#with being left out of Joker's narrative

[psalmsofpsychosis]

You know, i've been thinking about the way Batman keeps danger and weapons so close to his body, so tight to himself, practically tied around his neck, that joker often has no way left but to grab for him if he wants something Batman has. Batman does not want to be left out of Joker's plans, his story, he wants in on Joker's narrative by any means he can make it happen. It's such particular "you take me with you wherever you are, it's your punishment, just as it's my punishment to take you with me wherever i am" statement. Batman actively leaves no choice for Joker but to get very very close to him and claim him as part of his win or his loss. I mean,

he didn't have to. he could've put the key in one of his waist pouches, push it into the back of his left boot, he could've tied it around his bicep, i dont care— he could've done whateverthefuck with it. But he had to put it around his neck, and intentionally invite Joker to "come and get it". Something something classic cliche of the way lovers' bond is signified by a necklace-adjacent item and the way they interact with it; hold unto it, toss it, tie it around their necks, giving it back, not giving it back, necklaces as items of reverance and revenge. Something something a tie around neck being a sign of being claimed and owned,

[quacktities]

I feel like the appeal of C! Quackbur (to me at least) is just how versatile it is as a ship and the range it has.

You want a subtle rivals to lovers, mutual pinning and longing but one of them is repressing his own feelings because he hates himself too much to let someone get attached to him ship dynamic with a political backdrop? You want longing gazes, knowing looks and the unspoken truth that, maybe, just maybe this relationship and understanding between them goes deeper than either of them let on or want to admit? BOOM. Lmanburg election arc Quackbur!

You want all of that but with more tension, high stakes, mental illness, a very "forbidden romance" vibe with an enemies that have been in love with eachother for a long time but can now finally be on the same side and possibly act on their feelings dynamic (but theyre doomed by the narrative so it was never going to work out. Or maybe it will, who knows. Maybe this time they find solace in eachother. Maybe this time Quackity stops him before its too late. Maybe this time it doesnt end in flames. Who knows. Its up to you really, if you keep telling the story over and over again, maybe this time they get their happy ending here and it doesnt have to be a tragedy. Your choice really). Pogtopia era C! Quackbur!

You want fucked up grief and angst and reminiscing on the past and being haunted by what could have been? You want seeing the spectre of your dead friend (if he was truly your old enemy, why does he feel like a past lover to you) and wondering if maybe he remembers everything you both went through the same way you do and if maybe his heart aches when he sees you the same way yours aches when you see him but you know he isn't the same and you'll never see the old verison of him ever again... but hes here... as a ghost.. and that has to be worth something right. (Is it a miracle you can still see him or are you forever being tormented by what you can never have?). BOOM, Butcher arc C! Quackity and Ghostbur (or Aftermath C! Quackbur as I call them)

You want all of that, but hey. What if we brought back the guy. What if it didn't have to end in death? What if they could reunite and speak again after everything? Would they even get along? You want the culmination of years of pinning, grief, hurt, and mutual obsession? Do they truly love each other, or have they fallen in love with the idealised verisons of each other they have in their own heads? Maybe this time, they'll actually get their shit together and talk. There really isn't anything stopping them now, other than themselves and each other. Maybe C! Quackity finally finds someone who respects him, is dedicated to him, and can engage with him on the same intellectual level in C! Wilbur. Maybe C! Wilbur finally finds someone who makes him feel human and can challenge him and his more self-destructive behaviours while still loving him in C! Quackity. Maybe this time, they get to understand each other, and they get to heal. Maybe this time, it's not too late, and sure, they dont have the healthiest relationship, but they're working on it, and they're okay for once. Just this once. Maybe. Or maybe you don't want that. Maybe it is too late for them. Maybe they'll never have what they once had, and they're both left with bitter hatred and longing for the past that grows weaker by the day as the rose tinted filter starts to fade. Maybe they make each other worse. Maybe the closest they ever get to being close to each other is by hurting each other. Maybe the only times they hold hands are when they're catching each other's bloody fists. Maybe they're both too far gone now. Maybe they've hurt each other too much to ever be vulnerable with each other. Maybe it's just too late for them. Maybe it was never meant to be. You want a joker card ship dynamic that can either end in healing and a happy ending or in an even more fucked up tragedy? Or both! Why not. BOOM. Post revival C! Quackbur

[umbrellajam]

*steeples fingers and stares at my tablet with gimlet eyes*

so. Road to NML. You mean to tell me that the reason the rest of the country, Congress, and the President himself decided to write Gotham off, blow the bridges, and isolate everyone left - all criminals and asylum lunatics and 'undesirables', of course - was in large part due to *checks notes* a satanic rock star's unnatural, irresistible charisma and cult-like media manipulations aimed at dooming the city for his own benefit?

and that in order to find out what actually happens to this villain, who disappears from the Batman and 'Tec storylines...I'd have to *checks notes* read Azrael's event issues?

....yeah, PASS. I only included JPV's book on my reading list when I absolutely had to (*cough* whenever Cass pops up *cough*), so it's off to the wiki summaries for me!

...but okay, on the one hand I find it very funny how thoroughly fandom has excised this demonic media influencer aspect from the collective consciousness of NML - or at least it had never made its way to me via either fic or fandom posts. I know how few people read comics in general in this fandom, and even for those who do, NML is a Beast that only a percentage have tackled (see: me just starting to pick away at it!), so honestly it's not that surprising.

and like it can easily be left out of the story and still leave it coherent lmao!! One can certainly argue things are in fact neater that way; certainly it's not something that would ever be kept (or at least not in the same form) if NML were adapted to another medium, except as perhaps a normal media demagogue (or a montage of them).

but on the other hand...hmm. Thinking about Hurricane Katrina hitting all of six years after the NML storyline played out. And the debate over whether funds should be used for reconstructing New Orleans and other massively damaged areas. And people around the country wondering if New Orleans would or should be rebuilt at all. Or if a vibrant, historic city would just be basically wiped off the map.

