#But seriously the man genuinely doesn't understand fandom or what treating a character like a woobie actually means about how they see the

[got-into-worm-by-mistake]

Interlude 2 Live Reactions

(This is me, writing reactions as I read, because why the fuck not. They're not complete, mature thoughts taken after I sit back and evaluate what I've read. Consider them as such)

There were very few things, in Victoria Dallon’s estimation, that were cooler than flying.  The invisible forcefield that extended a few millimeters over her skin and clothes just made it better.  The field kept the worst of the chill from touching her, but still let her feel the wind on her skin and in her hair.  Bugs didn’t splat against her face like they did against car windshields, even when she was pushing eighty miles an hour.

I mean, there's a reason why people objected to Victoria being the MC of Ward way back when. Her first introduction really doesn't jive with the rest of Worm's general tone, sets the mood, etc. Collateral Damage Barbie and all.

Really, Ward may take place after Worm, and may be in the same verse, etc, but it's not a sequel in the conventional sense. it's not telling the same story, the theming and narrative is wildly different - plus, Worm is 1.6 Million words long. 1.6 Million is over 3 times longer than Lord of the Fucking Rings. That's not a Book, that's a series. Ward isn't a sequel to Worm, it's a new series in the same world, after the previous series. Which is definitely a thing.

Granted, this is nitpicking, but Ward sucks, so fuck Ward.

Anyway - this opener for Vicky here does set a tone for her. I know she 'gets better' even within Worm itself, etc, but at this point, all the reader really knows (bar spoilers) is that some heroes are apparently dicks, and some villains are apparently halfway nice people. I'm going to guess one of the main purposes of this interlude (since, if I have picked up things right, is an instance of Amy healing another one of Vicky's victims) is to further the case, to the reader, that the heroes aren't all bright and shiny.

(To be clear, based on my fic reading/wiki walking/reddit thread reading, I am actually a fan of Victoria Dallon overall)

She stayed in that kneeling position for just heartbeats, letting her platinum curls and the cape that was draped over one of her shoulders flutter in the wake of air that had followed her descent.  She met the eyes of her quarry with a steely glare. She’d practiced that landing for weeks to get it right.

We see her reveling in her power in a way Taylor never does, never wants to. We also see her being an overdramatic teenager, but then, If I'd had that sort of power when I was her age (17? 18?) I'd also be overdramatic as fuck, so I'm not blaming her.

“I didn’t do anything,” the man snarled. “Andrea Young!” Victoria raised her voice.  As she shouted, she exercised her power.  The man quailed as though she’d slapped him.  “A black college student was beaten so badly she needed medical attention!  Her teeth were knocked out!  You’re trying to tell me that you, a skinhead with swollen knuckles, someone who was in the crowd watching paramedics arrive with an expression bordering on glee, you didn’t do anything!?” “I didn’t do nothing worth caring about,” he sneered.  His bravado was tempered by a second look over his shoulder, as though he’d very much like to be elsewhere right that moment.

I mean, no one ever accused Neo-Nazis of being smart, but you do know who this is, you little shit, right? You may not care, but she does, so keep on denying it. It won't work, but you have to at least try.

God, his stupidity almost offends me more than his racism.

  For just a moment, she contemplated slamming him up against a wall.  It would have been fitting and satisfying to shove him hard enough against the brick to crack it, then drop him into the dumpster that sat at the wall’s base.

Intrusive thoughts, entirely understandable.

“I think it’s a safe bet to say you’re a member of Empire Eighty-Eight,” she told him, meeting his eyes with a hard stare, “or at least, you’ve got some friends who are.  So here’s what’s going to happen.  You’re going to either tell me everything the triple-E’s have been up to, or I’m going to break your arms and legs and then you’re going to tell me everything.”

Well. Not a great look, even as an empty threat, Victoria. Not a great look at all.

“Fuck you, you can’t touch me.  There’s laws against that shit,” he blustered, staring fixedly over one shoulder.

Okay, so I know police brutality still happens on Earth-Bet, so does this guy really think this will work?

(also, why is it in superhero fiction superheroes always seem to be better regulated and more likely to actually be punished than cops? Apart from author fiat, I mean? Probably Police Unions are a huge contributing factor, tbh)

Her body thrummed with current – waves of energy that anyone in her presence would experience as an emotional charge of awe and admiration.  For those with a reason to be afraid of her, it would be a feeling of raw intimidation instead.

Ah yes. The Aura. Nothing ethically dubious about this. Aura Theory may not be true, but really, wtf Vicky. Don't go running this thing like it's Candy Crush on a boring Thursday Night.

Was Candy Crush around in 2011? Does Earth Bet have Candy Crush?

He was utterly for still for long enough that Victoria had begun to worry that he’d somehow snapped his neck or broken his spine as he’d rolled.  She was relieved when he groaned and began to pull himself to his feet. “Ready to talk?” she asked him, her voice carrying down the alley.  She didn’t move  forward from where she hovered in the air, but she did let herself drop closer to the ground.

There is a reason Vicky's detractors (and even some of her fans) call her 'Cop' as a middle name.

Like, character doing torture in fiction happens, and in a story like Worm, might even still be an overall good person, but someone like Glory Girl really shouldn't fucking be doing this shit. Not with New Wave's whole schtick and her whole general... vibe as a superhero.

Then again, that she's doing this despite that is probably the whole goddamn point of the interlude.

What was this asshole thinking?  That she would just let him go?  That, what, she would just bend to his witless lack of self preservation?  That she was helpless to do any real harm to him?  To top it off, he was going to insult her and try to walk away?

