ikuzeminna
Talk Gundam Wing to Me
242 posts
Analyses, screencaps, and random observations. Mostly Gundam Wing, though Gundam SEED crops up, too.
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ikuzeminna · 9 hours ago
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Y'all, I'm losing my damn mind. Some random Joan Cusack sitcom was out here in 2001, repping Gundam Wing Gunpla. Deathscythe, my beloved!
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On a more serious note, it does kinda tell you where Gundam was in mainstream culture.
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ikuzeminna · 12 hours ago
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What does a goose have to do with any of it...?
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We're all wondering what the heck Tallgeese is supposed to be derived from, so I decided to do some research and the result is either ¯\_ (ツ)_/¯ or a Simone Biles level routine of mental gymnastics, which, notably, is not allowed to stick the landing.
But I finally figured out what Epyon is supposed to mean (which is an utter embarrassment that it took me so long, I'm so sorry @tinyozlion), so hooray for small victories, at least.
So first things first, let's get Epyon's etymology out of the way. The mobile suit name Epyon, phonetically /ˈe.pion/, is likely derived from the Ancient Greek word επιόν, phonetically /e.piˈon/, which means "the next one/the future one." Awfully fitting considering the characters treat Epyon and its system as though it can tell the future. I also find it hilarious how the Greek wiki page features a translation, whereas the English version just assumes everyone is fluent in Attic.
As if.
Bonus information for linguists:
Here's the excuse I have for not finding out sooner Epyon is apparently taken from επιόν. Επιόν is the present active participle, neuter nominative/accusative/vocative singular, of the verb ἔπειμι (épeimi), according to Attic inflectional endings, with the verb having various meanings, among them "to exist in the future/to approach/to attack" etc.
This means that επιόν is not a word you can directly look up in a dictionary, like the one I have lying around. You need to know it's derived from ἔπειμι and then know your Attic declension to reach this form. All I wanna know right now is who the Ancient Greek buff at Sunrise was who's to credit for this. Because this was in the era before anyone even thought of uploading translations of Ancient Greek words onto the worldwide web. And how you end up with one suit having a name you need to have studied a dead language for and another named after statuesque waterfowl.
Ikeda, I have questions.
On an additional note, επιών, the masculine singular, sounds the same phonetically, but since Epyon is a mobile suit and thus an object, it makes more sense to go with the neuter. Unlike with humans and animals, things don't usually have a gender in Greek unless it's a loanword.
Okay, so now that Epyon is figured out, let's look at Tallgeese. This one is a wild ride.
For the sake of argument, we'll step away from the goose thing for a second. Tallgeese in Japanese is spelled トールギス (Tōrugisu), which, taking Japanese's limits into account and the translated Amazon.co.jp listings of the mobile suit's various gunpla kits, means we could write Tallgeese as anything ranging from "Tallgis" to "Torgis." I've seen all kinds of spellings for it. (The obscure ones sometimes let you find a kit at a very reasonable price.)
So let's look at what theme OZ suits adhere to. Here's a list of all of them:
OZ-00MS Tallgeese
OZ-02MD Virgo
OZ-06MS Leo
OZ-07AMS Aries
OZ-07MS Tragos (Greek for Capricorn)
OZ-08MMS Cancer
OZ-09MMS Pisces
OZ-12SMS Taurus
OZ-13MS Epyon
OZ-13MSX1 Vayeate
OZ-13MSX2 Mercurius
Bonus: battleship Libra
The grunt suits are all in the 01-12 range, which corresponds to the Zodiac constellations being 12, even if they don't care about the correct order. Tallgeese, Epyon, Vayeate and Mercurius are the only ones outside this Zodiac range, so time to look at what other constellations there are.
Turns out there are 88 of them by now. 48 originally if we go with Ptolemy's version.
Let's look at the suit to find some hints as to what we're looking for.
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The red front-to-back plume evokes Roman or Spartan military. The round shield is definitely closer to trademark Spartan than Roman, so coupled with the death wish you need to pilot it, I'd say Spartan is a reasonable pick.
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I mean, if it fits, it fits.
The other interesting detail about Tallgeese is the yellow bird emblem on the shield, which it doesn't have in the series because it probably would have been too much of a pain to animate. The gunpla feature it though.
Here's the Tallgeese, and the Tallgeese Flügel version.
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The emblem on the shield is tinier, but it's there, and it's added to the giant wings as well. The reasonable assumption is that that's an eagle, which happens to exist as a constellation. Aquila, or rather Aëtos, and more specifically the Aetos Dios, "was a giant, golden eagle which served as Zeus' personal messenger and animal companion."
Tallgeese would be equated to Zeus then, since the suit obviously isn't the golden eagle itself, being all white. If we view Tallgeese as the father of all mobile suits and consider that Zeus fathered... honestly, everyone and his dog in Greek mythology <_<, it fits.
So, do we have a constellation that is something big, white, preferably with wings, that's connected to Zeus? Yup, there is the swan, Cygnus, or Kyknos if you prefer Greek, which has a very interesting story of how it ended up in the night sky.
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Turns out it's another one of Zeus' romantic adventures where he transformed into a swan to seduce Leda, the queen of Sparta.
"Leda was a queen of Sparta, the wife of King Tyndareus, who was seduced by Zeus in the guise of the swan. There were several versions of the parentage of her children:- Some say she laid an egg from which were hatched the Dioskouroi (Dioscuri) twins, Kastor and Polydeukes, both sons of Zeus. Others say she laid two eggs each containing a child of Zeus and a child of Tyndareus--Polydeukes and Kastor in one, and Helene and Klytaimnestra (Clytemnestra) in the other. Yet others relate that the second egg, containing just Helene, was delivered to Leda by the goddess Nemesis who had lain it after coupling with Zeus in the guise of a goose."
