#(( maybe he impersonating romano ))

[fuimus-troes]

I saw your earlier post abt Would You Fall In Love With Me Again and The Challenge as being Spaus-coded and that got me thinking about a Spaus EPIC au (I was also driving and listening to the second half of the musical so I got Ideas)

- Suffering & Different Beast would be very funny bc Austria being in water would break the illusion for Spain immediately. Just like—“Is that Rodrigo in the water??? Absolutely not. That’s some magic impersonation bullshit right there”

- Whatever hesitation Odysseus had in Scylla and Thunder Bringer, Antonio has absolutely none of it lol. He also felt complete and utter *rage* during mutiny.

- For Love In Paradise, Spain refuses to sleep with Calypso not out of a sense of faithfulness to Austria, but bc she immediately came at him with “It’s just you and me here” and “my love” and “you’re mine”. It feels like a trap and he does not want to fall for it.

- Antiochus is France bc I said so. And bc of certain things in canon. Other suitors include Türkiye and England.

- You’d think that I would put N. Italy as Telemachus but imo, Romano fits better. N. Italy is just hiding somewhere bc there’s too many suitors lol.

YES YES YES i've been microwaving the thought of an epic hetalia au in my head since i heard Get in the Water (which was the song that introduced me to the musical in first place) and then i was hit with "wait spaus are literally odysseus and penelope in slightly different font" realization and it was officially over for me SO

— on Suffering and Different Beast YES. antonio is squinting at the distance like "yeah you've lost me, my husband wouldn't even drink water if he could, not to mention that he can't swim." it gets him SO MAD also, bc not only siren is using his beloved husband to get at him, but she's also doing a SHITTY FUCKING JOB with it, like literally how dare you. off with your tail.

— i second it, raging antonio during Mutiny is chefs kiss and absolutely fucking correct (anger issues spain my beloved, i think about you everyday ❤️) also the image of roderich comforting antonio (or more like enabling bc antonio knows his decision right away and he doesn't give a fuck, he will see his husband and kids Period) with "let me take the suffering from you" lives in my head rent free.

— i am THE faithful antonio truther (even tho i absolutely can see the vision, but i just. hate cheating in general and as a trope with raging passion) so to me, it was both him being faithful and trying to avoid being trapped. not to mention that her behavior in comparison to roderich's (who's not a pda guy most of the time) just makes his brain shortcut, like why are you throwing yourself on me. can you like. take a step back, or maybe five?

— agreeing on antiochus being francis because antonio shooting francis in the throat would be hot. kill the bitch, antonio, you go antonio. (side note, since the first song i heard was Get in the Water, my brain connected it to england IMMEDIATELY. and since i have a fem!england brain disease, all i could think of while listening to Ruthlessness and Get in the Water was her constantly trying to drown antonio's ships. AND side note again but. Ruthlessness during the wreckage of the spanish armada. Get in the Water during the battle of trafalgar. yeah. yeah)

— YES TELEMACHUS ROMANO LET'S GOOO i usually went for hre bc i don't really see roderich as a father figure to italies in canon, so the possibility wasn't even on my mind, but romano as telemachus would slap so hard. imma need to listen to Little Wolf with that in mind

— antonio: would you still love me if i was a war criminal 🥺👉👈

roderich, who's currently dealing with the realization that antonio being covered in blood from head to toe is kind of doing it for him:

[astronomical-bagel]

Do you have any more random observations about Sanders Sides? The last post with them was really cool

Gladly, kind traveler!!

We’ve been to Patton’s and Virgil’s rooms, but the remaining sides have all taken Thomas to a different realm of sorts (the debate room, the theater, the court room, and that weird black place from Forbidden fruit)

Roman resorts to Remus humor/ideas a surprising amount for someone who is terrified of being seen like him.

Virgil actually counted out every single time that Thomas had overthought a problem athd. Did he slow down time to make all the scratches in the wall? Does he make one new scratch for every time? Did he just bullshit a number? Also, him waving the scratches away is pretty cool. 

Patton started taking off his pants in aio when Roman said that “I wear the pants in this house!” And yet, in aa, Patton made Thomas put his pants back on. 

Thomas has a Very Specific track that plays almost every time something gets sentimental (like in Roman’s speech during aa) and it makes me tear up every time

The fact that they didn’t come up with and answer to ““why do we wake up in the morning?” Is kinda concerning, ngl. Also, that is a really long episode name hh (what even is the abbreviation?? wdwwuitm?)

