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Look I'm sorry to anyone who thought the Saja Boys were a real band, but it was obviously fake from the beginning.

Huntr/x has been doing this gimmick for years where they'll put on a performance and some actors dressed up like demons will "interrupt" it or get into some choreo fights on stage and stuff. If you're a fan you know, the demons usually symbolize things like industry corruption, Mira's struggle with her family, Rumi being in the closet, etc, and there's lots of hints and secret messages to the fans in what they're wearing or how they show up. Check out huntresx5evah on blsky they've got an extensive examination of the "demons" over the years and what the messages to the fans are.

In the concert before Golden was released, the demons were dressed like flight attendants. That was the indication that something new was about to take off. @/queenhuntrixdontmiss and I speculated that it was going to be a new single and low and behold, it was.

But then the live performance got cancelled. It's an open secret that Rumi was having vocal issues, so that was probably not planned. They needed to buy time for her to recover, so, enter the Saja Boys -- a fake band of guys really clearly pretending to be demons, they release ONE single, do a bunch of b-tier variety shows for a week, nearly all of their public appearances have Huntr/x right there, keeping the hype and energy up until Rumi can get her throat polyps removed and furthering the routine where Huntr/x are supposed to be secret demon hunters and the Saja Boys are supposed to be secret demons.

Then the whole thing culminates in the Golden live performance at the idol awards, the big act with Huntr/x fake "break up" and the subsequent theatrics to make it up to fans for failing the first Golden performance. Huntr/x takes their obligation to fans very seriously, I've no doubt that they all felt terrible about having to cancel, so a free show was the obvious recourse to try and make it up to people. And they pulled out all the stops!

But the Saja Boys were never real. I mean they got real guys to pretend to be a boy band and do the dancing and lip syncing obviously, but come on, most of them didn't even have names.

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The Matriarch Isn’t the Villain. She’s the Mirror

I often hear a discourse where Celine in K-pop Demon Hunters, Alma in Encanto and Ming in Turning Red are seen as vilains. They’re the ones who restricted the younger generation, hurt them, and are ultimately responsible for their pain, trauma and self-doubt. They’re framed as the real villains of the story. But I’d like to differ.

These are stories of intergenerational trauma. They are women who survived, repressed, and tried to protect their families the only way they knew how: through control, perfectionism, and emotional suppression.

And yet, when the next generation begins to reclaim joy, freedom, softness — they become the obstacle. Not because they’re bad people, but because they’re scarred. Their minds cling to survival strategies, unable to recognize that the environment has changed.

Alma is still stuck fleeing the colonizers.

Ming is still afraid of her true self.

Celine believes that fear and mistakes must be hidden.

It’s not about hating these characters. It’s about how unprocessed trauma twists love into control. How survival, unexamined, turns into rigidity. These women were never given space to process their own pain and they project it onto their daughters and granddaughters.

And here’s something we rarely say enough: intergenerational trauma can create toxic patterns but that doesn’t always mean there was abuse or conscious harm. Even when their love becomes suffocating or controlling, these women are not necessarily “abusive parents.” They are daughters of silence, fear, and sacrifice. And they were never taught another way. It’s important to make that distinction, especially in a world that often pushes a binary, punitive reading of family dynamics.

They’re the product of a generation that was told to endure. But endurance without healing becomes its own kind of violence.

What’s powerful in these stories is that they don’t end in vengeance. They end in confrontation and transformation. The confrontation is necessary: the younger generation refuses the silence. Refuses the shame. Refuses to carry a burden that wasn’t theirs to begin with.

The house is destroyed in Encanto.

Mei accepts her full self.

So does Rumi.

And in the best cases, this confrontation allows the elder to soften too. Alma opens up. Ming listens. And I’m hoping in the sequel, Celine will open too.

Maybe that’s also why these stories speak so deeply to POC audiences. These aren’t stories about cutting ties. They’re stories about how hard it is to transform them, to protect ancestral bonds while refusing to perpetuate inherited pain. In many racialized families, collectivity, loyalty, and intergenerational duty are sacred... even when they come at the cost of personal boundaries.

And sometimes, Western individualist frameworks read these tensions as dysfunction or villainy. But for us, they’re just the difficult truth of growing up and trying to do better.

These women aren’t villains. That would be too easy. They embody the fragile, necessary work of bringing change without breaking the thread. These stories are about refusing to inherit their pain without reflection. Because love, without accountability, is not enough.