....We have arrived at the goose.
Fun fact: geese, swans and ducks are grouped into one family (anatidae). This is an important tidbit as things will become very dumb from this point onward.
Because I may have gotten Spartan, golden eagle, giant white bird and predecessor all consolidated under the Cygnus constellation, but etymologically, "Tallgeese" is nowhere near anything I've discussed so far. :(
It doesn't sound like Cygnus, it doesn't sound like Zeus, or any child of his with the Spartan queen. It doesn't even sound Greek, and yes, I checked more carefully this time. The best I can give is στοργής (storgís) which would be the genitive form of the word "affection," which could fit with the swan story if you reach enough to rival Luffy, but doesn't explain where the S went. The other option is οργή (orgí) which means fury, but is missing the T.
So I got the theme of the suit figured out, I think, but the name? Nope.
Is there maybe a star in the Cygnus constellation that sounds like Tallgeese or even just tall or geese?
Nope. I checked the other birds as well, like the eagle or the dove. Nothing. I checked if there was any star at all that sounded anything like tall or geese and the closest I got was Gliese 581, which is a red dwarf in the Libra constellation and not visible to the naked eye.
Fun fact: there is also Vulpecula et Anser, the Fox and Goose, which have been reduced to just the fox in modern constellations, so we did have a goose up there in ancient times.
All these dead ends lead to three options:
I'm either looking at the wrong language and Tallgeese or Torgis or whatever is close to the word for swan in a different language
Ikeda is trolling and it really is a tall goose or
I'm off my rocker and the Tallgeese was never associated with Cygnus to begin with. Which would call the goose into question again.
So, which one is it?
¯\_ (ツ)_/¯
The final season of Sailor Moon never fails to have me in tears because of the absolute hilarity that are the Sailor Starlights' attacks. Sailor Star Fighter's attack is "Star Serious Laser." Sailor Star Healer's is "Star Sensitive Inferno", which already has me go ???? But it's Sailor Star Maker who breaks me with her "Star Gentle Uterus." I have no idea what that lady is throwing, but I know I don't wanna get hit by it.
What I mean to showcase here is that [random adjective] + [random noun] = perfectly fine attack name for a Japanese manga/anime in the 90s.
It's hard to believe that the crew who had ridiculously specific knowledge of Ancient Greek would just derp with English, but what if they did? Let's say they wanted to name the suit after Cygnus, but in a language different from Latin or Greek to cement it is an outlier, while also pointing out that it is bigger than normal suits, so they got "tall" but landed on goose instead of swan because someone mixed them up. And it's "geese" and not "goose" because it's a nod to there being more than one Tallgeese, especially since Japanese doesn't even differentiate between singular and plural.
....
Look, I tried.
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ikuzeminna · 2 days ago
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ikuzeminna · 5 days ago
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I'm gonna be that person.
Epyon in Japanese is エピオン. Epione, the minor Greek goddess and Asclepius' wife, is エピオネ. Just because English butchers the latter to sound similar to "Epyon" doesn't mean Japanese does that, too. It's just like Escaflowne, which, in Japanese, is pronounced with a -ne at the end.
To get Tallgeese トールギス out of theurgist テウルギスト you'd have to go "Bologna rhymes with pony" levels of mangled pronunciation. The Japanese wiki says that its origin could be theurgist, or it could really mean tall geese because of the English spelling. Seeing as Tallgeese only has a Flügel (wings) expansion pack, I wouldn't put it past the creators to be trolling and mean the bird. Though "theurgist" would make more sense narratively, seeing as it is a miracle worker MS with how powerful it is.
Back to Epyon, I have no idea what "Epyon" is supposed to mean. What I do know is that it's supposed to be a (two-headed) wyvern. The definition of a wyvern is "a mythical dragon-like creature, having wings, only two legs and a barbed tail."
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See the flight mode? Two legs, two wings, a barbed tail. It's a very popular creature in heraldry, so that's absolutely up Treize's alley.
To get an association to anything evil, you'd have to look at G Gundam the suit design pays homage to. This is the Master Gundam, piloted by Master Asia:
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Gundam Wing absolutely pulled inspiration from G Gundam suits (and in Wufei's case, even character design). Look at Dragon Gundam and Altron:
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So yeah, Epyon is to Wing Zero what Master Gundam is to Shining Gundam. The "angel wings" were a redesign for a movie that came out a year after the series finished. It wasn't the original concept, so there's no good vs. evil theme going on. No need to force "Epyon" into meaning something it simply doesn't.
Huh.
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But then...
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ikuzeminna · 16 days ago
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I love how ChatGPT completely and utterly fails at math (of all things) when you ask it to age up characters.
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ikuzeminna · 26 days ago
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Is it Tsubarov or Tubarov?
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So, this one is funny. As you can see above, the wiki has adopted the latter spelling, which originates from the translation of Glory of Losers and Frozen Teardrop by Zeonic Scanslations. It's also where "Bilmon" first popped up as a last name for the guy, by the by. If you look at the katakana, it spells tsu-ba-ro-fu, but as anyone who has learned the Japanese alphabet knows, there is no tu, so tsu is usually used in its place. Just like there is no si, only a shi, which leads to all the "city boy" humor. Meaning, a translator might find themselves pondering if they should go with tu or tsu in a name, especially if it's a made up one. And in this case, the translator decided to go with tu because he probably felt "Tubarov" sounded more correct. This is Gundam Wing though.
