#Also Vash isn't that more human than Knives in trimax at least

[duncanor]

I've seen a lot of folks say Knives is the one to accept his nature as a plant as opposite to Vash who longs to be human but I don't really agree on that.

If anything Knives romanticize it.

(As unfair as it sounds) accepting his true nature as a Plant would mean accepting that he was created to nurture and be consumed in a way or another, and if there's one thing that Knives fear and reject, it's exactly that.

He tried to distance himself so hard from humanity, painting his nature as Godhood, but in the end, he became more human than anyone on NML in all the way he feared and hated.

[threegunbrainrot]

i dont have any trigun mutuals so i'm just gonna ramble my thoughts into the infinite void of tumblr. and im sure others have touched on this same topic but

it almost seems like vash is getting softer with every new installment of trigun? like incredibly consistently and incredibly specifically.

let me explain.

i'll start with tristamp and work backwards; the tristamp vash we all know and love there is incredibly adverse to violence.

more often than not he ACTIVELY refuses to fight and just WON'T draw his gun. this post loosely counted the amount of bullets that he shot throughout all of season 1, and almost ALL of them (like to an insane degree) were dished out against knives, who vash knew was strong enough to take the hit.

the few times vash does draw his gun against a human in tristamp, it's as a blunt force weapon (against the badlads gang and livio, for example) or to disarm others/save someone with ricochet (like shooting the punisher before wolfwood can kill livio).

he just doesn't shoot people. at ALL.

then if we look at 98 trigun, things change drastically.

here, vash isn't afraid to hurt people a little if it means more will be saved in the end. of course he never kills, but he actually shoots people here. not only that...

he holds a casual, sarcastic conversation while pointing his weapon at people.

he constantly shoots at limbs to immobilize people, fires warning shots extremely close to peoples' vitals, and performs several very insane trick shots throughout the show to wound those with armor.

tristamp vash wouldn't even draw, but 98 struts around firing warning shots into the sky and singing about bloodshed for intimidation! i'm not sure there's a single episode where he doesn't shoot someone at least once.

...so what about trimax, then?

(PLOT SPOILERS AHEAD)

he is so. shockingly. violent.

of course he never kills. of course he's still trying to save people, but there's this anger in him that i was completely taken off-guard by reading for the first time.

tristamp vash is so soft he's painful to watch. 98 vash makes a heartbreaking effort to be as silly and nonthreatening as possible, constantly making himself out to be the fool. but trimax?

he's... literally grief-stricken and out for revenge. explicit revenge. he's angry and he's hurt and he lays his intentions out so clearly. he's making THREATS.

seriously:

hunting legato. HUNTING him.

it's not even a matter of drawing his weapon anymore. he does it constantly, and fires just as much. never to kill, but he doesn't joke around the way 98 vash does. the most he'll offer is a sunny smile to reassure others and nothing more.

i'm not that far into the manga, either. i'm sure there's countless more (and probably better) panels to convey this side of trimax vash, but i suppose it also says something that i've found so many panels depicting this so early on.

but the progression of vash's personality is fascinating regardless.

from a tortured, angry loner desperately trying to cling to his morals for rem's sake

to an equally devastated man who devotes himself so completely to acting the role of the fool

and finally to the sad, chronically depressed shell of a person in tristamp who refuses to so much as draw his weapon.

[deludedfantasy]

Trimax Vol 12 Ch 1-4

This volume is extra long so figuring out how to divide this up is tricky. Hopefully, this post isn't too long because I have many, many thoughts about the showdown between Knives and Vash.

Ch 1

Chronica and Domina and honestly the entire Earth fleet present some really fascinating questions about Plants and how things work on Earth. I mean, the implications of something like this having happened before, and being so destructive and unpredictable that Chronica tells Domina not to rely on the data from previous encounters.

Also, the language they use around the data. “We already share all our data.” It’s a very sciencey way of referring to what is basically telepathy, I think. We haven’t had language for how any of this works before and that’s part of where the terror and uncertainty comes from. When Vash accidentally went all rogue angel and anyone touching him got a front row seat to his memories, that was probably “sharing data.” But that kind of clinical description sure as hell wasn’t what it felt like for anyone involved. Then, it felt more akin to the supernatural, to cosmic horror, because it was so unknown and out there. But for these Independents, it’s just sharing data, it’s just what they are and how they work. There’s a split between the level of mysticism that Plants have acquired on No Man’s Land (due to the lack of resources and how heavily they rely on them) and the more (seemingly) scientifically oriented Earth fleet. 