These stories show us that each generation has something to learn from the next. And the new generation must also break free from the chains they inherited while preserving what is meaningfull.

But it’s not just their story.

One day, we’ll be the older generation.

And we’ll need to be humble enough to learn from the ones after us.

So don’t be a fool.

We may be Mei, Rumi, or Mirabel today.

But tomorrow, we could be Ming, Celine, or Alma.

And when that time comes, we’ll realize how hard it is to unlearn what once kept us safe.

So let’s have compassion for all these characters.

Because these stories show us not just how the cycle of generations works, but how it can make us better, stronger, and more connected... if we’re all willing to go through the change.

∘₊✧──────✧──────✧₊∘

If you’re curious, I’ve written more on K-pop Demon Hunters:

A post on the mental health themes woven through the songs — right here.

A breakdown of Celine-Rumi in comparaison to Gothel–Rapunzel dynamic — here.

An analysis about Rumi, Jinu, and the danger of sinking together — here.

Some book recs for each of the K-pop Demon Hunters characters — here.

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brotherly comfort

[reblogs appreciated. comms open]

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I'm back, kind of :D

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Mischaracterisation of Epic!Eurylochus

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We’ve heard it.

He’s “Selfish. Greedy. Power-hungry. Stupid. Whiny. Unreasonable. Hypocritical.”

Believe me when I say I’ve seen the worst of the same bad surface-level takes for a certain character. It pains me every time I scroll down the comments of an awesome Epic animatic and UGghhGHhhGhh just make it STOOOOP-

(Plus, I’m in an analytical mood and I find it fun to yap about anything I hold passionate.)

Before we start, I want to establish that my stand in Eurylochus’ case is not exactly “defending,” but rather “understanding” him better. It’s not the word I’d use since it sorta implies I’m absolving him of fault. I’m just pointing out a different perspective that people tend to skim over. (including some of my own interpretations)

While all Epic characters should be fairly held accountable for their own actions, Eurylochus, HOWEVER, is scapegoated and treated like the devil incarnate to an insane amount. Meanwhile, Odysseus who has done his own share of atrocities is treated “Awww poor baby just wants to see his wife again 🥺🥺💔💔”

Let’s proceed with an open mind, shall we?

(Or don’t. That’s on you though.)

I don’t expect agreement to everything I say nor do I claim that all my interpretations are correct/canon. Again, just sharing a different perspective to view this character in another light.

Now take a seat and enjoy a snack while I guide your hand. I’ve divided and organised this post into sections hopefully for an easier read.

So feel free to skip to specific parts.

…………..

I recommend checking this video out before reading to get an insight into Jay’s brain: https://www.tiktok.com/@jorgeherrans/video/7390086030201752874

Basically, keep in mind that Jay has stated Eurylochus is lost without a purpose. But he finds his worth in being the PROTECTOR of the crew.

This is why he doesn’t have a consistent instrument. This is why he always has the backing vocals of the crew.

Remember this!!!!

Because this serves as his canonical core trait and motivation through the entire musical.

…………..

COLOR Coding: (Emphasis or Fandom Quotes || My Side Comments || Lyrics ||)

…………..

1.) The Windbag:

“He opened the windbag-!!!”

Let’s start with the most common hate against him. Which, yeah. Fine. Okay. Fair enough to dislike him for that. I won’t deny he’s at fault here.

However!

BEAR IN MIND that Eurylochus’ exact reasonings on “why” he did it were never explicitly confirmed or established. (Kinda wished they were though). While this situation is wide open to different interpretations, you can’t confidently say:

“He greedily believed it’s treasure!!”

Nooooo. Eurylochus wasn’t the one bearing interest at the thought of treasure. This COULD be the motivation of OTHER men on the ship, but NOT necessarily Eurylochus’ own.

Which doesn’t even make sense in the first place. He’s never even once brought up treasure as a desire. The ones interested were at least Elpenor and Perimedes among others.

(⬆️ Got this from Jay’s official screenplay for Epic)

Also, Eurylochus is 2nd in Command. And if we say he’s married to Ctimene, we can say he must be of high status as well. What need would he have for more gold? So claiming Eurylochus’ reasoning to be greed is just pulling out weak statements from the wind. (Hehe get it?)

“Eurylochus let his curiosity get the better of him.”

While not impossible, it’s also not very likely. Remember his caution with the lotus-eaters island and Aeolus? He’s strongly risk-averse. If he could avoid any risk to the men, then he would. Curiosity be damned.