I know this is a conversation that happens everywhere and every time a major disaster wrecks a city. There are always huge fights over disaster aid and funding allocations of any kind.

but man. It's something to see this fictionalized depiction in such close proximity to a real life disaster that paralleled it so strongly, and to know that - yes, there are always people who Do Not Abandon Their Homes and work to reclaim them. Yes, massive amounts of aid (federal and otherwise) and federal reconstruction funding did get dispensed. Yes, people cared, and yes, we rebuilt.

so...maybe we do actually need the demonic social media influencer's evil powers in order to comic book logic explain how everyone in the country turned their backs on Gotham and created No Man's Land.

like - no, it's not necessary. the narrative would work without it. and yet...

the premise imagines - requires? - a significantly more callous, selfish populace. Still plausible and compelling! Possibly even stronger as a story since the turnaround for No Man's Land still hinges on winning the country over to open Gotham back up, let aid in, and rebuild. But. You do have to start from - kind of a bleaker take on humanity?

it also kind of reminds me of what scintillyyy pointed out a few weeks ago about Dick killing the Joker, and how actually there's an important comic book superpower interaction going on there, too, with Rancor present massively amplifying Dick's hate and anger to push him over the edge.

but so few people ever notice or remember that and it certainly isn't one of those things that gets transmitted via fandom osmosis. (It was news to me!!) People focus on Dick breaking down and letting loose solely due to being pushed too far.

and that's extremely compelling on its own! It is! Just like the no-satanic-Nick-Scratch NML.

just thinking about fandom's tendency to ellide the supernatural or powered influences that are canonically affecting a situation, in order to explore/focus on more purely humanistic explanations or motivations...that actually end up being darker than what we might reasonably expect from real life, or from a character's typical values.

like it's part wanting to brush off comic book nonsense, part wanting to dive into gritty realism (that's not always realistic), part not having all the information because of learning things secondhand so you construct the most reasonable explanation...idk it's just interesting.

anyway.

more importantly: Dick and Tim are adorable in 'Tec 727-729!! Especially love them trading off yelling each other's names in fear/alarm, and also trading off protecting each other - Dick's "You hurt that kid and you're gonna be eating through a tube!" and Tim's clever solo rescue of a thoroughly captive Dick via clever use of a voice modulator and a two-way radio. The Boys 😊

[thefrogsennaneverfound]

let's not forget that ricciardo once made a bet with helmut marko back in 2018 that bottas would lose his seat by the end of the season. all purely for his own shits and giggles.

fed the narrative that red bull were doing him dirty causing a load of hate to be sent to verstappen by his pack of rabid fans, when in reality verstappen was just better than him.

was happy to let his rabid stans mock esteban ocon's ability all across social media when they were teammates at renault and made a few sideways jabs egging them on, because esteban was losing to him.

spent the months before joining mclaren making digs about norris's age and experience, disguised as jokes but clearly mind games, and spoke about norris like he was a child who needed to be shown by the master (him) how to drive. (boy did karma bite him on that one)

egged on the interviewers making mugging jokes and then pretended to grab norris's new watch off his wrist during an interview just days after norris had been held in a chokehold and mugged, then laughed like norris was being a bad sport when he understandably didn't find the jokes funny and walked out of the interview.

put out that pr statement about being committed to mclaren purely for pr purposes, bringing a deluge of hate onto the team when it was announced they'd dropped him. later came out he already knew the writing was on the wall at that point so clearly did it just to try to turn the narrative into a pity party for him before word got out.

he/his team also deliberately fed misleading information to espn during his time at mclaren saying that norris was only beating him because it was the only car he had ever driven in f1 and it was tailored around him and implying norris was overrated, only for him to be forced to admit when directly asked in an interview once he had left the team that the car hadn't suited norris either and that he was frequently baffled by the things he could see on the data that norris was able to do with the car that he just wasn't able to.

agreed pre-race in baku 2022 to the strategy of the two mclaren's holding station in whichever order they were at the end of the first lap in order to work together to use drs to keep the alpine of ocon behind, only for him to then get on the radio knowing it would be broadcast to whinge about how unfair it was that lando was holding him up from getting past alonso, forcing the team to tell him no they weren't swapping them and making the team look bad. he was pissy he hadn't been the lead mclaren at the end of the lap so had to hold behind and knew exactly what he was doing with that radio message. admitted after the race that the strategy had been arranged beforehand and that he wouldn't have got past alonso either as the mclaren was so slow on the straight, but by then the damage was done and norris and the team were being dragged all over social media by his rabid dog-pack.

never once condemned his fans for bullying his mclaren mechanics on social media (to the point one of their wives was posting begging the staniels to stop because it was having an adverse affect on the mechanics' mental health), didn't condemn them sending death threats to his engineer after the radio in baku when tom stallard asked him if the car was okay (he didn't realise ricciardo had crashed at this point, he thought the car had broken down), made digs that fed into his stans mocking norris's very real mental health struggles, and didn't condemn them from sending hate to a mental health charity that mclaren work with.

took visible pleasure in being undeservedly handed de vries's seat on a silver platter last season.

he is not mr nice guy at all. he is incredibly manipulative and good at playing the pr game. he also gets away with some really cruel jokes and jabs by putting on the 'joker' smile and playing the it's only banter card.

egged on the interviewers making mugging jokes and then pretended to grab norris's new watch off his wrist during an interview just days after norris had been held in a chokehold and mugged, then laughed like norris was being a bad sport when he understandably didn't find the jokes funny and walked out of the interview.