This entire sequence where Vash looks back at his past, everyone he’s helped and fought for, all the enemies he’s faced, is so gorgeous and hard-hitting. He’s steeling himself for the final battle and reminding himself what matters, what he’s fighting for. It’s so telling that the last images are of Rem and Wolfwood. But it’s also telling that we don’t see Wolfwood’s face. Is it because the grief is too fresh? Is it because Vash feels guilty? I’m not sure. But the juxtaposition of a solitary cross among a sea of faces is hard to beat. It’s a punch in the gut. 

And another thing! Razlo and Livio are included when he considers the Gung Ho Guns even though he never fought them directly. But Vash doesn’t place Wolfwood there though he also was very much so one of them. He doesn’t see him as one, Wolfwood has become so much more to him and he’s refusing to acknowledge some of Wolfwood’s last words, that all he is is a monster. 

There’s something about this page that reads to me like a prayer. Vash’s pose, his lowered head, his hand and gun centered, it’s his own form of prayer. To who or what, I can’t say. He’s not asking for anything except strength to reach the end, to protect those tough and tender days he loved so much. 

It hurts me that he doesn’t expect to make it to the end. Tellingly, his hair is almost entirely black here. He’s used up most of his life force. In some ways, I imagine he’s performing some kind of final ritual for himself. He’s reminding himself what he’s fighting for because the person that gave him hope again when he thought all was lost is gone. 

Is the Earth fleet planning on dropping a nuclear bomb on Knives to stop him? Because that’s really what it sounds like. I get that he’s dangerous, but wasn’t the whole point of coming here to help the people on this planet, not kill them? Seems like the Earth fleet aren’t quite the good guys we were hoping they would be. 

But then Knives just disappears! That’s not terrifying at all or anything.

Ch 2

Knives just teleported, a power apparently completely unknown for even fused Independents to have. That’s wild. But also not. He’s probably fused to more Plants than other Independent has before, to the point that his own body is losing shape and he seems to be becoming one of them. It’s weird to say that he’s becoming less human, since he’s always been so focused on not being human, but at least in form he was. Not anymore, and it’s signaling a dangerous change in his power levels. 

Domina experiences a Knives jumpscare, which doesn’t bode well for her. It’s never a good thing when Knives suddenly appears in your mind. 

Panic and fear for your life can make people do insane things, but truly shooting guns into the air at a massive airship that is far above the city is such an incredibly useless and stupid thing to do. 

Knives did say he had enough power to reach past the boundaries of the planet. But man, that’s horrifying. He took complete control of another Independent. He fused with her like he was originally thinking of doing with Vash. He spoke in her voice and everything, even convinced Chronica that it was Domina for a moment. That’s…really scary. Can you imagine if he had done that to Vash? 

Knives straight up doesn’t have anything resembling a body anymore. He’s getting into biblically accurate territory here. The body horror is real. 

Also, I’m not surprised that he calls Chronica and Domina slaves of humans. He’s always looked down at Vash for helping them and living among them. Of course he’d say even worse things for the ones actively working with humans in their military. Though I’m still curious how much actual choice Chronica or Domina had in taking this assignment and becoming part of this crew.  

Ch 3

Sometimes I forget Trigun is actually scifi. But now we have a spaceship battle! Though I’d actually argue Trigun is sci-fantasy but that’s another discussion entirely. 

I’m still not over the fact that Knives fused with another Independent and is using her like a puppet. Like, that’s a terrifying capability for Independent Plants to have. Imagine what else he could do like that. Imagine if he had Vash’s power behind him. Imagine if Vash had decided to do something like that. Truly, I can’t put into words how horrifying that is. I’m not surprised anymore that humans would find a way to alter Independents so they can’t do that. 

Shooting straight into the air when there’s nothing to hit up there really isn’t a smart move. But people are scared and aren’t known for thinking straight in those circumstances. 

I have to agree with Luida here. I don’t like how quiet the military is considering how adamant they were about fighting back earlier. That doesn’t bode well at all. 

Vash fired his angel bullets at Knives! They kinda look like a black hole in the form of a bullet.

His power and accuracy remain unmatched. He’s way too far away from Knives for his gun on its own to have the power to reach him. That means he’s using his Plant powers to gain more speed and distance. 