Remus is even paler than Virgil, and obviously has darker eyeshadow, and yet everyone comments on *Virgil’s* makeup

Roman has had two food nicknames so far (Romano cheese and romaine lettuce)  and has made two food comments (maybe more), one about corn and the other about mashed potatoes, and honestly same 

Janus tends to turn his face when he’s lying, I believe. It’s especially prevalent in clbg, but I’d need to watch the other Janus eps to make sure that he keeps that habit 

Roman refers to the Dragon Witch with she/her pronouns, and yet her voice was really deep and decidedly amab, so yeah she’s definitely trans and also I love her

Roman takes off his shirt like a girl. This statement makes total sense, I promise. I’m guessing most of y’all have seen that post with girls vs boys taking off shirts? That. (And if any of y’all wanna check, Roman starts taking off his shirt near the beginning-ish of lntao)

We haven’t seen Remus with purple hair, which makes me so, so sad. Do you think the tips of his mustache were purple, too?

Roman was wearing three-ish, four-ish layers in athd. I’m surprised he didn’t get heatstroke

Logan canonically is turned on by meeting deadlines, and that is the most cursed information within the entire show, Remus included. And no one mentioned it, for some reason??

When Thomas called Logan cool, the transcript reads “disbelieving scoff” and then he sinks out

According to his playlist, Remus is a toesucker. I am not surprised.

So, from what I’ve seen, the sides’ tics are: For Logan, adjusting his glasses and tie; for Roman, running his hands through his hair (and one or two times he fiddled or clutches at his sash); for Virgil, fiddling with his sleeves, and blowing at his hair (idk he does that often tho); for Patton....I actually can’t think of any at the moment, unless putting your hands in your hips counts as a tic; for Remus, that hand thing he did, idk what to call it; and Janus is so smooth and coy that I doubt he has one, though fiddling with his gloves would probably be most likely

Virgil just wanders around Thomas’s house, apparently?? Does he like...knock down glasses sometimes?? Can he interact with Thomas’s apartment?? 

Patton has the blinds, Roman has a tv and a lamp, Virgil has stairs, and Logan has what, the door?? The kitchen??? A hallway??? Why does he have so much room?? No wonder Janus has impersonated him the most, Logan actually has room to breathe over there

The dark sides seem to have trouble rising up?? Like, I’m excluding Remus’s first appearance bc he was crouched behind a tv and ambushing his brother and that’s a bit different than the standard rising up. Like, think about it, Virgil has risen up only twice, I believe, at the end of the two-parters, and Janus, when revealed, just sorta...appeared. And when he was impersonating Logan the first time, he wobbled a bit when rising up, and the second time, he just popped into the lowdown, and at the end of the lilypadton scene, he just kinda walked into place or smth. Remus rose up from behind the tv, but after that, he just kinda appeared and reappeared later. I wonder why?

Thomas has a lamp, tv, a light switch and a window all within five feet of each other. 

Logan used to stand in roughly Virgil’s spot (the first couple eps), and Roman used to stand in Patton’s spot. It’s so strange to me when I rewatch the eps.

The first time Roman rose up, he kinda....rose up from the side? In a rainbow motion??? How did Thomas even DO that??? 

I’m also confused as to how they made roman’s hair look like it was being pulled in logic vs passion

Roman has like three-ish (his shirt seems to be made of two parts, idk if that counts as a second layer or not lol) layers, even with a black shirt underneath, while Remus has a wide collar with no undershirt like the gay slut that he is

Aaaannnd that’s all I can think of for now but THANKS for asking it’s so fun to do these (I hope I didn’t repeat any lol) and sorry for any spelling mistakes It’s like 2am lol

[princestxrm]

My fault - Roman angst

(Reposting from my Wattpad, tws in the tags)

Platonic prinxiety!

Uh- I don't usually write angst about suicide or topics like that, because... I just don't? But I wasn't feeling my best, so here we are! Oh- uh- also, I didn't proof read this and I wrote it at 3 am so I'm a 100% sure it sucks and there are a lot of mistakes.

Roman stared at himself in the mirror, he didn't feel mad or sad… He just felt tired, emotionally tired, he hated himself so damn much, he shouldn't have laughed at Janus' name… If he hadn't done that then maybe he could have avoided the painful comment Janus made afterward… But, maybe Janus was right, maybe Roman is evil, just like his brother, maybe he was right all along… Maybe Roman is the villain, oh, what a twist! The "hero" ends up being the true villain of the story…