Shards, Shards, my dudes. my guys - DON'T GIVE TEENAGERS THIS SORT OF POWER

This time, he didn’t get up. “Fuck,” she swore, “Fuckity fuck fuck.”  She flew to him and checked for a pulse.  She sighed, and then headed to the nearest street.  She found the street address, grabbed her cell from her belt and dialed. “Hey sis?  Yeah, I found him.  That’s, uh, sort of the problem.  Yeah.  Look, I’m sorr- ok, can we talk about this later?  Yeah.  I’m at Spayder and Rock, there’s this little road that runs behind the buildings.  Downtownish, yeah.  Yeah?  Thanks.” Victoria returned to the unconscious skinhead, checked his pulse, and listened intently for changes in his breathing.  It took a very long five minutes for her sister to arrive. “Again, Victoria?” the voice disturbed her from her contemplations.

Again.

One word. Conveys so much character and worldbuilding, doesn't it?

“Use my codename, please,” Victoria told the girl.  Her sister was as different from her as night was from day.  Where Victoria was beautiful, tall, gorgeous, blonde, Amy was mousy.  Victoria’s costume showed off her figure, with a white one-piece dress that came to mid-thigh (with shorts underneath) an over-the shoulder cape, high boots and a golden tiara with spikes radiating from it, vaguely reminiscent of the sun’s rays or the statue of liberty.  Amy’s costume, by contrast, was only a shade away from being a burka.  Amy wore a robe with a large hood and a scarf that covered the lower half of her face.  The robe was alabaster white and had a medic’s red cross on the chest and the back.

Like, I've seen people give Wildbow grief for describing Amy's outfit as like a burka, and it wasn't a great choice of words, but is evocative.

He really should have picked another term tho.

Also! AMY! AMY! My Poor Borbo Sopping Wet Babygirl Little Meow Meow Who Did Nothing* Wrong! Finally she appears! Gimmie Gimmie Gimmie!

*As a necessary clarification for people who are Wildbow or who otherwise don't understand Fandom and/or tumblr Humor, yes, Amy of course did so fucking much that is wrong. I really shouldn't have to clarify this, but this fucking fandom (and this fucking Author)

“Our identities are public,” Amy retorted, pushing the hood back and scarf down to reveal brown frizzy hair and a face with freckles spaced evenly across it. “It’s the principle of the thing,” Victoria replied. “You want to talk about principles, Glory Girl?” Amy asked, in the most sarcastic tone she could manage, “This is the sixth – sixth! – time you’ve nearly killed someone.  That I know about!” “I’m strong enough to lift a SUV over my head,” Victoria muttered, “It’s hard to hold back all the time.”

Yes, but that's also why you don't... like... do those things, Vicky? If you can't be sure you will hold back, then don't do a thing where if you don't hold back, you leave a guy like this. At least if it's not an actual life and death situation.

Amy's not wrong here. Six fucking times is a lot, for a girl who hasn't had her powers for more than a few years.

Carol? Carol?! Who said you could let your teenage wrecking ball patrol around like this unsupervised? Caaaarol!

(God, Carol is just... the worst fucking mother all around, isn't she?)

“Look, can you just fix him?” Victoria pleaded. “I’m thinking I shouldn’t,” Amy said, quietly. “What?” “There’s consequences, Vicky.  If I help you now, what’s going to stop you from doing it again?  I can call the paramedics.  I know some good people from the hospital.  They could probably fix him up alright.”

I mean, on the list of things that's weighing Amy down, all the people that she's healed for Victoria is probably a bit lower down, but it doesn't help.

Don't help her Amy. I know you will, and I love you anyway, but don't. Please don't. You're right. Vicky does need to learn.

“I know you’re not keen on the superhero thing, but you’d really go that far?  You’d do that to us?  To me?”

Look who took guilt redirection classes from Mommy!

(Not that this is like, some horrible sin revealing Vicky as a garbage person, teenagers learning moral lessons from their parents is inevitable, and Carol, again, suuuuucks. Bad mom, bad superhero, bad human. All my homies hate Carol.)

Amy pointed a finger at her sister, “That’s not me.  It’s not my fault we’re at this point.  It’s you.  You’re crossing the line, going too far.  Which is exactly what people who criticize New Wave are scared of.  We’re not government sponsored.  We’re not protected or organized or regulated in the same way.  Everyone knows who we are under our masks.  That means we have to be accountable.  The responsible thing for me to do, as a member of this team, is to let the paramedics take him, and let the law do as it sees fit.”

Again. She's really not fucking wrong. If Vicky makes a bad first showing for a work like this, Amy makes a really good first showing.

“My adoptive family,” Amy mumbled into Victoria’s shoulder, “And stop trying to use your frigging power to make me all squee over how amazing you are.  Doesn’t work.  I’ve been exposed so long I’m immune.” “It hurts,��� the man moaned. “I’m not using my power, dumbass,” Victoria told Amy, letting her go, “I’m hugging my sister.  My awesome, caring and merciful sister.”

Being exposed to a mind altering power so much that you're 'immune' is still not the sort of thing a person should really be going through at all, you get that, right? Vicky? You do get that, right?

Are you really not? You sure? Because you just did lose control of your other power (super strength) a few minutes ago.

Aura Theory isn't true, but the Aura is still 17 kinds of bullshit, Vicky.

Amy frowned at Victoria, “I’ll heal him.  But this is the last time.”

Amy, I love you, I love you to pieces and to the moon and back, and I wish for nothing but happiness for you, but you and I both know this is not the last time.

Amy leaned over the man and touched her hand to his cheek, “Slingshot break to his ribs, fractured clavicle, broken mandible, broken scapula, fractured sternum, bruised lung, broken ulna, broken radius -“ “I get the point,” Victoria said. “Do you?” Amy asked.  Then she sighed, “I wasn’t even halfway down the list.  This is going to take a little while.  Sit?”

Vicky, you're really not sounding like someone who is getting it. You really should be hearing Amy's whole list.

Like, I get that Vicky's probably not supposed to be coming off great in this scene, and if so, task fucking successful.

