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away-ward · 6 months ago

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"I think you're on to something with Michael and Emory both seeing what the group needs and how people can be used. Maybe that's how they bond. And Emmy has time to sit and observe them up close, but I think even then she's just natural at understanding people."

yeah this. I'm ngl, i understand how people love to find the similarities and compare emory with damon, but i've always been on my michael x emory mastermind family and friends agenda, alright. I know many people dont like michael, but hear.me.out. I think because temperament wise, D & E matches and are pretty similar to each other on a surface level, readers tend to confuse them being the most similar with each other, but vision and role wise? Personality? Goals in life? Interests? The way they look at the systems around them? The way they handle their conflicts in life?

Damon and Emory could not be any more different than each other! And their differences in everything was clearer as we get to will's pov in nightfall, and we came to the conclusion that to a certain extend, one was an enabler, and one was an usurper. This shows their thoughts, words, beliefs and actions' patterns. What made them an enabler? An usurper? How does will come to that conclusion? Only two traits bring them back to be similar: dominance and aggression. But nothing else beyond that because the way they want and vision their life to be are very different from each other. Damon wnating his friends and banks, emory wanting the best for everyone and settle down his responsibilities towards education, caring duties and career first. (Their financial background does play in this factor, but hey, michael and kai were from rich families too, they werent acting all entitled towards their inheritance and life like damon. Much to think about). And Despite being angry and hopeless, emmy still put one foot in front of the other, visioning whats her future gonna be like. But damon want to be in hell, he doesnt give a fuck about anything else, even his company was started out of nowhere, he didnt even have the skills to know that people would want to pay for his labor's services, and when he fucks up too much, he didnt know how to reconcile with all that. Only promised that he'll make sure he deserves them later. D & E are so different, i was always confused when they relate one with the other. I believe, much to the disgrace of a lot of readers, damon was more similar with rika than he was with emory, or even banks.

Thats why it's also infuriating to me when readers said damon and will married the girl version of each other, because did we read the same books? What about will and winter, and damon and emory is the same to a T? This is Penelope Douglas we're talking about, they're not shy to write raunchy sapphic, polyamorous, dubious relationships. If they wanted a gay relationship between Damon and Will to happen, it wouldve happened, but the text always made it clear that theyre not into each other like that because of what they wanted the most in life, and also because damon only use sex to control people. Not until winte then he felt like he can just enjoy sex without pain. And now in this bonus, even Kai called him out for it. Not even will, his #1 bff had the power to change that. And will had years by his side, but this winter pops out of nowhere, and fix that for him in such a short amount of time (which emmy also knows that winter's the ony way to damon, interesting). I'm not even a fan of winter, but even i can't say that theres anyone else who would fit to be damon's lover or even anyone else in this series because they all have their very specific wants in their partners that they couldnt find anywhere else. Not even their best friends can fill in the rika, banks, winter snd emory-shaped holes in their lives. Ofc, fanon interpretations are allowed, so wtv. Damon and Emory has no similarites other than 1. Theyre in the same family for the same call of void, 2. They love will very much, 3. They had a very sad backstory that impacted their plots, and 4. Theyre grumpy on the exterior, dominant and aggressive. But even point 4 is debatable, because even though emory is dominant and aggressive, she is still pretty amicable to people as long as those people are or can be usefull to her or her higher motives.

Do recall her first interactions with Alex, Aydin, Micah, Rika in the present time. She saw what they can do for her, and she wasnt sorry at all to use them. I like that her character can be questionable sometimes, and i even like it when Alex called emmy a manipulative monster, because just like michael, i never saw something wrong with that. This is a dark romance with fucked up people who do want they want, who think they actions and words justify their ideas and beliefs, in an ugly way, why can't we see the potential of emmy being someone else's monster? And her not even denying alex? I was screaming!!! Because Isn't that cool? That she's not just this pure innocent nerdy girl from the town? Finally after 3.5 books, we actually see a dominant questionable FMC in this series. Let FMCs and women be morally grey!! She's a fictional dark romance character, let her be slimy AF just like the men in the series! Let her bully her lover! Let her use and support that serial killer and the son of a terrorist! Let her be friends with that same leader you hate (michael/aydin)! Emory Scott was not a morally righteous person, let her do her thing, and enjoy the ride. This is also why I like it when she was dealing with the police' questioning and reaffirming will about their family in fire night. It's for this reason. And noticed how michael didnt care what she did? Because he knew she did it for them! We need more questionable FMCs in literature, pleasee.

Now, coming back to damon and emory, i cannot deny, D & E both did make up to each other's strength, weaknesses and quality of what they want at work. That's why their partnership work very well. But that's where their pesonalities' similarities end (other than the ones i listed).

Onto my Michael x Emory family and friends masterminds agenda, M & E are like leader x architect mastermind. Theyre always in the position to either lead, or in an active stance, unlike kai, will, rika or winter. Damon and banks did fluctuate between passive and active depending on what others needs, but michael and emory's the pioneer. They're the front and center. Their opinions and decisions are usually what shape their current situations or the final say in a discussion. Their approach towards strategising is more hollistic, and it touches pretty much all aspects of their life. What i meant by that is their leadership, opinion and building of something doesnt just revolve around their work, but it also shapes the dynamic of the group, the role they or others play in their family, and they execute their role very well. Michael more so a leader than emory was. But i 100% believe than unlike damon, if emory actually wanted to take over michael's position, she could. She's an usurper, i dont think she'll just let michael have it easy if she didnt agree with something. And this is beyond like banks and michael bantering because they have some weird tension and families' companies. Emory actually do have input on what they do, and she is known to have a say in things, that other might not agree with.

another interesting thing about michael and emory's interaction with the people around them is, Being around people like M & E can make you feel like you're a fish in the water, not only you're breathing, but you feel at home, because when they disagree with you, it feels like youre being chided or corrected or shamed, but them being by yourside made you feel good about yourself. This part of M & E are not always explicit though, but you can see the implicit text by observing the reactions of how people react to their words and actions. Like how rika, kai, damon snd will reacted to michael's approval, help or disappointment, like how will, damon, aydin, alex, micah and rory reacted to emmy's actions and disagreements. Their words and actions have very impactful rippling effect on people unlike the rest. You can actually feel like you can achieve or be who you want to be, or where you want to Be with them. As if they knew where your wrong or right on your path to somewhere. I think rika, kai and will felt that with michael, and will, aydin and others felt that with emmy. We dont see much of others but we know that this is can be possible especially after ten years. Because their personality revolves not only being visionary, but them being accustomed to the system around them, made them able to have the ability to execute their plans to get what they want. Emmy doing all that in nightfall to support her grandma, to get a degree and a job, to have aydin's ally, to be friends with micah and rory, to borrow rika's items, to have someone by her side with alex, to offer herself to them sll in that train. "Nothing wrong if she just give in to what you want". Michael too with rika, with his nba career, to stay loyal with his friends, to open that resort, and many more. Can you see the vision, KO? (Pun intended)

M with the horsemen and later on with all the addition to their family, and E with the guys at blackchurch, and later with their big family, making decisions around them, finding what fits best for them etc. They both knew what was important to their values in life, and how to keep the family up, and it's not only within the group, but also to match the system outside of their family, like their potential allyship with khadirs and morreaus, enemies with ilya evans martin trevor, police system when they cause mischief around town, third and significant places of/in the town like the tower, church, cathedral, resort, etc. M & E knew the vision, what and how to preserve, and how to polish or do better so that they can move forward and profit more. This Doesnt mean that theyre better than the rest but this was where their strength lies best as compared to rika, banks, kai, damon, winter and will who took care about rules, state policies, morales (in private and in public) or tradition, They all take care of each others strength and weakness like this.

Unlike the majority of the fandom, i Never saw how D & E can be similar other than the ones listed above, but M & E? They've always been pretty similar, i believe. If not their background, it's the way they move. I still believe that Emmy is smarted than Michael but Michael is more intuitive than Emory. Hence why i think michael understand will's need for something more, above and beyond. Not like damon who he knew will didnt need alex. But michael would know WHY will needed emory. Someone that not only makes him see what's up there, but also someone who can take him up there to see what he's made of. Sounds similar to how michael made rika feel huh? The difference is that michaelrika just wanted to feel and discover something unknown, outside of their monotonous privileged life, but willemmy wants to use whatever unknown path in the light and dark to ACHIEVE something bigger, better, something above what they already knew about themselves. MichaelRika felt like an idea or a calling, but WillEmmy is like the tough final destination executioner, with KaiBanks as the strong steady pillar, and DamonWinter as the whimsical storytellers and dreamers of the group. WillEmmy would be the final destination executioner that wraps up all of their unknowns, where they gather the ideas, pillars and dreams from others and then set up a more structured, efficient and profitting path that benefits their families and everyone, knowing when and where to anticipate people like how they always deal with everyone. and i believe that was how they build their world when i finished the series then, I always get this feeling from these couple. This bonus just strongly reaffirmed my opinions about them building things together. WillEmmy "we build thunder bay together now, Em"! Exactly! Now they know what theyre made of!

side note: Made me also think about Rika and Emory's interaction throughout the series, and from that bonus from banks' pov, emory IS a steady, firm and strong support system for their family. Like a big sister. Like a pillar. That's why i also believed that nightfall should come before kill switch so that sensitive matters like rika's pregnancy can be handled better if she had a stronger, mature and steadier female presence and support system by a big sister like emmy, who's love is always flowing and very unyielding. I just knew that emmy would know how to breach this topic with rika and she would spoil them all always. That bonus really just showed that even in a short period of time, she was a very adoring and doting sister to everyone. Banks just didnt realised that emmy loved her the same way she did with rika because of her insecurities. Now this made me crave a rika, banks, winter and emory get together! What would they do on the weekends or for fun, huh?

Anyway, back to my M x E agenda, It's interesting too because at one point, i had the thought of switching michael's life with emmy's and i wonder, if emmy grew up like michael, how different or similar would she think, act, lead, follow etc. and how would michael react if he grew up like emmy. Sex and gender swap included. Because the very big differences for them would be their dinancial status and physical strength to overcome their abusers. Hmmm? How long would they take since by the end of nightfall, michael still havent killed evans, but martin's dead. And between michael and emory, emory was more likely to use physical violence than michael. Interesting, no? out of all the horsemen, michael and kai were the most class conscious. Like they knew how the system around them works, and only people who knows how system works can get far in life. damon and will had a late awakening, due to whatever things they were going through or enabling themselves with, but michael and kai were pretty clear-headed. Emory was clear-headed too. Making tough decisions was her forte. Again, the M x E crossover. But how would their class consciousness impact them if they swap realitues and sex/gender?

idk i havent think that far, but it's something that interests me now. What do you think of all these, KO? What do you think were similar or different about michael and emory? Or even other horsemen with her? I fully believe what alex said in emmys car at that cove scene was very important. In chapter three about what alex and the family needs. And emory knew it too, she just cant have it. Them.

but vision and role wise? Personality? Goals in life? Interests? The way they look at the systems around them? The way they handle their conflicts in life?

I totally get what you’re saying (I think). The thing about Emory and Michael is that they can see the blueprint.

Michael, as Kai said, is like The Builder. He sees how all the parts of something make the whole. How their strengths and weaknesses balance each other, who can hold what load, and where they need reinforcement.

Emory (an architect that can actually read blueprints, so it’s just funny in literal and figurative sense), does the same with people. She can destruct them, see how they fit together, and move forward based on that.

However, Damon, like Michael and Emory, is not without the ability, he just uses it differently. He sees life like a chessboard; people are just pieces to move. That takes understanding how people work, who has what power, where is their weakness, what holes are they leaving unprotected.

But going back to your point.

Reading this first point, I realized how true it is that Emory and Michael share a lot of the same traits. They’re both determined, realizing what they’re good at from an early age, set a goal, and took a path to achieve that goal. They were both able to make careers out of something they loved, despite all obstacles – family, financial, or otherwise. The only other person who shares this quality with them - knowing from a young age what they wanted to do and finding a way to do it - was Winter.

Additionally, the way that Michael allowed Evans to stay alive at the end of Nightfall to take care of his mother sort of echoes the way Emory let her grandmother stay with Martin. Both were on the condition that the person they’re letting off the hook is going to take care of the person they actually care about. At the same time, Emory acknowledges that a part of her loved her brother, at least the memory of him. And while Michael doesn’t want to take another person away from his mother, there might still be a part of him that wishes things could be different between him and Evans. At the very least, both Michael and Emory wanted their abuser to leave them be, without wanting to take revenge for the abuse.