"We love you" He mimicked Patton with a mocking tone underneath his breath "Yeah, right… I don't even love myself how could you love me?" He sadly giggled "I'm not good enough, am I? All I do is hurt the people around me" It's been 2 years since Virgil tried ducking out, none of the others sides have had the guts to tell Thomas that "ducking out" is like committing suicide if a side stops doing their job for an extended amount of time, they disappear, no one had ever directly told Roman that Virgil trying to duck out was his fault, but he knew they thought that and most importantly he knew it was true, why would Virgil try to do that if it wasn't because of all the hateful comments Roman had made in the past, he's been trying to stop hurting the people around him, but it's just impossible, it feels like whatever he tries he just ends up hurting someone else, Virgil didn't deserve it, neither did Janus, they were both trying to help Thomas, but unlike Virgil, Janus hurt Roman, he used him… Janus manipulated him 

"Roman! Are you okay? Can I come in?" Patton softly asked while knocking on the bedroom door 

"Go away!" Roman yelled 

Patton flinched at the sound of Roman's voice "I'm sorry for bothering you…" He apologized in a much lower voice but still loud enough for Roman to hear from the other side 

Roman felt bad about reacting in that way when Patton just wanted to help, but, what if it wasn't really Patton? What if Janus sent Patton to talk to him so he can manipulate him even more? But, what if it was actually Patton and he just wanted to help, but like a fool, he reacted in a rude way? And now Patton was probably sad… Roman sat on his bed, he stayed there for a while, thinking about nothing, just letting the tears fall "I hate myself so much…" He whispered underneath his breath "I deserve this, I deserve Thomas to hate me… I'm his creativity, I should come up with more original ideas, I should be better…."

"Romano!" He heard Virgil's voice for the other side of the door "Dude, you doin' ok?"

"Yeah…" Roman replied

"You sure? Patton told me about what happened today…" He sighed "Can I come in?"

"No…"

"Ok, I don't care I'm coming in any way" He sat next to Roman on the bed "You've been crying haven't you?"

Roman nodded

"Roman, I honestly don't really like Janus, I hate him if I'm being honest, but… maybe he isn't too bad, maybe he isn't the villain like we expected him to be"

Roman sighed "Listen, I can understand you not being the bad guy, but Janus literally impersonated our friends and made us play along, he manipulated us!"

Virgil placed his hand over Roman's shoulder 

"Virgil…" Roman took a deep breath "If you, Remus and Janus aren't the villains, does that mean I'm still the hero?" He sadly giggled "Don't even answer it, of course, I'm not… I'm the villain now! Thomas sees me as the villain now" his voice was now shaky, he was clearly going to start crying, Virgil slowly brushed Roman's hair with his fingers to calm him down "Does it feel nice? Is it helping?" 

Roman nodded "Can I hug you?" They've never properly hugged before, Roman was ready for Virgil to deny his offer

"I don't really like hugs, but I'll make an exception for you" Virgil softly hugged Roman

"Virgil… I'm so sorry" Roman said now crying 

"Why? Why? Why are you sorry?" He stuttered, he knew where this was going and was extremely surprised at the fact that Roman even apologized

"When you tried ducking out, it was my fault wasn't it?" Roman tightened the hug

"What? No, Roman! Of course not! It wasn't your fault"

"But I was the one to always insult you and treat you like shit"

"But that wasn't why I did it…" Virgil sighed "Just, Roman, it wasn't your fault, I promise"

"Please never leave me again!" He tightened the hug once again, he cried for a bit while Virgil softly brushed Roman’s hair with his fingers until he finally fell asleep and so did Virgil.

"Roman, are you in your room?" Janus said loudly opening the door "Oh" he whispered upon seeing the two sides asleep "I was going to apologize" Janus entered the room and grabbed a red blanket which was on top of a chair "But I'll guess I'll apologize to you two later…" He softly whispered placing the blanket on top of both sides and quietly leaving the room.

[damtoti]

Do you have any fic ideas you’re planning :0 ?

In terms of wips, yes, too many. Mainly because every time I sit down to write I end up starting something new, instead of working with what I already have. Here are a few that I have hopes of maybe, eventually, hopefully finishing at some point in my life. Fair warning, most of them are kinda angsty, lol...

1)  N. Italy / Germany / S. Italy:  PWP in which the Italy brothers are both charming, confident lovers who take charge and treat a lucky third (in this case, Germany) to a good time. Vene is flirty and teasing, Roma is rough and abrasive, but insanely good with his mouth, and Germany is too turned on to have coherent thoughts.

2) Greece / S. Italy:  An expansion of a drabble I wrote a while back. Romano and Greece are fuck buddies and the sex is great, but there’s angst lurking below.