It doesn’t sound like him to have opened the bag just to simply satisfy curiosity. Especially when it’s given by a god he didn’t trust in the first place.

Greed and curiosity may very well have been the OTHER members’ motives. Interpretations vary, but if we’re going to blame Eurylochus for the windbag, then AT LEAST do it in a way that makes sense for HIS OWN character.

We can do this by going back to his canon core traits: [Protectiveness and dedication to their crew]

Now let’s step into his shoes:

————

Your Captain has just returned with a suspicious looking bag and explains that it contains the storm blocking their way. Okay, makes sense. The sky has cleared when he returned so there’s some semblance of truth. Only…. It feels waaaay too easy….

No way a god would just allow them to leave without a catch, right? (Remember, even Ody had the same suspicion). They’re dangerous and not to be trusted. Is ‘not opening the bag’ really the only simple condition they’ve given?

It gets even more concerning when Odysseus, whom you’ve been through 10 years of war having each others’ back, ever since childhood. Who has trusted you strongly enough to assign you as 2nd in Command, just SHUTS you off.

Suddenly, he’s guarding that bag like a hoarding dragon, staying awake for an ungodly duration of 9 days. Not a word of further explanation. No extra orders given to at least take shifts.

Why is Odysseus keeping it so heavily guarded by himself alone? They were a team, were they not? They’ve defeated Troy and the Cyclops together. Went through the worst of storms alive.

If not the crew, he could’ve at least confided in his own 2nd in Command, right?? But he didn’t…

Even the crew picked up on this strange behaviour as well. Now they’re getting restless. Rumours of treasure, maybe even food are spreading around. And more rumours of mistrust towards Odysseus (which is fair enough, he’s known for his lies and wit.)

You don’t buy the treasure rumours. But whatever the rumours, 9 days is plenty of time for imagination to run wild and fill in these unanswered gaps of knowledge with absolutely ANYTHING:

——————

—> “Do we really take this god’s word for it? The captain said it was the storm inside the bag, but is that actually true? What if Odysseus had been lied to? Yes, the storm from before is gone. But did Aeolus really place it inside the bag or is that what they just wanted Odysseus to believe?”

—> “For all we know, they could’ve just snapped the storm away and placed nothing inside just to mess with mortals. Because why wouldn’t this god find it funny to be messing up Odysseus’ sleep schedule and watch him stress over nothing?”

—> “While that god’s flying winions seem to be successfully convincing some of our men about treasure, I’m not. But it doesn’t help that Odysseus refuses to entertain any questions. If this restlessness continues, someone’s going to end up stealing it anyway. Maybe even violently and I can’t let that happen to him. I have to reassure them somehow before it’s too late.”

—> “Or what if there’s something far more nefarious inside it. What if the bag’s enchanted with a curse or spell? What if we’re bringing something far more dangerous with us back to Ithaca, endangering everyone there? If that’s the case, we can’t open it within our borders. We have to do it here when we’re still a safe but close enough distance away.”

—> “Fine, if anyone’s opening it, it might as well be someone Odysseus trusts the most. As 2nd in Command, I can take the blame if needed. A small quick peak should be enough to reassure the crew, silence the rumours, ensure nothing is stolen, finally get some closure, and the bag can then be returned instantly with no harm done and maybe not even noticed when he wakes up. Sounds reasonable enough, right-?“

(Note that my mind came up with a bunch of scenarios and these are only within 10 minutes. Imagine 9 whole anxious days of biting what-ifs plaguing Eurylochus.)

—————

Someone else here said similar points as me. Props to them!

—————

Overall, what I’m trying to say is that it’s not in Eury’s character to be self-serving. His first lines in the musical are literally about how the mens’ food supply have been depleted. It’s a consistent fact that Eurylochus’ priority is always their men.

Whatever his reasoning for the windbag, he would’ve only been acting out of anxiety.

He only opened it because they ALL already were itching to open it.

Besides, doubt has already long been sowed ever since the team lost their first number of men to Polyphemus.

This mistrust, and the mysterious bag added with Aeolus’ constant whispering in everyone’s ears to steal it (because let’s face it, these Greek gods never play fair), is just what pushes the crew over the line of disobeying orders and most likely pester their 2nd person in charge.

…………..

2.) Aeolus’ Sabotage:

Check out Aeolus’ line:

“I give the fire enough to stay burning.”