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From the Gundam Wing Perfect Archive Series, p. 189. Tsubarov's name is supposed to be derived from the German word for 12, zwölf. The z in German is always a "ts" sound, so "Tsubarov" is actually the correct spelling. And before anyone thinks to themselves "well, why didn't they just go with the number then?" That's because the very first translators wanted to be phonetically close and anyone trying to pronounce zwölf who doesn't speak flawless German would probably end up saying some form of "ze-wolf" which doesn't even come close. The American dub had troubles pronouncing Hilde, for crying out loud. Like that's a hard name. So Tsubarov it is, just like it is Noin and not Neun. But. And here comes the funny part, which is just a euphemism for me having had to take linguistics, so now you all get to suffer through it with me. "Two" in German is "zwei". Depending on the region or if you watch Star Wars, you'll hear it pronounced "zwo", too, though. R2D2 is the most famous example. It also used to happen a lot on the telephone when people spelled telephone numbers or the number of a bank account etc. so that it doesn't get mixed up with 3, "drei". "Two" and "zwo" have the same root, the Proto-Germanic "twō". The difference is that English stopped pronouncing the w and German had a sound shift known as the High German consonant shift, where a lot of Proto-Germanic "t" sounds changed into "ts" which is how the letter z is pronounced in German. So, tomato, tomahto, or in this case, Tubarov, Tsubarov. It's amusing how a language on the other side of the globe lacking a tu ended up reverse sound shifting a name derived from a German word because a fan thought it'd sound better that way. What are the odds.
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ikuzeminna · 2 months ago
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ikuzeminna · 3 months ago
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New bot just dropped
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ikuzeminna · 3 months ago
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Hey, so, Patreon is lying to you about Apple forcing their hand.
Patreon is getting rid of 1st-of-the-month/per-creation billing, claiming a new decision by Apple has forced their hand. This will hurt a lot of creatives, and their excuse is bullshit. Allow me to explain.
In 2018, Patreon tried to impose a new ill-considered fee structure on everyone that would have cost creators a lot of smaller pledges. They ended up apologizing for this profusely; they have now deleted this apology from their website and unfortunately I was unable to find it on the Internet Archive. This was shameful, but to their credit they backed off quickly when things got ugly.
Back in 2021, Patreon discussed plans to force all creators into a rolling bill structure and get rid of first-of-the-month/pay-up-front billing. The community once again very decisively shouted them down, and they had to walk it back again. This whole fiasco damaged the already shaky trust between Patreon creators and staff.
This week, Patreon announced that, along with extra fees, Apple's policies were supposedly forcing them to move everyone over to the rolling fee structure that they first tried to get us to agree to in 2021. Patreon will tell you they are not happy about this. As a person who spent a long time watching Patreon make terrible decisions, I can tell you-- they are probably very happy about this, because it's exactly the smokescreen they needed to do what they've been trying to do for years, which is pull ALL Patreon creators away from 1st-of-the-month and per-creation billing.
The spin in the news I've seen so far is "Apple bullies Patreon, boo hoo hoo poor Patreon". This is very obviously not what's happening. Mind you: Apple does suck, and they are doing something bad here. Fuck apple. But Patreon and Apple are BOTH the asshole in this situation; Everyone Sucks Here. Patreon has options: they can make the iOS app a reader app and do billing through the browser to avoid the restrictions and the extra fees (Netflix and Amazon, notably, both do this), or they can allow creators to opt-out of iOS billing if they want to use billing models that don't work with it.
It seems most likely to me that the Apple situation is a real fire that Patreon has chosen to use as a convenient smokescreen to do what they've been wanting to do since at least 2021, and maybe since 2018.
What do we do?:
They have a feedback form specifically about this.
They also have a creator discord.
And they have lots of social media pages where they probably really, really hope that this doesn't blow up again, because they never learn. The incidents I've described here aren't the only two other times Patreon has pissed off their creators. They know if they don't contain the noise it'll be harder to get away with it, so make some noise. They've done a lot of work to spin this cleverly so you'll have sympathy for them and they won't get the kind of backlash they know they deserve.
Please don't misuse these links and make threats or spam or something. All you have to do is give well-reasoned feedback. Patreon hates feedback. Make sure they get a nice heaping helping of their least favorite vegetable.
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ikuzeminna · 3 months ago
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Apple soon charging 30% on Patreon subscriptions through iOS
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This is the email Patreon creators woke up to today. Patreon is asking us to either raise our prices on the iOS app so that Apple can slurp up 30% of the subscription price, or we can keep our prices as they are and have that 30% come out of our own earnings. Either way, this fee is hidden from potential subscribers so they don't know they're paying 30% to Apple when they could be avoiding that by subscribing on Patreon's website as opposed to the app.
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I find this to be a disgusting cash grab on the part of Apple because if they felt like their fees were fair then they would simply tack it on themselves at the point of checkout, not baking it into the prices of creators who had no say in this to make it look like we were the ones asking for more. If you find yourself wondering "Why are Patreon creators all raising their prices?" this is why. Please avoid transactions through iOS apps.
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ikuzeminna · 4 months ago
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I finally got around to building my birthday present to myself. :D
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A very nice build. Very simple, but looking great. There were a couple of parts I wondered at, but all in all this is really an excellent kit. Definitely not a Gundam, and taking full advantage of it for the range in motions.
It's weird. I never liked the Leo much in the series. Those fat thighs always turn me off. It's the same reason I dislike the Tallgeese design, even though I seem to be the only one.
But now that I've built the little fella, he has really started growing on me. Posed right and with all proportions correct, he does look cool.
...
Huh. My phone has filters? I wonder what those are. Pencil drawing, painting, cubism... Ah, it's that stuff that is available online, too. Probably gonna suck the same-
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...
