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britneyshakespeare · 1 year ago

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you know what it is. i talk about how vain he is and how he only talks about himself and that is the impression a lot of people have of him and it is the impression i favor leaning towards. he has a very coded way of self-disclosure; he often seems like he's trying to impress people but i know him to be not-the-most-assured in a lot of ways. when i first complimented him on his poetry and told him how much i liked a few pieces (and i loved some of what i read before i knew his last name, so when i read his poetry i did not assume the person whose poetry i so loved was, well, that retired male model i met in passing every now and then). when i told him that. he was very moved by it.

and i do talk about how vain he is; i do say he only talks about himself; but every now and then when he does say something about me it is not at all hidden that he does admire me. some of what he says that seems to coded to impress me or to get my validation, i know he is doing this towards me because he thinks im this smart poetry girl. and i am? i am that, he's not wrong. i think it makes me feel hopeless to think that he really does respect me and care what i think of him because i'd rather he didn't. i'd rather him be this charming but shallow pretty boy which i think he has been seen as by a lot of people throughout his life. despite that he is hardworking, despite that he has (or at least tries very hard to have) an intellectual side. perhaps what he says about himself is so often coded to please me even while it is fishing for my attention, and i want to see that as a reflection of his own self-regard but i don't know that it is.

i don't know that it's not, but i don't know that it is either and as neither of us is very frequently vulnerable with the other, it's not fair for me to say which is the case. or even that there's a "which" like it can't be both. i don't know that he admires me; i don't know that he sees me as this girl who is (or at least used to be) very charmed by him. i do know that he always comes to me and asks me about poetry because as far as he's told me, i'm the only one who has ever cared about his. for all i know that could also be bullshit, but then why should i assume it is either? i'm quite unfair to him in my assessments of him. i do have to admit, he has never actually seemed to have a disrespectful or unfair assessment of me.

#he told me today i was 'exquisite' basically #i think sometimes he's very shocked by my general lack of ambitions. while i do have all this artistic knowledge #i'm like some sort of poetry guru to him. which does make me laugh a little #his estimation of me is overstated.#im a fairy to him! a strange creature he doesnt understand #like how rochester used to call jane eyre a fairy. except we're both pretty good-looking #tales from diana #i dont call myself good-looking often either but i know other people see me as that. so. it is what it is #thats another piece of the puzzle is back in 2020 during quarantine he was... well he still is #but he WAS initially very flirty w me and sort of asked me out 'if we ever get out of this' (quarantine)#whether he sees me as some pretty smart girl who's 8 years younger than him. well.#thats probably exactly what he sees me as #although im not pretty enough or smart enough. or hell even young enough anymore #god we're both old now.#i do promise you reader i won't marry him

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bluinary · 2 years ago

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Imo it's the desire to experience a fantasy that motivates these comments. In these people's eyes, The Nice Guy At Work should either be perfect and emotionally mature with no character development needed, or he should crash and burn and prove himself an incel for the audience's satisfaction, while Retsuko learns to be happy alone. But you're right; folks forget that Aggretsuko's main thesis is teaching us how to *accept reality*.

If you're looking for love in your 20s-- which Retsuko is-- no man within a healthy age range of you is going to be fully formed and as emotionally healthy as, say, Kristoff in Frozen II. You're supposed to grow together, which Retsuko and Haida do.

Also, examining the "nice guys" trope Retsuko and Haida may fall into, people fail to examine Retsuko's reasons for saying "no" to Haida, or Haida's reasons for "pursuing", which he never really did after he got what felt like a clear "no". He's not just some dude from work-- he was in Retsuko's inner circle for quite some time. Maybe she felt like she "didn't know him that well," which she said a lot, but in actuality, she spent more time with him than everyone except Fenneko. The context seemed more leaning toward the feeling that Haida was her work friend, and nothing more, which was a boundary Retsuko placed.....for what? (Bear with me here.)

Because she knew that giving someone from her department a try would maybe be more difficult and risky, yet simultaneously boring, than dating, say, a mysterious dude from her Driver's Ed class. It would also be less exciting, because she *already* knew a lot about Haida. And let's be real; Retsuko's big character arc, in addition to gaining her confidence and her voice without exploding, is mainly about her losing her taste for whirlwind hijinks. Remember that her plan in S1 was to "get cute", find a rich guy, get married ASAP, and then leave her boring, crappy accounting job for good. But she grew to realize that her boss, while an asshole, wasn't the Devil himself. Tsunoda wasn't the workplace Succubus she imagined her to be, just predictably shallow in some areas of her personality. Kabae was more than a nuisance; Tsubone held a lot of wisdom to offer. Even Anai had a chill button. A steady job wasn't a bad thing. And throughout her development, Retsuko had to also reasses her relationship with Haida. Because while her "no" meant "no", and Haida took it as such without cutting her off as a friend, Retsuko had to change how she saw him as she did with all of her coworkers (save Fenneko) in order to grow as a person. And, while frustrated with some of his flaws, she saw that Haida was fundamentally kind, mostly easy-going, and extremely dependable when she needed a friend. Maybe not as exciting as Tadano, or seemingly mysterious as the Space Cadet, but Haida was an ideal long-term partner. Retsuko just had to grow up a bit to see it.