They are deliberately sowing distrust and rumours among the men to sabotage and make this game more fun. Why do you think the winions went: “It’s TREASURE! :DD” if Aeolus truly has no ulterior motive and wants to genuinely help?

Because the game was already rigged.

They don’t care if Odysseus wins their challenge or not. Given how they are characterised as playful and mischievous, Epic!Aeolus is most likely just bored and wanted to see how much they could mess with these humans.

They eagerly expected only a matter of time for someone to cave in. And that “someone” just happened to be Eurylochus.

It’s quite likely that they eavesdropped during “Luck Runs Out.” What if Aeolus had already sensed the mistrust between Ody and his men and used it to their own amusement?

(⬆️ Btw, above is my text. I just screenshotted it here.)

And with a chuckle, Aeolus deliberately planted seeds of doubt within Ody. They made Odysseus think his men weren’t capable of being trustworthy, when they ABSOLUTELY can be if given the chance.

And even if not all of them and we can give Odysseus benefit of the doubt, Eurylochus is RIGHT THERE!

You know, the guy who helped him kill Athena’s magical boar as young boys??? If they’ve been friends for that long, Ody has all the reason to trust him again and again.

(⬇️ Yes, this is canon in the Epic!verse)

But like I’ve mentioned before, that trust was already breaking ever since Polites. And it keeps getting worse onwards because apparently, these two grown men can’t clearly communicate with each other.

“Everything’s changed since Polites”

—————

Though interestingly, Aeolus had also subtly gave Odysseus a hint in winning their game.

“Keep your friends close and enemies closer~”

But to mess with him, Aeolus purposely blurred the line between friends and enemies. What it actually meant was Odysseus can entrust and keep his friends close (Eurylochus + trusted others) and keep his enemies closer. (The bag IS his enemy. Aeolus is NOT his friend. They DON’T care about them getting home. They just want to PLAY.)

Trust is a two-way street. Regardless if you’re the captain or king, you need to lend trust to your team so they can do the same. Not doing so will only weaken what could’ve been effective teamwork.

(I really thought majority of people nowadays are against blind obedience towards authority, especially on Tumblr of all platforms-)

Odysseus isolated himself from his crew for 9 days, missed Aeolus’ subtle hint, drove Eurylochus crazy with worry, and now all of them had suffered the consequences.

“But why else would they mistrust their captain who has lead 600 men to war and not one of them died?”

Well…..

…………..

3.) Trusting Odysseus:

Let’s go back to the point where everything was smooth-sailing (haha).

In Full Speed Ahead, Odysseus is less on edge. Note that in this point of time, as much as he’s excited to get home asap, Ody does not neglect the crew. When Eurylochus brings up the food supply, Ody ACTUALLY listens and reassures him that they’ll make a stopover to hunt for more.

“There we'll hunt for food, my second in command.”

ALSO NOTE that when they found the Lotus-Eaters island, while Ody disagrees with Eury’s “raid-the place” plan, he STILL doesn’t completely dismiss his valid concerns.

“Give me 'til sunrise, and if we don't return

Then six hundred men can make this whole place burn”

He hears him out and compromises that if anything happened to him and Polites past sunrise, Ody grants him permission to bail the both of them out with fire if proven necessary.

——

(Side Note: Raiding isn’t Eurylochus being malicious. It’s just him being anxious of not knowing what’s ahead. Strategically, if they strike first, they’ll have the upper hand and suffer minimal or no casualties. They just finished a war. It makes sense for them not to trust strangers.)

——

Since Odysseus openly trusted Eurylochus with their back-up plan to lead a rescue, Eurylochus trusts him in return and no longer resists his and Polites’ scouting mission. Still anxious maybe, but at least his worries were soothed. At least the Captain kept a back-up plan they could rely on.

(⬆️ He sings along here, see?)

Like I’ve said, Trust is a two-way street. Expecting only one person to give their trust is just asking for blind obedience. That’s not how effective leadership works. That’s why their teamwork was efficient back then before sht went down.

After the Cyclops saga and Polites’ death, everything falls apart. Their sense of invincibility shattered after the crew have suffered their first losses. Shaken and traumatised, Odysseus becomes fixated on getting home quickly. Because home is where Penelope is. Home is where he’ll find comfort.

And thus, he no longer confides in his crew OR his 2nd in Command anymore. Especially when doing that means slowing down their journey.

“But Eurylochus had no reason not to trust Ody!!”