Both were aware of class differences. I think Michael, aware of his privilege might have admired, or even envied, Emory because she had to fight for everything she got. Every accomplishment, every bright of recognition; none of it came because she was anyone’s child or she had an advantage. In fact, she had nothing but disadvantages and it didn’t stop her. Michael would have recognized that. In the bonus chapter, Trevor questions whether Michael would be as good at basketball if he didn’t have a court, and Michael wonders the same. In Nightfall, Emory wants the pool to herself because unlike them, she doesn’t have access to a private pool in her home. Micheal would have respected that, I think, even if Will hadn’t asked them to leave.

Michael doesn’t want to give up his privileges and good life; he wants to earn them for himself, apart from his father. Emory doesn’t want to stay poor, as if that would be revenge against the wealthy classmates she hates. She wants to earn it all herself and show them up. They have similar lines of thought about money and privilege.

They’re not always right; sometimes their biases get in the way. Still, they have much in common.

But after reading your message, something else occurred to me. We’ve been talking as if there can only be “X is most like Y”, “A is a reflection of B”, “C and D are literally the same, just different fonts.”

And none of that is true. Truth is Damon and Emory do share a lot of similar traits. They’re more reserved, they’re more calculating and suspicious of new people. They can endure a ton of pain by themselves, both physical and mental, possibly more than anyone else in the group could tolerate.

Emory is a lot like Michael, in that both of them can see people for what they are, they’re strengths and weakness, and make a plan to use them to the best of their ability. Like you said as an example, despite knowing that the group didn’t like Aydin and that he’d used her, she could see the value and benefit of keeping him close and including him. She didn’t let her personal opinion get in the way, and I think if it were Michael alone, she could probably sway him. But he as the think of the group as a whole.

Emory is also a lot like Kai in that she’s patient with people, and she realizes when she might have said something insensitive and backtracks (Emory with Elle in Nightfall vs. Kai with Damon in the Bonus Chapter). Emory also cares a lot about people, like Kai does, and they’re willing to do the dirty job of caring for those even when they don’t want to.

Emory is like Will in having a sense of curiosity and adventure, wanting to create something no one else has before.

And I’m guessing the same could be said for any of the other characters, and that’s why they’re a family? One thing I picked up from the Bonus Chapter was how often they guys commented ‘I need him for xyz reason’ Michael and Damon had their fathers in common and a dislike of extreme drugs and alcohol abusers (Will excluded, though Damon got on that fairly quickly when he came back). Damon and Will were wild, where Kai and Michael were cautious. Michael and Will were curiosity, and Kai and Will were easier to be around. Kai and Damon were opposites in almost always, but they both agreed that sometimes you need some healthy violence. All of these traits play into and off of each other, and as their family grows, the same can be said for each new addition.

I like the idea of comparing the characters, seeing where they are similar and where they are different, and what those differences mean of the situations they get into. So perhaps it is time to lean away from the “Damon and Emory are exactly the same” talk, and replace it with “what do the similarities mean? What do the differences mean?”

I was trying to think of where this discussion was coming from. We see Emory compared to Banks and Damon, and now Michael. We see Rika and Winter compared often. As you mentioned, so people compare Will with Winter.

At first, I thought that it was the "If this hated female character where a man, they'd basically be this male character who is universally loved." But that's not really the case here, is it?

D & E are so different, i was always confused when they relate one with the other. I believe, much to the disgrace of a lot of readers, damon was more similar with rika than he was with emory, or even banks.

And this goes to what I was saying above. Damon and Rika do share a lot in common. They like playing games of manipulation, treating situations as if they’re a game of chess. They value family (Rika forgiving Christiane because that’s her mother vs. Damon not seeing her as family because he’s got all the family he needs, and the fact that they fight over what makes someone family). They both wanted children. A lot.

While I get that what you’re saying is the comparison between Emory and Damon is weak when there are others that are more alike, I think the discussion of MBTI as shown me that these characters are all really different and that’s what makes the group work.

I, fortunately, haven't been confronted with this comment (that I can remember), but I can imagine people saying it.

I think the case for comparing Emory and Damon is stronger than comparing Will to Winter. Though I can see why they do. Will and Winter are easy to deal with (in theory). They’re both generally warm and welcoming people. But those are basic traits, and I’m not sure if there’s are deeper aspects in their personalities to draw comparisons to.

Still, I don’t agree that any of the characters can be compared as if they’re a 1:1 version of each other. Therefore Damon and Will couldn't have married the female version of the other. That’s stupid.

If they wanted a gay relationship between Damon and Will to happen, it wouldve happened,

That’s what I think every time I see someone state with complete confidence that they were in love. As if a part of this story isn’t that there are different ways to love a person. That not all love is romantic. As if their brotherhood doesn’t and can’t exist because Damon and Will care about each other deeply.

“But the sex!” they cry.

Yeah…because neither of them ever had sex with someone they didn’t love? Or had no real emotions towards? Because Damon never used sex as a manipulation tactic, and Will as a way to ease his pain? I’ll accept that they’re not completely straight as an argument, but I highly doubt either of them would ever fall in love with a man.

To have this as an example after saying that Damon and Emory don’t have anything in common is interesting, because I remember Damon using Alex to get information on Evans. He had no problem seeing what she can do, and using it to his advantage, even if it meant going behind the group's back. Alex even had a few words for him at that party, too, and Damon didn’t really care.

There’s the phrase “two sides of the same coin”?

These people are like six sides of the same dice. (Die? Is a single dice a die? You know what I mean.)

Because while I think Damon and Emory are the same in this situation, I can argue that Damon is more extreme than Emory.

Remember when Damon said that he didn’t think any of the boys would help him murder someone, but then when he was killing Natalya, Emory jumped in. She didn’t even really know the situation, but she recognized something in Damon that was in herself.

We know she never took the chance to kill Martin, because for her, it never got that far. She was never that desperate, though I have no doubt that if the situation were life and death, she’d be able to make that decision. Similarly, I don’t think Michael would have killed Trevor if the situation wasn’t life and death. Michael and Emory match up in that aspect, but that doesn’t mean Emory didn’t get there before him.

I think on the scale of No-Murder to Murder, she’s probably a lot closer to Damon than she is to Michael.

who think they actions and words justify their ideas and beliefs, in an ugly way, why can't we see the potential of emmy being someone else's monster? And her not even denying alex? I was screaming!!! Because Isn't that cool? That she's not just this pure innocent nerdy girl from the town?

I mean, I think Emory always sort of owned that she was a bomb waiting to go off in Will’s life, and that’s why she tried to get away from him. She never denied that certain things were her fault. She always had a backbone and was willing to cross the line if she needed to. She accepted accountability easily.

But I thought Alex was calling Aydin a manipulative monster, not Emory, because he was able to “manipulate” Emory into thinking she doesn’t have to answer to them, even though she owning up to her role in Will's life. She was essentially calling Emory weak for being Aydin's victim.

However, Emory came to that conclusion because she was ready to, not simply because Aydin opened her eyes. As Emory said, her view of Aydin was more complicated than Alex was willing to comprehend. Even so, Emory refused to apologize for it, which I guess made her a monster in Alex’s eyes, too.

Their [M&E] opinions and decisions are usually what shape their current situations or the final say in a discussion.

And it’s in this way that Will and Rika are similar. Both had to wait for the person they desired most to be ready to accept the inevitability of their love. They spent years watching, waiting, following, as their person was just outside of their reach. And when they finally thought that they’d grabbed hold of them, after just one night, Michael and Emory slipped away again.

Just an interesting comparison I thought about as I was reading.

But i 100% believe than unlike damon, if emory actually wanted to take over michael's position, she could. She's an usurper, i dont think she'll just let michael have it easy if she didnt agree with something.

I don’t think Emory would let Michael have it easy either, but is she persuasive enough to sway the group as a whole? I’m not so sure. Micah and Rory were different because their bond to Will was different, as well as their view of him. For over a year, he’s been a friend and ally, but all of the sudden he and his six friends – who they have no loyalty to – are ganging up on this girl they’ve come to care about? It’s no wonder she was able to get them to change sides. Not sure Emory would have as much success with Kai or Rika.

But she might have success with Damon, though. Because they have similar thought processes.

My point is that it all plays into each other, and it’s why I would have liked to see more of the dynamic between Emory and some of the others, especially Michael, but they hardly share more than a sentence in the entire series.

this is beyond like banks and michael bantering because they have some weird tension and families' companies. Emory actually do have input on what they do, and she is known to have a say in things, that other might not agree with.

But a part of Banks' character is never coming to the table without a plan, even if she knows Michael isn’t going to agree with it. She still tries; she puts it out there, states her case, and will argue to get Michael to see things her way. And sometimes she wins, like we see in Conclave when Michael eventually agreed to her idea.

There’s a reason people compare Emory and Banks, too. They think and strategize, and they don’t let people they see as equals boss them around.

They both knew what was important to their values in life, and how to keep the family up,

I do see your vision (haha!). But I think Emory probably isn’t as skilled in this as Michael is, if only because he’s had more time to develop and live with the responsibility of making this team, this family, work. You said that Emory was smarter, while Michael more intuitive. Emory is book smart, but then her goals in life relied on her getting out of town and into a school, while Michael relied on his intuition to survive his father and find his real family. Both are logical and goal orientated.

I can see Michael teaching Emory how to develop her skills. Maybe not directly, but identifying that she has these same skills and helping her cultivate them by testing her, giving her the opportunity to make plans and see them through. He did that with Rika. And being a mayor, Rika is something of a leader now. Banks learned from Damon, and A.P. how to execute her role as a Senator. But no one is there to teach Emory how to use her skills to the best of her ability, and as a leader of the family and the other person who can see the blueprint – the builder, the visionary, the mastermind, as you said – Michael could help her in that way.

This Doesnt mean that theyre better than the rest but this was where their strength lies best

Agreed. This doesn’t mean that they're better, just that their skills serve a different role. If they were all leaders, it wouldn’t work.

The difference is that michaelrika just wanted to feel and discover something unknown, outside of their monotonous privileged life, but willemmy wants to use whatever unknown path in the light and dark to ACHIEVE something bigger, better, something above what they already knew about themselves.

This is interesting, because I see your point. To me, it feels that Michael and Rika are very inward focused; they are concerned with themselves and what their family is doing, but not overly focused on things outside the group (this isn’t to say they’re unsympathetic or unwilling to help when they see a problem in Thunder Bay or the world), but that their concern will first and foremost always be them and the family. Whereas, Will and Emory are very focused on Thunder Bay as if the entirety of It (the town, with its traditions and mysteries and lore) is their family, and they want to build it up and take care of it. They’re more focused on the external.

I’m not sure if that’s what you were getting at but it’s how I heard it. Again, neither better or worse. Just different.

And between michael and emory, emory was more likely to use physical violence than michael. Interesting, no?

I completely forgot you made this point when I was talking up there but I think we agree?

if emmy grew up like michael, how different or similar would she think, act, lead, follow etc. and how would michael react if he grew up like emmy. Sex and gender swap included.

This really gets into the idea of nature vs. nurture, which is not something I’m competent enough to discuss thoroughly, but it’s an interesting question all the same. If we had Emerson Crist and a Michelle Scott instead?

I fully believe what alex said in emmys car at that cove scene was very important.

I believe it too. It was a fundamental theme in the story, but I think I would have liked it coming better from Michael, seeing that Emory was the missing piece that kept their family from reaching its full potential. Since he was the builder, after all. Instead, we got him being all defensive and acting like he didn’t know they needed her. Sure the family could continue without her, but he had to see the benefit if he was the visionary of the group.

Sorry it took so long to reply. There was a lot to reply too! Thank you for the message and the thoughtful comments. It was interesting to see Emory and Michael, and the group as a whole, from this perspective.

Let me know your thoughts!