“Better than ever, physically,” Amy replied, “I grew her new teeth, fixed everything from the bruising to the scrapes, and even gave her a head to toe tune-up.  Physically, she’ll feel on top of the world, like she had been to a spa and had the best nutritionist, best fitness expert and the best doctor all looking after her for a straight month.”

Powers.

Are.

Bullshit.

“Yeah, yeah.  Not can’t.  Won’t.  It’s complicated and I don’t trust myself not to screw something up when I’m tampering with someone’s head.  That’s it, that’s all.”

This isn't the (only) reason Amy has this rule, of course, but it's a damn fucking good one.

As far as she was concerned, Amy was doing herself a disservice by not practicing using her powers on the brain.  It was only a matter of time before her sister found herself in a situation where she needed to do some emergency brain surgery and found herself incapable.  Amy, for her part, refused to even discuss it.

...On the other hand.

Vicky's not wrong. Holy shit, is she not wrong. And not just for reasons stated, but for a bunch of other reasons Vicky doesn't know about.

The problem with rigid rules, and pinning your entire sense of morality to them is that if you break one, and you made it so rigid it's brittle, the whole moral edifice falls down.

Amy, babygirl, please. Someone needs to get this girl into at college level ethics course, STAT. She needs a moral worldview that she didn't inherit from Carol that isn't so black and white and rigid yet brittle.

“I… sue you, he gasped out, then managed an added, “Whore.” “Try it.  I’d just love to see a skinhead with a few broken bones go up against a superheroine whose mom just happens to be one of the best lawyers in Brockton Bay.  You know her, right?”

Aaand back to the Police Brutality analogues.

“And erectile dysfunction,” Amy said, just loud enough for the thug to hear her, “You fractured your ninth vertebra.  That’s going to affect all nerve function in extremities below your waist.  If I leave you like you are, your toes will always feel a little numb, and you’ll have a hell of a time getting it up, if you know what I mean.”

Always the best way to get to a guy poisoned on the kind of hypertoxic 'masculinity' that fascism and adjacent ideologies fill their supporters with: Go after what they love most.

“I have an honorary medical license,” Amy told him, her expression solemn, “I’m not allowed to fuck with you about stuff like that.  Hippocratic oath.”

Amy Dallon, Bullshittter Extraordinaire :rofl:

“This guy, Coil.  Don’t know what his powers are, but he’s got a private army.  Ex-military, all of ’em.  At least fifty, Kaiser said, and every one of ’em has top notch gear.  Their armor’s better than kevlar.  You shoot ’em, they’re back up in a few seconds.  ‘Least when you shoot a pig, you can be pretty sure you broke a few ribs.  But that’s not the fucked up thing.  These guys?  They’ve got these lasers hooked up to the machine guns they carry around.  If they don’t think bullets are doing it, or if they’re after people who are behind cover, they fire off these purple laser beams that can cut through steel.  Tear through any cover you’re standing behind and burn through you too.”

Aaaah Thomas Fuckface Calvert. First introduction of what is probably the closest thing Worm has to like a real 'main villain'. Jack Slash is a close second, but it takes too long for him to be relevant for that to count. Calvert looms over the entire narrative from midway through Arc 2 until he dies in what... I'm going to guess from what I know is somewhere in Arc 20? 21?

The skinhead laughed, then winced, “Are you dense, girl?  Everyone’s going to make a play.  It’s not just the major gangs and teams that are looking for a slice of the pie, there.  It’s everyone.  The Docks are ripe for the taking.  The location’s worth as much money as you’d get downtown.  It’s the go to place if you want to buy black market.  Sex, drugs, violence.  And the locals are already used to paying protection money.  It’s just a matter of changing who they pay to.  The Docks are rich territory, and we’re talking the potential for a full scale fucking war over it.”

Nature abhors a vacuum, and that's one reason you have to be careful about taking out whole gangs.

He continued, “You want to know my guess?  Empire Eighty Eight is going to take the biggest slice of the Docks, because we’re strong enough to.  Coil’s going to stick his thumb in just to spite us, ABB is going to hold on to some.  But you’re also going to have a bunch of the little guys trying to take something for themselves.  Über and Leet, Circus, the Undersiders, Squealer, Trainwreck, Stain, others you’ve never heard of?  They’re going to stake out their ground, and one of two things is going to happen.  Either there’s war, in which case civilians get hurt and things get bad for you, or there’s alliances between the various teams and solo villains and shit gets even worse for you.”

Chatty (and surprisingly insightful) little shithead, isn't he? Where were all these brains earlier when he was Mouthing Off to Alexandria Jr?

 “Try it.  My sister just healed you… most of you, with a touch.  Did you ever wonder what else she could do?  Ever think, maybe, she could break you just as easily?  Or change the color of your skin, you racist fuck?  I’ll tell you this, I’m not half as scary as my little sister is.”

Does Vicky realize how true this is? Like, really, truly, how easily her sister could become an S-class threat?

Also, just once, it would be funny as fuck if Amy did make a member of E88 black. Horrifying implications, but funny as fuck.

“I’ll be good.  I’ll be better,” Victoria promised as she dialed with one hand. 

If I'm Amy, I'm thinking 'You mean that now'.

But again. What 17 year old doesn't say "i'll do better" and, even when they mean it, sometimes fail?

“Amy!” Victoria laughed, hugging her sister with one arm, “Weren’t you just saying you weren’t going to mess with people’s heads?”

She said she wouldn't mess with their brains.

(Not that this shithead racist fucker seems to have many of those)

Overall, fucking love this Interlude, and even if I didn't have Amy Dallon Brainrot™ as a pre-existing condition, I think I would anyway.

But ooof. So many fucking oofs, given where I know the story is going.

[oreo-oro-orero]

I thought I would talk more about how I feel Ekko is often mistreated or ignored by the Arcane fandom and why I think that is and spoiler alert I Anti-Blackness is at least a part of it.