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...
WHERE'S MY OTHER GUNPLA
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ikuzeminna · 4 months ago
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Okay, I wanna talk about these gifs.
First of all, look at Heero being extra, as usual, and not using his fingers to carry his body weight like God intended, but his fist.
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If you had a friend who didn't know anything about the series and showed them just this scene, they would immediately peg Heero as the extreme one.
And you'd laugh your head off, because they'd have no idea just how bonkers this kid can get.
Next, we have the great escape, which is not the elaborate plan or wild kung fu sequence you'd expect from the guy who can do nothing like a normal person and has to blow up half a base while programming mobile dolls to kill you, but Heero just lying down and then sprinting out of the room real fast. lol
Like. It's utterly ridiculous in its simplicity. And how no one starts shooting.
Also, why the heck did you ask Duo to punch you if you were gonna lie there face down anyway? No one could see the bruise. I guess Heero really didn't want to owe Duo after the using Deathscythe as a spare parts shop debacle. It's sweet how their friendships have developed to the point they all mind each other's quirks now.
Which brings us to point #3. Trowa freaking Barton, who left a half-dead Heero in Heavyarms' hand as he drove off, not dropping Duo's unconscious body to the ground like a sack of potatoes, but actually lifting him to his shoulder.
Look at how gentle both of them are being with their friend. ...Well, after he got punched in the gut, something both of them have done. You know what? They really do owe Duo.
Both of them.
Also gotta love how Duo is basically glitching instead of being animated to be turned around while being handed to the guard. Animation goof :3
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ikuzeminna · 4 months ago
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AFTER VOTING, click here to see what genre you've landed in.
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ikuzeminna · 4 months ago
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Have a transparent bubble bath-less Treize Khushrenada, for all your edit needs.
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ikuzeminna · 4 months ago
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Gundam Seed Freedom was… something
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I'm not exactly a Seed fan. Yes, I own the gunpla, yes, Cagalli, Athrun and Badgiruel are my favorite characters, yes, I enjoy the series up until Kira gets the Freedom, but I will still mock it mercilessly, groan at every lack of bra or brain cell and by heavens, I want to smash every single one of Lacus' Haros to pieces.
And I only watched Destiny once because I couldn't stomach Cagalli's character assassination a second time. Or Gladys', literally, in the very last second. Like, ma'am, you have a kid. What are you doing dying on an exploding asteroid? :/
So you can imagine I wasn't exactly refreshing Gogoanime every two seconds to see if the movie had dropped. Eventually, it did and I got around to watching it, and although I had already spoiled myself with plot summaries and recorded scenes, this movie somehow managed to miss even my wacky expectations. I was promised wtf scenes, and I got them, but at x1.2 speed which just left me confused and checking my speed settings all the time.
So, let's get into this, with spoilers and all.
Though honestly, what's there to spoil? It's just the last episodes of Destiny all over again, which itself was recycling Seed's finale. If you have seen Destiny, imagine reading a retelling of its finale on Wattpad with a five-year-old and a fourteen-year-old collaborating. The five-year-old handled the plot while the fourteen-year-old handled the romances. That's Seed Freedom in a nutshell.
To be a little more specific, the plot is basically a new bunch of bad guys, Accords, who are super Coordinators able to read and manipulate minds, wanting to implement the Destiny Plan because... reasons. They were all grown by Walmart Mariemaia who Benjamin Button'd herself because... Tuesday. And she's the queen of a kingdom now, somehow, which has the brilliant name of "Foundation."
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"Kingdom of Foundation." Why don't you have it run by Prime Minister CEO while you're at it? Seriously, this physically hurts if you speak English. -_-
Anyway, the Earth Alliance and ZAFT are still trying to kill each other because it's Seed and while people can genetically manipulate their offspring to be superior and even reverse age now, they still haven't figured out how to grow brains yet, which is why Cagalli launched Seed's version of the Preventers, called Compass, which is basically Kira beam spamming everyone into submission like he always does because it's forbidden by law to put the words "Seed" and "originality" in the same sentence. The Accords use the conflict to make it seem as though the Earth Alliance blew up their Kingdom of Stupid Name via nuke so that they can then retaliate with Requiem because, again, originality is not allowed in this movie. Oh, and the Accords are also racist, because duh, everyone is.
Does this all serve a grander scheme? Why, of course! Do you think it's so that they can stage a successful coup on the PLANTs to gain more allies?
Actually no, that just happens to coincide.
The far grander scheme is to pinch Kira's girlfriend!! -_- I kid you not, as soon as they fire those nukes on themselves, they pull a Lady Une and make a dramatic escape with Lacus straight to space within 5 minutes tops, just so that Orphee, the leader of the Affronts To My Intelligence and a visual cross between Athrun and Cagalli, can repeatedly get rejected by Lacus since Baby Queen Abysmal Eye Shadow hardcoded being horny for Lacus into his DNA, but her love for Kira overrides her own genetic coding finding Orphee attractive (since Lacus was apparently also created by Queen Baklava For Brains while her mom wasn't looking?), so Orphee just ends up growing Shinji levels of sexually frustrated with Lacus, which, given how Lacus' (and every female's, honestly) lip fillers make her look like a blowup doll in various scenes, especially when she forms an "oh" with her mouth, I can almost understand why hearing her say no is unexpected. Too crass? That's what you get for making me watch a zoom-in on Lacus' giant butt in a cat suit in the finale.