#asked and answered #devil's night series #damon torrance #emory scott #michael crist #character discussion #asked and answered 304

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kindestegg · 2 years ago

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what's yr fav hidden gem horror game thats been wiped off the net

the fishermen and the worm :( i first heard it got gone when i randomly got a dm on reddit of all places bc once upon a time i commented on a post recommending it as a creepy game that doesnt look like horror at first, n the person basically went 'yeah hey do u still have the files for this bc turns out its gone from the net' n im like AGH NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO bc i lost those in between moving computers many times

iirc the only surviving proof of it existing is an incomplete lets play series on youtube n also some screenshots i took revisiting the ending location to show my bf a long time ago.

it was a very neat little game n it makes me sad the creator wanted it gone but i guess i sort of can understand it bc sometimes as an artist ur gonna get embarrassed of ur old art n want to move on from it n see it gone off the net, i know ive done that with like, p much all my old devart profiles (i have none atm)

you might be wondering what it was about... to give a summary, its about these two little guys who are dubiously in love or maybe just besties who live in like this cartoony paradise in a hole n call themselves fishermen but then theyre like. hey why do we call ourselves that if weve never fished. so they go to their elder and are like HEY WHERE THE FUCK IS ALL THE WATER n hes like FUCK YOU THERES NO WATER HERE ITS ON THE SURFACE YOU STUPID FUCK. so they go to the surface n they meet this worm bug lady whos rly nice n sort of a mother figure to them, shes like rly old, shes been told by her moms (<3) to wait for these two guys for thousands of years in that very same spot. theyre like can u show us water n shes like yeah n points to a speck on the horizon n theyre like wtf we meant to fish in n shes like ohhh okay. yeah we gotta go to a different place for that.

AND THEN. THE REAL GAME BEGINS. you see bc every place in this world is called an 'age', n the more you traverse it, the weirder n often times creepier it gets n the more u get the feeling this is kind of telling the story of someones life? but you cant figure out who. not yet at least. without spoiling too much though, i rly like all the diff visual n style changes for every age, the next age you encoutner right after you move away from the worms spot is genuinely really fucking creepy n with this genuinely NASTY looking grit to it n it only gets more fucked up the more u play through it. thats around the point where i realized OH. oh ive been tricked. this ISNT a silly goofy haha rpgmaker game thats short n sweet! THIS IS A SCARY GAME!

but as ive said every age has a diff look to it, one other is psychedelic, another almost looks like a dr seuss book... so on. eventually, everything starts coming together, n what i rly like about this game is that it doesnt just give u dead ends, it expects you to be smart to figure it out, yes, but it also gives you PLENTY of evidence to figure it out n flat out tells you some stuff n by the end youre probably gonna just naturally know what happened.

i will also say looking back on it i rly appreciate the underlying theme of being gay n growing up gay n how the world aorund you affects you, theres like, SOME REALLY DARK fucking themes when you really get down to it and actually study the full on implications of what its trying to tell you. it rly gets dark with like, how bad homophobia can get n how heartbreaking n desolate sometimes the experience of being a gay kid can be when u have no one who you think you can trust n then growing up into a gay adult whos just getting more confused n worried about the future n sometimes even getting taken advantage of.

but despite all the horror n darkness... its a game that knows when to give you plenty of breathers, the three main characters are so charming they just shine naturally, they combat all the darkness by just being themselves. theyre not the ones who lived through all this horrible crap, theyre just bright little cartoon guys who want to go fish! n by god(s, in this games case) theyre gonna do it!!! n in the end... they may just decide to make things better for everyone else. the game has a good ending. its good guys. the game is good.

#Commander's answers #if left alone i could ramble about this game for us. it is truly something special #im unsure if there will ever be anything quite like. i think only undertale has maybe made me feel this way

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magnetosupporter · 5 months ago

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Honey, sorry for getting in between but i do want to say something too

first things first, Rogue did not owe satisfaction to nobody, as you said, she could have just ended things up without explanation, but we both agree that it was kind of her to think that he deserved some kind of answer, the full story even, so she would be honest with as she wished he had been with her about belladona. it was her right to choose what to do and we aint in the place of judging her.

Nobody is saying Remy doesnt have the right to be upset, he should and will because, wether we like it or not, he liked her so much. but the fact is that he was!! childish when talking back to her, wishing her the worst because, you can be upset, but it was none of his business why rogue and erik had broke up in the first place, wether he was bad or they had demons to fight, it didnt matter to Remy. He couldnt tell if he would make her unhappy or not, neither were his business, he could have just say "let us be friends" and go mourn the 'what could have been'. but instead, he choose to be an asshole and even judge Rogue for her choice as he said "things deeper than skin". Rogue is not fucking dumb, she knows that and always have, and its even ridiculous to compare her with Cyclop when their powers are so different (a pair of red glasses and hes all good to go, but Rogue? cyclops powers still allow him to live normaly, but Rogue's scares and hurts her, we shouldnt even make such comparison)

With what Remy said to her, it feels she felt wrong for choosing herself and her dreams and needs over what she had with him, and thats why she changed her mind last second. She have always loved Remy and always will, but it was unfair that he made her feel like her wishes were silly, fool ones. "why think about touch when we love each other?" the matter is that she cant even give him a peck without getting him into a coma. and she has the right and IS NOT wrong for choosing herself in the first place of HER LIFE. one thing does not exclude the other.

besides that, why are that person even praising Remy for being a fucking decent man?? "oh he was willing to let go of sex for life because he loved her" can i hear an amen, church??? so??? if he loved her as much as he claimed to, it was the bare minnimun, love doesnt need sex, sex its just a part of love, not the whole thing. we will not applaude a man for just being a decent human being.

and to remember, nobody comes back to what hurt them, so if erik and rogue had that ioio kind of relationship, good for them, because we all have moments, we change and its okay for to choose not to be with a person anymore, or to be with them, if they are happy, this cant be bad. Remy had his right not to want this for his life, and thats alright, same with Rogue wanting erik in and out of her life, nobody has the right to judge them. I do think, if Rogue runs and then comes back to Erik, despite what Remy has said to her, he is her true home and harbor. if he wasnt, she wouldnt count on him for absolutely everything. so yes, she loves erik, maybe not how she loves remy, but not less or more, she just loves erik, as much as he lover her wholeheartly.

Its okay if you do not think Rogneto actually works or if you cant understand how people do not like remy (as I do not understand people who likes him), but let us Rogneto shippers have our thoughts and moments without you romy shippers come to advocate in his defense. nobody really cares.

Remy, upon being rejected: you never wanted to make things official, you didn't tell me the truth [two false accusations, Remy is not entitled to knowing Rogue's past nor to have a relationship], you won't be happy with him [wishing the worst], "some things are deeper than skin" [completely erasing what Rogue wants and her past struggles with her powers], sure we can still be friends [scowling, not looking at Rogue like an adult and instead looking at the fired and burning cards]. Made Rogue cry

Mind you, Rogue was rejecting Remy for Genosha, not for Magneto. What made her want to stay was the opportunity to do more than she could as an X-Men and not Magneto, Erik was just a plus

Now,

Magneto, being rejected: visibly devasted, yet does none of the above (on Mr. & Mrs. X, he actually incentives Rogue to pursue what makes her happy)

I saw people saying that Remy did not shout at Rogue and he was condemnable for that. C'mon now 💀

#xmen 97 #rogue xmen #erik lehnsherr #ship and let ship

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darlington-v · 3 years ago

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I know different interpretations of a work are generally enriching and cool... but c!dream villan interpretations is like how to tell me you only watch Tommy without saying you only watch tommy.... which would be fine but its not a great place to be making statements about the whole nature of the dsmp lol

Wild speculation, but sometimes I wonder if like, because the dsmp didn't really start as a narrative, and a lot of fans don't nessecarily enter it expecting a narrative, but then there is one and the fandom is really discourse heavy and everyone is sort of excpeted to have an opinion while maybe not expecting to form one from the begining or not having a ton of experience with narrative in a way that would "expect" them to have an opinion or not take things at face value??, I don't know if I explained that well at all... and I don't really even think thats right nessecarily... but like wow sometimes some of the takes about power and government and villany...

Honestly, it makes sense!!!

I think something interesting is like.... looking at how animatics have shaped the like tone and culture of the fandom essentially. Like, an interesting fact that I didn't really fully grasp until SUPER recently is like...

c!Wilbur out the gate admits he is manipulating c!Tommy. Like his first youtube video on the Dream SMP he admits his goal is to manipulate c!Tommy and people like c!Tommy into helping him achieve a potion ("drug") empire to monopolize on potions because there were a lot of people on the server who like to min-max, which is to put all of your effort into this one specific skill essentially. so like... i know minecraft doesnt have a skill tree but if it did, it would be putting all your points into that one specific branch of a skill tree. So he wanted to exploit the labor of all the TommyInnits to.... maintain a Potion Empire.

THIS IS A LONG POST BC I GOT CARRIED AWAY SO BUCKLE UP

And I don't think a lot of the fandom who joined later on knows this. I certainly didn't until like a week or so ago? Like... I knew c!Wilbur had been manipulative from the start because I'm a mod of (shameless self promo incoming) @dsmpanalysis and we have a lot of different POVs in that mod team and discord and we talk about it really frequently. I joined the fandom as someone who was really big on L'manburg ESPECIALLY crimeboys, and have turned into.... *gestures vaguely to my blog*

And ngl I owe a lot of it to @1-michibiki-1 in terms of c!Dream "Apologism" but all of the mods there have expanded my thoughts and views on the storylines of this narrative.

My application consisted of like largely essays about like... how I think Dream was the villain but he was meant to be the villain because you don't get any insight into his character WHICH.... IS A FAIR ASSUMPTION AT FIRST GLANCE. People are easily villainized when you cannot get a glimpse into their thought process. It's easy to dwindle someone down into this flat character and starting out I knew Dream didn't stream the SMP on purpose.

And I personally came to the conclusion of "Oh! So Dream is supposed to be the villain." However as the story continued and I learned more about what Dream went through I began to realize that... it's more than likely a form of a red herring. My opinions on this were immediately solidified when I watched Ranboo's 2 MIL stream because both Ranboo AND Dream agree on enjoying red herrings.

There have been MANY times were Dream has said that c!Dream is a complex character and he's not a wholly evil guy and there have been times where the narrative has honestly just proved that.

Anyways, what's important though was that... I learned most of this from other people who were more focused on c!Dream rather than myself. Eventually I shifted from c!Tommy to c!Ranboo and c!Techno after c!Tommy betrayed c!Techno and I began to realize.... everything I learned before hopping in wasn't exactly what it seemed.

Part of this is because I'm older, I heavily identify with c!Techno's sense of loyalty and philosophies on government, but I especially identify with the anguish c!Techno voiced in... a lot of lore but especially the lore around Doomsday.

I'm not 16 anymore. I don't always feel wronged by adults, or older people in my case, whenever they absolutely have done something wrong by me, but I do feel wronged by my close friends. I also felt like c!Tommy's sense of loyalty didn't line up with mine after what felt like him constantly flip-flopping and refusing to understand c!Techno's morals on government didn't line up with his.

In short, it was easier to identify with Tommy in these animatics versus in the actual stream content because c!Tommy is played by a 16 year old. I'm not a teenager and my line of thinking doesn't entirely line up with people that age anymore. It's harder to place myself in the same shoes of someone's OC who is played closer to their actual age, because I'm not that age.

Regardless, I was still on the c!Dream is a villain train. I wasn't ever like... c!Dream is repulsive I hate him, but I was like omg hot villain lad go brrr.

Even when the first like... mellohi, panic room, Ranboo lore stream popped up I thought "Oh! c!Ranboo corruption arc?"

And I was excited because I really wanted this shy, nervous character to turn into villain buddies with his good pal c!Dream. I'm a total sucker for villains and corruption arcs and all that good shit.

SO I STARTED GETTING REALLY INTERESTED IN ENDERSMILE. I'VE BEEN ON ENDERSMILE SQUAD OUT THE GATE. NOT THE SAME WAY I AM NOW, BUT I'VE ALWAYS WANTED THEM TO TEAM UP.

So... upon not really keeping up with c!Dream and being relatively??? indifferent? I don't think I started arguments on c!Dream back then, but I might have. But I remember like... starting to participate more whenever c!Dream came up and looking more into Dream's character BUT ESPECIALLY TALKING WITH OUR SERVER'S C!DREAM SPECIALIST MICHI ABOUT DREAM A LOT MORE.

And because Michi has been a watcher since day one and was a DTeam fan rather than a SBI fan, she was able to provide me with more information on how the server worked pre-Tommy but especially pre-Wilbur.