Well umm actually 🤓, he kinda does.

Athena had called Odysseus out for being “reckless” in ‘My Goodbye.’ Which is true! Ever since the Lotus-Eaters, Odysseus’ erratic behaviour became a lot more evident, consistently nurturing doubt within his team.

Want examples? Here you go:

————

(1) You’re telling me you completely trusted the words of absolute strangers on an island to find food in a cave? Okay, a bit of leeway on that because we all went along with it. But then again, the decision to blindly trust their claims for free food was still reckless.

(2) Dude, did you just dox your own name and home address to this vengeful cyclops? I get you’re mad but WHAT-.

(Not using this as an argument, but fun fact: Did you know the crew were upset and begging Odysseus to stop taunting the cyclops, because his loud-ass mouth was allowing Polyphemus to throw boulders in their direction in Homer’s Odyssey?)

(3) In Storm, Odysseus pushes his crew forward through a strong storm that Eurylochus WARNS him are causing them damage.

In contrast to “Full Speed Ahead,” does Odysseus heed his valid concerns? NOPE.

If it meant slowing down, he doesn’t want to hear it. This is already our first and subtle indicator that Ody would compromise his crew to achieve his goal. We know in Dangerous, Hermes explained that Poseidon summoned this VERY SAME storm to “stop them by design.”

So no matter how confident Ody was that they can push through, he was still ultimately going to forcefully lead their ships into imminent danger and death. The only reason they didn’t was because they spotted Aeolus’ island.

Eurylochus isn’t being whiny or being annoying here.

This is the equivalent of being in the passenger seat of your friend’s car and they’re speeding over the limit. Do I value my friend? Yes. Do I also value my own life and not wanting to crash? Also yes.

(4) “We’re going to shoot for the skies!” “What-?!”

Eury’s response here tells that he’s convinced Ody had completely lost his mind at this point. Because HELLO??

Magic island = magical creature.

The last creature they faced had caused deaths. Are we seriously just going to shoot at this magical being’s home and risk them going batshit over causing damage on their property? AGAIN???

(Metaphorically, this really establishes that Odysseus will take to great lengths to reach impossibly high goals. I also think it’s pretty neat that he’s the only one who climbed up. Almost foreshadowing that he’s the only one who can reach them.)

(5) Luck Runs Out seals the deal here.

Like Captain, it’s one thing to anchor our ships to the island for safety. But what do you mean you’re going up there ALONE to make a deal with a literal god?? Okay, fine let’s hear you out on your plan first.

No back-up plan? You’re just going to climb up there and talk? Are you mad??? Did we not learn from last time??

These red flags weren’t missed by Eurylochus. Of course he’s going to speak out about it! He speaks out because he cares so much!

He’s 2nd in Command. Questioning the Captain, pointing out risks, and communicating the crew’s concerns are part of the job description!! We can’t get mad at a cook for making dishes!!! (Although yeah, expressing them publicly was his mistake.)

Also, Polites, his other dear friend, had just DIED. To a beast that killed him after an “Open Arms” attempt. Odysseus (his captain and BROTHER) is about to go do the same thing. Eurylochus is already grieving for one person. He CANNOT go through another one so soon.

—————

(Bonus Point:)

This one’s a little miscellaneous but I’m going to mention it here.

People get on Eurylochus’ ass for swaying/manipulating the crew’s stance against Odysseus on purpose from the very start.

Oh honey, noooo. You’ve got the wrong man.

Manipulation is NOT Eury’s skill. That’s Odysseus’. Have you not been paying attention to the many times Ody uses his wit? Like I’ve said, Eurylochus worries a lot but his role is being the crew’s voice.

Whatever Eurylochus says out loud IS what everyone else is already thinking. He doesn’t need to sway/persuade anybody 😒

Ody on the other hand? He has to use manipulative means to get everyone on his side. Jay confirms it himself in this video at (2:12)

“Even though several of them died in the Cyclops Saga, I’m purposely trying to be manipulative in this situation.” - Jay

Basically, Odysseus diverts attention away from his misjudgement and failures with the Cyclops. He knows he messed up there, but he wants the crew to brush it aside and focus on his success instead in the war.

“Hey guys, ignore the deaths of our crewmates for a minute. I know exactly what I’m doing here. Now let me do what I have to do. End of discussion.”