Ekko is subjected to what a lot of black boys are too in real life which is  adultification. Ekko just like a lot of black boys was essentially forced to grow up and due to this I think a lot of the Arcane Fandom treat him as an adult and thus judge him more harshly just like how in real life black boys are often treated as older then they actually are and thus are subjected to more scruinty and Ekko is sadly constantly subjected to this by the fans. This is in direct contrast with Jinx who seems to be given a lot more leeway which to a certain extent is understandable because it is her story essentially but I still find it odd how she is given the "oh poor baby pushed around by the big bad world must protect" but Ekko is just given a side glance and a "he's doing fine" when both Ekko and Jinx deserve that "need to protect" additude but yet it feels like Jinx is given the most of the protection and Ekko is just left to fend for himself.

Honestly I don't think a lot of the Arcane Fandom looks at Ekko as a victim and that is genuinely upsetting. They look at his situation as more of a success story but even then his "success" is is very sad when you think about it.  Yes he built a community and yes I guess he did "turn out okay" despite his situation but he shouldn't have had build that community in the first place and just because he did doesn't mean he's healed, trauma doesn't just go away because your relatively okay compared to everyone else. I also think his hurt isn't taken as seriously as the other characters because he doesn't actively display it as much, in total his hurt is displayed in two main instances and that's it mostly, the other times he's on screen he's either angry or at the very least mildly annoyed or somber which is interesting because this is most likely a mask he wears and this mask is a direct result of the adultification I talked about earlier. 

Ekko suffers from what a lot of black characters do which is that despite them going through the same or sometimes even more trauma then non black characters, their trauma is often overlooked or downplayed to be less then it is which is something that happens in IRL to black people all the time. Also this mischaracterization of Ekko extended to Shipping as well to where some people label him as an abuser towards Jinx which is ironic because he is one out of like 2 other characters that doesn't actively kill anyone and if anything he tries to avoid that as much as possible so I genuinely don't understand where this abuser assumption came from, is it because they genuinely Believe it or is it because they saw a black man being aggressive an automatically assumed he was the one in the wrong in the situation.

I got a little bit ranty there and I apologize but Ekko is my favorite character from the show and just fiction in general and I feel like he has so much to offer but he is seemingly being mistreated by other fans of the show and that just doesn't sit right with me. I just hope next season really gives him his time in the spotlight.

[utilitycaster]

Threatened this once as a throwaway tag, so: let's talk about why "Justice for Adeen Tasithar" as an attempted criticism of Essek is absolutely wild as a choice.

Disclaimer: there are many deeply annoying fans of Essek who do not seem to understand that the narrative and the cast (and by extension, merch/official art/comics) will treat him differently for being an NPC, even if he is a very important NPC and a member of the Mighty Nein, and you are justified in being annoyed. There are also a number of equally annoying Essek haters, most of whom are bitter shippers who have (correctly) realized it's slightly more palatable to others in the fandom to openly hate on Essek than on a PC; or else they are the miserable souls who think that every minute spent on a character other than their personal favorite stolen and wasted time. I am a firm believer in this post; everyone is annoying and complaining on your own blog about it is your absolute right. Also, both in regards to the fans mentioned above and the characters mentioned below, it is possible for people on two opposite sides of a position to both suck.

The first issue is the phrase itself; it co-opts a statement usually used for victims of hate crimes or political prisoners in the real world, and makes it unironically about a pretend guy who had precisely one scene, which is certainly a choice. I'm not actually opposed to using "Justice for" jokingly in fandom, but it is weird to use it relatively seriously in fandom.

The second is that Adeen Tasithar is a member of one of the Dens of the Kryn Dynasty, and is a Taskhand, a term reserved for people with high-level military responsibilities, and is a member of the Bright Queen's Court. During wartime. Coupled with the fact that Essek, who, as described below, is never portrayed as particularly cruel nor petty despite his many flaws, thinks Adeen genuinely does suck, this means that at best, Adeen Tasithar is heavily involved in military operations at a very high level and is in some way personally unpleasant. At, frankly, not even worst, we're talking D&D Donald Rumsfeld. Now, we can debate whether Essek is a war criminal or merely traitorous (not on this post though, because I don't care and it's not relevant), but, while we know very little about Adeen Tasithar, it's not an overreach to say that this man has a pretty strong chance of being guilty of his own war crimes. In general, calling for justice is something I'd hesitate to use in an "the enemy of my enemy" manner, especially if it's well within reason to consider that you're talking about Ludinus Da'leth's Kryn counterpart.

The third is that while you're under no obligation to like Essek, he really is, in general, portrayed as a decent judge of character and a terrible judge of whether selfishly following his own ambition was appropriate and what the consequences might be. He detests the members of the Cerberus Assembly with whom he works; he likes the Mighty Nein despite them ultimately being his potential undoing. He has a few friends in the Dynasty and cares about his (unambiguously good) brother, and feels remorse about his father. Essek has done terrible things in the service of his goals; but directly throwing an innocent under the bus (vs. setting into motion things that will, as a side effect, lead to innocent collateral damage, which he obviously will do) isn't his style. Again, at the very least, Adeen Tasithar is someone whom Essek genuinely believes is a bad person (note that Essek, by this time, also considers himself to be a bad person, and Trent Ikithon to be a "fuck hole", which might help your understanding of scale here). This doesn't mean Tasithar deserves what he got, but frankly, in a campaign about people who got a lot of things they didn't deserve, it's a pretty blatant straw-grasp onto a side character with the briefest of appearances to decide he's your poster boy victim just so that you can go full spiked bat on a character you dislike.

The fourth is that there's never any connection to how Essek not being friends with the Mighty Nein (or entering a relationship with Caleb) would provide justice for Adeen Tasithar, who is in an Empire prison by the end following the exchange during peace talks. It's actually entirely possible that the Empire eventually figures things out re: Adeen, notably because memory modification as a criminal act is going to be really fresh in their minds following the Ikithon trial (and if they interrogate Trent, it's also possible the Empire finds out about Essek). Essek is already a fugitive from the Dynasty and cannot move freely through the Empire as a drow whom assembly members would recognize. The guy didn't get off scot free anyway, so really, he is going to suffer to some extent; you just want him to experience abject and total misery, rather than constant fear tempered with a small degree of happiness, like some kind of sicko, or megachurch member.