It also looks like he severed the threads connecting Knives to Domina. Or disrupted them? It’s hard to tell, but either way, he’s showing his hand and letting Knives know he’s here, and he’s not going to let him get away with his plan.

Ch 4

It strikes me that we’ve never seen Vash openly use his powers like this before. He might move inhumanly fast and dodge attacks that would kill most people but he hasn’t actively created gates and used them against people. His powers don’t work with his version of pacifism. Add to that his fear of them and what they’re capable of, and it’s no wonder he never used them.

Things have changed now. He’s throwing that aside now. He’s not on the defensive anymore. He’s not scared of himself either. He’s got nothing left to lose and he’s going to throw everything he has at Knives because he has to protect humanity (and everything Wolfwood fought to protect). 

But also, his face here. It’s empty, slightly unhinged. He chooses this moment to put his glasses on. Is he hiding? Putting up a shield? Or is he actively turning himself into diablo, the angry avenger he keeps inside himself? Either way, there’s just something cold and entirely unlike the Vash we know in these panels. Including the very antagonistic way he’s talking to Knives, which is also quite a change. He’s done trying to reason with him. He’s finally realized there’s nothing he can say that will stop him. All they can do is fight until there’s only one man left standing. 

Knives has also decided he’s done with Vash. If he’s so willing to attack him, Knives is done trying to protect him. But even as he says that, Knives covers his face. Like he can’t stand to see his brother’s death. He knows he has to do this for his mission to succeed, but deep down, he hates it. Now I’m wondering if that’s why Vash put his glasses on too. To give himself that barrier between himself and the death of his brother. Because I maintain that no matter how much Vash said he was out to kill him for revenge, until this moment, his actions said that he didn’t truly mean it. 

“I’m disappointed. I don’t even want to see your corpse.” Knives, that’s—that’s a lot. He wants to destroy Vash so utterly, there’s nothing left of him. But he’s lying to himself again, because I don’t think it’s about how Vash still fights like a human, so he’s disgusting and beneath Knives and deserves a destructive death. It’s about not wanting to see the dead body of the brother he would’ve done literally anything to protect. 

Vash’s hair is getting blacker and blacker by the page and it’s hurting me deeply. He doesn’t care about surviving at all. There’s just Knives and him. 

Interestingly, when Knives realizes that Vash has fashioned his powers into bullets, he becomes complimentary again. He’s basically thinking, “Well, at least you finally put your powers to good use.”

But Vash says no. He’s accepted who and what he is, he’s accepted his power, but at the end of the day, he’s still just a gunman. He’s a simple man fighting to protect what he loves. He is not “other” like Knives. He’s part of this world and he’s fighting to protect it. Vash reaffirms his beliefs and who he is before Knives and that’s really, really powerful.

[hikennosabo]

trimax vol 11 random thoughts

we're back to 6 chapters in this volume, huh!

i dont know if i'm ready for this, i still feel emotionally caught up in volume 10. but as always, i must press onward.

chapter 1:

CHAPEL JUMPSCARE?!?! WHY DOES THIS VOLUME OPEN WITH A SCENE OF CHAPEL. I THOUGHT WE WERE DONE WITH YOU!!!! GO AWAY!!!!

and we're back to legato!! yay!!! i feel like i haven't seen him in forever!! he's looking a little worse for wear...

HELPPPP HSDKLJFDKLSFJS SHE'S SO MEAN TO HIMMMM

"there's no reason why i shouldn't just kill you" SHE'S SO MEAN!!!!!

it's really such a funny dynamic and i agree that legato is very bullyable but where does this hostility come from, actually? does she view legato as a rival for knives's attention? does she just think he has rancid vibes? it seems kinda one-sided too, legato hasn't expressed the same degree of annoyance regarding elendira... or we haven't really seen what he thinks of her at all, iirc? he just kind of ignores her goading... which honestly makes this dynamic funnier LMAO

and now we cut to--wait, LIVIO CAN DRIVE?! ...actually, now that i think about it, he probably drove chapel around, right? chapel probably couldn't drive in the condition he was in...

WHAT'S WITH THE SWANKY-ASS CAR, THOUGH???

i am happy to see brad again. i am always happy to see brad

^ me when i see brad

vash is clearly so so so tired. he decided to trust livio because he trusts wolfwood who trusted livio, but he's also mad about it. he's still very raw and very angry with livio i think. and also just fed up with this conversation in general lol. he's low on patience.