Another very salient point I'd forgotten about. Thanks for pointing out this and so many other examples of his nasty behaviour.

he is not mr nice guy at all. he is incredibly manipulative and good at playing the pr game. he also gets away with some really cruel jokes and jabs by putting on the 'joker' smile and playing the it's only banter card.

Absolutely; this takes us right back 'round to the 'charming bully' analogy. The likes of Tsunoda don't make a fuss about his bullying so he gets away with it. Norris does make it clear that he doesn't think it's in the least bit funny (it was downright fucking cruel to bate him like that) so he twists it to make the victim look bad. Utterly vile behaviour and, sadly, Ricciardo is a long way from being in a minority of people who get away with it.

I really do appreciate you taking the time to add to the ever lengthening list of why that obnoxious twerp is such a wrong 'un. It's likely that some folks reading our descriptions of his behaviour will recognise people in their own lives who've been getting away with treating them badly just because they know they can get away with it. Maybe it'll give them the courage to be a Lando rather than a Yuki (although I don't mean to disparage Tsunoda) and make a stand.

[darkshadow90]

I Didn’t Like Joker 2 (Spoilers Mentioned)

Hey guys. I’ve wanted to post my thoughts on Joker 2. I’m still having trouble putting all my thoughts together especially since I’m really tired, so bear with me. First off before I start my rant, I just want to say to those of you that enjoyed the movie, that’s fine. I’m not trying to take that away from you. Nor I’m I telling you you’re wrong for liking it. You can like whatever you want. That being said, I didn’t like it all. I found it to be really upsetting. I have a lot of similar feelings that other people who didn’t like it have, so I’m probably going to come off as parroting points that people have expressed. But I really do feel the same way.

So when I hear people say, people didn’t want to see Arthur, they wanted to see Joker, yeah, in my case they’re not entirely wrong. Listen, I knew this isn’t supposed to be Clown Prince of Crime Joker. I knew it’s a different take on the character. I didn’t necessarily need to see him going up against Batman. I’m okay with different takes on the Joker. That’s what makes this Joker special. I found him to be unique and his story compelling. If they were going to make a sequel, I wanted to see more of this Joker. I wanted to see more of a continuation of where the first movie left off. But as the previews came out, I realized I might not be getting that. I was still willing to give it a chance. I thought maybe this could be a unique take on the Joker and Harley relationship. Instead I felt like I got slapped in the face and curb stomped.

The sequel basically retcons Arthur’s whole transformation into the Joker. Like, I’m sorry, am I supposed to forget the final scene in the first movie? It’s never mentioned. It was heavily implied he killed the psychiatrist in cold blood, but I guess that guy never existed? So we’re back to Arthur being like he was at the beginning of the first movie. Okay…still gonna see what happens. At least he might get to have some people in his life, like Harley or make friends with some inmates and have some happiness? Nope.

Arthur just gets used and abused by everyone around him and his life is hell. He doesn’t get to have any happiness. Sure it happened in the first movie, but it had the narrative pay off of Arthur becoming Joker and the people who treated him badly getting their comeuppance. Here we’re just watching Arthur’s and essentially Joker’s whole story being destroyed, and him having his dignity taken from him. There’s one scene where we get some of Joker with Gary. I loved it but then it’s completely undercut later on. Also like I said earlier, the Joker at the very end of the first movie wouldn’t have cared that he ruined Gary’s life. At that point, he was completely a monster who didn’t care whether someone was good or bad. He basically gave up on everyone and society and said “Fine, they want a monster? I’ll give them a monster.” The first movie was all about how a person can become a monster from a society without empathy. This movie completely undid all that.

After a little bit of Joker comes out in the scene with Gary, and Joker talking shit about the guards in Arkham, when Arthur is taken back to Arkham, the guards sexually assault him. It’s so unnecessary and really disturbing and upsetting. It didn’t need to be in the movie. At this point Arthur decides he doesn’t want to be Joker anymore, that there was never a Joker, just him. What the fuck, that just shits all over the first movie then. Then at the end of the movie, Arthur gets killed by some random guy who doesn’t even have a name. So basically fuck me and the rest of us who found Arthur to be an interesting character and this Joker’s story compelling. The guy at the end of the first movie who killed a psychiatrist in cold blood? Never existed. He’s a nobody.

It really does feel like this movie was made out of spite for DC fans or really anyone who enjoyed the first movie and resonated with it. I don’t mean to parrot what other people have said, but it does feel like they set out to destroy everything the first movie built up. I guess the message was we shouldn’t like the Joker because he’s bad or whatever. Okay, but like, it’s too late. People liked this take on the character and his story. What, were a few edgelords like “Yeah I feel like Arthur does and I think he’s a hero and I wanna be like him.” Or something? Is that really what Todd and crew took away from people who said they empathized with Arthur and resonated with his story? That they idolized the Joker and wanted be like him? No one was saying that. People can empathize with a villain and not condone their actions.

I guess the joke was on me and a lot of other people the entire time. We got clowned. We had all these theories about the guy in Arkham at the end of the first movie. We wondered who he was or if Arthur ever even existed and the whole story was made up by the Joker to get sympathy from the audience. Turns out it doesn’t matter because that guy never existed and Arthur is nobody. I’m not gonna let it ruin the first movie. I hate this movie. I wish we never got a sequel. Once again, if you like this movie, more power to you. I’m gonna pretend it doesn’t exist.

[trying-out-stuff]

Today's batman issue came out and I'm gonna focus on damian and what might happen and why I'm not happy at all .

My main problem is damian is being left alone with zur (see panels of today) the child here and not with the batfam (minus bruce) the adults... as we see them being together talking without Damian which makes it look as if damian didn't reconnected with them since gotham war (not counting the other books I'm only focusing on the chip run).

