and smart? He treated his suicide by Sasuke like a playdate. He toyed with him. He was a typical old soul, trauma and paralysis masquerading as maturity and composure. It's very apparent in the novels how helpless and small he felt. When the FUCK did he get a chance to unlearn his helplessness on one hand, and the world resting on his shoulders on the other? Itachi was deranged, but not by his own doing. A 4 to 12-year-old child is not responsible for their poor life "choices".

"So Itachi saved Konoha from zero potential wars, especially when none of the other villages attacked after Obito's, Orochimaru's, and Pain's assaults in the series."

I wasn't aware Itachi's Sharingan could accurately predict the future. He stopped the civil war that was certain to happen and that he could stop. Not a single ninja has ever been expected to fix the whole world and the few who expected it of themselves were even more deranged than Itachi. Why hold a 12-year-old to a higher standard just because he's foolish enough to do so himself? Right until Shisui died, Itachi clung to his naive dream of becoming the greatest ninja to stop all wars. And then, both Fugaku and Danzo demanded he be that, when Shisui's death just had him realize how helpless he is. And then, there was a war looming on the horizon that he COULD prevent.

"He practically sent Sasuke gift wrapped to Orochimaru or Danzo. He knew about Obito and Pain's plans and yet did nothing about them, which just screwed over Konoha immensely."

Yeah he fucked up with Orochimaru, and this was one of the things he could have predicted after Orochimaru tried it with him. Not killing Orochimaru when he had both cause and opportunity, was bafflingly stupid and I'll chalk it up to plot armour since Itachi will kill his own mother to protect Sasuke.

He was also a useless spy in Akatsuki, yes. He aided and abetted in several Kage and Jinchuuriki assassinations, all to keep a cover of questionable use.

We do have to grant him that he needed to stay alive to give Sasuke deserved closure. He didn't even know Obito wasn't Madara, so I don't expect him to have known much about Pain's abilities. Given he allegedly ties with Jiraiya and we all know what Pain did to him, Sasuke would not have gotten his revenge. As for Danzo, can we not underestimate him please? He had to be worn down into self-destruction by Sasuke, and when Itachi attacked him in the novel after getting the MS, he was immediately stopped.

"He was never a prodigy or anything, unlike Sasuke. His fights are just him using genjutsu on his opponents and overpowering them with it, which just childish and stupid. He pulled Susanoo, Mirror Yata, and the Tsoka Blade out of his ass."

I agree Susano'o and its rigs were asspull done to compete with DBZ ratings, but how was he not a prodigy when he was recommended for graduation at 8? Poor writing or not, the canon fact is that Itachi was way ahead of his peers and many adults. We can't blame a character's personality in one moment, then bad writing the next. All writing boils down to creating the character's reality and all facts written by the author are equally valid.

Calling genjutsu childish and stupid is silly as you can apply this to all jutsu. Naruto's army of clones is arguably more ridiculous than mastering an otherwise underdiscussed technique at a level that has people like Kakashi scared. Personally, I think the big noisy techniques like Kisame's water jutsus and Hashirama's Slaparama are a lot more childish and geared towards hollering little boys. Itachi's fighting style is elegant and super duper gay.

"This fucker is all over the place and doesn't make sense. Dushman-e-jaan has posts that go into greater detail about how this guy doesn't make sense, and I recommend you read them as she does an infinitely better job at explaining my dislike for Itachi than I have."

Dushman explicitly supports this:

But thinks Konoha is worse for allegedly being this:

In other words, Doucheman is fine with making 0 sense whatsoever as long as they can virtue-signal for fascists if they know how to sell the underdog act.