"at least let me punch him," says brad, after he already did it! livio would take the punch either way, he thinks he deserves to get punched... (ourgh...) but if you're going to ask for permission, do it beforehand!

i've been physically holding myself back from making more ff7 comparisons than i have already, but this is not making it easy. also y'all are literally in a narrative i know this shit is NOT going to work.

knives using his sisters as a shield... again... well, maybe "using" isn't the right word in this case. i actually expected him to destroy the cannon, but his expression... he knew it wouldn't fire.

i'm wondering about the plants' will now... how much self-awareness do they have? is it like, collective? are they more of a hivemind compared to the independents? ummm... hmmm... uuuummmm... i still feel like i don't know enough about plants!!

also does this mean they could have refused to fuse with knives if they didn't want to? not like knives is a stranger to using force, but in the scene where he fused with that first plant, he did ask... ummm... gaahhhh... my soupy brain...

i don't remember who in stampede said non-independent plants don't have free will... but it's an assumption everyone in this world seems to have been operating on...

"it's possible that the plants could rebel against humans. if that's the case, then there's no way humanity could survive." <- yeah no kidding! so you gotta be niceys to them!

chapter 2:

i'm apprehensive about the earth humans arriving, they're gonna make this situation even more complicated...

YOU'D BEST START BELIEVING IN SCIENCE FICTION, NAMELESS RANDO, YOU'RE IN ONE

UUAAAGH MERYL AND MILLY :( one of them (i can't tell who's talking) mentions her family... ARE their families okay?? hmmm... if they were, they'd probably be in this city, right? so i guess not... or maybe the situation is just too chaotic to find them even if they are in the city.

we never learned that much about meryl and milly's families, but i liked what we did get. that bit all those chapters ago, which touched on meryl's feelings about her own family (jeez that was FOREVER ago?!)... i thought it gave an interesting dimension to her.

THE REUNION.. CAN I GET A HUG?? CAN I PLEEEAAAASE GET A HUG??

oh holy shit he is giving MAAAAJOR sephiroth vibes here and i love it. he is beautiful and terrifying. and he's losing his shape... a physical representation of him losing himself...

and the ark itself is giving... something... i don't really know what to make of this grotesque display. it's... a lot.

chapter 3:

actually, what are the earth humans planning on doing exactly. are they gonna gather everyone up and ferry them back to earth? provide resources and technology so they can continue living on noman's land? i mean obviously we have to deal with knives first but what about after that?

OH?! BRAD TO THE RESCUE?! UNEXPECTED BRAD & LIVIO FRIENDSHIP?!

girl me too.

of course she immediately picked up on what really happened, not like brad's lie was any good to begin with...

OH, CUTE!!! what's in vash's coat! a lil figurine... what else does he have. the communicator pen, a swiss army knife, a key, the coin case... and some miscellaneous things...

"to tell you the truth, it wasn't a priority of mine" about the coins... it wasn't a priority of the author either dw

BRAD LIVIO FRIENDSHIP CUTE CUTE CUTE CUTE CUTE!!!! i love this, brad is trying so hard...!! he's so sweet... this is not a friendship i expected but i'm loving it so much!!!

:( vash crying over marlon's words to him is making me feel a type of way. it's something he needs to hear, but...!! "i don't know what else to do..." asking for help is easier said than done... he doesn't know how. i can relate...

and now we get... a big explosion and...!!!!

YES.... YES!!!!! LEGATO!!!!! MY SWEET (not an adjective that describes him in the slightest) LITTLE (also not an adjective that describes him) BAGWORM HAS FINALLY EMERGED FROM HIS COCOON!!!! i missed you so much honey i can't wait to see what fucked up shit you do next <3

oh also zazie's been cut in half. ehhh they'll be fine.

chapter 4:

oh fuck. this concept has been knocking around in my head for a while, and now it's been confirmed canon... it's never quiet for him anymore...

baby knives!!!!!! :(

someone: "you're nonbinary? but what's in your pants though?" zazie:

okay but jokes aside 1. GROSS!!!, 2. would this have even worked? legato and elendira recognize the danger so maybe it would have, 3. zazie says "we will use your powers for our purposes" which is... what? eliminating the humans, i suppose, and then... what?

huh... wait... is this how his powers worked all along or is this a new thing?? it's a new thing, right??