It doesn't culminate in him choking her out, but Orphee does try to force himself on her and the fact that Lacus doesn't knee him in the balls right then and there makes the whole scene pointless. It's very reminiscent of a fourteen-year-old fanfic writer thinking a woman talking her almost-rapist out of his action is the height of female empowerment. It's not. And this wasn't written by a fourteen-year-old. Fukuda says there were over a hundred drafts for this movie. And they settled for this? Lacus should have used that unearned Seed mode and gone Corin on Orphee's nuts.
(Go watch Turn A if you have no idea what I'm talking about. It's Seed but better. Which is an embarrassment, since Seed came out right after it.)
At this point it's pretty clear that our fourteen-year-old has infiltrated the plot with her romances, because we can't have a mere final battle with giant robots and pink explosions, it has to mean something!
And in this case, that meaning is a battle for Lacus' love!
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Same, Cagalli. -_-
So it's time now to look at the romance side of this movie, just so that you can understand why my brain started dripping out of my nose by the 1 hour mark already.
Every single character arc in this movie is relationship drama. Every. Single. One. From Kira to Lacus to Orphee to Ingrid to Agnes to even Luna and Shinn. If characters interact, it's always in the context of the same freaking love triangle. No variation.
So let's go through the list. First, we have Orphee, who we've established wants to get into Lacus' pants. Ingrid, the blue-haired Accord chick, is saddened by this because she wants him to get into hers instead, which, given how this Village Of The Darned refer to Mini Me as their mother, is... Freudian to say the least. Baklava For Brains either didn't code her right or is a sadist, I guess. Next, we have Kira, who is in Lacus' pants, but thinks Lacus prefers Orphee and starts whining about it because the movie can't make up its mind on how it wants to portray their relationship. It's clearly established that them living together alone and acting like husband and wife is anything but platonic, but when Lacus and Orphee have their shoujo sparkle moments of intense, sexual attraction, Kira acts as though he isn't her boyfriend, when it's abundantly clear that he's seen her naked on the daily for the past year or so. The movie adds the new character, Agnes, to the mix here, who looks like a pink Misa Misa (alas, without the hidden intellect) and has the hots for her commander, Kira, taking every opportunity to hit on him, even going so far as to try to plant one on him while Lacus is "hiding" around the corner.
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....She's not even trying.
And you know, you just know a fourteen-year-old wrote this because we hear nothing of the 152 regulations that hitting on your superior officer go against, never mind any consequences, because... brilliant writing. That they dare to give Agnes Flay's voice is such an insult to me, considering how her writing was freaking Mark Twain level compared to this Post-It note version we're getting here.
Kira ultimately rejects her and Agnes, who previously mocked Luna for settling for whatever came along (which had me laughing real loud because where is the lie?), falls into Walmart Yzak's arms a mere two seconds later because he told her she's pretty and proceeds to spend the rest of the movie as a bad guy because that's what happens to a woman scorned: both self-esteem and the IQ start hitting the negatives.
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There are also Murrue and Mwu, and while they don't have drama, they are pretty much reduced to their relationship to each other. You think you were gonna get any personality out of the veteran captain of the Archangel? Pfff, not with Becky writing. Have Murrue jumping, straddling and kissing Mwu on the bridge in front of everyone instead.
The only girls who aren't strangled by a relationship are Meyrin, who barely says three lines but gets to be a pilot now for some reason, Cagalli, who is, weirdly, the best character in the movie, and Ehehe. (You will know exactly who I mean once you watch it.)
Out of those three, Cagalli is the only one actually in a relationship and, lo and behold, her and Athrun are unexpectedly handled well! They even use that they are dating in their fight against Walmart Yzak, which leads to that famous lewd Cagalli fantasy of Athrun's. Cagalli even gets to react to that! (She's not pleased. lol)
The funniest part is that we didn't even know Walmart Yzak is allergic to girl cooties, what with hitting on Agnes previously, so this was Athrun full-on trolling him with Seed's version of the Sexy Jutsu. Look at Athrun having a sense of humor. Look at Cagalli consistently making every scene she is in better. :)
I'm honestly surprised that the best characters in this movie end up being Athrun and Cagalli, with the former being the most badass and the latter the most relatable and best-written, complete with personality and crowning moments of awesome, given how they had been handled in Destiny.
Took them 20 years, but they finally made up for it. Now, if only the rest didn't suck so bad. :/
Because the rest is pretty much Kira and Lacus angsting over not deserving each other for almost two hours because they apparently never sat down and talked about their feelings and relationship, so the merest hint of rejection or competition sends them spiraling into a depression that becomes a galactic conflict for reasons beyond intelligence. Like, picture Shinji and Asuka in a stable relationship act like Shinji and Asuka in Eva, without any depth and in dumb. That's the level of Huh???? the relationship was written with. It makes no sense at all.
Why are you two so insecure? Why is all it takes one comment from random people to make you question your year-long relationship??
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Agnes, Ingrid and Orphee are there to provide an external source of conflict because the relationship itself is full of gaping holes so we can't focus on that, and because Becky is fourteen, the best she can manage is contrasting Kira's and Lacus' lip service pure love with evil horniness. Even though it's heavily implied that they've boinked, too.
Okay, I'm being mean to my fictional Becky here. I have actually seen digital manhwa that have this exact same love story, so it's not like you can't write them as an adult and make money with them. I just had irrational expectations, I guess, after Flay hopped over that low bar.
The cherry on top of this sad puddle of melted brain matter is Fukuda saying in an interview that he viewed Kira as having an obsession with Lacus in Destiny, so this was his attempt to fix that. Sir? You catapulted their relationship right past toxic and straight to the acid pit from MK II, Erich Fromm quote or not. Lacus blathering about needing someone because you love them (mature love) rather than loving someone because you need them (immature love) is nothing but lip service in this fetishistic nightmare Lacan would balk at.