Now, you could definitely argue well Michi probably has clear bias but it made sense to me when I looked back on how the storyline had been constructed and was going along, and everyone in the server talks a lot about our own biases and how we want people to maybe not lean so hard on them. Michi would also provide like anecdotes on what had happened and I'm sure links were probably provided at one point but the point was I felt like Michi had no reason to lie or manipulate how the story was told and if she did, eventually someone would have pointed it out because... Group of like... right now it's around 20 or more analysts but I don't remember how many at the time there were. POINT BEING, WE'VE ALL GOT POINTS TO PROVE AND IN MY EXPERIENCE NOT MANY OF US HAVE BEEN SHY TO PROVE THEM.

So if anyone ever had any differing opinions they would be talked about and we literally had and still have discussions.

REGARDLESS.... I DIDN'T FACT CHECK IN DEPTH BECAUSE I THOUGHT PEER REVIEW WAS ENOUGH WHEN YOU HAVE LIKE HOURS UPON HOURS OF STREAMS TO WATCH.

Anyways. Eventually I started paying closer attention and looking more into c!Dream lore but only recently have I started to triple check before speaking about c!Wilbur lore because I know everyone has biases and while I did trust everyone's thoughts and analysis in the discord, whenever I make essays I typically like it to be largely air tight and if theres a mistake, I want it to be because I forgot not because I just trusted what was said. Plus, I wanted to get down to the specifics of how Wilbur had always started with manipulation on the mind.

SO I WATCHED HIS FIRST VIDEO ON THE DREAM SMP.

AND WHAT I WAS NOT BY ANY MEANS EXPECTING WAS WILBUR TO SAY WORD FOR WORD, VERBATIM,

"SO WHY DON'T I START AN INDUSTRY WHERE I USE THE TOMMYINNITS OF THE WORLD TO WORK FOR ME, TO CREATE THINGS THAT THE MIN-MAXERS OF THE WORLD WILL WANT."

Like... this is in no way an attempt to like hardcore villainize c!Wilbur like everyone does Dream, it's just more so to like REALLY outline how far off a lot of fandom interpretation of c!Wilbur is....

Because of SBI focused animatics.

Now, when I joined I watched A LOT of animatics that really highlighted like... Wilbur being this self-loathing JD-esque, "I destroyed it because I had to because the world was against me because no one loved us, Tommy" type of character. At least... that's what it came across as.

And it definitely highlighted the fact that Tommy was a victim, which he is. He is undoubtedly a victim and no not even any dream apologist can change my mind otherwise. Tommy, despite being an instigator sometimes, didn't deserve the abuse he received.

But these animatics never shown the fact that c!Wilbur started L'manburg as a shady ploy to exploit people like c!Tommy and vilify c!Dream so he could have power.

And that was easy because Dream and Tommy had wars before. They had spars and pranks and here's the plan to take back my disks and here's the plan to out smart the thieving little child etc etc.

And all of the animatics I watched never mentioned this. Neither did the recaps though. The recaps gave the events flat out, there didn't sound like there was bias, and honestly I don't really know if there was rather than like... a lack of nuance. And it's hard to provide a recap with that much nuance in a short period of time for a youtube video, to be perfectly fair.

However, this creates a perfect formula for entirely rewriting the history of a server. c!Wilbur quite literally fucking succeeded TO A META LEVEL. He slandered and ran smear campaigns against Dream and like he even does that with Sapnap in the beginning. But what's crazy is that it transferred over into the meta! Most of this fandom understands Wilbur as a victim of mental illness, and yeah maybe? He definitely wasn't mentally well by the end of pogtopia, but he never started out with honorable intentions. L'manburg was never a victim, only its citizens. The TommyInnits of the world.

I just think it's like... such an interesting case study. Because this is like... an opinion like shared by at least half of the fandom, but the vilifying of c!Dream is shared by MOST of the fandom I would argue. Which is like even more crazy for me because that was c!Wilbur's goal!!!

LIKE I GO INSANE WHEN I THINK OF THIS BECAUSE HIS REACH IS JUST TOO POWERFUL. HE'S NOT EVEN ENTIRELY REAL, JUST A MANIPULATIVE PERSONA OF SOME BRITISH GUY.

And I mean... maybe people who have watched Wilbur's video on the SMP still maintain this idea that Wilbur wasn't always the bad guy, but honestly... I wouldn't be surprised if their introduction was still an animatic. Like bias is hard to check and I'm not going to lie I could have sworn I watched both Wilbur's AND Tommy's video on the SMP in the beginning and yet I STILL was a ride or die for tragic yet on some level still honorable Wilbur and a resilient Tommy.

Like... upon watching Wilbur's first video... possibly again I was surprised because I thought I did watch it like right before I even started watching the streams and yet I was still so invested in c!Wilbur as this tortured anti-hero.

It took 6 months of... not being in an echo chamber, full of multiple different people of different ages, different stream POVS, and people who joined the fandom at different points in time.

IDK IF THIS WAS EVEN ENTIRELY RELEVANT IT JUST FELT TANGENTIALLY RELEVANT AND THIS WAS SOMETHING I'VE BEEN THINKING ABOUT FOR A HOT MINUTE AFTER LIKE WATCHING WILBUR'S FIRST VIDEO AGAIN.

TLDR;

SBI CENTRIC ANIMATICS HAD A LASTING AFFECT ON THIS FANDOM AS IT'S HARD TO GO BACK AND ACTUALLY CHECK THE NARRATIVE FOR SOLID FACTS FOR YOUR OWN INTERPRETATION BASED ON THE FACT THAT THIS NARRATIVE SPANS OVER HUNDREDS OF HOURS WORTH OF TWITCH STREAMS.

#asks #anon #dream smp #dsmp #dsmp analysis #dream smp analysis #dsmp meta #dream smp meta #my analysis #long post

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yellowbluemoonshine · 4 years ago

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The Wrong Way to Put Out Fire

I wanna talk about some details about Touya, Todoroki family and the different situtions Touya and Shouto had.

Touya is introduced us as innocent, nice kid who just wants to enjoy his father.

Thats actually first difference we saw between Touya and Shouto. Sometimes children fond of one of their parents more than other one. For Touya, he was daddy’s boy. Shouto is more like mommmy’s boy. (Even their clothes are parallels. Fire, ice. Daddy, mommy.)

And let me say this;

This marriage was wrong to begin with. Quirk marriage, the fact that Endeavour decided to put his ambitions on his children is wrong.

But as a first born, for Touya, his family was normal. Children dont magically understand what is right or wrong.

He simply saw that he got his father’s attention and it made him really really happy. Training was the bond he had with his father. Touya’s thoughts probably like; I am daddy’s son, my father is really happy when i become more strong etc etc.

Even he realize his family is different from other people, he probably simply thought that it might be different but its their thing. This is why we saw Touya as happy. Touya felt special when he got his father’s all attention.

And Touya saw his mother is okay with it. He probably saw that many times even when father being disrespectfull, mom doesnt seem to mind that much. This is probably why he starts to looks down on his mother too. Its just children dont respect adults who dont respect theirselves. If child think he can get away with it, they would simply do it. Mommy allows daddy to be the boss of the house, mommy allows daddy’s to be disrespectfull to herself so its ok to disrespectfull to mommy too. Thats how children think in those situtions.

What was Shouto’s difference then?

Shouto as last born, he never think his family is normal or this sitution is okay cause when Shouto is born, everyone in family already starts to break down. Mommy wasnt okay at all.

Endeavour put his own ambitions on Touya’s shoulders, he gave him impossible expectations which is literally name of the chapter. Wrong way to put out the fire. Those impossible expectations is abuse, btw.

Everything started cause Endeavour put out fire on wrong place, his family.

And after Touya failed, he was thrown away. Touya probably felt like; his father took him to the highest hill of the building, made him feel special but then threw him down.

Touya started to get the attention he had at first place to the point he started to burn himself over and over again. Look at how terryfying he looks when his brothers were born...

At this point, he understand he is replacable which made him question why was he born at first place.

Of course, Touya wouldnt listen Endeavour when he said ‘there is a life outside of being a hero’ cause Endeavour himself doesnt live his life like that. Children arent stupid, they observe adults’s actions too. Endeavour’s words condract with his actions thats why his words didnt reach out to Touya.

Touya was in a lot of pain to the point his heigh stopped growing (Look how he is shorter than his siblings), burns himself, his hair starts to change probably cause he used his quirk too much, he even starts to pull his hair which is sign of suicide. He was literally small kid who was mentally breaking down and he expressed his pain every way he can do but he was ignored.

Fuyumi-chan didnt understand him. Natsuo-kun doesnt listen him either. (Touya thought Fuyumi-chan didnt understand her cause she is girl but the reason she and Natsuo doesnt understand is they didnt have the same expectation at first place.)

And mommy is at fault too cause she is the one who allowed daddy to raised him like this at first place. She is the one the accepted this marriage, she is responsible too.

For a child, to be understood is very important thing but they didnt get it. He realized his siblings dont understand him. Even though, Touya was so mentally unstable to the point he attack his baby brother, his parents still didnt get him help or didnt specifically take care of him, instead they constantly ignore him. They kept telling him to forget what happenned and look other way.

This is exactly why Touya couldnt hold on something else cause in deep, he knows only way to be seen is prove himself.

For Touya, his mother didnt there for him. His mother allowed this to happen too. This is why his situtions are opposite of Shouto’s.

Touya thought family is normal, his daddy loves him, this is why training was fun.

This is why he end believing everything Endeavour taught him. Even he uses same words, literally in same chapter.

‘I live in different world from others.’

Shouto realized family isnt normal and father is the one who make everyone unhappy. This is why he hated training cause he realized father is forcing him.

For Touya, mother wasnt there for him and ignored his pain.

For Shouto, his mother was there for him, this is why she became his emotional support.

This is also why Shouto tried to protect mom cause Rei at this point was really in pain and she was reaching her breaking point. Mommy is there for me, i love mommy but dad make mommy upset, dad is the bad guy here.

Meanwhile for Touya, he didnt really see his mom as sad, he saw her being okay with sitution, thats why he probably think that the way Endeavour treat her as normal cause she accepted this sitution.

All those opposite situitons made them think opposite way. Not because one is good or bad, its just they had different kind of abuse. (Also hair symbolism is nice parallel too).

Though despite opposite situtions, they were also similar too. They were so cold child soldiers who only think about getting revenge from father, just opposite way cause Shouto has.

Touya waited his father to come forest to watch him but Endeavıur didnt come until Touya was burn to death.

Touya’s death wasnt just an accident but its both also suicide and murder. Touya was suicidal, he kept burning himself but parents didnt look at him and Endeavour is the one who push him this mental state. Even Touya says himsef;

‘After all, the only thing he taught me was how to turn up the heat’

Touya had to burn and reborn to get daddy’s attention again but even after his death, he was hardly mentioned by his family. I mean if Dabi never become a villain, they wouldnt even discuss this case as family.

And i honestly dislike how Todoroki handle this sitution.

Rei says everyone is responsible but Shouto, Fuyumi and Natsuo were children, its not their fault. Rei is at fault for not being there for Touya and Endeavour is the most at fault for making Touya mentally unstable. I hate how children carry the mistakes of Endeavour, it wasn their fault.

And with their talk, they made it sound like Shouto is better than Touya cause look, he became a hero and he forgave them!

I mean, Shouto didnt have much choice cause Endeavour forced him to be a hero. Even Endeavour wasnt there, Shouto had emotional support (mom) and inspiration (allmight) to be hero, he also has strong qurik so no wonder he can be hero, you know. But Touya didnt have any of it. He didnt have emotional support, inspiration to be better or strong quirk.

Not even need to mention how both Early-Shouto and Dabi obsess with revenge, cold child soldiers who dont pay attention to people around them. Just Shouto was in better environment and then he met Deku and he started to heal.

Even Shouto saw himself in Dabi, how he could be like him but he was lucky to be saved. Even their wound smbolically shows their pain. For Shouto, it was boiling water but for Touya, it was very strong fire that will burn him to dush.

Yeah, Dabi is villain but even so. To Deku, Shigaraki is completely stranger but he still thoguht that he needs to be saved. Meanwhile, Todoroki family knew what happenned to Touya. They are personally involved with him but i found it weird it how they didnt mention about ‘saving him’.