Last we saw damian, he was alone helping defeat the villain army in gotham with cass, duke and tim. Since then we had Bruce disconnected from the batfamily and the bat computer while looking for joker. We know Bruce left Dick and Barbara in charge of the family and act as parents for the rest (which kinda weird since all of them not counting Damian are adults with their own personal lives).

Zur decides to upload himself into failsafe and emprison Bruce with joker and other crminals in blackgate and acting out as batman from this issue.

Jason meets up with zur and doesn't really believe it's Bruce while talking to Barbara. My first issue is when Damian shows up to meet up with zur it looks like he isn't connected to oracle (this might end up wrong but for the moment it is) and all the rest of the batfam met up with oracle at her tower.

Which weird, why is Damian alone going to see zur ?

Is he playing double agent ? maybe but I wouldn't be so sure...

We know chip zdarsky likes to uplift Tim by downplaying or denigrating the other robins including Damian (see Tim towards Damian in batman #138). And chip doesn't seem to like Damian all that much.

So narratively speaking, If anything happens to Damian for being with zur I'm gonna blame the batfam and bruce not even joking, Damian is a 14 years old teen who can make choices but isn't supposed to be alone to decide (like hello he was alone during the lazarus tournament and the period when he was excluded from the family and they weren't there for his 14th birthday).

What might happen ?

We know in batman #147 that zur will have a sidekick and I'm very worried it might be Damian...

If it's Damian, I hope it isn't willingly and if it is, he better be a double agent or else...

[fractualized]

Zdarsky’s run on Batman ends soon, thoughts? 🎤

lmao I feel like I could either toss out a dismissive one-liner or rant for like a dozen paragraphs. Guess I'll go with the latter.

We'll, I'm certainly not going to miss him at the helm. I read Batman: The Knight, and even though I agree with the criticism of the end, it showed competent storytelling with a good emotional core, which is the most basic of standards, but let's be real, this is comics, I'll take competent any day. And when his Batman run started, I had caught up on Snyder-King-Tynion Batman and was excited to follow a run in real time.

I'd say I stopped having a good time when Bruce got sent to the alternate universe. Penguin faking his death was fun. Bruce being pursued by a dramatic robot version of himself was fun. Bruce again fretting about protecting the family was… par for the course. Calling back to Zur-En-Arrh didn't bug me because I hadn't read that full storyline yet, so it felt like a gateway to digging back into lore. Bruce surviving a fall through the Earth's atmosphere was too fucking ridiculous but the kind I can look past. (Imagine you're a DC writer. You have the idea: lol what if Batman got out of this by surviving a fall from the moon. You have opened that door in your mind. Do you have the will close it or would you be like FUCK IT LET'S DO IT?)

The Red Mask universe, however, dragged any momentum at that point to a stop, and I honestly don't care enough to dig deep into all the reasons why, which I guess gets at the core of what was wrong with the Red Mask universe. (Skeleton Jim Gordon was the most interesting thing but he was just a temporary side effect or something? Whatever.)

But, of course, since I'm a Joker fan, Darwin Halliday was a major sticking point as the most boring Joker to never joke. Nearly everything Zdarsky did with Joker was a major sticking point.

It still drives me crazy that from Snyder to the Zdarsky run, we had a Joker who tried to force Bruce both away from the batfam and Selina and back to basics multiple times, so their battle could be one-on-one again. We had a Joker who, after Bruce left him to die, was notably depressed and suicidal at the end of Joker 2021. He is still that way at the start of The Man Who Stopped Laughing.

And you could follow from that with the basic beats of what Zdarsky did. You could say Joker is disillusioned with his relationship with Batman, and that's why he turns to Zur-En-Arrh, a real Batman. But no, everything has to be too fucking complicated. We have do yet another retcon of so much other stuff and say that Joker always was looking for Zur. And we have to a weird take on Three Jokers because people were really biting at the bit to get a real answer within canon like a decade after Johns wrote that nonsense?? I don't know, I don't do marketing research, but I'm pretty sure if they just quietly never addressed it, it would be fine.

And the freaking Captio stuff. Ugh. UGH. I really just. I feel like this is a product of overthinking. "Well, Batman is so thoroughly trained, it only makes sense that Joker had at least some of the same training to beat him." No. Fuck that. We don't need that. Joker rivals Batman out of sheer audacity. I like that it doesn't really make sense that a clown pushes him to the limit. I like the juxtaposition of Bruce having to do so much training and learning to survive, but Joker is a cockroach revived by the narrative. I like Joker being a plague and a mystery that Batman cannot resolve. I like Joker being essentially absurd. No, it doesn't make sense, but he's here to stab you out of love and you better know how to dodge.

So much of Batman comics now are not about telling a fun Batman story. They're stories about Batman stories, just circling back and cannibalizing each other into a total fucking mess, and putting the city on the brink of destruction so much that those stakes no longer have meaning. There has to be a writer out there who wants to get back to just telling a smaller action/detective story that makes the reader give a shit about what's happening instead of feeling like maybe they're just not getting it, like they missed homework.

And I say that as someone who started reading Morrison's full run when Zdarsky's started so I could have the Zur background. I had to pause when Morrison's writing got to be too much (for the bad reasons!). I intended to jump back in again, but then Zdarsky's run nosedived and the effort no longer seemed worth it.

Especially when everything paused for Gotham War. Jesus Christ. The only good thing to come out of that was Rosenberg's second Red Hood issue. But speaking of Gotham War, I do wonder if there'll be an article years from now that will reveal Zdarsky had to deal with too much editorial fiat. He had to interrupt his Zur story not only with the badly executed Catwoman plot and the Knight Terrors, but cram in a Three Jokers explanation.