3) N. Italy / S. Italy:  This is something I had planned for APH Rarepair week for the prompt “music” but idk if I’ll get to it in time. I wanted to do something with siren’s call where Vene is some type of aquatic fantasy creature who lures people to their deaths (lol)

4) Germany / S. Italy:  Romano decides to impersonate his brother as part of a dumb prank. But things escalate, and he begins to push the limits, testing how far he can go before Germany figures out the truth and stops him. But maybe Germany isn’t as oblivious as Romano thinks. (Honestly this one was impossible to summarize because there are too many layers, but basically here’s one where Romano (and also Germany) act like assholes, because I overuse Vene as a villain)

5) Spain / S. Italy:  Trying to brush up a fic I submitted years ago for an exchange (which wasn’t good, very rushed and not at all conclusive). It’s a human AU where Lovino starts getting creepy (but not explicitly threatening) messages from a stalker. The fear drives him closer to his too-nosy coworker, Antonio, who he used to find pushy and annoying, but now sees as a protective presence.

They eventually start dating. Despite being an attentive and affectionate partner, Antonio tends to dismiss Lovino’s boundaries, starting with small things, but getting progressively more serious. Every time Lovino thinks things have gone too far and plans to leave, the creepy letters begin to increase, ultimately driving him back to Antonio.

[whimsicalskything]

I finished!!

Holy crap that was a ride!

So thoughts:

44 minutes??!! Oh joy!

Oh, shoot Deceit can actually fully tell the truth. well there goes all that fanfiction lol

Virgil looks genuinely uncomfortable holy crap what did Dee ever do to you? No, seriously I wanna know

Dee is snarky and sassy I love

They are in SUITS!!! I AM SO HAPPY RN I STARED AT THE WALL WITH A BIG GRIN LIKE AN IDIOT TRYING TO COMPREHEND

“well then don’t get impersonated.” -Romano

I am... love Deceit’s suit like holy crap and his arguments 

he started going off about names with Virgil like that got me 

Society!!!!

Omg Roman comes through in the end

HIS LOGOOOOOOOOO 

I still love his outfit

poor logan. He was a side character. Maybe he can have another debate with anxiety

Okay, but who are Deceit’s “friends”?

WHOOHOO LIFE LESSONS WITH PATTON!!~

Analyzing the new vid:

Okay I know that deceit wasn’t the most loveable character but when he’s self-preservation and he’s so annoyed with his host and other figments that he takes them TO A MOTHERF’ING COURTROOM and has a whole MOCK TRIAL its kinda hard not to feel bad for how hard he’s trying and the fact that he’s not getting any credit. He was trying to prove a point to Thomas that entire video and even once Thomas realized, he still didn’t get it. I understand that with the stakes lying is incredibly wrong, but Dee wasn’t trying to get Thomas to lie to his friends necessarily, He was trying to make Thomas understand that he was lying to HIMSELF. That going to the wedding would make Thomas unhappy. And while Virgil seems to be Thomas’s physical and sometimes mental self-preservation, Deceit is the selfish kind. He’s the one that says you can’t buy that person a gift or give money to someone because you need it for yourself and that can often times require lying. And whether that’s bad or not is up for interpretation but that's what he seems to be and I can’t wait to explore his character more in the future.

[toldnews-blog]

New Post has been published on https://toldnews.com/technology/entertainment/s-n-l-welcomes-adam-sandler-back-and-mostly-avoids-politics/

‘S.N.L.’ Welcomes Adam Sandler Back and (Mostly) Avoids Politics

Was Opera Man there? Of course Opera Man was there.

It was Adam Sandler’s first time hosting “Saturday Night Live” since he unceremoniously departed the show nearly a quarter-century ago, so naturally he brought back some of his best-loved characters from the mid-90s era when he shared the “S.N.L.” stage with David Spade, Mike Myers, Molly Shannon and others.

Sandler also drew out some other celebrated “S.N.L.” alums to pop up throughout this weekend’s broadcast, which also featured the musical guest Shawn Mendes. But more crucially, Sandler’s presence seemed to inspire the current cast and creative team to dig deeply for material that matched their host’s stature and impish spirit — if nothing else, “S.N.L.” largely set aside its divisive political pantomimes in favor of more absurdist sketches, and ended on a surprisingly touching note.

But first, Sandler had to account for how his “S.N.L.” tenure had ended in 1995. As he said in his monologue, he was 23 years old when he joined the show, his cast mates David Spade and Rob Schneider were 25 and “Norm Macdonald was maybe 60.” He said that he lost his virginity “to a woman in this very studio — I don’t kiss and tell but it was the Church Lady,” adding, “She said I was special.”

Then, explaining his exit from the program, Sandler began to sing:

I was fired, I was fired, I was fired, so sad to tell Well I never saw it coming I got fired from “S.N.L.”