The final one is that "justice for Yeza Brenatto" or "I don't like that Essek worked with the Assembly even if he wasn't happy about it" would actually be far more reasonable statements to make. Yeza was, in fact, a simple alchemist who was forced to become a pawn in the game being played by, among other people, Essek, and suffered immensely for it. The Assembly does in fact suck. And yet, rather than admit Caleb also considered working with the Assembly for selfish reasons, or that Veth, you know, exists people jump to woobify some random NPC about whom we know basically nothing other than "Military guy, well-connected politically."

So anyway: feel however you want about Essek; but if you're on Adeen Tasithar's bandwagon, I don't think you actually are terribly bothered by hypothetical fictional war crimes. I think you just are too spineless and online to say "I dislike Essek" and needed to construct an elaborate poor reason why.

[jiangwanyinscatmom]

I wouldn’t disagree, JGY is a villain. He does countless evil things. I would even go so far as to say that he doesn’t deserve any sympathy. I just think that it is very understandable that people feel sympathetic towards him.

But I don’t understand what is wrong about loving the character or enjoying fanfiction that characterises him as likeable and good and just “misunderstood” (even though this isn’t at all canon). He is not real. His crimes are not real. If I enjoy engaging with fanfiction portraying him like his canon facade (pitiful, sweet, in need of support), I don’t see the problem. Of course this is a misrepresentation from his canon version, but so what? It is fanfiction. What is so wrong about deciding that you want to see a version of the story where JGY’s mask/facade is the real him? I seriously fail to see the problem in this. I am very, very new to this fandom, so this is why I even ask. Maybe I am genuinely missing some context here. I just got started looking into the mdzs, cql fandom space here and was surprised to see so many controversy regarding this. In my mind it is all about a fictional character and it feels like people treat the whole thing like he exists for real and harmed real people. 

So this isn’t meant as a “Why do you hate JGY?” (It is pretty obvious why you hate him, there is admittedly a lot to hate). I just wonder why you seem so set against people who like the character based on the version of himself he pretends to be in most of canon. 

I'm not here to entertain their fanon or to act as if it's valid, I've been harassed far too many times to act as if I need to play nice about it anymore.

I don't have a reason at all to make them feel comfortable in wanting to make a wobbly sad man rapist their safe space when he's meant to be pathetic in his own plotline. I don't owe any sort of novelty for that as you said, he's fake, yet, they sure like to disregard the very real connotations of abuse and excuses people like him in life want and expect like it's their right. I don't care if he's liked, have at it, just don't expect me to have any sympathy for that type and act hurt that I despise that very characteristic that wants pity. Regardless of who it is, I don't very much care for enabling the abuser of any work because I feel like I can fix them.

Call it the running theme of misogyny within fandom spaces. As a woman, I don't need to have it forced down my throat I need to also sympathize with abusive men with absconded words usually for women victims, on a man that abused and used that very system for his own selfish needs. I don't condone the usage of him as something he isn't, as in context he is the abuser and misogynist that time and again the real world pedestals still based on "but he has a sad life so it's okay and he deserves support" when he actually had that, yet still moves to hurt others based on his own hate. As a woman, I don't need to be told to have more sympathy for a man who doesn't care about the abuse he enacts on the vulnerable and the empathetic for his own needs.

[marshmallowprotection]

not sure if this is an unpopular opinion but i tend to enjoy conversations with saeyoung more when he's being serious and not treating the MC like an audience he's performing to. however, so much of the fandom content is of him acting like this and it's really disheartening considering the whole point of his route was to accept him for who he is 😭

Oh, listen, Saeyoung is many things. He's not just a joker. He likes to tease and have fun, that's an aspect of his character but that's not his entire being. If you limit him to being a haha-funny-clown all the time instead of listening to him, that's quite frankly how you get a Bad End for him. That's the ending where he ignores everything and gives up on being taken seriously while you laugh and demand that he stays a silly persona. People who follow that ending don't care about who he really is.

They want 707.

Not Saeyoung.

Saeyoung deals with this in fandom a lot. I love to poke fun at him and make a joke sometimes, we all do, but at the end of the day, he's more than laughs and giggles.

There's more to him than the mask that he wears. He pretends to be a joker but that doesn't mean that he doesn't have those qualities. That is a part of him but he has forced himself to only show that part of his personality for such a long time. He hasn't allowed himself to be taken seriously. When you come into his life in a positive way, he starts to realize that it's okay for him to let out that serious side.

It's not going to hurt you. It's not going to destroy you. There are parts of himself that he's afraid of and he's hidden them away for such a long time. But, when you give him space and you respect him in the midst of the worst moment of his life, he realizes that he doesn't have to push you away and that he can let out that part of himself that he tried to bury.

I find it a little disheartening myself from time to time when I'm looking for content for him just to read and it turns into something where he's mischaracterized. I don't get to see people writing about him where he's being vulnerable or he's being open with himself very often. It's rough when that's all he really wants... he wants to be seen as himself.

At the end of his route, he tells you that he wants you to see the parts of him that he hasn't let out since he was a child. He says to call him Saeyoung… please don’t just call him Seven… or just Luciel. That was his name and that is his name. He cannot have it taken from him ever again. He wants to love his name... please, say it.

He doesn't want to bury himself anymore and he wants to be seen as all aspects of himself. Sure, he likes to tease you and he likes to make you laugh, but could you take him truly seriously? Listen to what he's saying because there's so much underneath the surface. There's so much that needs to be heard. He deserves to be listened to as he is and that means hearing Saeyoung and nobody else. He's a man with layers and sure, it'll take time to understand him, but you love him. It is worth the time to get to know him.