And speaking of Rosenberg, I can't end without mentioning that because he started TMWSL around the same time Zdarsky started on Batman, and they both had their protagonists dealing with other versions of themselves, man, there was such potential for a crossover event. Me and my pals had lots of fun theories about how these series would converge, because the idea that they wouldn't seemed ridiculous. There were two Jokers in TMWSL, and at the same time in Batman #131, Halliday seemed to have created three of them. I didn't like Halliday, but still, what did that mean? It would be ridiculous for those developments to be unrelated, right? RIGHT?

Joke's on us, as usual. 🤪

[weloveakechi]

Here’s the thing about why I think Akechi’s alive and why his return on Christmas Eve is really him.

He shows up to take Akira’s place testifying against Shido. As a simultaneous thank you to Akira and one last fuck you to Shido (Seriously the satisfaction he’d get by being the reason Shido’s crimes stick is not explored enough). It’s great, good for Akira and good for Akechi.

It’s also a thing that is only required because of the deaths and chaos caused in the Metaverse.

But in Maruki’s reality, Shido’s in prison for trying to overthrow the government. That’s it. No Metaverse murders have happened to charge anyone over.

So Akechi showing up to testify and turn himself in makes no sense. To Akechi it does, he still remembers said crimes, but if Maruki’s world were settled? Sae wouldn’t even be there asking the question.

And if Maruki’s very first act after gaining massive powers is to make Akechi stroll back into Akira’s life on Christmas Eve, why not do it in a way that makes it so they can be together right away?

It’s because Akechi is alive and well on Christmas Eve.

It’s him standing there, ready to pay back his debt to Joker and the Thieves in the only way he has left. Maruki has no idea this is happening. He’s still probably reeling from the sudden influx of power streamed over to him post Yaldy going down.

Leaving Akechi just enough time to well and truly assert himself into the narrative and screw with any neat and tidy plans Maruki might be dreaming of.

Maruki steps in only after Akechi’s gone and tossed himself in prison, effectively ruining any chance for Akira and Akechi to spend time together happily. And Maruki can’t have that, he needs to properly thank Akira for all his help (and all that godlike power he’s suddenly got).

So he’s scrambling, and wipes everyone’s records by removing the Metaverse crimes. (It also conveniently means Okumura and Wakaba are back too). And boom happy ending for everyone right? Right? Why aren’t these boys living their happy lives?

It’s the funniest possible reason to have Akechi alive and well. It’s hilarious if Akechi’s alive and the first thing any of us see him do next is becoming an absolute menace to the next godlike being that rolls up threatening to assert control over him. He’s really out here living up to his full potential and creating chaos for everyone (including himself). Truly some Wild Card behavior

[themattress]

Arcane's second season was shakier than the first, but still hit way more than it missed.

With that said, there is one part of it that I am really, really disappointed in.

(SPOILERS BEHIND CUT)

Jinx.

So, the concept for Arcane and whatever shows follow it is that it's the reality behind the world and characters seen in League of Legends. Legends have to come from somewhere, after all, and we see how they came to be in Arcane. And that works...except for Jinx.

In the first season, there was no such problem. It was masterful in being an origin story for Jinx, concluding with her choosing her path and becoming the nihilistic, psychopathic terrorist that would become legendary for her evil deeds. But similarly to Joker: Folie a Deux and how it handled its title character, the second season displayed great narrative cowardice by backtracking on this. It didn't do it immediately, mind you - Act 1 still had Jinx as she was where we left her, someone whose sole motivation in life is to "watch it all burn". She's not pure evil, as displayed by her bonds with Sevika and Isha, but she's also not redeemable.

Yet then Act 2 starts and she's suddenly become this inspiring symbol of resistance for Zaunites even though her actions have made things objectively worse for them by every metric. She resists this label only to later embrace it, becoming a "big fat hero" as she puts it. Then we get the revelation of Warwick being Vander, which is followed by Jinx reconciling with Vi and basically becoming Powder again, which is followed by her heroically saving Caitlyn's life, which is followed by her losing Isha which turns her suicidal only to be talked down from it by Echo which is followed by the finale where....well, if you're reading this far you probably already know. And all of this is executed pretty well, but it begs the question:

"How the fuck did any of that result in THIS being the public perception of Jinx!?"

How did the legend of Jinx become her as a villain and not her as a hero? She had already become viewed as a hero by Zaun even when she technically wasn't one, and then she played a huge and very flashy role in saving Piltover during the final battle, meaning they should also see her more positively now! There is no logical reason that the narrative of her as a loony terrorist who blows shit up for the lolz should be the one enshrined into legend.

And what hurts is that no other character has this issue. Vi, Caitlyn, Jayce, Viktor, Ekko, Heimerdinger, Singed, Warwick, not to mention the inevitable Mel legend that's going to be added to the game like her mother was...you can totally track how their legendary characters were shaped even if it's not wholly reflective of reality with a lot of nuances missing. But Jinx now has a huge disconnect between the person and the legend that doesn't make any sense.

Like I said, it feels like narrative cowardice. The ending of Season 1 had Jinx choosing the "Jinx" chair over the "Powder" chair, telling Vi things can never go back to how they were between them, and then has her let out a scream as she fires her bazooka at Piltover which was clearly meant to symbolize Powder's death cry; through committing this act, Jinx is killing what was left of her old self. The natural follow-up to this was for her to stay as she was presented in Season 2's Act 1 - no morality, no grander purpose, just living for chaos. But Jinx became popular, including with the writers, and they didn't want to commit to the tragedy they'd so excellently built up. It's such a letdown. Arcane and Jinx both deserved a lot better.