In another verse, he explained:

I got fired, not rehired Well it made me sad and blue I told my boy Chris Farley I got fired And he said, “Sandman, they fired my [expletive], too”

Chris Rock, a friend of Sandler’s and former “S.N.L.” cast member, turned up to contribute a verse of his own. He sang:

I got fired, I was fired, I was fired by NBC. Then I went on “In Living Color” Three weeks later, they took it off TV

Pete Davidson, a current “S.N.L.” performer, also started to sing about being fired from the show, but Sandler told him he hadn’t been let go. “I wasn’t?” Davidson asked. “How is that even possible?” Sandler replied, “I don’t know, but be patient because it’s coming soon.”

Then Sandler sang his closing verse:

I was fired, I was fired NBC said that I was done Then I made over $4 billion at the box office So I guess you could say I won

Impersonation Smorgasbord of the Week

As has often been the case this season, the opening sketch seemed at first to promise a comedic re-enactment of a recent political event. But no — as an exhausted narrator explained, Attorney General William P. Barr pulled out of a hearing before the House Judiciary Committee and then, the voice-over continued, “the Democrats chose to do some light prop comedy with a bucket of chicken. The whole thing was so depressing that we’d rather focus on the two things all Americans can get behind: ‘Game of Thrones’ and ‘Avengers.’”

That set up a “Family Feud” parody featuring the “S.N.L.” cast as characters from “Game of Thrones” (including Kate McKinnon as Brienne of Tarth; Melissa Villaseñor as Arya Stark) and “Avengers: Endgame” (Beck Bennett as Thanos; Leslie Jones as a comically miscast Groot). But of course the best lines went to Kenan Thompson as the host Steve Harvey, who repeatedly mocked both teams and their media franchises: “Let’s start with the Avengers,” he said at the outset, “because this show is just like their movies. We’re going to open with 45 minutes of introductions.”

Fake Ad of the Week

Sandler turned in a memorably deadpan performance as Joe Romano, the proprietor of Romano Tours, a company offering vacations in Italy to customers who come from all over “but mostly Long Island and Jersey.” Yet as the commercial went on, Sandler made clear he was addressing a certain kind of clientele: “People love us,” he said, “but every so often a customer leaves a review that they were disappointed or didn’t have as much fun as they thought. So here at Romano Tours, we always remind our customers: If you’re sad now, you might still feel sad there, O.K.?”

As he went on to painstakingly explain, with onscreen graphics and client testimonials, Sandler said, “Remember you’re still going to be you, on vacation. If you are sad where you are, and then you get on a plane to Italy, you, in Italy, will be the same sad you from before. Just in a new place. Does that make sense?”

Family Reunion of the Week

The celebrity family reunion sketch is a format that “S.N.L.” has used before, with hosts like Christopher Walken and Jim Carrey, but it seemed especially suited for Sandler, allowing the host to play straight man while the current cast served his characters and mannerisms back to him. That roster included Melissa Villaseñor paying homage to Sandler’s title character from “The Waterboy” and Pete Davidson as “Little Nicky,” as well as guest appearances from Jimmy Fallon and Kristen Wiig.

‘Weekend Update’ Character of the Week

Kate McKinnon reprised her recurring role as Elizabeth Warren, appearing at the “Weekend Update” desk to ask why her policy proposals aren’t getting more traction as the race for the 2020 Democratic presidential nomination heats up. “I’m over here, working ’round the clock to give you free college,” McKinnon said. “But oh, look-ee there — Beto O’Dork did parkour in a Starbucks. Wow. Whoops, I just figured out universal pre-K but what’s that over there — Mayor Pete Bu-Judge Judy-Jute’s playing piano and speaking fluent Klingon.”

Opera Man Medley of the Week

Yes, Sandler did previously put on the wig and cape of Opera Man, his grandiose “Weekend Update” vocalist, for the “S.N.L.” 40th anniversary special that aired in 2015. But we’ll regard this segment as his true return to the character, when he finally got to croon about President Trump, “Game of Thrones” and the prospects for the 2020 election. As he sang to the tune of “La donna è mobile”:

Kamala, Gillibrand Klobuchar, Warren They have slim chance-o They wear no pants-o

Cory, Pete and Beto Will have to wait-o Here we go again 70-year-old men

Chris Farley Tribute of the Week

With a tenderness and sincerity that he doesn’t often reveal in his comedy performances, Sandler closed out the show standing on the stage of Studio 8H with a guitar, singing a moving tribute to his “S.N.L.” co-star Chris Farley. Farley died from a drug overdose in 1997, at the age of 33, and a screen behind Sandler showed candid photos and videos of Farley from throughout his life, as well as some of his memorable “S.N.L.” performances, while the host sang about him in a balladeering, Springsteen mode:

The first time I saw him he was sweeter than honey Plaid jacket and belt too tight, and he wasn’t even being funny Then he cartwheeled ’round the room and slow-danced with the cleaning lady He was a one-man party You know I’m talking about — I’m talking about my friend Chris Farley

[slayerbook]

The Dark Knight Eviscerated

Here’s a thought that’s been nagging at me awhile now:

The Dark Knight Returns is the ultimate Batman story. And a significant, worthy piece of Western fiction. The cartoon movie, however, makes some baffling choices.

It’s probably my favorite Bat movie (after the Batman ‘66 one). I’m famously picky about Bat movies. I think Tim Burton’s Batman flicks are basically worthless — influential and significant, but crappy. And the Nolan ones are no fun: No scene can be summarized as “Bad guys are doing bad shit, then Batman drops in and kicks much ass.” (Captain America: The Winter Soldier is a much better Batman movie than any of the Batman movies. And the Bat fights in Bats v. Supes sure are swell, but...)

So unlike ALL other Batmovies, proper director Joy Oliva gave the cartoon Dark Knight Returns enough good action to satisfy. Still: over time, those choices gnawed at me. Some consciously, some not.

The cast is swell, but voice acting is disjointed and awful. Voice Director Andrea Romano is an hero in animation, but man, I don’t understand what she OK’d here. Peter Weller, Robocop himself, voices Bruce. He said he didn’t even read the comics, because he wanted to do his own thing with it. Oooof. I wish he had read it.

But more important: The script. Two things I can't get over, one obvious, one subtle but significant:

One: Cutting the narration, bad choice: If you're going to make a movie from the book, do it. Don't make it something else. Cutting the narration is like them adapting Year One, but totally changing the art style (only to use it in the credits,as if to say "Yeah, we coulda done that, but this is OUR shit — great, right?!"). But here's the one(s) I noticed this month, when I caught it on HBO:

Two, and here’s the kicker: The adaptation does everything it can to soften the political content. And the political content is essential. Not only does the adaptation remove the Bruce quote that serves as a thesis:

Bruce to Clark: "You say yes to anybody with a badge & a flag."

It also removes a nearby line from Oliver, who calls the police “fascist sons of bitches!"

The “badge & a flag” line is replaced with a couple utterly toothless, vague lines about being obedient to the wrong kind of authority. The changes remind me of Alan Moore objecting to V for Vendetta adaptation because the movie fails to mention fascism.

So, in conclusion, the Dark Knight Returns cartoon has stellar action, but fails because it won't say what the book does. The cartoon tells the story, but reduces it to a clash between two big superheroes — two essential American ideologies, not so much.

And I get it: What do you expect from a corporate cartoon?

But still, you know? If you're gonna do the thing, do the thing.

— BONUS: Here’s my full Winter Soldier vs. Nolan Batman piece, after the jump

I wrote this when Winter Solider was a new release, for Diffuser, which tried to be the AV Club for a minute, before the bosses stepped in and f*cked it up:

Captain America Out-Batmans Batman, and It Didn’t Take Much

It’s on. Captain America will go head-to-head against Batman and Superman in the DC heroes’ all-but-guaranteed megasmash crossover, when both franchises' next movies are released on the same day, May 6, 2016. Improbably, brand loyalty notwithstanding, Cap has the advantage if you’re waiting for an emotionally charged, kick-ass thrillride.

 Providing three-or-more thrills a minute, the pulse-pounding new “Captain America: The Winter Soldier” retroactively reduces all Batman movies’ scores by two letter grades. (OK, 2008’s “The Dark Knight” only loses one letter, for reasons we’ll get into). If “Winter Soldier” isn’t the best Super Hero Movie, Super Hero Action Movie, and Comic Book Movie, then it’s certainly in the top 3, in contention with “The Avengers,” “Scott Pilgrim vs. the World,” and M. Night Shylaman’s underrecognized “Unbreakable” — but definitely not Chris Nolan’s Bat-movies (or Bat-writer David Goyer’s mixed-bag of a Superman reboot, 2013’s “Man of Steel”).

 Captain America’s dark return once and for all shines a spotlight on the glaring fact that Batfans have been hesitant to acknowledge since Tim Burton’s slavishly overrated 1989 Batman: On the big screen, Batman has never been presented as an action hero.