I had to sit through two hours of "Gundam Seed - Get All These Drama Queens Freaking Therapy, But Not For War Trauma, But For Their Psychotic Relationship And Self-Esteem Issues."
Because not being in a relationship with the person you want in this movie results in emo exits to the left (seriously, count them), incessant temper tantrums and desperate clutching from heartbreak. We also get to wade through Kira's emo episode as the movie's emotional turning point, whining that Lacus doesn't love him because he can't make her happy and that he's good for nothing, which Athrun thankfully beats out of him quickly in good ol' Beavis and Butt-Head fashion, lest they have to go through Kira's character development in Seed again, too. And no, Kira still hasn't learned how to throw a punch properly. Athrun destroys him.
I read in a lot of reviews that people cheered at this scene, but I had to check my speed settings because the movements were all so fast. The pacing is really abysmal in this movie and I don't mean in a plot kind of way, but in a "my cat hits my keyboard and keeps fast-forwarding scenes until I stop it" kind of way. There are so many scenes that feel like I've accidentally hit increase speed, especially in fight scenes, and I'm utterly confused because letting a scene breathe was never an issue in Seed. We all remember Kira bawling his eyes out every five minutes and either muting the audio or dying from laughter because the VA just sounded severely constipated. Here we get sequences like Kira's Freedom getting destroyed, Shinn's Justice getting wrecked, a nuke going off, the Archangel being blown to pieces, and if any of it was supposed to make me emotional then it utterly failed because not even the characters react to these events with how fast we have to get to the next scene. Never mind people practically teleporting from one location to another, except for Kira who takes longer than Goku to get somewhere.
Seed Freedom is a very weird mix of dragging and speed-running and I don't get why. You had 20 years, man. In fact, even the movie knows it's paced awfully, which is why it keeps giving you the location every time, to increasingly ridiculous degrees.
Anyway, back to the plot and romance. So, Athrun snaps Kira out of his funk with a good walloping. What's next? The rescue mission, of course, which is supposed to be the scene that fixes Kira's and Lacus' relationship by proclamation of their true love for each other! Yay, emotional payoff for this relationship I was totally invested in and not groaning through.
Well, truth be told, I can't stand kumbaya Kira and Lacus in Destiny, so this movie not making me want to scream at my screen whenever I saw them is a feat. Too bad Becky heard me, because she presents us with the following, which somehow manages to be the most mind-bendingly dumb exchange in the entire movie, which honestly requires a superpower at this point to pull off.
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Kira, if she slits Lacus' throat, her vocal chords are gonna be the least of your worries. Why is the only one with a functioning brain in there Kisaka? Who, by the way, owns super Coordinator mind reader like it's nothing, despite being a Natural, because ovaries.
Just, ugh.
So after Kira and Lacus get to tell each other "I love you!" with dramatic catches thrown in despite no need for them, making things just awkward, we rush off to the final battle and it's like Fukuda took 5 episodes that were supposed to be the finale and condensed them into three, while cutting half the transitions. There's colorful pew pew, Shinn hilariously weaponizing his stupidity, things exploding, people dying, Yzak and Dearka pushing new gunpla sales, Mwu outright breaking the last remnants of my brain, Lunamaria and Agnes having a girl fight, Murrue ramming a space ship into another one because screw logic, and finally, rolled into this erratic nonsense burrito is Kira defeating Orphee with the power of Lacus' love and her being able to use the Force now, while Horny For Pink is still screaming about wanting to get into her pants and Ingrid still wants him to get into hers instead.
Thankfully, they both die and rid me of their presence.
The saving grace really are Athrun and Cagalli, who rely on actual skill and brains in their fight, and thus end up the best part of the movie by a landslide.
...And then there's Mwu tanking a Requiem shot to the face without issue and deflecting its beam with its puny shield to destroy various targets and Requiem itself because dinosaurs.
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Dang it, D.J., stop writing the script for the movie and go back to your noodle pictures. I have a hard enough time reining Becky in as it is. The happy conclusion is everyone smooching or reaffirming their relationship status otherwise, while Lacus blathers over the ending song with her and Kira as two human shaped blobs ready to get nasty on the beach.
Hooray.
So what's the verdict?
Gundam Seed Freedom sucks. And I don't even mean that as a movie, but as a Seed movie. If I previously thought Seed's characters had the depth of a rain puddle, then Freedom threw a maxi pack of paper towels on all of them.
You get a gigantic cast, with various well-established characters with pasts, and, somehow, only Athrun and Cagalli resemble themselves. The rest are bulldozed to single word characteristics like dumb, horny emo, or rude.
For instance, there are two separate occasions where Compass fights a Destroy, and Shinn doesn't care. Stella even gets a cameo, going full Tokomon teeth in his mind at the Evil Dumbass Brigade trying to infiltrate it, but do you think her traumatic death would warrant a reaction when he has to face the mobile suit she piloted when she was killed before him? Naaah.
Kira starts the movie with something resembling a personality, but that gets quickly flushed down the toilet by the time he and Lacus go through the same scene for the 8th time.
Murrue? Don't get me started on Murrue. Murrue spends the entire movie in heat. Funnily enough, she's finally wearing a bra when Archangel gets hit, so no more gainaxing boobs. But she's worse than the horny teenagers.
Everyone else you know and love is just there. I don't remember Sai even getting a line. Miri does, one. Dearka and Yzak exist and it's a big, fat whatever. You'd think they could have put some of them on the ships' bridges, so that we could get cool discussions, right? Yeah, no, have two new characters instead, one of whom is voiced by freaking Jiraiya. No, not Jiraiya's VA, but Jiraiya, because that man doesn't vary his voice one bit.