[stupendousfoxthing]

It is perfectly acceptable in Taekooker spaces to say Tae is the only one who faces problems with the company or hurdles during his releases and it's getting really depressing that so many Taekookers are seemingly just using Jungkook and don't actually pay any attention at all to him. Or they lowkey buy into the privileged company & fandom fave narrative to explain to themselves why he pulls much bigger numbers than the rest of the group on every platform, which is equally depressing. I know Jokers are like 99% pjm and Taekooker spaces are more balanced overall, but it's hard to find any space where Jungkook isn't being treated like this. Every JK-biased or solo (not akgae) can give you a long list of how the company has fucked up his releases and treated him like shit. The only way to be a Taekooker and not know about this is by only paying attention to one side of your ship. He was the last member to get a real solo MV. Euphoria should have been his, but you know no one uplifts the OT7 agenda better than the baby that was "raised" by the group. Adding BTS to the credits of his solo songs is sabotage. Adding BTS credits to his solo songs after you see them blowing up on streaming platforms is textbook sabotage. Giving him a few days to promote Seven while sick and still forcing him to take time away to film a travel show is sabotage. Doing the same thing during his extremely limited Golden promotions is sabotage. They took him to Japan for a couple of very lowkey Golden promotions squeezed in between more travel show filming and flew him out one day before MAMA where he could have actually had a chance to promote Golden on a big stage and accept the awards he earned. I don't want to hear anything about others being the only ones to get limited promotion when he released his album and had to enlist five weeks later.

I can acknowledge how terribly that company has treated both of them. It's infuriating. But if you can't, just say you're a solo and go. If this shrinks Taekooker communities by a significant percentage it's fine, because at least I'll know the people left support and care about both of them.

[analviel]

Civilian Tim shoots Joker on live television.

It's a whole daydream thing that started with Joker Junior though actually in this AU, there was no Joker Junior, it's just comics Wayne major-shareholder Tim Drake picking up a gun, Joker grinning at him, opening his mouth, and Tim just shoots him.

Something about 'not Robin so does not compromise the symbol and standards the Bats and Birds should always uphold' and it's just ineffecient to let him keep running around.

Like Joker being killed by a 'random Gothamite', which Tim Drake is. No personal grudge, no close family victims more than the usual Gothamite, just some guy in a shirt and pants and a gun on the ground, the Joker in front, and enough 'whatever' vibes. Just another case of, someone has to do it and if no one else is going to be that someone, then yeah I guess Tim can be.

Like, seems like no narrative theme or reason, no poetic justic or irony or a punchline for the Joker, he doesn't know this boy and he couldn't be Batman's civilian ID, was he even old enough for facial hair, just a boy out of the left field.

But ALL the consequences and after effects of it.

[marley-manson]

Do you ever think about just how much Hawkeyes character evolved, like, the other day I was thinking about that one deleted episode, Hawkeye on the double (?) or something like that, and how in that when he found out he was being duped by two people working together he staged his own fake attempted suicide via fckn minefield to traumatise them into never doing it again, like, comparing that to the joker is wild is crazyyyyy. Like obviously the scale of pranks there is off, but idk it just made me think, Hawkeye as a character definitely lost some edge as the show progressed

Yeah! lol it's kind of wild how much less of a mastermind Hawkeye became when the writers decided BJ's thing should be pranks.

I feel like the real reason for this is that the show's tone shifted away from satire and into character drama. When the show is a satire Hawkeye is the political centre, so his role in the story is to be right. The army/war can beat him in a tragic way, but in the early seasons his only righteous comeuppances that I can remember off the top of my head were like, Ceasefire when he got dumped three times in a row, and lol the script you cite, where there's more of an equal back and forth between him and the two women but it does end with Hawkeye nearly accidentally killing himself for real lol. So like, in the early seasons he occasionally gets narratively punished for misogyny, but otherwise he's meant to be the cool guy who is right and better than all the army representatives. And because it's a satire, I think that's great, it works very well, Hawkeye is an awesome character who absolutely should get narratively rewarded for driving colonels into early retirement and taking out their appendixes.

But then the show shifted to character drama instead and now Hawkeye needs flaws to examine, weaknesses the narrative can use to tear him down in a deserving way rather than a tragic way, etc. Sometimes his left-leaning politics ~go too far~ now, sometimes he's too self-righteous or unreasonable, sometimes he has to capituate to authority and admit rebellion is wrong, and sometimes the narrative tears him down just because we're meant to get some schaudenfreude from it, as in Joker is Wild. Because the narrative is no longer on Hawkeye's side by default, and often gets entertainment value out of punishing him for various sins, real or not.

So I don't think it's meant to be an intentional character shift, but it does make me want an in-universe explanation for why he loses his edge.

And the explanation I like that covers most of Hawkeye's narrative repositioning for me, including the lackluster pranks in later seasons and like, guilt in Preventative Medicine, etc, is that it's because of his shifting friend group. Trapper the constant supportive presence and enabling partner in crime is replaced by BJ who only selectively enables Hawkeye and often likes to take him down a few pegs instead. Henry the CO Hawkeye could walk all over is replaced by Potter who is successfully authoritative and puts his foot down. And Frank's gone and Margaret's chilled out so there are no more ideological enemies to target. Plus Charles is also someone willing and able to take Hawkeye down, and even Klinger is no longer into rebellion by season 8.

I mean when you think about it lol it does kinda make sense that Hawkeye would lose a lot of his enthusiasm for fucking with people when his new best friend yells at him for taking out an asshole army guy's appendix instead of helping him. And he might not want to go too far in retaliation for pranks when the whole cast turns on him pretty easily now, as in eg Fallen Idol. And it's probably harder to bring yourself to rebel against the army when you're making friends with a bunch of career army types like Potter, Margaret, and Mulcahy, and have no one else around who shares your ideological hatred for it.