 Both modern Batman franchises have been propelled into cult status through heroic applications of geek gratitude: A decent, dark Batman movie is better than no Batman movie. So the fanboys eat them up. And the people who don’t know any better embrace them as well.

 In retrospect, the Batmovies from the 1980s and ’90s paved the way for the superhero movie as we know it. But as Batmovies, they’re thorough failures. Burton’s first “Batman” was an art film with roughly thirty seconds of action, half of which involved Batman firing machine guns at Jack Nicholson, who was impersonating Daffy Duck, but somehow passed off himself off as the Joker. Clad in a rubber suit, Michael Keaton’s Batman punches a couple guys and almost randomly squares off with a Joker goon who has some martial arts training… for about six seconds.

 Batman 1989 Trailer:

http://youtu.be/HlsM2_8u_mk

 And the rest of the old-school Bat franchise is downhill from there. By 1997’s “Batman and Robin,” even with action icon Arnold Schwarzenneger in tow, the movies had developed into a campy drag-queen aesthetic. The universally derided — yet financially successful — final installment did more justice to Uma Thurman’s Poison Ivy than Batman or Bane. (In itself, there’s nothing wrong with that vibe, but it’s not what anybody wants in a Batflick.) At least Michael Keaton aced the brooding aspect of Batman. With George frickin’ Clooney and Val Kilmer in the Batman role, these supposed action flicks become costume fantasies that are invested in the idea that a person can put on a costume and suddenly become somebody completely different. And maybe that works at night clubs, but not when you’re fighting crime.

 At the heart of those Batflicks is a willful blind eye to physical reality: Someone who spent his whole life training to become Batman would not look — or move — like Keaton, Clooney, or Kilmer. Those movies barely pass the actors off as a billionaire playboy. And the action? Forget about it. The “Batman [’66]” TV series holds up better.

 That said, physical reality didn’t serve the Nolan Batmovies well, either. In 2005, “Batman Begins” provides a origin tale of young Bruce Wayne as a brawler-turned-ninja. And while it features some respectable action scenes, they’re not anything to make a viewer cringe or rewind and watch again. True, Nolan finally depicts Bruce Wayne as a guy who does some pushups. And real martial arts are in the mix, albeit with some stiff choreography.

 Batman Begins, Bruce Wayne escapes the League of Shadows… or does he?

http://youtu.be/Z8tysDC31Yo

 In 2008, the overlong “The Dark Knight” staged a couple swell action sequences, but they weren’t essentially rooted in Batman’s character. The most memorable IMAX-size scene is the Joker’s escape from a police van. In this second outing, Batman doesn’t emerge as an Olympic-level athlete. In fact, the plot’s tech-heavy resolution doesn’t make a very good case for Batman as a Sherlock Holmes-caliber detective, either. The guy in the costume is not doing what Batman is famous for doing.

 Dark Knight Van 2

http://youtu.be/Zg1cDKYmK98

 And the controversial misfire that was 2012 “The Dark Knight Rises”? Batman does fight more in it, but it’s nothing to blog about. Squaring off time and again, Batman and Bane trade rudimentary martial arts moves. The fighting style is realistic for a couple guys that size, but it’s dull.

 Batman’s big move is a thrusting front kick, which he uses over and over again. The technique is devastating when it connects, but you can see it coming all the way from the Triskelion. Batman’s first fight with Bane would be slightly more exciting if was really shot in total darkness. The movie’s climax involves a big vehicle chase, in which a weaponized camo SUV lobs a half-dozen slow-arcing, heat-seeking missiles at the Batwing. And it zooms away. Big whoop. Catwoman’s action had better choreography and revealed more about her character. At some point, Nolan deluded himself into imagining he was making a James Bond movie. “Dark Knight Rises”’ most memorable action sequences involve…

 1) Bane hijacking a plane (with Batman nowhere in sight).

 2) Hines Ward running back a kickoff for a touchdown as a football stadium collapses behind him (with Batman nowhere in sight).

 And

 3) Bane punching the sh*t out of a Tuscan column (instead of turning around, zeroing in on Batman, and displacing the rest of the Bat’s spinal column).