carve strings?? out of iron?? with what, his bare hands??? and he's moving by... puppeteering... himself?? that's... insane. i'm impressed.

i actually love seeing him up and moving around again, but i guess this means i can't call him a bagworm anymore... initially i called him a jolly rancher (because of his hair color in stampede and also because my friend called him "chewable"), then he changed to bagworm... which i guess was an upgrade since at least bagworms are alive?! i need another weird pet name for him. maybe i should just call him a moth now...

he's sitting like a frog :)

and he's imbuing the bullets with his power...! i see, that's how he defeated that big guy 2 chapters ago! ...and then livio startles him so much he leaves a hole. i'm sobbing.

handsome!!!! also "new hair, new outlook" hits different when it comes from vash, huh?

i am not gonna lie, the coin case has been such a nonentity in this story that i was temporarily VERY confused because i forgot it had come with the other halves already in the case.

also... elendira doesn't get one? why? is it because it's legato's game? so she refused to play... because she hates him...? LOL

and then. a random guy shows up. and gives them the last coin. why. listen nightow i know your initial plan for the coins went out the window and you need to wrap up this plot point now but like. is this REALLY the best you could do? LMAO

chapter 5:

oh boy... so much information here... the sudden reveal of another independent... and what to glean from all this about the relationship between plants and humans on earth... aaahghgh i wanted more information about this but now i have to wrap my head around it!! aaaaghh... my soupy brain...

"our generation was wired with neural blocking programs"... to prevent them from fusing? or is there more to it? hmmm. this is giving like. sci-fi advanced AI vibes. with a program that blocks them from going terminator. except the plants are made of flesh. or something. i'm... not sure how to feel about it, honestly.

i love seeing vash and livio being silly together. lord knows we need what silliness we can get.

vash going to press the switch and livio freaking out about it is SOOO funny BUT meryl DID tell vash that there were no explosives in the coin case. so he could've pressed it!!!

why is he flirting.....

i'm joking but also i'm not. but i think the only way these two would actually kiss is if they were playing a game of gay chicken.

...but come on, "let's kill each other, just the two of us"?? buddy...

also his uh... companion... helper...? is here...? is this the same one that was assisting him when he was a bagworm? ????? i still have no idea what they are or what to make of them.

?!?!?!?! RUDE?????

i mean she IS a bitch but i'm saying that as a COMPLIMENT. a compliment!!! as in "my wife is a bitch and i love her so much"!!! BUT VASH IS BEING RUDE!!!!

uagh, i had to post the full page, this is so lovely. i like seeing vash and livio bond; it looks like vash is warming up and happy that his choice to trust livio is paying off. and livio is trying really hard to live up to that. they both feel the impact wolfwood had on the two of them... it's very sweet.

this exchange is SO funny. just doing some diy with explosive items :)

uhhh, something something humanity's relationship with god!

right, this happened in the final fight in 98. "he cancelled me out..."

oh my god, FINALLY a fucking HUG around here!!!!!

they're sweet. :( also we need more hugs in this manga. EVERYONE needs a hug. what we really need is a big cuddle pile.

so much buildup... i'm scared. chronica turning off her "limiter program"... is this the same thing that prevents plants from fusing or is it something else? what is she gonna try doing?? ughhh, the apprehension is killing me...

chapter 6:

she's so cute... and she's soooo... COOOOL!!!!!

i love elendira, she is really cool and strong and funny, but... we don't really know anything deeper about her. what makes her tick? why is she following knives? are we gonna get a backstory? i wanna know everything about her!! i've wanted to know since her introduction!!!

and of course livio can live through getting impaled so many times. that's NOTHING to him. and his interaction with the kids is cute. and his reunion with jasmine is sweet. not going to say aaaanything about nightow's inconsistent timeline again...

actually no, i lied just now. it would be one thing if he had just... changed his mind midway though the manga and then stuck with it. but he's ACTIVELY going BACK AND FORTH on this. "six years" was LESS THAN 10 CHAPTERS AGO but if it still holds true then jasmine should NOT be this old. these chapters were published WITHIN THE SAME YEAR. RRAAAAAGHHGHGH

*cough* anyway. livio is such a big sweetie... i never disliked him, but my impression of him has changed. in stampede i didn't really know what to think of him. he didn't have a personality, he was just brainwashed. and his manga self was stoic and cool before. which... didn't seem like it was brainwashing, necessarily? i don't know?? maybe it was just an act he was putting on. he went goober mode as soon as the fight was over. perhaps no longer being beholden to EoM allowed him to embrace his inherent silliness. i liked his cool and stoic self but i LOVE his big silly teddy bear self. he's so... uwah. he makes me smile.

now that we're getting closer to the end i'm getting impatient... i feel the urge to just read the rest of it all in one go... but i mustn't... i must show restraint...!!!