I mean maybe thats what they will try eventually but still....i think heroes are good, villains are bad sitution contnues even in this sitution cause they say Dabi is the one who needs to be stopped and Endeavour is the one who take a hand.

Shouto needs to offer that hand to Dabi, not Endeavour cause the one who needs to be saved is Dabi/Touya, not Endeavour.

Not to mention how Best Jeanist and Hawks coldy listen sitution.

I guess, even after this, they still dont really look at Dabi’s pain cause if they saw it, at least they would talk about helping him more than stopping him...what a tragedy.

Touya, after everything he had been through is still ignored, even by his own family, remind me of Tenko’s sitution :’))).

#bnha 302 #todoroki touya #mha meta #bnha analysis #dabi

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einsk8rot · 4 years ago

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man i really did just realize (a lot after looking at @emmiewtf 's posts and @//animemindset on tik tok they are so cool) why the last episode really did overall feel so much more unsatisfactory and didnt have like. as much oomf as it could've. (tiny tl:dr at the end if you cant read through this all this do be long)

despite having some really cool ass scenes and little things and some cute ass renga stuff. it was so much more focused and around adam than usual? and being genuinely uncomfortable and still not really liking adam because he's still. super creepy. its really just kinda disappointing to see how focused it was on him and how he literally didn't get like any consequences for any of the shit he pulled? like cool clown man you like skateboarding again, are we like gonna acknowledge the constant assault of skaters you went against, one being reki why is obviously just a minor trying to have fun while you literally traumatized him? like so much of the shit that happened to reki. adam inadvertently or not caused that and the fear of him getting left behind by langa and stuff because of how adam skated with reki. like i don't know if this makes sense and im super happy reki is happy with skating again but that shit and trauma still happened and led reki to that downward spiral and i feel like we don't talk about that enough. and adam still like. never got any consequences for that. if not for weird ass behavior around people that are literally minors, especially knowing how adam acts and that adam had some sort of connection with miya who's like. hardly 13-14 or so. you had a fucked family life and childhood and it's understandable to change because of that but just because your past is shit doesnt mean you commit assault for fun and act like that to kids. and innocent people just watching like when he used bystanders when he raced. that wasn't fun that was just. concerning. and he got no punishments, he like, as i understand practically got away free

he genuinely is not a character i like. and many people probably feel the same. the last episode was more focused on him and redeeming him compared to others and it really just didn't feel right. more focus on the protagonists, reki and langa, ESPECIALLY reki just would've made it better i think? more about their relationship, cherry, joe, MIYA. miya like, got so pushed on the back burner in the more recent episodes? didn't even get an on screen apology or proper explanation of reki's situation and as someone who genuinely loves miya that was. pretty disappointing please give miya more appreciation. but despite that uh. reki and langa's relationship was like, practically used to give adam a reason to skate for fun again. which is. like alright i guess? i just really didnt like it. it was fucking amazing to see langa break out of 'the zone' type thing because of reki and him putting fun in his skateboard but the focus on teaching adam thats its fun. it makes sense, it was practically expected considering how focused the show is on skateboarding being fun but after all the stuff adam did it wasn't satisfying seeing him get away with everything and suddenly be sort of friends? like ok with the rest of the cast. (ALSO TADASHI WHY WERE YOU OK WITH THE DOG THING???? DUDE???????? his like. love for skating once again is back i guess? but bro that. alright if he's into that im not judgin)

episodes like episode 6, 10, and 11 were my favorites and that's solely based on it being more centric on the actual protagonists and the cast genuinely having fun. and adam getting what he deserves. or adam must not being there HEHAHAHEJHFV so. in episode 6 there was like no adam and it was just the main 6 having fun! it was a genuinely great episode to watch with the cutest moments, plus some good ass foreshadowing? okay just more subtle buildup of reki's insecurities with some really nice moments while also being funny and fun! and that was really nice to watch! i think episodes 10 and 11, moreso 10 are my favorites because they're reki-centric. episode 10, we got to see so many intense character moments, shadow literally getting fucking bonked by that dude with his manager (STILL SAD OVER HER GETTING WITH SOMEONE ELSE WHERE IS THE HIROMI APPRECIATION HE TOOK A BAT. LIKE MULTIPLE HITS TO THE HEAD FOR HER???), i think that was the episode with the matchablossom carry? MANAGER OKA MOMENTS WE LOVE TO SEE IT HELL YES GET IT MAN WE LOVE TO SEE THE SUPPORT AND ADVICE TO REKI. TADASHI TAKING REKI TO A LOVE HOTEL?? THAT WAS SO OUT OF NOWHERE BUT ACTUALLY SO FUNNY TO ME (kinda creepy when he asked have you never been here before like. tadashi he's like, 17, please) and HOO BOY. LIKE ALL OF THE REKI MOMENTS IN THE EPISODE. GETTING MORE INSIGHT IN REKIS PAST (WHO IS!!! THE GANG HE WAS WITH!!!!!!!) AND SEEING HIM SLOWLY START TO REGAIN HIS LOVE FOR SKATING AND APOLOGIZE TO LANGA???? LITERALLY THE WHOLE SCENE WHEN HE RECONNECTED WITH LANGA. NOW THAT WAS SATISFYING. SEEING THE WAY THAT REKI LIT UP AGAIN WHEN HE REALIZED SKATING WAS FUN. HIS CONFIDENCE COMING BACK. SKATING WITH LANGA BECAUSE SKATING IS PRACTICALLY LOVE AND THEIR LOVE LANGUAGE SO THAT WAS ENOUGH. THE WAY LANGA WAS FOCUSED ON REKI. HIS BOARD WAS BROKEN BUT HIS TOP PRIORITY ISN'T JUST SKATING, IT WAS REKI. IT WASN'T FUN WITHOUT REKI AND HE LOVES IT BECAUSE ITS WITH REKI. AND EPISODE TEN JUST REALLY SHOWED REKI AND LANGA'S RELATIONSHIP PERFECTLY AND THE MAKE UP WAS SO GENUINELY SATISFYING WITH THE CUTEST FUCKING MOMENTS. THAT COMBINED WITH HOW GOOD THE PROGRESSION OF REKI WAS THROUGHOUT THE EPISODE REALLY JUST MADE IT HIT TO ME. it actually focused on the protagonists. and it was. so good. i will give anything to feel the same way i did watching episode ten for the first time again. it was a rollercoaster in all the perfect ways and it was just so genuinely fun and satisfying. and episode 11? was the perfect continuation of that for me.

episode 11. was so good. as i've seen many people say, its like reki reclaiming his spot as the main character and one of the main protagonists. he took a chance on the rain, he went against adam again and this time showed he wasn't afraid. he was just having fun and he was overcoming adam because of it. it wasn't just the board he made. this was emphasis on reki's own skills and confidence and how it got him to, even with not actually winning the race, he fuckin won. he showed adam who the hell he was. he showed EVERYONE what he was capable of despite of how much everyone doubted him. and do you know what makes that doubt people had in him even better? okay that wasn't worded really well but the doubt people had in him made the payoff of his success even better. but its the way that langa didn't fucking doubt him for a moment. he had his FULL TRUST in reki the entire time even when pretty much everyone else wanted him to give up. expected him and wanted him to stand down against adam. but langa believed and trusted reki. and even when he didn't win his first thought was to check on him and protect him from adam. renga's relationship, platonic or not is just. so amazing. so fucking beautiful despite the ups and downs because of how much care. the amount of trust they have in eachother, how they just know and understand eachother. its fun and okay because its the two of them. and that showed throughout the episode and i loved that. BUT ENOUGH RENGA. THE FOCUS ON REKI IN THE EPISODE. i believe in reki supremacy and that he needs more appreciation as the main character, the protagonist, and hoo boy. eleven was THE most satisfying shit. ARE WE NOT GONNA TALK ABOUT REKI EFFECTIVELY, DESPITE TALENT, COPIED LANGA'S TRICK? HOW HE SORTA REVERSE LOVE HUGGED ADAM? HOW HE USED AND LEARNED THE THINGY MIYA TAUGHT HIM yes i forgot the name IN THE FIRST RACE WITH ADAM. HOW REKI IS SO GOOD AT LEARNING THAT SHIT JUST BECAUSE ITS FUN. HE JUST DID IT BECAUSE IT SEEMED MORE FUN AND THATS SO AMAZING. PLUS THE CONFIDENCE REKI HAS? THE RESILIENCE HE HOLDS? HOW HE KEPT STANDING UP? TAKING EVERY THROW SPIN AND PUNCH once again fuck adam thats just a kid having fun and you were punching him until he was bleeding. if he didn't pull away, adam had those spiky things on his elbows. he would've genuinely hurt reki AGAIN. PLUS HIM PULLING THE FULL SWING KISS ON REKI???????? WHAT THE FUCK MAN. LIKE THE WAY REKI EVADED IT WAS SO COOL GO OFF REKI BABY YOU'RE DOING AMAZING BUT ADAM WHAT THE FUCK. but on the note of reki being amazing again, this episode really did show that. it had so much focus on reki and showed how him being reki, his confidence, the skills he developed himself, his love for skating is what makes him amazing. him being reki. thats what made people like him. thats what gave him everyone's support. thats what made him practically win and show that he IS the main character. that was reki at his BEST. the satisfaction of proving everyone wrong. his found skating family being so hyped and proud of him. AND HOO. FUCKING, BOY, ANOTHER ONE OF THE BESTS PART OF ELEVEN WAS ADAM EATING SHIT. WHAT HE FUCKING DESERVED. the mentality of the s goers and fans is kinda dumb with them not really caring about reki until this and literally bashing him still sorta at the start of the race. then immediately clowning adam, but adam like actually deserves the clowning hah. bitch. the best part of episode 11 was not only reki, but how they treated adam. he was GETTING what he deserved. seeing adam on the ground and fallen. people booing him and focusing on reki being cool as shit instead of adam winning. that was so fucking satisfying. taking the 'king' away from his throne after all the fuckery he's done, him being shunned. now that was beautiful. that was what i liked and adored. 11 once again, reki-centric, and adam getting some punishment for his actions. that was amazing. that was what i liked. i watched sk8 for reki and seeing that made me scream in delight.

episodes 10 and 11 were just, yeah. the focus on the main characters and adam getting what he deserved. the renga relationship moments were just. something about them both was just perfect and i hope i conveyed that right. episode 12 just . didn't make me feel all that much. at least compared to those 2. and that's pretty much completely because of adam. and because after 10 and 11, 12 really was just. kinda underwhelming i guess? the adam-centricness of it. the use of langa's love for reki and skateboarding for adam's sake really was just kinda. eh. THE ENDING AND ACTUAL MOMENTS THAT HIGHLIGHTED REKI AND LANGA WERE BEAUTIFUL AS ALWAYS but the adamness was just. yeah. it was. mm. all of my rant juice is like running out ive been typing this for like an hour so

TL;DR: the focus on and redemption of adam and not our mains was what made 12 so eh. the characters and their relationships is what makes sk8 so good and the sudden focus on adam was just. mm if you read all of that i hope that made sense and please feel to add on and respond!! i love seeing people's insight on things and i tend to forget about stuff when i rant!