ANYWAY yeah hope you don't mind getting an essay in response lol, this is like one of the aspects of the show I like talking about most, to the point where it's my inspiration for like at least 2 fics lol.

[zahri-melitor]

I've been thinking about War of the Robins, aka 'Damian challenges the other Robins to prove he's the Best Robin' storyline from Batman and Robin 2011, and what I think worked about it in terms of characterisation. (look I'm reading New 52, you get to hear lots of my ten plus years out of date thoughts about New 52, enjoy)

Because look, I think it was successful in presenting how desperate for approval and validation Damian is, but it also feeds into the narrative you can see percolating during this time that Damian can't cope with just being one of the family, he has to be the best, have the most love and approval, have physical demonstrations of his superiority, because he's grown up understanding being one of the group to be a death sentence. (Dick has to be his Batman, and Damian Dick's Robin, he needs the writers giving him reassurance that they were 'the best' right before he dies, the new timeline cuts off any other occasions Dick was Batman, Damian gets given extra pets right before he dies as a sop for his death, etc etc)

Which is believable characterisation for Damian! It is understandable given the background they're building for him! But also sharply aggravating because nobody has ever accused fans of being reasonable and this just digs people into being more deeply opposed to the character their favourite is in conflict with.

So he 'challenges' Tim and Jason 'at something you feel unbeatable at' in a way that sharply exploits emotions they're sensitive about.

Damian...shows Tim a video of Tim considering killing and pulling back, and implies that that makes Tim a killer just like Damian and "they're the same". Now I think this one is actually pretty weak - while yes it's exploiting a point Tim's sensitive over (and in our world has dealt with twice in the calendar year prior to this story), it's also something Tim's pretty solid on; Tim knows he's not a killer and will pull back, while he's seen Damian kill. I also think that a Damian who's working to be a better person would not refer to the Spook situation as "a bit rambunctious", rather than it being something he regrets and tries to grow from. It does amuse me that Tim gets to smash Damian into Jason's trophy case however this time for the parallel, though being the one who breaks the case generally is framed to make you the one 'in the wrong' in the confrontation. Also as far as I can tell Damian never takes a physical trophy from this fight, which sort of ruins your whole premise, Damian. NB: I see Damian has Tim's bo in his room later, but Tim clearly ended the fight holding it and then left. There's definitely an art issue here.

Jason's fight is even more exploitation of a known weakness. Jason's got every right to be touchy about someone threatening him with a crowbar. Also I really really dislike that Damian's just freely admitting to the time he locked himself in with the Joker to beat him up at GCPD, because honestly that bit of story and its timing has always seemed to contradict the 'he's getting better' narrative that Dick maintains during Reborn. And again the whole conversation is "we're so alike but nobody loves you". At least this time Damian clearly takes his trophy (which is a helmet, which is still displayed in Damian's room during scenes there in the B&R Requiem issue).

Dick showing up at the end to explain to Damian that he doesn't need to try so hard prove his worth and just handing over an escrima stick - look it's sweet and it does impart the moral that Damian needed to learn over this whole situation. But also it does not really help, as it's just deepened the family fault-lines between Dick & Damian as a pair and *sigh* Jason & Tim.

The other thing I get out of it is whether it's just bravado or not, Damian's a lot more comfortable with his childhood violence continuing to come out rather than working to fit the rules of what makes a Robin and a superhero than people want to say he is. Yes, he needs unconditional love and support to grow and learn, and Dick's being used to provide that. But it's also occasion 3000 when I'm sitting here going "is anyone ever going to give Damian actual boundaries and enforce them when he tests them?" because he's once again well outside what is expected. Bruce tries at the start to defuse the argument, and Dick tries at the end to explain why Damian didn't need to do this, he's already won, but I do wonder how much of it sunk in.

[speedfreak01]

now that you CLOWNS, you JOKERS have got me thinking about the tarn identity reveal, man that was a really shitty reveal huh

like first off, yet another james roberts villain who has a disability (the physical and social disability of empurata, as well as the pre-existing disability of tarn's transformation addiction, which we as an audience are meant to see as some sort of indicator of tarn's vice and indulgence) and becomes the joker, like there aren't already a hundred of those in the damn book

but it's also a really unsatisfying way to conclude the dying of the light arc because it doesn't have anything to say. i've mentioned this before in other posts, but the reason that so many plot twists and narrative beats from mtmte season 1 work is that they tie back to an over-arching motif of emotional honesty, of saying the things that are uncomfortable to say, answering or addressing that central theme in a way that encourages its audience to think more deeply about them, and facilitate character development along those lines.

but dying of the light? you can clearly, CLEARLY tell that jro was writing this just to get people to say OH MY GOD THAT WAS SO SHOCKING AND UNEXPECTED AND BRUTAL on twitter, so he could termsearch and lap up their reactions, so it's all shock and no substance. the scene where megatron kills tarn with his super special black hole piss beam or whatever implies that the theme we were supposed to be picking up on was "evil people dress their cruelty up in grand narratives to disguise and justify it, but evil is in reality banal", but nothing else in the story serves that theme whatsoever, because the story is at this point uninterested in exploring any sort of theming.

in fact, the supposed thesis of dying of the light is directly invalidated by megatron himself, who has consistently dressed his cruelty up in grand narratives to disguise and justify it without being challenged by the story, and indeed continues to do so throughout the rest of the comic's run, and we as an audience are supposed to just take him at his incredibly constructed and carefully-crafted word!

but also!!! also!!!!!! jro somehow managed to pick like the one character that would make the plot beat of "oh he's just some guy" fall the flattest. because glitch ISN'T just some guy!!!! we know him!!!! even just a little bit!!! but at the same time we don't know him enough for the revelation to have any kind of impact in the other direction

too known to be a nobody, too much of a nobody to be shocking, clearly just intended to be WOAH COMPLETELY OUT THERE AND LEFT-FIELD for the sake of ~subverting expectations~

absolute scenes. a complete omnishambles

[naughtygirl286]

So yes this week we finally went to see Joker: Folie à Deux (Joker 2) I wanted to see it before I say anything about it or have an opinion on it. So we went to watch it. Now surprisingly at the showing we went to it wasn't empty! I went with someone else and the way people were talking I expected it was just going to be the 2 of us but actually there was like 10 or so other ppl there I know its not alot but still there was others I think people were curious about it.