 Bane vs. the Architecture

http://youtu.be/DImh0ac-jdQ

 After all that realistic fighting, Bane can suddenly barehandedly dismantle a stone column? Now, obviously, Nolan made a decision to root his Batmovies in reality. But who cares? What’s more exciting? Tom Hardy, Chris Nolan, and very few invisible wires? Or this boss fight from the videogame “Batman: Arkham Origins”?

 http://youtu.be/OqEqN17zW8s

 Batman, obviously, has endless potential as an action hero. And it’s not like it can’t be done. The only Batman movie with real action scenes that will make you applaud, duck, and empathetically wince is the 2013 adaptation of Frank Miller’s game-changing mini-series “The Dark Knight Returns.” Director Jay Oliva researched real-life muay Thai and mixed-martials arts techniques to choreograph larger-than-life action scenes like Batman taking out an entire SWAT team (granted, they have the aim of Imperial Stormtroopers) and dissecting a feral gang leader who’s bigger and fiercer than Bane:

 Bats vs. Mutants

http://youtu.be/RV18kZIBBZA

 In the movie’s adaptation of the greatest fight in comic-book history, Batman defeats Superman in visceral hand-to-hand combat. (More or less: Bats is wearing an armored suit, and Superman is weakened from a previous nuclear explosion.) Maybe bringing the ultimate Batman story to life requires a cartoon, but maybe not.

 Dark Knight Returns, Supes-Bats pt 2, including steamroller

http://youtu.be/OYBClxNR_fU

 In Rocksteady’s “Arkham Knight,” photorealistic CGI turns Batman into a high-flying, car-jumping, slow-mo leaping, gang-punching, bullet-dodging, man of action (with the aid of some brilliant writing on par with Nolan & Goyer’s best).

 Batman Arkham Knight Trailer

http://youtu.be/wsf78BS9VE0

 Presumably, Goyer’s upcoming Batman-Superman reboot will take its cues from “Man of Steel” and deliver some superspeed hand-to-hand combat. But as of now, no Batmovie’s action scene can be roughly described thusly: “Batman swoops in out of nowhere and punches the bejeezus out of a bunch of dudes in a nimble, über-athletic manner.” No, if you want that kind of action, you need to see “Captain America: The Winter Solider.”

 If you experienced seen the movie yet, we know it sounds suspect. “Captain America: The First Avenger” was a good super hero origin story. But it wasn’t an earth-shaker. Not like “The Avengers, “which sets the bar on superhuman, comic book-style, truly-epic-scale action. But “Cap2ain America” brings the pain better than any franchise since the “Bourne” movies. The action in the new Cap flick isn’t about the Hulk and Thor taking down an invading alien army. No, in “Winter Soldier,” simply put, the characters — guys and girls — kick ass.

 Cap ship scene:

http://youtu.be/6k0kkSHiiPE

 Now that is “Hero drops in from the darkness and punches the bejeezus out of a bunch of dudes in a nimble, über-athletic manner.” The first ten minutes of “Winter Soldier” present Cap as an unstoppable fighter who thinks as fast has he moves. No slow build. The credits roll, and bam. Cap takes out an elite commando unit almost singlehandedly. It’s an apples-to-oranges comparison, but Batroc the Leaper has more moves than Nolan’s Batman.

 Cap vs. Batroc:

http://youtu.be/aHh0XaW0UyQ

 In one fight after another, Captain Rogers, his allies, and foes sinker deeper into a disorienting world of intrigue and escalating stakes. And Cap’s small crew of well-defined characters convincingly fight like they’re in an MMA cage. Flying knee-smashes. Lethal acrobatics. Interpersonal hand-to-hand combat that will leave you ducking in your seat. Intricate weapons-play that might not be believable, but is sure as hell memorable. Captain America even walks up to Batman’s home turf and makes it his. Contrast these two rooftop scenes:

 Cap rooftop scene:

http://youtu.be/zyUTeZVnd2w

 Dark Knight Returns Rooftop Scene:

http://youtu.be/D1zBw86sPk8

 Guess whose is more awesome? Again, perhaps not physically plausible, but awesome. Even without Cap running through walls, which one is more likely to make you want to watch it twice?

 In Nolan’s Batmovies, the Bat Tumbler may have provided some highlights. Batman sures operates motor vehicles a lot. But contrast the Bat-chases with this motorcycle scene from “Winter Soldier.” Of course, nobody could really singlehandedly take out a fighter jet. But the movie makes you believe — if only for a moment — that Steve Rogers could. The real “Superman” movie made a generation believe a man could fly. And the Nolan Batmovies? They’ll make you believe a man can hop into a small flying vehicle and zoom away.

 Cap vs. Jet:

http://youtu.be/RYSgkqc9EWI

 If Goyer and Nolan have seen “Winter Soldier,” they should be losing sleep over it. The spent around $600 million to make three movies that are memorable mostly for their ambience and an unforgettable Heath Ledger performance. Compared to “Winter Solider,” the Nolan Batman films represent the largest wasted opportunity since the “Star Wars Episodes I-III: The Jar-Jar Trilogy.” The ball’s in your court, Bats. We’re eagerly awaiting your response.