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blondebooklion · 4 years ago

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why it drives me crazy when people say c!ranboo has no morals but think c!wilbur and c!ranboo could still have potential to be narrative foils

morals:

loyalty to family/friends: in both his normal functioning and his enderwalk stage ranboo is incredibly defensive of his loved ones. this is 100% the center of his moral compass. he doesn't do certain things he fears will upset others (thus succumbing to peer pressure yes) but i deeply disagree with people argument that that is proof he has no moral backbone. particularly due to a couple of instances:

ranboo visiting tommy in exile: while not directly breaking the rules there was a general expectation, especially the people ranboo spent his time with, of not really visiting tommy. it wasnt really a set rule or anything but ranboo was definitely putting himself at risk by doing so.

protectiveness over michael: when sam and puffy showed up to prank ranboo, he was incredibly defensive over his son. he was ready to kill to protect his son if it came down to it.

rescuing tommy+tubbo: while we have it confirmed this instance was in their enderwalk stage, ranboo going both proves ranboos values in the enderwalk are the same (or i'd argue strengthened even) ranboo moved protectedly in front of tubbo when he and tommy had separated

forgiveness: he is willing to give people more than one chance, he is incredibly quick to judgements but for the most part he does not rely on other peoples opinions of each other to dictate the way he feels about them, he does take it into account in his overall image of them, but like with revivebur, he is willing to offer him a chance.

reciporcity to kindness: when people are kind to him, he is kind back. y'all let this slide as a moral with techno. it counts here. no im not counting it as necessarily loyalty because he is polite and kind even to those he isn't close to.

self-reliance: for better or worse ranboo does not think he needs other people to survive, in many instances he has displayed thinking he and everyone else would be better off if he were isolated. he does not want to depend too much in anyone, which can especially be seen in his desire for wealth. i think it has always been more about i dont have to rely on others, if things go south i can still survive (obviously part or it is needed something to do on stream, im applying other characteristics of ranboo to infer) but we can also see this in him retreating to himself (panic room, not telling anyone about his book being missing) when he is threatened because he believes the best way to handle it is himself

security: ranboo is incredibly driven bu his desire for safety and stability for both himself and for his loved ones. he thrives on consistency. he struggles the most when things begin to change.

difference between foil and antagonist (just for clarity cause some people have been switching up the definitions)

"an antagonist is a character who is in direct opposition to the protagonist. their actions deliberately hinder the protagonist from achieving her goal. this relationship helps build conflict and propels a story forward."

"a foil exists simply to shine the spotlight on certain traits of another character, without necessarily creating opposition or conflict."

credit: masterclass

the opposing traits/beliefs that i think will cause the most conflict between the two (ranboos will be written like this and wilburs like this to differentiate)

leader vs follower

probably the most obvious contention point, pointed out on 5/05 stream by wilbur pressing ranboo on what he stands for. wilbur wants to be in charge. but i think ranboo is how wilbur wanted people to value him. wilbur wanted to be the guy that everyone liked because he believed being liked comes with power. ranboo does not necessarily want to be well liked by everyone, but he wants to at least be neutral so he does do things in order to keep them on his side

conflict driven vs conflict averse

wilbur thrives on chaos and conflict, much like dream he is willing to manipulate situations. rqnboo does everything he possibly can to avoid it

cockiness vs insecurity

wilbur is obviously bold and arrogant. he thinks extremely highly of himself and the postions he does and could potentially hold. he is ruled by this factor and often does not think about the consquences of his rashly made decisions(thats not to say he isn't calculated or intelligent, he is, he just focuses on how things affect him rather than others)

means to an end vs no ulterior motives

all of ranboos bonds are strong because when he cares about people he does what he needs to to take care of them, they usually initiate out of instances of kindness, but he does not seem to expect anything in return. he cares about people because he loves them, nothing more nothing less. wilbur however while some of his relationships were initially based on care the motives became corrupted and its hard to say whether there are any relationships he has at this point that aren't ruled by some kind of benefit for him (my only guess for that would be phil)

similaries: paranoia, trust issues, secretiveness

ranboo and wilbur really are two sides of the same coin, yes they are opposites in a lot of aspects but despite the differences in their values orginate from the same place they jutted of in two completely different directions, they tried to solve the same issue in vastly different ways. ranboos paranoia was attempted to be solved by isolationism, while wilburs mainly tried to solve it through manipulation. ranboo pushed people away and wil tried to force them to be around. both backfired for them and caused them to retreat further into the paranoid states demonstrated by wilbur blowing up l'manburg and ranboo catastrophizing with hearing dreams voice.

I think wilbur's main contenion with ranboo resides in wilbur thinking ranboo glazes through life easily, and that they disagree on what morals means. being more confrontational does not mean you are more or less moral than another person. wilbur does not understand that differing morals does not equal none at all.

I don't think their relationship is going to act as an antagonist because while ranboo is actively keeping an eye on wilbur it wouldn't really make sense for ranboo to suddenly be more confrontational. I know a lot of people are citing the Burr vs Hamilton relationship as parallels in their dynamicI want to remind you that narrative foils are not conflicting in nature. conflict can happen. but the point of them is to highlight the differences in character traits.

likening to burr vs hamilton

burr wanted power but he wanted it to come to him vs hamilton wanting power and actively chasing it

yes this makes sense for wilbur, but it doesnt for ranboo. ranboo doesn't want power. he never has. the reason burr waits on the sidelinesnis cause he is waiting for the chance to act, but ranboo is not waiting for something to happen, in fact he would rather have the exact opposite, for things to be as uneventful as possible.

"Hamilton’s success at the expense of his personal life is countered by Burr’s relative lack of success and his happy family life. Both of these are directly due to the two’s differing goals and approaches to life. Burr and Hamilton are two side of the same coin, opposite results with the same starting conditions."

source

this is exactly what I referenced earlier between the two. ranboo cares about family, wilbur about career. while a lot of their behavior originated from a similar place, their paths rapidly diverged.

hamilton's downfall at burr's hand

i'm gonna be honest i find it extremely hard to believe that a situation will exist where wilbur waits and ranboo acts. however, if one does i still firmly believe it will be revolving around (likely in defense of) the people ranboo loves and cares about, specifically michael, tommy, tubbo. it would be where he is cementing his views of choosing people. but wilbur being hesitant is still difficult for me to think of a scenario on which he would that hesitant? for it to be his downfall?

important to note: ghostbur did also akin ranboo to burr so it is definitely possible that this dynamic is going to countinue to playout in the future

I will shut up now thank you for reading. reminder that this is just my interpretation and analysis, obviously looking at different details could lead to different conclusions. i'm super willing to discuss as long as we are both going to be respectful of each others opinions and courteous <3

#ranboo #wilbur soot #revivebur #long post #also let me know if i need to tw anything else #tw paranoia #tw anxiety #tw death mention

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uchihashisuii · 4 years ago

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tumblr is tryna suppress the vik truth 😔 so sending in two here we go again:

scenario where johnny is alive and in a body at the end but i think v and johnny would become... maybe not inseparable, but theyd stay extremely close. i mean they literally know each other like the backs of their hands, so theyd hang out all the time, and both show up somewhere when you only invited the one. theyre family now, and its staying that way and sometimes theyd go to talk to the other before realizing oh yeah, they were trying to talk in their head again, they dont need to do that anymore. or theyd have mostly non verbal convos where they gesture and only half start a couple sentences while the other finishes them off because they know how they other thinks, and everyone around them is like ??? could ya speak up so the rest of us can follow please. and v and johnny will hang at the clinic bc v wants to hang, and vik gets to meet the bastard that almost killed her for the first time. and hed be gruff and cold and distant (and a little pissed) because yeah johnny didnt mean to but it still happened, she was still hurt and a mess for so long, and she had so much shit to deal with. he doesn't act outright hostile or anything because he saved her too in a fucked up way, and he'll be thankful to the bastard for the rest of his life for that, even if he never admits it.but hes also veeery jealous and trying not to show it. he doesnt mean to, but theyve got this bond no one else has now, and these same quirks and jokes and johnny understands her better than literally anyone ever, how could he not be jealous of that? hes got something vik wants, and hes upset for even thinking like this i mean hes too old to feel posessive of someone he has no right to. and he recognizes this, recognizes that johnnys not going away anytime soon. hes here for good and will be here as long as v's around, theyre a weird package deal right now, but he cant stay mad for long and needs to get over being jealous because he sees why theyre both friends now despite everything. like yeah hes a prick but his hearts in the right place, and he can be funny and charming and makes v laugh, and he sees the similarities in them. the smoking, the gun tricks, the jokes and the passionate rambling, they laugh the same or give the same grin. hes not as awful as hes made out to be, because he can see where v and him started merging and its maybe not a bad thing that v changed him, he can see it from the start of their first interaction. he shouldnt be jealous of the fucked up situation they both never asked for.

(cut for length ♥)

“ - anyway all of this to say that vik would absolutely try to keep johnny at arms length if they ever met, but would very quickly grow to like him because he sees so much v in him, and he cant not like anything thats a part of v (though he can live without them hamming up their silent convos, thank you) and johnny would absolutely pick up on the jealousy thing and think it kind of funny, and rib on vik when v leaves for a minute, or tease v when they leave because viks got it bad. and once all of thats been dealt with i think vik and johnny would have this fun dynamic of like, just shitting on each other and poking fun in a light hearted way. as if like, johnnys her brother and hes just tryna hold up his own with her family. and they wont talk about it but theyd recognize they have their own places in v's heart and theyd both do anything for her and thats okay, they have different roles to fill. i just think vik and johnnys dynamic would be so neat, johnny having essentially known everything about him and all v's feelings toward him, while vik just knows him as a terrorist, and the guy that was killing someone soso important to him. johnny would make fun of vik being an old timer, and vik would dunk back that not only is johnny older than him but he could absolutely demolish him with one hand tied behind his back. but yeah, lot of good potential there. i love the idea vik being jealous of johnny and feeling like an ass for even thinking like that. johnny going 'haha simp' but then also being like 'v, i unfortunately care for you so im gonna tell you right now no one in this city is worthy of you but the doc is the only one that comes close. i swear to god make a move on him before he turns green, i cant stand seeing him pine after you. fuck him and then never speak to me about it, i dont wanna know or see anything. luv u prick' and not to say that johnny would ever replace jackie bc he couldnt, and theyre not looking for a replacement. but their dynamic would echo the one v and vik had with jackie with the jokes and teasing. and vik would see the old v, the one from before the heist come back a little with how she bounces off everyone and keeps the convo going. shed light up again in a way she hadnt in what feels like a long time. and johnny wouldnt like, become bffs with vik or anything but he wouldnt treat friendships the way he did back in 2020, so he would really try with his friendship with vik when he needs to, if only for the sake of v. because everything and everyone important to her is important to him now too, and hes gonna take this second (third?) chance seriously because hes different now, and with everything vs done for him its worth doing. (apologies for the length again 🙏)”

------------

once again i find myself with not a goddamn thing to say you put into exact words EXACTLY the things i feel about this im

im obsessed with the image of johnny and vik ripping each other to pieces (jokingly) and v being in the middle of it like “why do two people i love gotta b like this to each other” and johnny being the one to try nd get them together oh my GOD johnny loving v with his whole heart and wanting nothing but the best and for them to be happy im

#i love your messages sm keep em coming #viktor vector #viktor vektor #victor vektor #victor vector #rippermerc #johnny silverhand #cyberpunk 2077

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littlefoxwithbighat · 4 years ago

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Hi! This is talking about the plot of the dream smp in a meta sense and its a bit negative. The person behind this blog wants to remind you that you can skip if it's not for you and they still love the SMP. :)

ALL DISCUSSION IS ABOUT CHARACTERS. DON'T ATTACK CCS OR I WILL STEAL YOUR KNEECAPS.

I can't lie; I'm really annoyed and worried at the way the writers are handling Tommys character at the moment, and am increasingly concerned about it messing up the plot.

I wasn't very happy with the finale. I don't think that means all is lost, I think they can pull it back but it's going to take some work. I was worried about the way that things were handled before but the green festival was actually very well handled, so my worries were mostly assuaged. But yesterday? I don't know.

The fact nobody lost a cannon death is kind of disappointing. The weight of blowing up an entire city/ (country?) brutally is somewhat lost if there is no human loss. Nobody was hurt physically and the only people this had a big mental impact on was Tommy and Tubbo, everyone else wasn't very attached to L'manburg or had gone rogue, or were detatched from the while situation. And maybe it's the fact it's happened to them before or that they still have each other or that it seems odd/ frustrating that they still care so much about this place or that it was always a losing battle and they knew it, but I dont find myself really pitying them like I probably should. And I think that comes down to character growth or lack thereof, which I'll discuss later.