[revenantghost]

your posts on tristamp got me thinking about smth again ((and idk if you've talked about this already, but anyway))

the existence of the files on vash and knives is so strange to me??? if we're to believe that rem meant to hide their existence as independent plants ((based on her telling knives not to use his powers in front of other humans)) then why create files that outs them as plants?? and if it wasn't rem who created them then who?? BILL??!! it scratches my brain...

but yea crazy...ALSO I love your bookclub posts OUGH YOUR BRAIN <3

I haven't talked about it! BUT, OH, I'VE THOUGHT ABOUT IT!!!

Not enough to make any post on it other than general confusion but boy, I think you're onto something. I'm gonna put this under a cut for some Trimax spoilers that Tristamp has foreshadowed will come to pass, so might actually be Tristamp spoilers (but this is Orange, they surprise me at every turn, so WHO KNOWS)

It's very plausible Conrad made those files.

We know that Knives knows Conrad from before the big fall as seen in episode... eleven? Where we see Tesla's eye on Knives's wrist. And knowing all the shenanigans the twins get up to, Knives probably accidentally woke everyone up again like he did in Trimax. And Conrad stayed behind to meet them after all of his regrets with Tesla (as seen in him collapsing when Knives shows up with that eye).

But that fucker. He has a picture while standing next to Tesla in his office to this day while ADVOCATING FOR GENOCIDE. Morals? Basic human decency? He sure as hell doesn't know them. He knew Tesla, it's hinted that he was at least fond of her, maybe loved her like a daughter in Tristamp, and even made some sort of fucked up replacement of her in Elendira. And he still let her become that tortured, tormented mess in those test tubes. He still let her stay "ALIVE," even though plants can obviously die.

Yes, Rem's access code gave them entry into those documents, but that doesn't mean she created them in the first place. Rem sure as hell isn't faultless in all this, but this strikes me as Conrad's m.o.

Legit gasped alive and came to the same conclusion before I even read you suggesting it was this asshole so LMAO GREAT MINDS??? Sorry if this is nonsensical, I just gasped and started typing.

Oh man, I feel like I'm making more shitposts than anyone or anything else in bookclub asdlkjansdlkjn But I'm happy you're enjoying the bookclub insanity :D <3

[collieii]

thinking abt how stampede handles wolfwoods introduction compared to other versions, and to me it kind of fails in a way. one of the big things about wolfwood's character is that he's kind right? he's a good person who was forced to be cruel. they show his soft side by having him interact with kids. it plays out a little differently depending on version, but essentially he sees some kids having a rough time and sacrifices smth (money or food) so they can be more comfortable. its esp poignant in trimax where they were literally stealing from him so it would be understandable if he got mad, but he isn't at all. and this follows the scene of him haggling with the driver, so we know for a fact that wolfwood is not in a good place.

meanwhile in stampede, the the kid wolfwood interacts with is zazie? and at the end of the ep its revealed that they know each other, that wolfwood is working with knives, etc. so it just makes that earlier scene look like a setup, at least thats how it seemed to me the first time i watched the ep.

it also feels a little less genuine than the moment wolfwood had with the kids in the other versions, i'm not sure why. maybe it's because the scene goes by too fast. or because of how different wolfwood is in stampede (he’s so much meaner than his past versions!) so the kindness we see here is just. obscured by how bitchy he is in half of his other scenes. if i'm to believe wolfwood is a good guy, i need to see him be good sometimes idk?

vash's comment about him being good in ep 4 is so jarring to me because it feels like he has zero reason to say that. ik it's maybe not supposed to be 'reasonable' since he doesn't even give an actual reason aside from the ~his eyes~ thing which is not logical at all lmao, just based on vibes. and i do sort of trust that vash has good instincts and can tell when a person is trustworthy or not based on vibes. but when i watched it as someone unfamiliar with the original trigun, unaware who wolfwood was, i was confused as to why exactly vash decided to trust wolfwood aside from maybe his general faith in humanity. the nicest thing wolfwood does is give the kid a lollipop which is sweet but in this context it doesn't have the same effect as giving him his money or smth (and as i said the effect is kinda retroactively belied by the fact that its zazie, not some rando he has no connection too). 