Odysseus is blatantly convincing everyone and Eurylochus to excuse his carelessness at the moment because “sitting down to talk through a back-up plan in case things go wrong so we can still ensure everyone’s safety” would take too loooooooong and he needs to go home to Penelope NOW.

Eurylochus wants to go home too. But unlike Odysseus, he’s willing to take his time and avoid as much risk as possible. Placing the crew in peril just to take a shortcut is NEVER worth it in his eyes.

………….

Anyways, that’s the Ocean Saga done, I’m going to do another post or two covering parts of the rest of the Musical where people have thrown as much mud as they could on Eury’s character that frustrate me to death.

For now, I’ll leave this here and hopefully have you reconsidering some things. See ya in the next part, peeps! <33

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This is canon btw

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PRE-EPIC #0

Fan comic for "Epic" the musical

This comic is going to be a collection of short stories about Odysseus, Polites and Eurylochus before The Trojan War. Keep in mind that this is not canon - no childhood facts were included in official songs of "Epic", so most of the comic is just my writing inspired by the musical and Homer's "Odyssey"

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:)

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❤️♻️ For every like and reblog, Odysseus and Polites get to slap a dumbass

They were just men-

(Analytic ramble below, idk if you care: ⬇️)

I firmly believe that people who unironically believe Ody hates his crew for what they did, sacrificed them out of spite, or thinks they deserved their fate has listened to the musical with their ears closed.

I can see him being mad at them initially but over time, Odysseus comes to acknowledge that he has also failed them.

In the Thunder Saga, he literally begs Zeus not to make him choose. They may have mutinied (which was reasonable), but Ody never wanted them to die. It’s just like how Eury and the men bandaged him up even after he sacrificed six of them.

Ody’s reasoning was “I have to see her,” NOT “You brought this upon yourselves.” His decision wasn’t stemming from anger but desperation. (Which makes sense that he’s worried for his family after Tiresias literally says he sees his palace covered in red.)

In the Vengeance Saga, is where it’s the most obvious that Odysseus doesn’t hold ill will against his men. In fact, he takes accountability for eroding their trust and straining them far beyond their limits because he was so hyperfocused on returning home asap.

In “Dangerous,” Odysseus openly admits that he was INDEED selfish. He was only thinking of HIS family. HE had one goal in mind. Ody doesn’t think the crew just died of their own stupidity, he believes he did them dirty too.

And I would like to mostly attract attention here in “600 Strike”

You’ve heard the argument: “Oh if only Eury didn’t open the windbag. Odysseus must want to kick his ass for prolonging the journey and killing 500+ men. Good Riddance”

To which I say, WRONG!!

Sure, Ody must’ve been pissed hearing the truth. But in the end, after probably some thinking/reflecting in Calypso’s island, Odysseus blames the 500+ deaths (and by extension, the remaining 43 men) NOT in Eurylochus’ hands, BUT POSEIDON’S.

And before you say, “Maybe, but Poseidon only killed the 500+ men. The rest were killed by Eury’s disobedience in killing Helios’ cattle.”

Nope. Not in Ody’s eyes. His song said 600 men in total. Not just the 500+ men.

“But the opened windbag-“ contains Poseidon’s storm that HE summoned to stop Ody’s crew. If Poseidon didn’t summon it, the stupid windbag wouldn’t even be needed nor opened at all. And it was Poseidon sinking the other ships that lead and forced Ody to think fast and have his remaining men go through the events of the rest of the sagas.

He also says “Look what YOU turned me into.” Like he’s saying Poseidon made him think that Ruthlessness is the only way and as a result, he has gotten apathetic to the ones on the ship with him that he cared about. Making him sacrifice men who also had families like him.

……….

By the end of the Vengeance Saga and upon finally reaching Ithaca, Odysseus doesn’t primarily and solely (if at all) blame Eurylochus for the sht they went through. That’s mostly on the Sea god. If anything, it hurts him more that he was driven to make the decision of killing his other best friend and family.

The funniest irony to me in the Epic fandom is that some people will keep claiming their precious baby girl did no wrong when Odysseus himself LITERALLY accepts being at fault.

And the most likely scenario if Ody ever knew about the bullcrap treatment given by the fandom to Eury?

“KEEP MY BROTHER’S NAME OUT OF YOUR FCKING MOUTH-“

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They were just men-

(Analytic ramble below, idk if you care: ⬇️)

I firmly believe that people who unironically believe Ody hates his crew for what they did, sacrificed them out of spite, or thinks they deserved their fate has listened to the musical with their ears closed.