Niki and Fundy have started a villain arc, or at least a violent nihilism arc, and I actually don't mind it, in fact I'm a fan but it wasnt really foreshadowed, or really just showing them cracking as much as it should have been. I would guess this has mostly been started for both of them to tie Niki into the plot and I can't blame her for wanting that. Fundys acting is very good, and I REALLY hope the writers handle this well. For Fundy, regarding the fact that his father is going to be resurrected and that Fundy is following in his footsteps... If the writers don't realise that connection and make this a big step in Fundys narrative I will scream. Also Funboo bros are very interesting character foils and I hope their relationship is maintained so that they can play of off each other and also man I just really want them to keep being friends, it's a generally positive healthy relationship that makes both characters sympathetic and we need that right now. As for Niki, her character motivations seem to be mostly centered around Tommy and on the one hand I'm like ehhhh, because Tommy's character already gets a disproportionate amount of attention in terms of narrative, and I get it, but recently he's been a bit TOO much of the protagonist for a multi-person POV improve server... and I'm apprehensive. However on the other hand this has potential for a nice confrontation between Tommy and Niki. If that happens I want Tommy to be aware that this is going to happen and not talk over Niki, and I don't want it to be brushed over. I think it would be best if it was just the two of them. This also gives a nice chance for Tommy to examine his trauma with Dream and explain his motivations and Niki to get her anger out. I also want it to end positively, because it absolutely can and lack of communication when the viewer knows how to fix it is OK as a plot device sometimes but incredibly frustrating if it keeps happening (cough, Tommy and Techno).

Ranboo is reacting to the plot amazingly and I have as usual only praise for him, go, you funky enderman boy, go.

Wilbur is getting resurrected which is a thousand percent because Will wants the plot back and honestly I don't really mind, I think he'll do a good job. However I really hope he speaks to everybody about their characters, particularly Fundy, Ranboo and Niki because I don't want their characterisation and arcs to be thrown away.

Tubbo is doing very well, and I don't have many complaints to be honest. I hope he continues to get in with the acting with no shame, because he's an amazing VA when he wants to be, but sometimes he undercuts serious moments a little too much by laughing. Same criticism for Phil actually. But both are doing good.

On the theme of that, while I don't mind tension relievers or humour in serious moments there are sometimes too many. It was a lot worse about a month back and it was improving, but it seems to be creeping back in and ehhh. It's kind of Marvel-esque and not in a good way? I think it has a lot to do with bloopers and for some reason there are loads at the moment? Like Wilburs arc had almost none and this arc there's at least 2 every moment. Which isn't always their fault but maybe they need to take more steps to prevent them.

Techno is doing OK, he's quite a meta character so I'm not too mad about him undercutting serious moments but sometimes he does do it too much or in the wrong place. Like making jokes about Connor completely over the top of Tommy and Tubbos reunion, you know an event which has been foreshadowed for yoinks, prevented them from getting a proper flow going and kind of ruined it. And that made the reunion really dissapointing, which is a shame because it could have been so cool. However his characterisation is consistent and dedicated, his goals and relationships are clear and he's getting humanised more which is nice, and his monologues are great. I'm curious to see what he does now NL'M is gone but I have total faith in him.

Now Tommy. Oh Tommy. His character is such a mess at the moment, which is a shame because there were moments I saw people doubting his character choices and I was behind him.

Firstly the relationship with Techno fell apart. That was inevitable. Tommy didn't care about anarchy and Techno didn't care about the discs and both of their goals would impede the others. But the way Tommy talks about Techno is so... No? And now I understand that Tommy is going to have a biased perspective on the whole situation, and that's fine and good, but his character is so wrong about Techno it feels weird and painful? Like even from his perspective it went down differently to how he talks about it. They don't listen to each other and it's like watching two people scream at a wall.

The issue is the relationship was fairly well developed. I struggle to see Tommy saying he saw Techno as a friend but Techno never saw him as a friend because hold on, what? Techno, here's a respiration helmet because of that one of thing you told me about your trauma, a disc because those make you happy, plus top tier armour and weaponry, plus I'm going to spend time with you, calm you down from panic attacks, hide you and protect you from Dream, let you wander around L'manburg and achieve your own goals and help you plan things out Techno and Tommy didn't get ANYTHING from that? Plus after Techno opens up about his goals and his trauma, do the one thing that would hurt him the most, (use and then betray him) and then directly oppose his goals after he helped me? Ugh. It just leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I know he would never let Tubbo get hurt and thats fine, but there were ways around that. If you're framing this character as the protagonist, then he needs to be sympathetic or at least grow and Tommy using Techno again without remorse and then refusing to listen to his perspective or show any gratitude for anything makes it difficult for viewers to empathise with him in my opinion. Have him betray Techno and then listen to Techno when he explains why Tommys betrayal hurt him and apologise, fine. Have him listen to Techno and try and find a way to keep Tubbo safe regardless, fine. Have him betray Techno but apologetically and still trying to avoid Techo getting crushed or killed, fine. But THIS? Im sympathetic towards Tommys character but this throws away so much potential character development for Tommy, where at least he saw Techno as a person, and not only that but a nice person who despite everything has set aside everything to help him? And then for him to be exactly where he was at the end of season 1, both literally, and emotionally ? I understand this is a child soldier with trauma but this is supposed to be our protagonist and if he doesn't grow, and isn't sympathetic and destroys someone we care about, how can we root for him?

Now all of this could be forgivable, not great, but forgivable, if Tommy had moved on from the discs. The Goddamn Discs™. And the worse part is all the dominoes were lined up to suggest he had! We had his moment of "he watched me" where he realised Dream was the villain and controlling him, "I've become worse than everyone I hated" good, amazing, I see where this is going, "The discs were worth more than you ever were!" and then he retracts and apologises and you think horray! Tommy has realised the discs were being used to control him and if he doesn't care about them, they hold no value! Now he's going to realise that his friends are more important and he's going to stop going after the discs. His new character motivation can be killing Dream and protecting his friends, especially Tubbo. It's clearly angled this way, and this way the plot progresses and Tommy with it. What marvellous character development. Look at him go.

And THEN, after everything that's happened he says the most important thing is the disc and I want them back!?!? EH !!? Why... Who... Who gave the OK on that writing decision? That's so static and boring and unsympathetic! And then he's back to asking people do fight for L'manburg? What?

I'll be honest I was kind go hoping either Tommy or Tubbo would die with L'manburg. I didn't mind it they didn't, there are a thousand ways to make the plot work without them dying, but this was not a great one.

PLEASE let Tommy have some growth. Yes he's had some from not caring about L'manburg to fighting for it in season one, but that was ages ago and he doesnt seem to have changed since then in any way that really counts. And I know this is harsh and he's traumatised but you have to understand I am talking about this in a sense of characters and narrative and NOT in terms of real life. Tommy needs to be better and dynamic because he is a charcacter and I want him to be a good one.

Having said all that, here are my thoughts on the future of the SMP.

Firstly, I am worried that becuse it is such a good source of content, especially for Tommy that they will never ever kill his character and leave him fighting with Dream for eternity. And I love the Dream SMP but I've seen stories that get dragged out for plot or content, and however much you think you want it to never end, let me tell you, yes you do. It will get stale and repetitive and I want the dream smp, or at least Tommys arc to go out with a beautiful and brilliant and fabulous plot ending instead of being dragged into the dirt. And then maybe new characters take the spotlight. Just please god give it a goode ending.

I also really hope they don't throw other things away to make Tommy the centre of attention, especially if it's destructive to the plot, or kind of weird and obnoxious.

Secondly, I am intrigued about the prison and Schlatts book to Dream and Technos favour and the egg and what that entails and I hope they really think through those plot points carefully and make them work, and don't forget them or throw them away.

Thirdly, I am intrigued for Wilburs return and hope that he manages to fix it cohesively without too crazy a change of pace and style and keeping characters (especially Ranboo and Fundy and Niki) consistent.

I hope they prep for the future and think things thought and communicate with each other.

It might be interesting to see other countries finally discussed but I don't know how much that would intefere with other plot points so we'll see.

That's all! Reminder that this is about characters and plot and this is just a few criticisms. I love the dream smp, but there are somethings I wanted to get of my chest. Please be respectful and feel free to discuss in the notes. Also, again, no hate to any CCs!

#mcyt #mcytumblr #dream smp theories #dream smp analysis #dream smp #dream smp spoilers #dream smp meta #tommy mcyt #negativity #negativity tw #dream smp plot

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camelely · 4 years ago

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13rw S4 Fix

So i did one of these for last season and I think now that I’ve had some time to think about S4 I’ll do the same. While last season I thought the issue was one character being overused. But here it seems like there were multiple smaller things that could have improved the whole season Again I’m keeping the same basic plotline and characters :)

1) Winston

Have Winston stay at Hillcrest. Him moving to Liberty did nothing for the main plot and he was basically a red herring through most of it. Let him try are befriend the characters from the outside. He can learn about Jess from Bryce’s trial and the news coverage and then try to befriend her at Monet’s. This is where he meets and later starts to date Alex. Since he doesn’t go to liberty school Alex sees him as a sort of escape and lets him in. Clay and Ani dont tell everyone about him because they dont know he is trying to get close to them. It makes them seem less like assholes and more like people. They don’t mention his connection to Monty because they dont realize how close he is getting to answers. Clay can still suspect he did the graffiti, after all it was a break in and a non student could have done that. Plus Estella is another red herring in the school. She serves that purpose so let Winston be the outsider looking in. His arc would still be about knowing a different Monty and not knowing who is was at Liberty but now he is literally the outsider who didn’t really get Monty, rather than it just being a figurative thing at the prom. You can still have the prom scene it would just be entirely imagined rather than the half imagined thing they went with. I think they overused the people talking to ghosts thing so here it would be a fantasy of Monty and the relationship they had rather then a representation of what could have been. However I don’t think this would have retracted from the point. Also play him up, he is a sympathetic antagonist and it sucks how much he is sidelined for Diego. I didn’t hate Diego but Winston and him basically went through the same arc. They were pro Monty and ending up dating a member of the group, couldnt believe that member was involved and then learned something about Bryce and Monty agreed to move on and just did. All while saying they will alway care for that member of the group. It was an unnecessary rehash. Having WInston be the outsider looking in and Diego the insider looking out also lets their characters compliment each other. They should still work together, just have Winston contact him looking for Monty’s friends. It’s simple.

2) Tyler and Tony

Oh Tyler. The character who seems to be in the middle of everything despite never doing anything himself. I didn’t mind his arc of helping the cops find the guys who sold the illegal guns. But Tony’s suspicions, eventually leading to Clay and Tony finding out the truth and just moving on never really go anywhere. I think it would be cool if Tyler tells Tony, despite the cops telling him not to tell anyone, because he trusts Tony. But Tony, who has had bad run ins with the cops, thinks it is a bad idea. He doesn’t want Tyler taking the deal. Tyler says its the only way the guns wont be traced back to them but Tony thinks teh cops are planning to double cross them to mind out more about Bryce and Monty. At the same time he starts getting close to that cop that takes him boxing and helps him get into college (i dont remember his name for the life of me lol). Tyler sees this as being hypocritical and pulls away. Tony still suspects Tyler is behind the lock down because he is pulling away and Tony is getting paranoid. The rest of their story can still be the same but this way they can show Tony’s paranoia and his loyalty.

As for Tyler and Estella, It was fine. The scene of them in the bathroom was really powerful, being in the bathroom with a de la cruz and becoming comfortable because isnt her brother was really nice. This could even be another reason Tony and Tyler fight. Tony can be paranoid that Tyler is trusting her too quickly and think she will turn on him.

3) Jess

Her arc with the principal, being scared and agreeing with the security measures before she sees them in action was really interesting. Focus more on it and less on her manipulating Diego. I did like parts of that arc for her so I don’t want it completely gone but I do think focusing on her working with the principal would have been cool. I would call more attention to her first meeting and her agreeing with the measures and slowly show her change her mind and start to turn against them. Maybe even have an early scene of her and ANi talking about it and have Jess admit she feels safer. Move the creepy cop trying to pat her down to the second or third day. So she can have a moment where they make her feel safe before the negative experience. I loved the protest and a bit better build up would have made it amazing

Her arc with Ani. They fought over Bryce... It should have been a conversation. Not a moment where Ani judges Diego and then they argue. I still think this arc should have been Chloe and Jess and should have been in last season. But they had the opportunity to include Chloe this season and just didnt. I’ll talk about this a bit more in the Zach section but I think Chloe should have been at Prom and the moment between the Ani Jess and Chloe should have been then. It would be right after Jess and Ani made up and would have been cool.

I don’t think she should have had scenes where she saw and talked to Bryce. Yes it created some powerful moments but they could be reworked. Have WInston use his wealth to commission a positive thing in the paper about Bryce and Monty and have her talk to his idealized photo of Bryce. I will mention it in the Clay section but her hallucinations detracted from his journey with mental health.