His true personality is somebody that's driven. He's very to the point when he speaks and when he's talking about something that he's interested in, you can see the light in his eyes. You can see there is a passion burning in his soul when he doesn't have to give up everything all the time.

Being with him isn’t just like being with a kid in a candy store running around with energy we’ve never seen before. It's more like being with somebody who has a genuine curiosity in the world around him and wants to learn as much as you can. He's like a sponge. He soaks up everything and he wants to be able to experience what it's like to be alive. He's not afraid of trying something even if it seems like it might be dangerous.

He wants to have conversations and discussions. He wants to debate things. He wants to be able to be taken seriously when he's talking. He doesn't want people to laugh at him or assume that it's some kind of joke. Even if what he's saying might seem outlandish, he still wants somebody to hear him out and see that there's a point to what he says. He's creative and there's no doubt about that, but if you treat him like everything he says is some kind of game, you're not getting it.

He's hurting. It would be nice for his depression and fears to be taken seriously when he voices them. There's not an expectation on your part to be a therapist or somebody that takes care of him like that, but it would be nice for him to hear for once in his life that he doesn't have to lie about it being okay. It's not okay. He's allowed to say that it's not okay. This is the kind of person that desperately wants to be okay so that nobody else has to feel like that.

He is the kind of person that would sacrifice everything if it meant that his loved ones would be safe. For once in his life, if you could look at him and tell him that everything that he's gone through isn't something that he deserved? Well, it would feel like he's finally been seen.

I don't know why I don't see more people writing about him being somebody that takes you out on a night drive where you both sit underneath the stars and talk about your place in the universe. He can hold a very intellectual conversation about this and it's a shame that he doesn't get this very often. Let him talk about space and what he learned about it! Even I think it would be intriguing to experience that with him and I only care about him platonically.

At the end of the day, I could go on and on about all of the ways that he is his own person in a way that has nothing to do with the Persona that he's been wearing. Yes, we can all agree that the jokester mask is a side of him but it is not the entirety of his being. If you limit him to being just that, then you didn't learn anything.

I feel the same way about people that don't write any of the Saerans with care, either, but I’m biased.

I care a lot about how the twins are represented. I put a lot of thought into how I try to perceive them because I feel like it's important that they have autonomy in what they express they want. I think the hardest thing for me is seeing people misconstrue Saeran’s path of forgiveness or Saeyoung’s choice to be himself.

God, I think the worst thing I’ve seen done to the twins that’s wildly inaccurate is people writing them drinking or engaging with anyone who drinks in close quarters. The two of them will never do that and they'd prefer not to be around it. Saeyoung has expressly stated he doesn’t drink or smoke, and he never will pick up the stuff. Saeran already had a horrible time with the elixir on top of the trauma he experienced from his mother’s alcoholism.

He wants no part of that, either. I get that it might sound a little silly, but as somebody who shares the trauma that they went through, whenever people write them drinking after they have very expressly said that they would never, I get a little upset about it. It feels to me like people who ignore you when you say that you don't want to take a sip of alcohol and try to coerce you anyway.

Anyway, there are a lot of issues in fandoms where characters get flanderized from one or two specific character traits.

Sucks.

[agent-cupcake]

Hey AC! I love your blog and was wondering if I could get your opinion on something. I've seen some people complaining that Ingrid and Hilda are treated by the fandom, with Ingrid stans saying that Hilda is also racist towards Almyrans (which, granted, she is) but doesn't get nearly as much hate about it as Ingrid does. But personally I feel like their attitudes and the way they react towards Dedue/Cyril are wildly different and Hilda generally seems less hateful/irrational about it. Thoughts?

This is... kind of a touchy topic... I like it though! It’s worth discussing, especially since I feel like it’s broke criticism to simply deflect blame onto a character in order to prop up another.  Full and obvious disclosure: I very much dislike Ingrid and very much love Hilda. That said, I don’t think it’s fair to compare them for the sake of which is worse. I fall into the trap of character criticism through comparison far too often and it's not really valid unless you can fully explore each character in their own right beforehand. Which is why, while writing this, I came to the conclusion that the ways these two characters are interpreted and the reason people view their racist tendencies differently has far more to do with the characters themselves than their actual beliefs.