And that message isn't for Nice Guys. Remember that the Aggretsuko brand was made specifically for us-- young, disillusioned women in our 20s who needed something a bit more relatable than, though just as cute as, Hello Kitty. And as someone who's been with a *lot* of dudes, the message rings true: compatibility doesn't lie in excitement. And while we should make our voices heard, the world will also feel like a much kinder place when we see everyone around us as human beings instead of caricatures or tropes. This also explains the lack of focus on Retsuko for the last few penultimate seasons; she had a HUGE arc accomplishment when she finally gave Haida a chance. Not for him, but for *her*. Being someone actively looking for a long-term partner, Retsuko's mental state and worldview was almost always reflected in one way or another by the man/ men she was dating in each season. Including the Otome men who made her broke. When she was finally able to cut through her own excuses for not giving a perfectly great potential partner an honest try, knowing that he could provide everything she truly wanted and needed, Retsuko broke through the last hang-up on her main character arc of the show: accepting reality. And these last few seasons, while she isn't perfect, she still maintains that development as she's slower to rage at little things, is still vocal about her wants and needs, and sees almost everyone around her as a necessary piece to the life she enjoys. She's found an amazing balance.

And as for Haida-- we're seeing a mostly static, already seemingly well-rounded character have his own arc. The important thing, I think, is that Retsuko isn't *responsible* for Haida's growth and development, even if she sometimes feels like she is bc she cares so much. Haida ultimately comes to his own conclusions, fosters his own growth, and works hard with the motivation of being a worthy partner for Retsuko. It's not the fantasy of him being the Perfect Man for their entire relationship, or somehow rescuing Retsuko from the issues she began the show with, but their relationship is mutually supportive and insanely healthy. And ykw...healthy is boring 😂 I saw someone saying "they don't do couple stuff", like what did they expect? Good relationships are boring and functional, and that is what Retsuko and Haida are. We can write fluffy, spicy, or angsty fanfic to fill in the gaps. But making their relationship more "interesting" would serve no purpose to the story. Though ofc, I wouldn't complain over a tag-team karaoke rage at Haida's dad, lol. (But even that didn't happen bc of great character development, bc being healthy and well-adjusted is.....say it with me.....boring 😂😂😂).

All of this to say: OP you're right and you should say it!!!

SO Ive seen several people say that Haida and Retsuko's relationship dident work this season due to their poor relationship skills and miscommunication. But I would argue that their relationship does work.

It works in that even after the two-way lying and miscomunication and tax fraud, their relationship still stands.

You guys have to remember that being in a relationship -- a true relationship -- is a big fucking hurdle to jump through. Yes, Retsuko had been in other relationships before, but this the first true relationship that has had any weight to it.

Throughout the 4 seasons we saw Retsuko's other relationships crumble to dust over the tiniest things.

Retsuke was a unmotivated wet napkin of a person and when he didn't commit to the relationship that Retsuko wanted, Retsuko told him and broke it off.

Tadano was a good egg, but Retsuko ultimately discovered that both Tadano and herself had conflicting future relationship goals --Retsuko wanted to get married and start a family, but Tadano wasn't interested in getting tied down (he said so himself, he though that marriage was a waste of time, and that hurt retsuko because one of her dreams through the entire series was to get married and settledown to have a family)

and the same thing happens with Haida and Inui. Like, they were a very cute couple and possibly would have gone somewhere, but Haida's feelings for Retsuko would have (for lack of a better word) stained the relationship. Inui saw how much he loved Retsuko, and very maturely, decided that she couldn't compete for his affections. So like, she cuts it off before it begins. Like, knowing that your relationship would have gone down hill due to uncontrolable outside influences and then cutting it off before it could get worse is a mature thing to do.

Also I've seen someone say that Retsuko was passive about the entire tax fraud and I'm like???? she wasn't???? She knew very well that her boyfriend was keeping secrets from her, and when those secrets were confirmed that her boyfriend was doing company-wide tax fraud for the CEO, instead of taking it to the Japanese national news, she formulated a mission impossible heist plan with all of her co-workers in order to get the information needed to confirm that they were infact commiting tax fraud in order to get the CEo fired and then had a talk with her boyfriend about how what he was doing was wrong. Like, she took the step and called him out and that untimely gave Haida the confidence to step up to the CEO and call him out on his bullshit????