to be fair, his intro scene serves other purposes in stampede. we learn about wolfwood's past in the orphanage, which is important to introduce because his arc with livio is addressed later in the season. it also ties into vash's new internal conflict in stampede about eating and self flagellation and stuff. but that ends up being kinda detrimental to the scene too? instead of saying something normal to the kid that makes us go ‘aww hes good with kids!’ it literally just feels like he’s talking to vash, which he would not be because wolfwood has known vash for 5 minutes atp. obviously im not expecting stampede to copy the scene from the manga or 98, but the fact that they included an analogue of it means to me that they're obviously aware of how important it is to wolfwood's character. still, they managed to execute it in a way that sort of fails to communicate something i personally consider fundamental to his character in any version.

[riftclaw]

i feel like adding some thoughts to this actually-- i think stampede is vastly inferior to the manga. i should not have read the manga before i watched stampede. i have a LOT of thoughts about stampede that a lot of people i've discussed them with Do Not Like but here's a few

the plot is super rushed and the characters have no room to breathe. 98 was mostly "filler" but what people call "filler" is usually important character building arcs-- its why milly and meryl spend so much time travelling with vash as his story is slowly revealed in the manga. instead of that we get a subdued, nearly emotionless vash (there's no contrast to his depression so he's not even like. entertainingly depressed, just depressed), a wolfwood who's way too open about his past, and a meryl who is just... like. they invented a man to make her wrong all the time.

the voice direction is really dull in both languages which probably contributes to everyone feeling so out of character

we've rapid fire used up like 80% of the characters and plot points already with no room for them to have any emotional impact. we're using a bunch of them, great! except they're really watered down and flat, bc they're mostly just there for you to go "oh! it's this guy!!!". it isn't faithful and when you care about some of their arcs (livio) having it wasted the way it is feels kinda bad. yes they're going to bring livio back we all know this but also. do i want them to at this point.

a lot of important plot points were really mangled, like taking a lot of Rem's bonding moments w the twins and instead making them Vash and Luida ones, so we barely see Rem and the idea that she had much of an impact on Vash's psyche is honestly kind of laughable

they made knives as generically evil as 98 did but they don't have the excuse of running out of time as 98 appears to have done. they kinda shoehorn in the plant thing later on but it's clear stampede as a narrative is treating regular plants as something substantially lesser than the twins, so even knives is ok letting them become collateral damage

other knives thoughts but this post puts it into words more eloquently than i can

i actually like knives in the manga

vash esp has no agency in most of the series, and he barely even uses his gun so why are they even calling him "the stampede", he hasn't done anything to warrant it and even the humans know this bc knives was RIGHT THERE at jenora rock. even blowing up july is something someone else did to him (which wasn't the case in the manga)

speaking of jenora rock that was one of my absolute favourite parts of the manga and like, they clearly aren't going to do that so

the tomas

the plants themselves have lost all the angel themes that made the plants in the manga so iconic. they're just space elves. this also makes the twins' wings really out of place.

and like. it's not all bad. zazie and the bugs fucking rule. but i probably shouldn't have read the manga first bc i can't look at stampede and not find it wanting considering how much richer the plot in trimax is. and it sucks! bc trimax would be fantastic animated, the fight scenes especially would be incredible in motion, but. we're just. not getting trimax animated. we're getting something more generic w superficial trigun branding.

unless they REALLY blow season 2 out of the water (and i don't expect this at all considering season 1) it's definitely my least favourite adaptation of the two animes. 98 is far from perfect but at least it kept the balance of tragedy and comedy that makes vash hit so hard as a character. the entire point is that he's a muppet dumbass who cries over spilled milk while also being a supremely accomplished gunman. tristamp didn't make him either of these things.

OKAY so having now finished stampede (watching with a friend who was a big fan of the original for a long time) i have... Opinions. based off other conversations i've had, it seems like people who were fans of the original (especially the manga) are a lot less likely to enjoy stampede, but obviously my sample size is pretty small SO i'm gonna use the power of democracy

this question is NOT abt whether you liked stampede as like, a show in general, it's about whether you like it as an adaptation of trigun specifically.