As someone who used to watch Naruto, it drove me bonkers. Especially when the female VAs put in the effort to blow everyone out of the water. Props to Cagalli's new VA especially who manages to capture the original's stresses and pauses perfectly. I knew right away it was Cagalli despite the different voice. Kudos.
Another positive thing are the backgrounds of the movie. I'm pretty sure a sizeable chunk of the budget was invested in those. They all look gorgeous.
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Those visual feasts sadly make the wonky characters stand out more though. Movements down to the very mouth flaps look really choppy, 3D Gundams are always a bad idea, please stop doing that, and often enough the animation quality dips noticeably.
This movie is also in love with potato noses so huge, Gerard Depardieu would laugh at them. It's especially weird 'cause half of those are on Coordinators. You know, the designer babies? Did dogs and pigs go extinct in the Cosmic Era that they need to sniff for truffles themselves now?
It's also a complete crime that the movie ends with no one having kicked Orphee between the legs. Or in the face. He taunts Kira so many times with the line that all he's good for is fighting that I kept yelling at my screen for Kira to please just display that and introduce a bat to Orphee's face.
Not even Shinn gets to throw a punch his way, and that boy is allowed to wave a sword at a person. But in a manner that makes me wanna tear my hair out.
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That's a saber, you moron. You don't hold sabers with two hands. Coordinator, my foot. You deserve getting your butt kicked just for that. Though I went full panda facepalm when Yzak With Hair Horns started doing cart wheels during their fight.
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Just. Throw a brick at my head, it's less painful.
Then we also have the gem that is the dance scene between Pinky and Horny For Her, which cracked me up specifically, because it's supposed to be this beautiful~ smooth~ charming~ skilled waltz the super Coordinators perform that makes Kira so sad, and I'm dying of laughter because I'm an avid Ballroom e Youkoso fan and if there is anything that series taught me, it's a) the man's hand goes where the bra strap is, so Orphee fails at a basic hold already and b) that's the most pathetic throwaway oversway I've ever seen. Total beer keg.
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If Kira knew the first thing about dancing, he would have been sassing Blond Athrun instead of getting all mopey, like actual Athrun did to Discount Yzak. Would have improved the movie by x1000 actually if Kira had gotten the same amount of brain cells as his sister and friend and spent the two hours snarking at all the fanfic nonsense instead of acting like he got gut punched all the time.
Alas, we can't have nice things. What we get after 20 years and over a hundred drafts is a movie about Kira's and Lacus' love story that's literally no different from a Wattpad fic. It glues itself to the surface level of the concept and pulls it off as if the entirety of the two prior series doesn't exist, while making sure to give it no substance at all. Sure, they throw in names and reuse plot points that anyone who has seen the series knows, but they end up as mere Easter eggs. There is no taking advantage of established backstories or past events. Not even a nod. Creating a sense of continuity or closure?
Not in this movie.
Another thing is this bizarre tug-of-war between prudish and sexy Lacus. There's no opening anymore in which she can float naked across our screen, so the movie needs to push her boobs in our faces in a different way, I guess, but she's still a "pure" character so it just ends up being... weird. She won't kiss Orphee and probably whip herself every night for ever considering it, but she'll prance around naked on the beach with Kira and go all Golden Boy with how she's shown riding those wing attachments for the Freedom. Like, make up your mind, movie.
I understand why Fukuda wouldn't want to sully Lacus' "purity" (outside of teenager's minds >_>), but I really wish that she had just kissed Orphee. Just, give me something to work with here. You can't drag out "No! I don't love you! I love Kira!" for two hours by recycling the same exchange over and over. If she had kissed him, there would have been a point to all the relationship drama at least. But like this, it's just boring and inane because we're stuck at the setup and never move to a build up or climax, much less a resolution.
So yeah, outside of the Cagalli and Athrun scenes, this movie really didn't do it for me. I actually recorded my reaction for my own amusement because I thought I'd have a blast hate-watching it, but it's just me going "good grief" increasingly loudly as the movie goes on and pausing to check my speed settings.
Oh, and me losing my mind at Kira and Lacus keeping their motorcycles in their living room. Who on Earth does this???
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ikuzeminna · 5 months ago
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Who are your top 5 favorite atla characters
This might surprise you, anon, but this is a difficult question for me. By the way, I hope you’re a Gundam Wing fan who noticed me in the ATLA tag and not someone from the ATLA fandom just asking me a question because boy, is this gonna be an introduction to my blog.
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I can tell you my favorite character right off the bat, which is Toph. She’s cool, and badass, and sarcastic, and wise, and self-deprecating, and saving the day left and right, and just all around awesome. That is to say, she is a joy to watch and there isn’t a single scene in the series where I’m annoyed by her. What is also in stark contrast to Aang is her commitment to improving herself. Toph is introduced as one of the strongest benders in the series, but does that stop her from evolving? No. She confronts and masters her weaknesses, sandbending and metalbending, going so far as to invent the latter to do so. This is what keeps her from being an obnoxious Mary Sue, even though she can take down armies by herself; Toph earns her strength. Unlike a certain someone who is only the strongest because he has the glowy uber mode.
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Number 2 would be Katara, who provides a very nice example of a rich and complex character, who also gets to have a very unique relationship with the former villain, Zuko. She gets a lot of really good writing, which is the reason I like her so much. The contrast between her Book 1 self and her Book 2 self and onward is also very interesting to observe, as we get to see what a healthy serving of self-confidence can do for Katara as a character and for her personality. She isn’t exactly different, but there is a noticeable level of maturity added with her mastery of waterbending. She also gets the most emotionally intense episodes. A Katara episode is always a good episode.