Like how is that passivity????

And everyone needs to know that Haida in the thick of it as well. Like his paranoia and fear wasn't something that came out of no where. Hadia said so himself that anyone else in the company had a fair chance of getting fired due to budget cuts and low profits, and so the pressure to succeed was growing. People were getting pressured to quiet left and right thanks to the new CEO. Mr. Tone was demoted then forced to quiet a job he really loved; Kabai was forced to quit as well from a job she really liked because everyone was making her feel worthless for having a family to take care of instead of being at work.

and when Haida showed that he had a good chance with his new accounting software to succeed and NOT get fired, he took that chance to rub elbows with the new CEO. And not only that, but thanks to the new CEO, the company was falling behind and had to commit tax fraud in order to stay afloat, and again DUE TO NOT WANTING TO BE FIRED AND DEEMED WORTHLESS TO THOSE AROUND HIM, Haida took up tax fraud in order to survive. On top of wanting the praise that he so badly needed. There were multiple times where Haida laments that Retsuko is on a whole new other level than him, and that he feels like he just one of the fanboys in the crowd. In the season, when he sees that Retsuko has restarted her screaming channel and has started growing back her following, that feeling comes back. He really does love Retsuko so much and wants to be where Retsuko is so badly but he feels as if none of what he's done in life fits with Retsuko's life.

Like, for christ sake, Retsuko is the ex-girlfriend to the aggretsuko version of Mark Zuckerberg who also one-hit-wonder pop idle star who nearly got murdered by an incel and Haida is a wanna-be British rock band bass guitar player who does accounting by day who still lives in his parents' apartment complex rent free (lucky bastard)

and on top of all that, there was Retsuko's lies. Like, his suspicion and jealousy was not unjustified??? Like, wouldn't you feel the same way if you saw your significant other lied in front of your face about what you were doing, arrive home in the fancy-ass limo of their ex-boyfriend and then notice that said ex-boyfriend FLIRTED BACK AT HER????? on top of using the pet nickname that he gave her when they were dating???? Like him calling Tadano out on his not-really-flirting-but-kind-of-is-flirting-flirting was no unjustified????

AND EVEN AFTER ALL OF THAT MESS OF DRAMA, THE END OF SEASON 4 CONFIRMS (though some would argue that its very ambiguous) THAT THEY'RE STILL IN A RELATIONSHIP. EVEN AFTER THE TAX FRAUD AND MISCOMUNICATION AND NEARLY THROWING YOUR SIGNIFICANT OUT THE WINDOW, THEY'RE STILL GOING OUT.

this is what Gori's soulmate app said about Haida and Retsuko. Even after so much shit, they're able to keep going to work on each other.

Aggrettsuko has stated that multiple times that romance is not a fairy tale, and that it takes work and that you may not get it right on the first time or the third time, but its good to keep working at it.

And Haida and Retsuko are working on it 🥺

#i have moments of distaste for haida at times too. but youre supposed to?#i feel the same way about retsuko. bc theyre characters with flaws and nuance. but like....motivation for those flaws!!#pacing-wise i would have enjoyed some fluffy respite of romcom hijinks before the Himura arc which had such high stakes #so the writing isnt perfect either here.#but overall its a lot of bad faith criticisms about the ship and the show itself #and im just like.....i see how yall maybe got some expectations of a more fantasy-oriented story #where Retsuko tells off her misogynistic boss.#rises to fame as the head of a girl group #gets with a young upstart tech guru #but each and every one of those scenarios ended with no payoff or horrific circumstances. on purpose.#and I feel like everyone with these particular criticisms about the show's direction are forgetting WHY none of those ventures worked out #and ignoring how Retsuko's character has changed FOR THE BETTER #maybe not entertainment-wise. but i watch it with a LOT of projecting onto Retsuko (bc shes a lot like me)#and her change in demeanor has delighted me. given me aspirations to be that way. im like “i wonder if therapy can make me be like her”.#like to all the haters YOURE MISSING THE POINT LMFAO #and i really liked how they deconstructed Haidas character as well. starting with his insecurity issues #and then working on his privilege #all the while Retsuko was supportive. but not playing therapist or doing any of Haida's tough shit for him.#this show is such a gift tbh and i wish folks would stop raining on parades #i came across many of these anti posts in the retsuko x haida tag. like what happened to shipping war truces??#long ass reblog though sorry 😅

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