4) Clay

Okay two thing here the first is his arc with mental health, hallucinations, and blackouts. They used it for drama and I wish they hadnt. It should have been about him healing. I didnt mind the way they handled the realization for clay that it was him doing everything (Did they explain the symbol he kept drawing because I missed it if they did? or i just forgot because it was that forgettable lol) but I think the whole thing could have been handled a lot better and a more educated fan then I can provide a better explanation for what exactly was off about it. I will say the the therapy sessions were repetitive and I know thats realistic but for a tv show its boring. The scene were Clay goes to his home was weird and low key scary. I understand the purpose but I wish he had called him and asked to meet at his office instead. A more likable and relatable journey for Clay with his mental health would be really good for a show that was accused of glorying suicide (personally i dont think it did. My inbox is open if you wanna talk though :))

The second thing is the phantom phone caller. I hate this trope so it might just be me but this is so stale. There are exactly two ways it could go. The person could know everything and be a real problem or the person could be fishing for information and not be a real problem. The whole thing was predicable since Winston had red herring written all over him, Estella was barely developed, and on this show it is always the football guys. Instead let the pranks be smaller and less crazy. Like these boys had to coordinate a lot to mess with Clay. There should be more than one prank and end with a Monty doll and Clay holding a knife to set up the camp episode. But they should be pranks, not the phantom caller psychological torture bs. The blood shower can also happen just on a different day. Clay can be confused about what is real and what isnt making him even more worried about his blackouts and again assuming the mental health arc is handled well, the pranks can be a real part of it. Dumping him in the pit on the camping trip also seemed kinda attempted murdery so maybe do something like tie him to a tree of the path or in a small dirt ditch not a rocky pit where if he hit his head or fell weird the team would all be murderers.

5) Alex

His arc with Charlie was one of my favorite stories this season. I was also not bothered by him getting close to and exploring his sexuality with Winston and Zach. I’m in the minority but I’m glad Zalex wasn’t made canon and Zach was used to be an effective (kinda) ally and good friend. Plus this way Zalex can live on in the fandom untouched or ruined by the writers interpretation.

They should have given us Alex in therapy. He tried to kill himself had a traumatic injury, an arc with steroid abuse, and an arc about killing someone. All of which were forgotten this season. All the other characters seemed to be dealing with Bryce and Monty, why not focus on Alex? Even if it isnt in therapy just let him exist in his feelings.

6) Zach

I have one major issue with Zach’s arc, the lack of Chloe. She was the reason he almost killed a man. Let them date, let him start to spiral while dating her. She doesnt know what he did. Have them grow apart on screen but her still connecting to him and not wanting to give up on him. They should go to prom together. I know the hooker was supposed to represent Zach turning into Bryce with the hookers and the drunken sex/potential rape and cocaine. But Chloe fills the same comparison. He brings cocaine she is not okay with it, He tries to convince her to have sex in the back she is not having it. Maybe he tries to convince maybe it becomes a bit worse than that but she breaks up with him at prom and leaves early. She sees Bryce in him, she doesnt have to say it but you can see it on her face and she walks away when her mind and heart tells her to this time no making excuses. Boom Chloe actually has an arc. As for Zach this is a big wake up call for him he sees what we had become. I know it is later in the actual show but I think it should be in the prom episode so he can have a better conclusion in the finale, like the other characters. The whole season was a downward spiral and I wish we got to see more of him pulling himself out of it. If the whole finale is him getting better even though he wont be all the way done he will be in a better place up the end.

7) Justin

Okay the hard one. I think the writers really wanted to kill him. I mean a fan favorite, who did bad things, and the death would be in the series finale. this is a tv writer’s drug of choice. So I’m gonna do a fix where I still kill him first then to the ideal version. Ok so first Justin dies. No HIV/AIDS. It was out of nowhere, unneeded, and seemed a bit insensitive. If you want it to be related to his drug use, make it so he got a bad batch when he relapsed. Or maybe organ failure. If it doens’t need to be drug related it can be an accident or someone he knew on the streets getting revenge, like that drug dealer we spent time with last season. Or if Justin helps Tyler put the gun salesmen behind bars then have it be retaliation for that. He can still go to the hospital and have goodbyes but it wont be an aids diagnosis and death in the same episode. I know they had signs in earlier episodes but the timeline is still really fucked up...

An ideal ending would have him live. He can still pass out at Prom. The diagnosis can be a combination of stress and withdrawal symptoms.He can be the red herring for the person in the coffin. If Justin lives he can represent hope. He can show the audience that you can get better and things can work out. Even if you are sick and think you will die you can do better be better and live in a better world. Plus I love him and really wanted him to be happy. The message would be you can get out of a bad situation and wold have ended a sad series on a positive note. Even if you are a bad person. Even if you have bad circumstance. Even if it feels like the world is against you, it can get better if you put in the effort. Which felt like the message the show was going for in eariler seasons by showing the people on the tapes doing better but abandoned this last season.

So who would I put in the coffin. Ani’s mom. Now I know she wasn’t a well liked character and her mom wouldn’t have the same audience or character reaction Justin’s death did. But this version isn’t about making the audience sad. Ani would finally have a plot that was really about her, her mom died, Bryce’s mom basically wants to provide for her. And she isn’t sure what to do. Justins funeral felt like it was overshadowed by graduation anyway. Now Ani’s moms absence and the funeral being overshadowed both make sense. She is going to college and doing what she can to honor her mom. And the death of a parent causes Clay to immediately appreciate his own family more. The theme in the first season with Clay was appreciating and acting on his feelings for Hannah before she was gone. Ani’s mom dying is a reality check for him and he know the most important things are his family and friends. Justin’s arc was about finding a family and he did. The core of the show is about family, friends, and the importance of a strong support system. And starting it with a mother grieving her daughter and ending it with a daughter grieving her mother would be a cool full circle moment.

This post is really long so if you read all the way down Thank you! :)

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ruffiorocks · 4 years ago

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Trying to understand Catra

Just re-watching season 1 episode 11 and this one really does give you an insight into why Catra is the way she is.

The first time you watch the childhood memories of Catra and Adora you just see Adora looking out for Catra (at least I did) but then this time round now that I've seen the final season I'm seeing more in this episode.

Those memories aren't just Adora looking out for Catra, yeah sure is being a best friend to her, but that's not all that's happening. The pickles Catra gets into are only ever resolved because Adora is there to help or speak up for her.

The training memory shows that Catra, despite being treated like garbage and not having much of a connection with anyone but Adora is actually really good at combat, she shines here, but she just can't outshine Adora. But she doesn't act bitter about it to Adora's face, she's supportive and then goes to let out her frustrations in the changing room.

The worst one is the scene where Catra and Adora go into the black garnet chamber and get caught by Shadow Weaver. Shadow Weaver doesn't think for a second to blame Adora or use magic on her or threaten her. It's automatically Catra's fault. Shadow Weaver threatens a little child. She actually tells Catra she will "dispose of her" herself if she hinders Adora's future in any way. She tell her that she only tolerates Catra because Adora is fond of her. That is quite horrific when you really think about it! Does Shadow Weaver hold any of the other orphans or cadets to these standards? Or is it just a personal vendetta against one child? Catra is told her place in the Horde, heck her very life is all dependent on her being in Adora's good graces. Catra can't shine now even if she truly wanted to, because of the risk it presents.

Shadow Weaver tell Adora she has to keep better control of Catra. Catra is there listening to this and it comes across as though Adora is her "keeper" . She is effectively Adora's "pet" so it's no wonder she lashes out.

When the memory ends Adora tells Catra she could come and join the rebellion and then she gets irritated that Catra doesn't just leave Shadow Weaver. But it's not the same for Catra as it was for Adora. I don't really like going into abuse themes, but if I don't someone will mention it. So here goes, we didn't see Adora being abused by Shadow Weaver, she is the golden girl, everyone likes her and even when she does something wrong it's blamed on Catra. Heck it reminds me of the old practice of having a "whipping boy" you can't punish royalty so you punish their servant in the hope they behave themselves.

Catra on the other hand is shown to be abused by Shadow Weaver, it's not as easy for someone to walk away from their abuser. It's all Catra knows and as we've seen, Catra has a bit of Stockholm syndrome where Shadow Weaver is concerned. She still wants her approval, she tells her not to worry when Hordak is mad and even when Shadow Weaver is locked up, Catra can't help but keep going to visit her. She's even heart broken when Shadow Weaver leaves, and who does she go to? Straight to Adora.

When Adora leaves the only thing Shadow Weaver cares about is getting her back and once again blaming Catra for something that Adora chose to do. Hordak on the other hand doesnt care about getting Adora back and he gives Catra something that she has never had before, he gives her chance to shine! He SEES her! Even when Adora goes to rescue Glimmer and Bow Shadow Weaver is ecstatic because she can erase Adora's mind and she tells Catra she's no longer relevant because Adora is back. It does explain why Catra let's Adora go and why she tells Adora this, Catra doesn't want and can't stand the idea of going back to being just "Adora's Pet".

Her relationship with Scorpia is a harsh one. But Scorpia isn't the cute, innocent little baby she's presented as. Scorpia willingly works for the Horde, she has no problem joining Catra in her missions to take the rebellion out. It's Scorpia that plants the heat bombs at the Princess Prom and uses her tail to sting Bow and Glimmer so they can be kidnapped. We just don't like to see her that way because she's funny, and sweet and likes to give warm hugs.

We can see moments where Catra enjoys being with Scorpia, where she's almost allowing herself to be real friends with her. But then she's pulled back and resorts to her defence mechanism of being an ass. Scorpia wants to protect her, hug her, take care of her, BUT that is exactly what Adora did. To me, even though Catra's behaviour isn't right, it's her not wanting to create that kind of a bond again because losing Adora was too much for her but at the same time it kind of freed her. She also doesn't want to become reliant on someone having to protect her all the time because thats what she's had to live with her entire life. What if Scorpia decides to leave like Adora did? It's a vicious , unhealthy cycle. She's also so obsessed with getting her job done and shining because now she can, she has Hordaks approval, she's taken her abusers place and suddenly has all this power and it goes to her head because what happens if she fails? She even gets rid of Entrapta because Entrapta won't let her proceed with the plan to open the portal, Catra is of course totally in the wrong but she's so far down the path she can't let go anymore. Sure she causes a lot of damage, but later on Glimmer causes a major issue when she trusts Shadow Weaver and messes with the Heart of Etheria because she's gone to far down a path she shouldn't have gone as well.

These memories, the one where Adora tells her nothing can just them as long as they have eachother is clearly something Catra had to rely on her whole life. Then suddenly Adora and that promise were gone. Catra had to be Adora's obedient pet the whole time they were in the Fright Zone, but that also means she had to believe the things Adora did and make sure she proved it, and that's a belief in the Horde.

People like to talk about the brain washing Hordak went through with Horde Prime. But what about the brain washing the orphans and cadets went through in the Fright Zone? Lonnie, Kyle, Regalio? They all happily fought for the Horde and took joy in taking down towns in season 4.

We always see Catra being both nice and an ass to Adora throughout the series. But to me it shows the conflict in Catra. She loves Adora, but part of her know she's Adora's pet and she rebels against this and takes it out on Adora, but the other part loves Adora and can't bear to be away from her. Adora doesn't understand it because all she sees is herself being treated very well and always saving Catra. She doesn't see what Catra really goes through, even though she knows that she's treated bad. Adora then gets a destiny, a life changing field trip and a bunch of new friends, then she just leaves and expects Catra to leave with her. But Catra doesn't have the same experience as Adora, all she sees is her best friend/The only reason she's still alive abandoning everything they were both dedicated to.

At the end of the episode Catra makes a choice, she can either wallow and want Adora back, or let go of Adora and move on. Catra tells Adora what living in her shadow is like and Adora is acting like it's the first time she has ever considered how everything affected Catra, she apologises but to Catra it's to late.

Scorpia tells Entrapta that Catra is the best friend ever, and you can see Catra stop for a second but we don't see her face. You can tell this comment has stopped her in her tracks, perhaps she does want to be a best friend again on her own merit, but she just won't allow herself to go down that road again. But this is ultimately the thing that causes her to lose everything.

Anyway, rant over, I'm glad it all ended happily 😊

#catra x adora #catra x scorpia #catradora #catra #Adora #she ra adora #she ra #shadow weaver #hordak

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