Now as for the movie itself. I can't say it was as bad as everyone says it is but it is of course no were as good as the first one was. It doesn't even compare to the original movie. Now the original idea for this movie I thought was good where you would see him in Arkham and he goes to trial and all that. I thought it was going to be a psychological drama/thriller and all that and then they introduced the musical element (which I will get to shortly) to it which I know left plenty of people scratching their head and thinking "wtf?" Now Joker as a character is as I always seen him quite flamboyant so a little bit of singing and dancing didn't really bother me but it did seem strange considering how the first one turned out.

Now as I mentioned about the Musical numbers which are many. Now they are not just thrown in there there is a reason for them and they do have a purpose to the over all story which is explained in the movie itself the explanation is that the singing is from what I understood is a form of therapy. Now the majority of these being musical numbers do not take place in "the real world" and mainly take place in the mind/imagination of Arthur Fleck/Joker (played by Joaquin Phoenix) so basically you are slipping from "the real world" to Arthur's fantasy world and back again.

Now I can say it was excellently acted Joaquin Phoenix continues a great performance as Arthur Fleck as well as many other characters from the first movie return to reprise their roles during the trial scenes. There was plenty of talk about Lady Gaga appearing as Harley Quinn or "Lee Quinzel" as she is referred to in this movie I believe they only refer to her as Harley once in the movie. Now this Harley is completely different then any other version of Harley. Gone is the playful wackiness and the accent. She is very serious in this movie and I think were in this movie's universe it is very serious and drab and grey and somewhat depressing at times and I feel that this is a Harley that fits this universe where she is normally more sweet, fun and bubbly this version is a more serious character who is more sly, selfish and manipulative and Lady Gaga plays her as such. Did she do a good job? I thought she did a good job as this version of the character that was created for this world, but if you are looking for a classic "mad love"/ Suicide Squad type of Harley you are not going to get it from this.

Now did I like the movie? it was alright like I said It doesn't even compare to the original movie one thing was I felt the animated opening was kinda weird and strange and after there I feel that it started off pretty good. There were parts of it that I liked that I thought this is pretty good and there there were parts of it that I thought "what the hell? why?" it feels like it was trying to be two different things at once and also it feels like it was out to or at least try to self sabotage itself for some reason..? also while watching this it felt like it lost something or it was missing something? Now I know it is trying to make a bigger social statement and "trying to do a masterclass on the psyche of the artistry and madness of the human condition" and all that stuff and as one person said "which is a absolute vision of true cinema as it's character studies with it's cerebral narrative that is blending the grotesque with the beautiful" That is not what it was and that is not what people wanted to see.

Now in the end I can't say it was horrible or it was terrible or anything like that as a friend of mine always says "There are no bad movies. some are just better then others" Now I personally say this is not what people wanted. I think if it stayed with the same tone of the first one and been a gritty Psychological crime Drama/Thriller similar to the first movie it would have been fine instead of these lavish over the top musical numbers people wanted to see him become "The Clown Prince of Crime" but that is not what they got with this and I think that is what turned people off from this movie So I don't know what else to say I not going to recommend it but all all I can say is if you want to see it then see it and if you don't then don't but I think you should always watch something first and then form your own opinion on it.

[j0kers-light]

I need to vent Chaos! I have this theory and blink twice if I’m right! Harley is her original character as a psychiatrist but I’m getting iffy vibes from her! The offhand comments to Y/n, the gun alarm, her thick accent. I’m scared Chaos. Is Harley and Joker working together? Are they gonna hurt my baby? Y/n has been through so much I literally cannot if Joker turns out to betray her. He loves her too much but he’s still The Joker!! He’s manipulative and unpredictable! Then we still have that mole in his gang and Morgana said J “keeps his friends close and his enemies closer”I’m scared 😭 This screams double crossing to me and maybe that’s why he refuses to go to our therapy sessions! All the clues lead to Harley and Joker teaming up but it doesn’t explain how Joker turned himself in. Maybe he had a change of heart or Harley framed him? I dunno. That’s my theory and I’m standing by it. If it’s true I’m gonna cry will reading it because your work is so good! I’m obsessed no matter what happens! Love you!

Hiiiiiii anon vent away my love! I love it!🖤✨

But how will you see me if I blink twice? 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 anyhoo this theory beloved…… 👀 Let’s talk about it.

I see where you got this idea from, and I encourage radical thinking like this! I love brainstorming and discussing my chapters with others because it can change the narrative and give me ideas for later chapters.

But alas. Not this time. All I can say is,

Do be wary of Harley. Do question who this mysterious mole is. Joker is manipulative and unpredictable and you should be worried (but not scared love). Joker stands by his words and he does in fact keep his enemies close and for good reason.

I have Joker shown as this loving simp doing anything and everything for his Light. Don’t forget who he is anon. 🫣

I’m happy that you’re noticing the strings being pulled behind the scenes and I hope you catch the clues I’ve left behind to prepare you for what’s to come. 😉