I can see him being mad at them initially but over time, Odysseus comes to acknowledge that he has also failed them.

In the Thunder Saga, he literally begs Zeus not to make him choose. They may have mutinied (which was reasonable), but Ody never wanted them to die. It’s just like how Eury and the men bandaged him up even after he sacrificed six of them.

Ody’s reasoning was “I have to see her,” NOT “You brought this upon yourselves.” His decision wasn’t stemming from anger but desperation. (Which makes sense that he’s worried for his family after Tiresias literally says he sees his palace covered in red.)

In the Vengeance Saga, is where it’s the most obvious that Odysseus doesn’t hold ill will against his men. In fact, he takes accountability for eroding their trust and straining them far beyond their limits because he was so hyperfocused on returning home asap.

In “Dangerous,” Odysseus openly admits that he was INDEED selfish. He was only thinking of HIS family. HE had one goal in mind. Ody doesn’t think the crew just died of their own stupidity, he believes he did them dirty too.

And I would like to mostly attract attention here in “600 Strike”

You’ve heard the argument: “Oh if only Eury didn’t open the windbag. Odysseus must want to kick his ass for prolonging the journey and killing 500+ men. Good Riddance”

To which I say, WRONG!!

Sure, Ody must’ve been pissed hearing the truth. But in the end, after probably some thinking/reflecting in Calypso’s island, Odysseus blames the 500+ deaths (and by extension, the remaining 43 men) NOT in Eurylochus’ hands, BUT POSEIDON’S.

And before you say, “Maybe, but Poseidon only killed the 500+ men. The rest were killed by Eury’s disobedience in killing Helios’ cattle.”

Nope. Not in Ody’s eyes. His song said 600 men in total. Not just the 500+ men.

“But the opened windbag-“ contains Poseidon’s storm that HE summoned to stop Ody’s crew. If Poseidon didn’t summon it, the stupid windbag wouldn’t even be needed nor opened at all. And it was Poseidon sinking the other ships that lead and forced Ody to think fast and have his remaining men go through the events of the rest of the sagas.

He also says “Look what YOU turned me into.” Like he’s saying Poseidon made him think that Ruthlessness is the only way and as a result, he has gotten apathetic to the ones on the ship with him that he cared about. Making him sacrifice men who also had families like him.

……….

By the end of the Vengeance Saga and upon finally reaching Ithaca, Odysseus doesn’t primarily and solely (if at all) blame Eurylochus for the sht they went through. That’s mostly on the Sea god. If anything, it hurts him more that he was driven to make the decision of killing his other best friend and family.

The funniest irony to me in the Epic fandom is that some people will keep claiming their precious baby girl did no wrong when Odysseus himself LITERALLY accepts being at fault.

And the most likely scenario if Ody ever knew about the bullcrap treatment given by the fandom to Eury?

“KEEP MY BROTHER’S NAME OUT OF YOUR FCKING MOUTH-“

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What a lovely trio of pals, I sure hope nothing bad happens to them <33

(Alt versions of Polites with and without glasses under cut)

Open Arms became one of my fav comfort songs fr fr

@your-ne1ghbor I remembered you loving this fandom before I joined, old friend :))

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My soul would be gone so fast lmao 💍🧎

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Stoick’s ship

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“The Mutiny in the Thunder Saga was uncalled for.”

What?? Why???

Omfg I can’t tell you enough how much I hate this take.

The crew’s anger is highly valid. Heck, I’d even say that it’s more likely disappointment and fear than actual anger at all.

We all mainly feel bad for Ody because he’s the main character, which means throughout the whole thing, it’s only HIS family we see. HIS internal struggles with morality. HIS grief. HIS guilt. We are able to see his character in full detail.

And I think that’s unfortunately why people tend to disregard and forget the crew are capable of feeling those same things as well. We don’t get to see THEIR stories.

In the Underworld, are we assuming that only Ody saw the ghosts of the dead? No doubt, each member must have seen the faces of their dead comrades. The faces of friends they’ve fought alongside together.

Brothers.

And just like Ody, may have even seen ghosts of their own families or friends back in Ithaca that have passed. Maybe they’ve taken too long too.

What do you think Eurylochus felt upon seeing Polites’ ghost? Weren’t the trio childhood friends in the Epic!verse?

It’s so easy to say: “Oh, Ody only sacrificed 6 men to Scylla. It’s fine. A small necessary cost.”