From first impressions to subsequent playthroughs, this is pretty much how I feel about Ingrid: she brings up her hatred of the Duscur people and Dedue unprompted and uncontested several times at the very beginning of the game, putting it front and center to her character. This is important, it sets a foundational component for how I could come to view her. According to her introduction, she is honorable and respectful, a model lady knight trope. But, as mentioned, she's really racist. Literally standing around thinking about how awful it is that Dimitri would trust a man of Duscur because they are all bad people. Yikes. And nobody calls her on it. Again, this is very important for perception. People judge Sylvain for his bad behavior in a much more harsh way than they do Ingrid for her vitriolic loathing for another classmate who we have seen as nothing but respectful. It's weird. And then, despite the fact that her close friend Sylvain was able to reason out that it’s not possible for the Duscur people to be at fault for the Tragedy, despite the fact that the prince of the country she supposedly hopes to serve with unwavering respect and loyalty has made it clear that he does not believe that Dedue or Duscar are responsible for the Tragedy, and despite the fact that Dimitri, her close friend and the one most affected by the Tragedy (seriously, she lost a guy she might have married and he lost his best friend, mother, and watched his father be killed in front of his eyes) continuously insists that neither Dedue nor Duscur are at fault, she loudly and openly believes that the ensuing massacre of Duscur was deserved and Dedue is inherently culpable simply because of his race. Her motivations for this hatred feel even more cheap considering her dogged hero worship for Glenn was born out of the fact that she was promised to him, making the fact that she’d use his death as reason enough for the destruction of countless innocent lives even more unsympathetic in my eyes. I mean, seriously, she was around 13 and he was older than her, how close could they have truly been? Dimitri says they were in love, but she was a child. Abandoning my modern sensibilities about age of consent or whatever, kids at that age don't have the emotional or mental capability. Maybe this is just nitpicking, but I have a very hard time caring about that relationship. But, if her actual justification is because of what happened to Faerghus as a result of the Tragedy and feels duty-bound as a knight to find justice through the systematic destruction of the Duscur people, then it just circles back to confusion considering the future leader of said country doesn't hold Duscur or Dedue responsible. The importance of perception comes in because despite these paper thin excuses and her seemingly willfully ignorant hatred, she is never challenged on her racist beliefs. The reason she seems to change her mind about Dedue and consider that maybe excusing a genocide is wrong stems from guilt that Dedue continuously comes to her aid in battle at the potential cost of his own life. I can understand, to a certain extent, why she might feel the way she does. But, again, I have such a hard time with any justification when nobody that she's close to is even nearly as hateful as her, there is plenty of evidence (evidence that the people close to her have found!) to provide a very reasonable counterclaim to Duscur's guilt, and that none of that even matters when it would require her to openly contradict the prince of her country to make the claim that Dedue was in any way complicit in the Tragedy. Which would be fine if she wasn't established as the model Lady Knight archetype, which also brings us into Ingrid's moral high horse. Admittedly, I hate the Lady Knight trope. I have a significant bias against these types of characters. However, I really do think that this moral crusade is where she lost me completely. Without even a shred of empathy or self awareness, she lectures Sylvain about his shitty behavior even though their circumstances are at least somewhat similar and he has his reasons (bad ones, maybe, but ones worth understanding if she actually cares about him), she lectures Felix about not being interested in knightly endeavors (an aspect of his character that is born of the trauma she has appropriated), and she lectures Claude about behavior that is befitting of a man in his position. Not because she cares about the girls Sylvain is hurting, not because she thinks there are any grave stakes from Felix choosing to do his own thing, and not because she knows that Claude's behavior affects his ability to lead, but because she doesn't like these behaviors and thinks they should be fixed. Yet, at the same time, she believes Dedue deserved to lose his family, country, and culture based on his birth and nobody ever does anything to morally correct her, it is something she eventually is forced to acknowledge on her own. It's frustrating, infuriating even, that the game lets her get away with being so grossly hypocritical. And, all the while, she is being painted as sympathetic. Again, I have a hard time feeling sympathy for her about Glenn, and I certainty don't feel sympathetic towards her issues about marriage because there's never any actual tension there. Of course she won't be forced to marry, she's a Lady Knight. Beyond being unsympathetic, I also find her massively unlikable. Awful design, poor voice direction, food-loving-as-a-personality-trait, the fact that she's written as one of those stock "feminist" characters who hate makeup and girly things until it benefits them, and constantly butting in on other characters to give her opinion without taking any criticism herself are all aspects that I just personally dislike. Ultimately, Ingrid being racist is only a symptom of the many reasons her character is one of my least favorites. Most of these points can be countered by someone who doesn't take issue with the things that annoy me and to point out that Ingrid DOES get over her racist beliefs. It's not fair to say that she doesn't change but, for me, the damage was already done by the time she became tolerable so I still have a hard time appreciating her. My assumption would be that there are a lot of other people who feel similarly to me regarding their dislike of Ingrid so they focus on one easy character flaw, her being racist at the beginning of the game, as a reason to validate their dislike of her overall.

On the other hand, Hilda's racism isn't a main trait of her character. It's related to her overarching character flaws, but she doesn't bring it up unprompted and can actually be pretty much missed without the Cyrill supports. Like you said, Hilda does seem less hateful and irrational, it doesn't take willful malice and an active rejection of reason for Hilda to dislike the Almyrans, they pose a genuine and provable threat to her family and territory, seemingly senselessly testing the borders and throwing away lives for the sake of conquest. To be clear, her "you're not like those OTHER Almyrans" schtick is legitimately nasty. Her behavior is gross and condescending and it really underscores the fact that Hilda is ignorant, lazy, inconsiderate, and incredibly comfortable in her privilege. She accepts what she's been told at face value because she's too lazy to look into it further. Cyrill does tell her she's stupid to think that way, though. Which is satisfying because Hilda in those supports is insufferable, it really highlights the worst aspects of her character, dismissive, manipulative, and very selfish. However, for me, she's also very likeable. I'm not interested in going over my opinions on her like I did with Ingrid as I don’t feel it’s as important to my point but a few reasons I really like her is because I think Hilda has a fantastic design, cute supports, amazing voice work, and is secretly sweet in a way that absolutely tickles my fancy. I am sure many people do not agree with me, which is fine. Additionally, just as Ingrid grows out of her racist beliefs, so does Hilda. They both end the game as more tolerant and caring people. Still, for the same reason a person could argue that Ingrid is actually great and I'm being unfair, they could argue that Hilda is terrible and I'm too biased. That's fair and true..... but I think the fact that Hilda is more generally appealing in conjunction with the less obvious nature of her racist attitude makes people less likely to dismiss her as a racist in the same way they do Ingrid. Unless they dislike Hilda, in which case, it’s all fair game.

Anyyyways, a main takeaway from this is that I highly doubt people are truly arguing on the individual basis of who's more racist, but that they're engaging in the age old waifu war. As with many characters in this game, it's easier to argue moral superiority when you can't quite articulate what you like or don't like about a character. Or, even worse, when you're arguing opinion. Even now, as is clear by reading this, I am arguing my opinion of why I don't like Ingrid. Not because she's racist, but because of the character traits and writing choices that make her unlikable to me. I like Hilda because, flaws and all, I find her to be compelling and enjoyable. From the people that I know, at least, that is basically how the Ingrid stans v Hilda racism argument is structured, even if they dress it up in different language.