From here on though, it gets difficult.
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Zuko is somewhere on the list of favorites, too, but only if I ignore the annoying parts, the greatest being the obsession with Iroh. I’m not gonna launch into a rant, because that would be a 20 pages long essay on its own, but know that no other character in the history of media has ever held my ire to the level Iroh does, not just on his own, but for the way he ruins other characters, too. Seeing him gets the same response from me the way mentioning the British Museum does to every culture the Brits looted.
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Aside from that, one thing that has always gotten on my nerves with Zuko is how we see nothing of his supposed princely background. Running around and throwing temper tantrums to get his way is how a brat acts, not necessarily a prince. Weirdly, they get it right with Azula. You can tell from a mile away that she’s nobility. Zuko? Zuko oscillates between ridiculously crafty and effin’ annoying. There is only one tiny hint I can identify that speaks to a higher standing and that is the way he sits straight. Other than that, nothing. No impressive vocab or signs of higher education or flowery language or sense of perfection and finesse. So another point for bad writing.
I just need two more, right?
Hmm. I’m gonna cheat with those and pick Piandao and Ursa. lol
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Piandao, because he is the poster boy for a proper master. He is insanely skilled and seemingly eccentric because he abhors over-inflated egos, being a humble and open-minded person. He teaches Sokka because of his own morality and conviction and seems like someone who genuinely wants to help people. He doesn’t troll people like Bumi, nor does he abandon his nephew to go on a glory crusade. He’s also not a drama queen like Jeong Jeong. He’s a good role model and should have been the sole leader of the White Lotus, seeing as his house is plastered with lotus symbols. And he never should have accepted Iroh and Pakku. >_>
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Here is where I run out of truly favorite characters. Ursa is not so much a favorite as she is interesting to me because I’m digging the family dynamics the series hints at. One NATLA picked up, too. It’s not the abuse victim/hostage nonsense the comics threw at us, which is offensive beyond belief, but a wonderfully complex mess that, if added to correctly, can turn Ozai from a flat pancake into a fully rounded character while enriching Zuko and Azula, and provide a parallel to Katara’s and Sokka’s family, too. But I’m gonna spare everyone a lengthy explanation for this, as that could be another post on its own.
Suffice it to say that while Ursa looks like the angel to Ozai’s monster and the series, for whatever reason, tried to paint one bloodline as good while the other is eeevul, it’s her who killed Azulon. Give me all the gray characters.
This should answer your question, anon. Now to blather about the stuff you didn’t ask me for.
~Part deux~
As I said in the beginning, picking five favorite characters in ATLA is difficult for me because I don’t have that many characters I truly like. It’s not that I necessarily hate them, I just don’t care about most characters.
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Like, I don’t care for Sokka. He's the comedic relief, okay, whatever. If he gets a moment of awesome, it feels unearned. Him being touted as a great leader makes me laugh since the series implies it’s because he’s suddenly the only one who can read a map. He’s horribly written. Everything is rushed, from his romance with Yue to his one-day mastery of swordsmanship. That crap takes years. Never mind him getting a super special awesome space sword that’s practically a lightsaber. So it’s not even his own skill?
Same thing with Suki. I’m not bothered by her character the way Sokka annoys me (I do, in fact, dislike him when the series over-inflates his worth) but she’s just not interesting enough for me to care about her. Her being tethered to Sokka does her no favors in my book either. If you remove every scene where she interacts with him, is there any screen time left for her?
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Aang is a can of worms. I like goofy Book 1 Aang. I absolutely loathe Bryke’s self-insert Book 3 Aang. And don’t even get me started on the shipping. It’s like pairing kid Goku with teen Bulma. Just, no.
So do I like Ozai then? No. Unless I make him interesting, he’s boring. Azula started out very strong, but then fell apart because the show decided to strangle itself with binaries. She’s also incredibly isolated, having only pancakes and her brother in her orbit. Mai and Ty Lee are flat. Jet got killed off before he had the chance to develop layers. That leaves me liking blank slates like Kanna. Yes, I will prefer the stock character over the badly written, flat ones.
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This may all sound like I don’t like the series or, at the very least, don’t enjoy it, but that’s not the case. I have plenty of episodes I watch and rewatch because it is a fun show and I don’t need to like all the characters to enjoy an episode’s story. Being flat or inconsistent doesn’t bother me when they can manage to be consistent for an episode at least. And the bending battles are cool to look at. The trouble starts when we take all the series into account because the wasted potential through shoddy writing becomes more apparent, especially towards the end.
When you compare the characters and their writing to the likes of the Gundam Wing cast –and now we swerve to my blog’s main theme– the difference couldn’t be more glaring. This blog is dedicated to one single series, with me writing meta upon meta, sometimes about the most minute detail in one of the first episodes because it’s a hint for something that happens after the series, in the movie following the show, because the level of care to get the characters not just consistent but also massively layered is utterly insane in this show. If you were to make a character relation sheet, you’d just end up connecting everyone because every character gets a unique dynamic with everyone else. And this series doesn’t even focus on the characters. It’s plot-driven. It’s about politics and war.
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Ironically, I have a harder time picking a favorite episode in Wing than I would in ATLA because I enjoy the characters in their entirety, which is reflected in the entirety of the series. Wing is hard to watch because it’s not episodic. Some of the coolest moments happen without fanfare. But I’d have no problem listing five favorite characters. Duo at the top because he’s the best, hands down, then Relena, then Wufei, then- wait no, first Meilan, then Wufei. And then it’s a battle between Trowa and Noin, with Dorothy being close behind.
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