Necessary? Yeah probably. But small? Uhm no?????

After all they’ve been through, what if the crew got closer to the remaining few of them to cope and for comfort? They’ve all been through the same war and struggles.

And without warning, Odysseus just allowed them to be snatched away and killed. It’s such an asshole move to spring this decision onto them without consulting them all first.

(There just might be some willing volunteers and there’s less chance of a mutiny. At least this way, what’s left of the remaining trust isn’t broken. A little something we can call ✨Communication✨)

At this stage, what is even the difference between their captain and the gods/monsters they’ve encountered? They’re both a higher figure with more power who would use them to their own benefits.

With this monster on their ship, they are no longer safe. Whose lives are going to be next? Ody has become unpredictable and dangerous, JUST LIKE the beasts they’ve faced. They are scared and betrayed.

“It was only 6 men.”

Please. One of those men could most likely be one alive member’s remaining tether. One’s best friend. All that one has got left. If Penelope could be Ody’s everything, to the point of trading the world just to return to her, what’s to say one of the 6 sacrificed men wasn’t somebody’s everything too?

It’s just so terribly easy to gloss this over and call their mutiny an overreaction when the musical doesn’t hand over their humanity to you on a silver platter.

“It’s hypocritical since Eurylochus was willing to sacrifice men behind on Circe’s island.”

First of all, Eurylochus never knew Circe’s place is a trap. He didn’t intentionally lead them to their potential demise. Odysseus on the other hand, knew Scylla had a cost.

Second, what did you want Eurylochus to do? Sword fight a powerful sorceress who could easily snap them into bacon? There’s nothing that can be done without risking any more lives. (The only way they succeeded was because of Hermes but HOW ARE THEY SUPPOSED TO KNOW THAT WAS AN OPTION??)

Ody, unlike Eury, DID have a choice to tell his crew the plan. Which he didn’t.

“But what if they rise up if he told them early on?”

He’d still be honest and at least give them time to think it through and maybe understand. But it’s still ultimately a “what-if” scenario. No one knows how they’d really react if Ody did consult with them first.

As Eurylochus’ had said: If he wanted all the power, Ody must be willing and ready to take the blame/consequences.

So the chance of the crew protesting is just going to be something that is expected. This is just a case where Ody prioritised his ideals of returning home ASAP over the welfare of his team. To which he willingly and selfishly took.

Odysseus doesn’t consider that the lives he sacrificed had their own “Penelope and Telemachus,” anything they might’ve held dear, back in Ithaca too.

And that’s why Eurylochus was pissed about it. Not only is he mourning his friends, but he knew as well that he could easily have been one of them. He has a wife back home as well. Ctimene. Ody’s sister. But Ody doesn’t give a fck about anyone other than himself anymore, doesn’t he?

Not excusing the crew’s own mistakes but damn, calling their reaction unreasonable frustrates me. Everyone here on the ship is HUMAN whether it’s spelled out or not.

You can fault them all you want. They’re all flawed and imperfect. Including their captain. But just because the crew messed up doesn’t make them incapable of being grief-stricken like Ody.

Plus, undermining the crew’s suffering is ALSO detrimental to Ody’s monster arc. How does he fulfil his own promise to become monstrous when y’all brush off the hurt he has selfishly caused?

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hey girl, get deer'd

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So like.

Random WildChip concept.

In my brain.

Think about it.

Remember how uptight Crunchy Chip is in the Odyssey? And that the fandom as a whole agree that he should take it easier on himself?

Wildberry gets him to relax after offering him a pie, to which Chip eventually takes and happily enjoys the sweet treat. And it helps keep him from being uptight all the time from then on. A taste that he so definitely needed.

And then this idea popped into my head. What if during the Eternal Sugar adventure, Wildberry snacks on some Cacao nibs that Chip has gifted him at some point? And the bitterness of those helps ground his senses away from the temptation of the sugary paradise? A taste that he so definitely needed.

We know in canon that this works:

(It’s not that Wild knew the nibs would come in handy. I just like thinking he just genuinely came to like bitter snacks and just carries some around with him.)

Think about it.

Wild being the sweetness in Chip’s surrounding bitterness that essentially makes him a stronger warrior by removing that shame of treating/rewarding himself.

Chip being the bitterness in Wild’s surrounding sweetness that also makes him a stronger warrior by reminding him that while the real world may be unpleasant, there’s still things worth fighting for.