By the by Hilda never talks about how the Almyrans deserve to be wiped out. I think that probably sours a lot of people's opinions of Ingrid no matter what happened afterward but that’s fine we can just pretend that didn’t happen

[tequiladimples]

I hope this doesn't come off as rude, but I saw that you dislike when collision is branded het cause you're not het, but no one's talking about you personally? like for me, I really like collision but I can understand the criticism in a way and that isn't an attack on you (or an attack at all lol). again hope I'm not rude but idk it seems unnecessary to get upset, it's better to take it as constructive criticism

sigh i don't think ur rude but it simply isn't constructive.

look i’ll talk abt this one more time n then i Beg we can put it to rest! (this is gna be a lot of word vomit but if i'm elaborative now i hope i won't have to talk abt this ever again)

i’m deeply insecure abt many aspects of collision. i don’t really keep that a secret. i also know some ppl don't like fantasy, some ppl don't like the kinds of dynamics i like, some ppl don't vibe with my style of writing (hell, i barely vibe with my style of writing). those things are fine. i can't control that and i don't take that personally. the reason why this is the one critique i do take personally is because it genuinely presumes wrongful, harmful things about me and my values, especially when i've made deliberate efforts to avoid writing the exact flavor of fic they're accusing me of having written. just because people don’t mean for what they say to reflect back on me, doesn’t stop it from doing so.

the thing about calling something a “het fic” is that the term brings along certain connotations which i don’t stand by at all and feel deeply uncomfortable and distraught to possibly have created. i’ve gone over this godforsaken story again and again just to be absolutely sure i didn’t actually do so. when people say “het fic” they generally don’t mean “boy meets girl and they fall in love”, they mean “super rude and mean boy meets uptight virtuous girl and makes her fall in dependence with him through manipulation and treating her like shit until she behaves how he wants.” and that is straight up not the fic i wrote. i’m not stupid. i know the dynamic i went with is widely and easily misused and there’s a lot of fiction depicting really bad, uneven, unhealthy relationships through it. i knew this going in, and i’ve tried persistently to avoid making those same mistakes. 

skipping over the fact that they’re both boys (bc duh)--harry doesn't exhibit any real manipulative power over louis. collision harry is a grumpy, fruity little nerd who happened upon a really unfortunate lot in life and managed to trick himself into believing he's evil for like half a second of the story and his resolves crumble like a danish pastry the moment he receives his first hug. he's kind of aloof and arrogant, and understandably hardened from his past, but he's not bad. he's just lost. that's the basis of his character arc. now on the other hand, louis has harry wrapped around his finger starting like chapter 4. harry’s the one who opens up emotionally first, harry’s the one desperately seeking louis’ approval and caring about his opinion, harry’s the one who makes himself vulnerable continuously throughout the entire story. the only time louis makes himself vulnerable on a comparable scale is during the smut scenes, and even then, harry is gentle and attentive and puts louis first. louis is less experienced than harry in that area, but he isn't scared or intimidated by harry, and he has full reigns of the progression and nature of their relationship as a whole. that’s kind of how it needs to go with tough x soft dynamics for the power balance to not feel uneven, and i wrote the story accordingly. if you then happen to still be so blindly determined to associate soft/small with weakness (and thereby uh, womanhood ig) that you still felt like louis had an inferior position to harry solely because he is indeed soft/small, that sounds quite frankly like a you problem.

now, the whole point of louis’ character is that he’s underestimated. sure, he’s naive and self-centered and sheltered from the real world--that’s the basis of his character arc. those things all change. but louis isn’t ever weak. like idk who apparently needs to hear this but you can be small and simultaneously not be a pushover. the two aren’t mutually exclusive. there isn’t a single time louis takes shit in this story, especially not from harry; he gives back as good as he gets every time. oh! and then he literally saves the entire universe and the execution of that whole thing was his idea alone. i tried really hard to underline how strong-willed and full of grit he is to contrast what others think of him. if you think he’s portrayed as a meek and frail damsel, you missed the point. once again, i feel like we circle back to this misconception of louis being kind of naive and physically small = louis being inferior = louis being female. just do some soul searching.

(i could also get into the fact that for a bunch of people who don’t know these boys personally (no matter how much we like to think we do), this fandom is weirdly opinionated about characterization. especially regarding sexual stuff. i know creating a version for ourselves of who we think these boys are based on things we recognize in ourselves or things we find endearing is part of the comfort with loving them. but that doesn’t really equate to actually knowing them, and besides, this is fan fiction; no one’s opting to write a biography, anyway. being experimental and explorative and putting different aspects of their personalities in different lightings is what makes fic fun. if someone’s writing harmful or one-dimensional characters, that’s one thing, and preferences is again whatever floats your boat. but the “out of character” argument feels mostly really strange to me. this is a bit of a tangent, though.)

lastly, the thing is that i will and i do take it personally if someone insinuates that a character--a gay character--that i, a lesbian, construed is a secret vessel for expressing heterosexual attraction. if someone calls louis a “self-insert”, that does reflect back on me. and to elaborate on that--i don’t particularly love to bring it up, but it's quite disheartening to pour personal PTSD experiences into a character and rly put effort into doing it right and justice and underline growth and healing, just to find out people disregard all that completely in favor of declaring that my self-projection lies in the attraction to a man--which is to say, the one thing i couldn’t possibly feel more estranged from. it's so incredibly tactless. i feel thoroughly whiny at this point but how is that not supposed to make me a little sad?

anyway. none of this is to say that you can’t dislike or critique collision. you can. sometimes ppl don’t like things. but i hope i’m clear about where i’m coming from with my discomfort now. people’s preferences and dislikes are indeed not mine to be hurt by, but these things are. this definitely got unnecessarily long and i probably look like i take myself unbearably seriously (i promise i don’t), so i’m sorry. but at least i've said everything now, and if i encounter this sort of rhetoric in the future, i have something to redirect people to. also anon, none of this is directly pointed at you, i know you mean well. take care <3